Errico Malatesta A Talk About Anarchist Communism Between Two Workers William. Ah Jack, is that you? Im la!

to meet you. I"e been wantin a talk with you #or a lon time. $h, Jack% Jack% What ha"e I hear! about you% When you li"e! in the country you were a oo! la!, &uite an e'am(le to the youn #ellows o# your a e)I# your (oor #ather were ali"e) Jack. William, why are you s(eakin to me like this? What ha"e I !one that you re(roach me? An! why woul! my (oor #ather ha"e been !issatis#ie! with me? William. *ont be o##en!e! at my wor!s, Jack. I am an ol! man an! I s(eak #or your oo!. An! besi!es I was such #rien!s with ol! An!rew, your #ather, that I am as "e'e! to see you o astray as thou h you were my own son, es(ecially when I think o# the ho(es your #ather ha! o# you an! the sacri#ices he ma!e to lea"e you a oo! name. Jack. But William, what are you talkin about? Am I not an honest workin man? I"e ne"er !one any harm to any one, an! e'cuse me i# I say that I"e always !one as much oo! as I coul!+ so why shoul! my #ather ha"e been ashame! o# me? I !o my best to learn an! im(ro"e, an! my mater an! I are tryin to hit u(on a reme!y #or the e"ils which a##lict us all+ how then ha"e I !eser"e! that you shoul! (itch in it me like this? William. Ah, that is ,ust it% I know well enou h that you work an! hel( your nei hbors. -oure a oo! sort o# cha(+ e"erybo!y in the countrysi!e says that o# you. But it is none the less true that you ha"e been in (rison se"eral times, an! (eo(le say that you are watche! by the (olice, an! that e"en to be seen with you is enou h to et one into trouble. Im maybe makin thin s awkwar! #or mysel# this "ery moment. But I wish you well, an! I will s(eak to you all the same. Jack, listen to the a!"ice o# an ol! man+ belie"e me you ha! best lea"e (olitics to the entlemen who ha"e nothin to !o, an! only trouble yoursel# about workin an! !oin what is ri ht. That is the way to li"e (eaceably an! ha((ily+ i# you !ont you will be lost, bo!y an! soul. .isten to me an! i"e u( your ba! com(any+ #or it is that, as e"eryone knows, that lea!s (oor la!s astray. Jack. Belie"e me, William, my com(anions are #irst/rate #ellows+ the brea! they eat is watere! with their sweat a! sometimes with their tears. .ea"e the masters to s(eak ill o# them+ men who woul! like to suck the last !ro( o# our bloo!, an! then treat us as black/ uar!s an! ,ail/bir!s i# we try to better oursel"es an! esca(e #rom their tyranny. My com(anions an! I ha"e been im(rison, it is true, but it was #or a oo! cause+ we shall o a ain, an! (erha(s somethin worse may be#all us, but it will be #or the oo! o# all, an! e cause we wish to !estroy in,ustice an! misery. -ou who ha"e toile! all your li#e an! su##ere! like us #rom hun er)you who (erha(s will ha"e to o into a workhouse to !ie when you can toil no lon er)you, at least, ou ht not to (ut yoursel# on the si!e o# the entle#olks an! the o"ernment an! #all u(on those who try to im(ro"e the lot o# the (oor. William. My !ear boy, I know that the worl! oes on "ery ba!ly, but to try to chan e it is like tryin to strai hten the le s o# a ban!y/le e! !o . 0o let us take thin s as they are, an! (ray 1o! that at least we may ne"er be in want o# a crust o# brea!. There ha"e always been rich an! (oor, an! we, who are born to labor, ou ht to work an! be contente! with what 1o! sen!s us, otherwise we !isturb the (ublic (eace an! in,ure

our own character. Jack. $ur character% .ook at these entle#olks, as you call them. 2irst o# all, they take e"erythin #rom us, an! make us toil like beast o# bur!en to earn a crust o# brea!, whilst they are li"in lu'uriously an! i!ly on the sweat o# our brow, an! then, i# we !ont submit cheer#ully to see them rowin #at at our e'(ense, the say we are a ba!, !ishonest lot, the (oliceman comes an! !ra s us to (rison an! the cler yman sen!s us to hell. I tell you what, William, the real rascals an! ba! characters are those who li"e by o((ression, those who ha"e taken (ossession o# e"erythin un!er the sun an! ha"e roun! !own the workers until they are like a #lock o# shee(, &uietly allowin themsel"es to be shorn an! slau htere!. An! you, you ha"e ne"er sucke! the li#e/ bloo! out o# your #ellow/men, !o you take the (art o# (eo(le who !o such thin s, !o you turn u(on us? Isnt it enou h #or them to ha"e the 1o"ernment to back them u(? 1o"ernment is ma!e by the rich #or the bene#it o# the rich an! is boun! to be on their si!e, but must the workers, our own brothers turn a ainst us ,ust because we want them to ha"e brea! an! #ree!om? Ah% I# it werent that I remember all the lon a es o# misery an! ser"itu!e an! !e ra!e! habits the (oor ha"e su##ere!, I shoul! say that the worst (eo(le o# all, those who ha"e the least o# the !i nity o# man, are the (oor who let themsel"es be ma!e the tools o# the o((ressors o# humanity. As #or us, at least we are riskin the bit o# brea! an! shre! o# liberty we ha"e that we may brin about a state o# thin s in which all may be ha((y. William. Well, all soun!s "ery #ine+ but you know, my la!, that without the #ear o# 1o! no oo! thin is (ossible an! we must all submit to 3is will. Jack. 4ow, William, i# we are oin to talk reasonable, !o let us lea"e 1o! out o# the &uestion, because the name o# 1o! is use! as a (rete't an! ,usti#ication by all those that are tryin to !ecei"e an! o((ress their #ellow men. 5in s (reten! that 1o! has i"en them the ri ht to rei n, an! when two kin s !is(ute about the crown o# a country, they both (reten! to hol! their commissions #rom 1o!. 4e"ertheless 1o! i"es the "ictory to him who has most sol!iers or the best arms. The (ro(rietor, the e'(loiter, the mono(olist, all s(eak o# 1o!. The Catholic (riest, the 6rotestant, the Jewish, the Turkish, all alike cal themsel"es the re(resentati"e o# 1o!, an! it is in the name o# 1o! that they make war u(on one another an! try to brin rist each one to his own mill. They all seem to think that 1o! has i"en e"erythin to them an! con!emne! us all to misery an! rin!in toil. They are to ha"e 6ara!ise in this worl! an! the ne't too+ but we are to ha"e 3ell in this li#e, an! only to ha"e 6ara!ise in the ne't i# here we are obe!ient sla"es. 4ow is you come an! tell me that an! 1o! has really wille! an! !esire! such an! arran ements this, I can only say that he is a "ery wicke! one. .est e"ery one belie"e as he thinks ri ht, but when we are !iscussin the state o# thin s in this worl!, let us stick to what we know somethin about an! see i# it isnt (ossible to et a little ha((iness in this li#e #or oursel"es an! our #ellowmen+ #or you know that the (arson himsel# says that all men are 1o!s chil!ren an! there#ore brothers. William. 76on my wor!, youn man, since you"e been to the town an! take to rea!in an! writin , you"e ot a way o# s(eakin that woul! (u88le a lawyer. But now tell me, is it really true, as they say, that you want to steal all the (ro(erty o# ay one who has ot any? Jack. 1oo!% 4ow at last we"e come to the (oint. 4o, that is not true, we !ont want to

steal anythin whate"er. What we !o wish is that the 6eo(le shoul! take the (ro(erty o# the rich an! make it common, #or the bene#it to all. That woul! not be stealin , the 6eo(le woul! sim(ly be takin a ain what is their own. William. What% *o you mean to say that the entle#olks (ro(erty is ours? Jack. Certainly+ it is our (ro(erty+ it is e"erybo!ys (ro(erty. Who a"e it to the rich (eo(le? 3ow ha"e they earne! it? What ri ht ha! they to sei8e u(on it an! what ri ht ha"e they to kee( it? William. But their ancestors ha"e le#t it to them. Jack. An! who a"e it to their ancestors? .ook here now+ the stron est an! the luckiest took a!"anta e o# their stren th or their luck to take (ossession o# e"erythin an! so #orce! the others to work #or them+ an! not satis#ie! with li"in in i!leness themsel"es, o((ressin an! star"in the reater (art o# their contem(oraries, they must nee!s lea"e their sons an! ran!sons the #ortune they ha"e usur(e!, thus con!emnin #uture enerations to be the sla"es o# their !escen!ants+ thou h now these !escen!ants ha"e become so en#eeble! by in!olence an! the lon e'ercise o# (ower, that they coul! ne"er !o to/!ay what their #ore#athers !i! lon a o. *oes all this seem to you ,ust? William. Well, no+ not i# they ot their wealth by #orce. But the entle#olks say that they ot their wealth #rom labour, an! it !oes not seem #air to me to take away #rom any man what he has worke! #or. Jack. Always the same ol! story% 6eo(le who !o not work an! ne"er ha"e worke!, are #or e"er s(eakin in the name o# labour% But tell me+ Who (ro!uce! the earth, metals, coal, stone an! so #orth, by his labour? $r how !i! these thin s come to e'ist? Isnt it a #act that we all #in! them when we come into the worl!, that there#ore we all ou ht to be able to make use o# them? What woul! you say i# the rich (eo(le thou ht #ir to take (ossession o# the air #or their own use, an! only to i"e us a little, an! that the most im(ure, makin us (ay them #or the use o# it with our toil? 4ow the only !i##erence between the earth an! the air is that they ha"e been able to lay hol! o# an! !i"i!e the earth, while they coul! not !o this with the air, but belie"e me that, i# the thin were (ossible, they woul! !eal with the air ,ust as they !o with the lan!. William. True+ thats ri ht enou h. The lan! an! al the thin s that nobo!y has ma!e ou ht to belon to all. But there are thin s that ha"e not come o# themsel"es. Jack. Certainly, there are thin s that are ma!e by mans work an! the lan! itsel# woul! be worth "ery little i# it were not cleare! by the han! o# man. But in common #airness these thin s shoul! belon to those who (ro!uce them. By what miracle !oe sit ha((en that they are in the (ossession o# e'actly those (eo(le who are !oin another an! ha"e ne"er !one anythin ? William. But the entle#olks state that their #athers ha"e worke! an! ma!e sa"in s. Jack. An! they ou ht to say, on the contrary, that their #athers ha"e ma!e other work without (ayin them, ,ust as is !one to/!ay. 3istory teaches us that the lot o# the worker has continually been wretche! an! that he who has honestly laboure! without takin a!"anta e o# his nei hbor has ne"er been able to lay by any consi!erable

sa"in s. 1enerally he has not been able to et enou h to kee( him #rom nee!. .ook at what is oin on be#ore you eyes. *oes not all that the workers (ro!uce o into the han!s o# the masters? A man s(en!s a #ew (oun!s on an unculti"ate! bit o# marshy roun!, (uts some men there to work an! i"es them scarcely enou h to li"e on, whilst he stays &uietly in town an! !oes nothin . A #ew years a#ter, this bit o# waste lan! is a ar!en, with a hun!re! times its ori inal "alue. The sons o# the (ro(rietor will inherit this #ortune an! say they are en,oyin the #ruits o# their #athers labour+ whilst the sons o# the men who really toile! an! su##ere! there will continue to toil an! su##er. That to you think o# that? William. But i#, as you say, the worl! really has always been thus, there is nothin to be !one an! the em(loyers cannot hel( it. Jack. Well, I am rea!y to a!mit e"erythin in #a"our o# the entry. .et us su((ose that the hol!ers o# (ro(erty are all sons o# (eo(le who ha"e worke! an! ma!e sa"in s an! he the workers are all sons o# i!le s(en!thri#ts. This is ob"iously ri!iculous, you un!erstan!+ but e"en i# thin s actually were so, woul! there be any ,ustice at all in the (resent social or ani8ation? I# you work an! I am a la8y !o , it is ri ht enou h I shoul! be (unishe! #or my la8iness+ but this is no reason that my sons, who may be honest workin men, shoul! be worke! to !eath an! #amishe! to kee( your sons in i!leness an! (lenty. William. All that is "ery #ine, an! I !ont say to the contrary, but then the entle#olks ha"e ot the (ro(erty, an!, when alls sai! an! !one, we must be rate#ul to them, because i# it werent #or them (eo(le coul! not et a li"in . Jack. I# they ha"e the wealth it is because they ha"e taken it by #orce an! ha"e increase! it by (ocketin the #ruit o# other (eo(les labour. But they may chance to lose it the same way as it was aine!. 9ntil now men ha"e been #i htin with one another+ they ha"e been tryin to snatch the brea! out o# one anothers mouths, an! each has esteeme! himsel# ha((y i# he coul! sub,u ate his #ellow an! use him #or a beast o# bur!en. But it is time this state o# thin s was (ut an en! to. We ain nothin by #i htin with one another+ the only har"est we ha"e rea(e! is (o"erty, sla"ery, crime, (rostitution, an! now an! a ain, those bloo!/lettin s calle! wars an! re"olutions. I# instea! we coul! come to a mutual a reement, lo"e an! ai! each other, we shoul! see no more o# these e"ils+ there woul! no lon er be some (eo(le with a reat !eal an! other with nothin at all, an! we shoul! all be tryin to make e"ery one as well o## as (ossible. $# course I know that the rich, who are accustome! to rule an! to li"e without workin , will not hear o# a chan e o# system. We shall act accor!in ly. I# they come to un!erstan! that there ou ht no lon er to be hate an! ine&uality between men, an! that all ou ht to work, so much the better+ i#, on the contrary, they claim a ri ht to continue to en,oy the #ruits o# their own an! their #athers "iolence an! robbery, so much the worse #or them: they ha"e taken what they (ossess by #orce, an! by #orce we shall take it #rom them. I# the (oor know how to come to an un!erstan!in , they are strin er than the rich. William. But when there are no more entle#olks how shall we mana e to li"e? Who will i"e us work? Jack. What a &uestion% Why you see what ha((ens e"ery !ay+ that it is you who !i , (lou h, sow, rea(, you who thresh the corn, who #ee! the beasts, who make the better

a! cheese, an! yet you ask me how we shall li"e without the entle#ollks? Ask me rather how the entry woul! mana e to li"e without us, (oor #ools o# workin men in town an! country, who sla"e to clothe an! #ee! them. A moment a o you wante! us to be rate#ul to the em(loyers because they enable us to li"e. *ont you un!erstan! that it is they who are li"in on your work an! that e"ery bit o# brea! they eat is taken #rom your chil!ren, e"ery #ine (resent they make their wi"es means the (o"erty, hun er, col!, e"en (erha(s the (rostitution o# yours? What so these entle#olks (ro!uce? 4othin . There#ore what they consume is taken #rom the workers. 0u((ose all a ricultural labourers !isa((eare! to/morrow+ there woul! be no one to till the roun! an! e"ery one woul! be star"e!. I# the shoemakers !isa((eare!, there woul! be no more shoes+ i# the masons "anishe!, there woul! be no one to buil! houses, an! so #orth. I# each class o# workers #aile!, one a#ter anther, with each a branch o# (ro!uction woul! !isa((ear an! men ha"e to !o without some use#ul or necessary thin s. But what harm woul! it !o us to be ri! o# the entry% It woul! be like the !isa((earance o# the locusts. William. -es, it really is we who (ro!uce e"erythin + but how coul! I, #or instance, row corn i# I ha! neither lan! nor beasts nor see!? I am sure there is nothin #or us but to be !e(en!ent u(on the em(loyers. Jack. Come now, William, !o we un!erstan! one another or not? I ha"e tol! you alrea!y what we must take #rom the masters what is nee!#ul to enable us to work an! li"e, lan!, tools, see! an! all. I know "ery well that as lon as the lan! an! instruments o# labour belon to the masters, the workers must always be in sub,ection an! will rea( nau ht but sla"ery an! (o"erty. This is ,ust why the "ery #irst thin to !o is to take away (ro(erty #rom the mi!!le/class+ without that the worl! will ne"er men!. William. -ou are ri ht, you !i! say so. But all this is so new that I et &uite lost. 4ow e'(lain a bit how you woul! !o. What woul! be !one with this (ro(erty taken #rom the rich? It woul! be !i"i!e!, I su((ose? Jack. 4o, no, nothin o# the sort. I# you hear any one say that we want to !i"i!e u( (ro(erty an! take the (lace o# those who ha"e it now, you may rely u(on it that he !oes not know what he is talkin about or is a scoun!rel. William. Well then, I !ont un!erstan! in the least. Jack. An! yet it is (lain enou h+ we sim(ly wish to (ut e"erythin in common. We start with the (rinci(le that e"ery one ou ht to work an! e"ery one ou ht to be as well o## as (ossible. A man cant li"e in this worl! without work+ i# he !oes not work himsel# he must li"e u(on the labour o# others, which is un,ust an! hurt#ul. But o# course you must un!erstan! that hen I say that all must work, I mean all those who can !o+ cri((les, in"ali!s, an! ol! (eo(le ou ht to be su((orte! by society, because human #eelin #orbi!s us to let any one su##er+ an! besi!es we all row ol!, an! we are all liable to become cri((le! or sickly at any time, an! so may those who are !ear to us. 4ow i# you think it o"er care#ully, you will see that all wealth, that is to say all thin s which are use#ul to man, can be !i"i!e! into two sorts. $ne, which inclu!es lan!, machinery an! all instruments o# labour, iron, woo!, stone, the means o# trans(ort, etc., etc., is absolutely necessary to enable us to work an! ou ht to be (ut in common #or e"ery one to work with. As to the metho! o# workin , we shall see about that later. I belie"e it woul! be best to work in common, because in that way one (ro!uces more

with less #ati ue, an!, in many tra!es, i# each (erson ha! to work se(arately, we shoul! ha"e to i"e u( usin machines which reatly sim(li#y an! !iminish the labour o# man. Besi!es, when human bein s ha"e no nee! to snatch the brea! out o# one anothers mouths, they will not be like cats an! !o s, but will take (leasure inbein to ether. Certainly those who choose to work alone will be le#t to !o so, the essential thin s that no one shoul! li"e without workin , thus com(ellin others to work #or him+ but o# course that woul! not be likely to ha((en where each ha! a ri ht to eh material #or work an! woul! certainly not choose to make himsel# the ser"ant o# another. The other sort o# wealth inclu!es the thin s which !irectly ser"e the nee!s o# man, like #oo!, clothes, houses. I think these ou ht to be (ut in common an! !istribute! in such a way that (eo(le can et on until the new har"est an! until in!ustry has su((lie! some new (ro!uce. As #or the thin s that will be (ro!uce! a#ter the ;e"olution, when there will be no la8y em(loyers li"in on the toil o# #amishin (roletarians, the workers o# each country will share them as they choose. I# they are willin to work in common an! to (ut e"erythin in common, that will be best+ in that case they will try to re ulate (ro!uction in such a way as to satis#y the nee!s o# all, an! consum(tion in such a way as to secure the reatest well/bein to e"ery one. I# they !o not (rocee! in this way, they must calculate what each (ro!uces so that each may take an amount o# thin e&ui"alent to what he has (ro!uce!. This calculation is rather !i##icult, I think mysel# it is almost im(ossible+ so the result will (robably be that when they see the !i##iculties o# (ro(ortionate !istribution, they will be more incline! to acce(t the i!ea o# (uttin e"erythin in common. But any way, thin s o# the #irst necessity, like brea!, !wellin s, water an! suchlike, must be secure! to e"ery one, re ar!less o# the amount o# work he may !o. Whate"er or ani8ation is a!o(te!, inheritance shoul! e'ist no lon er, #or it is not ,ust that one shoul! be born to wealth an! another to hun er an toil. E"en i# we a!mit that each is absolute master o# what he (ro!uces an! may make sa"in s on his own account, those sa"in s ou ht to return to the community at his !eath. Chil!ren ou ht to be brou ht u( an! e!ucate! at the cost o# all an! in such a #ashion as to (rocure them the reatest !e"elo(ment an! best attainable teachin . Without that, there can be neither ,ustice nor e&uality, the (rinci(le o# the ri ht o# each to the instruments o# labour will be "iolate!, #or it !oes not su##ice to i"e men lan! an! machinery i# they are not also (ut in a con!ition to make the best (ossible use o# them. I !o not say anythin s(ecially about women, because we think women shoul! be the e&uals o# men an! when we s(eak o# <men= we mean human bein s without !istinction o# se'. William. There is ,us tone thin : to take the #ortune o# rich men who ha"e robbe! an! star"e! the (oor is all "ery well+ but i# a man by har! work an! sa"in has (ut by somethin to buy a little #iel!, or o(en a little sho(, what ri ht ha"e you to take #rom him what is really the #ruit o# his labour? Jack. That is not an o"er common case in these !ays when ca(italists an! o"ernments make a clean swee( o# so much o# the (ro!uce+ but any way, I ha"e tol! you that each (erson has a ri ht to ray material an! the instruments o# labour an!, #or that reason, i# a man has a bit o# roun! which he culti"ates with his own han!s, he mi ht ,ust as well kee( it an! he woul! be i"en besi!es all the best tools an! manures an! e"erythin else he re&uire! to make it (ro!uce as much as (ossible. Certainly it woul! be the best (lan to (ut e"erythin in common+ but there will be no nee! to #orce (eo(le to !o so because a like interest will ur e all to a!o(t a communist system. Thin s will o better with common (ro(erty an! work, an! "ery likely there

may be more, which it is more con"enient to use in common. William. Machinery% The machines are what we ou ht to burn% It is the machines that break our arms an! take away our brea!. 3ere, in the country, as sure as a machine comes, we can reckon on our wa es oin !own an! some o# us losin our work an! ha"in to o somewhere else. It must be worse in the towns. I# there were no machines the entle#olks woul! want our labour more an! so we shoul! li"e a bit better. Jack. -oure ri ht, William, to think the machines one cause o# (o"erty an! loss o# work+ but that ha((ens because they belon to the rich. I# they belon e! to the workers, it woul! be ,ust the other way+ they woul! be the (rinci(le cause o# human com#ort. 2or a#ter all, machines only work in our (lace an! #aster than we !o. Thanks to machinery man will not be obli e! to toil #or lon hours to satis#y his nee!s, will not be con!emne! to (ain#ul e'ertion e'cee!in his (hysical stren th. This is why, is machinery were a((lie! to all branches o# (ro!uction an! belon e! to e"ery one, a #ew hours o# li ht an! easy work woul! su##ice #or all the nee!s o# consum(tion an! each worker woul! ha"e time to ain knowle! e, to kee( u( #rien!ly relations, in a wor!, to li"e an! en,oy li#e, (ro#itin by all the con&uests o# science an! ci"ili8ation. ;emember, that what we ha"e to !o is to take (ossession o# the machines, not !estroy them. -ou may be sure the owners will !o ,ust as much to !e#en! their machines a ainst whose who want to !estroy as a ainst those who try to take (ossession o# them+ there#ore, as there will be the same e##ort to make an! the same risk to run in either case, it will be a !ownri ht #olly to break rather than take the machines. Woul! you !estroy corn an! hoses i# they coul! be share! by all? 0urely not% Well, we must !o the same with the machines+ #or i# in the han!s o# em(loyers they are instrumental to our (o"erty an! ser"itu!e, in our han!s they will become instrumental to wealth an! #ree!om. William. But i# thin s are to o well un!er such a system, e"ery bo!y must be willin to work. Jack. $# course. William. An! su((ose there are some #olks that woul! like to li"e without workin ? Toil is a har!shi(, e"en !o s !ont like it. Jack. -ou con#use society as it is to/!ay with society as it will be a#ter the ;e"olution. -ou say that e"en !o s !ont en,oy toil+ but coul! you s(en! whole !ays !oin nothin ? William. I? 4o, because Im accustome! to work. When I"e nothin to !o my han!s seem to itch to be a#ter somethin + but there are #olks who woul! stay all !ay lon at the (ublic house (layin car!s or loun e about with their han!s in their (ockets. Jack. 4ow/a/!ays, but not a#ter the ;e"olution, an! I will tell you why. 4ow/a/!ays work is !isa reeable, ill/(ai! an! looke! !own u(on. 4ow/a/!ays the workin man ,ust #a himsel# nearly to !eath or be hal# star"e!, an! he is treate! like a beast o# bur!en. The workin man has no ho(e+ he knows that ten to one he will en! his !ays in the workhouse. 3e cant atten! to his #amily as he ou ht a! he has scarcely any en,oyment in his li#e, while he continually su##ers ill/treatment an! humiliation. $n the other han!, the man who !oes not work takes his ease in e"ery (ossible way+ he is

looke! u( to an! esteeme!+ all men an! all (leasures are at his ser"ice. E"en amon st workin men, those who !o least an! whose work is the least !isa reeable earn most an! are thou ht more o# than the others. Is it to be won!ere! at that #olks are !is uste! with work an! are ea er to sei8e an o((ortunity to !o nothin ? But when work is !one un!er con!itions #ir #or human bein s, #or a reasonable time an! accor!in to the laws o# health+ when the worker knows that he is workin #or the well/ bein o# his #amily an! o# all men+ when e"ery one who wishes to be res(ecte! must necessarily be a worker an! the la8y are as much !es(ise! as are s(ies an! (rocuresses to/!ay+ who will then wish to #ore o the ,oy o# knowin himsel# use#ul an! belo"e!, that he may li"e in an i!leness !isastrous alike to his bo!y an! his min!? E"en now/a/!ays, e"erybo!y, a(art some rare e'ce(tions, instincti"ely loathes the i!ea o# bein a s(y or a (rocuress. An! yet by these "ile callin s more can be aine! than by !i in the roun!+ there is little or no work an! more or less 0tate (rotection. But as these tra!es are reckone! abominable, nearly e"ery one (re#ers (o"erty to the in#amy o# #ollowin them. There are e'ce(tions, there are weak, !e ra!e! creatures who (re#er in#amy, but this is because their choice lies between in#amy an! (o"erty. But who woul! choose an in#amous an! contem(tible li#e when by workin he coul! secure com#ort an! (ublic esteem? Certainly such a man woul! be ma!. An! there is no !oubt that this (ublic re(robation o# i!leness woul! arise an! make itsel# #elt, #or work is essentially nee!#ul to society. I!le #olks woul! not only har! e"eryone by li"in on what others (ro!uces without contributin their own work to su((ly the wants o# the community, but also break the harmony o# the new or!er o# thin s an! become the elements o# a !iscontente! (arty, who mi ht !esire a return to the (ast. Collecti"e bo!ies are like in!i"i!uals+ they lo"e an! a!mire what is or what they think or use, an! hate an! !es(ise what they know or belie"e to be hurt#ul. They may be !ecei"e! an! too o#ten they are+ but in the case be#ore us no mistake is (ossible, #or it is clear as !ayli ht that the (erson who !oes not work, eats an! !rinks at the e'(ense o# others an! is wron in e"erybo!y. Why, su((ose you ,oin a (arty o# men to !o some work all to ether an! share an! share alike in the (ro!uce+ o# course you will be consi!erate to any o# your mates who may be weak or unskille!, but as #or a mere shirker will he not be le! such a li#e that he will take himsel# o## or else #eel incline! to set his shoul!er to the wheel? That is ,ust what will ha((en in the community at lar e is the la8iness o# some o# its members threatens to become a serious !an er. I# we coul! not o ahea! because o# those who woul! not work, which to me seems "ery unlikely, the reme!y woul!, a#ter all, not be #ar to seek+ they woul! sim(ly be turne! out o# the community. Then, as they woul! ha"e a ri ht to nothin but ray material an! the instruments o# labour, they woul! be #orce! to work i# they wishe! to li"e. William. -ou are be innin to con"ince me+ but tell me, will e"erybo!y ha"e to work in the #iel!s? Jack. Why shoul! they? Men !o not nee! only brea! an! beer an! meat. We want houses, an! clothes an! book s an! all the thin s that workers o# allsorts o# tra!es (ro!uce an! no one can by himsel# su((ly all his own nee!s. E"en to till the soil, !o we not want the hel( o# the blacksmith an! the im(lement maker #or our tools, an! conse&uently o# the miner who unearths the iron, the mason who buil!s houses an! sho(s an! so #irth. It !oes not #ollow, there#ore, tat all must till the roun!, only that all must !o some use#ul work. Besi!es the "ariety o# tra!es will allow each (erson to choose what suits hum best, an! thus, as #ar as (ossible, work will be nothin more than e'ercise, an! an ar!ently !esire! en,oyment.

William. Then e"ery one will be #ree to choose any tra!e he likes? Jack. $# course. $nly we must be care#ul that some tra!es are not o"erstocke!, whilst others want han!s. As we shall be workin #or the (ublic interest, we must arran e so that e"erythin really necessary is (ro!uce! whilst in!i"i!ual (re#erences are consulte!. But you will see that will come ri ht when we ha"e no masters to #orce us to toil #or a crust o# brea!, without knowin what is the ob,ect or use o# our work. William. -ou say it will all come ri ht, but I !ont see it. I think that no one will !o !isa reeable work+ they will all be lawyers an! !octors. Who will work in the #iel!s? Who will risk his li#e an! health in a mine? Who will o !own into the black man/holes o# the sewers or clean our cess(ools? Jack. $h, you may lea"e out the lawyers. .awyers an! (riests are a sort o# an rene in society that the re"olution will cure. .et us talk about use#ul work an! not about occu(ations carrie! on at the e'(ense o# ones nei hbours+ otherwise we mi ht count the bur lar as a worker+ he o#ten has (lenty o# e'ertion. 4ow/a/!ays we (re#er one tra!e to another not because it is more or less in accor!ance with our tastes an! #aculties, but because it is easier to learn, because we earn, or ho(e to earn, more by it, or because we think we shall run the best chance o# em(loyment in that line+ it is only in the secon! (lace that we consi!er i# such an! such work is more !isa reeable than another sort. In #ine, the choice o# a tra!e is mostly im(ose! u(on us by our birth, by chance an! by social (re,u!ice. The work o# an a ricultural labourer, #or instance, woul! not (lease e"en the (oorest townsman. An! yet there is nothin re(ulsi"e in a riculture in itsel#, an! like in the #iel!s is not without its (leasures. >ery much the contrary+ i# you rea! the (oets you will see that they are enthusiastic about country li#e. But the truth is that the (oets who write books ha"e "ery sel!om tille! the soil, whilst the #arm labourers are work out with work an! hal# star"e!, li"e worse than the beasts an! are treate! as nobo!ies, until the (oorest wretch in a town woul! har!ly chan e (laces with them. 3ow can you e'(ect (eo(le to like to be a ricultural labourers? E"en we who were born in the country, lea"e it as soon as we can, because whate"er we !o, we are better o## an! thou ht more o# elsewhere. But how many o# us woul! wish to lea"e the country, i# we were workin there on our own account an! coul! #in! com#ort, #ree!om an! res(ect in our work? It is ,ust the same in all tra!es, because as thin s are now, the har!er an! the more necessary any work is, the worse it is (ai!, the more it is !es(ise! an! the more inhuman are the con!itions un!er which it must be !one. 1o, #or e'am(le, into a ol!smiths sho( an! you will #in! that, in com(arison with the wretche! holes we li"e in, the (lace is clean, well "entilate! an! warme!, that the workin hours are not "ery lon an! that thou h the men are ill (ai!, #or the em(loyer takes the best (art o# what they (ro!uce, still they are well o## com(are! to other workers+ they can amuse themsel"es in the e"enin + when they take o## their workin ,ackets, they can o where they like, with no #ear o# bein stare! or sneere! at. But i# you o into a cutlers worksho(, you will see (oor #ellows kni#e/ rin!in there #or a miserable wa e, in a (oisonous atmos(here, which will !estroy their li"es in a #ew years, an! i#, a#ter their work, they take the liberty o# oin where entlemen are, they will be lucky i# they are not ma!e to #eel themsel"es ri!iculous. It will not be sur(risin i#, un!er such circumstances, a man (re#ers ol! workin to cutlery. To say nothin o# the workers who use no tool but a (en. Just think+ a man who only writes ba! news(a(er articles earns ten time more than a #arm labourer an! is thou ht o# much more hi hly. When ,ournalists, en ineers, !octors, artists, (ro#essors,

are in work an! know their business well, they li"e in com#ort+ but com(ositors, bricklayers, shoemakers, all sots o# han!/workers, an! some (oor teachers an! other brain/workers too, are hal#/star"e!, whilst they are worke! to !eath. I !ont mean to im(ly that the only way o# con&uerin 4ature, becomin ci"ili8e!, ainin reater #ree!om an! well/bein + !octors, en ineers, chemists, teachers, are as use#ul in mo!ern society as #arm/labourers an! other han!workers. I only mean to say that all use#ul work shoul! be e&ually a((reciate! an! so arran e! that the worker may #in! e&ual satis#action in !oin it+ an! also that intellectually work, bein a reat (leasure in itsel#, an! i"in the man who !oe it a reat su(eriority o"er those who remain in i norance, shoul! be (ut within the reach o# e"ery one an! not remain the (ri"ile e o# a #ew. William. But i#, as you yoursel# say, intellectual work is a reat (leasure an! i"es those who !o it an a!"anta e o"er others who are i norant, surely e"ery one woul! want to stu!y+ I shoul! as much as any bo!y. An! then who is to !o the manual work? Jack. E"ery one+ because whilst stu!yin literature an! science they shoul! also !o (hysical work+ e"ery one shoul! work with both hea! an! han!s. These two sorts o# work, so #ar #rom inter#erin with one another, are su((lementary+ #or a healthy man nee!s to e'ercise all his or ans, his brains as well as his muscles. 3e whose intelli ence is !e"elo(e! an! who is accustome! to think !oes best at manual work, an! he who is soun! an! healthy, as (eo(le are who e'ercise their limbs un!er healthy con!itions, has his min! in a more wi!e/awake an! (enetratin state. Besi!es, as both kin!s o# work are necessary an! as one is (leasanter than the other an! has enable! man to attain to the !i nity o# sel#/consciousness, it is not ,ust that a (art o# mankin! shoul! be con!emne! to the stu(e#yin e##ects o# e'clusi"ely manual toil, that the (ri"ile e o# science, which means (ower, may be le#t to a #ew. There#ore, I say a ain, e"ery bo!y shoul! work at once (hysically an! intellectually. William. I can un!erstan! that+ but there is manual work which is har! an! manual work which is easy, some is u ly, some is beauti#ul. 4ow who woul! be a miner, #or instance, or a sca"en er? Jack. My !ear William, i# you only knew what in"entions an! researches are bein ma!e e"ery !ay, you woul! see that e"en now, i# the or ani8ation o# work !i! not !e(en! u(on (eo(le who are not workin themsel"es an! conse&uently !ont trouble about the com#ort o# the workers, all manual labor coul! be carrie! on un!er con!itions which woul! (re"ent it #rom bein re(ulsi"e, unhealthy an! toilsome. There#ore there is no reason why any work shoul! not be !one by workers who ha"e chosen it "oluntarily. An! i# this woul! be (ossible to/!ay, ,ust #ancy what mi ht ha((en when, e"erybo!y ha"in to work, the stu!ies an! e##orts o# all woul! be !irecte! towar!s makin work less bur!ensome an! more (leasant. An! i# a#ter all there wee still some cra#ts har!er than others, it coul! be arran e! to make u( #or these ine&ualities by some s(ecial a!"anta es. Besi!es, when men are workin in common, #or the common bene#it, we see arisin amon st them that same s(irit o# brotherliness an! com(liance which belon s to #amily li#e in its best as(ect+ so that each, #ar #rom seekin only to sa"e himsel# trouble, tries rather to take the hea"iest work #or his own share. William. ;i ht enou h, i# all this ha((ens+ but su((ose it !oesnt?

Jack. Well, i# in s(ite o# all this, there still remains some nee!#ul work which no one will !o by choice, then we shall e"ery one o# us ha"e to take a han! at it, each !oin a little, workin at it, #or e'am(le, one !ay a month, one week a yea, or somethin like that. But set your min! at rest. I# a thin is nee!#ul #or e"ery one, means will certainly be #oun! to !o it. William. *o you know, you are be innin to talk me o"er% -et theres one thin I cant ri htly see my way to. Its a bi ,ob that takin away (ro(erty #rom the entry. I !ont know, but)isnt there anythin else you coul! !o? Jack. 3ow woul! you mana e? Whilst it remains in the han!s o# the rich they will be cocks o the walk an! will #ollow u( their own interests without troublin about ours, as they ha"e !one since the be innin o# time. But why !ont you want to take away (ro(erty #rom the entle#olk? 6erha(s you #ancy that it woul! be un#air, an! a wron thin to !o? William. 4o, no+ a#ter what you ha"e tol! me it seems to me that it woul! be "ery ri ht, as in tearin away #orm them, we are snatchin #rom them also our won bo!ies on which they are #ee!in . An! besi!es we are not takin their #ortune #or oursel"es, but to (ut it in common to !o oo! to e"ery one, arent we? Jack. Most assure!ly. An! i# you look close at the matter, you will see that the entry themsel"es will also be the ainers. They will ha"e to i"e u( or!erin others about, (uttin on airs an! races, an! i!lin + they will ha"e to set to work, but when work is !one with the hel( o# the workers, it will become nothin but a use#ul, (leasant e'ercise. *o not the entry now/a/!ays o huntin ? *o they not ri!e on horseback, (ractice ymnastics an! take e'ercise in other ways which (ro"e that muscular e'ertion is a necessity an! a (leasure to healthy, well/#e! men? 2or them then it is merely a &uestion o# (uttin into (ro!uction the (hysical ener y they now (ut #orth (urely as an amusement. An! then how much a!"anta e they will rea( #rom the eneral well/bein % .ook, #or e'am(le, at what we see be#ore our eyes. A #ew entle#olks are wealthy an! can (lay the lor! in their own houses, but #or them as #or us the streets are hi!eous an! #ilthy, an! the ba! air which rises #rom our ho"els an! slums makes them ill as well as us+ with their (ri"ate #ortunes they cant im(ro"e the whole country, a thin which coul! be !one easily i# e"ery one set about it. $ur (o"erty is a continual bli ht u(on their li"es, actin u(on them in!irectly in a million ways, without countin their !rea! o# a "iolent re"olution. -ou see then that we shall be only !oin oo! to the entle#olk by takin their wealth. Thou h they certainly !ont un!erstan! this, an! ne"er will, because they like to i"e or!ers an! they #ancy that the (oor are #ashione! o# a !i##erent clay #rom themsel"es. But what matter? I# they will not come to terms with us, so much the worse #or them, we shall know how to #orce them to !o so. William. That is all #air enou h+ but cant thin s be !one bit by bit, by mutual a reement? 6ro(erty mi ht be le#t to those who (ossess it, but on con!ition that they woul! increase wa es, an! treat us like human bein s. Then, ra!ually, we mi ht lay by somethin , an! we too mi ht buy a bit o# lan!, an!, at last, when we were all (ro(erty owners, we woul! (ut e"erythin in common, as you say. There was a cha( I hear! (ro(osin somethin o# the sort. Jack. 4ow look here% There is only one way o# comin to #rien!ly terms, an! that is #or

the (ro(erty owners "oluntarily to renounce their (ro(erty. But you know, as well as I !o, that it is no oo! thinkin o# that. Whilst (ri"ate (ro(erty e'ists, that is whilst the lan!, instea! o# belon in to e"ery one, belon s to 6eter or 6aul, there will always be (o"erty an! thin s will o #rom ba! to worse. 9n!er (ri"ate (ro(erty each is tryin all the time to bein rist to his own mill. The (ro(erty owners not only try to i"e the workers as little as they can, but they are always #i htin amon st themsel"es. 1enerally s(eakin each tries to sell his (ro!uce #or as much as he can, an! each buyer, on his si!e, tries to (ay as little as (ossible. An! then what ha((ens? The lan! owners, manu#acturers, an! lar e merchants, who can manu#acture an! sell wholesale, (ro"i!e themsel"es with machinery, take a!"anta e o# all #a"ourable states o# the market, wait until the ri ht moment to sell or e"en sell at a loss #or a time, en! by ruinin the small (ro(rietors an! !ealers, who sink into (o"erty an! are obli e!, they an! their chil!ren, to o an! work #or a !aily wa e. Thus ?it s a thin we see e"ery !ay@ men who work on their own account alone or with a #ew ,ourneymen, are !ri"en, a#ter a bitter stru le, to shit u( sho(, an! o to seek work in bi #actories, small lan!/owners who cannot et enou h ca(ital #or their #armin an! cannot e"en (ay their tithes an! ta'es ha"e to sell their #iel!s an! houses to the lar e (ro(rietors, an! so on. I# a kin!/hearte! em(loyer really wishe! to better the con!ition o# his work/ (eo(le, he coul! only (ut himsel# in a (osition to be ruine! by com(etition. $n the other han!, the workers are oa!e! by hun er into com(etin with one another+ an! as there are more han!s to be ha! than are nee!e! #or the work to be !one, they are continually snatchin the brea! out o# each others mouths. 4ot that there is not (lenty o# work that nee!s !oin , but that at any (articular time there is only a certain amount which it (ays the em(loyer to ha"e !one. Thanks to this situation, (ro ress itsel# becomes a mis#ortune. A machine is in"ente!: imme!iately a number o# men are thrown out o# work+ they can earn nothin , there#ore cannot consume as be#ore, an! thus in!irectly e##ect the brea!winnin o# other workers. In America wi!e tracts o# lan! are brou ht un!er culti"ation an! much corn (ro!uce!: the lan!/ownin , or course without en&uirin i# e"erybo!y in the 9nite! 0tates has (lenty to eat, shi( their rain o"er here that they may et more #or it. 3ere the (rice o# corn is lower, but the (oor !o not rea( the a!"anta e, #or the Euro(ean lan!/owners, not able to com(ete with this chea(ness, let the soil o out o# culti"ation, e'ce(t some o# the most (ro!ucti"e (ortions, an! thus a number o# a ricultural labourers lose their em(loyment. When a man has not e"en a (enny in his (ocket chea( brea! is no oo! to him. William. Ah+ now I un!erstan!% I"e hear! say that they woul! not let the corn come #rom abroa!, an! I thou ht is a rascally thin to try to kee( #oo! out o# the country+ I belie"e! the entle#olks an! the #armers between them wante! to star"e the (eo(le. But now I see they ha! their reasons. Jack. 4o, no+ i# the corn !i! not come it woul! be "ery ba! #rom another (oint o# "iew. Then the lan!lor!s an! #armers, ha"in no com(etition to #ear #rom outsi!e, woul! sell at any (rice they chose an!) William. Then what is to be !one? Jack. *one? I tol! you be#ore+ e"erythin must be (ut in common. An! then the more (ro!uce there is the better it will be.

William. But now tell me: how woul! it be i# an arran ement were ma!e with the owners o# (ro(erty: they to contribute the lan! an! ca(ital an! we the work+ the (ro!uce to be share! between us an! them? What !o you say to that? Jack. 2irst o# all I say that i# you were willin to o shares, ten to one your master woul! be willin to !o nothin o# the sort. -ou woul! be obli e! to use #orce to brin him to it. But in that case, why !o thin s by hal"es? Why content yoursel# with a system which allows in,ustice an! (arasitism to continue an! (resents the increase o# (ro!uction? An! #urther, what ri ht ha"e certain men who !o not work to come an! take hal# o# what is (ro!uce! by the workers? Besi!es, as I ha"e tol! you, it is not only that hal# the (ro!uce woul! o to the em(loyers, but that the sum total o# (ro!uce woul! be less than it mi ht be, because where you ha"e (ri"ate (ro(erty an! isolate! labour less is (ro!uce! that by workin in common. It is like when you want to mo"e a rock: a hun!re! men woul! not succee! by tryin sin ly, whereas by unitin their e##orts two or three can raise it easily. I# one man wishe! to make a (in, I !ont know i# he coul! et throu h it in an hour+ whereas ten men workin into each others han!s can make thousan!s o# (ins a !ay. Economists, many o# whom ha"e le themsel"es be scan!alously biase! by class (re,u!ice, ha"e o#ten sai! that (ro(erty is not the result o# the sei8ure o# (ro(erty by the u((er classes, but o# the scarcity o# natural (ro!ucts, which woul!, say they, be &uite insu##icient, i# they were !istribute! to all men. This enables the sai! economists an! their !isci(les to conclu!e that (o"erty is an ine"itable thin , a ainst which no measures can be taken. *ont belie"e a wor! o# it. E"en as thin s are or ani8e! to/!ay, the (ro!uce o# the earth an! o# in!ustry is enou h to enable e"ery man to li"e in com#ort+ an! i# it is not more abun!ant, that is the em(loyers #ault. They thin o# nothin but how much they can ain, an! e"en o so #ar as to !estroy articles or let them o to waste merely to kee( u( the (rice. Whilst they (reten! there is not enou h natural wealth, they are lea"in lar e tracts o# country unculti"ate! an! numbers o# workmen with nothin to !o. But, answer a certain school o# economists, e"en when all roun! is brou ht un!er culti"ation an! tille! as intelli ently as may be, still the (ro!ucti"e (ower o# the earth is limite! an! the increase o# (o(ulation is not. There#ore there must always some a moment when the (ro!uction o# #oo! stu##s will be stationary, whilst (o(ulation will o on rowin in!e#initely an! with it #amine. The sole reme!y, they conclu!e, #or social ills is that the (oor shoul! ha"e "ery #ew chil!ren. Im not "ery learne! about the law o# rent but Im sure this reme!y is no cure #or our social e"ils. -ou ha"e only to look at countries where there is (lenty o# lan! an! a scanty (o(ulation+ you will see as much or more (o"erty as where (o(ulation is !ense. We must chan e our social or ani8ation an! brin all the lan! un!er culti"ation, an! then, i# the (o(ulation seems rowin too #ast, we can consi!er how to check it. But let us o back to the &uestion o# (ro!uce/sharin between (ro(erty/owner an! workman. It is a system which use! to e'ist in (arts o# 2rance in #iel! work. It still e'ists in Tuscany, but it is ra!ually !isa((earin because the lan!owners #in! !ay/labour (ay them better. 4ow/a/!ays, what with machines, scienti#ic culture an! #orei n (ro!uce, the masters are obli e! to #arm on a lar e scale an! em(loy hire! labourers. I# they !ont, they are ruine! by com(etition. I# they (resent system oes on, I belie"e that (ro(erty will be more an! more concentrate! in the han!s o# a #ew, an! the workers re!uce! to utter wretche!ness by machinery an! ra(i! metho!s o# (ro!uction. We shall ha"e a #ew bi #inanciers an! ca(italists masters o# the worl!, a certain number o# workmen atten!in u(on the machines, an! a number o# ser"ants an! (olice to wait on an! !e#en! the a#oresai! bi men. The mass o# the (eo(le will ha"e to !ie o# hun er or li"e on charity. The be innin s o# such

a stat o# thin s may alrea!y be seen+ small (ro(erties are !isa((earin , the numbers o# out/o/works increases, the entle#olks, #rom #ear or #rom (ity, busy themsel"es with sou( kitchens an! the schemes o# 1eneral Booth. I# the (eo(le !o not wish to be re!uce! to be their brea! #rom rich (hilanthro(ists or .ocal Boar!s, as they once !i! at the ates o# monasteries, let them lose no time in takin (ossession o# the lan! an! machinery an! workin on their own account. William. But how woul! it !o i# 1o"ernment were to make some oo! laws to #orce rich (eo(le not to make the (oor su##er? Jack. The same ol! story, William% Isnt the o"ernment ma!e u( o# entle#olks, an! is it likely that they will make laws a ainst themsel"es? But e"en su((osin the (oor coul! mana e to take their turn at o"ernin , woul! that be a reason #or lea"in the rich with the means o# ettin the u((er han! a ain? ;ely u(on it, where"er there are rich an! (oor, the (oor may make their "oices hear! #or a moment !urin an outbreak, but the rich will always et hol! o# the (ower in the en!. This is why we, i# we are the strin er #or e"er so short a time, must at once take (ro(erty away #rom the rich, so that they may not ha"e the means o# (uttin thin s back as they were be#ore. William. I un!erstan!. We must ha"e a real ;e(ublic, make all men e&ual, an! then the man who works will eat, an! the man who !oes nothin can o with an em(ty stomach. Ah me% Im sorry Im ol!. -ou youn #olks will see a oo! time. Jack. 0o#tly, so#tly, #rien!% By the wor! <;e(ublic= you mean the 0ocial ;e"olution, an! #or those who un!erstan! you that is all "ery well. But you are e'(ressin yoursel# ba!ly+ #or what is commonly un!erstoo! by a ;e(ublic is not at all what you mean. 1et it well into your hea! that re(ublican o"ernment is a o"ernment like the rest+ only instea! o# a kin there is a (resi!ent an! ministers, who really ha"e ,ust the same (owers. We see that "ery (lainly across the Channel, an! e"en i# the 2rench ha! the !emocratic re(ublic (romise! by their ra!icals, they woul!nt be any better o##. Instea! o# two Chambers they woul! ha"e one, the Chamber o# *e(uties, but woul!nt the (eo(le be #orce! to be sol!iers an! to work like sla"es all the same, in s(ite o# all the #ine (romises o# the entlemen !e(uties? *ont you see that as lon as there are rich an! (oor, the rich will ha"e the u((er han!? Whether we li"e un!er a ;e(ublic or a Monarchy the results which s(rin #rom (ri"ate (ro(erty will always e'ist. Whilst economic relations are re ulate! by com(etition, (ro(erty will be concentrate! in a #ew han!s, machines will take work #rom workin men an! the masses will be re!uce! to misery. 3a"e any o# the ;e(ublics that e'ist seriously bettere! the con!ition o# the workin classes? William. Well to be sure% An! I always belie"e! that ;e(ublic meant e&uity% Jack. -es, the re(ublicans say so, an! this is how they make it but+ <9n!er a really !emocratic ;e(ublic,= say they, <the members o# (arliament who make the laws are electe! by the whole (eo(le. Conse&uently when the (eo(le are not contente!, they chan e their M.6.s #or better ones an! e"erythin comes ri ht. An! as the (oor are the reat ma,ority, it is (ractically they who o"ern.= That is what the re(ublicans say, but the reality is somethin &uite !i##erent. The "ery (o"erty o# the (oor causes them to be i norant an! su(erstitious, an! they will remain so as lon as they are not economically in!e(en!ent an! are unconscious o# their true interest. -ou an! I who ha"e been lucky enou h to earn more than some an! to be able to teach oursel"es a

little, may ha"e intelli ence to un!erstan! where our interests lie an! stren th to #ace the em(loyers re"en e+ but the reat mass will ne"er be able to !o so as lon as (resent con!itions last. In a time o# ;e"olution one bra"e man is worth a score o# timi! ones an! !raws alon with him numbers who, le#t to themsel"es, woul! ne"er ha"e the ener y to re"olt. But in #ront o# a ballot/bo' character an! ener y o #or nothin . Mere numbers are all that tell. An! in the (resent state o# thin s the reatest number will always be #or the men who hol! their !aily brea! in their han!s an! can i"e or withhol! it at their (leasure. 3a"ent you ha((ene! to notice as much? To/!ay the reater (art o# the electors are (oor, but how o#ten !o you see them choosin men o# their own class to re(resent them an! !e#en! their interests? William. 4o, most o# 7em !ont like to run the chance o# o##en!in the lan!lor!, the (arson, or their em(loyer. I# they !o, they are as like as not to be turne! o## an! e"en e"icte!. Jack. 4ot a ho(e#ul outlook #or the bene#its to be e'(ecte! #rom uni"ersal su##ra e, is it? The (eo(le will always sen! mi!!le/class men to (arliament, an! these will always be contri"in how to kee( the (eo(le as !e(en!ent an! submissi"e as (ossible. E"en i# we were to ha"e (ai! members an! the (oor were to take a!"anta e o# this to sen! workin men to re(resent them, what coul! they !o in so corru(t a me!ium? The #ew that ha"e been trie! ha"e not cut a "ery brilliant #i ure in any country, 4o% !urin the ne't re"olution the (eo(le must not allow themsel"es to be hoo!winke! as they ha"e so o#ten been by !emocrats an! re(ublicans. $"er an! o"er a ain the (eo(le ha"e !ro((e! their arms on bein (romise! a ;e(ublic, because they ha"e been tau ht to belie"e that it is the best (ossible #orm o# or ani8ation an! will work mar"els in their con!ition. 4e't time they must not rest content with em(ty wor!s, they must resolutely lay han!s u(on (ro(erty. William. -ou are ri ht. We ha"e been !ecei"e! so o#ten, it is time we o(ene! our eyes. But still there must always be a o"ernment, #or i# there is no one to i"e or!ers, how can thin s o on? Jack. An! why must we be or!ere!? Why cant we mana e our a##airs oursel"es? 3e who rules always seeks his own a!"anta e, an!, either i norantly or will#ully, betrays the (eo(le. 6ower makes e"en the best o# men i!!y with (ri!e. Besi!es, an! this is the (rinci(al reason #or not wishin to ha"e an chie#, men must cease to be le! like a #lock. They must row accustome! to think, an! learn to reco ni8e their !i nity an! stren th. I# the (eo(le are to be e!ucate!, an! accustome! to #ree!om an! the mana ement o# their own a##airs, they must be le#t to act #or themsel"es an! #eel themsel"es res(onsible #or their con!uct. They may o#ten make mistakes an! !o wron , but they will see the conse&uences #or themsel"es, an! un!erstan! that they ha"e !one amiss an! must o on another tack. Another thin . The harm the (eo(le may !o le#t to themsel"es will ne"er be one millioneth (art o# that which is !one by the best o# o"ernments. I# a chil! is to learn to walk, he must be let walk by himsel#, an! not be a#rai! o# the #alls he may ha"e. William. -es, but be#ore a chil! can be set !own to walk he must ha"e some stren th in his le s+ i# he has none, he must say in his mothers arms. Jack. Thats true. But o"ernments are not in the least like mothers. It is not they who im(ro"e an! buil! u( a nation. As a matter o# #act, social (ro ress is almost always

ma!e in o((osition to the o"ernment or in s(ite o# it. The most o"ernment !oes is to (ut what the masses ha"e be un to nee! an! !esire into the #orm o# law, an! this it s(oils with its s(irit o# !omination an! mono(oly. The (eo(les are in !i##erent sta es o# a!"ancement+ but in no matter what state o# ci"ili8ation, or e"en o# barbarism, a (eo(le may be, they coul! mana e their a##airs better without the o"ernment which has s(run u( amon st them. As #ar as I can see you #ancy that the o"ernment is com(ose! o# the most intelli ent an! ca(able men. 4othin o# the sort. 1enerally s(eakin o"ernments are !irectly, or be !ele ation, com(ose! o# those who ha"e the most money. An! besi!es, the e'ercise o# (ower s(oils the #inest s(irits. 6ut those who ha"e hitherto been the best o# men into the o"ernment an! see what ha((ens. They no lon er un!erstan! the nee!s o# the (eo(le, they are obli e! to busy themsel"es with the interests create! by (olitics, they are corru(te! by the absence o# the emulation an! criticism o# their social e&uals, an! they are !i"erte! #rom the s(here o# action in which they were really com(etent, to make laws about thin s they ha"e not e"en hear! o# be#ore. 2inally, they en! by belie"in themsel"es a su(eriour or!er o# bein s, an! #orm a caste which takes no hee! o# the (eo(le e'ce(t to check an! ba##le them. Better, #ar better, #or us to mana e our own a##airs, by (uttin oursel"es in a reement with the workers o# other tra!es an! other (arts o# the country+ an! not only with those o# En lan! an! Euro(e, but o# the whole worl!+ #or all men are brethren an! ha"e an interest in ai!in one another. *ont you think so? William. -es, you are ri ht. But what about the wicke!? What is to be !one with thie"es an! robbers? Jack. To be in with, when there is no more (ro(erty an! i norance we shant be trouble! with many o# that sort. But e"en su((osin there were some le#t, is that a reason to ha"e a o"ernment an! (olice? Cant we oursel"es brin them to reason? 4ot by ill/treatin them, as both innocent an! uilty are ill/use! to!ay, but by (uttin them in con!itions where they cant !o any harm, an! !oin e"erythin in our (ower to set them on the ri ht roa! a ain. William. 0o when we ha"e 0ocialism, e"erybo!y will be ha((y an! contente!, an! there will be no more wretche!ness, hatre!, ,ealously, (rostitution, war, or in,ustice? Jack. I cant tell how #ar human #elicity may o, but Im sure thin s will be "ery much better than now. -ou see, men will o on tryin to better thin s, an! all the (ro ress ma!e then will bene#it e"ery one, not only a #ew. William. But when is all this oin to ha((en? Im an ol! #ellow, an! now that I know that the worl! isnt always oin on as it !oes at (resent, I shoul!nt like to !ie without ha"in seen one !ay o# ,ustice. Jack. When will it ha((en? I !ont know. It !e(en!s u(on us. The more we !o to o(en #olks eyes, the sooner the chan e will come about. 3owe"er, there is one thin to be sai!. A oo! a!"ance has alrea!y been ma!e. A #ew years a o there were "ery #ew who (reaches 0ocialism, an! they were treate! as #ools, ma!men, or incen!iaries. To/ !ay the i!ea is un!erstoo! by many. Then the (oor su##ere! in silence, or re"olte! when ma!!ene! by hun er, without knowin the causes or the reme!ies o# their wron s, an! were massacre!, or ma!e to massacre one another. To/!ay all o"er the worl! they come to a common un!erstan!in , a itate an! re"olt with the i!ea o# liberatin themsel"es #rom their em(loyers an! #rom o"ernment. They !o not count

on anythin but their own (owers, ha"in at last be un to un!erstan! that all the (arties, into which their em(loyers are !i"i!e!, are e&ually their enemies. .et us, then, be acti"e in s(rea!in our i!eas now, when the moment is #a"orable. .et all o# us who un!erstan! the &uestion unite more closely. .et us #an the #ire which smol!ers amon the masses. .et us (ro#it by all !iscontent, e"ery a itation, e"ery re"olt. .et us strike while the iron is hot, without #ear or hesitation. Then it will soon be all u( with the mi!!le/class, an! the rei n o# well/bein will be in. William. 1oo!% But we must take care to count the cost. To take the (ro(erty o# the em(loyers is easily sai!. But there are the (olice, the sol!iers. 4ow that I come to think o# it, Im a#rai! han!/cu##s, swor!s an! uns are ma!e more to !e#en! the mi!!leclass than anythin else. Jack. Thats as (lain as a (ike/sta##. But is the mi!!le/class o"ernment use arms a ainst us an! try to kee( us in sla"ery with their (ow!er an! melinite, we must teach them that we too can (lay at such a ame as that with the a((liances o# mo!ern scienti#ic war#are. The (oor are the immense ma,ority, an! i# they be in to un!erstan! an! taste the a!"anta es o# socialism, there is no (ower on earth which an #orce them to remain as they are. Consi!er, the (oor are those who work an! make e"erythin . I# only one lar e section o# them were to sto( workin , there woul! be such a to/!o, such a (anic, that the re"olution woul! &uickly (ro"e to be the only (ossible way out. Consi!er too, that sol!iers, #or the most (art are themsel"es (oor men, !ri"en by hun er to sell themsel"es to hurt an! butcher their own brothers. As soon as they ha"e seen an! un!erstoo! the #acts, they will sym(athise, at #irst secretly an! then o(enly, with the (eo(le. -ou may be sure the re"olution will not be hal# so !i##icult as it a((ears at #irst. The essential thin is to kee( the i!ea that the re"olution is necessary constantly to the #ore+ to be always (re(are! #or it. I# we !o this, theres no !oubt that somehow or another the chance to act will cro( u(. William. 0o you say, an! I belie"e you are ri ht. But there are those who say that the re"olution woul! !o no oo!, an! that thin s will slowly ri(en o# themsel"es. What !o you say to that? Jack. -ou must know that since 0ocialism has become as serious matter, an! the mi!!le/class ha"e be un to be really a#rai! o# it, they ha"e been tryin in e"ery (ossible way to turn asi!e the tem(est an! !ecei"e the (eo(le. All sorts, e"en em(erors, are be innin to say they are socialists, an! I lea"e you to uess what such <socialism: is worth. E"en amon st our own comra!es, there ha"e been traitors tem(te! by attention #rom the entle#olks, an! the a!"anta es they mi ht ain, to !esert the re"olutionary cause an! set themsel"es to (reach le al means an! alliance with (olitical (arties, which they say are all more or less socialistic. <We are all socialists not%= as 3arcourt sai! in the 3ouse o# Commons. 0uch men treat re"olutionaries as #ools an! worse. 0ome o# them (ro#ess still to wish #or a re"olution, but, meantime they wish a reat !eal more to be M.6s. When any one tells you that the re"olution is not necessary an! be ins talkin about nominatin M.6.s an! County Councillors, o# makin common cause with any mi!!le/class (arty, i# he is a mi!!le/ class man, or seems as i# he woul! like to be one, sen! hum about his business. Amon st those mistaken 0ocialists there are some who in all oo! #aith wish to !o oo!, an! belie"e they are !oin it+ but i# some one sincerely belie"in he is !oin you oo!, thrashes you till youre hal# !ea!, you will think #irst o# all how to et the stick

out o# his han!s. The most his oo! intentions will !o will be to sto( you, when you ha"e ot the stick, #rom breakin his hea! with it. William. ;i ht you are% But now theres somethin else I want to ask you. When you say 0ocialists, what !o you mean e'actly? I o#ten hear tell o# 0ocialists, an! Communists, an! Collecti"ists, an! Anarchists, an! I know no more than A!am what all those wor!s mean. Jack. Ah, Im la! you"e ot on that. Theres nothin like clearin u( the meanin o# wor!s. Well now, 0ocialists are #olks who belie"e that (ro(erty is the #irst cause o# all social ills, an! that as lon as (o"erty is not !estroye!, neither i norance, nor sla"ery, nor (olitical ine&uality, nor (rostitution, nor any o# the e"ils which kee( the (eo(le in such a horrible con!ition, can be roote! out+ to say nothin o# the #ri ht#ul su##erin which arises #rom actual want. 0ocialists belie"e that (o"erty results #rom the #act that the soil an! all raw materials, machinery an! all instruments o# labour, belon to a #ew in!i"i!uals, who thus are able to !is(ose o# the li"es o# all the workin class, an! #in! themsel"es in"ol"e! in (er(etual stru le an! com(etition, not only with the (roletariat ?those who ha"e nothin @, but also amon st themsel"es, #or the (ossession o# (ro(erty. The 0ocialists belie"e that by abolishin (ri"ate (ro(erty, i.e., the cause, they will at the same time abolish (o"erty, the e##ect. This (ro(erty can an! ou ht to be abolishe!+ #or the or ani8ation an! !istribution o# wealth ou ht to be re ulate! by the real interests o# men, without re ar! #or the so/calle! :ac&uire! ri hts,= which the mi!!le/class claim #or themsel"es, because their ancestors were stron er, more lucky, or more kna"ish than other men. 0o you see the name 0ocialist betokens all those who wish that social wealth shoul! be at the ser"ice or all men, an! that there shoul! no lon er be (ro(erty/owners an! (roletarians, rich an! (oor, em(loyers an! em(loye!. William. Then you are a 0ocialist, thats sure. But what !o the wor!s Communist an! Collecti"ist mean? Jack. Both Communists an! Collecti"ists are 0ocialists, but they ha"e !i##erent i!eas as to what ou ht to be !one when (ro(erty shall be (ut in common. The Collecti"ists say: Each worker, or rather each association o# workers, has a ri ht to raw material an! the instruments o# labour an! each man is master o# the (ro!uce o# his own toil. Whilst he li"es he !oes what he likes with it+ when he !oes anythin he has (ut on one si!e returns to the association. 3is chil!ren, in their turn, ha"e the means o# workin an! o# en,oyin the #ruit o# their labour+ to let them inherit anythin woul! be a #ist ste( towar!s ine&uality an! (ri"ile e. As re ar!s instruction, the e!ucation o# chil!ren, the maintenance o# the a e! an! in#irm, an! (ublic works in eneral, each association o# workers must i"e what is nee!e! to su((ly the unsu((lie! wants o# the members o# the community. The Communists say: Men must lo"e each other an! look on each other as members o# one #amily, i# thin s are to o well with them. 6ro(erty ou ht to be common. Work, i# it is to be as (ro!ucti"e as (ossible an! the ai! o# machinery em(loye! to the uttermost, must be !one by lar e (arties o# workers. I# we are to make the most o# all "arieties o# soil an! atmos(heric con!ition an! (ro!uce in each locality what that locality can (ro!uce best, an! it, on the other han!, we are to a"oi! com(etition an! hare! between !i"ers countries, it is nee!#ul to establish (er#ect soli!arity between the men o# the whole worl!. There#ore, instea! o# runnin the risk o# makin a con#usion in tryin to !istin uish what you an! I each !o, let us all work an! (ut e"erythin in common. In this way each will i"e to society all that his

stren th (ermits until enou h is (ro!uce! #or e"ery one+ an! each will take all that he nee!s, limitin his nee!s only in those thin s o# which there is not yet (lenty #or e"ery one. William. 4ot so #ast% 2irst o# all, what !o you mean by 0oli!arity? -ou say there ou ht to be soli!arity between men an! I !ont know what you mean. Jack. .ook here: in your #amily, #or instance, all that you an! your brothers, your wi#e an! your son earn you (ut in common. -ou et some #oo! an! you eat alto ether, an! i# there is not enou h you all (inch yoursel"es a bit. I# one o# you is lucky an! ains the more than usual, it is a oo! thin #or e"ery one. I#, on the contrary, one is out o# work or ill, it is a mis#ortune #or you all+ #or certainly amon st yoursel"es the one who is not workin eats all the same at the common boar!, an! the one who #alls ill costs more than any bo!y else. 0o in your #amily, instea! o# tryin to take work an! brea! away #rom each other, you try to ai! each other, because the oo! o one is the oo! o# all, an! the ill o# one the ill o# all. Thus en"y an! hatre! are ke(t a#ar o## an! a mutual a##ection is !e"elo(e!, which ne"er e'ists in a #amily where there are !i"i!e! interests. That is what is calle! soli!arity. We must establish amon st mankin! the same relations as e'ist in a truly unite! #amily. William. I un!erstan! that. But let us return to what we were s(eakin o#. Tell me, are you a Collecti"ist o# a Communist? Jack. As #or me, I am a Communist, because i# (eo(le are oin to be #rien!s, I belie"e they ou ht not to be #rien!s by hal"es. Collecti"ism lea"es the erms o# ri"alry an! hatre! still in e'istence. But I o #urther. E"en i# each coul! li"e on what he (ro!uces himsel#, Collecti"ism woul! be in#erior to Communism, because it woul! kee( men isolate!, an! so lessen their stren th an! their sym(athy. Besi!es, as the shoe/maker cant eat his shoes, nor the blacksmith li"e on iron, an! as the a riculturalist cannot till the coil without the workers who (re(are iron, manu#acture im(lements, etc., it will be necessary to or ani8e e'chan e between the "arious (ro!ucers, kee(in a reckonin o# what each ones. Then it will necessarily ha((en that the shoe maker, #or instance, will try to (u## the "alue o# his shoes an! et as much money as he can in e'chan e, whilst the a riculturalist, on his si!e, will i"e him as little as (ossible. 3ow the !e"il can we mana e will all this? Collecti"ism seems to me to i"e rise to many !i##icult (roblems an! be a system likely to lea! to con#usion. Communism, on the contrary, will not i"e rise to any !i##iculties. I# all work, an! all en,oy o# the work o# all, it only remains to see what are the thin s nee!e! to satis#y e"ery bo!y an! to arran e that these thin s shall be (ro!uce! in (lenty. William. 0o un!er Communism no money woul! be wante!. Jack. 4either money nor anythin in its (lace. 4othin but a re ister o# what is nee!e! an! o# what is (ro!uce!, so that (ro!uction may be ke(t u( the le"el o# nee!. The only serious !i##iculty woul! be i# many men re#uses to work. But I ha"e alrea!y tol! you the reasons why work, which to/!ay is a har!shi(, woul! then become a (leasure, an!, at the same time, a moral obli ation #rom which "ery #ew woul! wish to relie"e themsel"es. Besi!es, i#, in conse&uence o# the ba! e!ucation we ha"e ha!, some in!i"i!uals shoul! re#use to work when the new society be ins, they can be le#t outsi!e the community an! i"en raw material an! tools. Then, i# they want to eat, they will set to work. But at this moment what we ha"e to reali8e is that the soil, raw

material an! instruments o# labour, houses an! all e'istin wealth must be (ut in common. As #or the metho! o# or ani8ation, the (eo(le will !o as they (lease. 6ractice only will show them the best system. It is easy to #oresee that in many (laces they will establish Collecti"ism an! in many others Communism. When both ha"e been (ut to the (roo#, the better will be wi!ely a!o(te!. But min!, the chie# thin is that nobo!y shoul! be in to or!er the others about or to a((ro(riate the soil or instruments o# labour. It will be necessary to b eon the watch, an! i# this is attem(te!, to (re"ent it, e"en by #orce o# arms. The rest will #ollow naturally o# itsel#. William. That too I un!erstan!. But, tell me, what !oes the wor! Anarchism mean? Jack. Anarchy means without o"ernment. I"e tol! you alrea!y that o"ernment is oo! #or nothin but to !e#en! the mi!!le/class, an! that, where our interests are in &uestion, the best thin we can !o is to look a#ter them oursel"es. Instea! o# electin M.6.s an! County Councillors to make an! unmake laws #or us to obey, we will !iscuss our a##airs oursel"es, an! when it is nee!#ul to commission someone else to carry out our !ecisions, we will ask hum to !o so an! so, an! not otherwise. I# there is somethin which cant be !ome ri ht o##, we will commission ca(able (ersons to look into it, stu!y it an! let us know what they think ha! better be !one. But, at all e"ents, nothin will be !one on our behal# without our will. An! thus our !ele ates will not be in!i"i!uals to whom we ha"e i"en the ri ht to comman! us an! im(ose laws u(on us. They will be (ersons chosen #or their ca(acity, how will ha"e no authority, but sim(ly be char e! with the !uty o# e'ecutin what the (eo(le ha"e !eci!e! u(on. 2or e'am(le, some will be char e! to or ani8e schools, others to make streets, or look a#ter the e'chan e o# (ro!uce, ,ust as to/!ay a shoe/maker is aske! to make a (air o# shoes. William. 6ray e'(lain a little more. 3ow coul! I, a (oor, i norant ol! #ellow, un!ertake all the business which is !one by M.6.s an! ministers? Jack. An! what oo! !o these M.6.s an! ministers !o, that you shoul! bemoan yoursel# #or not bein able to !o the like? They make laws an! or ani8e the (ublic mi ht to kee( the (eo(le !own, in the interest o# the (ro(erty/owners. Thats all. It is a skill we !o not nee!. True, the ministers an! M.6.s !o busy themsel"es about oo! an! use#ul thin s, but only to turn them to the (ro#it o# a class an! hin!er (ro ress by means o# useless an! "e'atious enactments. 2or instance, these entry busy themsel"es about railways+ but why shoul! they? Woul! not the en ineers, mechanics, an! workmen o# all sorts be enou h? An! woul! not the locomoti"es run ,ust the same i# ministers, M.6.s, sharehol!ers, an! other (arasites !isa((eare!? It is ,ust the same with the (ost an! tele ra(h o##ice, na"i ation, e!ucation, hos(itals, all thin s carrie! on by workers o# one sort or another, with whom the o"ernment only inter#eres to !o harm. 6olitics, as they are un!erstoo! by (oliticians, are a !i##icult art #or us, because in oo! earnest they ha"e nothin to !o with the (eo(les real interests. But i# they are un!erstoo! by (oliticians, are a !i##icult art #or us, because in oo! earnest they ha"e nothin to !o with the (eo(les real interests. But i# their en! was to satis#y the actual nee!s o# the (o(ulation, when they woul! be more !i##icult #or an M.6. than #or us. What can M.6.s resi!in in .on!on know o# the nee!s o# the country !istricts? 3ow can these #olks, who ha"e mostly waste! their time in tryin to learn 1reek an! .atin, which they !ont know a#ter all, un!erstan! the interests o# the "arious cra#ts an! in!ustries? Thin s woul! o "ery !i##erently i# each busie! himsel# with what he knows

about an! he nee!s he has ascertaine! on his own account. When once the re"olution has taken (lace, we shall ha"e to be in at the bottom, so to s(eak. 9n!er the in#luence o# the (ro(a an!a an! the enthusiasm o# the time, the "arious tra!es in each !istrict, (arish, or town, will #orm associations. An! who can un!erstan! better than you the interests o# your own tra!e an! your own locality. A#terwar!s, when it is !esirable to brin se"eral tra!es or se"eral !istricts to a common a reement, !ele ates #rom each will carry the wishes o# those who ha"e sent them to a s(ecial con ress, an! !o their best to reconcile the !i"erse nee!s an! wishes. But their !eliberations will always be submitte! to the control an! a((robation o# their (rinci(als, so that the interests o# the (eo(le will not be ne lecte!. Thus ra!ually the human race will be brou ht into harmony. William. But how shall we mana e i# in a country or an association there are some who are o# a !i##erent o(inion #rom the rest? The lar er number will be sure to ha"e the u((er han!, wont they? Jack. 4ot by ri ht. 2or as re ar!s truth an! ,ustice numbers ou ht to o #or nothin . $ne may be in the ri ht a ainst a hun!re!, a ainst a hun!re! thousan!, a ainst e"ery bo!y. 6ractically, we must !o as best we can. I# we cannot obtain unanimity, those who a ree an! are the ma,ority will carry out their i!ea, within the limits o# their won rou(, an! i# e'(erience shows they were ri ht, there is no !oubt but that they will be imitate!. I# not, it is a (roo# that the minority were in the ri ht, an! action will be taken accor!in ly. Thus the (rinci(les o# e&uality an! ,ustice, u(on which society ou ht to be #oun!e!, will not be "iolate!. But remark that the &uestions u(on which (eo(le cannot come to an a reement will be small in number an! im(ortance, because there will no lon er be the !i"ision o# interests which e'ists to/!ay. 2or each will then be #ree to choose his country an! the association, i.e., the com(anions with whom he likes to li"e. Also the matters to be !eci!e! will be thin s e"ery one can un!erstan!, belon in rather to (ractical li#e an! (ositi"e science than to the !omain o# theory with this en!less !i##erences o# o(inion. When the best solution o# such an! such a (roblem has been arri"e! at by e'(erience, the &uestion will be how to (ersua!e #olks by (ractically showin them the thin , not how to crush them un!er a ma,ority o# "otes. Woul! you not lau h i# to/!ay citi8ens were calle! u(on to "ote the season #or sowin see!, when it is a matter alrea!y settle! by e'(erience? An! i# it were not yet entirely #i'e!, woul! you ha"e recourse to a "ote to !eci!e it, rather than to e'(erience? All (ublic an! (ri"ate a##airs will be treate! like this. William. But what i# some out o# mere (i hea!e!ness an! sel#/will shoul! o((ose a !ecision ma!e in the interests o# all? Jack. Then, o# course, it woul! be nee!#ul to take #orcible action. 2or i# it is un,ust that the ma,ority shoul! o((ress the minority, the contrary woul! be &uite as un,ust+ an! i# the minority has a ri ht to rebel, the ma,ority has a ri ht to !e#en! itsel#. But !o not #or et that always an! e"erywhere all men ha"e an un!eniable ri ht to the materials an! instruments o# labour. Thou h it is truth hat this solution is not com(letely satis#actory. The in!i"i!uals (ut out o# the association woul! be !e(ri"e! o# many social a!"anta es, which an isolate! (erson or rou( must !o without, because they can only be (rocure! by the coo(eration o# a reat number o# human bein s. But what woul! you ha"e? These malcontents cannot #airly !eman! that the wishes o# many others shoul! be sacri#ice! #or their sakes. 1i"en soli!arity, #raternity, mutual ai!, an!,

where nee!#ul, mutual consi!eration an! su((ort, an! you may be con"ince! that ci"il tyranny or war will not arise. ;est assure! rather, that men will har!ly ha"e become masters o# their own !estinies be#ore soli!arity will row u( amon st them. 2or tyranny an! ci"il war work e"il to all, an! soli!arity is the only con!ition in which our i!eals can be reali8e!, an! which will brin with it (eace, (ros(erity, an! uni"ersal #ree!om. 4ote too that (ro ress, while it ren!s always to unite men, ten!s also to ren!er them more in!e(en!ent an! sel#/su##icin . 2or e'am(le, to/!ay, to ra"el ra(i!ly o"er lan!, it is necessary to make use o# the railway, the construction an! workin o# which re&uire the collecti"e labour o# many (ersons. There#ore the tra"eler will still, un!er Anarchy, be obli e! to a!a(t his arran ements to the ours an! re ulations which the ma,ority ha"e thou ht best. It, howe"er, someone in"ents a locomoti"e which one man can ui!e, without !an er to himsel# or others, on any street, then he will not nee! to a!a(t himsel# in this matter to the arran ements o# other #olks, an! e"ery one will be able to tra"el where an! when he (leases. 0o it i! with thousan!s o# other thin s that are, or that will be in the #uture. Thus it is clear that the ten!ency o# (ro ress is towar!s a certain relation between men, which may be !e#ine! by the #ormula Moral 0oli!arity an! Material In!e(en!ence. William. That is ,ust is. 0o you are a 0ocialist, an! amon st 0ocialists you are s(eci#ically a Communist an! an Anarchist. But I ha"e hear! say too that you are an Internationalist. What !oes that mean? Jack. *i! you e"er hear o# the International Workin Mens Association? About thirty years a o, a reat association was #orme! amon st the workmen o# all ci"ili8e! countries, to take counsel to ether about the wron s which the workers o# e"ery lan! alike su##er #rom the e'(loitation o# (ro(erty/owners, an! to act to ether so as to brin about a uni"ersal social re"olution. 2or, in e"ery country which has reache! our sta e o# ci"ili8ation, the workers are e'(loite! in much the same way, an! the rulin classes are ban!e! to ether to kee( the masses !own. There#ore, the common interests o# the workers o# all lan!s are #ar stron er than their national !i##erences, an! it is only by actin in common, as their e'(loiters act in common, that they can throw o## the yoke o# ca(italism. The International Workin Mens Association no lon er e'ists. 4e"ertheless, the reat labour mo"ements which a itate the workers ha"e arisen #rom it. Also the carious 0ocialist (arties in !i##erent countries, s(eci#ically the International 0ocialist Anarchist ;e"olutionary 6arty, which is now or anisin to i"e the !eath blow to the mi!!le/class society o# to/!ay. The aim o# this (arty is o# !o e"erythin to s(rea! the (rinci(les o# Anarchist 0ocialism+ to show how ho(eless it is to look to "oluntary concessions #rom (ro(erty owners or o"ernments, or to ra!ual constitutional re#orms+ to awaken the (eo(le to a consciousness o# their ri hts, an! rouse in them the s(irit o# re"olt+ to ur e them on to make the social re"olution, i.e., to !estroy all o"ernment an! to (ut all e'istin wealth in common. Any one who acce(ts this (ro ramme an! wishes to ,oin others in stri"in #or it, belon s to this (arty. The (arty has no hea!, no authority+ it is entirely #oun!e! on s(ontaneous an! "oluntary a reement amon st those who are #i htin #or the same cause. There#ore, each in!i"i!ual that belon s to it is com(letely #ree to ,oin in intimate com(anionshi( with those he (re#ers, to use such means as he thin s best, an! to s(rea! his own (articular i!eas in his own (articular way, so lon , o# course, as he !oes not thereby o((ose the eneral (ro ramme an! tactics o# the (arty. William. Then are all who acce(t 0ocialistic, Anarchic, ;e"olutionary (rinci(les

members o# this (arty? Jack. 4o. A man my (er#ectly a ree with our (ro ramme, but, #or one reason or another, may (re#er to act alone, or with a #ew others, without #ormin connections o# e##ecti"e soli!arity an! coo(eration with the mass o# those who acce(t the (ro ramme. This may be suitable #or certain in!i"i!uals, or #or certain s(ecial (ur(oses, but it cannot be the eneral metho!, because isolation is a cause o# weakness, an! creates anti(athy an! ri"alry where there ou ht to be #raternity an! concor!. 0till in e"ery way we always consi!er as #rien!s an! comra!es the men an! women who are stri"in in any #ashion #or the i!ea #or which we stri"e. But a ain there may be #olks con"ince! o# the truth o# the i!ea, but kee(in their con"ictions to themsel"es, not takin the trouble to s(rea! what they belie"e is ri ht. $ne cant say that such #olks are not 0ocialists an! Anarchists theoretically, because they think as we !o+ but their con"ictions certainly must be "ery weak, or they themsel"es "ery (oor s(irite!. When a man sees the terrible e"ils that a##lict himsel# an! his #ellows, an! belie"es he knows a reme!y which woul! cure them, how can he stan! inacti"e, i# he has any heart at all? I# a man !oes not know the truth, he cannot be blame!+ but the man who knows it an! set it on one si!e is a heartless cowar!. William. -ou are ri ht. Im oin to think "ery seriously in!ee! o"er what you"e sai!. An! when Im thorou hly con"ince! in my own min! that its true, I shall ,oin the (arty, an! !o all I can to s(rea! the sacre! truth. An! i# the entle#olks shoul! call me a scoun!rel or a #ool, I will tell them to work an! su##er as I !o, an! then they will ha"e a ri ht to s(eak.

Errico Malatesta

Neither Democrats, nor Dictators: Anarchists

Theoretically democracy means popular government; government by all for everybody by the efforts of all. In a democracy the people must be able to say what they want, to nominate the executors of their wishes, to monitor their performance and remove them when they see fit. Naturally this presumes that all the individuals that ma e up a people are able to form an opinion and express it on all the sub!ects that interest them. It implies that everyone is politically and economically independent and therefore no"one, to live, would be obliged to submit to the will of others. If classes and individuals exist that are deprived of the means of production and therefore dependent on others with a monopoly over those means, the so"called democratic system can only be a lie, and one which serves to deceive the mass of the people and eep them docile with an outward show of sovereignty, while the rule of the privileged and dominant class is in fact salvaged and consolidated. #uch is democracy and such it always has been in a capitalist structure, whatever form it ta es, from constitutional monarchy to so"called direct rule. There could be no such thing as a democracy, a government of the people, other than in a socialistic regime, when the means of production and of living are socialised and the right of all to intervene in the running of public affairs is based on and guaranteed by the economic independence of every person. In this case it would seem that the democratic system was the one best able to guarantee !ustice and to harmonise individual independence with the necessities of life in society. $nd so it seemed, more or less clearly, to those who, in the era of the absolute monarchs, fought, suffered and died for freedom. %ut for the fact that, loo ing at things as they really are, the government of all the people turns out to be an impossibility, owing to the fact that the individuals who ma e up the people

have differing opinions and desires and it never, or almost never happens, that on any one &uestion or problem all can be in agreement. Therefore the government of all the people, if we have to have government, can at best be only the government of the ma!ority. $nd the democrats, whether socialists or not, are willing to agree. They add, it is true, that one must respect minority rights; but since it is the ma!ority that decides what these rights are, as a result minorities only have the right to do what the ma!ority wants and allows. The only limit to the will of the ma!ority would be the resistance which the minorities now and can put up. This means that there would always be a social struggle, in which a part of the members, albeit the ma!ority, has the right to impose its own will on the others, yo ing the efforts of all to their own ends. $nd here I would ma e an aside to show how, based on reasoning bac ed by the evidence of past and present events, it is not even true that where there is government, namely authority, that authority resides in the ma!ority and how in reality every democracy has been, is and must be nothing short of an oligarchy ' a government of the few, a dictatorship. %ut, for the purposes of this article, I prefer to err on the side of the democrats and assume that there can really be a true and sincere ma!ority government. (overnment means the right to ma e the law and to impose it on everyone by force) without a police force there is no government. Now, can a society live and progress peacefully for the greater good of all, can it gradually adapt to ever"changing circumstances if the ma!ority has the right and the means to impose its will by force on the recalcitrant minorities* The ma!ority is, by definition, bac ward, conservative, enemy of the new, sluggish in thought and deed and at the same time impulsive, immoderate, suggestible, facile in its enthusiasms and irrational fears. +very new idea stems from one or a few individuals, is accepted, if viable, by a more or less si,eable minority and wins over the ma!ority, if ever, only after it has been superseded by new ideas and new needs and has already become outdated and rather an obstacle, rather than a spur to progress. %ut do we, then, want a minority government* -ertainly not. If it is un!ust and harmful for a ma!ority to oppress minorities and obstruct progress, it is even more un!ust and harmful for a minority to oppress the whole population or impose its own ideas by force which even if they are good ones would excite repugnance and opposition because of the very fact of being imposed. $nd then, one must not forget that there are all inds of different minorities. There are minorities of egoists and villains as there are of fanatics who believe themselves to be possessed of absolute truth and, in perfectly good faith, see to impose on others what they hold to be the only way to salvation, even if it is simple silliness. There are minorities of reactionaries who see to turn bac the cloc and are divided as to the paths and limits of reaction. $nd there are revolutionary minorities, also divided on the means and ends of revolution and on the direction that social progress should ta e. .hich minority should ta e over* This is a matter of brute force and capacity for intrigue, and the odds that success would fall to the most sincere and most devoted to the general good are not favourable. To con&uer power one needs &ualities that are not exactly those that are needed to ensure that !ustice and well" being will triumph in the world. %ut I shall here continue to give others the benefit of the doubt and assume that a minority came to power which, among those who aspire to government, I considered the best for its ideas and proposals. I want to assume that the socialists came to power and would add, also the anarchists, if I am not prevented by a contradiction in terms. This would be the worst of all* /es, to win power, whether legally or illegally, one needs to have left by the roadside a large part of ones ideological baggage and to have got rid of all ones moral scruples. $nd then, once in power, the big problem is how to stay there. 0ne needs to create a !oint interest in the new state of affairs and attach to those in government a new privileged class, and suppressing any ind of opposition by all possible means. 1erhaps in the national interest, but always with

freedom"destructive results. $n established government, founded on the passive consensus of the ma!ority and strong in numbers, in tradition and in the sentiment ' sometimes sincere ' of being in the right, can leave some space to liberty, at least so long as the privileged classes do not feel threatened. $ new government, which relies for support only on an often slender minority, is obliged through necessity to be tyrannical. 0ne need only thin what the socialists and communists did when they came to power, either betraying their principles and comrades or by flying colours in the name of socialism and communism. This is why we are neither for a ma!ority nor for a minority government; neither for democracy not for dictatorship. .e are for the abolition of the gendarme. .e are for the freedom of all and for free agreement, which will be there for all when no one has the means to force others, and all are involved in the good running of society. .e are for anarchy.

May ABCD