Peter: Good Afternoon Pastor

Rev. Wilson: Good Afternoon

Peter: I must admit it is a privilege as your son to have an opportunity to interview
you on a topic that I believe has become extremely important today. We are going
to talk about the theme of Restoring Manhood. And Im going to start with a very
general question for you.
As we think about where we are today, do you believe that there is an issue with
men in general right now and their position as men in their homes?
Rev. Wilson: Well let me just say that Im going to deal with this really from a black
perspective. Yes I do. I think men are out of place. They do not understand their
proper place in their homes or in their communities. And I feel that one of the
reasons is because there is a great disconnect or divide between our communities
and particularly or men with God and their responsibilities.
Peter: I guess we can unpack that a little more. You have clearly made reference
that part of the dis-connect is with men and I guess the relationship or
understanding of how their walk should be in fellowship with God. Can you expound
on that a little more?
Rev. Wilson: My way of looking at life is really found in Proverbs 3 when Im told to
trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not unto your own understanding. In all
your ways acknowledge him and he shall direct your path. I believe when we lose
our cognizance of who God is and we try to establish our own methodology. What
we end up doing, we end up going in the wrong direction as far as being strong and
to give proper leadership in our homes and in our families.
Peter: But specifically, talking about men. What should men be doing in their homes
differently then what they are doing today?
Rev. Wilson: First of all I believe men need to acknowledge who God is. The bible
clearly lets us know that we are created in Gods image and his likeness. We have a
responsibility to be fruitful and we are told to multiply. God has given us the
authority in his name to work diligently to bring about a more cohesive community.
And one of those things are without God we can do nothing.
Peter: Is there some role that women should play in helping men to reclaim their
position as men and Godly men, in your opinion?
Rev. Wilson: Yes, I believe a woman needs to take her rightful position. And this is
beside the man. I know we live in a culture today were woman are now mostly
they have made their own way. They have been taught to be independent. But I
think that men and women are interdependent. They must learn to depend on each
other. And a woman must help a man to understand that she is depending on him to
be the strength in the life of her family and the community.
Peter: And how does that interplay with the teachings for the children in the
household specifically related to fathers?

Rev. Wilson: Well again I return to Proverbs and I find that in Proverbs it says train
up a child in a way that they should grow. I believe it is incumbent on a man to be
the head as far as teaching. In the book of Deuteronomy we find that a man should
talk about God as he walks, throughout his daily walk. His children should know that
he reverence God. And that he is primarily responsible for the stability of his family.
Peter: And how would you say that in the family dynamic the man is supposed to
lead in this regard? Being your son you have always taught me that the man is
responsible for being the spiritual head of the house.
Rev. Wilson: Well first of all may I say, I learned something during the transition of
your schooling and I never forget the day your mom and I dropped you off at
Syracuse. And I learned something about being a father. I learned that the suffering
and when I use this term suffering, sacrificial things start at the top. And that a
father should himself be willing to sacrifice for the best for his family. And when I
say that I believe the wife should have the better car. I believe the children should
be the first to go to the table to dine. I believe fathers should be the person that
exhibits a sacrificial life.
Peter: We talk about sacrifice. And thats for many a very tough word to hear. The
notion of putting others before yourself. Do you think now that we are at time when
we are seeing in particular that men are not putting their families first, their children
first, their wives first.
Rev. Wilson: Well, let me just say from experience I have been at that juncture in my
own life. And today I am delighted that I met a couple men here in Mount Vernon
that taught me sacrificial living. First there was a man by the name of Lou Sultan, he
was a car dealer. And I desired to get me a racing car. He informed me that I needed
a car that would be able to ride my family. I did not listen but I must say I learned
later that he was absolutely right. A man by the name of Ed Schubert, who taught
me how to be thoughtful about a simple thing, to have a good set of china and
silverware to go on the table. It was framing my way of thinking that I need to learn
that my pleasures are one thing. But the necessities of life is providing for those
whom God have given me.
Peter: As you speak about, very eloquently, others that was role models for you. In
particular you pointed to 2 men that taught you the idea, the notion that sacrifice is
part of the journey for men. What obligation as men do we have to one another in
order to teach and to provide the value structure to understand what it means to be
a man today?
Rev. Wilson: Well let me just say I was reared in a home in the south and I was
reared by my step father. I grew up angry at my father, my natural father, because
of what I had been told by my mother and others. But my step father was a strong
man. At the time I didnt know it. I didnt realize he was a strong man. Because I felt
that he took too much. When I say he took too much, he allowed others to have
before he provided for himself. And so I was somewhat confused by the way he lived
his life. But then I discovered that he was one of the finest men I ever knew because
of the fact he always put the wife and the family and children first.

And let me just say, a few years ago you came to speak to us from that most helpful
scripture in Ephesians chapter 6 and you reminded me of something that I really
didnt know I had done as well as you said. You said that I worked very diligently, I
took care of the home, I took up the children, I even labored at Pepsi Cola and I
even led Mt. Zion. But in your conclusion you said out of all of the things I have
done, that you observed, I have taught you how to be a good husband and a father.
And I thought that, it meant that in living my life you observed me and I have given
you something that you can also pattern your own life after.
Peter: Now, I count myself blessed clearly to have had you as a role model in my
own life. But I imagine there are a number of men that have not been as blessed to
have had strong father figures in their homes. For those that are seeking some level
of guidance around how to proclaim their presence as men, what would you say to
them about finding their path even if they do not have the traditional role model in
their household?
Rev. Wilson: Well, let me just say that on many occasions you have heard me talk
about men who were instrumental in my life. When I was on the farm, I still look
back and I see men. One man used to let me ride with him. I wasnt strong enough
to pick up anything but he took me along. And taught me how to use the tools he
had. I use to go fishing just to watch. It was always those men who allowed me to
be near them; that I was able to receive something beneficial for my life. There was
a brother, Deacon Earley Jones taught me how to be a neighbor. He showed me that
it was something that we should do. We should always provide through what we
have for others. And so those things have helped me to develop my position and
most of all my relationship with God.
Peter: But specifically, Im talking about, we have a number of youth right now that
many of which have become fathers earlier then I think would probably be desirable
today. There are others that are kind of struggling at this point because they are not
in their homes, but yet want to be fathers or even figure out how to lead even from
a non-traditional setting. What level of advice do you have for those individuals and
what still are their obligations that you would find for them to try to seek out and do
in their lives?
Rev. Wilson: One of the things I would say to young men today is that you need to
look among your peers but you also need to look out and see some man that you
admire. Just for being strong. Not for what he drives. Just for the way he walks and
learn to listen to a man of wisdom. Much of the problem today is that our young
men, they dont listen. Many of our young men have been taught that they are
always to be the recipient of others giving for them, giving to them. We are not
trained to be hard workers. We think everyone owes us something. Matter of fact
many of the young men I see today, many of them still have a pacifier. I will say
this, that the women, in particular the mothers, should start training their sons to be
strong, dependable. Fathers need to do the same. And even in our churches there
are many times young men that need to listen. I believe I am a good listener. I
believe I am a good observer. And because you dont hear me say anything
sometimes, which although I talk a lot, but I am a good listener. I am a good
observer. And if I was to do anything if I was a young man, I would seek out a man
that I see has worth to him. And learn to inquire of them. The bible says God called

the young man because he is strong and an old man because he is wise. I would
seek out a wise man.
Let me just say something I do here at Mt. Zion and I think, it was given to me and I
love it. I started to share with the young boys at church. And I deal with the young
guys and others and I discovered that if I butt them on the head and tell them that
their head is hard, you got a hard head and I have explained what I mean. No,
youre not being hard headed, you have a hard head. And a hard head is like having
a safe. Its a good place to deposit things. So whatever you deposit in your head,
whatever you deposit in your heart can aid you. And I notice now with the young
fellas in the church, they run around looking for a butt. Because I have instilled in
them that they have worth. Even today I go to a lot of our schools and I never speak
to young fellas now without saying, Sir. One little fella looked at me one day and
said, Im not your age. And I said Im not speaking to you Im speaking to the man in
you that you are becoming. And one day you will recognize that you are somebody
special.
Peter: You talked a little just now on the churchs role. You alluded to the concept of
the churchs role. What is our churchs responsibility not only to the youth that are
within the four walls of this institution but also to the community at large to help to
restore manhood to so many of these men walking out here?
Rev. Wilson: First of all, I think men need to learn to seek the Lord. What do I mean
by seek the Lord? You need to ask God to order your steps so that you can be in a
place to aid and assist. And another thing, never walk around with a condescending
attitude. Always see young people, as vulnerable as they may be, that you have
been there too. I love sharing with young men. Matter of fact, I met a young man
the other day that was 19 years old. And I asked him how old he was. He said 19. I
said we have something in common. He said, what do we have in common? I said I
have been nineteen. He said, that was a different time. I said, no, nineteen is
nineteen no matter where you are, or what place you are at, nineteen is nineteen. I
had the same kind of experiences you are having. You may have more to do but
guess what, being nineteen is just, nineteen. Therefore, Im talking out of
experience.
One thing I think as older men we are afraid to do. And that is to be honest with
young people. We want to walk around and make it appear that we have never done
wrong. We have always been right. We have never messed up. Matter of fact, if it
wasnt for the grace of God, I would be somewhere incarcerated. But because of
Gods mercy and Gods grace, I made it. And I have a responsibility; I have an
obligation to let others know that if it had not been for God on my side, where would
I be.
Peter: Well Pastor, I think this has been a wonderful conversation around restoring
manhood. Do you have any final thoughts that you would like to leave for any of the
listeners or those that are going to be watching this video around where we are as a
people? Where we should be trying to strive to be as a people and specifically what
our men need to do to try and reclaim their place in their homes, their communities,
their families?

Rev. Wilson: Well let me just say, I had a young man to tell me one day that he was
looking for a good wife. Then I asked him, do you know where she can find a good
husband? And he said, what do you mean? I said, well, first of all you want a woman
to be good. Are you trustworthy yourself? Because I have learned something about
trust, trust is not something that is given. Trust is earned. Take you and I. I admire
you. I stand off and I observe. And I never forget the day we were in Virginia. My
father felt that he had totally failed. He had made a mess out of his life. Indeed my
father really came up short. Because of circumstances. And my father was sitting
under the tree telling me, Peter I have not done much with my life. I said you did
pretty good Dad. He said what do you mean by that. I said you begotten me. And I
feel that I am a pretty good man. Im not all that I should be but I think that I am a
pretty good man. So you can at least give God thanks for that. And you was there
playing under a tree. And I said, see that little boy walking around out there. He said
yes, I said thats your grandson. He says he wants to become a lawyer. And one of
these days if he becomes a lawyer, you will have become a lawyer as well, because
in him is you. And so he can not accomplish a great deal in life without him
recognizing that he is your seed.
My dad began to cry. And I thought you know that may have been one of his
highlight moments. My dad was able to cry. We have too many men that are afraid
to shed a tear. We have men that are really afraid to just really be truthful about life.
I have it too much of it around church. Men who, ever since the children have known
them, they have been grown and been a deacon, they never have anything to share
about their life, their life experiences. I guess if I didnt have an experience to share
my life really would be worthless. I love telling the story of where God has brought
me from. What God has brought me through. And I realize. You have heard me say
this on many times. I remember a man I did not like , I couldnt stand him, didnt like
him at all. And I was that man. God has changed that.
So I will say to men today, you want to be restored, go to the one that can restore
you. Find your place, give him priority in your life, serve him daily and remember
what is said in Ecclesiastes chapter 12, verse 1: Remember now thy Creator in the
days of thy youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw nigh, when thou
shalt say, I have no pleasure in them.
God is the only one that can restore us. But, God gives each of us the power if we
have the compassion to help restore. May I conclude with this, there are young men
that graduated high school and went off to college from Mt. Zion. I call them at
midnight sometime. May be disturbing them, but I call them anyway. I have a few
that I call now. I call to Virginia, I call to North Carolina. Just to speak to them to let
them know, there is a man who cares for them and praying for them and that they
are going to make mistakes, o yes. I tell them its alright to make mistakes. I made
plenty. But I still can sing, God looks beyond your faults to see your needs.