Jumbo Glacier Resort

Notes regarding an Archeological and Traditional Use Study Progress Meeting

The meeting started at 4:30 pm at the Delta Resort Hotel at St. Eugene, on July 16, 2003. In attendance: Grant Costello Kris Payne Mike Keefer Oberto Oberti Samantha Sam Thomas Munson Wayne Choquette Jim Beare Oberto Oberti explained that he had asked to meet in order to be informed at to be able to report on the progress of the TUS. Mike Keefer and Wayne Choquette reported that they had started working on the TUS two days before and had planned to go to the site but were waiting for the slide in Jumbo Creek to be cleared. Grant Costello mentioned that the slide comprised a certain amount of snow and debris made of broken bush and tree branches, He showed a picture indicating that the snow had melted and that wood material seemed to be relatively easy to overtake with a 4x4 with good clearance. It was agreed that an attempt would be made soon to start fieldwork on site. The discussion covered a number of points: 1. Mike Keefer (MK) mentioned that he did not know much about the project. Oberto Oberti (OO) gave him a current Project Outline booklet, and noted that it would be important to have correct information on the project. 2. Mike Keefer questioned whether red and blue listed species had been studied. Oberto Oberti responded that environmental studies have been going on since 1990 in response to B.C. Environments review requirements and that he should call Glenn Stewart, the project manager of the environmental studies since then, to gain the necessary information on the project. 3. MK questioned the treatment of goats at Golden Peaks (now Kicking Horse Mountain Resort) and asked whether cariboos and goats had been studied for Jumbo Glacier Resort. OO noted that environmental reports indicated that cariboos are not present in the area under study and that information on goats may be obtained from the environmental consultants. Glenn Stewart recently gave a presentation at the St. Eugene offices of the Tribal Council, and would be available to answer questions. There has been extensive work done by the environmental consultants over the last thirteen years, also in response to the project Specifications issued by the Environmental Assessment Office in consultation with B.C. Environment, and it is important that the TUS consultants become familiar with that information. 4. MK and others wanted to know the Proponents position on climate change and whether we were aware that it is expected that the glaciers would disappear in the next twenty-five years. OO explained that in this extreme case skiing would disappear from lower areas such as Panorama and the rest of B.C. resorts and would remain only at Jumbo in the higher elevations, with skiing over moraines, similar to the existing situation skiing from Glacier Dome into Jumbo Creek today. In reality the experts do not feel that they can predict what would happen to microclimates such as the Central Purcells; it is just as possible that the warming trend would increase the amount of precipitation in the form of snow at higher elevation in winter and increase the amount of snow and the thickness of the glaciers in the upper collection area. OO reported that the opinion of the experts involved with the project such as Dr. Michael Maxwell, formerly of UBC and now of Golder Associates, is that there is no cause for alarm regarding the health of the

glaciers in question. OO will forward copy of his 1994 report and copy of a letter to Stephanie Stevens, not published by the Valley Echo that was reviewed by Dr. Maxwell and is an update on the subject. The Project Committee of the EA Office decided in the Project Specifications that glacier retraction and disappearance is not an issue for the project. 5. MK asked about the visibility of the project. OO explained that the project would not be visible from Jumbo Pass and from most of the hiking locations, because of the geography. Fo example, the sawmill site for the proposed project is hidden from Jumbo Pass by a mountain shoulder to the left of the line of sight from the Pass into Jumbo Creek. The only locations from where the resort would be visible would be from the top of Redtop Mountain and perhaps of Bastille Mountain, basically where there is a direct line of sight from the south. The lifts and the arrival stations would not be visible from kilometers away, as one would be if not using the resort facilities. 6. The next question was salt on the glaciers. OO reported that the use of salt or chemicals does not occur in ski areas for tourists and the Proponent had already given assurance that this was not going to be done by Jumbo Glacier Resort. Also, salt or chemicals used at ski racing camps or ski races is minimal and has not been reported in any location as having had negative environmental impacts. Ski race organizers and ski training camps organizers in any event would be separate entities from the Proponent and would be handling their permitting conditions directly and independently with the B.C. Government. OO noted that information from Blackomb and Mount Hood has indicated that the training activities there for some fifteen years have not had any discernible impacts. 7. Mike Keefer asked what would be OOs position if the TUS found that the Jumbo area is a special place would he recommend abandoning the project? OO responded that this would be a very difficult question to resolve and that it would open up a whole series of other questions from the investors, such as why was this not communicated at the beginning of the process rather than at the end. The project started thirteen years ago and followed invitations of five different B.C. Governments to proceed with the application as well as utilizing all available information to fit into Government policies. These are policies, which invite investors to the Province in particular sectors and geographic regions, and the project direction has been confirmed to the investors over thirteen years by all B.C governments. 8. MK asked whether the First Nations were ever consulted before. OO noted that he had personally been introduced to the Shuswaps in 1990 and had spoken to chief Paul Sam and others since then. The question moved on to whether the Columbia Band had been consulted. OO noted that the consulting group for the project had made at least one presentation to the Columbia Band in 1995 or 96. Thomas Manson confirmed. Following another question OO confirmed that he and the other consultants had made presentations also to the KKTC and that the response had been rather negative. MK asked why did we not stop the project then. OO responded that not all people among First Nations were negative and that particularly the Shuswaps, who are the closest Band, had been supportive. OO explained that it appeared that the KKTC was responding to misinformation about the project and that the evaluations were based on the misinformation. It did not seem reasonable to stop a project on objections based on misinformation. 9. MK and others asked how people were misinformed. OO mentioned that there were rumors and myths about many aspects of the project, including its location relative to mountains and industry needs, its size, which was claimed to be too big, market choice, type and demand, whereby it was incorrectly thought that there were too many ski resorts, summer and glacier skiing as if they had negative impact on the glaciers, etc. Also the environmental information did not seem to be shared despite a great deal of work. OO thought that the Proponent group could make the case that the project would be good for the region, and especially for the First Nations, but the opportunity to make the case had not properly materialized, despite on going efforts. 10. Jim Beare (JB) expressed a concern about affordability. Grant Costello (GC) explained that the project would be a considerable improvement relative to the cost of access by bus and helicopter, as it is currently the case and that it is expected that the project would be very near the current costs of other resorts such as Panorama, which are much more affordable than heli-skiing. GC noted that access limited to heli-skiers is definitely in the less affordable category.

11. MK asked clarifications on project size, WC asked the number of people the project is designed for. OO explained that the resort project as presented in 1995 was less than a tenth of Whistler (including Blackcomb), but that it has even been downsized relative to the 1995 proposal, with a CRA that is about half size, less lift capacity and a resort of less than 6,500 beds including employee housing. OO explained the basic numbers of skiers per day at build out in the range of 2,200/2,800 by memory, but offered to send the precise information by e-mail. OO thanked those attending the meeting for a useful exchange but had to excuse himself to go to Panorama for a 7:30 appointment, and suggested to meeting to review the progress of the work to come. MK offered to look at the timetable and to inform OO of the progress, even if he was not sure yet of a completion date.

Oberto Oberti

Grant Costello