KATHERINE JACKSON V AEG Live May 17

th
2013
Marty Hom (Tour promoter)
By video http://youtu.be/DepL_bnrLSw

MARTY HOM, having been administered an oath, was examined and testified as follows:
EXAMINATION
By Mr. Boyle:
Q. Mr. Hom, how are you doing today?
A. Good, thanks.
Q. Am I pronouncing your last name correctly?
A. You can call me Marty.
Q. Well, I'll probably call you Mr. Hom.
A. That's fine.
Q. Now, when did you start working in the music industry?

A. I've been in the music industry approximately 25 to 30 years now.

Q. Okay. And, sir, how would you describe your profession today. What is your job today?
A. My job and my title today is, usually I'm called the tour director or tour manager. And do
you want me to describe the functions of my job in a general sense?
Q. I will ask you that.
A. Okay.
Q. How many years, approximately, have you been considered a tour director or a tour
manager?
A. Since 1985.
Q. And, sir, when you serve as a tour manager, who is your employer?
A. The artist usually.
Q. In the usual case when you're working as a tour manager, who pays you?
A. The artist.
Q. So, for example, you'll get a check from the artist directly to you?
A. That's correct.
Q. Now, do you know if Mr. Jackson was paying Mr. Gongaware for the This Is It tour?
A. I do not know that.
Q. Would that be something that would be important for you to know in assessing what Mr.
Gongaware's role was on the This Is It tour?
A. No.
Q. And why not?
A. I think that -- I think that when I speak about tours and I speak about tour managers, I try to
stress the importance that every tour that I do and every tour everybody does, is always different

from others. Like they consistently change. My role changes from one tour to the next. It's
never consistent. There's not a set of rules that I go by like, this is the way I do it and this is the
way I run a tour. I have to tell people that I have to adapt as quickly as possible to an artist's
needs, whatever those needs are and how they want me to fulfill those needs. So it's just
different. Every tour that I've run across and I've done is totally different from another.
Q. Okay. Is it a fair statement that the two largest promoting companies in the world are Live
Nation and AEG?
A. In my opinion, yes.
Q. And which one is the number one company?
A. I can't really answer that. I think they're both the two biggest companies in the business.
Q. Now, when you say "AEG," are you referring to Anschutz Entertainment Group, Inc., or are
you referring to some other entity?
A. Anschutz Entertainment.
Ms. Strong: For clarity of the record, AEG Live?
A. AEG Live, yes.
By Mr. Boyle:
Q. In 2002 you were the Concerts West tour director for the Eagles, correct?
A. That is correct.
Q. And was that a tour or what was that?
A. That was a tour that the Eagles promoted -- I'm sorry. That's a tour that Concerts West
promoted and they asked me to go out on that tour to be their representative to oversee that tour.
Q. Who asked you to go out?
A. Mr. Clouse, Doug Clouse.

Q. And Mr. Clouse works with Concerts West and AEG Live, right?
A. That's correct. Do you know who Randy Phillips is?
A. I do.
Q. Who is Randy Phillips, to your understanding?
A. I'm not sure of his exact title. He is either president or CEO of AEG Live.
Q. And, sir, you're friends with Mr. Phillips, correct?
A. I am.
Q. And how long have you been friends with Mr. Phillips?
A. I've known Mr. Phillips probably for ten years.
Q. And are you -- have you worked with Mr. Phillips before?
A. Have I worked for Mr. Phillips before?
Q. Worked with.
A. With?
Q. Yeah.
A. Yes, I have.
Q. And in what capacity have you worked with Mr. Phillips?
A. Well, Mr. Phillips and AEG Live were the promoters for Bette Midler's residency show in
Las Vegas.
Q. Is that the show, "The Showgirl Must Go On"?
A. That's correct.
Q. And what was Mr. Phillips' role in that?

A. AEG Live was the promoter for Bette's run at the Coliseum at Caesars Palace.
Q. Okay. And what was your role in that?
A. I was the -- my role on that particular show was the general manager, since it wasn't really a
touring show, it was a residency show.
Q. Now, was that the only time that you've ever worked with AEG Live?
A. Yes, that is correct.
Q. And so, sir, when you testified earlier that you -- you're friends with Mr. Phillips, do you do
social things together?
A. No.
Q. Have you ever been to Mr. Phillips' house?
A. No.
Q. Has he ever been to yours?
A. No.
Q. How is it that you maintain the friendship?
A. I think the business in general is a very, very small business. Mr. Phillips used to manage a
former client of mine, Lionel Richie.
Q. And when was that?
A. Well, I worked with Lionel in 1997, probably for two or three years. Well, I'm sorry, from
1998 to '99. And so Mr. Phillips did not manage Lionel at that time.
Q. And -- was the first time you met Mr. Phillips on the Bette Midler tour?
A. Probably, yeah.
Q. Now, sir, when you say you're friends with Mr. Phillips, do you recognize that Mr. Phillips
is a defendant in this case?

A. Yes.
Q. And, sir, I see on Exhibit 4 of your list of materials reviewed, that Mr. Phillips' deposition is
not on here. Is that true?
A. That is true.
Q. So you've not read Mr. Phillips' deposition?
A. I have not.
Q. Sir, have you ever worked with a man named Paul Gongaware?
A. No, I have not.
Q. Have you ever met Paul Gongaware?
A. Yes.
Q. Under what circumstances have you met Paul Gongaware?
A. I can't recall, but I've known Paul for many, many years. Again, because of the nature of the
business and the smallness of it, Paul and I would run into each other on occasion.
Q. Like you do with Mr. Phillips, do you consider yourself friends with Mr. Gongaware?
A. Yes.
Q. Sir, have you ever served as an expert witness before?
A. No.
Q. Sir, do you believe that you can be ethical and unbiassed in your opinions, given your
friendship with two of the individual defendants and the fact that you do business with a
corporate defendant?
A. Yes, absolutely.
Q. And you don't think that's going to color your opinion in any way?
A. No.

Q. And what can you do to ensure to the jury that you're not going to be influenced by your
friendship with these men?
A. I think that, you know, if you look on my resume, I've also worked for Janet Jackson and
have met Mrs. Jackson at times, and that too would not sway my opinion one way or the other. I
think that this business is a very, very small business, and I probably know most of the people
involved in this business.
Q. And how is it that you knew Mr. Gongaware back in 1993?
A. Again, just the smallness of the business. I've known Mr. Gongaware for probably 25 years.
Again, just in passing.
Q. Now, sir, do you also know Mr. Gongaware's friend Dr. Stuart Finkelstein?
A. I do not.
Q. Sir, I don't see Dr. Finkelstein's deposition on your list of materials reviewed. Were you
given Dr. Finkelstein's deposition?
A. I was not.
Q. So you weren't given Randy Phillips' deposition, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And you weren't given Dr. Stuart Finkelstein's deposition, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And you were not given Mr. John Meglen's deposition, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And you were not given Tim Leiweke's deposition, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. Sir, were you shown any -- any e-mails sent by any AEG Live personnel?

A. None.
Q. Not one e-mail?
A. Not one e-mail. I'm assuming you were contacted to serve as an expert witness in this case
approximately three weeks ago?
A. Three or four weeks ago, yes.
Q. Who contacted you?
A. Adam from the attorney's office.
Q. Adam -- someone named Adam?
A. Yes.
Q. From the law offices of O'Melveny & Myers?
A. That is correct.
Q. And what did Adam say to you?
A. He called and asked if I would be interested in providing expert testimony in this case.
Q. And what did you say?
A. I said that I would need more time -- that I would need more details on the case and that my
time at the moment was pretty maxed out.
Q. And what did Adam say?
A. He said, "We would really like you to do this."
Q. And what did you say?
A. I thought about it for a day or so and I called him back and I agreed to do it.
Q. When you were speaking with Adam on that first call, did he tell you what the scope of
expertise they wanted you to talk about was?

A. I think he just spoke in generalities about the case itself, and I don't think we went into much
detail what kind of testimony I would provide.
Q. At that -- at the time you were contacted by Adam of O'Melveny & Myers, did you already
have any preconceived thoughts about this case?
A. No, I did not.
Q. And so when you called Adam back -- did you call Adam back or somebody else?
A. I called Adam back.
Q. When you called Adam back and said you would do it, did you tell him how much your
charges would be?
A. He asked me how much I would charge and I said, "Well, I don't do this for a living. What
do you pay your expert witnesses?" And he said he paid them between 400 and 500 dollars an
hour.
Q. And it appears that you settled on $500 an hour?
A. That's correct.
Q. And at what point in time were you advised on what they wanted you to look at and give
testimony about?
A. I think shortly after agreeing to do it, I think that they sent me some of the documents on this
list of materials that I've -- that I received.
Q. And did anybody talk to you and explain to you what they wanted you to testify about?
A. I think they just wanted me to testify on the general scope of what I do for a living.
Q. And why do you think that?
A. I think they were looking for someone who was very familiar with the touring industry.
Q. Have you ever been on a tour where the artist had a physician?

A. I have not. I've been on tours where the artists have had physical therapists, have had
masseuses, have had cooks, have had trainers. I've never gone a tour where I've actually taken a
doctor on the road.
Q. What about whether the artist has taken a doctor on the road?
A. I've never been on a tour where an artist has taken a doctor on the road.
Q. In your role as tour manager, have you ever hired a doctor for an artist?
A. Yes.
Q. Okay. Can you explain that, please.
A. I've hired doctors in individual cities when my artists were ill or wanted to get a B-12 shot.
I've hired doctors to come in and look at various members of the touring party, dancers, band
members who were ill, sick. I had a doctor at my show last night in Tampa because I had several
of my crew members who weren't feeling well.
Q. And so in those instances you hired a doctor to come deal with whatever the problem was?
A. Correct.
Q. And then did you pay that doctor?
A. Yes, we did.
Q. You did, yes?
A. I didn't personally, but the tour paid the doctor.
Q. Sure. So let's use a hypothetical. Let's say you have a dancer who breaks her ankle. Okay?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Understand?
A. Yes.
Q. Now, and you're going to be hiring a doctor to come in and check out the ankle for the
dancer. Are you with me?

A. Yes.
Q. It's important, correct, that you hire a doctor who is going to give -- who is going to put the
interests of the patient before what he thinks you might want to have happen, correct?
A. Yes. That doctor should look out for the best interests of the patient.
Q. And if this dancer might be your best dancer that you really want to be out on stage the next
night, you personally, as the tour manager, you don't want the doctor sending her on stage if
that's not in her best interests; is that correct?
A. I think that's a decision I make, and I would never put that dancer on stage if it wasn't in her
best interests.
Q. And you want to hire an unbiased and ethical doctor who will be concerned about her best
interests, right?
A. That's correct.
Q. Who is Kenny Ortega?
A. Kenny Ortega is an artistic director. I've worked with Mr. Ortega before.
Q. Do you think Mr. Ortega would ever falsely sound an alarm to a concert promoter or
producer about the declining health of an artist?
A. No.
Q. Sir, you weren't shown any testimony from Mr. Ortega where he informed AEG Live
personnel that Michael's health was rapidly declining, were you?
A. No.
Q. Sir, as -- in your role as a tour manager, have you ever injected yourself into the doctor-
patient relationship?
A. No.
Q. Do you think that's appropriate for a tour manager to inject themselves in the doctor-patient
relationship?

A. No.
Q. Do you think it's appropriate for a promoter to inject themselves in the doctor-patient
relationship?
A. No.
Q. And do you think it's appropriate for a tour producer to inject themselves into the doctor-
patient relationship between the doctor and the artist?
A. I don't think that in terms of interjecting themselves in the doctor-patient relationship, I think
if you're a promoter and you had genuine concerns that an artist you were working with was
getting ill, there needs to be some concern there. So I can see that if you had booked a series of
dates or were promoting a tour and the artist that you had booked to go do that tour was not
feeling well or was physically getting ill, yes, there would be some concern.
Q. So do you think it's appropriate for someone in the music industry to speak to an artist's
doctor without that artist being present --
Q. -- about their medical care?
A. I don't see -- I don't see a problem asking the question. I think it would be the responsibility
of the doctor to say, "Hey, look, I can't divulge that information to you."
Q. You're a tour manager, right?
A. Yes.
Q. And you've hired many doctors?
A. Yes.
Q. So is it appropriate for you to be asking the doctor all kinds of question about the health of
the people who they're treating?
A. I have to tell you, I've done it myself.
Q. And you think that's okay?

A. I don't know if it's okay or not, but I've had people that were ill that were supposed to
perform, whether that evening or at other shows, and as my natural instinct to go to that doctor
and ask him, "Is that dancer going to be able to make a show in a day?" "Is that dancer or
musician going to be able to make that show in a week?" Is it appropriate? I don't know if it's
appropriate. But it's a question that I have to ask for the well being of the tour and the well being
of the artist that I work for. "Look, did she sprain her ankle? How long is she going to be out?
Do I need to fly another dancer in?" "How long is that musician going to be sick? Do I need to
get another drummer?" So I think it's a legitimate question that I have to ask as the tour
manager.
Q. And your role as a tour manager or based on your experience in the industry with promoters
and producers that you say you're qualified to testify about here today, do you know of any
instance where a tour manager, a promoter or a producer went over to an artist's house while that
artist wasn't home and had a private conversation with that artist's doctor?
A. I do not know of a situation like that.
Q. Do you know who Timm Woolley is?
A. I do.
Q. Who is Timm Woolley?
A. Timm Woolley is an accountant and business manager. I spoke with Tim Woolley about
four weeks ago.
Q. What did you speak with Mr. Woolley about?
A. He wanted to know if I was available and interested in doing a Rolling Stones tour. Nothing
to do with the case.
Q. Are you going to do the Rolling Stones tour?
A. I am not.
Q. And what role was Mr. Woolley talking to you about doing on the Rolling Stones tour?
A. As a tour manager.
Q. And at the time Mr. Woolley called you, had you been retained by the AEG lawyers in this
case?

A. No.
Q. Do you know if Mr. Woolley had any role on the This Is It tour?
A. From reading the documentation, yes, he did.
Q. What was your understanding of what Mr. Woolley's role was on the This Is It tour?
A. It sounded like he was the business manager/tour accountant.
Q. And you understood that he was reporting to Paul Gongaware, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And so that he was working for AEG, correct?
A. That is correct.
Q. Have you ever spoken to Mr. Woolley about his role on the This Is It tour?
A. Never.
Q. So, sir, I see on Exhibit 3, which is what they typed up of what your opinions are, in the
middle it says, "No red flags here." Do you see that?
A. Yes.
Q. But you didn't see any of these e-mails that I'm talking about, did you?
A. Yes, I didn't read the hard e-mails, but some of the e-mails were in the context of some of
this.
Q. But you didn't read any of the e-mails where Mr. Ortega was waving a red flag and
informing AEG executives about Michael's declining health, did you?
A. No.
Q. So you don't think a doctor from Las Vegas asking for $5 million to go on the tour raises a
red flag?

A. That raised a red flag.

Q. Okay. And tell me about that. Why did that raise a red flag?
A. Just the enormous sum of the money.
Q. It's outrageous, right?
A. Outrageous.
Q. Did it make you wonder, wow, what was this doctor going to be doing that he thinks he can
demand $5 million?
A. No. I think it was a number that the doctor threw out there and if somebody said yes to it,
then he would be thrilled to death.
Q. Have you ever in your career, before reviewing that document in this case, have you ever
seen another draft agreement between a tour promoter/producer and a doctor?
A. No, not that I can recall.
Q. How many years have you been in the business?
A. 30.
Q. Sir, one of the areas in your outline is about different roles and responsibilities of various
people in the tour industry, right?
A. Correct.
Q. What is an artist's manager's role?
A. An artist's manager's role is to basically --
A. An artist's manager really represents the artist in terms of, you know recording deals, tour
deals, sponsorship deals, you know, guiding the artist's career.
Q. My question is would it be unusual in the music industry for a producer/promoter to pay for
the artist's personal manager?

A. Again, I don't think it's necessarily unusual. I think, again, every role is different. If they
were paying Dr. Tohme to fulfill a specific role that they had specified in that agreement to do
certain things outside the scope of being an artist's manager, then --
Q. Okay. Sir, based on your experience in the music industry, can you point to any examples
that you know of from your personal experience where a producer/promoter of a tour was paying
the artist's personal manager?
A. Not that I'm aware of.
Q. Sir, under what circumstances would you tell a show director that you did a check on the
artist's doctor when you really didn't do a check on the artist's doctor?
A. I would never tell a show director that.
Q. Right. You would never tell a show director who is expressing concern about the artist's
well being an untruth about a check that you did on the artist's doctor, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. Because it would be totally and completely inappropriate, correct?
A. Again, if I had all the facts, I would not -- again, I would not relay that information unless I
completely understood the situation.
Q. Would you ever hire a doctor to give an opiate-dependent artist Demerol?
A. No.
Q. Would you ever hire a doctor with knowledge that one of the roles the doctor was going to
be fulfilling is feeding the chemical dependency of the artist?
A. I would not.
Q. And so then you obviously agree that Dr. Murray was a tour personnel?
A. Dr. Murray was someone who was supposed to be on the tour, that's correct.
Q. So an artist's personal physician can also be a tour personnel, correct?
A. Yes.

Q. Then "No red flags here." This is your other section. Now, were you talking about just no
red flags at the time they hired Dr. Murray?
A. This pertained to Mr. Berman's testimony.
Q. Sir, do you have an expert opinion in this case as to whether the defendants hired Dr.
Murray?
A. No.
Q. And, sir, when was the last time you spoke to Mr. Gongaware?
A. Approximately three or four weeks ago.
Q. Under what circumstances did you speak to Mr. Gongaware?
A. He called me regarding the Rolling Stones tour.
Q. Mr. Gongaware did?
A. Yes. He was the initial phone call and then he had Mr. Woolley call me.
Q. So at that time that Mr. Gongaware called you, had you already been retained to serve as an
expert witness for the defense in this case?
A. No. He called me prior to the law firm contacting me.
Q. And offered you a job to work on the Rolling Stones tour?
A. No, didn't offer me a job. Wanted to know my availability and interest.
Q. And what did you tell him?
A. I said I was pretty busy for the year and that it was the Rolling Stones and I would definitely
throw my resume in the pot.
Q. Because a tour manager would want to work on a Rolling Stones tour, I'm assuming?
A. Yes.

Q. So you told Mr. Gongaware you would throw your resume in the pot, correct?
A. Yes.
Q. And then Mr. Woolley called you?
A. Yes.
Q. When was it that Mr. Woolley called you?
A. Probably the following day.
Q. And he called you also in regard to you potentially working on the Rolling Stones tour?
A. That's correct.
Q. Is it a fair statement, sir, that you hope to in the future work with AEG Live?
A. No.
Q. Is it a fair statement that you in the future do not want to work with AEG Live?
A. It depends how you define "work for." If you --
Q. I said "with," sir.
A. Oh, "with." I'll take it back. Yes, I would like to work with AEG Live in the future. With.
Not for.
Q. Are you concerned that if you were to give your opinion under oath on video that you think
that AEG Live and Paul Gongaware and Randy Phillips did something wrong in regard to
Michael Jackson, that they wouldn't want to work with you anymore?
A. No. They don't have any say in who hires me or what tours I do.
Q. Work with them, though. I mean, they called you about the Rolling Stones, right?
A. Yes.

Q. I mean, would you be comfortable saying to them when they call about Rolling Stones
saying something like, "Well, I think you guys acted very unreasonably with how you treated
Michael Jackson"? Would you say that?
A. I wouldn't make a statement like that.
Q. Because you want to work with those guys again, right?
A. I will tell you that I actually have no interest in working for AEG. Working with and
working for -- if you're saying that I'm going to work for AEG, I have no interest in working for
AEG. If you say that one of my artists is going to do a tour that AEG promotes, I have no
problem with that.
Q. That's what I mean. And, in fact, as you testified before, the two biggest promoters in the
world are AEG Live and Live Nation, right?
A. Yes.
Q. And so you want to do, presumably, tours for your artists with both of those companies,
right?
A. Correct.
Q. Have you ever talked to either Randy Phillips, Paul Gongaware or Tim Woolley about
Michael Jackson?
A. No. You were asked questions about whether or not you thought it was -- something to the
effect of -- I'm not going to get this precisely right, but something to the effect of whether you
would talk with doctors about the health status of an artist. Do you recall that testimony?
A. I do.
Q. And you said something to the effect of you don't know whether it's appropriate or not.
What did you mean by that?
A. Let me clarify. When we talked about me going to a doctor in relationship to a dancer or
musician and maybe -- go back to the example of the broken ankle. I felt that it was -- again, to
clarify my answer, it was to see what kind of condition that dancer was in or that musician was
in, and going to a doctor would give me some kind of assessment as to can that person perform
the next night or in two weeks or in three weeks. And I don't think that it was inappropriate in
the sense of AEG Live to go to Dr. Murray and say, "How is Michael's health?" Because, again,

they were trying to figure out if he would be able to perform these shows in London. So that's
what I meant.
Q. And, just to be clear, so whether it's appropriate or inappropriate from a medical perspective
or not, that's not what you're speaking to? You're talking about the standard in the industry; is
that right?
A. Yes, I am. Totally.
Q. And is that something that you would expect to see folks do in your industry, in the touring
industry, is to ask a doctor how an artist is doing?
A. Absolutely. I think everyone would want to know on the concern about when the next show
is, when this artist can go back up on stage and perform. I've had artists that have had the flu and
I've been told, "This artist needs a week of rest before he or she can recuperate and perform
again."
Q. And is that something that's of concern to the producer?
A. I think it's a concern with anybody associated with the tour.
Q. You also testified that you've not seen a draft agreement between a producer and a doctor in
your time in the industry. But are you aware that doctors have gone on tours with artists?
A. Yes.
Q. And can you give us some examples of doctors who have gone actually on tour with an
artist?
A. I know that the Rolling Stones carried -- on their last tour had a physician out on tour with
them.
Q. Any others?
A. I think Blink-182 at some point had a doctor that toured with them as well.
Q. And you were not involved in those tours, correct?
A. I was not.

Q. Okay. So you don't know one way or the other what kind of agreements there were with
respect to the doctors on those tours. Is that fair to say?
A. That's fair to say.
Q. And, in general, there were several questions where he was asking you -- Mr. Boyle asked
you several questions where you were relaying your personal experience about what would be
appropriate or inappropriate to do in a given instance. Would those opinions that you gave apply
to the industry as a whole and essentially would be consistent with the standard practice in the
industry as you're familiar with it?
A. I do. I think -- I think in general, like I mentioned, every tour is different, but I think also
there is a general consensus about how tours operate and how tours run, and I've tried to offer the
best opinions I could as to what those standards are.
Q. Based on your industry experience on the whole?
A. Correct.
Q. You talked about how Mr. Woolley and Mr. Gongaware reached out to you in connection
with the Rolling Stones tour, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. Did you get that job?
A. I did not.
Q. You -- why not?
A. They hired somebody else.
Q. And I believe you testified that you would like to work with AEG Live in the future to the
extent you have any artist that wants to do any tours with them; is that correct?
A. That's correct.
Q. And the same is true with respect to Live Nation, correct?
A. Correct.

Q. And the artists you represent, they essentially work with either Live Nation or AEG Live; is
that fair to say?
A. That's very fair to say. Who I work with, the artists that I work with, the promoters have no
responsibility in terms of paying me or hiring me. I work for an artist and they have no say
whatsoever whether I'm hired or not by those artists.