McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor's Agent Transcript 2014 10 06

McMillan Sand Filtration Site 10/6/2014
Washington, D.C. Baltimore, MD Florida

Olender Reporting, Inc. (888) 445-3376 WORLDWIDE
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GOVERNMENT OF THE DI STRI CT OF COLUMBI A
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Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d
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Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d Hear i ng
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Mayor ' s Agent
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Pr oper t y Addr ess:
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McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on Si t e
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Case Number : H. P. A. 14- 393
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9: 39 a. m. t o 5: 05 p. m.
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Monday, Oct ober 6, 2014
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D. C. Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Of f i ce
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Of f i ce of Pl anni ng
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1100 4t h St r eet , S. W. , Room4302
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Washi ngt on, D. C. 20024
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APPEARANCES:
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J UDGE:
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J . Pet er Byr ne
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For Opponent s:
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Andr ea C. Fer st er , Esq.
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2121 War d Cour t , N. W.
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Fi f t h Fl oor
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202- 974- 5142
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af er st er @r ai l st ot r ai l s. or g
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El i zabet h S. Mer r i t t , Esq.
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Deput y Gener al Counsel
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Nat i onal Tr ust f or Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on
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2600 Vi r gi ni a Avenue, N. W.
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Sui t e 1000
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202- 588- 6026
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emer r i t t @savi ngpl aces. or g
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For Appl i cant s:
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Mar y Car ol yn Br own, Esq.
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Hol l and & Kni ght
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800- 17t h St r eet , N. W.
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Sui t e 1100
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202- 862- 5990
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car ol yn. br own@hkl aw. com
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- - -
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WI T N E S S E S
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Di r ect Cr oss Redi r ect Recr oss
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Mar t i ne Combal 14 24 46 -
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Ronan Gul st one 48 55 - -
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Anne Cor bet t 63 70 - -
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Emi l y Hot al i ng Ei g 81 108 - -
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149 154 - -
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Ki r k Met t am 121 139 - -
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Br uce Leonar d 174 189 - -
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Mat t hew J . Bel l 198 242 - -
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AdamC. Weer s 262 276 - -
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J ai r Lynch 285 291 - -
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WI T N E S S E S ( cont . )
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Di r ect Cr oss Redi r ect Recr oss
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Aakash Thakkar 316 336 - -
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Li ndsl ey Wi l l i ams 349 358 - -
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Cel i a Di ane Bar nes 364 369 - -
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E X H I B I T S
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Page
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No. 1 - Emi l y Hot al i ng Ei g Cur r i cul umVi t ae 81
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No. 2 - Ki r k Met t amCur r i cul umVi t ae 120
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No. 3 - Br uce Leonar d Cur r i cul umVi t ae 171
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No. 4 - Mat t hew J . Bel l Cur r i cul umVi t ae 197
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No. 5 - Li ndsl ey Wi l l i ams Cur r i cul umVi t ae 349
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P R O C E E D I N G S
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J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , l adi es and
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gent l emen, l et ' s pr oceed, pl ease. Wel l , good
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mor ni ng, ever ybody. I ' mPet er Byr ne and I ' mt he
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desi gnat ed Mayor ' s Agent f or t hi s mat t er , whi ch
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i nvol ves a per mi t appl i cat i on t o r aze 15 of t he
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r emai ni ng 18 f i l t r at i on cel l s i n t he McMi l l an Par k
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Reser voi r at 2501 Fi r st St r eet , Nor t hwest . And t he
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appl i cat i on i s assi gned Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Act
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Number 14- 393.
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The case i s bei ng hear d under t he aut hor i t y
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of D. C. Law 2- 144, t he Hi st or i c Landmar k and Hi st or i c
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Di st r i ct Pr ot ect i on Act of 1978. The l aw r equi r es
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t he Mayor or hi s agent t o r evi ew per mi t appl i cat i ons
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f or demol i t i on, al t er at i on, subdi vi si on, new
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const r uct i on on t he si t e of hi st or i c l andmar ks wi t hi n
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hi st or i c di st r i ct s.
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Pr i or t o consi der at i on by t he Mayor ' s
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Agent , t he l aw r equi r es t hat appl i cat i ons be r ef er r ed
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t o t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d f or i t s
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r ecommendat i on.
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We' ve had many hear i ngs her e, but on May
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22d, 2014, HPRB r ecommended agai nst t he i ssuance of a
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r aze per mi t on t he gr ounds t hat i t woul d not be
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consi st ent wi t h t he pur poses of t he Hi st or i c Landmar k
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and Hi st or i c Di st r i ct Pr ot ect i on Act . Af t er t he
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Boar d made i t s r ecommendat i on, t he appl i cant
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r equest ed t hi s publ i c hear i ng, as pr ovi ded by l aw.
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The hear i ng wi l l be conduct ed i n
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conf or mance wi t h t he D. C. Admi ni st r at i ve Pr ocedur e
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Act and Ti t l e 10C, Di st r i ct of Col umbi a Muni ci pal
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Regul at i ons, whi ch cont ai n t he r ul es of pr ocedur e f or
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t he Mayor ' s Agent , pur suant t o t he Pr eser vat i on Law.
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The pr ocedur e t hi s mor ni ng wi l l be as
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f ol l ows. Fi r st , we' l l have a consi der at i on of
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pendi ng mot i ons and pr ocedur al mat t er s, t hen
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pr esent at i on of t he Appl i cant s' case, r epor t s or
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st at ement s by publ i c agency r epr esent at i ves,
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st at ement s by af f ect ed Advi sor y Nei ghbor hood
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Commi ssi ons, par t i es and ot her per sons i n suppor t of
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t he appl i cat i on, t hen par t i es and ot her per sons i n
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opposi t i on t o t he appl i cat i on.
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Then we' l l have r ebut t al by t he Appl i cant ,
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r ebut t al by par t i es i n suppor t of t he appl i cat i on,
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and sur r ebut t al by par t i es i n opposi t i on t o t he
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appl i cat i on.
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And t hi s mor ni ng, we' r e goi ng t o use t he
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second chai r her e as a wi t ness chai r f or wi t nesses
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who ar e si mpl y goi ng t o t est i f y and t he f i r st chai r
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at t he comput er wi l l be f or wi t nesses who ar e doi ng a
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comput er pr esent at i on, okay?
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One of t he aspect s of t he r egul at i ons i s
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t hat al l t he wi t nesses who ar e goi ng t o pr esent
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t est i mony need t o be swor n and i t ' s somet i mes most
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conveni ent i f we j ust do t hat al l at once.
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You' ve al l si gned i n t o one of t he f or ms i f
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you' r e goi ng t o be a wi t ness and t hose who' ve si gned
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i n and ar e goi ng t o be wi t nesses, I ' d ask you pl ease
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j ust r ai se your r i ght hand. A sea of hands, okay.
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( The wi t nesses ar e dul y swor n by J udge
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Byr ne. )
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J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you ver y much. We' l l
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begi n, t hen, wi t h some pr ocedur al mat t er s. Ther e ar e
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t wo appl i cat i ons pendi ng f or par t y st at us i n t he
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case, one by t he Fr i ends of McMi l l an Par k and one by
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t he Nat i onal Tr ust f or Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on. And i s
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t her e any obj ect i on t o t hose?
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MS. BROWN: I have no obj ect i on t o Fr i ends
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of McMi l l an Par k. I do have a quest i on about t he
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Nat i onal Tr ust , i f t hey have wi t nesses or i f t her e' s
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j ust - - ar e you appear i ng as t he at t or ney or as t he
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- - as you sai d i n your r equest f or par t y st at us, or
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ar e you goi ng t o be a wi t ness?
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MS. MERRI TT: Wel l , our pl an i s t hat I
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woul d t est i f y not as an exper t , but on behal f of t he
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Nat i onal Tr ust , and we' r e al so expect i ng t he di r ect or
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of Pr esi dent Li ncol n' s Cot t age t o come and t est i f y.
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She won' t be her e f or a coupl e of hour s.
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MS. BROWN: I guess what I ' maski ng i s,
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t hen, I wi l l be abl e t o cr oss exami ne you and t hat
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you ar e pr ecl uded f r omcr oss exami ni ng our wi t nesses
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i f you' r e a wi t ness.
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MS. MERRI TT: I t ' s my expect at i on t hat my
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t est i mony woul d be subj ect t o cr oss exami nat i on, but
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i t was al so my expect at i on, because I ama l awyer f or
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t he Nat i onal Tr ust , essent i al l y, I ' mki nd of l i ke a
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pr o se par t y, t hat I woul d be abl e t o cr oss exami ne
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wi t nesses, as wel l .
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MS. BROWN: Then I woul d have an obj ect i on,
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because t hat does not compor t wi t h t he Rul es of
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Pr of essi onal Conduct , Rul e 3. 7, Lawyer as Wi t ness.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Can I see a copy of t hat ,
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pl ease?
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( Ms. Br own hands document t o J udge Byr ne. )
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MS. MERRI TT: Wel l , I guess i f I have t o
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choose bet ween t he t wo, I woul d sacr i f i ce t he - -
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MS. FERSTER: You know, i f I coul d j ust say
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t hat I t hi nk t hat Bet sy Mer r i t t i s a pr o se l i t i gant
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i n t hi s case because she i s Deput y Gener al Counsel of
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t he Nat i onal Tr ust f or Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on. She
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r out i nel y t est i f i es on t he posi t i on of t he Nat i onal
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Tr ust , you know, and i n many hear i ngs wi t h peopl e of
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t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d.
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She i s not an exper t wi t ness, she i s si mpl y
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communi cat i ng t he Nat i onal Tr ust ' s posi t i on on t hi s
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mat t er . So I don' t see any obj ect i on t o her bei ng,
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you know, bot h a l awyer and a wi t ness r epr esent i ng
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t he Nat i onal Tr ust ' s posi t i on on t hi s mat t er .
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MS. BROWN: I t hi nk i t ' s wor t hwhi l e, t hen,
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t o r evi ew Rul e 3. 7. I don' t t hi nk she i s pr o se
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because she cl ear l y sai d t hat she was goi ng t o be
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appear i ng as counsel f or t he Nat i onal Tr ust . So I
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j ust want t o make sur e we know what t he r ul es ar e
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because I don' t want her cr oss exami ni ng my wi t nesses
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i f she' s a wi t ness her sel f .
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J UDGE BYRNE: And how do you t hi nk your
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cl i ent woul d be pr ej udi ced by t hat , your wi t nesses
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woul d be pr ej udi ced by t hat ?
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MS. BROWN: Wel l , number one, i t ' s agai nst
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t he Rul es of Pr of essi onal Conduct .
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J UDGE BYRNE: But t hat woul d be somet hi ng
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t hat you coul d t ake up wi t h t he bar , r at her t han wi t h
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me, I t hi nk.
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MS. BROWN: Wel l , secondl y, I t hi nk i t ' s
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j ust t hat t hi s pr ocdeedi ng shoul d be conduct ed i n
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accor dance wi t h t he Rul es of Pr of essi onal Conduct .
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And I t hi nk t hat i t does pr ej udi ce our wi t nesses
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because we have her act i ng as an advocat e and a
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wi t ness and we need t o pi ck one.
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J UDGE BYRNE: So ar e you goi ng t o t est i f y
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as t o f act s or ar e you goi ng t o j ust pr esent t he
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posi t i on of t he Nat i onal Tr ust ?
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MS. MERRI TT: Wel l , i t ' s a mi xt ur e of bot h,
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because some of t he f act s i nvol ve aspect s of t hi s
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cont r over sy t hat we' ve been i nvol ved wi t h i n t he
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past , so t her e' s a bl end of f act s i n t her e. I mean
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i f I have t o choose bet ween one or t he ot her , my
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pr ef er ence i s goi ng t o be t o t est i f y and t o f or ego
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t he r i ght t o cr oss exami ne.
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MS. BROWN: And t hat woul d be f i ne by me.
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MS. MERRI TT: I ' mnot goi ng t o f or ego t he
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r i ght t o t est i f y i n or der t o - -
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J UDGE BYRNE: Ri ght .
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MS. MERRI TT: - - cr oss exami ne.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Let me l ook at t hi s agai n. I
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guess what st r i kes me i s t hat t he r ul es pr ovi de by
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t hei r t er ms t wo t r i al s, and a Mayor ' s Agent hear i ng
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i s a pecul i ar bl end of an adver sar i al hear i ng and a
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publ i c hear i ng i n whi ch peopl e gi ve opi ni ons on
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mat t er s. And whi l e ever yone i s swor n, i f we have
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cr oss exami nat i on, I t hi nk t hat i t seems t o me t hat
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i t ' s accept abl e i n t hi s cont ext f or Ms. Mer r i t t t o
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act i n bot h capaci t i es.
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MS. BROWN: And I woul d cont i nue t o not e my
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obj ect i on f or t he r ecor d.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, f ai r enough. Now I do
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have anot her mat t er t hat r el at es t o t he pr esence - -
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pr eser vat i on l awyer s ar e a smal l communi t y and I am
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cur r ent l y pl anni ng a nat i onal pr eser vat i on l aw
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conf er ence wi t h t he Nat i onal Tr ust . I have no
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pecuni ar y i nt er est i n i t , i t ' s st r i ct l y an
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educat i onal mat t er , i t has not hi ng t o do wi t h
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advocacy. But I want ed t o put t hat out her e t o gi ve
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anyone a chance t o quest i on whet her I have a conf l i ct
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of i nt er est .
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I n my own vi ew, I have no concer n about my
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abi l i t y t o deci de t he case on t he f act s and t he l aw,
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but I t hought i t was appr opr i at e t o di scl ose t hat on
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t he r ecor d at t he begi nni ng. Do you have any
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concer ns?
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MS. BROWN: No, I have no concer ns.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hank you, no concer ns.
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Al l r i ght , good. So l et ' s t hen pr oceed wi t h t he
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pr esent at i on by t he Appl i cant .
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MS. BROWN: We qual i f i ed t hat t hese t wo
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wi l l be par t i es, yes?
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J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
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MS. BROWN: We accept ed - -
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J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, I ' msor r y, yes, yes,
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t hank you.
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MS. BROWN: And t hen I ' d l i ke t o qual i f y
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our wi t nesses as exper t s i n cer t ai n ar eas - -
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J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, yes.
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MS. BROWN: Let me get t hei r r esums.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Do you want t o do t hat
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i ndi vi dual l y as t hey t est i f y?
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MS. BROWN: What ever i s - -
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J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk t hat ' s pr obabl y best .
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MS. BROWN: Then we can go di r ect l y i nt o
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our openi ng st at ement .
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J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hank you.
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MS. BROWN: Act ual l y, I do have one
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r equest . The Co- Appl i cant i s t he Di st r i ct of
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Col umbi a, t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce.
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J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
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MS. BROWN: And we have t wo r epr esent at i ves
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f r omt he Di st r i ct her e. One i s Mar t i ne Combal f r om
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t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce and t he ot her i s Ronan
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Gul st one f r omKenyan McDuf f i e' s of f i ce and I was
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wonder i ng i f i t ' s appr opr i at e f or t hemt o speak
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f i r st .
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J UDGE BYRNE: That woul d be f i ne. Pl ease,
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come her e. Act ual l y, t he second chai r i s what we' l l
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t r y t o do her e. Good mor ni ng. Pl ease st at e your
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name f or t he r ecor d.
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MS. COMBAL: Good mor ni ng, my name i s
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Mar t i ne Combal , I amt he I nt er i mDeput y Di r ect or of
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Real Est at e i n t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce f or Pl anni ng
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and Economi c Devel opment .
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J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you.
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Wher eupon,
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MARTI NE COMBAL
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havi ng been pr evi ousl y dul y swor n, t est i f i ed as
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f ol l ows:
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DI RECT EXAMI NATI ON
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THE WI TNESS: Good mor ni ng. I amone of
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t he Di st r i ct ' s pr oj ect execut i ves over seei ng t he
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devel opment of t he McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on Si t e.
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And unf or t unat el y, Deput y Mayor Mi l l er i s unabl e t o
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at t end t hi s mor ni ng, so I amher e t o speak.
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On behal f of t he Deput y Mayor and t he Gr ay
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Admi ni st r at i on, I amdel i ght ed t o be her e t oday t o
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voi ce our st r ong suppor t f or t he par t i al demol i t i on
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and over al l r edevel opment at t he f or mer McMi l l an Sand
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Fi l t r at i on Si t e. I n f act , t he pr oj ect has had
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unwaver i ng endor sement of not onl y t hi s
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Admi ni st r at i on, but sever al pr evi ous admi ni st r at i ons,
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as wel l .
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The Ci t y pur chased t he pr oper t y i n 1987,
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expl i ci t l y f or mi xed use r edevel opment t o benef i t t he
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communi t y, t o devel op not j ust a good pr oj ect or a
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gr eat pr oj ect , but an exempl ar y pr oj ect of speci al
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mer i t t hat woul d benef i t t he communi t y- at - l ar ge.
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The Ci t y has devel oped det ai l ed,
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Compr ehensi ve Pl an l anguage f or t he McMi l l an si t e
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cal l i ng f or a mi xed use r edevel opment wi t h
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si gni f i cant communi t y benef i t , agai n, a pr oj ect of
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speci al mer i t .
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The Ci t y sel ect ed a mi xed use devel opment
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t eam, Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s, VMP, i n 2007 wi t h t he
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expl i ci t i nt ent of devel opi ng a mi xed use pr oj ect .
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The VMP pl an has r ecei ved unani mous suppor t and
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appr oval of al l gover nment al bodi es because of i t s
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consi st ency wi t h t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an and i t s
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si gni f i cant communi t y benef i t s.
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Thi s si t e has i ncr edi bl e hi st or i cal
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si gni f i cance and nat ur al beaut y, t hough i t has been
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i naccessi bl e t o t he publ i c. I t was bui l t as an
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i ndust r i al si t e, a wat er f i l t r at i on pl ant , si nce i t s
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openi ng t he ear l y 1900s.
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The Di st r i ct , t oget her wi t h our devel opment
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t eam, has devel oped a pl an t hat cel ebr at es and
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pr eser ves t he hi st or y of t he si t e, t r ul y opens t he
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f or mer f aci l i t y up t o t he publ i c and of f er s a br oad
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and deep ar r ay of communi t y benef i t s t o Di st r i ct
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r esi dent s of al l ages and mor e i mpor t ant , al l i ncome
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l evel s.
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The Di st r i ct ' s i nvol vement wi t h t he si t e
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dat es back t o 1986, when t he Ar my Cor ps of Engi neer s,
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t he owner s of t he si t e, decl ar ed i t sur pl us and asked
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t he Gener al Ser vi ces Admi ni st r at i on t o di spose of i t .
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GSA sear ched f or pr ospect i ve buyer s,
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i nsi st i ng on sel l i ng t he pr oper t y f or mi xed
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commer ci al devel opment and t he Di st r i ct acqui r ed t he
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pr oper t y f or t hi s i nt ent .
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The Di st r i ct conduct ed pl anni ng wor kshops
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f or t he si t e i n 2000 f or pot ent i al new uses f or t he
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si t e and sever al opt i ons wer e consi der ed, i ncl udi ng a
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mi xed use r esi dent i al / r et ai l scenar i o wi t h a
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si gni f i cant par k and open space component , as wel l as
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hi st or i c pr eser vat i on el ement s.
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The si t e cur r ent l y appear s as an open ar ea
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of gr ass and t r ees, anchor ed by t wo ser vi ce cour t s
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wi t h st r i ki ngl y di st i nct above- gr ound f eat ur es.
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However , beneat h t he sur f ace ar e 20 unr ei nf or ced
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concr et e f i l t er cel l s, each one acr e i n si ze and i n
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var yi ng condi t i ons, some sever el y det er i or at ed.
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MS. FERSTER: Obj ect i on. Do you have
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qual i f i cat i ons t o eval uat e t he condi t i on of t he
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under gr ound cel l s?
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THE WI TNESS: I have been i nf or med by t he
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devel opment communi t y, as wel l as our cont r act or s.
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MS. FERSTER: I mean I under st and t hat you
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wi l l have a st r uct ur al engi neer pr esent i ng t hat
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i ssue, so I woul d obj ect t hat an unqual i f i ed wi t ness
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t al k about t he st r uct ur al condi t i ons.
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MS. BROWN: She' s been seei ng t he r epor t s
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of st r uct ur al engi neer s f or year s. She' s qual i f i ed
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t o r epor t on what she has r ead f or t he Di st r i ct of
4
Col umbi a.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Over r ul ed. Go ahead.
6
THE WI TNESS: Thank you. The McMi l l an si t e
7
has been t he subj ect of communi t y di scussi ons f or
8
near l y 30 year s and some r esi dent s have advocat ed f or
9
onl y a par k on t he si t e. Today, t he si t e i s i n
10
di sr epai r , unsaf e and wai t i ng f or a new l i f e, wai t i ng
11
t o be opened up t o t he communi t y.
12
For t he Di st r i ct , her e i s a sever el y
13
under ut i l i zed pi ece of pr oper t y t hat i f pr oper l y
14
l ever aged, coul d yi el d a wor l d cl ass communi t y
15
st eeped i n hi st or y and compr i sed of si gni f i cant
16
pr eser vat i on, new mi xed i ncome housi ng, t he cr eat i on
17
of a medi cal di st r i ct t o cr eat e j obs at al l i ncome
18
l evel s i n a war d t hat has per eni al l y suf f er ed f r om
19
hi gh unempl oyment , whi l e cr eat i ng a mi x of r et ai l
20
uses and a gr ocer y st or e i n an under ser ved communi t y,
21
al ong wi t h si gni f i cant par ks and open spaces
22
t hr oughout , a devel opment of t r ue exempl ar y publ i c
19
1
benef i t , a pr oj ect of speci al mer i t .
2
The Di st r i ct set ver y r obust goal s f or
3
economi c devel opment and communi t y ameni t i es f or t he
4
si t e and we ar e so pl eased t hat t he var i ous el ement s
5
have been el egant l y i nt egr at ed i nt o t he pr oj ect .
6
As t he owner of t he pr oper t y, t he
7
Di st r i ct ' s speci f i c r ol e i s t o over see t he
8
ent i t l ement pr ocess t o ensur e t hat t he pr oj ect
9
maxi mi zes benef i t s t o t he communi t y and t o t he ci t y.
10
These i ncl ude open space par ks and gr een space,
11
hi st or i c pr eser vat i on and cul t ur al ameni t i es,
12
af f or dabl e housi ng, nei ghbor hood- ser vi ng r et ai l , j ob
13
cr eat i on ar ound a heal t h car e i ndust r y, a st r ong
14
compr ehensi ve set of communi t y benef i t s t hat assi st
15
t he communi t i es ar ound t he McMi l l an si t e and posi t i ve
16
f i scal and economi c i mpact s.
17
Ear l i er t hi s year , t he Di st r i ct t ur ned t o
18
t he McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on Si t e as a r esour ce t o
19
assess st or mwat er management concer ns i n War d 5.
20
Demol i t i on of t wo cel l s and an adapt at i on of a t hi r d
21
cel l was appr oved by t he Mayor ' s Agent t o al l ow t he
22
si t e t o ser ve t he ci t y. Once agai n, and on a
20
1
br oader , mor e i mpact f ul way, we ar e l ooki ng t o use
2
t he si t e t o st r engt hen t he Di st r i ct and t he
3
communi t y.
4
I woul d l i ke t o br i ef l y f ocus on some of
5
t he communi t y benef i t s t he pr oj ect of f er s. Fi r st ,
6
t he mul t i f ami l y par cel s, whi ch compr i se appr oxi mat el y
7
25 per cent of t he devel opment pr ogr am, wi l l be f ul l y
8
devel oped by J ai r Lynch Devel opment Par t ner s, whi ch
9
i s a Cer t i f i ed Busi ness Ent er pr i se devel oper , a CBE.
10
Second, our f i scal anal ysi s est i mat es t hat
11
3, 200 per manent j obs and 3, 000 t empor ar y const r uct i on
12
j obs wi l l be cr eat ed by t he PUD i n over a 30- year
13
per i od. The pr oj ect wi l l gener at e 1. 2 bi l l i on i n new
14
t ax r evenues.
15
The si t e i s not downt own and i t i s i n a
16
l ocat i on wher e j obs acr oss t he i ncome spect r umar e
17
vi t al oppor t uni t i es f or l ocal r esi dent s. The
18
Di st r i ct needs t hese j obs.
19
Thi r d, we see an expansi on of much needed
20
af f or dabl e housi ng. The si t e wi l l have af f or dabl e
21
uni t s of appr oxi mat el y 20 per cent of t he t ot al
22
devel opment , t ot al devel oped uni t s, as wel l as
21
1
af f or dabl e, pl us wor kf or ce housi ng wi l l be
2
appr oxi mat el y 60 per cent of t he t ot al uni t s,
3
i ncl udi ng nei ghbor hood- ser vi ng r et ai l f or an ar ea
4
t hat has been deemed a f ood deser t , as wel l as ot her
5
communi t y ameni t i es.
6
Four t h, most of t he si t e' s most i mpor t ant
7
hi st or i c at t r i but es, al l 20 si l os, al l f our r egul at or
8
houses, t he pl ane- l i ke pl i nt hs, t he ser vi ce cour t s
9
and t wo cel l s wi l l be not onl y pr eser ved, but
10
r ei nvi gor at ed.
11
Fi f t h, we see what wi l l unquest i onabl y be,
12
at 12 acr es, t he ci t y' s l ar gest new par k syst em. And
13
t hi s par k syst emwi l l be seaml essl y woven i nt o t he
14
pr eser vat i on and devel opment pr ogr am, demonst r at i ng
15
exempl ar y l and pl anni ng t o go al ong wi t h t he vast
16
publ i c benef i t s.
17
I n concl usi on, t hi s i s not an easy si t e t o
18
devel op; i t i s compl ex, t o say t he ver y l east . As
19
st af f not ed dur i ng t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew
20
Boar d pr ocess, quot e, " The McMi l l an si t e r epr esent s
21
one of t he most chal l engi ng si t es i magi nabl e t o bot h
22
pr eser ve and adapt f or cur r ent use. The det er i or at ed
22
1
st r uct ur al condi t i on, t he pauci t y of vi abl e r euse
2
opt i ons f or t he bel ow gr ade cel l s, t he enor mi t y of
3
i nf r ast r uct ur e and si t e al t er at i on necessar y t o
4
st abi l i ze t he si t e have made pl anni ng f or t he
5
pr eser vat i on adapt at i on of t he si t e unusual l y
6
di f f i cul t , " end quot e. Thi s i s f r omt he Hi st or i c
7
Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d r epor t i n 2012.
8
HPRB not ed i n i t s appr oval of t he pr oj ect
9
t hat t he pr oj ect r et ai ns, quot e, " . . . i mpor t ant
10
char act er - def i ni ng f eat ur es of t he si t e, suf f i ci ent
11
t o convey i t s hi st or i c char act er i st i cs and
12
r epr esent s an ar chi t ect ur al l y coor di nat ed and
13
cohesi ve appr oach. "
14
The Di st r i ct concur s wi t h t he HPRB and
15
bel i eves t hat t he devel opment t eamhas st r uck a
16
symbi ot i c bal ance of economi c devel opment and
17
pr eser vat i on of open space and hi st or i c st r uct ur es,
18
of f i scal i mpact and communi t y ameni t i es and
19
r eweavi ng t he ur ban f abr i c, whi l e di st i ngui shi ng a
20
ver y i mpor t ant hi st or i c l andmar k. Col l ect i vel y, t hey
21
have maxi mi zed t he over al l benef i t s t o bot h t he
22
sur r oundi ng communi t i es and t he Di st r i ct as a whol e.
23
1
Thi s pr oj ect has gone t hr ough a l engt hy
2
ent i t l ement pr ocess, get t i ng bet t er each st ep of t he
3
way. The HPRB has appr oved t hi s pr oj ect , al l
4
appr opr i at e Di st r i ct agenci es have appr oved t he
5
pr oj ect . Last Monday eveni ng, t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on
6
t ook pr oposed act i on and appr oved t he PUD. Each of
7
t hese bodi es i n t hei r own way wer e l ooki ng f or st r ong
8
speci al mer i t t o appr ove t he pr oj ect . Each of t hem
9
ul t i mat el y f ound j ust t hat and pr ovi ded a st r ong
10
endor sement of t he pl an and t he communi t y benef i t s.
11
As such, t he Di st r i ct bel i eves
12
unequi vocal l y t hat t he exempl ar y l and pl anni ng, t he
13
st r ong pr eser vat i on pr ogr amand t he communi t ywi de
14
benef i t s of t hi s pr oj ect gr eat l y out wei gh t he l oss
15
of t he 16 cel l s t hat need t o be demol i shed f or t he
16
pr oj ect t o pr oceed.
17
We bel i eve t hat t hi s pr oj ect i s exact l y t he
18
t ype of pr oj ect f or whi ch speci al mer i t shoul d be
19
gr ant ed. The Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce r espect f ul l y
20
r equest s t hat t he Mayor ' s Agent appr ove t hi s
21
appl i cat i on so we may move f or war d wi t h t hi s
22
except i onal pr oj ect . Thank you.
24
1
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you. Ms. Br own, do you
2
have any f ur t her quest i ons?
3
MS. BROWN: No quest i ons.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Cr oss exami nat i on?
5
MS. FERSTER: A coupl e of quest i ons, t hank
6
you.
7
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
8
BY MS. FERSTER:
9
Q So you indicated that D.C. purchased the
10
property in 1986. Do you know what the purchase
11
price you paid for the property was?
12
A I do not have t hat i nf or mat i on of f hand, but
13
I can def er t o our par t ner s at BMP.
14
Q Approximately, does $9.3 million ring a
15
bell to you?
16
MS. BROWN: Asked and answer ed.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, sust ai ned.
18
BY MS. FERSTER: ( Resumi ng)
19
Q Well, I'd be happy to show you a document.
20
MS. BROWN: That was not par t of her
21
di r ect , t he pr i ce of t he pr oper t y.
22
MS. FERSTER: I t ' s wi t hi n t he scope of her
25
1
di r ect , t hat D. C. pur chased t he pr oper t y.
2
3
Q I'm going to show you -- you represent the
4
District of Columbia -- I'm going to show you a cash
5
sale document from 1990 showing a recorded deed. And
6
if you could read that, in Paragraph 2, what that
7
indicates the price paid for this property was.
8
MS. BROWN: Agai n, she di dn' t t est i f y t o
9
t he pr i ce.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk t hi s i s sor t of
11
pushi ng t he wi t ness i n a pl ace t hat ' s i nappr opr i at e.
12
I t hi nk i f you want t o pr esent t est i mony l at er on
13
about t he pr i ce pai d, t hat wi l l be f i ne, but I t hi nk
14
not now.
15
16
Q So you work for the Deputy Mayor in
17
Economic Development, so how long have you worked
18
there?
19
A I have wor ked f or t he Di st r i ct gover nment
20
f or ni ne year s.
21
Q And specifically for the Deputy Mayor of
22
Economic Development?
26
1
A I wor ked f or t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce f r om
2
2005 t o I bel i eve August 2008, at whi ch poi nt , I went
3
t o t he Depar t ment of Housi ng and Communi t y
4
Devel opment and wor ked t her e f or t hr ee and a hal f
5
year s, and t hen came back al most t hr ee year s ago.
6
Q And what would you say your involvement is
7
in public-private partnership projects similar to the
8
McMillan project?
9
MS. BROWN: And I ' mgoi ng t o obj ect agai n
10
because t hat wasn' t par t of her di r ect t est i mony.
11
She' s her e as a wi t ness and she pr esent ed her
12
t est i mony.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: I ' mgoi ng t o l et t hat
14
quest i on go.
15
THE WI TNESS: I have wor ked on publ i c-
16
pr i vat e par t ner shi ps f or t he l ast ni ne year s. I
17
st ar t ed wor ki ng on a pr ogr amcal l ed t he Home Agai n
18
I ni t i at i ve and have wor ked on nei ghbor hood
19
st abi l i zat i on pr oj ect s f or t he l ast ni ne year s.
20
21
Q And those are in the District of Columbia.
22
A Al l of t hemar e i n t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a
27
1
because I ' ve onl y wor ked f or t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a
2
Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce f or Pl anni ng and Economi c
3
Devel opment .
4
Q Good point. And can you name a couple of
5
those public-private partnership projects that you
6
worked on?
7
A Do you want me t o go t hr ough al l of t hem?
8
Q Well, I can ask you --
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Can you gi ve us a sense of
10
wher e you' r e goi ng wi t h t hi s?
11
MS. FERSTER: I woul d l i ke t he wi t ness t o
12
pr ovi de - - my next quest i on wi l l be t o pr ovi de an
13
assessment of t he l evel of benef i t s of f er ed by t hi s
14
pr oj ect , compar ed t o ot her publ i c- pr i vat e
15
par t ner shi ps t hat you' ve wor ked on. So t hat ' s not my
16
quest i on, but t hat ' s wher e I ' mgoi ng.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk i t woul d onl y be
18
r el evant f or hi st or i c pr eser vat i on cases.
19
MS. FERSTER: Hmm?
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Woul dn' t i t onl y be r el evant
21
f or hi st or i c pr eser vat i on cases?
22
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , exact l y, exact l y, and I
28
1
t hi nk t he poi nt I woul d l i ke t o make i s t hat t he
2
l evel of benef i t s of f er ed her e i s pr obabl y si mi l ar t o
3
ot her publ i c- pr i vat e par t ner shi ps.
4
MS. BROWN: And you know, she' s t est i f yi ng
5
now.
6
MS. FERSTER: I ' mj ust answer i ng - -
7
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s not evi dence, she' s
8
suggest i ng what she woul d l i ke t o br i ng out .
9
MS. FERSTER: Yes. And so one woul d assume
10
t hat , you know, t hi s pr oj ect shoul d have a hi gher
11
l evel of publ i c benef i t because i t does i nvol ve a
12
speci al mer i t pr oj ect , as opposed t o t he ot her
13
par t ner shi ps.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: I don' t t hi nk so, I don' t
15
t hi nk t hat ' s act ual l y a r el evant poi nt . I t hi nk t he
16
quest i on i s whet her i t ' s speci al mer i t f or hi st or i c
17
pr eser vat i on, and what t he publ i c benef i t s wer e i n
18
non- hi st or i c pr eser vat i on cases t hat di dn' t get
19
eval uat ed f or speci al mer i t s, i t doesn' t seemr eal l y
20
r el evant t o me.
21
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , i f I mi ght j ust
22
el abor at e on t hat poi nt , I t hi nk what t he deci si ons
29
1
of t he cour t and t he Mayor ' s Agent have made cl ear i s
2
t hat aspect s of t he pr oj ect t hat ar e common t o ot her
3
devel opment pr oj ect s t hat ar e non- hi st or i c
4
pr eser vat i on pr oj ect s don' t qual i f y f or speci al mer i t
5
consi der at i on. So i n t hi s case - -
6
MS. BROWN: And I t hi nk her
7
r epr esent at i onal - -
8
J UDGE BYRNE: Hol d on.
9
MS. FERSTER: So i n t hi s case, I do t hi nk
10
i t ' s r el evant t hat t he benef i t s t hat ar e of f er ed i n
11
t hi s case ar e pr obabl y si mi l ar t o or pr obabl y even
12
l ess t han t he benef i t s t hat ar e of f er ed i n non-
13
hi st or i c pr eser vat i on cases.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: I don' t t hi nk I want t o go
15
t her e, I t hi nk t hat ' s a ver y - - t her e' s a l ot of
16
f act or s t her e t hat ar e ver y har d t o eval uat e and I
17
honest l y don' t - - I mean I under st and t he poi nt
18
you' r e maki ng, but I t hi nk t he f act t hat t her e may be
19
ot her publ i c- pr i vat e pr oj ect s t hat have what I or you
20
may consi der t o be gr eat er publ i c benef i t s r eal l y
21
doesn' t go t o t he l egal quest i on her e. So I ' mnot
22
goi ng t o al l ow i t .
30
1
2
Q So let me ask you just a couple of
3
questions about your testimony about the benefits
4
that you believe outweigh the destruction of the
5
historic resources in this case. You talked
6
specifically about tax benefit.
7
A Mm- hmm( nods i n t he af f i r mat i ve) .
8
Q Are you aware of the fact that the District
9
of Columbia is assuming that there will be
10
significant tax abatements provided to the developer,
11
the ultimate developer of this project?
12
MS. BROWN: And I ' l l obj ect t o t hat because
13
I don' t t hi nk t her e' s been any t est i mony about t ax
14
abat ement s.
15
MS. FERSTER: I mean, you know, t hi s i s t he
16
Di st r i ct of Col umbi a' s wi t ness and she cl ai ms t o be
17
knowl edgeabl e about t hi s par t i cul ar pr oj ect , so I
18
t hi nk she coul d t est i f y t o t he benef i t s t hat ar e
19
bei ng of f er ed. I f she i s not knowl edgeabl e about
20
t hat , t hen her t est i mony i s not - -
21
MS. BROWN: No, i t wasn' t on di r ect .
22
MS. FERSTER: She di d t est i f y about t he t ax
31
1
benef i t s.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: She t est i f i ed t hat t her e' d be
3
t ax benef i t s.
4
MS. FERSTER: Yes.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: So I t hi nk a l i t t l e bi t of
6
quest i oni ng about t he di mensi ons of t he t ax benef i t s
7
woul d be appr opr i at e.
8
9
Q Well, my specific question, and I
10
understand there's been a Green Door Advisors report.
11
Are you familiar with that report that's been
12
prepared that describes I think the tax benefits that
13
you summarized? And so one of those tax benefits
14
that you're assuming is a property tax benefit, is
15
that correct?
16
A My under st andi ng of t he t ax benef i t s ar e
17
i ncome, sal es and pr oper t y t ax r evenue t hat woul d be
18
comi ng t o t he ci t y t hat make up t hat over al l t ax
19
benef i t .
20
Q Mm-hmm. And are you aware of the fact that
21
under the exclusive rights agreement with the Vision
22
McMillan Partners, that you have assured Vision
32
1
McMillan Partners that you will pursue property tax
2
abatement, you, the District of Columbia?
3
MS. BROWN: And I ' mj ust cur i ous, agai n, we
4
di dn' t hear any t est i mony about t he excl usi ve r i ght s
5
agr eement .
6
J UDGE BYRNE: Ri ght , so I guess I woul d
7
j ust ask i s i t cont empl at ed t hat t her e' l l be t ax
8
abat ement , pr oper t y t ax abat ement f or t he devel oper s
9
as par t of t hi s?
10
THE WI TNESS: Not at t hi s t i me. We haven' t
11
di scussed t hat .
12
13
14
Q So let's talk a little bit about affordable
15
housing. Is this project going to be subject to an
16
affordable dwelling unit agreement with the District
17
of Columbia?
18
A Yes.
19
Q And are you familiar with affordable
20
dwelling unit agreements that the District of
21
Columbia has been --
22
A Yes.
33
1
Q -- entered into in the past? And isn't it
2
correct that every agreement that the District of
3
Columbia government has been a party to involving
4
affordable dwelling unit programs, both condo and
5
rental, have included the requirement of a maximum 20
6
percent of the units to be affordable?
7
A Sor r y, you' r e sayi ng t hat ever y pr oj ect t he
8
Di st r i ct has ever - -
9
Q Every project involving affordable dwelling
10
unit agreements.
11
A I t ' s on a case- by- case basi s and i t depends
12
on t he pr oj ect .
13
Q Are you aware of any affordable dwelling
14
unit agreements that do not require 20 percent of the
15
units to be affordable?
16
MS. BROWN: I ' mst ar t i ng t o t hi nk we' r e
17
wander i ng beyond her di r ect t est i mony her e.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Wel l , I ' mgoi ng t o l et i t go
19
a l i t t l e bi t l onger . Pl ease answer t he quest i on.
20
THE WI TNESS: I bel i eve t her e ar e ot her
21
pr oj ect s; however , I do not have t hat i nf or mat i on i n
22
f r ont of me, I don' t have a l i st of pr oj ect s i n ever y
34
1
ADU covenant t hat was ent er ed wi t h me t oday.
2
3
Q And do you believe that it's typical for
4
ADU agreements to have a requirement that the
5
affordable units be spread across different
6
categories of area median income, for example, you
7
know, percentages for 30 percent area median income,
8
percentages for 50 percent area median income and
9
percentages for 80 percent area median income?
10
A Agai n, t hat ' s t he pol i cy of t he Di st r i ct
11
and i t depends on t he capaci t y of t he pr oj ect , t he
12
economi c capaci t y, and t hat ' s somet hi ng t hat ' s
13
gener al l y negot i at ed wi t h our devel opment par t ner s.
14
Q Are you familiar with the Justice Park
15
public-private partnership development?
16
A On t he edges, but I do not wor k di r ect l y on
17
J ust i ce Par k.
18
MS. BROWN: I ' d have t o ask what ' s t he
19
r el evance, I mean I t hi nk we have got t en past her
20
di r ect t est i mony.
21
MS. FERSTER: I mean t he wi t ness di d
22
t est i f y t hat she bel i eves t hese af f or dabl e housi ng
35
1
benef i t s ar e of a speci al mer i t qual i t y. And so I
2
t hi nk i t i s r el evant t o pr obe t he wi t ness about ot her
3
af f or dabl e housi ng pr oj ect s t hat t he Di st r i ct of
4
Col umbi a has been i nvol ved wi t h.
5
MS. BROWN: But agai n, as t he Mayor ' s Agent
6
di r ect or her e, we' r e wor r i ed about speci al mer i t
7
pr oj ect s wi t h hi st or i c pr eser vat i on.
8
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you have mor e on t hi s
9
af f or dabl e housi ng par t ?
10
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , I di d want t o have a
11
f ol l ow- up quest i on about t he J ust i ce Par k pr oj ect .
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Wel l , she sai d she doesn' t
13
know t hat much about i t .
14
15
Q Do you know something about it or do you
16
know whether or not it has a hundred percent
17
affordable housing in it?
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Ther e ar e ot her cases wher e
19
t her e ar e 100 per cent af f or dabl e housi ng pr oj ect s. I
20
have a case pendi ng wi t h me, so t hat does exi st .
21
MS. FERSTER: Mm- hmm, t hank you.
22
36
1
Q So you would agree that there are public-
2
private partnerships that the District of Columbia
3
entered into that are a hundred percent or more than
4
30 percent affordable housing.
5
A Of cour se, t he Depar t ment of Housi ng and
6
Communi t y Devel opment pr ovi des l oans and gr ant s t o
7
devel oper s and I woul d consi der t hat a publ i c- pr i vat e
8
par t ner shi p. I t ' s not excl usi ve t o pr oj ect s t hat
9
i ncl ude Di st r i ct l and t o be consi der ed a publ i c-
10
pr i vat e par t ner shi p.
11
Q You did testify that you had ensured that
12
the entities that were part of VMP are certified
13
business enterprises?
14
A Yes.
15
Q JL Development Partners, is that a
16
certified business enterprise?
17
MS. BROWN: Obj ect i on, I don' t t hi nk she
18
sai d - -
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, she j ust ment i oned J ai r
20
Lynch bei ng cer t i f i ed.
21
22
Q Okay, so only one, then, only one of the
37
1
partners.
2
A Yes.
3
MS. BROWN: Wel l , she ment i oned - -
4
5
Q Okay, now you testified that the affordable
6
housing for this project would be 20 percent
7
affordable housing. And how much of that 20 percent
8
is for persons earning 30 percent or less of area
9
median income?
10
A My under st andi ng i s t hat none of t he uni t s
11
ar e cur r ent l y cat egor i zed at 30 per cent AMI , t her e
12
ar e bet ween 50 and 80 per cent AMI . And some of t hat
13
I t hi nk i s goi ng t o shi f t on t he number of t he
14
over al l uni t s as t o what t hat exact per cent age i s
15
goi ng t o be.
16
Q And how many of these units are going to be
17
available to persons earning in excess of 80 percent
18
AMI?
19
A I n excess, I bel i eve i n my t est i mony, I
20
sai d t hat 60 per cent of t he af f or dabl e and t he
21
wor kf or ce, so t hat woul d be 40 per cent of t he t ot al
22
uni t s.
38
1
Q 40 percent of the units are available to
2
people in excess of 80 percent.
3
A 80 t o 120 per cent AMI i s gener al l y what ' s
4
consi der ed wor kf or ce.
5
Q Can you just clarify, 40 to 80 percent AM
6
-- how many units are available to people who make
7
between, you know, what you call workforce housing,
8
how many of those units, and what is the area median
9
income for workforce housing?
10
A I t hi nk I j ust answer ed t hat quest i on.
11
Q Yeah, I'm sorry.
12
A Can you r epeat t he quest i on?
13
Q I did not get exactly the number of units
14
that you specified would be available to persons who
15
make I guess what you would consider workforce
16
housing units.
17
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk she gave a per cent age.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: She gave a per cent age.
19
20
Q That was the 40 percent number, so that 40
21
percent number. What is the range of the income that
22
40 percent will earn?
39
1
A I t ' s bet ween 80 per cent and 120 per cent AMI
2
and t he AMI changes ever y year , based on HUD' s
3
desi gnat i on, so i t wi l l change as HUD updat es t hat
4
number .
5
Q Okay, thanks. So the 40 percent -- let me
6
just get this correct. You're saying that 40 percent
7
of the units will be made available to persons
8
earning between 80 to 120 percent AMI.
9
A Yes, and I woul d def er t o t he VMP t eamt o
10
answer mor e speci f i c quest i ons on t he t ot al number of
11
uni t s.
12
Q And do you know currently, what the AMI is
13
for a family of four for this area?
14
A I haven' t l ooked at t he AMI number t hi s
15
year . I bel i eve i t was ar ound 106, $107, 000. 00.
16
I t ' s act ual l y st abl e over t he l ast f ew year s and i t
17
had gone down I t hi nk at one poi nt .
18
MS. FERSTER: I s t her e a wi t ness who' s
19
goi ng t o be speaki ng mor e di r ect l y t o t he t ax
20
abat ement s t hat ar e bei ng pr ovi ded or i s t hi s t he
21
Di st r i ct of Col umbi a' s - -
22
MS. BROWN: You' l l f i nd out .
40
1
MS. FERSTER: Because I di d want t o go a
2
l i t t l e bi t mor e, I j ust want t o under st and at what
3
poi nt t he t ax abat ement i s goi ng t o be pr ovi ded i n
4
t hi s pr oceedi ng.
5
6
Q Is that you, are you the person who's
7
testifying --
8
MS. BROWN: She can' t answer t hat .
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, she t est i f i ed.
10
MS. FERSTER: Okay, I t hi nk t hat ' s i t .
11
MS. MERRI TT: I have a coupl e of quest i ons.
12
BY MS. MERRI TT:
13
Q Do you know how much the city will be
14
spending to build the community center?
15
A I do not have t hat i nf or mat i on, of f hand,
16
and VMP has some mor e pr oj ect budget i nf or mat i on t hat
17
t hey shoul d be abl e t o shar e.
18
Q Okay, just one more related question. Do
19
you know how much the city will be spending to build
20
the roads?
21
A Agai n, I woul d def er t o VMP, but my
22
under st andi ng i s t hat t hose r oads wi l l be pr i vat e
41
1
r oads.
2
Q Yeah, we heard that they're going to be
3
constructed by the city, but if you don't know, we'll
4
ask someone else.
5
Do you know what the total amount of the
6
city's subsidy is for the project in kind of
7
characterizing the big picture of the public-private
8
partnership? What's the total amount that the
9
city --
10
MS. BROWN: Can we get a cl ar i f i cat i on on
11
t hat of what you mean by subsi dy?
12
BY MS. MERRI TT: ( Resumi ng)
13
Q Well, my questions were related to the
14
claims about number of jobs and creation of a new
15
park. And so the question, and I realize you don't
16
know the answers to most of my questions, was
17
designed to explore the relationship between the
18
question of whether this level of construction is
19
necessary in order to achieve those benefits and the
20
city's own funding of elements of the project, in our
21
view, makes the demolition work necessary. So that's
22
why I'm trying to pin down the --
42
1
MS. BROWN: And I j ust r eal l y - - I mean
2
t hat ' s what you meant by subsi dy. But I t hi nk al so,
3
she di dn' t t est i f y t o t he budget of t he ci t y, as
4
wel l .
5
J UDGE BYRNE: I s t her e goi ng t o be
6
t est i mony about t he over al l economi cs of t he pr oj ect ?
7
MS. BROWN: We wi l l have some t est i mony t o
8
t hat degr ee.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Maybe we' l l wai t and sor t of
10
see what t hat l ooks l i ke. They' r e t he Appl i cant ,
11
t hey have t he bur den of pr oof , so - -
12
13
Q You mentioned that you considered some
14
alternative scenarios, I think, in your testimony.
15
What did those involve?
16
A Our par t ner s at VMP went t hr ough a ser i es
17
of i t er at i ons t hat have pl ayed out wi t h t he communi t y
18
and I agai n woul d def er t o t hemt o t al k mor e
19
speci f i cal l y about t he hi st or y of t hose al t er nat i ves.
20
But I wi l l say gener al l y, wi t h a si t e l i ke
21
t hi s and t he char act er i st i cs of i t , i t ' s a bal anci ng
22
act bet ween t he benef i t s and t he over al l goal of
43
1
achi evi ng economi c devel opment , communi t y benef i t s
2
and r evi t al i zi ng t hat por t i on of t he ci t y.
3
Q Did the City consider any other developers,
4
did they talk to other developers in the process of
5
coming to this public-private partnership
6
arrangement?
7
A I have some hi st or y on t he pr oj ect pr i or t o
8
my i nvol vement . Even bef or e I st ar t ed wi t h t he ci t y,
9
t her e was an RFP t hat was i ssued. At t he t i me, i t
10
was t he Nat i onal Capi t al Revi t al i zat i on Cor por at i on
11
t hat went out wi t h an RFP and t her e wer e sever al
12
ot her appl i cant s.
13
Q Do you know how many applicants there were
14
in response to that RFP?
15
A No.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: She wasn' t t her e.
17
MS. MERRI TT: I have no f ur t her quest i ons.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, so I have a coupl e of
19
quest i ons. So t el l me about - - f i r st of al l , a
20
si mpl e quest i on. A cer t i f i ed busi ness devel oper , can
21
you t el l me what t hat i s?
22
THE WI TNESS: A cer t i f i ed busi ness
44
1
ent er pr i se - -
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
3
THE WI TNESS: - - i s a desi gnat i on t hat i s
4
al l ocat ed by t he Depar t ment of Smal l and Local
5
Busi ness Devel opment , DSLBD. The def i ni t i on has
6
changed over r ecent year s, but i t ' s essent i al l y a
7
l ocal busi ness t hat oper at es out of t he Di st r i ct of
8
Col umbi a.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: I see, a l ocal busi ness.
10
THE WI TNESS: Ther e ar e di f f er ent
11
cat egor i es of t hat t hat you can appl y f or . I ' mnot
12
an exper t i n t hat par t i cul ar f i el d, i n t hat
13
desi gnat i on, but - -
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, so you of f er ed t hat as
15
sor t of one of t he benef i t s of t hi s.
16
THE WI TNESS: Yes.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Maybe we can hear l at er on
18
about why t hat ' s si gni f i cant . The ot her quest i on was
19
j ust i n your exper i ence i n t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce
20
and I guess DHCD, as wel l , about t he use of ent er i ng
21
i nt o excl usi ve agr eement s wi t h par t i cul ar devel opment
22
t eams, as opposed t o havi ng sor t of a di f f er ent - - as
45
1
t o havi ng, f or exampl e, sor t of a pr oposal f or a
2
cont est , desi gn cont est , t hat sor t of t hi ng.
3
J ust t el l me a l i t t l e bi t about t he
4
pr act i ce of wor ki ng wi t h sor t of a sel ect ed
5
devel opment t eambef or e t he pr oj ect i s pl anned.
6
THE WI TNESS: Wel l , i f I coul d answer
7
gener al l y, an excl usi ve r i ght s agr eement f or t he most
8
par t i s an agr eement t o negot i at e i n good f ai t h and
9
t o sor t of wor k t hr ough cer t ai n i ssues t hat ar e known
10
at t hat poi nt i n t i me wi t h t he pr oj ect , but
11
acknowl edgi ng t hat t her e ar e ot her I guess pi eces of
12
i nf or mat i on, i nvest i gat i ons t hat woul d need t o be
13
done t hat need t o be put i n pl ace pr i or t o ent er i ng
14
i nt o what we cal l a l and di sposi t i on agr eement . So
15
t hat ' s gener al l y t he pur pose t her e.
16
Our of f i ce has done t hat on a coupl e of
17
pr oj ect s and f or a pr oj ect of t hi s si ze, agai n, I
18
woul d say t her e ar e a l ot of compl exi t i es t o i t - -
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
20
THE WI TNESS: - - t hat we don' t necessar i l y
21
know t oday and t hat we need t o have t hat document i n
22
pl ace t o gi ve t he devel opment t eamand t he Ci t y
46
1
assur ance t hat we ar e wor ki ng i n a par t ner shi p
2
t owar ds t he ul t i mat e di sposi t i on.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: So woul d you say t hat t he
4
compl exi t y of t he pr oj ect i s an i mpor t ant f act or i n
5
ent er i ng i nt o one of t hese excl usi ve agr eement s
6
bef or e t her e' s a desi gn devel oped f or t he si t e or
7
some sor t of ot her pr ocedur e t o get t o a desi r abl e
8
out come?
9
THE WI TNESS: I woul d say yes, t he
10
compl exi t y of a pr oj ect does somet i mes beg you t o
11
devi at e f r omyour pr ocesses. We have di f f er ent
12
t ool s, di f f er ent l egal i nst r ument s i n our of f i ce and
13
an excl usi ve r i ght s agr eement i s one of t hose t ool s.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , t hank you. I
15
don' t have anyt hi ng el se. Do you have anyt hi ng?
16
MS. BROWN: I do have one qui ck quest i on.
17
REDI RECT EXAMI NATI ON
18
BY MS. BROWN:
19
Q Are you familiar with the Randall School
20
Project?
21
A Agai n, j ust sor t of gener al l y, yeah.
22
Q Thank you, that's all.
47
1
MS. BROWN: Thank you.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you ver y much.
3
MS. BROWN: And I j ust want ed t o cl ar i f y
4
f or t he r ecor d, I amr epr esent i ng Vi si on McMi l l an
5
Par t ner s and t he Di st r i ct i s a Co- Appl i cant , so I
6
j ust want ed t o make sur e t hat I amnot necessar i l y
7
t he counsel f or t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a i n t hi s
8
mat t er . I ' mnot sur e i f t hat was cl ear on t he
9
r ecor d.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: So t hat t hey ar e par t ner s t o
11
t he pr oj ect .
12
MS. BROWN: Yes, t hey ar e.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, I under st and t he
14
di f f er ence.
15
MS. BROWN: Thank you. And I under st and
16
t hat Ronan Gul st one f r omKenyan McDuf f i e i s her e f or
17
a st at ement .
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Second chai r , pl ease. Good
19
mor ni ng.
20
THE WI TNESS: Good mor ni ng. How ar e you?
21
J UDGE BYRNE: Pl ease st at e your name f or
22
t he r ecor d.
48
1
THE WI TNESS: Thank you, Ronan Gul st one.
2
Wher eupon,
3
RONAN GULSTONE
4
havi ng pr evi ousl y been dul y swor n, t est i f i ed as
5
f ol l ows:
6
7
THE WI TNESS: Good mor ni ng, my name i s
8
Ronan Gul st one, I ' mt he Deput y Chi ef of St af f f or
9
Kenyan McDuf f i e, counci l member f or War d 5, t he
10
counci l member whose war d i n whi ch t he McMi l l an Sand
11
Fi l t r at i on Si t e i s l ocat ed.
12
On behal f of Counci l member McDuf f i e, i t i s
13
my honor and pr i vi l ege t o pr esent t hi s t est i mony i n
14
st r ong suppor t of Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s, LLC, and
15
t he Deput y Mayor f or Pl anni ng and Economi c
16
Devel opment ' s appl i cat i on f or par t i al demol i t i on at
17
t he McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on Si t e.
18
Pur suant t o D. C. Of f i ci al Code, Sect i on
19
6- 1101 and what f ol l ows, t hi s body may aut hor i ze t he
20
i ssuance of a per mi t t o par t i al l y demol i sh a hi st or i c
21
l andmar k wher e i t f i nds i t necessar y t o al l ow t he
22
const r uct i on of a pr oj ect of speci al mer i t . For t he
49
1
r easons I wi l l t est i f y t o, Counci l member McDuf f i e
2
hopes t hat t he Mayor ' s Agent wi l l appr ove
3
appl i cat i on.
4
As way of backgr ound and t o put some of t he
5
comment s i n t hi s t est i mony i n cont ext , I ' l l speak
6
br i ef l y about Counci l member McDuf f i e' s r el at i on t o
7
t hi s pr oj ect . Counci l member McDuf f i e i s a t hi r d
8
gener at i on, l i f el ong r esi dent of t he Di st r i ct of
9
Col umbi a.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: Si r , coul d you speak up a
11
l i t t l e bi t , some of t he peopl e i n t he back can' t hear
12
you ver y wel l .
13
THE WI TNESS: Sor r y. I n f act , he cur r ent l y
14
r esi des i n a home on Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet , whi ch i s
15
di r ect l y adj acent t o t he McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on
16
Si t e. The home i s t he same home he was r ai sed i n and
17
was pur chased by hi s gr andpar ent s i n 1951.
18
Counci l member McDuf f i e was el ect ed t o t he
19
Counci l i n 2012. However , hi s communi t y i nvol vement
20
and l eader shi p sur r oundi ng t he McMi l l an Redevel opment
21
Pl an di d not st ar t t her e. Counci l member McDuf f i e was
22
a member of t he McMi l l an Advi sor y Gr oup, al so known
50
1
as MAG, f r omappr oxi mat el y 2008 t o 2010, when he
2
r esi gned t o r un f or Counci l .
3
Addi t i onal l y, i n about 2002 and agai n i n
4
about 2009 t o 2010, Counci l member McDuf f i e ser ved as
5
t he St r onghol d Ci vi c Associ at i on pr esi dent , whi ch as
6
you wel l know i s di r ect l y adj acent t o t he McMi l l an
7
si t e. I n bot h of t hose capaci t i es and i n hi s cur r ent
8
capaci t y, Counci l member McDuf f i e has par t i ci pat ed i n
9
count l ess open communi t y meet i ngs r egar di ng t he
10
pr oposal t o adapt i vel y r euse t he McMi l l an Sand
11
Fi l t r at i on Si t e.
12
The r esul t of t he year s of communi t y
13
meet i ngs and pl anni ng by VMP and t he Di st r i ct i s what
14
wi l l unquest i onabl y be a wor l d cl ass pr oj ect t hat
15
achi eves al l of t he obj ect i ves of t he Di st r i ct , t he
16
Compr ehensi ve Pl an and t he communi t y, i ncl udi ng open
17
space, hi st or i cal pr eser vat i on, mi xed i ncome housi ng,
18
j obs, a new t ax base, and t he openi ng of t he
19
wonder f ul hi st or i c asset t o t he ci t y and i t s
20
r esi dent s.
21
The pl an bef or e you i s a bal anced pl an,
22
wor ked on f or seven year s by VMP, t he Di st r i ct and
51
1
t he communi t y. Most i mpor t ant l y and what
2
Counci l member McDuf f i e has f ought t o ensur e si nce at
3
l east 2000, and why he i s such an ar dent suppor t er ,
4
t hi s pr oj ect wi l l have si gni f i cant communi t ywi de
5
benef i t s f or War d 5 and t he Di st r i ct .
6
As has been known t o Counci l member
7
McDuf f i e. hi s par ent s and gr andpar ent s, t he McMi l l an
8
Sand Fi l t r at i on Si t e has al ways been an i ndust r i al
9
si t e. I t was cr eat ed t o pr ovi de and t o cl ean t he
10
ci t y' s wat er suppl y. I t has been f enced of f and
11
i naccessi bl e t o t he publ i c f or decades. Thus,
12
Counci l member McDuf f i e, hi s f ami l y, nei ghbor s and t he
13
r est of t he Di st r i ct have not been abl e t o enj oy t he
14
use of t he McMi l l an si t e f or at l east t he l ast 60
15
year s.
16
The si t e was not cr eat ed f or human
17
occupancy and use and i s onl y known as a par k i n
18
name, due t o i t s r enami ng f r omt he Washi ngt on Ci t y
19
Reser voi r t o McMi l l an Par k Reser voi r as a t r i but e t o
20
Senat or J ames McMi l l an i n 1911.
21
Today, t he Di st r i ct has t he oppor t uni t y t o
22
adapt i vel y r euse t hi s l ong vacant pr oper t y, but wi t h
52
1
an appr opr i at e, i n f act si gni f i cant pr eser vat i on of
2
t he si t e' s hi st or i c cont ext .
3
The pr oposal pr esent s a uni que oppor t uni t y
4
f or War d 5 and t he Di st r i ct as a whol e t o r edevel op
5
a l ar ge par cel wi t h no di spl acement . Mor eover , t he
6
pr oj ect wi l l i ncl ude t he f ol l owi ng cr i t i cal communi t y
7
benef i t s:
8
A f i r st cl ass communi t y cent er ;
9
Mi xed i ncome housi ng, i ncl udi ng af f or dabl e
10
seni or housi ng, whi ch i s ext r emel y i mpor t ant t o War d
11
5, gi ven t hat i t i s home t o one of t he l ar gest
12
popul at i ons of seni or r esi dent s i n t he ci t y;
13
The ci t y' s l ar gest new par k at
14
appr oxi mat el y 6. 2 cont i guous acr es, i n addi t i on t o
15
t wo smal l er pocket par ks;
16
Pr eser vat i on of hi st or i cal aspect s of t he
17
si t e, i ncl udi ng t he r ehabi l i t at i on and r est or at i on of
18
al l of t he sand st or age bi ns and r egul at or houses,
19
one compl et e under gr ound cel l and a por t i on of
20
anot her cel l and a wal ki ng museum, whi ch wi l l
21
pr eser ve t he hi st or y of t he McMi l l an si t e and f or t he
22
f i r st t i me, al l ow our chi l dr en t o i nt er act i vel y l ear n
53
1
about and shar e i n t hat hi st or y;
2
Wor kf or ce devel opment and empl oyment
3
oppor t uni t i es; and
4
A new t ax base der i ved f r ompr evi ousl y
5
nont axed l and.
6
The pr oj ect has r ecei ved suppor t f r om
7
Advi sor y Nei ghbor hood Commi ssi oner s and has been
8
appr oved by t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d
9
and now t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
10
Addi t i onal l y, i t i s Counci l member
11
McDuf f i e' s under st andi ng t hat on Sept ember 15t h, t he
12
Nat i onal Capi t al Pl anni ng Commi ssi on i ndi cat ed t hat
13
t hey have no obj ect i on t o t he pr oj ect .
14
I t shoul d al so be not ed t hat gi ven t he
15
cur r ent condi t i on of t he si t e and i t s onl y pr i or use,
16
i t i s Counci l member McDuf f i e' s opi ni on t hat any new
17
use of t he pr oper t y, shor t of denyi ng publ i c access
18
and r et ai ni ng t he chai n l i nk f ence whi ch bor der s t he
19
pr oper t y wi l l r equi r e par t i al demol i t i on of t he
20
st r uct ur e.
21
I n concl usi on, Counci l member McDuf f i e hopes
22
t hat t he Mayor ' s Agent wi l l appr ove t hi s appl i cat i on.
54
1
As st at ed pr evi ousl y, t he pr oj ect wi l l pr ovi de War d 5
2
and t he Di st r i ct wi t h si gni f i cant benef i t s f or i t s
3
r esi dent s, wi l l al l ow a decades ol d, shut t er ed
4
pr oper t y t o be opened t o t he communi t y, wi l l pr ovi de
5
sor el y needed mi xed i ncome housi ng and af f or dabl e
6
seni or housi ng and addi t i onal commi t t ee ameni t i es.
7
Counci l member McDuf f i e woul d al so l i ke t o
8
not e t he oppor t uni t y f or t he expansi on of heal t h car e
9
ser vi ces t hr ough t he addi t i onal medi cal of f i ce par k
10
bui l di ngs and t he oppor t uni t y t o secur e a l ar ge
11
gr ocer t o ser ve t he communi t y.
12
Counci l member McDuf f i e expect s t hat t he
13
Counci l wi l l soon be r evi ewi ng and appr ovi ng t he
14
sur pl us and di sposi t i on r esol ut i ons f or t he si t e as
15
t he McMi l l an pr oj ect i s becomi ng cl oser t o r eal i t y
16
each day.
17
I n shor t , we need t he j obs, we need t he
18
r et ai l , we need t he housi ng and we need t he par k
19
space f or our f ami l i es and chi l dr en. Counci l member
20
McDuf f i e i s pr oud, as t he War d 5 counci l member , t o be
21
a par t of what wi l l be one of t he most t r ansf or mat i ve
22
and communi t y f r i endl y pr oj ect s i n t he Di st r i ct .
55
1
Thank you f or al l owi ng me t o t est i f y on
2
behal f of Counci l member McDuf f i e t oday.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you. Quest i ons?
4
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
5
BY MS. FERSTER:
6
Q Yes, I have a couple of questions, going
7
particularly to your testimony about Councilmember
8
McDuffie's strong support for the affordable housing
9
element of this project.
10
So you are Deputy Chief of Staff for the
11
councilmember, so you're familiar with legislation
12
that the councilmember proposes.
13
A Some, t hat ' s cor r ect .
14
Q Are you aware that Councilmember McDuffie
15
has proposed legislation called the Disposition of
16
District Land for Affordable Housing Amendment Act of
17
2013?
18
MS. BROWN: Rel evance?
19
MS. FERSTER: Fi r st , I t hi nk i t ' s r el evant
20
i n t hat t he bi l l t hat Counci l member McDuf f i e has
21
i nt r oduced woul d r equi r e Di st r i ct of Col umbi a l and
22
devel opment pr oj ect s t o pr ovi de a much hi gher l evel
56
1
of af f or dabl e housi ng t han t hi s par t i cul ar pr oj ect
2
does.
3
MS. BROWN: And I woul d obj ect because he
4
has not t est i f i ed t o - -
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, I don' t t hi nk t hat ' s
6
r el evant t o an ar gument t hat you mi ght make, t hat he
7
doesn' t need t o t est i f y about a bi l l t hat ' s act ual l y
8
been i nt r oduced I don' t t hi nk.
9
MS. FERSTER: Okay, t hen I do not have any
10
mor e quest i ons. Thank you.
11
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any quest i ons,
12
t hank you.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , t hank you ver y
14
much.
15
THE WI TNESS: Thank you.
16
MS. BROWN: Thank you. I ' d l i ke t o now go
17
i nt o t he Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s pr esent at i on and I
18
woul d l i ke t o make an openi ng st at ement .
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
20
MS. BROWN: I ' d al so l i ke t o ask i f , I
21
t hi nk i t mi ght go smoot her , but i f we coul d hol d our
22
cr oss exami nat i on quest i ons t o t he end i f you want i t
57
1
on a wi t ness- by- wi t ness basi s.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: How many wi t nesses ar e you - -
3
MS. BROWN: We have ei ght wi t nesses.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Ei ght wi t nesses.
5
MS. FERSTER: I f I coul d wei gh i n her e, we
6
woul d st r ongl y pr ef er t hat we do i ndi vi dual cr oss
7
exami nat i on, you know, because t her e ar e j ust so many
8
wi t nesses, i t ' s goi ng t o be i mpossi bl e f or us t o keep
9
t r ack of t hat .
10
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, I can under st and t hat ,
11
but on t he ot her hand, I t hi nk t he ot her aspect of i t
12
i s I t hi nk t hat i t woul d be good t o be aski ng t he
13
wi t nesses who act ual l y know somet hi ng about t he
14
t hi ngs you want t o l ook i nt o.
15
So maybe as we go t hr ough, you can hel p us,
16
t el l i ng us, you know, i nsof ar - - you know, whi ch
17
wi t nesses have knowl edge about whi ch of t he i ssues
18
t hat Opponent s ar e i nt er est ed i n, so we can t r y t o do
19
t hi s as ef f i ci ent l y as possi bl e.
20
MS. BROWN: Okay, gr eat , t hen I ' l l pr oceed
21
t o my openi ng st at ement .
22
Openi ng St at ement on Behal f of Appl i cant s
58
1
MS. BROWN: Agai n, f or t he r ecor d, I ' m
2
Car ol yn Br own, wi t h t he l aw f i r mof Hol l and and
3
Kni ght , on behal f of Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s. And
4
we' r e so t hr i l l ed t o be her e t oday because i n al l t he
5
wor k t hat I have done on hi st or i c pr eser vat i on cases
6
and Mayor ' s Agent cases, t hi s i s one of t r ul y
7
except i onal speci al mer i t . I t i s al most I woul d say
8
of epi c pr opor t i ons, compar ed t o any ot her Mayor ' s
9
Agent case bef or e t he Mayor ' s Agent i n t hi s hi st or y.
10
We have t hr ee new wor l d cl ass heal t h car e
11
f aci l i t i es, t wo mi xed use, mul t i f ami l y r esi dent i al
12
bui l di ngs wi t h appr oxi mat el y 500 uni t s, 80, 000 squar e
13
f eet of much needed nei ghbor hood f ocused r et ai l ,
14
anchor ed by a f ul l ser vi ce gr ocer y st or e,
15
appr oxi mat el y 146 i ndi vi dual r owhouses, a 17, 500
16
squar e f oot communi t y cent er wi t h a swi mmi ng pool ,
17
appr oxi mat el y t en acr es of open space - - act ual l y, 12
18
acr es of open space.
19
We have pr eser vat i on of al most al l above
20
gr ade hi st or i c st r uct ur es and t wo under gr ound cel l s,
21
ext ensi ve ar t wor k t hr oughout t he si t e i n
22
coor di nat i on wi t h Cul t ur al D. C.
59
1
We have wor kf or ce devel opment pr ogr ams,
2
schol ar shi ps, nei ghbor hood beaut i f i cat i on and suppor t
3
f or publ i c school STEM pr ogr ams, j ob cr eat i on t hat
4
you hear d t he Deput y Mayor ' s Of f i ce r epr esent at i ve
5
t est i f y about .
6
We have af f or dabl e housi ng t hat she
7
t est i f i ed about , wel l beyond t he ei ght per cent t hat
8
i s r equi r ed under zoni ng. Her e, i t ' s al most 20
9
per cent , wi t h deeper l evel s of af f or dabi l i t y,
10
par t i cul ar l y t hose wi t h t ownhouses.
11
These ar e except i onal benef i t s and f eat ur es
12
of t he pr oj ect and t hey wi l l accr ue t he communi t y- at -
13
l ar ge, not a subset of pr i vi l eged per sons, not l uxur y
14
condomi ni ums; i t ' s f or t he gr eat er good of t hi s ci t y.
15
Al l t hese benef i t s ar e f ul l y suppor t ed by
16
t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an and t he ci t y' s goal s f or a
17
wor l d cl ass medi cal di st r i ct at Mi chi gan and I r vi ng
18
St r eet s, i n conj unct i on wi t h t he Washi ngt on Hospi t al
19
Cent er , Chi l dr en' s and t he VA Hospi t al s.
20
The demol i t i on and subdi vi si on ar e
21
necessar y t o al l ow a pr oj ect of speci al mer i t . As
22
you wi l l hear f r omour exper t st r uct ur al engi neer ,
60
1
t he under gr ound cel l s ar e not st r uct ur al l y sound and
2
cannot suppor t any si gni f i cant above gr ade
3
devel opment .
4
We expl or ed al t er nat i ves t o demol i t i on and
5
you wi l l hear f r omour exper t s any pl an f or r euse of
6
t he under gr ound cel l s or r edevel opment of t he si t e
7
r equi r es such ext ensi ve st r uct ur al i nt er vent i on t hat
8
t he i nt egr i t y of t he under gr ound cel l s wi l l be
9
compr omi sed, no mat t er how t hey' r e used. And you' l l
10
hear t hat f r omour exper t s i n st r uct ur al engi neer i ng
11
and hi st or i c pr eser vat i on.
12
The pr oj ect bef or e you t oday i s al so t he
13
r esul t of ext ensi ve negot i at i on, compr omi se and
14
r est udy of numer ous al t er nat i ves, i ncl udi ng
15
r el ocat i on of t he par k f r omt he cent r al l ocat i on t o
16
i t s cur r ent l ocat i on t o t he sout h.
17
Each component has been car ef ul l y st udi ed,
18
chal l enged, r ef or mul at ed i n l i ght of t he si t e' s
19
hi st or i cal si gni f i cance, i t s physi cal const r ai nt s t o
20
make i t t r ul y speci al and mer i t or i ous.
21
I al so want t o emphasi ze what t hi s case i s
22
not about . I t ' s not about compl i ance wi t h Sect i on
61
1
106 of t he Nat i onal Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Act , i t ' s
2
not about compl i ance wi t h hi st or i c pr eser vat i on deed
3
r est r i ct i ons or t he 1990 Compr ehensi ve Pl an or any
4
ot her document t hat ' s out dat ed.
5
I ' d l i ke t o t al k a l i t t l e bi t about our
6
ent i t l ement pr ocess. You hear d t he Deput y Mayor ' s
7
r epr esent at i ve quot e ext ensi vel y f r omt he Hi st or i c
8
Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d suppor t f or t hi s pr oj ect .
9
We al so have had Zoni ng Commi ssi on appr oval f or t he
10
PUD, who r evi ewed ext ensi vel y t he compl i ance wi t h t he
11
Compr ehensi ve Pl an.
12
The Of f i ce of Pl anni ng, we have t hei r
13
suppor t sayi ng t hat t hi s pr oj ect f ul l y compl i es wi t h
14
t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an. We' ve had our t est i mony f r om
15
t he r epr esent at i ve f r omCounci l member McDuf f i e' s
16
of f i ce. We' ve r esol ved usage i ssues wi t h NCPC st af f
17
f or t he PUD pr ocess. And t he Land Di sposi t i on
18
Agr eement pr ocess has been compl et ed and i t ' s on i t s
19
way t o t he Counci l now.
20
So t hi s t r ul y has been an ext r aor di nar y
21
pr oj ect vet t ed by al l sor t s of gover nment agenci es,
22
and we have an except i onal amount of speci al mer i t t o
62
1
t hi s pr oj ect and t he demol i t i on i s necessar y i n or der
2
t o const r uct t hat pr oj ect of speci al mer i t .
3
So now I ' d l i ke t o pr oceed t o our f i r st
4
wi t ness, Anne Cor bet t , t he pr oj ect di r ect or f r om
5
Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s.
6
J UDGE BYRNE: You had sai d sever al t i mes
7
t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on appr oved t he PUD on
8
t hi s week or al l egedl y - -
9
MS. BROWN: I t was l ast Monday, t hey
10
pr oposed act i on. I t wi l l be r ef er r ed t o t he Nat i onal
11
Capi t al Pl anni ng Commi ssi on f or comment on t he
12
i mpact s t o t he f eder al el ement s of t he Compr ehensi ve
13
Pl an, t he Ci t y l ooks at t he Di st r i ct el ement s of t he
14
Compr ehensi ve Pl an, and t hen i t wi l l r et ur n t o t he
15
Zoni ng Commi ssi on f or f i nal act i on and a wr i t t en
16
or der t her eaf t er .
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you. Al l r i ght , good
18
mor ni ng.
19
THE WI TNESS: Good mor ni ng.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Pl ease st at e your name f or
21
t he r ecor d. We' l l t ake a f i ve- mi nut e r ecess.
22
( Wher eupon, a br i ef r ecess i s t aken. )
63
1
J UDGE BYRNE: We' r e goi ng t o begi n agai n,
2
pl ease.
3
THE WI TNESS: For t he r ecor d, my name i s
4
Anne Cor bet t and I ' mpr oj ect di r ect or f or Vi si on
5
McMi l l an Par t ner s.
6
7
Wher eupon,
8
ANNE CORBETT
9
10
f ol l ows:
11
12
THE WI TNESS: So agai n, good mor ni ng, and
13
l i ke I sai d, my name i s Anne Cor bet t . I l ead t hi s
14
publ i c- pr i vat e par t ner shi p t hat i nvol ves sever al
15
pr i vat e devel oper s, i ncl udi ng EYA, our t ownhouse
16
devel oper . You' l l hear mor e about t hei r - - f r om
17
Aakash Thakkar , J ai r Lynch Devel opment Par t ner s, t he
18
mul t i f ami l y and gr ocer y- r et ai l devel oper , and Tr ammel
19
Cr ow Company, our heal t h car e f aci l i t y devel oper ,
20
al so our r et ai l commer ci al component .
21
And agai n, our f our t h par t ner i s t he
22
Di st r i ct of Col umbi a, t he owner of t he pr oper t y, who
64
1
i n 2007 sel ect ed t hi s t eamaf t er a compet i t i ve
2
pr ocess and gave us an unpr ecedent ed oppor t uni t y t o
3
par t ner wi t h t hem.
4
I t ' s our r esponsi bi l i t y t o bal ance hi st or i c
5
pr eser vat i on wi t h economi c devel opment . We have been
6
ent r ust ed wi t h a t r ul y uni que si t e t hat r equi r es t he
7
most speci al car e, never mi nd t hat i t ' s been dor mant
8
f or so l ong as i t awai t s r ebi r t h. So i t commanded a
9
ver y speci al dynami c vi si on, honor i ng i t s l egacy out
10
f r ont , whi l e r emaki ng i t i nt o a t r ul y r emar kabl e new
11
pl ace i n our ci t y.
12
That bal ance agai n: hi st or i c l egacy, woul d
13
hel p sust ai nabi l i t y, j ob oppor t uni t i es, and a dynami c
14
new pl ace t o l i ve, wor k, shop, pl ay.
15
Agai n, even dor mant and negl ect ed, i t s
16
beaut y cal l s out t o you, so i t s new l i f e must be
17
si mi l ar l y amazi ng and i nspi r i ng.
18
Thi s vi si on t r ansl at es i nt o ver y t hought f ul
19
goal s. We di d not compr omi se. I n f act , we l ever aged
20
t he publ i c- pr i vat e par t ner shi p t o ensur e t he br eadt h
21
and dept h of t hese obj ect i ves, agai n, ver y meani ngf ul
22
pr eser vat i on, l ar ge, i nvi t i ng open spaces, dynami c
65
1
nei ghbor hood- ser vi ng r et ai l , wher e t her e had been a
2
dear t h, economi c di ver si f i cat i on and j ob cr eat i on, as
3
wel l as an expansi on of heal t h car e t o i mpr ove t he
4
l evel of car e t o our ci t y' s r esi dent s.
5
Agai n, back t o my obj ect i ves. Ther e i s a
6
mi x of housi ng t ypes and a mi x of af f or dabi l i t y
7
l evel s, t he hi ghest qual i t y mast er pl anni ng,
8
ar chi t ect ur e and par k desi gn. We cer t ai nl y ut i l i zed
9
t he D. C. Compr ehensi ve Pl an as a gui de i n or der t o
10
r econnect t he ur ban f abr i c t o sur r oundi ng
11
nei ghbor hoods and ensur e meani ngf ul communi t y
12
engagement .
13
Speaki ng of communi t y engagement , a ver y
14
col l abor at i ve communi t y pr ocess f ol l owed t he
15
sel ect i on of VMP as t he si t e devel oper . Ther e have
16
been over 200 event s si nce 2007. They' ve been i n a
17
var i et y of f or mat s: char r et t es, wher e r esi dent s wer e
18
i nvol ved i n shapi ng t hose vi si on pr i nci pl es and
19
gui del i nes t hat gover n t he si t e; open houses, wher e
20
peopl e can come and go as t hey pl ease; as wel l as
21
your mor e t ypi cal di r ect pr esent at i on and communi t y
22
f or ums.
66
1
We' ve been i nvol ved wi t h not one, but t hr ee
2
ANCs, 5E, 5A and 1B, at l east ei ght ci vi c
3
associ at i ons and t he McMi l l an Advi sor y Gr oup. And
4
hence, t he pl an you' l l see t oday i s a di r ect r esul t
5
of t hat communi t y engagement pr ocess.
6
Key communi t y r equest s t hat we' ve hear d
7
t i me and t i me agai n and t hat our pl an r esponds t o
8
i ncl ude i mpr ovi ng t r anspor t at i on, managi ng
9
st or mwat er , a gr ocer y st or e, housi ng seni or
10
r esi dent s, cr eat i ng cont i guous, l ar ge, open spaces,
11
pr eser vi ng hi st or i c r esour ces and di st i ngui shi ng t he
12
l andmar k.
13
That l eads you t o an over al l benef i t of a
14
dynami c $34 mi l l i on i nvest ment i n t he Par k and
15
Pr eser vat i on Pr ogr amby t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a.
16
And t hat wi l l cr eat e 12 acr es of open space, near l y
17
50 per cent of t he si t e, and agai n, expandi ng heal t h
18
car e opt i ons f or Di st r i ct r esi dent s as we cr eat e a
19
pr emi er medi cal di st r i ct .
20
We' r e goi ng t o make a ver y st r ong case f or
21
speci al mer i t t oday and i t t ook t wo sl i des t o cover
22
al l - - and I don' t even t hi nk I ' ve cover ed
67
1
ever yt hi ng.
2
I t st ar t s wi t h economi c oppor t uni t y; agai n,
3
expanded heal t h car e ser vi ce, l evel of car e, access
4
t o car e, conveni ence. An empl oyment engi ne i s a par t
5
of t hat , per manent j obs acr oss t he spect r umof
6
educat i on l evel s i n t he heal t h car e i ndust r y. Par t -
7
t i me j obs on si t e f or t eens and seni or s and
8
unpr ecedent ed CBE par t i ci pat i on.
9
Second, housi ng. 85 af f or dabl e seni or
10
uni t s, 50 and 60 per cent of AMI , 22 af f or dabl e, f or
11
sal e r owhouses, and t hen addi t i onal r ent al uni t s,
12
af f or dabl e t o moder at e i ncome and wor kf or ce
13
househol ds.
14
Thi r d i s t he r et ai l component . Ful l
15
ser vi ce gr ocer y st or e, space and f unds on si t e t o
16
suppor t l ocal st ar t - up busi nesses and a commi t ment t o
17
a mi x of l ocal and nat i onal t enant s.
18
Four t h, t r anspor t at i on benef i t s. Ri ght
19
now, t he si t e i s an i sl and. We wi l l i mpr ove t he
20
st r eet net wor k by cr eat i ng per meabi l i t y acr oss t he
21
si t e f or bot h car s, bi kes, pedest r i ans. We wi l l
22
expand t he publ i c t r ansi t capaci t y, we wi l l expand
68
1
t he bi ke net wor k and f aci l i t i es f or cycl i st s, bot h
2
l ei sur e and commut er cycl i st s.
3
Sust ai nabl e desi gn i s number f i ve. We have
4
l ow i mpact desi gn t echni ques empl oyed t hr oughout t he
5
si t e vi a r et ent i on, r ai n gar dens, per meabl e paver s,
6
r et ai ni ng st or mwat er , r eusi ng st or mwat er on si t e, an
7
ent i r el y new st or mwat er i nf r ast r uct ur e. Ther e i s no
8
st or mwat er i nf r ast r uct ur e on t hi s si t e as i t
9
pr esent l y st ands.
10
Par ks and pr eser vat i on, l ast , but not
11
l east . An unpar al l el ed pr eser vat i on pr ogr am, t he
12
l ar gest new par k syst emi n t he Di st r i ct . I t s 17, 000
13
squar e f oot , hi gh qual i t y communi t y cent er wi t h a 25
14
met er pool , mul t i pl e out door r ecr eat i on ar eas f or
15
ki ds of al l ages, an out door amphi t heat er , and what
16
I ' ve dubbed t he wal ki ng museum, whi ch i s an
17
i nt er pr et i ve pr ogr amt o l et vi si t or s access t he
18
hi st or y of t he si t e, f r ee and avai l abl e ever y day of
19
t he year .
20
Toget her , we' r e wor ki ng t o cr eat e a new
21
McMi l l an, a pl ace t hat wi l l l i ve up t o t hat hi st or i c
22
l egacy and ser ve a br oad segment of t he War d 5, War d
69
1
1 and ci t y, as a whol e. Thank you ver y much.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hank you. Do you have
3
addi t i onal quest i ons?
4
MS. BROWN: I don' t have addi t i onal
5
quest i ons.
6
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, so bef or e we go t o
7
cr oss exami nat i on of Ms. Cor bet t , t hen, maybe you can
8
j ust gi ve us a l i t t l e bi t of an expl anat i on about who
9
el se i s goi ng t o speak and what t hei r ar eas t hey' r e
10
goi ng t o f ocus on so t hat we can di r ect t he cr oss
11
exami nat i on i n a way t hat makes sense.
12
MS. BROWN: Sur e. We wi l l have next Emi l y
13
Ei g, our exper t i n hi st or i c pr eser vat i on and
14
ar chi t ect ur al hi st or y. We' l l have Ki r k Met t am, our
15
exper t st r uct ur al engi neer f r omRober t Si l man
16
Engi neer s; Mat t Bel l f r omPer ki ns East man, t he exper t
17
on ar chi t ect ur e; Br uce Leonar d f r om- - sor r y - -
18
t hat ' s r i ght , Br uce Leonar d f r omSt r eet sense, who' s
19
our exper t i n r et ai l desi gn; AdamWeer s f r omt he
20
Tr ammel Cr ow Company; J ai r Lynch f r omt he J ai r Lynch
21
Devel opment Company; Li ndsl ey Wi l l i ams, an exper t i n
22
pl anni ng and zoni ng; and t hen Aakash Thakkar f r om
70
1
EYA.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, ver y good. So r eal l y,
3
what we' r e t al ki ng about - - so Ms. Cor bet t - - I t hi nk
4
t he cr oss exami nat i on quest i ons woul d be appr opr i at e
5
about t he over al l scope of t he pr oj ect and about sor t
6
of - - and t hen we' l l j ust sor t of t ake i t f r omt her e.
7
I may want t o r eser ve some of your cr oss exami nat i on
8
t o wi t nesses t hat ar e bet t er abl e t o answer i t , but
9
I ' l l t r y t o st r i ke a good bal ance so you have a
10
chance t o ask your quest i ons.
11
Al l r i ght , Ms. Fer st er , go ahead.
12
MS. FERSTER: Thank you, j ust a coupl e of
13
quest i ons.
14
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
15
BY MS. FERSTER:
16
Q You indicated that VMP was selected through
17
a competitive process in your testimony. Can you
18
elaborate on that?
19
A I woul d qual i f y i t by sayi ng t hat I was not
20
on t he t eamdur i ng t he compet i t i ve pr ocess. But i t ' s
21
my under st andi ng t hat t her e was a compet i t i ve pr ocess
22
conduct ed by t he Nat i onal Capi t al Revi t al i zat i on
71
1
Cor por at i on wher e t her e wer e f i ve appl i cant s t o t he
2
pr ocess and Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s was t he sel ect ed
3
t eami n 2007.
4
Q And do you know anything about the content
5
or proposals in these alternative proposals?
6
A I do not .
7
Q You indicated in your testimony that this
8
project had unprecedented CBE participation.
9
A Mm- hmm.
10
Q Which of your partners are CBEs?
11
A J ai r Lynch Devel opment Par t ner s i s a f ami l y
12
of compani es t hat i ncl udes CBE ent i t i es.
13
Q So it's your understanding that Jair Lynch
14
Partners is itself not CBE, is that correct?
15
A When I r ef er t o J ai r Lynch Devel opment
16
Par t ner s, I amr ef er r i ng t o t hei r br and name.
17
Q So --
18
A Not a l egal ent i t y. I ' mr ef er r i ng t o t he
19
f ami l y of compani es t hat J ai r Lynch i s t he CEO over .
20
Q And you believe that you're partnering with
21
the family of companies, each of Jair Lynch's
22
subsidiaries, then?
72
1
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk she' s answer ed t he
2
quest i on as best she can.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Appar ent l y, J ai r Lynch i s
4
goi ng t o t est i f y, t oo, so you can ask mor e about
5
t hat . I s t hat t he ext ent of t he CBEs, t hen, wi t hi n
6
t he J ai r Lynch Par t ner s?
7
THE WI TNESS: Cor r ect .
8
MS. FERSTER: But I t hi nk t hi s i s t he
9
wi t ness who woul d know who t he CBEs you' r e par t ner i ng
10
wi t h ar e.
11
12
Q Correct, you are the appropriate witness
13
who is testifying with the overall partnership
14
because you were the project manager?
15
A Yes, and so i n r eal est at e devel opment , you
16
cr eat e a speci al pur pose ent i t y t o devel op a
17
par t i cul ar pr oper t y. That i s not uncommon.
18
So J ai r Lynch Devel opment Par t ner s i s a
19
l ocal l y owned mi nor i t y company t hat has a var i et y of
20
speci al pur pose ent i t i es, dependi ng on t he pr oj ect
21
t hat t hey' r e i nvol ved i n. And so t hey have an
22
advi sor y company t hat i s par t of t hat f ami l y t hat i s
73
1
a CBE, t hey don' t have a speci al pur pose ent i t y
2
speci f i cal l y t o t hi s si t e and t o t hi s pr oj ect t hat
3
wi l l be a CBE. I t hi nk you' r e par si ng somet hi ng,
4
l ooki ng f or somet hi ng, I don' t know.
5
Q Okay, so you're saying that they will be
6
creating -- because you used the word "will" -- they
7
will be creating a special company that will be a CBE
8
that you will partner with. Was that your testimony?
9
I just want to know whether you are currently
10
partnering with an entity that is a CBE.
11
A We ar e cur r ent l y par t ner i ng wi t h an ent i t y
12
t hat i s a CBE.
13
Q And can you provide the name of that
14
entity?
15
A I can. I don' t have t he det ai l i n f r ont of
16
me and I woul d l ook t o you - - I woul d suggest t hat i f
17
you want t hat det ai l t oday, t hat you ask t hat
18
quest i on of J ai r Lynch. Ot her wi se, I ' mhappy t o
19
f ol l ow up wi t h t he speci f i cs.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Thi s i s a speci al pur pose
21
ent i t y f or t hi s pr oj ect t hat you' r e descr i bi ng,
22
r i ght ?
74
1
THE WI TNESS: I t ' s f unny, I can see t he
2
l egal document i n my head because we wer e j ust
3
wor ki ng on i t t he ot her day and, you know, i t ' s t he
4
det ai l of I don' t want t o get i t wr ong.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s f i ne.
6
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , I woul d j ust ask t hat
7
Ms. Cor bet t ' s t est i mony i s t hat t hi s pr oj ect does
8
have unpr ecedent ed CBE par t i ci pat i on - -
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
10
MS. FERSTER: - - and t hat she pr ovi de t he
11
names of t he devel opment ent i t i es or compani es t hat
12
i n f act ar e CBEs.
13
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk t hi s i s up t o t he
14
Appl i cant s t o deci de how much t hey want t o submi t t o
15
suppor t t he r ecor d and we wi l l consul t among
16
our sel ves t o deci de t hat .
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hat ' s f i ne.
18
19
Q Okay, you testified about the
20
transportation benefits of this project, the
21
infrastructure that would be created, and the bicycle
22
facilities as part of the special merits, yes?
75
1
A ( Nods i n t he af f i r mat i ve. )
2
Q So are you familiar with the Transportation
3
Impact Study that Gorove/Slade prepared that was
4
submitted to the Zoning Commission?
5
MS. BROWN: Rel evance?
6
J UDGE BYRNE: The r el evance, I assume, has
7
t o do wi t h t he qual i t y of t he t r anspor t at i on
8
i nf r ast r uct ur e t hat ' s bei ng pr ovi ded.
9
MS. BROWN: But what I want t o make sur e
10
t hat we don' t end up doi ng her e i s r ehear i ng t he
11
whol e Zoni ng Commi ssi on case.
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Me, t oo; me, t oo.
13
MS. FERSTER: I have no i nt ent i on - -
14
MS. BROWN: We want t o be car ef ul .
15
16
Q And as I'll explain in my follow-up
17
question, it will certainly ask that, assuming you
18
are familiar with your expert's transportation impact
19
study, whether or not you believe that the bicycle
20
facilities will reduce the transportation impact to
21
an acceptable level of service for this project and
22
whether you believe that the transportation
76
1
infrastructure that you are providing will address
2
the failing level of service that your own study
3
indicated would result?
4
J UDGE BYRNE: So t hi s i s ver y di f f i cul t
5
because we haven' t had, r eal l y, t est i mony about t he
6
ext ent of t he t r anspor t at i on i nf r ast r uct ur e t hat i s
7
goi ng t o be pr ovi ded, so we don' t have t hat t o st ar t
8
wi t h.
9
MS. FERSTER: I s t her e anot her wi t ness who
10
wi l l be t est i f yi ng i n mor e det ai l about t he
11
t r anspor t at i on i nf r ast r uct ur e el ement t o t he speci al
12
mer i t pr oj ect ? I f t hat ' s so, I woul d be happy t o
13
hol d my quest i ons.
14
THE WI TNESS: Yes.
15
MS. BROWN: Yes, appar ent l y, we' l l have
16
somebody t est i f yi ng t o t hat .
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , because I know
18
t hat t her e' s Bi ke Shar e st uf f and what not , but i t was
19
a ver y gener al t est i mony about t he nat ur e of t he
20
t r anspor t at i on.
21
MS. BROWN: Ri ght , and I t hi nk t hat t hose
22
st and on t hei r own, wi t hout havi ng t o get i nt o t hi s
77
1
whol e t r anspor t at i on i nf r ast r uct ur e r epor t ,
2
t r anspor t at i on i mpact r epor t . And agai n, t ur ni ng
3
t hi s i nt o a Zoni ng Commi ssi on hear i ng, whi ch i s what
4
I ' maf r ai d of - -
5
J UDGE BYRNE: No, t hat ' s not goi ng t o
6
happen.
7
MS. FERSTER: I f I coul d j ust cl ar i f y, t he
8
poi nt I woul d l i ke t o make i s t hat i f you' r e
9
pr esent i ng any t r anspor t at i on f aci l i t i es t hat you' r e
10
pr ovi di ng as a component of your speci al mer i t , I
11
t hi nk I shoul d be ent i t l ed t o pr esent quest i ons about
12
t he f act t hat t hese benef i t s wi l l not even come cl ose
13
t o mi t i gat i ng t he sever e t r anspor t at i on - - t r af f i c
14
i mpact of t hi s pr oj ect .
15
MS. BROWN: I don' t know t hat she t est i f i ed
16
t o mi t i gat i on measur es.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk t hat ' s r i ght . I mean
18
I t hi nk i f you want t o put on t est i mony, i f you want
19
t o put on evi dence about t he pauci t y of t he
20
t r anspor t at i on benef i t s, you' r e f r ee t o do t hat . So
21
I t hi nk we' l l l eave t hat t her e, t hen.
22
MS. FERSTER: Okay, so t hat ' s al l t hat I
78
1
have.
2
MS. MERRI TT: I have a coupl e of quest i ons.
3
BY MS. MERRI TT:
4
Q One is you said, or your slide said that
5
the development is anticipated to create 3,200
6
permanent jobs. And I specifically heard the first
7
witness from the City say that it would create 2,300
8
permanent jobs and that's a 50 percent difference.
9
So I'm just wondering if you could reconcile that.
10
A I don' t bel i eve t hat ' s what she sai d.
11
J UDGE BYRNE: She' s shaki ng her head no.
12
MS. MERRI TT: Okay, I must have mi shear d.
13
14
Q I have one more question and it's a follow-
15
up about the question that was earlier asked
16
regarding the selection of VMP after a competitive
17
process and you mentioned that there were five
18
bidders, five proposers I guess, in response to the
19
solicitation that was released. And I'm just
20
wondering if you know who the others were.
21
A I don' t have t hat i nf or mat i on at my
22
f i nger t i ps.
79
1
Q What was your role at the time or is this
2
just what you heard?
3
A I al r eady st at ed t hat I was not wi t h t he
4
pr oj ect at t hat t i me.
5
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any addi t i onal
6
quest i ons.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: I have a quest i on or t wo.
8
THE WI TNESS: Sur e.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: So I ' d l i ke t o hear mor e
10
about t he benef i t s t o communi t y heal t h f r omt he
11
medi cal f aci l i t i es. I under st and, you know, t hat
12
havi ng - - ar e we t al ki ng about doct or s' of f i ces,
13
basi cal l y, her e or what i s envi si oned her e f or t hat ?
14
THE WI TNESS: So t o st ar t by sayi ng Adam
15
Weer s of Tr ammel Cr ow Company i s goi ng t o t est i f y - -
16
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay.
17
THE WI TNESS: - - l at er t o t he det ai l s.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay. Yeah, but what do you
19
see as t he benef i t s, j ust gr eat er capaci t y wi t hi n t he
20
medi cal i nf r ast r uct ur e of t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a or
21
i s t her e somet hi ng mor e speci f i c?
22
THE WI TNESS: Cor r ect , so we' r e addi ng a
80
1
mi l l i on squar e f eet - -
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
3
THE WI TNESS: - - t o t he medi cal
4
i nf r ast r uct ur e.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
6
THE WI TNESS: And t hat magni t ude of new
7
gr owt h i n t he medi cal i ndust r y wi l l undoubt edl y - - I
8
mean i t adds t o t he suppl y.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, but t hat ' s j ust what
10
you mean i s addi ng t o t he suppl y of medi cal
11
i nf r ast r uct ur e. Okay, good, t hat ' s al l I want ed t o
12
ask. Thank you ver y much.
13
MS. BROWN: Next , I woul d l i ke t o cal l
14
Emi l y Ei g f r omt he EHT Tr acer i es, t he exper t i n
15
ar chi t ect ur al hi st or y and hi st or i c pr eser vat i on.
16
She' s been pr evi ousl y qual i f i ed bef or e t he Mayor ' s
17
Agent .
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, many t i mes.
19
MS. BROWN: And we have her r esum i n case
20
you need i t f or t he r ecor d.
21
J UDGE BYRNE: Sur e. I guess we' l l cal l
22
t hat Exhi bi t 1.
81
1
( Exhi bi t i s mar ked f or
2
i dent i f i cat i on. )
3
J UDGE BYRNE: So, Ms. Ei g, wel come. Can we
4
j ust qual i f y her as an exper t , wi t hout goi ng t hr ough
5
any of t hi s?
6
MS. FERSTER: I have no obj ect i on.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hank you. Ms. Ei g,
8
you' r e qual i f i ed. Pl ease j ust st at e your name f or
9
t he r ecor d.
10
THE WI TNESS: My name i s Emi l y Hot al i ng Ei g
11
and I wi sh you a good mor ni ng.
12
13
THE WI TNESS: I wi l l go t hr ough t he ef f or t s
14
t hat we have made, st ar t i ng act ual l y bef or e 2007, and
15
pr ovi de some i nsi ght i nt o t he appr oach t hat ' s been
16
t aken.
17
The sand pl ant t oday i s t he 25- acr e si t e
18
t hat i s abandoned, i t ' s i n di sr epai r , i t no l onger
19
can be used f or i t s or i gi nal pur pose, nor i s i t abl e,
20
but i t i s def i ni t el y a r omant i c l andscape t hat
21
cont r ast s wi t h t he st r i ct engi neer i ng geomet r y. The
22
evocat i ve r ui n i s a speci al pl ace and i t i s par t of a
82
1
much l ar ge hi st or i c l andmar k.
2
The McMi l l an Reser voi r Par k l andmar k, whi ch
3
was desi gnat ed i n 1991 by t he D. C. Hi st or i c
4
Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d, i ncl udes 92 acr es. And as
5
you can see, t hi s i s t he boundar y of t he l andmar k as
6
desi gnat ed i n 1991 and subsequent l y was put on t he
7
nat i onal r egi st er i n 2013. The si t e t hat we' r e
8
t al ki ng about i s t hi s 25- acr e r ect angul ar si t e her e,
9
as opposed t o wher e t he r eser voi r and t he si t e t hat ' s
10
owned, st i l l , by t he f eder al gover nment t o t he west ,
11
wher eas, t hi s si t e i s owned by t he Di st r i ct of
12
Col umbi a.
13
We pr epar ed a pr eser vat i on r epor t st ar t i ng
14
back i n 2005. We l ooked at t he i nf or mat i on t hat was
15
avai l abl e, whi ch a gr eat deal of wor k had been done
16
by Anne Sel l i n and Tony Nor man and ot her s t hat was i n
17
pr epar at i on f or t he hi st or i c l andmar k nomi nat i on.
18
I shoul d st at e t hat our r epor t , whi ch I
19
bel i eve was al r eady admi t t ed i nt o t he r ecor d, was
20
pr epar ed wi t h t he assumpt i on t hat t her e woul d be some
21
l evel of devel opment . What t hat l evel of devel opment
22
woul d be was not somet hi ng t hat we addr essed. I t was
83
1
done bef or e t her e was any pl an, i t was begun bef or e
2
t her e was any pl an.
3
And t he cont ent basi cal l y has cer t ai n
4
si gni f i cance of t he si t e as a whol e, t he l andmar k
5
si t e, because i t was not separ at ed out i n t he
6
l andmar k desi gnat i on. But t hen t he si t e descr i pt i on
7
i n t he r esour ce i nvent or y, whi ch was based, i n par t ,
8
on wor k t hat had been done as an af t er mat h t o t he
9
1987 sal e t o t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a, wor k whi ch was
10
done when Gr eenhor ne and O' Mar a i nvent or i ed t he si t e.
11
Ther e was an assessment of hi st or i c
12
i nt egr i t y based on t he f i l t r at i on pl ant i t sel f ,
13
l andscape and vi sual r esour ces. We devi sed a met hod
14
f or r el at i ve l evel of si gni f i cance of i ndi vi dual
15
r esour ce t ypes t hat was based on t he l andmar k
16
appl i cat i on and desi gnat i on by HPRB.
17
And we devi sed pr eser vat i on
18
r ecommendat i ons, bot h gener al and r esour ce speci f i c
19
and we made suggest i ons f or mi t i gat i on, knowi ng t hat
20
i t was hi ghl y l i kel y t hat not al l t he r esour ces woul d
21
r emai n i n pl ace, once t hi s devel opment pl an was
22
appr oved and i ni t i at ed.
84
1
As I sai d, t he Nat i onal Regi st er l i st i ng
2
was compl et ed i n 2013. I t had been r ecommended by
3
t he Revi ew Boar d i n 1991, but t he act ual pr ocess of
4
pl aci ng i t on t he Regi st er di d not happen unt i l 2013.
5
And what ' s i nt er est i ng about t hi s i s t hat
6
t he or i gi nal 1991 desi gnat i on i s as a l andmar k. The
7
Nat i onal Regi st er cal l ed f or t hi s t o be a hi st or i c
8
di st r i ct and you' l l not e i t says " Pr ef er r ed" ; t hat
9
t he Pr eser vat i on of f i cer pr ef er s t hat i t be deal t
10
wi t h as a hi st or i c di st r i ct . And t hat has t o do wi t h
11
our l ocal l aws and not wher e t he Nat i onal Regi st er i s
12
concer ned. But i t woul d, by t oday' s st andar ds, be
13
consi der ed a hi st or i c di st r i ct .
14
J ust a ver y br i ef out l i ne of t he McMi l l an
15
Reser voi r Par k as a whol e. They began const r uct i on
16
i n 1903. I t act ual l y st ar t ed, 1898 was t he begi nni ng
17
of t he i nt ent i on and t he oper at i ons began i n 1905.
18
But i t wasn' t unt i l 1906, ' 07 t hat
19
Fr eder i ck Ol mst ed, J r . , was asked t o pr epar e a
20
l andscape desi gn. Thi s had been al r eady l ai d out , i t
21
was i n oper at i on. So Ol mst ed, J r . , act ual l y appl i ed
22
l i ke an over l ay of l andscape and we' l l t al k about
85
1
t hat a l i t t l e whi l e l at er . And i t oper at ed - - i t was
2
compl et ed i n 1919, t her e f or many year s.
3
Then i n 1941, i n pr epar at i on, or
4
expect at i on, I shoul d say, of t he Wor l d War I I , t he
5
ent i r e si t e was f enced of f , i t was al l f eder al
6
pr oper t y and t her e was t hi s f ence on bot h si des of
7
Fi r st St r eet .
8
I t cont i nued as t he wat er oper at i ons unt i l
9
1986, when t he f eder al gover nment bui l t a r api d
10
f i l t er syst emt hat i s on t he west si de of Fi r st
11
St r eet .
12
I n 1987, t he f eder al gover nment di sposed of
13
t he pr oper t y t hat we ar e t al ki ng about t oday, t he
14
sand f i l t r at i on pl ant t hat i s t o t he east of Fi r st
15
St r eet , f or appr oxi mat el y $9. 5 mi l l i on, wi t h t he
16
ant i ci pat i on i t woul d be f or devel opment .
17
I n 1988, t he si t e was abandoned and i n
18
1991, was l i st ed i n t he D. C. i nvent or y, t hen i n 2013
19
on t he Nat i onal Regi st er .
20
I t ' s i mpor t ant t o under st and t hat t he sand
21
f i l t r at i on pl ant i s - - we' r e onl y goi ng t o be t al ki ng
22
about t hi s ar ea her e. I t ' s act ual l y not ent i r el y
86
1
shown i n t hi s space, t her e' s a por t i on bel ow her e,
2
but sand f i l t r at i on cel l s go acr oss Fi r st St r eet and
3
t hey' r e on t he f eder al gover nment pr oper t y t oday.
4
They ar e no l onger oper at i ng because t hey' r e usi ng
5
t he r api d f i l t er syst em, whi ch i s down her e, but t hey
6
ar e on bot h si des of Fi r st St r eet .
7
The sand f i l t r at i on pl ant pr obabl y i s t he
8
most i mpor t ant aspect as we see, i t ' s a speci al
9
or gani zat i on i n t opogr aphy. I t ' s t hi s r ect angul ar
10
shape. The si t e act ual l y was al r eady subdi vi ded wi t h
11
st r eet s t hat we' r e goi ng t o cor r espond t o t he st r eet s
12
t hat we have on t he east . But t hi s t r i par t i t e
13
or gani zat i on i s based on t he oper at i ons of t he
14
f aci l i t y, not on any pr evi ous subdi vi si on.
15
The l and, act ual l y t he si t e, $209, 000. 00,
16
was pur chased f r omt he owner s at t hat t i me, t he
17
pr i vat e owner s.
18
The si t e al so r epr esent ed a ver y
19
undul at i ng, l et ' s cal l i t , t opogr aphy as i t moves
20
f r omt he nor t h t o t he sout h. Ther e i s a dr op of
21
appr oxi mat el y 20 f eet . And i n or der t o al l ow t he
22
f aci l i t y t o wor k pr oper l y, t her e was a maj or cut and
87
1
f i l l ef f or t t hat made ever yt hi ng at gr ade. But as
2
you can see, at t hi s poi nt , we' r e one l evel f r omdown
3
her e t o 20 f eet . So t hi s i s a f l at pl i nt h t hat ' s at
4
t he same gr ade acr oss t he si t e.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Woul d you def i ne pl i nt h?
6
THE WI TNESS: A pl i nt h, l i ke a pl at eau,
7
t hi nk of a pl at eau, a f l at , r ect angul ar i n t hi s case,
8
shape.
9
Ot her r esour ces t hat ar e par t of t hi s
10
i ncl ude t he r egul at or houses, whi ch ar e t hese smal l
11
r ed br i ck houses t hat act ual l y have an openi ngs i n
12
t hei r f l oor s so t hat t he manual r egul at i on of wat er
13
woul d come t hr ough f r omt he under gr ound r eser voi r
14
t hat woul d connect t o t he above gr ound r eser voi r .
15
Ther e wer e t he sand bi ns, t hose ar e t he
16
cyl i ndr i cal concr et e st r uct ur es t hat you can see on
17
t he si t e, al so, t oday. Sand washer i s a ver y
18
i mpor t ant par t of t he pr ocess because t he i dea i s
19
t hat sand goes i n cl ean and comes out di r t y and has
20
t o be cl eaned agai n. So t he par t i cl es of t he
21
f i l t r at i on woul d be at t ached t o t he sand, t he wat er
22
can r un t hr ough cl ear l y.
88
1
And t hen, of cour se, t hese cel l s t hat wer e
2
each f i l t er beds, t her e ar e 20 of t hemon t he si t e
3
we' r e t al ki ng about , and as you can see t he gr ade,
4
al l t hese t hi ngs t hat wer e goi ng on wi t h t hi s t o
5
devi se a f l at sur f ace.
6
Thi s i s an or i gi nal phot ogr aph pr i or t o, i n
7
t hi s case, pr i or t o t he l andscapi ng, you can see t he
8
wor ker s, wi t h an i ndust r i al si t e. Thi s i s t he por t al
9
t hat l ed down i nt o t he cel l s bel ow and t her e' s some
10
t r acks, act ual l y, t hat ar e no l onger ext ant wher e
11
t hey' ve moved t he l ar ge sand, por t i ons at di f f er ent
12
t i mes, and t hen t hese ar e - - t hi s i s a phot ogr aph of
13
t he under gr ound cel l s.
14
When Fr eder i ck Ol mst ed, J r . , came i nt o t he
15
pr oj ect , he st udi ed i t , as you mi ght i magi ne, and
16
t her e ar e ext r aor di nar y document at i ons of hi s ef f or t s
17
at t he Ol mst ed Ar chi ves i n Br ookl i ne, Massachuset t s.
18
And a l ot of t hi s i nf or mat i on was not act ual l y
19
avai l abl e i n 1991 when t hey di d t he nomi nat i on,
20
because t hey had not i ndexed i t and i nvent or i ed i t
21
yet , but we wer e abl e t o get hol d of i t now.
22
And he devi sed t hr ee ar eas, A, B and C.
89
1
Now Ar ea A, whi ch we r ef er t o as The Pl ai ns, i s what
2
we ar e t al ki ng about t oday, t hi s sl ow sand f i l t r at i on
3
pl ant . Ar ea B i s t he r eser voi r , whi ch had pr eexi st ed
4
t he pl ant , i t was al r eady t her e, and addi t i onal
5
i nf i l t r at i on cel l s. And t hen Ar ea C, whi ch was
6
desi gned f or publ i c r ecr eat i onal use.
7
He, as I sai d, wr ot e ext ensi vel y on t hi s
8
and he expl ai ned t hat , you know, A i s t he ar ea,
9
i ncl udi ng t he r eser voi r , f i l t er bed sand washer s and
10
t hei r appur t enances. And t hen t he spaci ous and
11
i mpr essi ve open r eser voi r , encl osi ng banks and
12
hi l l si de, et cet er a.
13
And t he sout her l y par t l yi ng i n t he mai n
14
bel ow t he damn of t he r eser voi r , a separ at e
15
appendage, so t her e' s no pr act i cal f unct i on i n t he
16
oper at i on of t he wat er wor ks pr esent i ng a di st i nct
17
l andscape uni t . I t can be shaped i nt o an agr eeabl e
18
and consi st ent pi ece of i nf or mal par k l andscape, wi t h
19
pr ovi si on at t he west er l y end f or a chi l dr en' s
20
pl aygr ound.
21
And t he r eason t hat I br i ng t hi s out i s
22
because t her e' s been many conver sat i ons about t he
90
1
f act t hat t he si t e t hat has been r ef er r ed t o as The
2
Pl ai ns was t he publ i c par k. Ther e was publ i c access,
3
as a r ul e, ar ound t he edge of i t , but i t was not t o
4
be accessed her e. I f anyone was t her e, t hey wer e not
5
i nvi t ed.
6
C, however , was wher e t her e was act i vi t y,
7
i ncl udi ng t he pl acement of t he McMi l l an f ount ai n
8
because Senat or J ames McMi l l an, who i s t he Senat e
9
Di st r i ct Commi t t ee chai r man, he had been t he sor t of
10
mover and shaker , we woul d say, behi nd t he McMi l l an
11
pl an and ef f or t s wi t h t he par k syst emand al l t hese
12
ci t y beaut i f ul i mpr ovement s t hat t he ci t y was
13
exper i enci ng at t hat t i me.
14
So Ol mst ed di scussed i n l andscapi ng A,
15
t her e was a pr obl em, and I won' t r ead al l of t hi s,
16
but essent i al l y, t he pr obl emwi t h t hat i t s per haps
17
i nexpedi ent t o t he publ i c t o t he use of The Pl ai ns,
18
even upon a f enced pat h.
19
And t he i dea t hat he was t hi nki ng about
20
doi ng a f ence, t hi s act ual l y di scusses what ki nd of
21
t r ees he coul d do and what woul d bl ock i t . And he
22
was t r yi ng t o al l ow f or a vi si bi l i t y acr oss t he si t e,
91
1
but somet hi ng t hat woul d keep peopl e f r omwal ki ng on
2
t he si t e.
3
And he came up wi t h a l andscape desi gn of
4
passi ve shr ubber y, t r ees, t hat woul d di scour age
5
access t o t he cent er of The Pl ai ns, but t hat woul d be
6
an at t r act i ve pat h f or peopl e t o wal k ar ound t hat
7
si t e.
8
And t hese ar e some of t he dr awi ngs f r om
9
t hat you can see. I t woul d access each cor ner of t he
10
si t e, i t had st eps t hat wer e bui l t and her e' s t he
11
pat h and her e' s some of hi s ear l y pl ans. Thi s i s
12
har d t o see, but essent i al l y, you can see t hat he
13
i ncl uded hi s l andscape ar ound her e.
14
He al so suggest ed t her e be some ki nd of
15
smal l t r ees or pl ant s al ong each of t he t wo ser vi ce
16
cour t s. Ther e had al r eady been some sor t of gr owt h
17
of an undesi r abl e i vy and he suggest ed a di f f er ent
18
pl ant t hat woul d be mor e cont r ol l abl e t hat coul d be
19
pl aced t her e. And t hi s i s ear l y, act ual l y bef or e t he
20
l andscapi ng, so I sor t of t hi nk t her e mi ght be
21
somet hi ng goi ng on her e, but i t ' s ver y ear l y on and
22
t her e' s a pedest r i an wal ki ng al ong t hi s pat h, but
92
1
t hey had not compl et ed t he l andscapi ng, by any means.
2
The McMi l l an Memor i al Fount ai n was i n t hi s
3
ar ea her e. Thi s i s our si t e and t hi s i s t he ar ea
4
t hat we j ust di scussed and t he f ount ai n has an
5
el abor at e pl an and t her e ar e some st eps t o i t . I t
6
was t he si t e of many act i vi t i es, i ncl udi ng bands,
7
mar chi ng bands and many, many t hi ngs t hat went on i n
8
t hi s par k. And go t o t he next sl i de, pl ease.
9
Al so, i t was known t hat i t was a
10
desegr egat ed par k and t hey wer e not - - i t may be t he
11
f i r st desegr egat ed par k. These ar e phot ogr aphs of
12
Li l l i an Evant i , who was an oper a si nger , her son,
13
Thur l ow Ti bbs, at t he par k, ci r ca 1930. I t ' s ver y
14
beaut i f ul and her e' s t he r eser voi r i n t he backgr ound,
15
you can see t he f ount ai n her e and t hey' r e wal ki ng
16
al ong her e, r eal l y beaut i f ul phot ogr aphs of t hat .
17
Unf or t unat el y, t he f ount ai n was di smant l ed
18
and r emoved. Par t of i t i s t her e, but par t s of i t
19
ar e i n ot her pl aces. And t he si t e of t he f ount ai n i n
20
act ual l y 1986 i s t he si t e of t he r api d f i l t r at i on
21
pl ant . The f eder al gover nment put i t on t hat si t e
22
t her e at t hat t i me.
93
1
So once agai n, you know, t he l andmar k
2
t oday, we have t hi s pi ece and we have t hi s l ar ger
3
pi ece and t hi s ar ea i s no l onger open t o t he publ i c
4
because i t r emai ns f enced, as i t was si nce 1931.
5
The r esour ces, however - - t hen we' r e goi ng
6
t o f ocus on t hi s si t e f or t he r est of t he - - t he
7
r esour ces i ncl ude t he ser vi ce cour t s. We have t he
8
cyl i nder s, t he r egul at or houses, t he por t al s t hat
9
have access t o t he under gr ound cel l s. The f ount ai n
10
i s not t her e; i t was t her e, but i t i s not t her e. And
11
t he cel l s, r emai ni ng f i l t er beds, bot h of whi ch ar e
12
par t of a l ar ger one- acr e f i l t er bed, and t her e ar e
13
20 f i l t er beds.
14
I n our wor k, we i dent i f i ed si t es and
15
r esour ces. As I sai d, i n t he ear l i er 1990s,
16
Gr eenhor ne and O' Mar a had gone out and done an
17
i nvent or y, but we went back and we act ual l y t r i ed t o
18
see what we coul d f i nd, what was st i l l t her e, because
19
t he si t e had been abandoned t hat many mor e year s and
20
t her e had been l i t t l e f or mal access t o i t , t her e was
21
no act ual use of i t . So we had phot ogr aphs t hat we
22
compar ed wi t h phot ogr aphs cur r ent l y, usi ng al l t he
94
1
dr awi ngs and compar i ng t hem.
2
We i dent i f i ed si t e r esour ces, l andscape
3
r esour ces and bui l t r esour ces. Because t he si t e
4
i t sel f was so i mpor t ant and t he concept of t he
5
l andscape was not t her e, but i t was so i mpor t ant , i t
6
was Ol mst ed' s par t i ci pat i on and t he bui l t r esour ces
7
t hat st i l l r emai n on t he si t e.
8
I t hi nk t hat t hi s i s wher e I shoul d say
9
t hat I t hi nk t hi s i s one of t he most compl ex, i f not
10
t he most compl ex, r esour ces t hat we have st udi ed
11
because, one, of i t s i ndust r i al nat ur e, t he t ype of
12
r esour ces t hat ar e on i t , whi ch ar e st r uct ur es,
13
t hey' r e not bui l di ngs. The Nat i onal Par k Ser vi ce
14
ver y cl ear l y def i nes habi t abl e space ver sus
15
i nhabi t abl e space and t hese ar e not meant f or peopl e
16
t o l i ve i n or t o wor k al ong, you know, as an of f i ce
17
l i ke t hey ar e st r uct ur es. Next , pl ease.
18
Ther e ar e 22 r esour ce t ypes t hat we' ve
19
f ound and we have over 4, 000 r esour ces. We ar e
20
count i ng, t her e wer e 137 of t he r esour ces such as t he
21
above gr ade r esour ces, t hen t he cel l s, t he manhol e
22
cover s goi ng t o t he l ar ger number .
95
1
I n l ooki ng at t hem, we t r i ed t o under st and
2
what we wer e l ooki ng at and we went back t o t he 1991
3
l andmar k desi gnat i on. We di dn' t t r y t o r ei nvent t he
4
wheel , by any means, because t hi s was t he desi gnat i on
5
l anguage. And essent i al l y, i t i s desi gnat ed f or
6
t hr ee mai n r easons, i t s associ at i on wi t h t he hi st or y
7
of t he wat er pur i f i cat i on syst emand t he t r i umph of
8
sl ow wat er f i l t r at i on syst emover advocat es of
9
chemi cal met hods.
10
Washi ngt on, D. C. was t he l ast ci t y t o bui l d
11
a sl ow sand f i l t r at i on pl ant . I t was consi der ed t o
12
be passe by t hat t i me, but Congr ess, i n hear i ng
13
t est i mony, deci ded t o pr oceed wi t h t he sl ow wat er
14
f i l t r at i on, and i t t ook unt i l t he 1980s f or t hat
15
act ual l y t o be r epl aced.
16
The associ at i on wi t h Senat or J ames
17
McMi l l an. McMi l l an was such a l eader t hr ough al l of
18
t hi s. He di d not have, you know, di r ect r el at i onshi p
19
wi t h t hi s par t i cul ar si t e. However , he di ed i n 1902
20
and i t was an unexpect ed deat h.
21
And i f you can i magi ne McMi l l an' s pl an,
22
whi ch had been publ i shed ear l i er i n t he year - - i t
96
1
wasn' t cal l ed t he McMi l l an Pl an at t hat t i me, i t was
2
cal l ed t he Pl an of 1902. But hi s associ at i on wi t h i t
3
was so gr eat t hat i t was deci ded t hat t her e shoul d be
4
a memor i al t o hi mand i t was associ at ed wi t h t hat
5
l ar ge f ount ai n t hat was pl aced on t hi s si t e.
6
Di st i nct i ve publ i c desi gn as a maj or
7
Amer i can engi neer i ng r esour ce. I t was desi gned by
8
t he Cor ps of Engi neer s. A man named Hayden was t he
9
desi gner , wor ki ng wi t h Ol mst ed, f ol l owi ng wi t h
10
Ol mst ed, and a publ i c wor ks f aci l i t y t hat was of a
11
qual i t y t hat we do not see t oday i n our publ i c wor ks.
12
To eval uat e t he r el at i ve si gni f i cance and
13
i nt egr i t y of t hese r esour ces, we det er mi ned, based on
14
t hei r si gni f i cance, whet her t hey wer e key suppor t i ng
15
or mi nor r esour ces. We det er mi ned t hei r i nt egr i t y,
16
based on t he Nat i onal Par k Ser vi ce' s Seven Aspect s of
17
I nt egr i t y. And we i dent i f i ed how many wer e ext ant .
18
Now t hi s i s act ual l y somet hi ng t hat was
19
done i n Febr uar y of 2012, t her e was one number t hat
20
was bei ng used by t he devel oper and t hat had changed
21
i n Sept ember of 2012 and i t ' s j ust a way t o show t hi s
22
qui ckl y, what was goi ng on.
97
1
But we t ook t he r esour ce t ypes and we made
2
gener al r ecommendat i ons, r esour ce speci f i c t r eat ment
3
r ecommendat i ons and r esour ce speci f i c mi t i gat i on
4
r ecommendat i ons. As I sai d bef or e, we di d not know
5
what t he devel opment was goi ng t o l ook l i ke and we
6
di dn' t know what was goi ng t o st and, but we want ed t o
7
make i t cl ear what we t hought was i mpor t ant and t hat
8
i f t hi ngs, you know, how i mpor t ant , i f t hi ngs wer e
9
goi ng t o be r emoved, t hat t her e be mi t i gat i on. And
10
t hi s i s f ol l owi ng a pr et t y st andar d Sect i on 106 ki nd
11
of appr oach t o t hi s as a way, wi t hout act ual l y havi ng
12
a pl an i n pl ace.
13
And t hese ar e al so i n t he r epor t s t hat we
14
handed out and we gave pr ef er r ed t r eat ment appr oaches
15
f or each of t hese t hi ngs. And as you can see, t he
16
r egul at or houses wer e key and hi gh i nt egr i t y. The
17
pr ef er r ed t r eat ment appr oach was pr eser vat i on, but i f
18
t hey wer e not goi ng t o be pr eser ved, r ehabi l i t at i on
19
and mi t i gat i on woul d be appr opr i at e.
20
And onl y i n t he suppor t i ng t hi ngs was t her e
21
any j ust si mpl y mi t i gat i on, t her e was usual l y
22
r ehabi l i t at i on and mi t i gat i on. And i t had t o do wi t h
98
1
i nt egr i t y. Hi gh i nt egr i t y onl y had t he pr eser vat i on
2
or r ehabi l i t at i on/ mi t i gat i on; t he moder at e i nt egr i t y
3
had r ehabi l i t at i on and pr ef er r ed appr oach and
4
mi t i gat i on as an al t er nat e appr oach.
5
We t ook t hese r ecommendat i ons, and i f I can
6
t ake j ust a ver y l ong pr ocess and put i t i nt o a f ew
7
moment s, but t he pr ocess, t he r epor t di r ect s t hat
8
t her e be a r et ent i on of t he r ect angul ar f or m, t he
9
pl i nt h, or t he pl at eau, be r et ai ned, as t hi s i s 20
10
f eet hi gher her e t han i t i s her e. The ber ms t hat
11
sur r ound i t , t her e' s a gr assy ber mt hat i s ar ound t he
12
ent i r e si t e, obvi ousl y 20 f eet hi gh at t hi s end and
13
i t ' s act ual l y depr essed at t hat end.
14
The t r i par t i t e or gani zat i on, whi ch I wi l l
15
say t he ci t y, at f i r st , ver y much t hr oughout t he
16
pl anni ng want ed t o r ei nst at e t he st r eet pl an. But
17
t he l andmar k i mpor t ance, we f el t , di ct at ed t hat i t ' s
18
a t r i par t i t e or gani zat i on.
19
The r eci pr ocal r el at i onshi p bet ween t he
20
ser vi ce cour t s, a sense of open space and t hen t hat
21
pedest r i an wal k, whi ch we' r e now cal l i ng Ol mst ed
22
Wal k, t hat sur r ounded t he ent i r e si t e.
99
1
We r ecommended t he i ncor por at i on of vi sual
2
expr essi on, bot h i n f or m, mat er i al , col or s, and we
3
r ecommended a scope of pr eser vat i on wor k t hat
4
i ncl uded r est or i ng t he hi gh l evel r esour ces t o t hei r
5
or i gi nal appear ance, st abi l i zi ng and pr eser vi ng,
6
pl anni ng f or f ut ur e mai nt enance and r epai r of al l
7
pr eser ved r esour ces and f ol l owi ng t he Secr et ar y of
8
t he I nt er i or ' s st andar ds and gui del i nes f or
9
r ehabi l i t at i on wor k.
10
Thi s j ust gi ves you a l i t t l e, qui ck l ook at
11
t he r et ent i on and r est or at i on, r ehabi l i t at i on. And
12
r ehabi l i t at i on woul d i ncl ude i f we t ake t he r egul at or
13
house and t ur ned i t i nt o a l i t t l e cof f ee shop,
14
r ehabi l i t at i on woul d be appr opr i at e. But we
15
r ecommend t hat at l east one of t he r egul at or houses
16
woul d be act ual l y r est or ed t o i t s or i gi nal appear ance
17
so we coul d under st and how i t was used. And i n each
18
case, t her e wer e at l east one, i f not mor e, of t hese
19
r esour ces t ype t hat wer e t o be r et ai ned and r est or ed.
20
We r ecommended i ncor por at i on and
21
r econst r uct i on i n cer t ai n pl aces. We f el t t her e was
22
an oppor t uni t y f or some r eal l y cr eat i ve use of t he
100
1
obj ect s and i ncor por at i ng, such as t he vi ews bei ng
2
i ncor por at ed i nt o t he desi gn.
3
And we al so f ound t hat r econst r uct i on woul d
4
be desi r abl e. The cor ner st ai r s, onl y one exi st ed of
5
t he f our cor ner st ai r s, and t he per i met er pedest r i an
6
pat h, f or al l i nt ent s and pur poses, j ust seemed
7
over gr own, so t hat we want ed t hose i t ems t o be
8
r econst r uct ed.
9
So you wi l l see - - Mat t Bel l wi l l be
10
f ol l owi ng wi t h t he pr esent at i on of t he pr oj ect , but I
11
j ust woul d l i ke t o show you how, a qui ck l ook, t hat
12
t he pr oposal s t hat we made di d, i n f act , r et ai n t he
13
r ect angul ar f or m, t he pl i nt h, t he ber m, t he
14
t r i par t i t e or gani zat i on, t he r eci pr ocal r el at i onshi p,
15
a sense of open space and pedest r i an wal k.
16
We al so wer e t r yi ng t o f i nd a pl ace t hat
17
woul d have an ext ensi ve vi ew, because we knew t her e
18
woul d be devel opment , we knew t her e wasn' t goi ng t o
19
be t hi s ent i r e si t e open, l i ke i t had been. And we
20
saw t hat t he pr oposed pr oj ect - - act ual l y, r at her ,
21
t he sout her n por t i on of t he si t e we per cei ved t o be
22
ver y cl ose t o what Ol mst ed' s l andscape scene cal l ed
101
1
f or .
2
I t has The Pl ai ns, i t has t he r ai sed
3
el evat i on associ at ed wi t h t he ber ms, i t has a
4
r el at i onshi p di r ect l y wi t h t he sout h ser vi ce cour t ,
5
t he sur r oundi ng st r eet s, because i t you keeps t he
6
r ect angul ar edge and t he ber m, whi ch you cl ear l y know
7
when you' r e dr i vi ng up or even down Nor t h Capi t ol
8
St r eet , when you have r eached t hi s si t e.
9
I t has pr eser vat i on of a por t i on of t he
10
cel l . And t hese t wo cel l s ar e t he ones t hat have
11
been demol i shed by D. C. Wat er , t hese cel l s ar e
12
f ai l i ng and t hi s i s t he cel l t hat i s goi ng t o be
13
i ncor por at ed.
14
So al l wi t h t he i nt ent i on, t he most
15
i mpor t ant t hi ng bei ng r et ai ni ng a sense of pl ace,
16
t hat ever yone knew t hat t hey wer e at t he McMi l l an
17
Sand Fi l t r at i on Pl ant as par t of t hi s gr eat er
18
l andmar k.
19
And l ast , t hat t her e be an i nt er pr et i ve
20
pr ogr ami nt egr at ed i nt o t he desi gn, st r ong vi sual
21
r eadi ng of t he l andmar k' s uni que char act er , publ i c
22
access. Remember , t her e was onl y access t o t he edge
102
1
and t hat was st opped i n 1941. And t hi s woul d al l ow
2
peopl e t o wal k and exper i ence t hi s por t i on of t he
3
si t e wi t h t he new st r eet s and t he ser vi ce cour t s and
4
t he pedest r i an wal k ar ound t he ent i r e si t e.
5
The l andscape mat er i al s, t he i ncl usi on of
6
wat er , communi t y cent er , i nt er act i ve pl ay component s,
7
heal i ng gar dens, i nt er act i ve i nt er pr et i ve di spl ays
8
such as t he wal ki ng museum, al l of t hese t hi ngs
9
desi gned t o, i n f act , r el at e t o t he l andmar k' s
10
si gni f i cance, but al so, goi ng back t o her e, i s t hat
11
we want ed t o r et ai n and i nt egr at e cel l s i nt o t he
12
devel opment pr ogr amand r euse of above gr ound
13
r esour ces.
14
Wi t h al l of t hi s t oget her , I ' ve been asked
15
t o j ust sor t of put t hi s i n cont ext of a coupl e of
16
speci al mer i t pr oj ect s. And t her e ar e many, many
17
speci al mer i t pr oj ect s t hat have come t o t he Mayor ' s
18
Agent . But t hese ar e pr oj ect s t hat have si mi l ar or
19
not so si mi l ar , I wi l l say, because t hese ar e much
20
l ess compl ex pr oj ect s.
21
They al l ar e bui l di ngs. They al l i ncl ude
22
ei t her t he demol i t i on of t he bui l di ngs and t he
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1
i ncor por at i on of a f acade and new const r uct i on ar ound
2
t hemor por t i ons of t he bui l di ng bei ng demol i shed.
3
They ar e var i ous st ages of t hat . But none of t hem
4
compar e t o t he compl exi t y of what we' r e l ooki ng at
5
t oday.
6
The cl osest we mi ght use i s t he O St r eet
7
Mar ket , wher e t her e i s a si ngl e bui l di ng, and i f you
8
r emember t he i ce st or mof however many year s ago i t
9
was, 2005 or somet hi ng, when t he r oof col l apsed, and
10
i n or der t o act ual l y br i ng t he bui l di ng, t he
11
col l apsed wal l s t hat wer e r emoved and t hen
12
r econst r uct ed.
13
And t hi s l ar ge si t e i s a par t of t he new
14
const r uct i on ar ound i t , so t hat i t hi ghl i ght s t he
15
r esour ce t hat was t echni cal l y demol i shed, but i n
16
f act , i t was bot h nat ur al and manmade causes f or t he
17
demol i t i on t o al l ow t hi s t o be r ehabi l i t at ed and
18
become an act i ve par t of t he nei ghbor hood agai n and
19
al l of t he new const r uct i on t hat went ar ound i t t o
20
hel p gi ve i t l i f e, what had been a ver y di smal si t e.
21
But as I sai d, t her e i s r eal l y not hi ng t hat
22
can compar e wi t h what we' r e l ooki ng at t oday and t he
104
1
i nt er est , obvi ousl y, i n t r yi ng t o pr eser ve somet hi ng
2
t hat i s meani ngf ul t o so many peopl e on so many
3
l evel s, whi ch has not been accessi bl e t o t he publ i c
4
at any t i me, except al ong t he edge.
5
And t hat wi l l al l ow f or an ext r aor di nar y
6
i nt er pr et i ve oppor t uni t y f or under st andi ng how t he
7
wat er pur i f i cat i on of our ci t y changed our ci t y and
8
kept our ci t y as i t moves i nt o t he 21st Cent ur y.
9
And as I sai d ear l i er , t he t wo cel l s t hat
10
wer e demol i shed, t her e' s al so anot her cel l , Cel l 14,
11
t hat ' s bei ng used as a st or mwat er r et ent i on si t e by
12
D. C. Wat er . Because t hey ar e, i n f act , i n pr ocess
13
wi t h a maj or new st ep, t he next cent ur y st ep, of
14
devel opment as t hey put i n new t unnel s ar ound t he
15
ci t y t o pr ovi de f or wat er t hat act ual l y can meet t he
16
new demands of our enl ar ged ci t y mor e t han a hundr ed
17
year s l at er f r omt he t i me t hat t hi s was const r uct ed.
18
So t hat concl udes my pr esent at i on. I ' m
19
happy, of cour se, t o answer any quest i ons.
20
MS. BROWN: I have a coupl e of quest i ons
21
t hat I want t o r edi r ect , but I al so want t o not e t hat
22
I ' d l i ke t o r ecal l her af t er t he st r uct ur al engi neer
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1
t est i f i es t o gi ve her exper t opi ni on on t hat
2
t est i mony.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay.
4
BY MS. BROWN:
5
Q Ms. Eig, how many Mayor's Agent cases have
6
you worked on, would you say, ten, 20, 30, 50?
7
A 30, I t hi nk pr obabl y 30, bet ween 25 and 30.
8
Q And based on that slide, how does the
9
special merit of this project compare with those that
10
you have worked on?
11
MS. FERSTER: I woul d obj ect t o t hat . Ms.
12
Ei g' s t est i mony does not go t o speci al mer i t , i t goes
13
si mpl y t o t he hi st or i c si gni f i cance of t he si t e.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Pr oceed, I ' d l i ke t o hear
15
what you have t o say.
16
THE WI TNESS: I t hi nk t hat t hi s pr oj ect i s
17
pr esent i ng a ver y speci al i ncor por at i on of t he si t e
18
t hat al l ows t he si t e t o be accessi bl e t o t he publ i c
19
at a l evel t hat most speci al mer i t cases do not even
20
begi n t o r each, t hat t he speci al aspect of i t , t he
21
par k t hat al l ows bot h par k act i vi t i es, but al so wi l l
22
be i nt er pr et i ve of t he hi st or y of t he ci t y' s wat er
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1
syst em, I t hi nk i s r eal l y qui t e a r emar kabl e appr oach
2
i n t he end.
3
I t i s ver y di f f i cul t because, as you know,
4
my t est i mony di d not di scuss condi t i on, but i n my
5
r epor t t her e i s cer t ai nl y acknowl edgement t hat t he
6
condi t i on of t he under gr ound cel l s has af f ect ed what
7
can happen at t hi s si t e. And t he oppor t uni t y her e t o
8
br i ng at t ent i on t o a publ i c wor ks f aci l i t y i n t hi s
9
way i s, I bel i eve, ver y speci al mer i t .
10
BY MS. BROWN: ( Resumi ng)
11
Q You have a slide up about the O Street
12
Market. Do you recall if there was affordable
13
housing required on that site?
14
A Yes, I bel i eve - -
15
MS. FERSTER: I obj ect agai n t o Ms. Ei g
16
comment i ng on - -
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Thi s i s di r ect t est i mony,
18
r i ght ? I mean she can ask pr et t y much what she
19
want s.
20
MS. FERSTER: Rel evance t o her t est i mony,
21
not wi t hi n t he scope of - -
22
MS. BROWN: I t ' s st i l l her di r ect
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1
t est i mony.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: I t ' s st i l l her di r ect
3
t est i mony.
4
MS. FERSTER: Under st ood.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: She can ask anyt hi ng she
6
want s.
7
THE WI TNESS: I bel i eve i t ' s 20 per cent of
8
af f or dabl e housi ng.
9
10
Q And was that a City project?
11
A Yes, a publ i c- pr i vat e par t ner shi p.
12
Q And the 20 percent affordable is considered
13
part of the special merit of that project.
14
A Yes.
15
Q And are you familiar with the Randall
16
School Project?
17
A Yes, I am.
18
Q And is that also a public-private
19
partnership with the City involved in that?
20
A I t hi nk i t ' s a pr i vat e devel opment .
21
Q Do you know if there were restrictions on
22
the site for affordable housing?
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1
A I know t hat 20 per cent af f or dabl e housi ng
2
was i ncl uded i n t hat pr oj ect .
3
Q And is that considered special merit?
4
A Yes.
5
Q Thank you.
6
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk t hat ' s al l I have f or
7
now.
8
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , Ms. Fer st er , your
9
wi t ness?
10
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
11
BY MS. FERSTER:
12
Q Just a couple of questions about the
13
Randall School property that you're familiar with and
14
the O Street Market.
15
When you talked about the affordable
16
housing on the site, how much of that affordable
17
housing, what was the area's median income that that
18
affordable housing --
19
A I do not know t he answer t o t hat .
20
Q Okay, for any of these projects that you've
21
handled in --
22
A Of f t he t op of my head, of f t he t op of my
109
1
head, no. I ' ve par t i ci pat ed i n t he pr oj ect s and I
2
pr obabl y knew t he answer t o t hat at one t i me, but not
3
at t hi s moment , I coul dn' t say.
4
Q So it's correct that the McMillan Sand
5
Filtration Site is listed in the D.C. inventory of
6
historic sites as a historic landmark, correct?
7
A No, t hat ' s not cor r ect . Act ual l y, i t ' s
8
l i st ed as par t of a si ngl e l andmar k of t he 92- acr e
9
si t e, i t i s a por t i on of i t .
10
Q A portion, okay, but it is a part of a
11
historic landmark.
12
A That ' s cor r ect .
13
Q Okay, and it is independently eligible for
14
listing, independently listed in the National
15
Register as a historic district.
16
A The ent er 92- acr e si t e, yes.
17
Q Now you testified that one of the benefits
18
of this project is the public accessibility that it
19
will provide. But you also testified, and isn't it
20
correct, you also testified that The Plains site,
21
which is where the sand filtration site is, is not
22
significant for its public accessibility? In fact,
110
1
you testified that --
2
A That i s cor r ect , i t s accessi bi l i t y, I t hi nk
3
i t ' s pr ef er r ed because i t i s a si t e no l onger used
4
and t her ef or e, becomes somet hi ng t hat can be
5
i nt er pr et ed. And i t ' s t he i nt er pr et i ve val ue and
6
educat i onal val ue of bei ng abl e t o under st and how t he
7
wat er - -
8
Q Okay, so that was part of your view about
9
the special merit of the project, as opposed to the
10
significance of the site.
11
A Yes.
12
Q And isn't it correct that a key feature of
13
the significance of that site is its open space?
14
A That i s cor r ect .
15
Q And it's correct, also, that it's your
16
opinion that the site maintains a high degree of
17
historic integrity, is that correct? I'm quoting,
18
actually, from your report.
19
A Yes, but we woul dn' t be her e i n f r ont of
20
t he Mayor ' s Agent i f we wer e r et ai ni ng t he si t e as i t
21
i s. The poi nt of t hi s i s i t ' s a speci al mer i t case,
22
so t her e' s an acknowl edgement on ever yone' s par t her e
111
1
t hat t he l andmar k as i t i s t oday i s bei ng pr oposed t o
2
be al t er ed t o pr ovi de a di f f er ent pur pose.
3
Q And then your report also indicates and
4
your testimony also indicates that you believe the
5
character and history of this site is unique and
6
would be difficult to convey to future visitors
7
because of the level of development proposed.
8
A I t hi nk you' ve got t hat out of cont ext .
9
The sect i on t hat you' r e r eadi ng has t o do wi t h
10
mi t i gat i on and so t hat dependi ng on t he l evel of t hat
11
- - r emember , t hi s r epor t was wr i t t en wi t hout any
12
devel opment pl an i n pl ace.
13
So i t was a quest i on of wher e on t he scal e,
14
on a scal e of , say, one t o t en, how di f f i cul t i t
15
woul d be, t he mor e mi t i gat i on woul d be necessar y. I t
16
wasn' t eval uat i ng what t hi s pr oposal was goi ng t o be,
17
by any means, because t her e was no pr oposal t o
18
eval uat e. Do you under st and?
19
Q Yes. And in terms of your recommendations
20
for rehabilitation of the above ground structures in
21
your report, have your recommendations been
22
implemented in the project, is there any specific
112
1
rehabilitation and mitigation plan for those
2
recommendations?
3
A Ther e i sn' t an i nt ent i on t o do t hat . We
4
act ual l y spent a gr eat deal of t i me wor ki ng out a
5
pr ogr amt hat woul d pr ovi de f or r ehabi l i t at i on and
6
r est or at i on, as appr opr i at e, of t he di f f er ent
7
r esour ces. As I t est i f i ed, i n some cases, t her e i s
8
an i nt ent i on t hat a r esour ce wi l l be r est or ed t o i t s
9
or i gi nal appear ance so we coul d under st and t he
10
f unct i on. I n ot her cases, i t woul d be adapt i vel y
11
r eused and r ehabi l i t at ed.
12
Al l of t he r egul at or houses, t he sand bi ns
13
ar e bei ng r et ai ned, most of t he por t al wal l s, sand
14
washer s ar e bei ng r et ai ned, so t he above gr ound
15
f aci l i t i es. And t he ser vi ce cour t i s bei ng r et ai ned
16
and a l ot of t he manhol e cover s ar e bei ng r et ai ned,
17
t hi ngs l i ke t hat ar e bei ng r et ai ned.
18
Q And in terms of the future maintenance of
19
the property, is there a plan in place that will
20
provide for adequate future maintenance for the site
21
and for how long?
22
A We r ecommended i n t he r epor t t hat t her e
113
1
act ual l y be l i ke a BI D, a B- I - D, a gr oup of peopl e
2
who r epr esent ed t he owner s and r epr esent ed t he
3
occupant s and r esi dent s and nei ghbor s, t o det er mi ne a
4
pr ogr amt o make sur e t hat t hi s woul d happen. But
5
i t ' s somewhat pr emat ur e f or t hat t o happen because
6
we' r e st i l l wai t i ng t o get an appr oval f or a pr oj ect ,
7
but t hat was i n our r epor t , we r ecommended t hat , and
8
t hat was made ver y cl ear t o t he owner s.
9
Q But none of these plans are currently in
10
place, then, for the future maintenance or the
11
rehabilitation.
12
A I don' t t hi nk t hat ' s t r ue, I t hi nk t hey ar e
13
consi der ed as par t of i t , but I t hi nk t hat i t ' s not
14
somet hi ng t hat - - i t ' s not at t hat st age yet t o do
15
t hat .
16
Q And what stage is it appropriate for the
17
Applicants, in your opinion, to provide for a binding
18
commitment to preserve these historic structures and
19
maintain them for a period of time?
20
A Wel l , I woul d t hi nk t hat once you have a
21
concept appr oval , t hat woul d be, you know, appr oval
22
f r omt he Mayor ' s Agent . Obvi ousl y, t hi s has al so
114
1
gone t o t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on and I bel i eve t her e ar e
2
many r equi r ement s t hat t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on has
3
al r eady set f or war d as bi ndi ng t owar d t he publ i c-
4
pr i vat e par t ner shi p t o wor k out .
5
Q And is a rehabilitation and maintenance
6
plan one of those requirements?
7
A I don' t know t he answer t o t hat quest i on.
8
MS. FERSTER: Okay, t hank you.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Ms. Mer r i t t ?
10
MS. MERRI TT: I j ust have a coupl e of
11
quest i ons.
12
13
Q When you were describing your own
14
recommendations about preservation and rehabilitation
15
and mitigation, could you elaborate on what you
16
intended at the time, what you were thinking in
17
reference to mitigation? What sort of mitigation
18
measures did you have in mind?
19
A I t hi nk t he r epor t i ncl udes some of t he
20
mi t i gat i on. I t was our ant i ci pat i on t hat t he
21
Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d or st af f , Pr eser vat i on
22
st af f and t he Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d - - I
115
1
shoul dn' t say t hat .
2
The st af f woul d i ndi cat e what ki nds of
3
t hi ngs t hey woul d l i ke as mi t i gat i on. We cannot say
4
what mi t i gat i on woul d be, i t woul d have t o be
5
somet hi ng t hat woul d come f r oman appr oval body. And
6
t hat mi t i gat i on devel oped over t i me i s par t of t he
7
Zoni ng Commi ssi on case and i t ' s par t of t hi s case of
8
speci al mer i t . And t o have speci al mer i t i ncl udes
9
ameni t i es t hat ar e t o be bal anced, whi ch i s what
10
mi t i gat i on i s, i t ' s a bal anci ng of t he l oss agai nst
11
t he gai ns.
12
Q In your recommendations about what to
13
retain, one of the features that you mentioned was
14
the reciprocal relationship between the service
15
courts. Can you elaborate on that?
16
A The l andmar k as i t st ands t oday has t hese
17
t wo ser vi ce cour t s and t he r el at i onshi p bet ween t hem,
18
t he sense of t he t r i par t i t e, and t hat was what I
19
t hought shoul d be r et ai ned.
20
Q Did you mean a visual relationship?
21
A Yes, a vi sual r el at i onshi p.
22
Q And do you think that the current plan
116
1
achieves that recommendation?
2
A The cur r ent pl an has nor t h- sout h st r eet s
3
t hat wi l l al l ow a vi sual connect i on bet ween t he t wo
4
ser vi ce cour t s.
5
Q At the point of the streets, is that what
6
you mean?
7
A Ri ght , as wel l as t her e ar e ot her poi nt s
8
t hat you' d be abl e t o see t hat . I t ' s a wi de ar ea.
9
I f you' r e wal ki ng ar ound t he Ol mst ed Wal k, t hat
10
cr eat es t hi s uni t y t hat al l ows you t o see t he
11
r el at i onshi p. I t ' s not t he same as i t woul d be i f no
12
devel opment t ook pl ace, but i t i s a good compr omi se,
13
t o al l ow t he l andmar k t o be r et ai ned as i t s sense of
14
pl ace, as bei ng kept .
15
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any f ur t her
16
quest i ons.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: I have j ust a f ew. So what
18
was t he or i gi nal f unct i on of t he r egul at or houses?
19
THE WI TNESS: The r egul at or houses wer e
20
wher e men, i t was men, act ual l y manual l y t ur ned
21
val ves t o cont r ol t he wat er , how f ast or sl ow i t was
22
goi ng t o come f r omt he under gr ound r eser voi r i nt o t he
117
1
sand.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght .
3
THE WI TNESS: And t hen out agai n.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: And t hen t her e wer e a number
5
of t hembecause t her e wer e di f f er ent pat hways f or t he
6
wat er t o pass down t hr ough.
7
THE WI TNESS: Mm- hmm. Now each of t he
8
cel l s i n t he f i l t er beds ar e - - I won' t say t hey' r e
9
st and al one, because t hey can' t st and al one, but
10
t hey' r e cl osed f r omeach ot her . I t ' s not l i ke a
11
whol e, bi g ocean, i t ' s l i ke l ot s of sect i ons.
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, mm- hmm. I s t her e an
13
ext ant sand f i l t r at i on syst emst r uct ur e el sewher e
14
t hat you' r e awar e of ?
15
THE WI TNESS: Wel l , acr oss t he st r eet .
16
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, okay, r i ght , t hat ' s
17
t r ue.
18
THE WI TNESS: I can' t say I ' mpr epar ed t o
19
answer t hat quest i on, per se, but t hey ar e - -
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Has anybody pr eser ved t hem,
21
i nt act as a - -
22
THE WI TNESS: I don' t know t he answer t o
118
1
t hat quest i on, I don' t , no.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you vi ew t her e bei ng a
3
si gni f i cance or a di st i nct i on bet ween t hi s bei ng a
4
l andmar k or a par t of a l andmar k or a par t of a
5
hi st or i c di st r i ct ?
6
THE WI TNESS: That ' s a ver y good quest i on,
7
because as a l andmar k, cer t ai n t hi ngs f r omD. C. l aw
8
had t o be f ol l owed - -
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Ri ght .
10
THE WI TNESS: - - whi ch woul d have been
11
sl i ght l y di f f er ent i f i t was a hi st or i c di st r i ct .
12
The f act t hat i t was pr oposed by t he hi st or i c
13
pr eser vat i on of f i cer t o t he Regi st er as a di st r i ct i s
14
i n keepi ng wi t h what t he Nat i onal Par k Ser vi ce, t he
15
Nat i onal Regi st er woul d i dent i f y as a hi st or i c
16
di st r i ct . They woul d not i dent i f y t hi s as a
17
l andmar k, per se, by t hei r st andar ds t oday.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Ri ght , because of t he
19
di f f er ent el ement s, t he pr eser vat i on el ement s t hat
20
ar e t her e.
21
THE WI TNESS: Ri ght .
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Ar e you awar e of any speci al
119
1
mer i t case t hat i nvol ved t he demol i t i on of
2
st r uct ur es, as opposed t o bui l di ngs?
3
THE WI TNESS: St r uct ur es? I have t o t hi nk
4
about t hat . Yeah, I mean I ' d have t o t hi nk about
5
t hat .
6
J UDGE BYRNE: Br i dges or - -
7
THE WI TNESS: Yeah, I - -
8
J UDGE BYRNE: You don' t know of any.
9
THE WI TNESS: No, but i f I can get back t o
10
you on t hat . You know, I ' mnot , of f t he t op of my
11
head, awar e of any, I ' mgoi ng t o say t hat .
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , t hank you, t hose
13
ar e my quest i ons.
14
MS. BROWN: I have no r edi r ect .
15
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , ver y good. Thank
16
you, Ms. Ei g.
17
18
MS. BROWN: The next wi t ness - - I ' mj ust
19
l ooki ng at t he t i me and I don' t know what your
20
schedul e i s or how you want t o pr oceed.
21
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, we' l l cer t ai nl y do at
22
l east one mor e wi t ness bef or e we br eak f or l unch,
120
1
okay?
2
MS. BROWN: Our next wi t ness i s Mr . Ki r k
3
Met t amof Rober t Si l man Engi neer s and I ' d l i ke hi m
4
qual i f i ed as an exper t i n st r uct ur al engi neer i ng. I
5
shoul d have hi s r esum her e. He' s been qual i f i ed
6
bef or e t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
7
( Exhi bi t 2 i s mar ked f or i dent i f i cat i on. )
8
J UDGE BYRNE: Any obj ect i on t o qual i f yi ng
9
t hi s wi t ness?
10
MS. FERSTER: No obj ect i on.
11
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, good. Mr . Met t am, I ' l l
12
qual i f y you as an exper t i n st r uct ur al engi neer i ng.
13
So pl ease st at e your name f or t he r ecor d.
14
THE WI TNESS: Sur e. My name i s Ki r k
15
Met t am, I ' ma pr i nci pal wi t h Rober t Si l man
16
Associ at es, st r uct ur al engi neer s.
17
MS. BROWN: Go ahead and pr oceed wi t h your
18
di r ect t est i mony.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
20
Wher eupon,
21
KI RK METTAM
22
havi ng been pr evi ousl y swor n, t est i f i ed as f ol l ow:
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1
2
THE WI TNESS: I ' ve i ncl uded a coupl e of
3
sl i des, j ust gi vi ng some backgr ound about t he f i r m.
4
We' r e st r uct ur al engi neer s t hat l ove hi st or i c
5
bui l di ngs and al l t he chal l enges associ at ed wi t h
6
t hem, f or bet t er or f or wor se. So we' ve wor ked on a
7
number of not abl e hi st or i c bui l di ngs, but al so, some
8
adapt i ve r euses of var i ous t ypes of st r uct ur es, bot h
9
bui l di ngs and nonbui l di ngs.
10
And one of t he r ecent pr oj ect s we wer e
11
i nvol ved i n i s t he desi gn of t he al l new par k down at
12
t he wat er f r ont , but al so adapt i ng t he use of t wo of
13
t he i ndust r i al st r uct ur es t her e as new bui l di ng
14
st r uct ur es.
15
So what I ' d l i ke t o do t oday, we wer e
16
r et ai ned by Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s sever al year s
17
back t o l ook at al l t he st r uct ur es of t he si t e, and
18
so we' ve i nvest i gat ed t he above gr ade, as wel l as t he
19
bel ow gr ade st r uct ur es. But r eal l y, I want t o f ocus
20
t oday on t he under gr ound st r uct ur es because t hat
21
seems t o be t he ar ea t hat i s l east under st ood.
22
I ' ve got a l ot t o cover , so f or gi ve me i f I
122
1
t al k a l i t t l e f ast . I know t hi s i s ver y exci t i ng
2
mat er i al . So as a means of get t i ng t hr ough t hi s, I ' m
3
goi ng t o t al k a l i t t l e bi t about t he or i gi nal
4
st r uct ur es f i r st and t hen t al k about , i nt r oduce what
5
we know about t he exi st i ng condi t i ons and, l ast l y,
6
t al k about t he const r ai nt s and oppor t uni t i es bot h f or
7
pr eser vat i on and adapt i ve r euse.
8
So on t he l ef t hand si de of t hi s i mage, we
9
see t he ent i r e si t e. Under l ayi ng beneat h t he si t e
10
ar e r eal l y t hr ee l ar ge, cont i nuous, concr et e masses.
11
You see t hese out l i ned i n a bol d whi t e l i ne. Each of
12
t hose bol d whi t e l i nes bounds an ar ea t hat i s a
13
cont i nuous mass of concr et e, t hey ar e each a
14
st r uct ur e. That was j ust a means of const r uct i on.
15
Wi t hi n t hose st r uct ur es, t her e' s an ar r ay,
16
i f you can see, i t ' s a f our deep by f i ve ar r ay of
17
cel l s. We use t he t er m" cel l s" t o descr i be a
18
concr et e el ement t hat r et ai ns a mass of wat er . And
19
t hose cel l s wer e f i l l ed wi t h wat er and r el eased, as
20
needed, as t he oper at i on r equi r ed.
21
I t ' s ver y i mpor t ant t o not e t hat t hese ar e
22
hi ghl y const r ai ned, bot h by t he adj acent cel l s and by
123
1
t he soi l ar ound t hem, and we' l l get t o t hat a l i t t l e
2
bi t l at er . But i f you zoomi nt o - - i f you' l l see my
3
f i r st yel l ow bubbl e on t he l ef t . I f you zoomi nt o
4
one of t hose cel l s, Cel l 14 whi ch we' r e payi ng a l ot
5
of at t ent i on t o - - t hi s i s a l i t t l e bi t out of scal e
6
- -
7
But what you see i s t her e' s l i t er al l y one
8
way i nt o t he cel l , one avenue i n per r amp. I t ' s got
9
concr et e wal l s on f our si des. Two of t hemar e
10
boundi ng t he sur r oundi ng soi l , so t hey' r e heavy, mass
11
r et ai ni ng wal l s. The i nt er i or wal l i s a l i ght er
12
wal l . And t hen zoomi ng i n agai n - - I ' msor r y, t hi s
13
under gr ound cel l has 200 col umns, each suppor t i ng a
14
vaul t .
15
So you zoomi n agai n and you st ar t t o see
16
t he scal e of what we' r e t al ki ng about and I ' l l go
17
i nt o t hi s i n mor e det ai l . But I r eal l y f eel i t ' s
18
i mpor t ant f or ever ybody t o under st and t he scal e of
19
what we' r e deal i ng wi t h her e. I n al l , t her e ar e
20
4, 000 of t hese vaul t s over t he t en- acr e st r uct ur e.
21
J ust as a br i ef i nt r oduct i on t o t he
22
const r uct i on, t hese ar e unr ei nf or ced concr et e, and
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1
we' l l t al k mor e about t hat l at er . So a cont i nuous
2
st r uct ur e. I t was never i nt ended f or occupancy. I
3
say t hat f or t wo r easons, one, because of t he
4
l oadi ng, t he t ype of const r uct i on t hat was used.
5
But secondl y, t her e' s no wat er pr oof i ng, i t
6
was meant t o house wat er , so t hey di dn' t mi nd i f
7
wat er got i n i t . Ther e' s no wat er pr oof i ng on t op of
8
i t . Wat er penet r at ed t he sur f ace, t he soi l on t op,
9
penet r at ed t he concr et e, got i n her e. I t was mi xed
10
wi t h t he wat er t hat was bei ng t r eat ed, ul t i mat el y,
11
f or dr i nki ng wat er and exi t ed t he si t e. So i t ' s not
12
i nt ended f or occupancy, t her e i s no dr y space, t her e
13
i s no wat er bar r i er .
14
I t ' s al so not i nt ended t o suppor t added
15
l oads. Thi s t op sur f ace was meant f or access by
16
wor ker s onl y, not f or any sor t of vehi cul ar or even
17
heavy pedest r i an use. And i t ' s now over a hundr ed
18
year s ol d.
19
So I ' mgoi ng t o beg your f or gi veness and
20
cal l t hi s St r uct ur es 101 because I need t o descr i be a
21
coupl e of t hi ngs. These ar e vaul t ed st r uct ur es. You
22
can see t hat i n t hi s sect i on her e. Act ual l y, qui t e
125
1
beaut i f ul when you get i n and l ook at t heml ocal l y.
2
Vaul t ed st r uct ur es wor k i n compr essi on and
3
compr essi on onl y, t hey' r e a ver y anci ent f or mof
4
st r uct ur e.
5
And t he r eason t hat wor ks i s, as I
6
descr i bed bef or e, because t hey' r e hi ghl y conf i ned by
7
t he t hi ngs ar ound t hem, whet her t hey' r e cel l s or
8
soi l , and t hat r epr esent s a f ai r amount of
9
vul ner abi l i t y. And what I mean by t hat i s t hat when
10
somet hi ng happens t hat causes t he vaul t t o no l onger
11
be i n compr essi on, i t becomes an unst abl e st r uct ur e.
12
The t hi ngs t hat coul d cause t hat t o happen woul d be
13
l oadi ng on t op, i f t her e was no l onger a bal anced
14
l oadi ng, or i f somet hi ng moved. And we' l l see i n
15
t hi s st r uct ur e t hat a l ot has moved.
16
When t he soi l t ends t o move bel ow i t and
17
whet her t hat movement r epr esent s - - i f you f ol l ow t he
18
cur ser - - i f t he movement r epr esent s a ver t i cal
19
set t l ement of t he soi l or over t he edges, a l at er al
20
movement of t he edge, bot h of t hose t hi ngs cr eat e an
21
i nst abi l i t y i n t he st r uct ur e t hat cause t ensi on i n
22
concr et e, t hen cr eat e t hese vul ner abi l i t i es,
126
1
ul t i mat el y, i n t hi s unr ei nf or ced concr et e st r uct ur e
2
t hat can l ead t o a cat ast r ophi c col l apse.
3
The ot her t hi ng I want ed t o ment i on i s t he
4
bl essi ng and t he cur se of t hi s bui l di ng, t hi s
5
st r uct ur e r at her , i s t hat i t was bui l t of
6
unr ei nf or ced concr et e. I t was a moi st ur e r i ch
7
envi r onment . They knew t hat i f t hey r ei nf or ced t hi s,
8
t hat we woul dn' t see t hi s st r uct ur e t oday, we woul d
9
have had t o t ear i t down 50 year s ago. The st eel
10
r ei nf or cement i n t hat ki nd of const ant exposur e t o
11
moi st ur e woul d have caused r ust . The r ust woul d have
12
what we cal l bl oomed, i t woul d have expl oded and i t
13
woul d have been a subj ect of demol i t i on and no l onger
14
her e.
15
So t her e i s no r ei nf or cement i n t hi s
16
st r uct ur e. I n f act , some of t he r epai r s t hat wer e
17
done back i n t he ' 40s wer e done wi t h st eel and you go
18
i n t oday and t hey' ve expl oded.
19
So t he ot her sor t of subt l et y t hat I need
20
t o r ai se, i t ' s a ser i ous consi der at i on, because we
21
have t hese l ar ge masses of concr et e t hat have been
22
subj ect t o - - t hat have been wet , basi cal l y, si nce
127
1
t he day t hey wer e bui l t and we' r e t al ki ng about
2
pot ent i al l y usi ng t hemas i nhabi t ed space. We need
3
t o dr y t hemout .
4
And so vol ume changes occur when you change
5
t he moi st ur e of concr et e and especi al l y when i t ' s a
6
l ar ge mass of concr et e of t hi s magni t ude. That ' s a
7
ser i ous consi der at i on as we move f or war d.
8
One l ast bi t . Unr ei nf or ced concr et e i s not
9
per mi t t ed by code t oday, we don' t do i t . The onl y
10
pl ace t hat we use unr ei nf or ced concr et e i s bet ween,
11
you know, t he bot t omof our f oot i ng and soi l and i t ' s
12
f or t he r easons I j ust descr i bed.
13
When we put r ei nf or ci ng i n bui l di ngs, i t ' s
14
t o acknowl edge t hat t her e wi l l be a cr ack and when
15
t hat cr ack opens up, i t ' s car r i ed by t he st eel of t he
16
st r uct ur e. And bef or e some sor t of a col l apse
17
happens, t her e' s l ar ge def or mat i ons, t her e' s t i me,
18
t her e ar e t hi ngs t hat al l ow us t o get out of t he
19
st r uct ur e bef or e i t becomes unsaf e.
20
So I want ever ybody t o be awar e t hat t hi s
21
cl ass of st r uct ur e i s subj ect t o cat ast r ophi c
22
f ai l ur es. I n f act , you' l l see out at t he si t e, t hi s
128
1
has happened.
2
The ot her t hi ng t hat happens i s t hat i n
3
t hese unr ei nf or ced cei l i ngs, when somet hi ng st ar t s t o
4
spal l of f , t her e' s no r ei nf or cement t her e t o hol d i t
5
i n pl ace. So l ar ge chunks of concr et e can be
6
pr eci pi t at ed by movement and can cr eat e a f al l i ng
7
hazar d i nt er i or t o t he st r uct ur e. So unr ei nf or ced
8
concr et e i s ver y, ver y vul ner abl e t o l oadi ng and
9
set t l ement pr obl ems.
10
So we st ar t ed our wor k t o i dent i f y t he
11
exi st i ng condi t i ons. Ther e was a r epor t done whi ch
12
we r ef er t o as CCJ M, J ohnson and Mal hor t a, i n 2000, a
13
ver y good r epor t . Unf or t unat el y, i t was a dr af t
14
r epor t and never i ssued i n f i nal f or m.
15
But t hey per f or med a condi t i on assessment ,
16
t hey r epor t ed on pr i or assessment s t hat had been done
17
i n 1944, i n 1967, bot h of whi ch wher e t hey not ed
18
ext ensi ve cr acki ng and some col l apse. They per f or med
19
a st r uct ur al anal ysi s and devel oped sever al
20
al t er nat i ves, bot h f or pr eser vat i on, as wel l as
21
ver t i cal addi t i ons, and t hey l i st ed a one- and a
22
f our - st or y addi t i on.
129
1
They al so i dent i f i ed t he cost of t hese
2
scenar i os i n 2000 dol l ar s and i n t he year 2000, i t
3
was somewher e bet ween t wo and ar ound $3 mi l l i on a
4
cel l , j ust t o pr eser ve t he cel l s, i n t hei r opi ni on,
5
so t he 40 t o $56 mi l l i on mi ni mumpr eser vat i on
6
pr oj ect .
7
I n 2012, we i ssued a r epor t t hat was r eal l y
8
an updat e of t hei r r epor t . What we f ound i n t he
9
r evi ew of t hei r r epor t i s t hat t hey di dn' t compl et e
10
t he wor k and one of t he t hi ngs t hey wer e mi ssi ng was
11
r eal l y an anal ysi s of t he i mpact of t he soi l s on t he
12
si t e.
13
We knew t hat t he soi l s wer e a pr obl em, so
14
we got mor e i nf or mat i on and st ar t ed t o addr ess what
15
i mpact t he st r engt h of t he soi l s had and what i mpact
16
t he set t l ement of t hose soi l s had on t hese uni que
17
st r uct ur es.
18
We al so updat ed t he condi t i on assessment
19
and per f or med f ur t her anal ysi s and t hen al so r evi sed
20
t hese var i ous al t er nat i ves and we' r e goi ng t o t al k
21
mor e about t hat . But i n essence, t hi s set t he st age
22
f or t he di scussi on of t he r euse opt i on.
130
1
So we l ooked at pot ent i al l y onl y r eusi ng
2
t he t opsi de, what does i t t ake t o al l ow peopl e t o use
3
t hi s as a par k. We l ooked at pot ent i al r equi r ement s
4
f or usi ng t he i nt er i or as an occupi ed space and we
5
l ooked at oppor t uni t i es f or over bui l d.
6
And t he one t hi ng I want t o poi nt out i s
7
t hat we di d f i nd t hat t he CCJ M r epor t , because i t
8
wasn' t compl et e, had over est i mat ed t he amount of
9
ver t i cal expansi on t hat coul d be put on t hi s bui l di ng
10
and we r evi sed t hat , we r educed t hat t o a t wo- t o
11
t hr eest or y l i ght f r ame const r uct i on, as opposed t o a
12
f our - st or y of f i ce t ype const r uct i on.
13
We' ve al r eady seen t he exi st i ng condi t i on
14
l ayout .
15
Somet hi ng el se t hat Emi l y had al l uded t o
16
and I want t o get t o mor e speci f i cs i s we di d know
17
t her e was a si gni f i cant r egr adi ng on t he si t e,
18
st ar t i ng I t hi nk r i ght af t er t he Ci vi l War . But t hi s
19
r ed l i ne r epr esent s t he di vi si on bet ween what was
20
bel ow t hat r equi r ed el evat i on and what was above.
21
Ther e was sor t of a peak al ong her e and a val l ey her e
22
and t hi s i s t he ol d Ti ber Cr eek under neat h t he si t e.
131
1
So t hi s mat er i al was cut , t hi s mat er i al was bui l t ,
2
we di d know t hat .
3
Then bot h t he CCJ M r epor t and our r epor t
4
r epor t ed degr ees of damage t o t hese concr et e cel l s,
5
t he r ed bei ng t he wor st , wher e we' ve act ual l y had
6
col l apses, r angi ng al l t he way back t o mi nor .
7
And you can see, i f you t oggl e back and
8
f or t h, t he sor t of di r ect cor r el at i on bet ween t he
9
f i l l mat er i al on t he si t e and t he col l apses,
10
speci f i cal l y, and t he damage, so i t ' s t el l i ng us a
11
l ot of what we know. But t he i mpact on t he st r uct ur e
12
was t hat t her e was si gni f i cant set t l ement , i t was
13
ongoi ng si nce ' 67 or bef or e, i t cont i nues t oday.
14
And t he ot her t hi ngs ver y i mpor t ant her e i s
15
t hat t hat expl ai ns t hi s r ed and or ange swat h. I t
16
doesn' t expl ai n t he yel l ow. What ' s happeni ng i n
17
t hese yel l ow zones i s t hat when conf i nement i s
18
of f er ed by a l ar ge r et ai ni ng wal l al ong i t s edge and
19
a ber mof soi l , t hat t ends t o move l at er al l y and t hat
20
l at er al movement al so compr omi ses t he cel l s. That ' s
21
a ver y i mpor t ant poi nt because t hese ar eas wer e shown
22
t o be compr omi sed.
132
1
I n any scenar i o, i f you l ook at t hi s
2
di agr am, al l t hr ee of t he st r uct ur es, t hi s bei ng one,
3
t wo, t hr ee, have been compr omi sed over t i me. I n any
4
scenar i o wher e we subdi vi de and save some of t hese
5
cel l s and not t he whol e st r uct ur e, we' r e goi ng t o be
6
cr eat i ng an edge zone. So even t hough i t hasn' t
7
necessar i l y been compr omi sed - -
8
So f or exampl e, t her e was a l ot of
9
exci t ement about t hese t hr ee cel l s. Those cel l s ar e
10
uncompr omi sed t oday, but i t ' s such a sensi t i ve
11
st r uct ur e t hat anyt hi ng t hat we woul d do i s goi ng t o
12
compr omi se t hose t o some degr ee l at er .
13
I t hi nk ever ybody has t he pi ct ur e, but I
14
want t o show you di r ect l y i f you haven' t seen t hi s.
15
The saf et y i ssues ar e ver y obvi ous when you get out
16
t o si t e. Ther e ar e gapi ng hol es al ong Nor t h Capi t ol
17
St r eet on t he hi gh si de of t he ber m. So we' ve got
18
i ni t i al l y, cr acki ng of concr et e r i ght at t he apex of
19
t hese vaul t s. Then we st ar t t o see t hese hi nges and
20
t hese hi nges happen al l t hr oughout t he st r uct ur e i n
21
many of t he vaul t s.
22
And t hen ul t i mat el y, i f you wat ch my l i t t l e
133
1
Fr ed Fl i nt st one di agr am, t hi s r eaches a cer t ai n poi nt
2
wher e ei t her t he set t l ement l at er al l y or ver t i cal l y
3
i s such t hat i t j ust r eaches an i nst abi l i t y. And
4
t hat does happen cat ast r ophi cal l y.
5
And whi l e i t l ooks ki nd of t r i t e on my
6
di agr am, t hi s i s t ons of soi l , t hi s i s a huge mass of
7
mat er i al t hat comes down i n t he mi ddl e of t hi s. We
8
see peopl e wal ki ng out t her e, occasi onal l y, and I
9
war n t hem, I j ust say t hi s i s not a good i dea. Thi s
10
i s a ver y danger ous si t uat i on.
11
You know, i t ' s qui t e st r i ki ng and beaut i f ul
12
f r omt he i nsi de. Once you open t hese up, t hey l ook
13
qui t e compel l i ng, but t hi s i s a ver y danger ous
14
si t uat i on f r omt he i nsi de. And get t i ng nat ur al l i ght
15
i nt o t hese cel l s i s not possi bl e.
16
So t he f i r st t hi ng t hat I want t o emphasi ze
17
i s - - I ' ml ooki ng now at Const r ai nt s and
18
Oppor t uni t i es - - t hese cel l s cannot be used as i s,
19
you can' t j ust t ake down t he f ence and st ar t usi ng i t
20
as a par k. I t ' s gr eat , sounds wonder f ul ; i t cannot
21
be done, i t ' s an unsaf e condi t i on as i s. We' ve
22
devel oped scenar i os t o f i x i t and we' l l t al k about
134
1
t hat .
2
The ot her t hi ng you need t o know, as I j ust
3
ment i oned, i s i f we do any wor k di r ect l y adj acent t o
4
a cel l , we need t o al so t ake speci al measur es and
5
st abi l i ze t hat cel l . These ar e phot ogr aphs of t he
6
wor k t hat D. C. Wat er has been doi ng i n t hei r cur r ent
7
oper at i on. Thi s i s at t he por t al , wher e t hey had t o
8
have - - t hey t ook ext ensi ve measur es t o st abi l i ze t he
9
por t al as t he excavat i on and demol i t i on occur r ed
10
behi nd i t and t hese ar e i n adj acent cel l s t o t hei r
11
demol i t i on.
12
So t he l ast t hi ng I ' d l i ke t o go t hr ough i s
13
speci f i cal l y what we i nvest i gat ed. Thr ee gener i c
14
si t uat i ons wher e we used t he t opsi de, wher e we used
15
t he i nt er i or and accompani ed wi t h some t opsi de use,
16
and t hen t he t hi r d, an over - bui l d scenar i o, wher e you
17
ei t her use t he i nt er i or down bel ow or you don' t .
18
On t he t opsi de l oadi ng, i n t heor y, we don' t
19
have t o wat er pr oof t hi s, r i ght ? So i t woul d r equi r e
20
compl et e r emoval of al l t hi s soi l , r epl aci ng i t wi t h
21
a new sl ab t hat t i es t he st r uct ur e t oget her , t hat
22
pr ovi des us a new engi neer ed sur f ace on whi ch we can
135
1
put l i ght vehi cul ar t r af f i c and peopl e, put soi l
2
back, r eoccupy i t .
3
Unf or t unat el y, t hat added wei ght al so
4
r equi r es us t o r ei nf or ce t he exi st i ng f oundat i ons.
5
Thi s coul d be done pr obabl y wi t hi n t he dept h of t he
6
sand t hat ' s t her e, so t hat t he i nt er i or woul d appear
7
as i t does t oday. And t hen we' d have t o mai nt ai n
8
access t o t hi s f or i nspect i on, but t hat woul d be i t .
9
The r eal chal l enge her e i s t he i nt er i or
10
char act er i s mai nt ai ned, but i t ' s r eal l y i naccessi bl e
11
f or occupancy, t her e' s r eal l y no chance of usi ng
12
t hi s, onl y maybe access f or i nspect i on.
13
I t r equi r es, as I ment i oned, ver y car ef ul
14
cont r ol of any adj acent const r uct i on, i t r equi r es
15
cont r ol of vehi cl es and const r uct i on act i vi t y on t he
16
t op. And t hat was t he scenar i o t hat had been l ar gel y
17
pr i ced, at 2, 000 dol l ar s, t wo t o $3 mi l l i on a cel l .
18
I nt er i or use, al l t he t opsi de r equi r ement s
19
I j ust ment i oned. Now we have t o put i n new
20
dr ai nage, get t he wat er of f and wat er pr oof t he
21
st r uct ur e.
22
I t ' s al so goi ng t o r equi r e i nt er i or
136
1
r epai r s, a l ot of t he cr acki ng i nvol ved mapped out ,
2
we know wher e we need t o go. I t al so r equi r es
3
r egul ar moni t or i ng and mai nt enance and t hi s i s
4
somet hi ng I need t o emphasi ze, because we' r e dr yi ng
5
t hemout , because we' r e not el i mi nat i ng al l of t he
6
set t l ement of t he soi l s.
7
Whoever t he user of t hi s space i s i s goi ng
8
t o have t o al l ow us t o cont i nue t o see t he under si de
9
of t hat st r uct ur e, so t hat cr acks don' t st ar t t o
10
pr eci pi t at e and l ar ge f r agment s of concr et e don' t
11
come down. So i t ' s a speci al i zed use. I cal l i t not
12
a convent i onal 50- year desi gn l i f e sol ut i on, but i t ' s
13
somet hi ng t hat coul d be done i n t heor y.
14
Chal l enges I t al ked about , t he cr acki ng,
15
t he vi si bi l i t y on t he under si de. But t he f oundat i ons
16
now, t he f oundat i on r ei nf or cement becomes a bi gger
17
pr obl embecause you r eal l y don' t have t he cei l i ng
18
hei ght i n t he maj or i t y of t hese cel l s t hat you need.
19
Removi ng t he sand woul d be a ver y good i dea, but now
20
t hese r ei nf or ced f oot i ngs st ar t t o get i n t he way.
21
Ther e ar e l ot s of ot her nonst r uct ur e consi der at i ons
22
whi ch I ' l l go t hr ough i n a mi nut e.
137
1
Last l y, t he over - bui l d. The pr i or r epor t
2
had sai d r ei nf or ce t hese f oot i ngs, ever y ot her or
3
ever y t hi r d f oot i ng and j ust put new l oad on t op of
4
i t , make a huge pi er her e and put a new bui l di ng on
5
t op of i t .
6
We absol ut el y di sagr ee wi t h t hat appr oach
7
and I t hi nk t hat t hey woul d, as wel l . But what we
8
f ound i s t hat i f you t ake ever y ot her one of t hese
9
col umns and subj ect i t t o t he set t l ement t hat t hat
10
new l oad woul d i mpose, t hi s ent i r e st r uct ur e woul d
11
be, i n essence, demol i shed. The di st r ess i n t hi s
12
unr ei nf or ced concr et e woul d be unaccept abl e, we' d be
13
t hr owi ng t he baby out wi t h t he bat h wat er , i t ' s not a
14
good si t uat i on.
15
We devel oped an al t er nat i ve appr oach, whi ch
16
f r oma pur el y st r uct ur al per spect i ve we t hi nk makes
17
sense. We do some l i mi t ed demol i t i on of t he exi st i ng
18
f oundat i on sl ab, we put i n some new deep pi l e
19
f oundat i on and we come i n wi t h - - and t hi s i s
20
l i t er al l y t hr ough t he manhol es, pr obabl y, but a ver y
21
sensi t i ve i sol at i on of a new st r uct ur e.
22
The pr obl emi s t hi s can onl y accommodat e a
138
1
t wo- t o t hr eest or y, as I sai d, l i ght f r ame
2
const r uct i on. And whi l e, you know, i t may be an
3
at t r act i ve appr oach t o me, put t i ng a new col umn i n
4
t he mi ddl e of a 14- f oot bay i s not a ver y at t r act i ve
5
sol ut i on f or many ot her s.
6
So I j ust want ed t o say we' ve i nvest i gat ed
7
al l t hr ee of t hese, our t eamhas had t hi s
8
i nf or mat i on.
9
I ' mnot goi ng t o go t hr ough t hese, but t he
10
nonst r uct ur al chal l enges wi t h usi ng t hi s space t hat
11
i s l ef t over , once we do al l our wor k, ar e ver y
12
si gni f i cant because of t he cei l i ng hei ght s, t he bay
13
si ze, si ght l i nes, t r yi ng t o get mechani cal and
14
ut i l i t i es, t hat i nt o t hi s ver y conf i ned space. And
15
t hen al so, you know, we need t o connect t hi s f or
16
egr ess; t her e' s onl y one means i nt o t hi s r i ght now.
17
We have r ampi ng, ADA, al l sor t s of t hi ngs.
18
And t hen, you know, you l ook at t hi s and I
19
do l ove t he st r uct ur e, but t her e' s 4, 000 of t hese,
20
and wi t h al l t he l i mi t at i ons her e, t he r eal quest i on
21
i s how much of t hi s can we absor b.
22
J ust i n summar y, and I apol ogi ze f or t aki ng
139
1
so much t i me, we' ve l ooked at t hese al t er nat i ves,
2
t hey' r e cover ed i n gr eat det ai l i n our r epor t . I n
3
our opi ni on, t he pr oposed sol ut i on bal ances
4
pr eser vat i on and adapt i ve r euse of a number of t hese
5
under gr ound cel l s, wi t h si gni f i cant pr eser vat i on of
6
t he above- gr ade st r uct ur es, wi t h t he devel opment of
7
t he si t e. And i t seems l i ke a ver y r easonabl e and
8
appr opr i at e sol ut i on.
9
10
MS. BROWN: I j ust have one qui ck quest i on.
11
BY MS. BROWN:
12
Q You mentioned that it was over ten acres.
13
The actual area of the site is 25 acres.
14
A Oh, I ' msor r y. Each of t he cel l s i s one
15
acr e, t her e ar e 20 of t hose cel l s, and t hen t he
16
r emai nder of t he si t e f i l l s out at 25 acr es. My
17
apol ogi es, t hanks f or t he cor r ect i on.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, Ms. Fer st er ?
19
MS. FERSTER: Yes, t hank you.
20
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
21
BY MS. FERSTER:
22
Q So I'm holding your report dated April
140
1
10th, 2014, the Existing Conditions and Assessment of
2
Feasibility Evaluation, and I have a couple of
3
questions about your presentation.
4
A Sur e.
5
Q One question is whether or not everything
6
in your presentation that you have summarized here
7
today is expanded, the detail is in this particular
8
report, or is there additional items?
9
A I bel i eve t he onl y addi t i onal i t ems t hat
10
we' ve i ncl uded wer e i n r esponse t o t est i mony, pr i or
11
t est i mony.
12
Q And what were those additional items that
13
are not summarized in your report?
14
A Ther e was a l ot of f ocus by you on t he CCJ M
15
r epor t .
16
Q So going particularly to your discussion of
17
the three reuse options that you laid out here, the
18
sort of park, the interior and the overbuild, are
19
those, that discussion of those reuse options
20
described in more detail in this report?
21
A Yes.
22
Q And can you direct me to which pages of
141
1
that report?
2
A I t ' s under t he Feasi bi l i t y St udy sect i on,
3
Pages 41 t hr ough 44.
4
Q Okay, and in particular, you provided some
5
cost estimates for the costs of some of these various
6
reuse --
7
A No, t hat ' s not t r ue.
8
Q -- scenarios in that report?
9
A No, we di d not pr ovi de any cost est i mat es.
10
Q No, in your presentation, I wrote down you
11
said 2,000 to $2 million per cell cost and other
12
costs that you mentioned here. Are they set forth in
13
this report?
14
A No, I bel i eve I made i t cl ear t hat t hose
15
came f r omt he CCJ M r epor t of 2000.
16
Q Okay, so none of those costs are in your
17
report.
18
A Cor r ect .
19
Q And how about the part of your testimony
20
where you talked about the fact that you disagreed
21
with the CCJM report about the overbuild allowing
22
four stories and that you think the overbuild, only
142
1
one to two stories. Can you direct me to where in
2
your report that's discussed, one to two stories?
3
A Wel l , t her e was cl ar i f i cat i on pr ovi ded,
4
based on t he r ecent t est i mony.
5
Q Okay, so it's not in your report.
6
A Our r epor t i dent i f i es a t wo- t o t hr eest or y
7
ver t i cal expansi on and - -
8
Q Excuse me.
9
A Our r epor t i dent i f i es a t wo- t o t hr eest or y
10
l i ght f r ame ver t i cal expansi on.
11
Q And where is that, please?
12
A I don' t know, of f t he t op of my head, but I
13
wi l l get t hat page number and so f or t h f or you.
14
Q Okay, and so this later elaboration where
15
you now think that the overbuild could only allow one
16
to two stories, is there a separate analysis that
17
you --
18
A I don' t bel i eve I sai d t hat .
19
Q I'm sorry, maybe we should go back to your
20
frame, then, on the overbuild.
21
A Two- t o t hr eest or y l i ght f r ame.
22
Q Two to three stories, okay. I don't think
143
1
it's funny, but thank you for helping me out. So if
2
you could, the overbuild is on Page 43, Option 6, is
3
that the overbuild interior program? So was this the
4
paragraph or the place in your report where you
5
discuss the two- to three-story overbuild?
6
A I ' mgoi ng t o have t o r evi ew t he r epor t t o
7
f i gur e out exact l y wher e we say t wo t o t hr ee st or i es,
8
but I i magi ne i t ' s her e. Do you want me t o do t hi s
9
now or woul d you l i ke me t o get back t o you?
10
J UDGE BYRNE: What ' s t he - -
11
12
Q I mean it's really only one page, but if
13
you would like to do it later, that's fine, you can
14
come back.
15
A I woul d pr ef er t o do t hat .
16
Q Okay, so are you involved in the
17
preservation of Cell 28, the structural work on that
18
cell?
19
A Ther e hasn' t been any wor k done on t hat
20
yet , but I hope t o be.
21
Q So this is not within the scope of your
22
work as yet.
144
1
A No.
2
Q And are you prepared to provide the
3
Malhorta report into the record at this proceeding,
4
since it was the basis of some of your analysis?
5
A I bel i eve i t ' s par t of t he r ecor d and has
6
been f or year s.
7
MS. BROWN: I don' t know t hat i t ' s par t of
8
t hi s r ecor d and t he Opponent s ar e wel come t o submi t
9
i t , as wel l .
10
THE WI TNESS: The r equest was made by t hi s
11
i ndi vi dual pr i or , so I i magi ne you have i t .
12
MS. BROWN: I t was at t he Zoni ng
13
Commi ssi on.
14
THE WI TNESS: Okay.
15
MS. BROWN: I ' msor r y, I ' mspeaki ng out of
16
t ur n.
17
MS. FERSTER: But you don' t pl an t o submi t
18
i t i nt o t he r ecor d as par t of t he Appl i cant s' case.
19
MS. BROWN: Not at t hi s t i me.
20
THE WI TNESS: I def er .
21
MS. FERSTER: Okay, t hat ' s al l I have f or
22
now.
145
1
MS. MERRI TT: I have j ust a coupl e of
2
quest i ons.
3
4
Q Would it be possible to go Slides 12 and
5
13? So Cell 28, I believe, is the cell that's been
6
chosen for renovation, that's the bottom row, second
7
from the right corner. And then on the next slide,
8
13, it shows that it's in a severe damaged condition.
9
A Mm- hmm.
10
Q Do you have any knowledge about why a
11
severely damaged cell was the one chosen for
12
preservation, as opposed to one that's in better
13
condition?
14
A I know t hat i t was a bal ance bet ween ot her
15
pr eser vat i on f ocused agenda on t he si t e. Ther e was a
16
gr eat i nt er est i n t he ber mand i n t he pr eser vat i on of
17
t he si t e l i nes, whi ch we' ve j ust di scussed, and so
18
t her e was an i nt er est on t he par t of t he t eamt o say,
19
" Can t hat be pr eser ved, " and t he answer was, " Yes. "
20
I t pr obabl y r epr esent s mor e money and mor e
21
i nvest i gat i on, but t hat was t he answer .
22
Q Do you have a cost estimate of what the
146
1
preservation of that cell would involve?
2
A No, I do not .
3
Q Could you put up Slide 21? This is the
4
overbuild slide. Is it your understanding that this
5
is the concept that's being proposed for Cell 28, the
6
overbuild concept, or is it a different concept?
7
A No, t hi s wor k was done some t i me ago and
8
t hi s was i ni t i al f easi bi l i t y st udi es t o see what
9
coul d be done at t he si t e. So t hi s was pr ovi ded t o
10
t he t eamt o see what t hey coul d - - i t ' s a pal et t e of
11
opt i ons. And I do not bel i eve t her e' s any over bui l d
12
pl an f or Cel l 28 t hat ' s goi ng t o be par t of t he
13
pl i nt h.
14
Q Okay, I guess I stepped over a step in the
15
logic. The location of the community center, is it
16
your understanding that that's going to overlap with
17
Cell 28, or do you know?
18
A No, I bel i eve t hat ' s t he adj acent cel l .
19
Q One more question about Slide 21, though.
20
So in the overbuild scenario, it doesn't say anything
21
about whether or not any access to the underground
22
would be allowed, other than for inspectors.
147
1
A Yes.
2
Q And what was your --
3
A Ther e ar e many per mut at i ons of t hese, so I
4
t r i ed t o addr ess t hemi n i sol at i on. But yes, I di d
5
ment i on r at her qui ckl y, I ' l l admi t , t hat t hi s coul d
6
be done ei t her wi t h or wi t hout access t o t he
7
under gr ound. I f we needed access t o t he under gr ound,
8
t hen al l of t he const r ai nt s, al l t he r equi r ement s and
9
t he chal l enges of t he f i r st sl i de woul d appl y, as
10
wel l .
11
Q The first slide to --
12
A I ' msor r y, t he f i r st opt i on.
13
Q -- topside loading or --
14
A I nt er i or use.
15
Q Could you go back to 12 and 13 with a map
16
of the different cells?
17
MS. MERRI TT: I s t her e anot her wi t ness,
18
coul d I ask, who' s goi ng t o speak t o t he l ocat i on of
19
t he communi t y cent er ?
20
MS. BROWN: Yes.
21
MS. MERRI TT: Okay, I don' t have any ot her
22
quest i ons.
148
1
MS. BROWN: You had quest i ons, r i ght ?
2
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk I have one. J ust t o
3
go back t o t he CCJ M st udy and t he cost est i mat es or
4
t he pr i ces t hat wer e t her e, and t hat was j ust f or , as
5
I under st and i t , t he st abi l i zat i on of t he cel l s - -
6
THE WI TNESS: Uh- huh.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: - - f or peopl e t o be abl e t o
8
j ust t r aver se acr oss t he t op.
9
10
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s cor r ect , not hi ng t o do
11
wi t h cost of addi ng any ki nd of over bui l d or access.
12
THE WI TNESS: Two answer s. So t hey di d
13
have opt i ons f or i ncr easi ng or r ei nf or ci ng so t hat
14
t he bui l di ng became a f oundat i on f or t he over bui l d,
15
so wi t hi n t he r ange of t wo, i t went f r omt wo t o sor t
16
of t hr ee mi l l i on per cel l .
17
J UDGE BYRNE: I see.
18
THE WI TNESS: We di sagr ee wi t h t hat
19
appr oach, f undament al l y.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Fundament al l y, about - -
21
THE WI TNESS: The cel l .
22
J UDGE BYRNE: - - t he physi cal possi bi l i t y
149
1
of usi ng t he cel l s as t he f oundat i on f or bui l di ng.
2
3
J UDGE BYRNE: I t ' s r eal l y not a quest i on of
4
i ncr eased cost i n your mi nd, i t ' s j ust t he physi cal
5
f easi bi l i t y of you doi ng t hat .
6
THE WI TNESS: Exact l y.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you, t hat ' s al l I have.
8
MS. BROWN: I r eal i ze i t ' s al most 12: 30. I
9
don' t know i f i t ' s appr opr i at e t o r ecal l Emi l y Ei g at
10
t hi s poi nt t o now - -
11
J UDGE BYRNE: Sur e, l et ' s do t hat , because
12
you sai d you want ed her t o comment on t he st r uct ur al .
13
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk t hat woul d be a good
14
br eaki ng poi nt .
15
J UDGE BYRNE: Let ' s do t hat and t hen we' l l
16
t ake a br eak f or l unch.
17
Wher eupon,
18
EMI LY HOTALI NG EI G
19
was exami ned and t est i f i ed as f ol l ows:
20
21
BY MS. BROWN:
22
Q Ms. Eig, you've have a chance to look at
150
1
the structural elements, the structural report from
2
Mr. Mettam. In your opinion, can you achieve
3
preservation more than what we're doing on this site?
4
A Pr eser vat i on?
5
Q Yes. Of the options that he showed, is
6
there any way to use, preserve the cells -- in his
7
first option, he was preserving the cells.
8
A To t he Secr et ar y of I nt er i or st andar ds,
9
whi ch woul d be r equi r ed - -
10
Q Right.
11
A - - by t he deed i f we wer e pr eser vi ng t hem?
12
Q If you preserve them that way, would you be
13
having a project of special merit? Would you be able
14
to use this site?
15
A I don' t t hi nk you can be abl e t o use t hi s
16
si t e. The l evel of damage t hat t he cel l s have was
17
not t aken i nt o account i n anyt hi ng t hat was
18
di scussed, i t was j ust a r aw cel l , okay, f i r st .
19
And t he i nt er vent i ons t hat I ' ve seen, l i ke,
20
D. C. Wat er wer e so sever e when t hey wer e act ual l y
21
t r yi ng t o save t hi ngs and t hey wer e j ust cr acki ng
22
t hem- - we saw t her e' s an i mage of t hat I t hi nk i n
151
1
t he sl i des, so I t hi nk i t woul d be ver y di f f i cul t t o
2
because t he - - I ' mnot sur e I under st and your
3
quest i on. Pl ease, so I can make sur e I under st and.
4
Q Let me ask a different question. Was there
5
a plan at one time to put the park in the center of
6
the site?
7
A Yes, t her e was.
8
Q And that would have been in the location of
9
the cells that have the least amount of damage --
10
A Ri ght .
11
Q -- is that correct?
12
A Cor r ect .
13
Q And yet, that alternative was not pursued.
14
A Ri ght .
15
Q Why not?
16
A The pl acement of t he par k i n t he cent er ,
17
wel l , i t f i r st seemed l i ke a good i dea when i t was
18
bei ng br ought f or war d. But t he mor e t hat i t was
19
di scussed, i t seemed t hat i t di d not - - i t wasn' t
20
opt i mumi n t er ms of t r yi ng t o pr eser ve. And bel ow
21
gr ound, maybe i t was bet t er , but above gr ound, i t was
22
not bet t er , because t he sense of t he openness of t he
152
1
space was gone.
2
The cur r ent pl an al l ows t hat openness of
3
t hat sout her n t hi r d t o keep a sense of pl ace t hat i s
4
so st r ong f or t he si t e.
5
And al so, by havi ng t he openness i n t he
6
mi ddl e, you di dn' t get t he benef i t of t he ber m, t he
7
exper i ence of t he ber mbei ng hi gh at t he sout her n end
8
and l ow at t he nor t her n end. Ther e was j ust t hat
9
sor t of equi l i br i umt her e, whi ch act ual l y wor ked
10
agai nst an under st andi ng of what had happened on t hi s
11
si t e, so t hat i t was cr amped and i t di dn' t have an
12
openness t hat i s al l owed by t he sout her n sect i on
13
bei ng pr eser ved.
14
Q If you were to try to preserve more cells,
15
would we be achieving the project of special merit
16
proposed today?
17
A Wel l , we' ve t al ked about pr eser vi ng mor e
18
cel l s. The pr obl emwi t h pr eser vi ng mor e cel l s i s
19
t hat ei t her i t has a physi cal i mpact or a f i nanci al
20
i mpact t hat i s so gr eat on t he pr oj ect . I t hi nk
21
usi ng t he CCJ M number s f r om2000, t he t wo t o $2. 8
22
mi l l i on was j ust t o st abi l i ze so you coul d wal k on
153
1
t op of i t . And i t di dn' t t ake i nt o account any ki nd
2
of damage t hat was wi t hi n t he cel l s, i t was j ust t he
3
r aw cel l s t hat t hey pr oposed.
4
I don' t t hi nk t hat you coul d - - you
5
coul dn' t access i t . You don' t get anyt hi ng mor e t han
6
you get r i ght now. I mean i t ' s l i ke you have a
7
si t uat i on wher e we ar e goi ng t o have a par k t hat
8
peopl e can act ual l y wal k on, t hey wi l l be abl e t o see
9
i nt o some cel l s, wi t h a l ot of r emedi at i on on our
10
par t , t hey wi l l see and under st and i t . But i f we
11
wer e pr eser vi ng mor e cel l s, t he i mpact woul d be
12
al most l i ke no di f f er ent , i t doesn' t r eal l y gai n us
13
anyt hi ng, i f t hat makes sense.
14
Q And to reinforce it with another column
15
going down through the manholes and the reinforce
16
that it would take, is the integrity of the structure
17
compromised?
18
A Yes.
19
Q And is that good preservation?
20
A No.
21
MS. BROWN: Thank you.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Ms. Fer st er ?
154
1
MS. FERSTER: Yes.
2
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
3
BY MS. FERSTER:
4
Q In terms of the last question that Ms.
5
Brown asked you about whether reinforcement was good
6
preservation, isn't it correct that demolition of the
7
cells is probably worse preservation than the
8
reinforcement of the cells?
9
A I don' t t hi nk t hat you can compar e t hem
10
t hat way, because i t ' s - - do you t hi nk i t ' s bet t er t o
11
r econst r uct a bui l di ng t hat i s l ost , i s t hat
12
pr eser vat i on? No, i t ' s a new const r uct i on.
13
Q Well, let me ask you --
14
A You woul dn' t have any abi l i t y t o go i nt o
15
t hese cel l s wi t h t hat const r uct i on. I t hi nk as Ki r k
16
expl ai ned, we have a si t uat i on t hat we have t o l ayer
17
on t hese di f f er ent appr oaches i n or der t o get what
18
you' r e t al ki ng about .
19
Q Mm-hmm.
20
A So you woul d be doi ng t he over bui l d wi t h
21
t he col umns, t hese col umns ever y seven f eet , ever y
22
seven f eet - -
155
1
Q Mm-hmm.
2
A - - and t hat you coul dn' t go i n t hat space.
3
Q Okay. Wholly apart from that issue, okay,
4
so I'm looking at your report, Appendix K, which is
5
the Secretary of Interior's standards that outlines
6
four treatments, approaches, and the four are
7
preservation, rehabilitation, restoration and
8
reconstruction.
9
And isn't it correct that a reconstruction
10
means all the elements, you know, contributing
11
elements of the structure are gone and you
12
reconstruct it?
13
A Yes, i t ' s mi ssi ng, t hi s woul d be - - yes.
14
Q Right. So if you retained many of the
15
elements, that you reinforced the vaults so that you
16
were not wholly demolishing that, wouldn't that be
17
more like a restoration?
18
A No.
19
Q Okay, what would that be?
20
A You' d be encapsul at i ng, essent i al l y, t he
21
cel l s and you woul d be pr eser vi ng t hemi n pl ace, but
22
t hey woul d not be vi si bl e, t hey coul d not be accessed
156
1
and t hey woul d cost t r emendous amount s of money.
2
Q Okay, so that would be a preservation
3
option, then, a preservation in place.
4
A That pr eser vat i on opt i on, t he pr eser vat i on
5
of - -
6
Q Well, bad in the sense it would be costly
7
and inaccessible, but it would still be a
8
preservation option.
9
A Dependi ng on how f ar i t went . I f you wer e
10
compl et el y encapsul at i ng damaged mat er i al s, because
11
you' r e not r epai r i ng mat er i al s f i r st , you ar e
12
essent i al l y cr eat i ng t hi s - - I ' mt r yi ng t o t hi nk of
13
an equi val ent t hi ng. Ther e' s not hi ng gai ned by i t ,
14
t her e' s not hi ng gai ned by i t . You can' t go i nt o i t ,
15
you can' t t ouch i t , you can' t see i t , i t ' s
16
under gr ound and you don' t even know what i t ' s goi ng
17
t o l ook l i ke any mor e because each of t he - - t hat was
18
a ver y pur e si t uat i on t hat you have t her e.
19
Q Okay.
20
A I f you wor ked wi t h r eal bui l di ngs and wi t h
21
r eal concr et e, you know t hat t hey st ar t t o f al l
22
apar t . You coul d r econst r uct t hem, we coul d t ear
157
1
t hemdown and r ecr eat e t hem, not pr eser vat i on,
2
r ecr eat e. We woul d t ear t hemal l down and r ecr eat e
3
t hemt o l ook l i ke t hey l ooked by usi ng r ei nf or ced
4
concr et e and havi ng f al se appear ance, whi ch i s not
5
Secr et ar y of I nt er i or st andar ds.
6
Q Okay, so one of these cells is going to be
7
preserved so that it will be publicly accessible and
8
so there will be an historic record, is that correct?
9
A We hope t hat i s cor r ect . Do we pl an t o do
10
t hat ?
11
Q It's possible.
12
A No, no, I ' mnot sayi ng i t i s possi bl e, I
13
t ake gr eat def er ence wi t h t hat . I amver y concer ned
14
t hat i t ' s not possi bl e. I have expr essed t hi s t o t he
15
t eam, t hat I t hi nk we can do our best t o pr eser ve i t .
16
I amnot convi nced t hat i f we act ual l y t r y t o meet
17
al l t he codes t hat we have t o meet , we' r e goi ng t o be
18
abl e t o do i t . I ' mnot convi nced.
19
But I ' mnot t he code exper t , I j ust have a
20
l ot of exper i ence wi t h t hi s ki nd of st uf f , so I ' m
21
j ust t he war ner , I ' mwar ni ng now. Let ' s be car ef ul
22
what we say.
158
1
Q It is theoretically possible --
2
A I ' mnot sur e i t i s.
3
Q -- to do --
4
A I ' mnot sur e i t ' s even t heor et i cal l y
5
possi bl e, I ' mr eal l y not . That ' s how ser i ous t hi s
6
i s. And I ' msor r y, I wi sh I coul d say yes, we' r e
7
goi ng t o have a pur e and per f ect cel l her e f or us t o
8
al l l ook at .
9
But I have been i n many si t uat i ons wher e we
10
t hi nk we' r e goi ng t o be abl e t o do somet hi ng and al l
11
t he exper t s r eal l y t r y t o do i t and t hen i t doesn' t
12
happen and I amdi sappoi nt ed. And I ' mt el l i ng
13
ever yone I expect t o be di sappoi nt ed.
14
Q So you're aware that part of the benefit
15
that has been touted for this project is the
16
preservation of that cell.
17
A Tr ust me - - I t hi nk you' r e conf usi ng what
18
I ' msayi ng. Ever y ef f or t wi l l be made t o pr eser ve
19
t he cel l , but i f t he cel l cannot be pr eser ved, i t
20
can' t be pr eser ved. I mean, yes, we wi l l do out
21
best . I t ' s not goi ng t o be pr eser ved keepi ng i t t he
22
way i t i s, i t ' s goi ng t o event ual l y col l apse.
159
1
Q So assuming you do the best you can and,
2
you know, the measures that you're going to undertake
3
to reinforce the cell in order to preserve it so that
4
the public can view it are possible, but, you know,
5
is this preservation?
6
A I f we can, i n f act , do t hat , i f we can
7
pr eser ve t hat cel l and we can j ust do some mi nor
8
r epai r so we st i l l have i t s i nt egr i t y, t hat woul d be
9
gr eat , I hope t hat ' s what happens.
10
Q Okay, and if you then went into that cell
11
and you did some more reinforcement so that you could
12
do a modest overbuild, for example --
13
A No, you' ve al r eady r ei nf or ced i t so you
14
coul d go i nt o i t and t hen you' r e doi ng t he col umns
15
ever y seven f eet t o t he end of t he expanded
16
f oundat i on. You wi l l not exper i ence t he same t hi ng.
17
Q And I understand you would not experience
18
the same thing, but you know, many elements of the
19
integrity of the vault would be still present, isn't
20
that correct?
21
A Some el ement s of i nt egr i t y, but i t woul d
22
not have i t s i nt egr i t y.
160
1
Q Not the entire --
2
A I t woul d be so di mi ni shed t hat you woul d
3
have t o have someone expl ai n t o you what you' r e
4
l ooki ng at .
5
I nt egr i t y i mpl i es t hat t he r esour ce can
6
convey i t s si gni f i cance. Wi t h al l of t he r emedi al
7
wor k t hat ' s bei ng pr oposed her e, I doubt t her e ar e
8
many cel l s - - maybe t her e i s a cel l t hat can st i l l
9
have i nt egr i t y, maybe t her e ar e t hr ee or f our
10
i ndi vi dual cel l s wi t hi n t he f i l t er bed. Maybe i t ' s
11
mor e. God wi l l i ng, i t i s mor e. But we have a
12
si t uat i on - -
13
Cel l 14, whi ch was t he pl an of t hi s pr oj ect
14
f r omt he begi nni ng t o save, i s now bei ng used as a
15
wat er r et ent i on pl ant by D. C. Wat er . And t hat ' s
16
goi ng t o happen f or t en year s. Can you t el l us what
17
i t ' s goi ng t o l ook l i ke i n t en year s?
18
Q Are you asking me a question?
19
A Exact l y. You can' t . I t was a r het or i cal
20
quest i on. The poi nt i s t hese ar e st r uct ur es t hat
21
have had - - t hey wer en' t desi gned t o be habi t abl e,
22
t hey wer e desi gned t o do t hat . And when we st ar t t o
161
1
make t hemhabi t abl e, al l ki nds of t hi ngs wi l l happen.
2
Q And have you reviewed the drawings that
3
describe the structural reinforcement that would be
4
undertaken as part of, for example, one of these
5
preservation --
6
A I ' ve r ead Si l man' s r epor t ; t hi s i s t he
7
si mpl i f i cat i on of t hat r epor t .
8
Q But have you actually looked at drawings
9
that actually depict the reinforcements under those
10
scenarios?
11
A Do you mean have t her e been act ual
12
engi neer i ng dr awi ngs? No, not yet .
13
MS. FERSTER: I don' t have any mor e
14
quest i ons.
15
BY MS. MERRI TT:
16
Q I have just a couple of questions. One is
17
just to make sure I understand what you were saying
18
in answer to Andrea's questions.
19
Is it your position that whatever is done
20
to Cell Number 28, if it becomes accessible to the
21
public, would not comply with the Secretary of the
22
Interior's standards?
162
1
A No, t hat ' s not what I sai d. I sai d we
2
don' t know - - we woul d be appr oachi ng t hi s wi t h t he
3
Secr et ar y of t he I nt er i or ' s st andar ds as t he goal , as
4
we woul d appr oach ever y pr eser vat i on pr oj ect .
5
But what I was sayi ng i s t hat t hi s i s not
6
an easy pr oj ect wher e we can say, Thi s i s t he wal l
7
of a bui l di ng, we know how i t ' s bui l t , we know what
8
we can do, we' ve done i t 50 t i mes bef or e, i t ' s not a
9
pr obl em, i t ' s a no br ai ner .
10
Thi s i s goi ng t o be a di f f i cul t pr oj ect and
11
i f ever yone doesn' t under st and t hat , l et me make t hi s
12
cl ear . Thi s i s a ver y di f f i cul t pr oj ect . And t o do
13
what needs t o be done i s ver y cost l y, i t ' s goi ng t o
14
t ake a l ot of exper t i se and a l ot of car e. And each
15
t i me we go i n, we don' t know what t he condi t i on i s
16
goi ng t o be. Ever y si ngl e t i me, i t coul d be
17
di f f er ent , i t coul d be al l t he same. We don' t know
18
because i t i s a gr eat unknown.
19
No one has been t hr ough ever y si ngl e cel l
20
of t hese 25 acr es of cel l s and ever y day, t hey can be
21
changed. You saw t hat bi g hol e. One day, t hat hol e
22
wasn' t t her e and t hen t he next day, t her e i s t hi s
163
1
gi ant hol e.
2
And we don' t know, I ' mj ust t r yi ng t o be
3
r eal i st i c her e. Our goal i s t o do i t , we' r e goi ng t o
4
do our best , but no one can say, no one can say - -
5
and Ki r k, you know, wi t h Si l man, has done so many
6
ver y sophi st i cat ed pr oj ect s and he' s war ni ng
7
ever ybody when you r ead t hi s, you know, " These ar e
8
t he consequences. " He' s sayi ng wi t h t he physi cal
9
consequences and I ' msayi ng f r oma pr eser vat i on poi nt
10
of vi ew i s t hat we wi l l do our best t o make sur e we
11
can save as much as possi bl e, we wi l l do our best ,
12
but t her e' s no guar ant ee.
13
Q So is it fair to say that you don't know
14
enough now about what kinds of modifications or
15
reinforcements might be necessary to know whether the
16
Secretary's standards --
17
A We know what t he mi ni mumi s, we don' t know
18
what t he maxi mumi s.
19
Q And do you have any thoughts about whether
20
the minimum would be consistent with the Secretary of
21
the Interior standards, in your view?
22
A Sur e, yes. I f we can use t he mi ni mum, i f
164
1
we can act ual l y go i n t her e and we can f i x t hi s one
2
par t wi t hout much ef f or t , i f we know we' r e not goi ng
3
t o be wal ki ng on t hat ar ea, we know how i t ' s goi ng t o
4
be i nt egr at ed i nt o t hi s desi gn, yes.
5
But we j ust don' t know what t he condi t i on
6
i s f or each par t i cul ar pl ace and we wi l l not know
7
unt i l i t ' s act ual l y done. I f we went i n t oday, t hat
8
i sn' t good enough, i t woul d have t o be mor e act ual l y
9
pr oceedi ng.
10
Q I have two more questions. You were asked
11
a couple of questions about why the middle area was
12
not ultimately selected for the location of the park.
13
And my full question is if the middle area were open
14
as a park in between the two service courts, would
15
that go farther to retaining the reciprocal
16
relationship between the service courts within the
17
current plan?
18
A I f t hi s pr oj ect coul d be done by
19
el i mi nat i ng a maj or por t i on of t he devel opment ,
20
al l owi ng t hat t o be t her e, t hat woul d be gr eat . But
21
t hi s pr oj ect , as you' ve hear d, i t ' s a bal anci ng act
22
of so many di f f er ent goal s.
165
1
As a pr eser vat i oni st , i t ' s ver y easy t o say
2
we want t o do t hi s, t hi s and t hi s. But t hen you say,
3
wel l , who' s goi ng t o pay f or t hat , how i s i t goi ng t o
4
be t hat , what ar e we goi ng t o do?
5
And t her e ar e so many goal s t hat t hi s
6
pr oj ect has been goi ng t hr ough si nce 1987 and t hi s,
7
r i ght now, i s t he best bal ance of al l of t hemand
8
get s us so much mor e pr eser vat i on t han any pr evi ous
9
pl an has done.
10
MS. FERSTER: I have a f ol l ow- up.
11
BY MS. FERSTER:
12
Q Based on your answer to that question, I'm
13
just so intrigued by your statement that this is
14
better than any previous preservation plan. Are you
15
familiar with other preservation plans for McMillan,
16
I mean other alternative proposals.
17
A That we have done t hat have been r eal i st i c
18
appr oaches wi t h act ual under st andi ng of what t he
19
cost s and consequences of t hemar e, we have done t hi s
20
si nce 2007 and - -
21
Q Just for VMP, though.
22
A For VMP.
166
1
Q Oh, I thought you were aware of some other
2
proposals.
3
A I ' mawar e of ot her pr oposal s t hat I do not
4
t hi nk can meet t hose bal ances.
5
Q And are you aware of alternative proposals
6
by other developers?
7
A No.
8
MS. FERSTER: Sor r y t o i nt er r upt you.
9
Thank you, I don' t have an ot her quest i ons.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: I don' t know i f you' r e t he
11
r i ght per son t o ask t hi s, but gi ven your comment s
12
about t he f act t hat t he pr eser vat i on of Cel l 28 may
13
not be f easi bl e goi ng f or war d, i s t her e i n t he
14
appl i cat i on an al t er nat i ve or mi t i gat i on pl an i n case
15
t hat doesn' t wor k?
16
THE WI TNESS: I t hi nk t hat what I ' msayi ng
17
i s t hat i f you' r e l ooki ng at i t f r ompur e
18
pr eser vat i on, t hat usi ng t he Secr et ar y of I nt er i or
19
st andar ds, t hat t hi s may be - - our goal i s t o have i t
20
l ook a cer t ai n way, because t hat wi l l be t he
21
exper i ence t hat peopl e wi l l benef i t f r omt he most .
22
And our goal i s t o pr eser ve as much as possi bl e t o
167
1
make sur e we do i t . But j ust ever yone be awar e t hat
2
t hat may t ake a l ot mor e r ecr eat i on t han we woul d
3
want t o do.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: I see. So you' r e not sayi ng
5
t hat you woul d abandon t he i dea - -
6
7
J UDGE BYRNE: - - of doi ng Cel l 28, but you
8
mean i t woul d be mor e of a r ecr eat i on.
9
THE WI TNESS: The bal ance, yeah, t he
10
bal ance woul d go t hr ough - -
11
J UDGE BYRNE: Mor e of a r ecr eat i on t han a
12
pr eser vat i on.
13
THE WI TNESS: Ri ght , r i ght .
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, I under st and t hat . So
15
di d you want t o - -
16
MS. BROWN: I have no mor e r edi r ect . We
17
have ot her wi t nesses.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk t hi s mi ght be a good
19
t i me t o t ake a br eak. How l ong do we t hi nk we' l l
20
need, maybe an hour , l ess? Less t han an hour , 45
21
mi nut es?
22
MS. FERSTER: We have a number of our
168
1
wi t nesses who ar e under some t i me const r ai nt s and so
2
I guess coul d we j ust get a sense at t hi s poi nt of
3
how much l onger af t er t he br eak your case i s goi ng t o
4
t ake and what t he or der of t he pr oceedi ngs wi l l be?
5
MS. BROWN: Wi t hout cr oss exami nat i on, I
6
woul d say 35 t o 40 mi nut es, but I t hi nk t he cr oss
7
exami nat i on i s t he unknown.
8
J UDGE BYRNE: So i f we' r e comi ng back at
9
1: 35, t hen maybe you' d be done wi t h t hat par t of t he
10
case by 2: 30, even wi t h cr oss exami nat i on? Maybe
11
not .
12
MS. FERSTER: I don' t t hi nk so, because how
13
many wi t nesses have you had so f ar , t hr ee?
14
MS. BROWN: The r emai ni ng wi t nesses - -
15
MS. FERSTER: Thr ee, and i t ' s al r eady
16
t aken - -
17
MS. BROWN: - - ar e Br uce Leonar d, Mat t
18
Bel l , AdamWeer s, J ai r Lynch, Aakash Thekkar and
19
Li ndsl ey Wi l l i ams.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: So si x.
21
MS. FERSTER: Si x.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: So 35 mi nut es sounds
169
1
opt i mi st i c.
2
MS. FERSTER: And how l ong do you i nt end t o
3
go f or t oday?
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes, t hat ' s a good quest i on,
5
t oo. I can go unt i l 5: 00.
6
MS. FERSTER: And j ust so I can t el l our
7
wi t nesses - -
8
MS. BROWN: Ther e' s goi ng t o be a
9
cont i nuat i on, essent i al l y.
10
MS. FERSTER: Yes, yes.
11
J UDGE BYRNE: You know, I t hi nk t her e i s
12
si gni f i cant r i sk - - I don' t know how many wi t nesses
13
you' r e pl anni ng t o put on - -
14
MS. FERSTER: We have a number of
15
wi t nesses.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: So I t hi nk i t ' s pr obabl e t hat
17
t her e be a cont i nuat i on. Nobody want s a
18
cont i nuat i on, but - -
19
MS. FERSTER: Maybe we coul d r eassess af t er
20
you f i ni sh your case about whet her or not we want t o
21
br eak up t he opposi t i on case i nt o t wo days, based on
22
t i me or whet her we want t o def er i t al l . Because
170
1
t hen I can e- mai l or l et my wi t nesses know we' r e
2
pl anni ng t o show up af t er t he l unch br eak.
3
MS. BROWN: May I ask how many wi t nesses
4
you pl an on pr esent i ng?
5
MS. FERSTER: Yes. Wel l , t he Nat i onal
6
Tr ust has wi t nesses and t hen we have - - yeah, t hey
7
have t wo wi t nesses and we have si x wi t nesses.
8
J UDGE BYRNE: Si x wi t nesses and t her e may
9
wel l j ust be peopl e who ar e her e t o make a st at ement .
10
MS. FERSTER: Yes, t hat ' s our wi t nesses,
11
t hat ' s not - - you know, t hat ' s j ust f or t he par t y.
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Ri ght , so gener al l y, i f
13
peopl e ar e j ust maki ng a st at ement , we t r y t o hol d
14
t hemt o f i ve mi nut es or l ess and t hat can go f ai r l y
15
qui ckl y. And gener al l y, t her e' s not cr oss
16
exami nat i on, i t ' s not necessar y i n t hose cases.
17
So I t hi nk we' l l j ust have t o come back and
18
we' l l f i ni sh t he Appl i cant s' case and j ust sor t of
19
see wher e we ar e. So we' l l commence agai n at 1: 35.
20
( Wher eupon, at 12: 49 p. m. , a l uncheon
21
r ecess i s t aken. )
22
- - -
171
1
AFTERNOON PROCEEDI NGS
2
( Wher eupon, at 1: 35 p. m. , t he pr oceedi ng
3
r esumed. )
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , l adi es and
5
gent l emen, l et ' s st ar t agai n, i t ' s 1: 35. Next
6
wi t ness?
7
MS. BROWN: Yes, our next wi t ness i s Br uce
8
Leonar d, who I ' d l i ke t o have qual i f i ed as an exper t
9
i n r et ai l desi gn wi t h St r eet sense.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay.
11
MS. FERSTER: A qui ck quest i on?
12
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
13
MS. FERSTER: Bef or e you go on, j ust a
14
qui ck quest i on. Wer e you goi ng t o br i ng your
15
st r uct ur al engi neer back t o have t hat cl ar i f i cat i on
16
t oday or at a di f f er ent t i me?
17
MS. BROWN: He' s l ef t f or anot her meet i ng.
18
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Mr . Leonar d i s bei ng of f er ed
20
as an exper t i n r et ai l devel opment ?
21
MS. BROWN: Ret ai l desi gn and devel opment
22
as i t r el at es t o, speci f i cal l y, r euse of t he
172
1
under gr ound cel l s.
2
J UDGE BYRNE: Speci f i cal l y t o t he r euse of
3
t he under gr ound cel l s?
4
MS. BROWN: Pot ent i al l y.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Oh, I see.
6
Wher eupon,
7
BRUCE LEONARD
8
9
f ol l ows:
10
VOI R DI RE EXAMI NATI ON
11
BY MS. FERSTER:
12
Q Just a couple of questions. Mr. Leonard,
13
have you been qualified as an expert in retail design
14
before the Mayor's Agent in the past or any other --
15
A Not i n t he past , no.
16
Q And can you say a little bit about your
17
educational background, the nature of your degrees?
18
A I have t wo degr ees, I have a degr ee i n
19
ur ban desi gn and mast er pl anni ng and I have a degr ee
20
i n ar chi t ect ur e and I ' mr egi st er ed i n t he Di st r i ct of
21
Col umbi a.
22
Q But you're not seeking to be qualified as
173
1
an expert in architecture for this purpose?
2
MS. BROWN: I t ' s r et ai l desi gn, whi ch
3
ent ai l s ar chi t ect ur e.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: So t he desi gn of space f or
5
r et ai l , t hat ' s what t he t opi c i s.
6
MS. BROWN: Yes.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, I see.
8
9
Q Will your testimony describe a little bit
10
about your background in designing retail space?
11
A ( Nods i n t he af f i r mat i ve. )
12
MS. FERSTER: So I ' l l r eser ve my posi t i on
13
on t hi s qual i f i cat i on unt i l af t er I hear a l i t t l e bi t
14
mor e about hi s backgr ound.
15
MS. BROWN: I ' mhappy t o have hi mdescr i be
16
hi s backgr ound r i ght now.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Why don' t we hear mor e about
18
your backgr ound, Mr . Leonar d, so we' l l get t hat
19
r esol ved so we can get t o t he subst ance of your
20
t est i mony?
21
THE WI TNESS: Sur e. I ' ma managi ng
22
pr i nci pal at St r eet sense. St r eet sense i s a
174
1
mul t i di vi si onal company t hat has exper t i se i n r et ai l
2
and mi xed use. We have 105 empl oyees.
3
I ' ve been r egi st er ed about 25 year s, been
4
i n pr act i ce al most 30 year s. I ' ve been wor ki ng on
5
pr obabl y f i ve of t he t op t en mi xed use pr oj ect s i n
6
t he count r y and have, you know, j ust a br eadt h of
7
knowl edge about i nt egr at i ng mi xed use and desi gni ng
8
ef f ect i ve gr ound pl ans and st or es.
9
So we wor k on hundr eds of pr oj ect s a year
10
and r i ght now, we have about 245 pr oj ect s act i ve i n
11
our of f i ce.
12
13
BY MS. BROWN:
14
Q And Mr. Leonard, do you have specific
15
information on how retail succeeds and what makes it
16
fail --
17
A Yes.
18
Q -- and how you design around that to make
19
sure that it can succeed?
20
A Yes.
21
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, ver y good, pl ease
22
pr oceed.
175
1
THE WI TNESS: Okay, f i r st sl i de. So what
2
I ' d l i ke t o do f i r st , bef or e we get i nt o t he cel l s,
3
i s r eal l y j ust t al k about good commer ci al
4
f undament al s f or bot h r et ai l and ot her commer ci al
5
r equi r ement s.
6
They' r e r eal l y i mpor t ant because
7
essent i al l y, t hey hel p est abl i sh val ue t o t he t enant
8
user . And nor mal l y, whet her i t ' s a r et ai l t enant ,
9
of f i ce t enant or ot her commer ci al user , t hey have a
10
ser i es of cr i t er i a t hat need t o be mat ched. And when
11
you st op mat chi ng t hose cr i t er i a or checki ng t he
12
boxes, as we used t o say, t hey st ar t t o l ose i nt er est
13
i n t he si t e, you' r e st ar t i ng t o cr eat e bar r i er s f or
14
ent r y and r educi ng t he val ue and oppor t uni t y of t he
15
r eal est at e.
16
So we have a whol e di vi si on t hat f ocuses
17
excl usi vel y on doi ng what we cal l r et ai l peer r evi ews
18
and eval uat i on of space f or our cl i ent s, so t hat when
19
t hei r pr oj ect s ar e compl et e, t hey' r e f ul l y l easabl e
20
and t hey can get t he hi ghest and best t enant s t o
21
occupy t hei r pr oj ect .
22
So gener al l y, t hi s i s ki nd of a pr i mer .
176
1
Ret ai l er s l ook f or an 18- f oot f l oor t o f l oor hei ght s,
2
t ypi cal l y, as t he i ndust r y st andar d. 16 mi ni mumf eet
3
cl ear i s pr ef er r ed. So t hat ' s ki nd of a gener al .
4
Wi l l t hey t ake l ower space? Yes, but usual l y, i t ' s
5
l ess appeal i ng t o t hem.
6
Of f i ce, whi ch i s pr et t y st andar d i n t he
7
Di st r i ct , 12- f oot f l oor t o f l oor , ni ne f eet mi ni mum
8
cl ear . Col umn spaci ng i n r et ai l - - i n a smal l shop
9
r et ai l , i t ' s got t o be gr eat er t han 20 f eet . For
10
l ar ge f or mat r et ai l er s, l i ke a Tar get or a gr ocer y
11
st or e, 30 f eet on cent er i s pr ef er r ed.
12
So t hey l i ke spaci ous col umn spaci ng, so as
13
you can see i n t he t op sl i de, you know, t he mer chant s
14
can ki nd of di spl ay t hei r war es. Ther e you see t hese
15
l ar ge expanses. They l i ke hi gh vi si bi l i t y and ease
16
of access.
17
Basi cal l y, on speci al t y mer chant s, t hey
18
l i ke t he cust omer t o be abl e t o see, have a l ot of
19
t r anspar ency, see t he mer chandi se, be abl e t o ki nd of
20
make deci si ons about what t hey want t o see and t ouch
21
and t hat sor t of f aci l i t at es t he act of shoppi ng.
22
When i t st ar t s t o get compr essed, consumer s
177
1
can' t see t he mer chandi se, of t en mi ss i t or st ar t t o
2
check out ment al l y and t hen l eave t he st or e. So t hey
3
r eal l y f ocus on havi ng an expansi ve f l oor pl an.
4
Gr ound l evel r et ai l , t ypi cal l y, i s r eal l y
5
pr ef er r ed by our cl i ent s. So once we st ar t
6
suggest i ng t hey go bel ow gr ade or above gr ade,
7
usual l y, we see a r ent r educt i on of about t wo- t hi r ds.
8
So i f i t ' s a $60. 00 r ent we' r e aski ng on H St r eet or
9
14t h St r eet , i f t hey' r e i n t he basement , you' l l be
10
l ucky t o get 20. And t hat ' s because i t does af f ect
11
t hei r oper at i ons and usual l y, t he qual i t y of t hat
12
space i s di mi ni shed.
13
They have bot h, whet her of f i ce or
14
par t i cul ar l y r et ai l and r est aur ant s, t hey have heavy
15
MEP r equi r ement s and hi gh t onnage demand f or cool i ng.
16
Rest aur ant s can get as l ow as one t on per hundr ed
17
squar e f eet and I ' ve seen, not i n t hi s mar ket , i t get
18
as l ow as one t on per 75 squar e f eet . So t hat
19
gener at es t he need f or heavy cool i ng equi pment , whi ch
20
can be ver y cumber some. A 30- t on uni t i s about t he
21
si ze of a smal l semi , so you can i magi ne when you
22
st ar t t o ext r apol at e t hat .
178
1
Anchor st or es l i ke t o be wel l l i ght ed and
2
have spaci ous shel vi ng f or mer chandi se. Agai n,
3
t hat ' s ki nd of obvi ous, but t hey l i ke t he mer chandi se
4
t o be wel l di spl ayed and cl ear and t hey want ease of
5
use and ci r cul at i on by t he cust omer .
6
And t hen of f i ce spaces, t oo, t oday, i f you
7
l ook at what ' s cur r ent , i s t hey l i ke ampl e nat ur al
8
l i ght and spaci ous col umn spaci ng. So i f you' r e
9
desi gni ng a bui l di ng downt own, t he i ndust r y st andar d
10
i s 45 f eet cl ear f r omt he bor der wal l t o t he
11
per i met er and t hey l i ke t o spr ead out t he col umns as
12
wi de as possi bl e, i f not el i mi nat i ng t hemal t oget her .
13
So when we st ar t t o l ook at t he under gr ound
14
cel l s - - and a l ot of t hi s has been descr i bed bef or e,
15
but I ' l l j ust r epeat i t - - r i ght now, t hat col umn
16
space i s 14 f oot on cent er . For commer ci al pur poses,
17
t hi s i s ext r emel y t i ght and mar gi nal , so i n t he
18
cr i t er i a of checki ng a box, t hi s woul d be a r ed f l ag
19
t o most nat i onal br ands and i t woul d be al most a
20
nonst ar t er f or anchor user s because t hey woul dn' t be
21
abl e t o get t hei r shel vi ng i n any ef f i ci ency.
22
The l ow cei l i ng hei ght i s wel l bel ow what ' s
179
1
consi der ed a good t hr eshol d f or r et ai l . And even i n
2
r est aur ant s, t hey pr ef er hi gh cei l i ngs because
3
t hey' r e t r yi ng t o - - t he di ni ng exper i ence i s about
4
cr eat i ng an exper i ence and at mospher e. And i f you
5
t hi nk about t he r est aur ant s you l i ke t o eat i n, you
6
can ki nd of , i n your mi nd' s eye, ki nd of vi sual i ze
7
what t hey' r e l i ke. And most of t en t han not , t hey' ve
8
got hi gh, expansi ve cei l i ngs and l ot s of r omant i c
9
l i ght i ng.
10
The same t hi ng wi t h speci al t y r et ai l er s.
11
Real l y, i t ' s t he col umn spaci ng i s a nonst ar t er f or
12
t hembecause i t doesn' t al l ow t hemt o ef f ect i vel y
13
di spl ay t hei r war es.
14
Li mi t ed accessi bi l i t y. We di d an
15
eval uat i on of Cel l 14 and t her e' s qui t e a l ot of
16
chal l enges t o get t i ng ADA access and ser vi ci ng and
17
l oadi ng t o i t . I t ' s achi evabl e, but i t r equi r es
18
ext r aor di nar y ef f or t s t o do t hat .
19
And we haven' t even del ved i nt o t he
20
occupancy r equi r ement s, egr ess, st ai r s, al l t hose
21
component s, whi ch wi l l be consi der abl e when you
22
consi der f or somet hi ng l i ke a mar ket use, i t woul d be
180
1
assembl y and i t woul d di ct at e, you know, pr et t y
2
ser i ous l i f e saf et y r equi r ement s on egr ess.
3
And t hen agai n, t he MEP chal l enges, you can
4
see f r omt he space, wi t h t he t i ght col umn spaci ng and
5
t he compr essed - - you know, t ypi cal l y, you need about
6
t wo f eet , mi ni mumt o r un duct wor k and el ect r i cal
7
chaser s and t hi ngs l i ke t hat and l i ght i ng. You' r e
8
r eal l y get t i ng l ow i n t hese cel l s f or any ki nd of
9
commer ci al use.
10
I f you put t he duct wor k i n t he sl ab or
11
bel ow t he sl ab - - and I ' l l l eave t hat t o t he
12
st r uct ur al engi neer - - but gi ven t he l oadi ng nat ur e
13
of t hi s, you coul d be cr eat i ng some ser i ous i ssues i n
14
under mi ni ng t he st r uct ur al i nt egr i t y of t he sl ab.
15
They can be over come. I ' mj ust sayi ng t hese ar e
16
si gni f i cant chal l enges t o t he t enant goi ng i n her e.
17
So ki nd of t o sumup, some of t hi s has been
18
sai d. I mean one of t he i ssues we have and we' l l be
19
wr est i ng wi t h i s, you know, t hese wer e r eal l y not
20
desi gned f or human habi t at i on, i t ' s ki nd of uni que
21
t hat way i n t hat , you know, i t ' s a sand f i l t r at i on
22
bed. So t r yi ng t o occupy i t , you know, i t never was
181
1
i nt ended f or human use.
2
The unr ei nf or ced concr et e i s not per mi t t ed
3
by code t oday and i t ' s hi ghl y unst abl e, so we' r e
4
goi ng t o have t o over come some ser i ous l i f e saf et y
5
i ssues as we st ar t t o occupy t hese spaces. They' r e
6
si gni f i cant and t o a cer t ai n ext ent i n my mi nd,
7
unknown, i n t er ms of what t he r ami f i cat i ons r eal l y
8
wi l l be.
9
They have no l i ght and l i mi t ed ai r , whi ch
10
f r omour st andpoi nt , on ot her commer ci al uses ot her
11
t han r et ai l , you st ar t t o l i mi t t he opt i ons. Because
12
you know, whet her you' r e a of f i ce space or a mar ket
13
hal l , you know, t he need f or nat ur al l i ght I t hi nk i s
14
i ncr edi bl y i mpor t ant . How we r esol ve t hat i s goi ng
15
t o be a si gni f i cant i ssue f or us.
16
The ADA access, agai n, i s ext r emel y
17
chal l engi ng. I t hi nk i t ' s r esol vabl e, but i t ' s goi ng
18
t o r equi r e ext r aor di nar y ef f or t s t o get peopl e i n
19
wheel chai r s and wi t h, you know, mot or di sabi l i t i es t o
20
access t he space.
21
The f act t hat t hey don' t suppor t
22
const r uct i on above f or cool i ng equi pment , any of
182
1
t hose t ypes of t hi ngs, t hat ' s goi ng t o be a chal l enge
2
f or us.
3
And t hen, you know, t he f act t hat t he cel l
4
i nt egr i t y, as t he st r uct ur al engi neer out l i ned, you
5
know, j ust f r omour st andpoi nt , l ooki ng at i t f r oma
6
r et ai l er or of f i ce eyes, i t ' s pr esent i ng a l ot of
7
chal l enges and unknowns, whi ch i s a r i sk f or anybody
8
t hat ' s at t empt i ng t o occupy t he space.
9
So j ust some f i nal t hought s. You know, t o
10
me, t hi s i s not a r egi onal si t e. I f you add up al l
11
t he cel l s, t her e' s about 870, 000 squar e f eet , whi ch
12
woul d be def i ni t el y a r egi onal use f or any commer ci al
13
act i vi t y. I mean t he densi t y t hat t he si t e coul d
14
suppor t i s not even cl ose t o t hat . I t hi nk i t r eal l y
15
want s t o t r ade t o t he l ocal nei ghbor hood and ser ve
16
t he l ocal nei ghbor hood.
17
And t he si t e gener al l y l acks cl ose
18
pr oxi mi t y t o Met r o, so f r oman of f i ce st andpoi nt and
19
r et ai l , you' r e not r el yi ng on t hat Met r o t r af f i c, per
20
se. You know, t he r et ai l er who wi l l l ook at t hi s
21
si t e i s r eal l y havi ng t o st and on i t s own and ser ve
22
t he l ocal communi t y.
183
1
The r et ai l t enant demand i s, agai n,
2
sust ai nabl e at a nei ghbor hood densi t y, whi ch I t hi nk
3
t he t ar get ment i oned of 80 t o 100, 000 f eet i s
4
appr opr i at e f or t hi s si t e and I t hi nk anyt hi ng above
5
t hat woul d be ver y aggr essi ve. And when you get
6
aggr essi ve, what you do i s you st ar t t o r un out of
7
t he best and hi ghest t enant s and you st ar t t o r un
8
i nt o t he mor e mar gi nal t enant s, whi ch af f ect s t he
9
t enancy, and you' r e sor t of sear chi ng t o f i l l sl ot s
10
and i t degr ades t he pr oj ect . So I t hi nk we t r y t o
11
f i nd t hat bal ance of what t he r eal mar ket can
12
suppor t .
13
And t hen t he si gni f i cant desi gn and cost
14
chal l enges, I mean we t hi nk, you know, i n Cel l 14,
15
we' r e goi ng t o gi ve a r eal l y good ef f or t t o get some
16
out st andi ng user s i n t her e, but i t ' s a r eal l y
17
r est r i ct ed suppl y of t enant s t hat we can put i n
18
t her e. I t ' s goi ng t o be a l ot of chal l enges and
19
sal es wor k t o convi nce t hemt o go i nt o t he space and
20
you know, i t ' s not goi ng t o be an easy and
21
st r ai ght f or war d ef f or t .
22
And I t hi nk f r omour st andpoi nt , t oo, and
184
1
we do t hi s on our l easi ng si de - - get t i ng t he t enant
2
i n t her e, t o me, i s one t hi ng. But get t i ng t hemt o
3
have a sust ai nabl e busi ness wher e t hey' r e doi ng
4
enough sal es per squar e f oot t o pay some ki nd of r ent
5
and oper at i onal cost s and pay t hei r st af f i s anot her
6
t hi ng.
7
So we r eal l y have t o be di l i gent i n maki ng
8
sur e what ever uses we put i n t her e can r eal l y sust ai n
9
t hemsel ves i n a r eal i st i c way. Ot her wi se, we' r e j ust
10
goi ng t o put t hemi n at cost and t hen t hey' l l be
11
vacant i n t hr ee mont hs when t hey' r e not per f or mi ng.
12
So as we go t hr ough t hi s exer ci se, we' r e
13
goi ng t o have t o put a l ot of at t ent i on t o r eal l y
14
put t i ng i n t he r i ght uses, whi ch ar e ext r emel y
15
l i mi t ed and maki ng sur e t hat t hei r busi ness can be
16
sust ai nabl e at t he bel ow gr ade envi r onment .
17
That concl udes my pr esent at i on.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you have anyt hi ng?
19
MS. BROWN: J ust a coupl e of qui ck
20
quest i ons.
21
22
Q So you focused on Cell 14 as the potential
185
1
retail use. If you had to try to do that for any
2
other cells, what kind of challenges would you face,
3
or multiple cells?
4
A Wel l , t he one t hi ng t hat woul d come t o my
5
mi nd i s, you know, t her e' s a l i mi t ed amount of
6
qual i f i ed user s. And t he ot her t hi ng i s what t he
7
col umn spaci ng says t o me and t he scal e of t he space
8
i s i t ' s best sui t ed f or smal l scal e user s. That
9
woul d be a smal l r est aur ant , a smal l nei ghbor hood
10
ser vi ce ki nd of - - maybe a sal on, somet hi ng l i ke
11
t hat . Those don' t have a l ot of squar e f oot age and
12
when each cel l i s 40, 000 f eet , t hat ' s t he si ze of
13
al most a pr et t y bi g gr ocer .
14
So t he chal l enge we have of expandi ng t he
15
cel l s f r oma commer ci al st andpoi nt i s t he cel l s
16
ar en' t set up f or t he bi gger f or mat user s whi ch wi l l
17
al l ow you t o el evat e t hat pr oj ect ' s squar e f oot age.
18
So we r eal l y ar e l i mi t ed t o a much mor e f i ne gr ai ned
19
appr oach t o t he t enant mi x t hat I t hi nk i s best
20
sui t ed, whi ch i s l i mi t ed.
21
I j ust t hi nk I r eal l y per cei ve t he si t e as
22
ki nd of a nei ghbor hood scal e, wher e t he peopl e t hat
186
1
l i ve and shop ar ound i t ar e f r equent i ng i t , you' r e
2
not get t i ng peopl e f r omf i ve mi l es away and ot her
3
sect i ons of t he ci t y comi ng her e, i t ' s goi ng t o be
4
t r adi ng much mor e l ocal l y.
5
Q Thank you. You referred to means of
6
egress. Because this only has one way in, could you
7
explain what that one way and out --
8
A Wel l , t he one way i n i s not r eal l y usabl e.
9
I t was desi gned f or an i ndust r i al use t o get l ar ge,
10
heavy l oads of sand and car t s, pr obabl y when t hey
11
wer e haul i ng t he sand out .
12
Q That's that filter bed door?
13
A Yes, so I don' t know what t he sl ope i s on
14
t hat , but i t ' s def i ni t el y above ADA st andar ds, i t ' s
15
qui t e pr eci pi t ous. So what we have t o do i s, you
16
know, when you go back t o t he sect i on, you' l l see
17
t hat t o get an ADA r amp, whi ch i s somet hi ng ver y
18
shal l ow, I t hi nk we est i mat ed i t was about a hundr ed
19
f eet t o 200 f eet a r un bef or e we coul d get - - because
20
you can' t j ust go st r ai ght down, you' ve got t o l and
21
i t f or a bi t t o get i t , but i t ' s a l ot of di st ance t o
22
get somebody down.
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1
We coul d add an el evat or cor e, but t hen
2
we' d have t o r ei nf or ce al l t he cel l s. That mi ght be
3
anot her al t er nat i ve. But t hen how does t hat
4
i nt er f ace, you know, wi t h t hi s and you know, how i s
5
t hat al l f unct i oni ng.
6
And t hen we haven' t even r eal l y exami ned,
7
as I sai d, how you get peopl e out . So 20, 000 peopl e
8
of assembl ed use coul d be qui t e a f ew peopl e, say i f
9
you t r i ed a mar ket hal l . So t hi s woul d be f our or
10
f i ve st ai r ways out of her e t o meet t he l i f e saf et y
11
code, t hat ' s somet hi ng, and wher e t hey' r e comi ng up
12
f r omt he st r eet , how t hat get s t r eat ed.
13
And t hen l i ke I sai d, f or me, how we' r e
14
handl i ng t he heat i ng and cool i ng equi pment f or t hi s
15
f aci l i t y i s goi ng t o be a pr obl emt o sol ve and i t ' s
16
not goi ng t o be i nsi gni f i cant equi pment , i t ' s goi ng
17
t o be subst ant i al .
18
Q One final question. Are you familiar with
19
the Dupont Circle Underground and if you are, do you
20
think there are any parallels to the difficulties?
21
A Yeah, I t hi nk t hat ' s a r eal l y good exampl e.
22
I n f act , you know, I ' ve pr act i ced i n t he Di st r i ct
188
1
f or al most 30 year s and I t hi nk t he t hr ee compani es
2
t hat have been consul t ed t o see i f t hey coul d sol ve
3
t he pr obl em, most r ecent l y St r eet sense, br oker s
4
t our ed i t l ast year , i nt er nal l y, I mean t hey' r e j ust
5
not i nt er est ed i n t he ext er i or .
6
And br oker s, i f you under st and t hem,
7
t hey' r e sel f - empl oyed, t hey onl y ear n t he deal s t hat
8
t hey cl ose, so t hey' r e ver y f ocused on t hi ngs t hat
9
ar e achi evabl e and t hey don' t l i ke t o wast e t hei r
10
t i me on deal s t hat r eal l y won' t bear f r ui t . We had
11
15 br oker s t hat had zer o i nt er est i n t he pr oj ect at
12
al l . I t ' s ext r emel y chal l engi ng f or t he r easons I
13
out l i ned f or t he r et ai l t enant s.
14
One t hi ng I ' l l add i s a bi g t hi ng we' ve
15
seen si nce t he l at e - - when you' r e t al ki ng about
16
nat i onal r et ai l br ands i s we' ve done over 500
17
St ar bucks i n t he r egi on. I n t he heyday, we wer e
18
doi ng 52 a year as our r ecor d. And t he manager was a
19
woman f or St ar bucks, she bl ew f i ve l ocat i ons. She
20
was f i ne, she had 45 deal s t o show t he commi t t ee t hat
21
she had done a gr eat j ob. She' s doi ng t hr ee t hi s
22
year . So i f she bl ows a l ocat i on, her j ob' s on t he
189
1
l i ne.
2
So what you' r e seei ng - - and t hat ' s why
3
we' r e spendi ng so much t i me wi t h r esi dent i al and
4
of f i ce devel oper s, get t i ng t he f undament al s r i ght .
5
Because i f your cei l i ng t ype i s not r i ght or you' r e
6
not get t i ng t he r i ght st or ef r ont or t hey don' t l i ke
7
t he HVAC r equi r ement s, t hey' r e passi ng on t he si t e.
8
They' r e not goi ng t o put t hei r j obs on t he l i ne t o
9
t ake a r i sk. And t hat ' s St ar bucks as an exampl e, but
10
you coul d go down t he l i st of nat i onal br ands and
11
t hey' r e al l t he same. So r eal est at e t oday i n t he
12
nat i onal mar ket s get s a t r emendous amount of
13
scr ut i ny.
14
MS. BROWN: Thank you, t hat ' s al l I have.
15
16
MS. FERSTER: Thank you.
17
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
18
BY MS. FERSTER:
19
Q So in your experience in doing this design
20
and execution of mixed use projects, have you been
21
involved in projects that involve the adaptive reuse
22
of historic buildings or structures to small scale
190
1
uses?
2
A Yes.
3
Q And would you agree that most historic
4
structures, at least many historic structures, would
5
not satisfy the specifications that you outlined that
6
a large retailer or big box store would require, is
7
that correct?
8
A Wel l , I ' l l gi ve you an exampl e of one I
9
di d. I di d a bui l di ng year s ago i n t he meat packi ng
10
di st r i ct , whi ch was an ol d war ehouse. Or i gi nal l y, i t
11
was a meat packi ng pl ace wher e t hey sl aught er ed al l
12
t he meat whi ch came i n f r omNew Yor k.
13
And basi cal l y, we wer e abl e t o conver t t hat
14
i nt o ef f ect i ve r et ai l space because f or t unat el y, i n
15
t hat bui l di ng, we di d have 18 - - i t was desi gned as a
16
f act or y, so i t had ver y spaci ous hei ght s and we wer e
17
abl e t o ef f ect i vel y r euse i t .
18
I mean i t was a bui l di ng t hat was desi gned,
19
i t al ways had humans wor ki ng i n i t wor ki ng, so i t was
20
f ai r l y st r ai ght f or war d, so i t was a commer ci al
21
bui l di ng. So i t was l i ke conver t i ng a ki nd of
22
f act or y t o - - and I ' ve had success conver t i ng
191
1
i nvest or bui l di ngs t o apar t ment l ot s, t hi ngs l i ke
2
t hat .
3
Ot her bui l di ngs, you know, somet i mes i t i s
4
a chal l enge and when i t ' s a chal l enge, we f eel
5
somet i mes i t ' s not an opt i on, you know, and somet i mes
6
you j ust have t o say t hat .
7
Q And in terms of the smaller buildings, for
8
example, historic buildings on a main street that
9
might date to the 1800s that don't have the kind of
10
vertical ceiling, with the other kind of requirements
11
that you --
12
A Yes.
13
Q -- laid out for the larger retailers,
14
wouldn't you agree that many of these historic
15
buildings have, nonetheless, been successfully
16
adapted for retail use, perhaps not by big box
17
stores, but by other users?
18
A Smal l user s wi l l f i t . I ' l l gi ve you an
19
exampl e. Cl evel and Par k, i f you know t hat bui l di ng
20
t hat ' s on t he west si de of Connect i cut , when you come
21
r i ght out of t he Met r o - - so when I was wi t h
22
St ar wood, we devel oped t hat . And i t had ni ne- f oot
192
1
cei l i ngs and mar gi nal t enant s t hat wer e bar el y
2
get t i ng by.
3
And what we ended up doi ng was t aki ng t he
4
second f l oor out of t hat space and cr eat i ng t hi s
5
l ar ge space and we wer e abl e t o t ot al l y r et ai n t he
6
bui l di ng and upgr ade t he r est aur ant si gni f i cant l y.
7
And we put a hai r sal on i n t her e and some ot her
8
speci al t y user s, t ot al l y wer e abl e t o upgr ade t he
9
t enant mi x. But i t di d r equi r e i nt er vent i on on t he
10
cei l i ng hei ght s, t hey never woul d have gone i n,
11
ot her wi se. But t o answer your quest i on, smal l er
12
bui l di ngs l end t hemsel ves t o smal l er t enant s, ver y
13
much so.
14
Q And have you been involved in the adaptive
15
reuse of what we might call unusual structures? And
16
I'm thinking particularly of things like the Viaduc
17
des Arts in Paris. I don't know if you're familiar
18
with that, which is an elevated earth, you know,
19
stone embankment, a rail line that's elevated in
20
Paris, where they've actually carved out retail
21
spaces in that embankment.
22
Are you familiar with any of those sorts of
193
1
creative, adaptive reuse projects where these unusual
2
structures have been adapted for retail uses?
3
A Not hi ng t hat unusual . I ' ve seen exampl es
4
of ol d i ndust r i al bui l di ngs, l i ke Gr anvi l l e I sl and i n
5
Vancouver t hat got conver t ed.
6
J UDGE BYRNE: Gr anvi l l e I sl and?
7
THE WI TNESS: Yes, Gr anvi l l e I sl and. I
8
went t o school t her e i n ' 87 and i t ' s st i l l a vi abl e
9
mar ket t oday, i t st i l l t hr i ves.
10
11
Q And just to be clear, your testimony -- I
12
didn't hear you say that it was impossible to
13
adaptively reuse these underground cells, for example
14
for small scale users. You just said that there are
15
difficulties, is that correct?
16
A Yes, and I ' d say t her e' s a l i mi t ed suppl y
17
of t enant s t hat coul d f i l l . So one i s a t echni cal
18
pr obl emof adapt i ng t he space; t he ot her , t o me, i s a
19
mar ket demand. Ther e' s j ust a l i mi t ed pool of vi abl e
20
user s t hat coul d even at t empt i t . And i t ' s smal l .
21
And when you' r e gi ven t he squar e f oot age of 870, 000
22
squar e f eet of cel l s, I mean you' r e not - - you have
194
1
l i ke one per cent you coul d pr obabl y occupy.
2
Q And if one had a very special place that
3
one was really trying to adaptively reuse that for a
4
small scale user, how would one go about soliciting
5
those special users who would be interested in having
6
their business in a historic structure? Would you do
7
an RFP? How would you go about that?
8
A Fi r st , we' d pr obabl y i nt er nal l y t r y t o
9
t hi nk of what - - because you know, we deal wi t h
10
hundr eds of t enant s a year i n di f f er ent f or mat s. I
11
woul d t r y t o t hi nk of what user s we f eel i n our
12
pr of essi onal opi ni ons woul d make sense. And we woul d
13
pr obabl y get a st or y t el l i ng package t oget her and go
14
out and t r y t o engage i nt er est and I t hi nk i t woul d
15
be a heck of a sal es j ob.
16
We' d al so be concer ned about t he
17
sust ai nabi l i t y and we' d have t o do a l ot of due
18
di l i gence t o make sur e - - l i ke I sai d, i t ' s one t hi ng
19
t o get a t enant i n t he space; i t ' s anot her t hi ng t o
20
keep t hemi n busi ness. You know, we' r e r epr esent i ng
21
t he t enant , we have t hei r i nt er est at hear t , and we
22
don' t want t o j ust get t he commi ssi on. We want t o
195
1
make sur e t hat we t hi nk t hey can be successf ul t her e.
2
Q And do you know whether there are firms
3
that do this kind of retail design that specialize
4
specifically in the small scale users and, you know,
5
unusual spaces?
6
A Wel l , we do hundr eds of st or es a year al l
7
over t he ci t y. I f you go on H St r eet , pr obabl y most
8
of t hose r est aur ant s, or down 14t h St r eet . So we do
9
do r eal l y cool , hi gh end desi gn i n f unky spaces, but
10
usual l y, t hey' r e at gr ade and t hey' r e i n cohesi ve
11
envi r onment s. Thi s i s not t hat case.
12
I t hi nk ever ybody sai d t hi s i s a r eal l y
13
uni que si t e wi t h uni que i ssues. I t ' s a pr obl emt o be
14
sol ved t hat hasn' t been sol ved many t i mes and i t ' s
15
got a l ot of chal l enges.
16
Q So if this were your project and you were
17
specifically told that you wanted to solicit tenants
18
for this unique space, one of the things you
19
mentioned is you'd go out with a story board. And
20
then what are some of the other things that you would
21
do to identity these unusual or unique small scale
22
users who might be interested in a space that didn't
196
1
meet big box retail specs?
2
A Wel l , t o me, si nce i t ' s goi ng t o t r ade at
3
t he nei ghbor hood l evel , i t woul d have t o be r el evant
4
t o t he nei ghbor hood. So you know, say i t was an ar ea
5
t hat - - I ' mgoi ng t o t ake t hi s ar ea out her e. Say I
6
had a pr obl emsol ver and t he demogr aphi c was aver age
7
househol d i ncome of 45, 000, you know, dol l ar s, so t he
8
househol d made - - I woul dn' t go out and t r y t o f i nd
9
Ti f f any' s because t hat ' s not goi ng t o be r el evant ,
10
r i ght ?
11
Q Mm-hmm.
12
A So i t ' s f i ndi ng t hat mi x t hat can ser ve t he
13
l ocal mar ket t hat makes sense i s how you appr oach i t
14
because i t ' s goi ng t o be t r adi ng - - peopl e ar e goi ng
15
t o be wal ki ng t o t he si t e or dr i vi ng ver y shor t
16
di st ances, t hat ' s who' s goi ng t o pat r oni ze t hi s si t e
17
and make i t vi abl e. So I woul d be t r yi ng any vi abl e
18
t enant mi x, maki ng sur e t hat i t r esonat ed t o t he
19
l ocal mar ket , number one.
20
Q But you've never been asked to do that?
21
A Uh- uh ( shakes head i n t he negat i ve) .
22
MS. FERSTER: That ' s al l I have.
197
1
MS. MERRI TT: I have j ust one quest i on.
2
BY MS. MERRI TT:
3
Q Can you give us a sense of some of the
4
special challenges and problems and issues involved
5
in trying to attract a grocery store to this site, is
6
that within your area of expertise?
7
A Somewhat . I woul d say, l i ke I sai d - -
8
MS. BROWN: I ' mgoi ng t o obj ect because
9
t hat r eal l y wasn' t hi s scope of hi s t est i mony, about
10
a gr ocer y st or e user her e, i t was r eal l y j ust about
11
r et ai l and - -
12
MS. FERSTER: You' l l have anot her wi t ness
13
on t hat , r i ght ?
14
MS. BROWN: On t he gr ocer y st or e?
15
MS. FERSTER: Yes.
16
MS. BROWN: Ri ght .
17
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, Mr . Leonar d, t hank you
18
ver y much.
19
THE WI TNESS: Gr eat , t hank you.
20
MS. BROWN: Our next wi t ness i s Mat t Bel l ,
21
a mast er pl anner and ar chi t ect f or t hi s, and I ' ml i ke
22
hi mqual i f i ed as an exper t i n ar chi t ect ur e and mast er
198
1
pl anni ng. And I have hi s r esum i n my st ack her e.
2
( Exhi bi t 4 i s mar ked f or
3
i dent i f i cat i on. )
4
5
Wher eupon,
6
MATTHEWJ . BELL
7
8
f ol l ows:
9
10
BY MS. BROWN:
11
Q Mr. Bell, have you testified before other
12
D.C. agencies as an expert in architecture and master
13
planning?
14
A Yes, I have.
15
Q Could you name a couple of them for the
16
zoning commission?
17
A Yes, BZA, Zoni ng Commi ssi on and HPRB, I
18
qual i f i ed f or al l t hr ee of t hose.
19
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , we wi l l qual i f y
21
you as an exper t i n si t e pl anni ng and ar chi t ect ur e.
22
Good, t hank you. So pl ease pr oceed.
199
1
THE WI TNESS: Wel l , good af t er noon. My j ob
2
t oday i s t o wal k you t hr ough t he mast er pl an and t o
3
t al k about t he way i n whi ch we have pr ovi ded an
4
exci t i ng synt hesi s of devel opment and pr eser vat i on of
5
open space f or t hi s pr oj ect .
6
I n t he end of t he day, when t hi s pr oj ect i s
7
bui l t , t hr ough our mast er pl an, peopl e wi l l know i t ' s
8
McMi l l an. They wi l l al ways know i t ' s McMi l l an
9
because of t he speci al f eat ur es and t he car ef ul
10
i nt egr at i on of t hose t hr ee el ement s i nt o t he pl an.
11
What I ' d l i ke t o do f i r st i s t o wal k you
12
t hr ough how we got t her e and t al k a l i t t l e bi t about
13
some of t he i ssues r el at i ve t o t he si t e and t hen t al k
14
about some of t he t hi ngs t hat we wor ked t hr ough wi t h
15
t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d and t he Zoni ng
16
Commi ssi on and some of t he t hi ngs t hat t hat means f or
17
us movi ng f or war d.
18
So Emi l y has t al ked about t he si t e' s
19
char act er i st i cs of t he 25 acr es, par t of t he 92- acr e
20
l andmar k. And Ki r k Met t amand Br uce have t al ked
21
about some of t he i ssues r el at ed t o bot h t he
22
st r uct ur e and t he vi abi l i t y of r et ai l on t he si t e and
200
1
some of t he chal l enges t her e.
2
I t ' s my j ob as a mast er pl anner t o br i ng
3
t he const r ai nt s t o bear on t he si t e i n a cr eat i ve
4
way, i n a way t hat deal s wi t h maki ng a gr eat pl ace
5
f or t he ci t i zens of t hi s ci t y and t he nei ghbor hood,
6
i n a way t hat makes a vi abl e devel opment pr ogr amso
7
we can have t he act i vi t y and t he vi t al i t y t hat we al l
8
l ove i n gr eat pl aces and gr eat nei ghbor hoods.
9
And t he way t o addr ess speci f i cal l y t hi s
10
cont ext , such t hat t he mast er pl an f or t hi s si t e not
11
onl y embr aces t he l andmar k and t akes t he best aspect s
12
of t he char act er i st i cs of t he l andmar k, but al so
13
t akes t he best aspect s and char act er i st i cs of t he
14
cont ext , whi ch i s di f f er ent on al l f our si des.
15
On t he east si de, we have St r onghol d, whi ch
16
i s a smal l t ownhouse nei ghbor hood and t he Gl enwood
17
Cemet er y and f ur t her af i el d, Tr i ni t y and Cat hol i c
18
Uni ver si t i es. On t he sout h, we have t he Vi ct or i an
19
r owhouse nei ghbor hood of Bl oomi ngdal e. On t he West
20
si de we have f ur t her af i el d, t he Howar d Uni ver si t y
21
and some of t he nei ghbor hoods t o t he west , and al so,
22
t he bal ance of t he r est of t he 92- acr e l andmar k.
201
1
What we al so have t o t he nor t h i s t he
2
Hospi t al Cent er , t he Chi l dr en' s Hospi t al and t he
3
Vet er ans Af f ai r s Medi cal Cent er .
4
And what t he si t e si t s i n i s t he mi ddl e of
5
a cont ext wher e we have wal kabl e st r eet s and bl ocks
6
t o t he sout h, we have a smal l r owhouse nei ghbor hood
7
her e t o t he east , and we have r eal l y a ki nd of
8
subur ban l ayout st yl e hospi t al compl ex wi t h par ki ng
9
l ot s and t al l bui l di ngs, up t o 129 f eet or so, of f t o
10
t he nor t hwest .
11
Ther e' s r eal l y no cent er i n t hi s
12
nei ghbor hood, but t hi s si t e of f er s us t he oppor t uni t y
13
t o cr eat e a gr eat pl ace t hat wi l l benef i t peopl e who
14
wor k her e al r eady, t hat ' l l benef i t t he r esi dent s of
15
Bl oomi ngdal e, St r onghol d and t he ot her r esi dent i al
16
nei ghbor hoods, benef i t peopl e l i vi ng f ur t her t o t he
17
east or goi ng t o school at t he uni ver si t i es i n t hose
18
ar eas, and al so have benef i t f or peopl e over on t he
19
west si de, as wel l .
20
And l i ke I ment i oned, t hi s pl an, one of t he
21
r easons i t ' s si gni f i cant , i t i s a cr eat i ve synt hesi s
22
of pr eser vat i on, open space and devel opment , and i t
202
1
i s appr opr i at e t o bot h cont ext s, t he cont ext of t he
2
l andmar k and t he cont ext of t he ci t y ar ound i t .
3
I n devel opi ng our mast er pl an, we devel oped
4
f our t hemes, heal t h, wat er , pr eser vat i on and
5
sust ai nabi l i t y. Cl ear l y, you' ve hear d about how t hi s
6
si t e was bui l t as a pl ace t o enhance t he publ i c
7
heal t h i n t he begi nni ng of t he 20t h Cent ur y t o
8
pr ovi di ng cl ean dr i nki ng wat er .
9
We t ake t hat t heme f or war d wi t h some of t he
10
wat er t hat we' l l be i nt r oduci ng on t he si t e t hat wi l l
11
be used f or ot her pur poses, such as r ecr eat i on or
12
per haps t r eat i ng st or mwat er . Ri ght now, t he si t e
13
doesn' t have st or mwat er t r eat ment . We' r e usi ng t hat
14
as a t heme t hat you' l l see.
15
Pr eser vat i on, Emi l y has spoken t o aspect s
16
of pr eser vat i on i n t he si t e, wher e we' r e r et ai ni ng
17
t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t s, t he above gr ade
18
st r uct ur es and cr eat i vel y pr oposi ng t he possi bi l i t y
19
of r eusi ng cel l s i n t he par k and i n t he nor t h cour t
20
f or t he r et ai l di st r i ct .
21
And sust ai nabi l i t y, sust ai nabi l i t y not onl y
22
i n t er ms of r ai n gar dens and t r eat i ng st or mwat er on
203
1
si t e, but sust ai nabi l i t y i n t er ms of maki ng a pl an
2
t hat begi ns wi t h t he set t l ement pat t er n, begi ns wi t h
3
maki ng a pl ace wher e peopl e can wal k, shop, r ecr eat e,
4
pl ay Fr i sbee wi t h t hei r ki ds, wal k t hei r dog, go t o
5
t he communi t y cent er , wher e t hey coul d wor k dur i ng
6
t he day.
7
I t ' s a pl ace wher e you don' t have t o move
8
t wo t ons of st eel , as i n your car , t o get a quar t of
9
mi l k. And t hat wi l l be an i mpor t ant f eat ur e of t hi s
10
movi ng f or war d, t o pr ovi de f or t he possi bi l i t y of
11
mor e wal kabi l i t y i n our ci t y, whi ch i s a ver y
12
si gni f i cant benef i t .
13
These t hemes have been devel oped i n t he
14
cour se of our engagement wi t h t he communi t y out r each,
15
f eedback f r omr egul at or y agenci es, t he Hi st or i c
16
Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d and l ot s of communi t y
17
meet i ngs as t hey i ncor por at e t he det ai l s. You wi l l
18
know i t ' s McMi l l an by t he t hemes.
19
Our mast er pl an. We had a ver y pr oduct i ve
20
and f r ui t f ul di al ogue wi t h t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on
21
Revi ew Boar d and wher e we ended up i s not wher e we
22
st ar t ed, I ' mpr oud t o say, and I t hi nk we ended up
204
1
wi t h a much bet t er pl an as a r esul t of our di al ogue
2
and t hei r f eedback. But t hey haven' t been t he onl y
3
ones wei ghi ng i n, we' ve got t en f eedback, as wel l ,
4
f r omt he Of f i ce of Pl anni ng and t he communi t y and al l
5
sor t s of f ol ks.
6
And i t ' s ver y common when doi ng a l ar ge
7
mast er pl an t hat t hi ngs change over t he cour se of
8
t i me, t hat t hey' r e goi ng t o change as needs ar e
9
known, as i ssues ar e vet t ed and under st ood. And t hi s
10
has been a pr oj ect t hat has had, you know, i t ' s had
11
i t s chal l enges i n t er ms of get t i ng our ar ms ar ound
12
al l t he di f f er ent i ssues, because t her e ar e
13
si gni f i cant l y unusual i ssues her e. But I t hi nk t he
14
pl an we' r e br i ngi ng t o you t oday i s r eal l y somet hi ng
15
t hat i s about McMi l l an, but adds ever so much mor e.
16
So t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d,
17
i n gi vi ng out t hei r appr oval , chal l enged us t o come
18
up wi t h somet hi ng speci al and sai d, " Tel l us what t he
19
r oot s of McMi l l an ar e, t el l us what t he DNA i s. Tel l
20
us what you under st and about t he si t e.
21
So what I want t o wal k t hr ough f i r st ar e
22
some of t he most sal i ent aspect s of t he mast er pl an,
205
1
bot h i n t er ms of how t hey or i gi nat ed wi t h t he
2
or i gi nal pl an and t al k about how t hey' r e appl i ed t o
3
t he mast er pl an.
4
So what you see f i r st i s t he t r i par t i t e
5
or gani zat i on t hat Emi l y Ei g spoke about , t hese t hr ee
6
l and- based, separ at ed by t hese t wo ser vi ce cour t s,
7
t he t wo ser vi ce cour t s, whi ch have t he char act er i st i c
8
bui l di ngs and f eat ur es and t he ser vi ce cour t s.
9
The t hi r d i s t he pl i nt h, t he pl ai n.
10
Ol mst ed cal l ed i t t he pl ane, our t eamcal l ed i t t he
11
pl i nt h. As t he gr ade f al l s ar ound t he si t e, t hi s
12
seems t o emer ge out of t he gr ound as a sor t of - - we
13
l i kened i t t o al most sor t of an ai r cr af t car r i er wi t h
14
t hi s bi g pl ane.
15
Next of cour se, i mpor t ant as wel l i n t er ms
16
of our under st andi ng of t he vi ews acr oss t he si t e,
17
acr oss t he si t e f r omNor t h Capi t ol . The f i r st ,
18
acr oss t he ser vi ce cour t s and our par k i n t he sout h,
19
whi ch I ' l l t al k about i n a l i t t l e bi t , memor i al i zes
20
t hat vi ew.
21
And f i nal l y, t he Ol mst ed Wal k, t hi s ver y
22
cr eat i ve wal k t hat Ol mst ed i nvent ed si mpl y t o al l ow
206
1
t he publ i c t o see par t s of t he pl ane, wi t hout
2
per mi t t i ng t hemt o go out t her e. We ar e r emaki ng
3
t hat , r eest abl i shi ng t hat , usi ng t hat as a si gnat ur e
4
el ement of t he mast er pl an.
5
So what ar e doi ng? We have a t r i par t i t e
6
or gani zat i on. We have t he heal t h car e bui l di ngs i n
7
t he nor t h t her e wi t h Cel l 14 and t he heal i ng gar dens.
8
We have t he cent er par t t hat wi l l be mi xed use,
9
r esi dent i al ar ea, and t hen we have t he par k ar ea t o
10
t he sout h. So each of t hese t hr ee ar eas ar e
11
di st i nct , i n and of t hemsel ves.
12
The ser vi ce cour t s ar e mai nt ai ned and
13
enhanced. The hi st or i c f eat ur es i n t hemwi l l become
14
par t of t he new l andscape of t he open desi gn. I n t he
15
nor t h, i t wi l l be a mi xed use envi r onment , we' l l show
16
some pi ct ur es of t hat . And i n t he sout h, par t of t he
17
ei ght - acr e over al l par k i n t he sout her n par t of t he
18
si t e. They' l l be enhanced. And t hese r epor t s ar e
19
al ways used f or t r af f i c, as wel l .
20
The pl i nt h I ment i oned i s mai nt ai ned and
21
we' l l show a sl i de of t hat i n a second. The Ol mst ed
22
Wal k i s r emade and r eest abl i shed ar ound t he per i met er
207
1
of t he si t e t her e, so t he si t e pul l s back f r omt he
2
edges i n or der t o gi ve space t o t he wal k so you can
3
see i t i n i t s cont i nui t y, even r ecal l t he cur vy
4
aspect s at t he nor t h end.
5
And t her e ar e vi ews acr oss, si gni f i cant l y
6
i n t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t her e, t he vi ews
7
acr oss and of cour se, as I ment i oned bef or e, t he
8
vi ews acr oss t he par k i n t he sout her n t hi r d of t he
9
si t e. I t ' s ver y i mpor t ant t o be abl e t o see acr oss.
10
The under gr ound cel l s. We have
11
st r at egi cal l y chosen t hese, so t hat t hi s cel l can
12
pl ay an i mpor t ant r ol l i n t he f ut ur e l i f e of t he
13
nor t h ser vi ce cour t .
14
Br uce Leonar d t al ked about some of t he
15
chal l enges wi t h r et ai l . We bel i eve t hat by i ncl udi ng
16
r et ai l i n t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t t hat i s desi gned t o
17
mar ket st andar ds, we st and a gr eat er chance of
18
i ncl udi ng somet hi ng uni que i n Cel l 14 i n t he
19
nor t heast cor ner . So we t hi nk t hi s i s a possi bi l i t y
20
f or t hat and t hat ' s one of t he r easons why we l ocat ed
21
i t .
22
The ot her r eason i s t hat we pul l ed t he
208
1
bui l di ngs back f r omt he edge of Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet
2
so t hat t hese bui l di ngs woul dn' t bl ock t he vi ew
3
comi ng down Nor t h Capi t ol . Because i f you know t hi s
4
si t e, you know t hat t her e' s a ver y pr omi nent vi ew of
5
t hese si l os. So t he bui l di ngs pul l back, t hose si l os
6
ar e exposed and t he Cel l 14, so t her e' s a sor t of
7
pamphl et set of t he si t e r i ght t her e and al l owi ng
8
t hose vi ews.
9
And t hen i n Cel l 28 i n t he par k,
10
i ncor por at i ng i t as par t of t he l ower l evel , so
11
you' l l be abl e t o be i n t he communi t y cent er and see
12
i nt o t he l ower l evel s of Cel l 28 as par t of t hi s
13
l ar ge par k.
14
One of t he chal l enges, of cour se, i s maki ng
15
deci si ons about wher e t hi s sor t of st r at egy i s best
16
depl oyed. We bel i eve t hat t hese t wo pl aces ar e t he
17
pl aces wher e t he exper i ence of t hat hi st or i c aspect
18
of t he si t e wi l l be most pr of ound. We t hi nk t hat
19
t hat ' s an i mpor t ant par t of t he concept of t he mast er
20
pl an.
21
We have st or mwat er management f eat ur es
22
t hr oughout . Ri ght now, t he si t e i s l acki ng t hese
209
1
st or mwat er management f eat ur es. I n t he nor t h ser vi ce
2
cour t , r ai n gar dens, Hal f St r eet cont ai ns a l i near
3
r ai n gar den and t hen t he sout h ser vi ce cour t cont ai ns
4
a r ai n gar den, as wel l acr oss, movi ng east - west . And
5
t he sout heast er n por t i on of t he par k wi l l have a
6
st or mwat er pond and r ai n gar dens, as wel l .
7
And t hi s i s t he r esul t of an under st andi ng
8
of t he geohydr aul ogy of t he si t e t hat I ' l l show i n a
9
coupl e of mi nut es her e. But we have st or mwat er
10
f eat ur es t hr oughout and t hese wi l l be di dact i c
11
f eat ur es, peopl e wi l l see t hemand under st and how t he
12
si t e' s per f or mi ng, r ecal l i ng agai n t he wat er i n t he
13
whol e mast er pl an t heme.
14
Par ks, heal i ng gar dens wi t h t he heal t h car e
15
bui l di ngs at t he nor t h, Cel l 14 t her e, maki ng t hat
16
si gnat ur e openi ng i nt o t he si t e, and t hen t he ei ght -
17
acr e par k, i ncl udi ng t he sout h ser vi ce cour t at t he
18
bot t omt hi r d, l ocat ed i n a way so t hat t hi s par k not
19
onl y can be par t of t he pl i nt h and memor i al i ze t he
20
r eadi ng of t he pl i nt h, but al so be gr eat er access t o
21
t he Bl oomi ngdal e communi t y and ot her communi t i es t o
22
t he sout h.
210
1
We had ear l i er schemes, whi ch I ' l l show
2
you, t hat had t he par k i n t he cent er . We f el t af t er
3
some di scussi on wi t h t he communi t y t hat t hi s woul d be
4
a par k t hat woul d be seen as mor e of an asset t o
5
communi t i es, not j ust sur r oundi ng t he par k i n t he
6
cent er , but al so communi t i es t o t he east and t o t he
7
sout h.
8
The st r eet net wor k t hat r econnect s McMi l l an
9
t o t he ci t y f abr i c. Oh, we have t he nor t h and sout h
10
ser vi ce cour t s. Ri ght now, t hi s di es dead- end her e.
11
We' l l be i nt r oduci ng r amps so t hat t hi s wi l l be abl e
12
t o be connect ed her e t hr ough t o Fi r st St r eet , so t hat
13
t hi s wi l l be connect ed al l t he way acr oss. The sout h
14
ser vi ce cour t wi l l al so be a pl ace wher e vehi cl es can
15
ent er and connect t o t he st r eet net wor k. Ther e wi l l
16
be access t o t he communi t y cent er her e f r omt he sout h
17
ser vi ce cour t t her e.
18
And know t hi s as wel l . We have Hal f St r eet
19
as our mai n spi ne, a smal l set of st r eet s t hat ar e
20
dr op- of f s f or t he heal t h car e bui l di ngs. But not i ce
21
t he or i ent at i on of t he st r eet s. We have st r eet s and
22
si dewal ks t hr oughout t hat al l ow f or gr eat er mobi l i t y,
211
1
but al so t he or i ent at i on of t he bl ocks or gani zed i n
2
such a way t o r ef er t o t he nor t h- sout h connect i on or
3
a vi sual r el at i onshi p bet ween t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t
4
and t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
5
Emi l y Ei g t al ked about t he coher ence of
6
t hat r el at i onshi p. You' l l be abl e t o st and - - and
7
I ' l l show a pi ct ur e of t hi s - - and see t he hi st or i c
8
el ement s i f you l ook nor t h and sout h on t hese
9
st r eet s.
10
Heal t h car e f aci l i t i es i n t he nor t h her e
11
and al so on t he sout her n si de of t he nor t h ser vi ce
12
cour t . Mul t i f ami l y bui l di ngs l ocat ed her e, t hi s one
13
wi t h a gr ocer y st or e and, al so, t hese wi t h r et ai l on
14
t he gr ound f l oor and t hen r owhouses.
15
What ' s i mpor t ant i s we have bui l di ngs t hat
16
descr i be t he space of t he st r eet t hr oughout . So we
17
have what ' s cal l ed posi t i ve sur vei l l ance, eyes on t he
18
st r eet . McMi l l an wi l l be a pl ace wher e peopl e wi l l
19
see what ' s goi ng on. They' l l f eel good about bei ng
20
i n t he nei ghbor hood because t hey' l l know t hat t her e
21
ar e bui l di ngs cl ose t o t he def i ni t i on of t he st r eet s
22
and t hey' l l be abl e t o see ever yt hi ng t hat ' s
212
1
happeni ng i n t he publ i c space.
2
The communi t y cent er , about 18, 000- squar e
3
f oot communi t y cent er t hat navi gat es t he change i n
4
gr ade f r omt he upper l evel of t he par k t o t he l ower
5
l evel of t he par k. And t hen our r et ai l f r ont age
6
al ong t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t her e at t he base of t he
7
heal t h car e bui l di ngs and at t he base of t hese
8
bui l di ngs, as wel l .
9
Communi t y f ocused r et ai l . We wor ked a l ot
10
wi t h t he communi t y i n t er ms of l i st eni ng t o what
11
t hei r needs wer e and under st andi ng how t o i nt egr at e
12
t hat i nt o t he pl an. Thi s sor t of DNA wi l l sor t of
13
memor i al i ze McMi l l an, you wi l l know i t ' s McMi l l an.
14
So t hi s gi ves you a summar y of t he pr ogr am,
15
I won' t go t hr ough t hi s i n det ai l . But you can see
16
t he way i n whi ch t he par k now on t he sout h r el at es
17
mor e t o t he nei ghbor hoods t o t he sout h. The heal t h
18
car e bui l di ngs compl ex r el at es t o t he heal t h car e
19
bui l di ngs t o t he nor t h.
20
And i t ' s cl ear t hat when t hese ar e bui l t ,
21
peopl e f r omt hese bui l di ngs her e wi l l wal k over and
22
use t he r et ai l or maybe per haps t hey' l l have busi ness
213
1
i n t hese bui l di ngs and wi l l begi n t o t r ansf or mwhat
2
i s a ver y subur ban par t of Washi ngt on wi t h our
3
pr oj ect her e. And t hen t he st r eet s and bl ocks of t he
4
cent er emphasi zi ng t he nor t h- sout h connect i on of t he
5
nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t s, al l r i nged by t he
6
Ol mst ed Wal k.
7
So t he ber m, an i mpor t ant char act er i st i c
8
her e, some hi st or i c pi ct ur es on t op, some pi ct ur es of
9
what i t ' s l i ke t oday. Si nce t he si t e' s been f enced
10
of f , i t ' s cl ear t hat , you know, most peopl e pr obabl y
11
under st and t he si t e t oday by under st andi ng t he ber m.
12
Thi s i s an i somet r i c of our pr oj ect wi t hout
13
most of bui l di ngs. Ther e' s t he sout h ser vi ce cour t ,
14
t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t and t he communi t y bui l di ng.
15
What you can see i s t he way i n whi ch i n our desi gn
16
t he ber mi s pr eser ved and memor i al i zed as t he
17
per i met er of t he si t e.
18
Thi s was somet hi ng t hat was ver y i mpor t ant
19
t o t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d. I n gi vi ng
20
us t hei r appr oval , t hey emphasi zed t he ext ent t o
21
whi ch t he l egi bi l i t y of t he si t e f r omt he ext er i or
22
had t o be under st ood.
214
1
We have an openi ng i nt o t he par k on one
2
par t of t he ber mher e. You pr obabl y know t hat t he
3
si t e si nks down i nt o t he gr ade a l i t t l e bi t at Cel l
4
14 her e, but t he aspect of t he pr oj ect emer gi ng and
5
t he si t e emer gi ng out of t he gr ound wi l l be
6
mai nt ai ned as t he ci t y' s t opogr aphy f al l s away. Thi s
7
wi l l be uni que and i t wi l l be somet hi ng t hat wi l l be
8
an i coni c i mage of McMi l l an f or year s t o come.
9
I ' l l t al k about t he ser vi ce cour t s,
10
r epur posi ng t hem. They have t hese uni que si l os and
11
r egul at or houses t hat Emi l y had t al ked about , some of
12
t he sand washer s. Thi s i s a vi ew of t he sout h
13
ser vi ce cour t above Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet , wi t h t he
14
r owhouse di st r i ct t o t he r i ght . You can see t he
15
wal l s on ei t her si de of t he sout h ser vi ce cour t her e.
16
What ' s i mpor t ant t o not e about t hi s i s t hat
17
r i ght now, because of t he gr ade, you can' t get f r om
18
Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet up i nt o t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
19
So we' l l be i nt r oduci ng publ i c st eps, publ i c ar t ,
20
f ount ai ns and t hi ngs t o announce t he pr esence of
21
McMi l l an, t o i nvi t e peopl e i n, t o i nvi t e t hemi nt o
22
t hi s wonder f ul uni que publ i c space and al so i nt o t he
215
1
par k, f ur t her beyond t he communi t y cent er , so t ot al l y
2
t r ansf or mi ng t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
3
The ser vi ce cour t wal l s. I n some cases i n
4
t he sout h ser vi ce cour t we' l l be mai nt ai ni ng t hem,
5
some of t hemwi l l be used t o f r ame t hi ngs, such as
6
t he ent r y i nt o t he communi t y cent er t her e. So we
7
si t uat ed t he new communi t y cent er i n such a way t hat
8
i t ' s f r amed by t he exi st i ng wal l s of t he sout h
9
ser vi ce cour t and becomes sor t of engaged wi t h t hat
10
i n such a way t hat t her e' s an act i ve di al ogue bet ween
11
new const r uct i on and t he hi st or i c r esour ces.
12
I ment i oned t he Ol mst ed Wal k. Thi s i s a
13
pi ct ur e of i t s condi t i on t oday. Cl ear l y, t he
14
pl ant i ng of t hat wi l l pr ovi de f or yet anot her
15
si gnat ur e pi ece of t he per i met er of t he si t e, as wel l
16
as f or a ni ce pl ace t o wal k on a Sunday af t er noon,
17
t ake t he dog f or a wal k or st r ol l ar ound t her e. I t
18
woul d be a wonder f ul pl ace f or t he nei ghbor hood t o
19
use.
20
And al so i n t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t , we ar e
21
t r ansf or mi ng t hi s i nt o an exci t i ng mi xed use, what
22
Anne Cor bet t has done, a McMi l l an Mai n St r eet , wher e
216
1
we have commer ci al uses, such as t he heal t h car e
2
bui l di ngs, r esi dent i al uses, al l wi t h gr ound f l oor
3
r et ai l .
4
One of t he ni ce t hi ngs about t he nor t h
5
ser vi ce cour t i s t he spaci ng of t he el ement s bet ween
6
t hemcan be used f or per haps out door seat i ng.
7
Regul at or houses can be r epur posed i nt o r est aur ant s
8
or per haps publ i c f aci l i t i es t her e and i t becomes
9
r eal l y a vi br ant pl ace, hopef ul l y wi t h l ot of
10
j aywal ki ng, l i ke t hese peopl e ar e doi ng. Because we
11
know t hat i n r eal l y good publ i c envi r onment s, peopl e
12
j aywal k a l ot and i t ' s a pl ace t hey can be saf e.
13
We' l l al so be r ei nt r oduci ng t he hi st or i c
14
pavi ng, hi st or i c concr et e whi ch was i n t he ser vi ce
15
cour t s t her e and usi ng t hat as a way t o r ecal l t he
16
or i gi ns of t he si t e.
17
The Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Revi ew Boar d al so
18
sai d t o us, " Look, deal wi t h McMi l l an i n t er ms of i t s
19
DNA, bot h i n t er ms of t he br oader concept s and i n
20
t er ms of det ai l ed concept s. " So we went back and we
21
l ooked car ef ul l y at some of t he hi st or i c aspect s of
22
t he si t e and many of t he t hi ngs t hat you see i n
217
1
McMi l l an ar e qui t e uni que t o t he si t e, not t hi ngs
2
t hat you necessar i l y see i n many ot her pl aces.
3
So or exampl e, t he st or age si l os have a
4
ki nd of beaut i f ul ski n pat t er n t hat t al ks about t he
5
di f f er ent concr et e l i f t s, t hat t he pour ed f or m
6
concr et e was used t o make t hi s f or m. I n ot her wor ds,
7
so you see t hi s sor t of pat t er n of r i ngs of concr et e
8
on t hese cyl i nder s.
9
They al so have ver y si mpl e si ngul ar f or ms,
10
si mpl e ar ched openi ng on ei t her si de, t hey' r e not
11
compl ex, t hey' r e ver y pl at oni c i n a sense, ver y
12
si mpl e.
13
When Ol mst ed came on t he si t e, he
14
i nt r oduced t o some of t he ser vi ce cour t wal l s
15
over hangi ng pl ant s t o sof t en t he vi ew of t he pl ace.
16
And t her e ar e subt l e t hi ngs, l i ke t he ent r i es i nt o
17
t he under gr ound cel l s have accent ed pi eces, smal l
18
dent i l s, ar chways t hat poke up above t he wal l s.
19
Fur t her mor e, t hi ngs l i ke t he r ai sed pl i nt h,
20
t he medi cal of f i ce bui l di ngs, heal t h car e cent er at
21
t he nor t h end has i t s own pl i nt h and i s sor t of
22
r ecal l i ng t hat wi t h t he wal l s of t he nor t h ser vi ce
218
1
cour t t hat i t est abl i shes.
2
Veget at i on on pl aces l i ke - - t hat was
3
i nt r oduced on t he sand si l os and some of t he
4
bui l di ngs ar e embr aci ng, t hi s i s an i dea. Fr amed
5
openi ngs, si mpl e openi ngs t hat ar e f r amed by t he
6
r egul at or houses or t he si l os, ver y si mpl e openi ngs,
7
not ver y compl ex.
8
And i nt er est i ng subt l et i es her e, t he
9
ser vi ce cour t wal l i s cant er ed sl i ght l y, t he ent r y t o
10
t he por t al s ver t i cal at 90 degr ees, t he wal l s
11
t hemsel ves cant er ed, al most l i ke a bat t er ed wal l .
12
And we ar e usi ng t hat t hemat i cal l y, as wel l , i n t he
13
nor t h ser vi ce cour t t o make t he r et ai l wal l of t hat
14
cour t .
15
The concer n t hat t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on
16
Revi ew Boar d al so r epr esent ed t o us i s how can t hese
17
bui l di ngs and what you i nt r oduce on t he si t e have a
18
sense of ar chi t ect ur al cohesi on. Because what t hey
19
st r essed t o us was what you i nt r oduce can' t l ook l i ke
20
Bl oomi ngdal e, i t can' t l ook l i ke t he Washi ngt on
21
Hospi t al Cent er acr oss t he st r eet or anyt hi ng ar ound
22
i t , i t has t o have an i nt egr i t y al l of i t s own so
219
1
t hat t he l andmar k i s i dent i f i abl e.
2
So we came up wi t h a uni f i ed pal et t e of
3
mat er i al s. Some of t hemr aw, some of t hemr ef i ned,
4
because what we needed t o do i s t o f i gur e out a way
5
t hat t he smal l bui l di ngs, such as t he r owhouses, and
6
t he medi umsi zed bui l di ngs, l i ke mul t i f ami l y
7
bui l di ngs, coul d seemt o be member s wi t h t he same
8
f ami l y of t he medi cal of f i ce bui l di ngs t o t he nor t h.
9
And t hey al so suggest ed t o us t hat t he
10
r owhouses r eal l y ought t o be composed as si ngul ar
11
bui l di ngs. I n ot her wor ds, i nst ead of ever y r owhouse
12
havi ng a di f f er ent f acade, composed i n such a way
13
t hat t hey l ook as t hough t hey have an or der t hat i s
14
addi ng up t o a gr eat er ki nd of sense of t he bui l di ng,
15
r at her t han j ust separ at e, i ndi vi dual bui l di ngs.
16
So t hese ar e some of t he pr ecedent s we
17
l ooked at , t hese ar e not bui l di ngs at McMi l l an, but
18
we sor t of wer e dr awn t o t hi s pal et t e wi t h t he whi t e
19
wal l s and t he dar ker f enest r at i on and accent i ng
20
col or s and some of t he dar ker ocher col or ed ot her
21
accent s.
22
So what we came up wi t h was t hi s col or
220
1
pal et t e wi t h t he pr i mar y bui l di ng col or , t he
2
f enest r at i on, t he secondar y col or bei ng a char coal
3
col or , and a t er t i ar y col or bei ng sor t of an or angy
4
ocher col or , some aspect s of i t maybe t er r a cot t a,
5
some maybe a wood col or . But t hi s i s r eal l y t he
6
col or pat t er n of McMi l l an.
7
You wi l l know t hat i t ' s McMi l l an because
8
t hese bui l di ngs have a r el at i onshi p and t he r owhouses
9
wi l l have a si mi l ar col or pal et t e t o t he mul t i f ami l y
10
bui l di ngs, whi ch wi l l have a si mi l ar col or pal et t e t o
11
t he heal t h car e bui l di ngs.
12
Why i s t hat i mpor t ant ? So t hat t hey seem
13
as t hough t hey bel ong wi t h each ot her , and we enj oy
14
t he vi r t ues and t he benef i t s of t he mi xed use pr ogr am
15
and t he vi t al i t y t hat t hat br i ngs, but we al so need
16
t o be mi ndf ul t hat McMi l l an i t sel f i s somet hi ng t hat
17
has t o have a coher ent char act er t o i t .
18
So t he r owhouses ar e or gani zed i n gr oupi ngs
19
wher e we have bay wi ndows and smal l symmet r y so t hey
20
add up t o somet hi ng l ar ger t han j ust an i ndi vi dual
21
bui l di ng. Mul t i f ami l y bui l di ng, t hi s i s t he bui l di ng
22
sl at ed f or a gr ocer y st or e at gr ound l evel and t he
221
1
mul t i f ami l y above.
2
And t hen heal t h car e showi ng t he concr et e
3
at t he l ower l evel s r el at i ng t o t he nor t h ser vi ce
4
cour t wi t h t he r et ai l st or e f r ont s and t hen an
5
i nt er medi at e l evel t hat ' s l i ke a pl i nt h and t hen t he
6
upper l evel s woul d pr obabl y be l ar ger t er r a cot t a
7
panel s, al l wor ki ng t oget her f or a coher ent har mony
8
on t he si t e.
9
We al so have spent t i me, as you know, wi t h
10
t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on, r ecei vi ng pr el i mi nar y appr oval
11
t he ot her ni ght . They r evi ewed t he bui l di ng hei ght s
12
and we wor ked ver y cl osel y wi t h t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on
13
and t he st af f of NCPC t o concer ns about t hese.
14
Fr omt he begi nni ng, what we hear d f r omt he
15
nei ghbor hood was t hey want ed t o make sur e t hat t he
16
bui l di ng hei ght s di d not have adver se i mpact s on t he
17
sur r oundi ng nei ghbor hoods. So we have smal l er
18
bui l di ngs st eppi ng up t o t he cor ner , t o t he
19
nor t hwest , wher e t he t al l est bui l di ngs ar e l ocat ed.
20
So t hese ar e sympat het i c t o t he scal e and si ze of t he
21
bui l di ngs on t he east and t he sout h and t he t al l er
22
bui l di ngs l ocat ed so t hat t hey ar e cl oser t o t he
222
1
t al l er bui l di ngs at t he Washi ngt on Hospi t al Cent er
2
and Chi l dr ens.
3
We al so l ooked at l and use wi t h Zoni ng,
4
t al ki ng about t he di f f er ent ki nds of uses t hat wi l l
5
be on t he si t e. I ment i oned heal t h car e, t he r et ai l ,
6
t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t , r esi dent i al , mul t i f ami l y
7
bui l di ngs t her e, r owhouses i n t he cent er of t he pl an,
8
t he communi t y cent er t her e, al l of t hese st r eet s
9
connect i ng, nor t h- sout h.
10
Thi s pl an i s about havi ng a pl ace f or
11
peopl e t o l i ve, wor k, pl ay, vi si t , shop and l ear n
12
hi st or y about t hi s si t e, i t i ncor por at es al l of t hese
13
t hi ngs. And by i ncl udi ng bui l di ngs t hat descr i be and
14
f r ont ont o st r eet s, we' r e pr ovi di ng a saf e pl ace t hat
15
wi l l have a vi t al i t y and a saf et y f or i t t hat wi l l
16
enhance t he nei ghbor hoods ar ound i t .
17
So l et me t al k a l i t t l e bi t about t he
18
evol ut i on of t he pl an. Because as I ment i oned when I
19
st ar t ed, al l maj or , bi g mast er pl ans go t hr ough
20
evol ut i ons. I ' ve never been par t of a mast er pl an
21
t hat di dn' t go t hr ough some sor t of evol ut i on at some
22
poi nt i n t i me.
223
1
And t hi s i s a pl an t hat was done - - we wer e
2
br ought ont o t he pr oj ect i n 2010, but I want t o wal k
3
t hr ough t he evol ut i on of some of t he t hi nki ng t hat
4
went i nt o ear l i er pl ans and some of t hi ngs t hat have
5
evol ved and i nf l uenced us as we began t o cr af t t he
6
pl an t hat we br i ng t o you t oday.
7
The f i r st pl an i n 2008 had f ewer of t he
8
st r uct ur es i n t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t s
9
pr eser ved and you' l l not i ce mi ni mal pr eser vat i on of
10
under gr ound cel l s and you' l l not i ce t her e' s al most no
11
par k, an i mpor t ant aspect t o see acr oss t he si t e.
12
I n 2011, we t al ked ser i ousl y and devel oped
13
a ser i ous appr oach t o pr eser vi ng t he st r uct ur es i n
14
t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t , i nt egr at i ng Cel l
15
14 i nt o t hat pl an. And t hi s case I ment i oned
16
ear l i er , t he par k i n t he cent er of t he pl an. Thi s i s
17
t he ver si on of t hat t hat di d t hat .
18
We al so par t i al l y r est or ed t he Ol mst ed Wal k
19
her e on t wo si des of t he si t e her e, whi ch was not i n
20
t he ear l i er pl an. I t i ncl udes mor e pr eser vat i on, a
21
l i t t l e bi t mor e of t he Ol mst ed Wal k and a par k i n t he
22
cent er of t he si t e wi t h t he communi t y cent er i n
224
1
t her e.
2
The pl an we br i ng t o you t oday r eal l y
3
i ncl udes t hese yel l ow bands of adapt i ve r euse
4
pr eser vat i on her e, Cel l 14 i n t he nor t h ser vi ce
5
cour t , t he sout h ser vi ce cour t and t he par k. And
6
what does t he par k do f or us? The par k gi ves us t he
7
pl i nt h at i t s most dr amat i c l ocat i on, i t gi ves us t he
8
vi ews acr oss. I t al l ows us t o di spl ay a sor t of
9
st or mwat er ar ea as par t of t he l ower l evel of t he
10
par k, and I ' l l t al k about t hat i n a second, and t he
11
f ul l r est or at i on of t he per i met er of t he si t e, t he
12
Ol mst ed Wal k.
13
So t hi s has been an i mpor t ant evol ut i on f or
14
us, i t ' s been an i mpor t ant di al ogue wi t h l ot s of
15
di f f er ent gr oups. We f eel ver y conf i dent t hat t hi s
16
i s t he best ver si on we' ve done, we t hi nk i t ' s
17
si gni f i cant and speci al and of ver y hi gh qual i t y.
18
I ' l l j ust t al k a l i t t l e bi t mor e about t he
19
evol ut i on of t he open space because t her e was al so a
20
ver y st r ong sense on t he par t of t he communi t y t hat
21
t he pl an needed t o i ncl ude mor e open space.
22
So t hi s i s a December 2008 pl an, si x acr es
225
1
of open space cent er ed on t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce
2
cour t s. I n 2011, ni ne acr es, a l i t t l e bi gger par k i n
3
t he cent er . Ther e was a sense t hat t hi s was per haps
4
not bi g enough and so by vi r t ue of movi ng t hi s par k
5
t o t he bot t om, we got a l ar ger par k, we wer e abl e t o
6
get t he vi ew al l t he way acr oss, have t he pi ece of
7
McMi l l an and t he pl i nt h wher e i t ' s most dr amat i c. So
8
t he pl an we' r e br i ngi ng you t oday, as I ment i oned
9
bef or e, i ncl udes al l of t hat .
10
So t hat evol ut i on has been an i mpor t ant
11
par t of our t hi nki ng and an i mpor t ant par t of how we
12
wei gh di f f er ent i mper at i ves wi t h t he pr oj ect .
13
So t hi s i s Col umbi a Hei ght s. We ar e not
14
seeki ng t o make a Col umbi a Hei ght s. We know McMi l l an
15
wi l l be a uni que pl ace and a uni que pr oj ect and i t
16
wi l l be a uni que nei ghbor hood. But we t hought i t
17
mi ght be usef ul t o have a sense of t he scal e of t he
18
McMi l l an 25 acr es and compar e i t t o somet hi ng t hat ' s
19
under gone what we al l bel i eve i s a ver y posi t i ve
20
t r ansf or mat i on r ecent l y i n Col umbi a Hei ght s. Thi s i s
21
t he smal l pl aza at Col umbi a Hei ght s t her e. Thi s i s
22
USA - - what ' s i t cal l ed - - DC USA r i ght t her e, and
226
1
t hi s i s t he par k at McMi l l an.
2
So you can see t hi s i s t he bal ance of t he
3
25 acr es of McMi l l an.
4
We have a chance wi t h t hi s pr ogr am, wi t h
5
t hi s pr oj ect and t he vi t al i t y t hat comes wi t h i t t o
6
be as t r ansf or mat i ve as Col umbi a Hei ght s has been.
7
I t ' l l be di f f er ent , i t ' l l be uni que, i t wi l l have
8
di f f er ent aspect s t o i t , but i t wi l l have t hi s
9
beaut i f ul par k and open space at t he sout her n end,
10
but i t wi l l al so have devel opment t hat wi l l br i ng a
11
vi t al i t y t o t hat par t of t own.
12
Let me wal k you ar ound t he si t e a l i t t l e
13
bi t her e. Thi s i s t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t , McMi l l an
14
Mai n St r eet her e. You can see her e t he si l os and t he
15
r egul at or houses i n t he cent er . Thi s i s Nor t h
16
Capi t ol St r eet t her e wi t h t he si dewal k al ong t her e,
17
Cel l 14, and t hen you can see our r et ai l si t es wi t h
18
t he bui l di ngs on ei t her si de of t he nor t h ser vi ce
19
cour t .
20
We have pushed t he bui l di ngs back, we
21
needed t o make t hi s a l i t t l e bi t wi der i n or der t o be
22
abl e t o accommodat e si dewal ks and par al l el par ki ng
227
1
and t he possi bi l i t y of havi ng out door di ni ng and
2
act i vi t i es on si dewal ks t her e. So t he par t of t he
3
nor t h ser vi ce cour t wal l s t hat we' r e r et ai ni ng i s
4
associ at ed onl y wi t h Cel l 14. But you can see Cel l
5
14 and how pr omi nent i t i s and al so t he si l os and t he
6
sandwasher and t he ent r y t o t he si t e.
7
You can see as wel l t he way i n whi ch t he
8
bui l di ngs st ep back above t he f i r st f l oor . Thi s i s
9
somet hi ng t hat t he HPRB was qui t e i nt er est ed i n i n
10
t er ms of gi vi ng hi st or i c el ement s r oomt o br eat he,
11
but at t he same t i me, per haps r ecal l i ng t he wal l of
12
t he ser vi ce cour t wi t h t hi s l ower wal l of t he r et ai l
13
devel opment at gr ound f l oor .
14
So t he bui l di ngs pay r espect t o t he
15
l andmar ks i n t he cent er of t he si t e, t hey r ecal l t he
16
l i ni ng of t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t wi t h r et ai l and
17
t hey i nt egr at e di f f er ent uses bet ween t he cel l s and
18
t he r egul at or houses, as wel l .
19
So as I sai d, we expect t hi s t o be a
20
vi br ant pl ace wi t h peopl e j aywal ki ng and havi ng
21
di nner and meet i ng f r i ends and al so under st andi ng t he
22
hi st or y of t he si t e.
228
1
I shoul d al so ment i on, as I sai d bef or e, by
2
i ncl udi ng Cel l 14 i n t hi s l ocat i on, i t i s our
3
cont ent i on t hat i t makes r edevel opment and r euse
4
possi bi l i t i es f or t hi s mor e possi bl e by associ at i ng
5
wi t h t he act i ve uses her e.
6
You can see, as wel l , t he way i n whi ch t he
7
pl i nt h of t he heal t h car e bui l di ngs t o t he nor t h ar e
8
set back, r ecal l i ng t he pl i nt h of t he si t e. And you
9
can' t see i t so wel l her e, but t he ar chi t ect s of t hi s
10
bui l di ng, Shal omBar anes Associ at es, ar e al so usi ng
11
vi nes and scr eens on t he f acades of t hose bui l di ngs,
12
r ecal l i ng some of t he vi nes t hat Ol mst ed had pl ant ed
13
on t he si l os i n t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t s.
14
I ment i oned t hi s bef or e, r epur posi ng t he
15
r egul at or houses, t he possi bi l i t y wi t h r et ai l and t he
16
spaces i n bet ween f or act i ve publ i c use. And of
17
cour se, t hi s i s one of t he si l os and you can see t he
18
gr ound f l oor of t he r esi dent i al bui l di ng wi t h r et ai l ,
19
act i ve r et ai l , f ocusi ng out on t he space i n t he
20
st r eet .
21
Thi s i s a vi ew st andi ng at what we cal l
22
Hal f St r eet , whi ch i s a st r eet i n t he mi ddl e of t he
229
1
pl an, l ooki ng sout h. And we ment i oned bef or e t he need
2
t o have a coher ent and vi si bl e connect i on bet ween t he
3
hi st or i c r esour ces i n t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t and
4
hi st or i c r esour ces i n t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
5
Thi s gi ves you a sense of t hat vi ew i nt o
6
t he par k, f eat ur i ng t he si l o, her e i n t hi s par t i cul ar
7
case r ender ed wi t h t he possi bi l i t y of a publ i c
8
st ai r case up and a ki nd of l ookout at t he t op.
9
Fr ami ng t he bui l di ngs, f r ami ng t he vi ews
10
i nt o t hat par t , a ki nd of si mpl e ar chi t ect ur e t hat i s
11
desi gned not t o over power t he l andmar k, but yet ,
12
compl i ment i t i n t er ms of i t s col or pal et t e and i t s
13
f or mand i t s wel l sust ai nabl e f eat ur es i nt egr at ed
14
i nt o t he si t e.
15
So what you see her e i s a l i near r ai n
16
gar den r unni ng up and down Hal f St r eet , you can see
17
pavi ng up and down t he st r eet her e, t hi s wi l l be
18
per vi ous pavi ng wher e t he car s ar e par ked. So t he
19
si t e, i n a way, t he desi gn wi l l t each peopl e about
20
t he sust ai nabi l i t y, t hey' l l be abl e t o see t he
21
sust ai nabl e el ement s t o t r eat st or mwat er i n an act i ve
22
way. Our pl an her e i s r eal l y t o suppor t and
230
1
di st i ngui sh t he l andmar k, but not compet e wi t h i t .
2
I ment i oned t he sout h ser vi ce cour t . I
3
j ust want t o t al k about t he way i n whi ch t hese
4
bui l di ngs - - agai n, t hey' r e backgr ound, t hey' r e
5
si mpl e massi ng, si mpl e set backs at t he skyl i ne,
6
r et ai ni ng sor t of a doubl e si dewal k condi t i on on t he
7
sout h ser vi ce cour t i nsi de i t t her e, so we' l l have
8
pl ent y of ways f or t he publ i c t o ci r cul at e and ways
9
t o move down i nt o t he par k.
10
The par k syst emher e, I ment i oned bef or e
11
t he heal i ng gar dens, Cel l 14 and t he par k, and al so
12
t hese l i near par ks as par t of t he Ol mst ed Wal k up on
13
t he nor t h and sout h si des - - east and west si des,
14
excuse me - - and al so, t he l i near r ai n gar dens i n t he
15
cent er of t he pl an.
16
The hydr ol ogy i s i mpor t ant . Our l andscape
17
ar chi t ect s, Nel son, Byr d, Wol z, wor ked ver y har d t o
18
desi gn publ i c spaces t hat ar e uni que f or McMi l l an and
19
t o come up wi t h t hi s desi gn f or t he par k, t hat i s of
20
McMi l l an and no ot her pl ace. So i t ' s i mpor t ant - -
21
Ki r k Met t amment i oned Ti ber Cr eek comi ng down i n t hi s
22
l ocat i on acr oss t he sout heast cor ner of t he si t e.
231
1
Thi s i s a sket ch t hat Nel son, Byr d, Wol z
2
di d, wor ki ng wi t h t he t eam, showi ng how t he Ti ber
3
Cr eek comi ng t hr ough her e coul d be memor i al i zed. And
4
t hen a st or mwat er ar ea, a l ower l evel of t he cr eek
5
open t o Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet , t he smal l amphi t heat er
6
f ocusi ng t owar ds t he east t o t he upper l evel of t he
7
par k and Cel l 28, t he communi t y cent er and t hen t hi s
8
sor t of open expanse acr oss t hat si t e.
9
And Nel son, Byr d, Wol z has i ncl uded a pl ant
10
t axonomy, a l i st of pl ant s t hat wi l l be depl oyed t hat
11
ar e based upon t he Ol mst ed pl ant i ng scheme f or t he
12
si t e. Some of t hemar e i nvasi ve speci es, don' t ask
13
me whi ch ones, but t hei r pl an f or t he pl ant i ng of t he
14
si t e i ncl udes t hi ngs l i ke t he Hawt hor ne t r ees and
15
ot her t hi ngs t hat Ol mst ed had used i n t hei r
16
i nvent or y.
17
The par k i t sel f i ncl udes di f f er ent pl aces.
18
Ther e' s a bosque t hat has a pl ay ar ea i nsi de t he
19
bosque and I ' l l show you a pi ct ur e of t hat i n a
20
second. Fur t her t o t he east i s an i nt er act i ve wat er
21
pl ay ar ea t hat ' s par t of t he si l os t her e and t he ki ds
22
wi l l be abl e t o enj oy, f ami l i es can come when t he
232
1
weat her i s good and spl ash ar ound i n t he wat er . And
2
t hen we have open pl ay l awn ar eas t hat st r et ch acr oss
3
a ver y l ar ge por t i on of t he si t e, east t o west .
4
Thi s j ust gi ves you an i dea of some of t he
5
el ement s t hat woul d be i n t he bosque pl aygr ound, some
6
of t he t hi ngs t hat ar e r ecal l i ng McMi l l an f r om
7
t unnel s and r amps and pl ay ar eas t hat ' l l be si t uat ed
8
t her e, pl aces f or peopl e of al l ages, al t hough I
9
don' t t hi nk I ' l l be cr awl i ng ar ound i n any of t hese
10
t hi ngs, but pl aces f or ki ds and passi ve ar eas f or
11
adul t s.
12
And t hen t hi ngs t hat ar e r el at ed t o
13
McMi l l an' s t heme, such as sand and wat er pl ay and
14
sl i des, per haps r ecal l i ng r amps and even some of t he
15
spr ay j et s, t he wat er f ount ai ns t hat wi l l be par t of
16
t he publ i c space of t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
17
Ext er i or t o t hi s ar ea i n t he par k, goi ng up
18
Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet , we have a br i dge and a sor t of
19
por t al i nt o t he par k. The Hawt hor ne t r ees of t he
20
Ol mst ed Wal k cont i nue acr oss, but on Nor t h Capi t ol
21
St r eet , you' l l be abl e t o see i nt o t he par k and see
22
t he communi t y cent er bui l di ng and see t he publ i c
233
1
pl aces t hat ar e par t of t hat and t he amphi t heat er .
2
So we r eal l y want Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet t o be engaged.
3
Thi s wi l l be a speci al pl ace, a speci al exper i ence.
4
But on t he ot her si de, t he f ar west si de of
5
t he par k, you' l l be abl e t o exper i ence t he vast
6
expanse of McMi l l an, t her e' s t he communi t y cent er ,
7
and al so see t he r el at i onshi p of t he hi st or i c
8
el ement s t o t he par k.
9
So t hese ar e t he si l os and t he r egul at or
10
houses on t he sout h ser vi ce cour t as t hey ar e t oday.
11
They wi l l have a r el at i onshi p t o t hi s gr een space,
12
r i nged by t he space of t he Hawt hor ne t r ees and t he
13
sor t of per i met er wal k, ver y, ver y much r epr esent i ng
14
t he scal e of t hat vi ew acr oss t he si t e. And t hat
15
vi ew pr evi ousl y was about r i ght her e, l ooki ng t hi s
16
way.
17
You can see how al l t hat comes t oget her
18
wi t h t he ent r y f r omNor t h Capi t ol , t he st or mwat er ,
19
t he communi t y cent er si t uat ed bot h t o navi gat e t he
20
l evel her e, engage Cel l 28, on t he l ower l evel , t he
21
communi t y cent er and engage t he sout h ser vi ce cour t .
22
I shoul d al so ment i on we ar e put t i ng back
234
1
t he st ai r s. Ther e wer e cor ner st ai r s t hat Ol mst ed
2
had i ncl uded t o access t he Ol mst ed Wal k, so we' r e
3
put t i ng t hose back i nt o t he pl an.
4
So t he communi t y cent er bui l di ng i s
5
concei ved of - - by 18, 000 squar e f eet - - concei ved t o
6
be ver y si mpl e geomet r y. We don' t want somet hi ng
7
t hat ' s so compl ex t hat i t compet es wi t h t he
8
l andmar ks, so i t ' s a si mpl e r ect angul ar f or m. Ther e
9
wi l l be a pool at t he l ower l evel and t hen changi ng
10
r ooms, t he l ocker r ooms opposi t e t hat and t hen al so
11
r ooms f or t he communi t y on t he second f l oor so t hey
12
can see out i nt o t he pool and out over i nt o t he par k.
13
That s t hat vi ew t hat we j ust saw.
14
The communi t y cent er al so f r ames vi ews up
15
and down, so t hi s l oggi a, you' l l be abl e t o wal k up a
16
set of st ai r s and sor t of wal k al ong, see i nt o t he
17
communi t y cent er and see out i nt o t he par k and upper
18
and l ower l evel s. The ent r y I ment i oned bef or e
19
f r ami ng i t .
20
Thi s i s a l i t t l e bi t of t he pl an. The onl y
21
t hi ng I ' l l poi nt out about t he pl an, her e s t he pool ,
22
i s t he maj or way movi ng, r esol vi ng. The gr ade i s a
235
1
r amp, whi ch r ecal l s t he r amps t hat exi st t her e t oday
2
on t he si t e. So a sect i on t hr ough t he communi t y
3
cent er , an i mpor t ant publ i c ameni t y.
4
Her e, t hi s i s t he sout h ser vi ce cour t . You
5
can see t he l ower l evel her e. You' l l be abl e t o see
6
i nt o t he cel l her e f r omt hat and t her e wi l l be
7
exhi bi t s t her e expl ai ni ng how t hat was used and what
8
you coul d see her e. And t hen t hi s shows t he l ower
9
l evel of t he par k, Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet , and how t he
10
bui l di ng i s a t wo- st or y st r uct ur e t hat navi gat es
11
bet ween t hose t wo l evel s.
12
I n t he l ower l evel her e, we' l l be usi ng
13
concr et e t o r ecal l - - t hi s i s new const r uct i on, but
14
i t r ecal l s t he f or mand t he l ower l evel s t he vaul t s
15
at McMi l l an, so i t wi l l be of McMi l l an, you wi l l know
16
i t ' s McMi l l an.
17
We have t he r egul at or houses. Ther e ar e
18
sever al di f f er ent opt i ons avai l abl e f or how t hese can
19
be r epur posed. One i s per haps pr eser vi ng t hemi n
20
t hei r hi st or i c condi t i on. A second woul d be r eusi ng
21
t hem, per haps, as a publ i c r est r oomand smal l r et ai l
22
space. They' r e r eal l y ni cel y si zed, beaut i f ul l y
236
1
cr af t ed. They' r e ut i l i t ar i an, but t hey have a sense
2
of char act er al l t hei r own. Or t hey coul d be used
3
over al l as a r et ai l space, as wel l .
4
So t he next sl i de shows j ust how i t mi ght
5
be a cof f ee shop or somet hi ng t her e t hat coul d be
6
r eused and we t hi nk t hat t hat woul d be a gr eat way t o
7
br i ng back t he char act er i nt o t he si t e.
8
The si l os ar e per haps a t ad mor e
9
compl i cat ed i n t he sense t hat t hey have a st r uct ur e
10
i n t he cent er . The sand sat t her e and t her e was a
11
nozzl e t hat t he sand came out of . Ther e' s a ver y l ow
12
cei l i ng i nsi de t her e, not t o ment i on t he f act t hat
13
t hey wer e pour ed of a ki nd of uni f i ed concr et e
14
st r uct ur e, so adapt i ng t hemf or ot her use i s
15
somet hi ng we' r e st i l l st udyi ng. But t hey coul d be
16
used f or si t e st or age, f or ot her t hi ngs. They
17
pr esent a l i t t l e bi t mor e of a chal l enge t han t he
18
r egul at or houses, at l east as f ar as t he i nt er i or i s
19
concer ned.
20
But we do t hi nk on t he ext er i or , t hey can
21
be used t o go up and st and on t op and t ake a l ook out
22
over t he whol e si t e. And i t woul d be qui t e a l ot of
237
1
f un t o desi gn a st ai r t o have t hat ki nd of publ i c
2
f eat ur e f or t he si t e.
3
Publ i c ar t i s a ver y i mpor t ant par t of t he
4
pl an f or McMi l l an. We have a f ai r l y r obust t axonomy
5
of opt i ons f r ompl ace wher e we t al k about how t o gi ve
6
char act er t o t he gat her i ng spaces. And t hese ar e not
7
speci f i c sl i des, t hese ar e j ust meant t o gi ve a ki nd
8
of over al l appr oach.
9
But r eusi ng some of t he mat er i al s on t he
10
si t e, pl acement s f or cont empor ar y ar t , pl acement s f or
11
i nt egr at ed st r eet scape desi gn. These wi l l al l be
12
i nt egr at ed as we devel op t he publ i c ar t pl an.
13
When you l ook at t he si t e, as wel l , and al l
14
of t he di f f er ent possi bl e oppor t uni t i es f or ar t i st i c
15
i nt er vent i on, you can see cer t ai nl y t he oppor t uni t i es
16
r el at ed t o t he nor t h and sout h ser vi ce cour t s and how
17
one woul d memor i al i ze var i ous i deas, but al l t he
18
di f f er ent pl aces t hat we' ve l i st ed, at l east
19
i ni t i al l y, t hat show oppor t uni t i es f or t hat ki nd of
20
nar r at i ve expl anat i on of what McMi l l an was about .
21
The l i ght i ng pl an. Ther e' s a l i ght i ng pl an
22
t hat i s of McMi l l an. You wi l l know you' r e i n
238
1
McMi l l an by t he l i ght i ng pl an. We have upl i ght i ng on
2
t he Hawt hor ne al l ee on t he upper l evel of t he ber m.
3
We have l i ght i ng t hat l i ght s t he ber mher e and
4
hi ghl i ght s t hat and we' l l show you a pi ct ur e of t hat .
5
I t ' s desi gned speci f i cal l y t o hi ghl i ght t he hi st or i c
6
f eat ur es, but we al so want i t t o be a saf e pl ace wi t h
7
t he l i ght i ng pl an.
8
And t hen i t ' s i mpor t ant t o get t he l i ght i ng
9
r i ght f or t he hi st or i c el ement s, so we have l i ght i ng
10
- - we' ve been st udyi ng l i ght i ng f i xt ur es t hat coul d
11
be i nst al l ed t o wash l i ght ar ound t he cyl i ndr i cal
12
shape of t he si l os and hi ghl i ght t hemas hi st or i c
13
f eat ur es.
14
So Anne showed t hi s bef or e, i t ' s one of our
15
char act er i st i c i mages of McMi l l an dur i ng t he day. We
16
have a ni ght t i me shot as wel l her e. Thi s i s a vi ew
17
showi ng t he hi ghl i ght i ng of t he Hawt hor ne t r ees
18
ar ound t he per i met er and of t he ber mt her e and how
19
t hat wi l l be exper i enced at ni ght .
20
And t hen r ecal l i ng t he r oof of t he
21
communi t y cent er and skyl i ght conf i gur at i on,
22
r ecal l i ng t he pat t er n of skyl i ght s and br i ngi ng l i ght
239
1
i nt o some of t he under gr ound cel l s and r eal l y
2
l i ght i ng i t i n such a way t hat i t wi l l be a beaut i f ul
3
pl ace, a pl ace t hat ' s act i ve and usef ul , a pl ace t hat
4
memor i al i zes hi st or y and a pl ace t hat br i ngs new
5
vi t al i t y t o t hi s par t of t he ci t y, not ci t ywi de.
6
So we j ust want t o cl ose wi t h a shor t vi deo
7
t hat gi ves you a sense, t hr ee- di mensi onal l y, of what
8
t he mast er pl an ent ai l s.
9
( The wi t ness pl ays a vi deo. )
10
THE WI TNESS: You' r e over Nor t h Capi t ol
11
St r eet her e, Nor t h Capi t ol and Channi ng. Looki ng
12
i nt o t he par k, movi ng up Nor t h Capi t ol , t he sout h
13
ser vi ce cour t . Cr eat i ng access, vi si bi l i t y.
14
A l i t t l e f ur t her nor t h, t he mul t i f ami l y
15
bui l di ngs and t he r et ai l t her e, t he bui l di ngs pushed
16
back t o gi ve you a vi ew i nt o t he hi st or i c el ement s,
17
t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t . Movi ng i nt o t he nor t h
18
ser vi ce cour t , t he r et ai l di st r i ct on a snowy day.
19
The way i n whi ch t he set back gi ves mor e space t o t he
20
hi st or i c el ement s.
21
Now we' r e t ur ni ng t o go down Hal f St r eet
22
and you' l l see t he r owhouses pi cki ng up and t he way
240
1
t he r hyt hmof t he r owhouses f ocuses your eye down
2
t owar ds t he hi st or i c el ement s.
3
A possi bl e use of t he sout h ser vi ce cour t
4
f or ei t her ar t i st i c f ai r s or f ar mer s mar ket s. I t ' s
5
t he ki nd of pl ace t hat can be managed and pur posed
6
f or many di f f er ent t hi ngs, r eal l y a pl ace t hat woul d
7
become an i mpor t ant par t of t he communi t y.
8
And t hen a vi ew i nt o t he communi t y cent er
9
and t he pool and t he gl ass of t he communi t y cent er
10
engagi ng t he par k out si de. And a vi ew out over t he
11
t er r ace amphi t heat er and a vi ew acr oss t he par k f r om
12
t he west .
13
So our mast er pl an i s uni que, i t ' s
14
cohesi ve, i t ' s of t he pl ace, i t ' s t r ansf or mat i ve, i t
15
br i ngs t he vi t al i t y and t he benef i t s of mi xed use
16
devel opment and oppor t uni t y t o t he ci t y, r epur posi ng
17
t he l andmar k. I t br i ngs i t al so t o t he nei ghbor hood.
18
I t ' s hi gh qual i t y and i t ' s uni quel y McMi l l an. You
19
wi l l know you' r e at McMi l l an. Thank you.
20
21
MS. BROWN: J ust a coupl e of qui ck
22
quest i ons.
241
1
J UDGE BYRNE: Sur e.
2
3
Q Mr. Bell, you went through a couple of the
4
alternatives that you studied prior to the current
5
plan and the earlier plan had more demolition of
6
historic structures, correct?
7
8
Q The berms --
9
A Yes.
10
Q -- the Olmsted Walk.
11
12
Q Now that we are where we are, do you think
13
this project of special merit could be accomplished
14
if we demolished even fewer cells, underground cells?
15
A I t hi nk i n a pr oj ect l i ke t hi s, what you' r e
16
t r yi ng t o do i s t o bal ance t he benef i t s of t hr ee
17
t hi ngs, pr eser vat i on, open space and devel opment .
18
And i t i s t hat equi l i br i umt hat makes t hi s a speci al
19
pl an.
20
And by l ocat i ng and put t i ng t he cel l s and
21
l ocat i ng t hemwher e we have i n t he mast er pl an, i t
22
gi ves t hema ver y i mpor t ant r ol e t o pl ay i n t el l i ng
242
1
t he st or y about McMi l l an. So we t hi nk i t ' s
2
appr opr i at e and t he r i ght si ze f or McMi l l an.
3
MS. BROWN: Thank you, no mor e quest i ons.
4
5
MS. FERSTER: Yes, I have some quest i ons.
6
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
7
BY MS. FERSTER:
8
Q Sir, would you mind going to Slide 32?
9
A I don' t mi nd, but t he comput er seems t o be
10
havi ng i ssues.
11
Q While we're waiting, you did have some
12
mention of the preservation of Cell 14 and then
13
there's parts of Cells 28 and 29 that are being
14
preserved, is that correct?
15
A Wel l , Cel l 28, por t i ons of i t , i s par t of
16
t he exper i ence of t he l ower l evel , t he communi t y
17
cent er . Cel l 29 i s par t of t he l ower l evel par k, of
18
t he sout heast cor ner .
19
Q And Cell 14 is the cell that's going to be
20
preserved intact?
21
A Wel l , you know, as peopl e have sai d
22
pr evi ous t o me, our i nt ent i on i s t o r epur pose and
243
1
r ei nt egr at e i t wi t h what we' r e desi gni ng. So I ' mnot
2
qui t e sur e what you mean by i nt act .
3
Q Well, I guess my question is as an
4
architect, is it your intention to preserve Cell 14?
5
A Yes, we woul d l i ke Cel l 14 t o be abl e t o
6
t el l t he st or y of McMi l l an, whet her i t ' s as Mr .
7
Met t amment i oned, you know, sor t of st abi l i zi ng i t so
8
peopl e coul d see i t bet t er and under st and i t or
9
act ual l y r epur posi ng i t , whi ch has i t s chal l enges, as
10
Mr . Leonar d has ar t i cul at ed.
11
Q And you heard Ms. Eig's testimony, that she
12
didn't think -- and do you agree that -- as I heard
13
her testimony, that she did not think it was possible
14
to preserve Cell 14. Do you agree with that
15
testimony or not?
16
A I don' t t hi nk she sai d i t was i mpossi bl e, I
17
t hi nk she sai d i t had i t s chal l enges. I t hi nk t hi s
18
t eami s ver y sober about t he chal l enges.
19
Q But do you think it can be done?
20
A We' r e goi ng t o t r y.
21
Q Okay. And do you think after you try, it
22
can be done, is it possible?
244
1
A I f I coul d pr ognost i cat e t he f ut ur e, I
2
woul dn' t be her e, I mean do you see what I ' msayi ng?
3
I mean we' r e goi ng t o gi ve our best pr of essi onal
4
ef f or t t o maki ng t hat par t of t he McMi l l an pl an and
5
so we have made a pl an t hat al l ows t hat t o be
6
possi bl e.
7
Q Okay, but would you try if you thought it
8
were impossible to do?
9
A I f I t hought i t was i mpossi bl e, woul d I
10
t r y? I don' t t hi nk so. I t hi nk i t ' s possi bl e, yes.
11
Q Okay, thank you. All right, so here we are
12
at Slide 32. So this is the passive recreation that
13
I assume will occur on top of Cells 25 and 26, that's
14
correct?
15
A Wel l , ar en' t t hose t he ones t hat ar e bei ng
16
r emoved by D. C. Wat er ? I don' t t hi nk t hey' r e t her e
17
any mor e.
18
Q It's in that location.
19
A Yes, i t ' s i n t hat l ocat i on, yeah.
20
Q And then Cells 28 and 29 are the cells that
21
are going to be partially -- yes?
22
A Yes.
245
1
Q And those cells are under the community
2
center.
3
A No, t hey ar e adj acent t o t he communi t y
4
cent er . I f you go t o t he sect i on, you can see - -
5
what we' r e pr oposi ng i s bei ng abl e t o see i nt o t hose
6
cel l s f r omt he l ower l evel of t he communi t y cent er .
7
Q Okay, can you go to I think it was Slide
8
20?
9
A I s t hat t he one you want ?
10
Q Yes, and actually, yeah, if you could also
11
then go to Slide 15. Yeah, so this slide shows the
12
heights of the buildings that will be basically
13
surrounding the sand towers on the north court. And
14
the views that you showed us of the sand filtration
15
site were taken from within the site.
16
A Some of t hem.
17
Q Some of them. I did not see any views in
18
your presentation that were taken outside. Were
19
there some there?
20
A Wel l , Vi ew 20 i s act ual l y acr oss Nor t h
21
Capi t ol St r eet , i t ' s not on t he si t e, t hi s one.
22
Q I guess my question would be if you're
246
1
standing on Michigan Avenue and you're at ground
2
level on Michigan Avenue, can you see the sand
3
filtration towers?
4
A I f you l ook down Hal f St r eet .
5
Q So you'll be able to see how many sand
6
filtration towers if you look down Half Street?
7
A Thi s i s Hal f St r eet r i ght t her e.
8
Q You'll be able to see one.
9
A Ri ght . But you pr obabl y, di agonal l y, you
10
coul d see t hese t wo, as wel l , on t he nor t h ser vi ce
11
cour t . The spaci ng i s i nt er est i ng, you know, t he
12
st r eet f i t s t hr ough t her e and so i f you' r e up her e,
13
you get t o see t hat one and t hat one, t hen you have a
14
sense of t he di st ance of t hat one.
15
Q Okay, so you could see maybe three if
16
you're standing in that location.
17
A Yeah, dependi ng on wher e you' r e st andi ng.
18
Q And if you're standing farther over on the
19
other side of Michigan Avenue, that would be in the
20
area of the hospital facility, can you see the sand
21
filtration towers from that vantage point?
22
A You mean f r omover t her e?
247
1
Q Yes.
2
A You coul d pr obabl y see some of t hem,
3
pr obabl y t he same exper i ence. I t ' s not so ver y
4
di f f er ent f r omst andi ng her e t o st andi ng t her e.
5
Q So one and three, okay. And then I think
6
you probably would agree that the views of the towers
7
are significantly altered by the height of the
8
construction on Michigan Avenue, isn't that correct?
9
A Wel l , a one- st or y bui l di ng woul d occl ude
10
your vi ew, as wel l , r i ght ? Because i f you' r e on
11
gr ade, a one- st or y bui l di ng, you woul dn' t see i t
12
anyhow, r i ght ?
13
Q But if you moved farther away --
14
A You st i l l woul dn' t see i t i f i t was a one-
15
st or y bui l di ng.
16
Q -- the Armed Forces Retirement Home, you
17
wouldn't see them.
18
A I don' t t hi nk I t est i f i ed t o t hat ,
19
act ual l y, t he vi ew, I don' t t hi nk I t est i f i ed t o t he
20
vi ews f r omt he Ar med For ces Ret i r ement Home.
21
Q Okay, that's fine. I'll be happy to ask
22
that question of somebody else. Okay, so there was a
248
1
slide that you showed of the Columbia Heights
2
development and I didn't jot down what number it was.
3
Here we go. Okay, and you said that this was similar
4
to Columbia Heights.
5
A I di dn' t say t hat .
6
Q In some ways.
7
A No, what I sai d was I want t o gi ve a sense
8
of a compar at i ve t r ansf or mat i ve devel opment . I sai d
9
essent i al l y, t he pr oj ect i s not goi ng t o be l i ke
10
Col umbi a Hei ght s, i t ' l l be l i ke McMi l l an.
11
Q Mm-hmm, okay.
12
A What I was t r yi ng t o do was gi ve a
13
r ef er ence t o scal e t her e so t hat peopl e coul d
14
under st and, you know, i n t hi s hear i ng t he si ze of
15
McMi l l an r el at i ve t o t hat and t he ext ent t o whi ch
16
t hat has been a ver y posi t i ve t r ansf or mat i on i n t he
17
ci t y.
18
Q And wouldn't you agree that a very
19
significant difference between the Columbia Heights
20
development and the McMillan development is that
21
Columbia Heights has a Metrorail station near there
22
and McMillan has a Metrorail station that is more
249
1
than one mile away?
2
A I can' t change t he l ocat i on of t hat , t hey
3
ar e di f f er ent . I know t her e i s Met r o at Col umbi a
4
Hei ght s and t her e i s not at McMi l l an.
5
Q And just a question about -- and I know you
6
were probably a little facetious when you made that
7
comment about jaywalking, but I feel that --
8
A Act ual l y, no, but go ahead.
9
Q Because it gave me some concern. If you go
10
back to your slide where you show the picture of the
11
stairs that you are reconstructing to the park
12
area --
13
A Yes.
14
Q -- are you really encouraging jaywalking on
15
North Capitol Street?
16
A Not i n t hat l ocat i on, no, not i n t hat
17
l ocat i on. What I meant , i f I coul d cl ar i f y, what I
18
meant was i n a r et ai l di st r i ct peopl e need t o f eel
19
comf or t abl e t hat t hey can cr oss t he st r eet s. And on
20
t he nor t h ser vi ce cour t , I t hi nk t hat ' s what we' r e
21
goi ng t o have.
22
I don' t t hi nk we' r e goi ng t o have t he same
250
1
si t uat i on on Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet . I t hi nk Nor t h
2
Capi t ol St r eet woul d be si gni f i cant l y i mpr oved, but I
3
t hi nk what we' r e l ooki ng f or on t he nor t h ser vi ce
4
cour t i s t hat ki nd of act i vi t y.
5
Q Okay, but you are assuming that people in
6
the neighborhood are going to use this park and you
7
are aware of the fact that this site is going to
8
generate approximately 31,500 weekday trips. So is
9
there any concern on your part for the accessibility
10
to this park for the people in the neighborhoods,
11
given the traffic levels that are going to be seen on
12
those streets?
13
A No.
14
Q And why is that?
15
A Because I ' ve met a l ot of peopl e i n t he
16
nei ghbor hood, t hey seeml i ke t hey know how t o cr oss
17
t he st r eet . So I t hi nk i t ' s a nor mal cr ossi ng of t he
18
st r eet , when t he l i ght changes and t her e' s an
19
oppor t uni t y t o get i n t he cr osswal k, t hey' l l do i t .
20
Q And is there a light at the corner of
21
Channing and --
22
A Today, I t hi nk t her e i s.
251
1
Q -- that First Street?
2
A Yeah, t her e i s t oday. Ther e i s t oday, yes.
3
Q There is a light at the corner of Channing
4
and First Street?
5
A No, i t ' s Nor t h Capi t ol , t her e i s.
6
MS. BROWN: You know, he di dn' t t est i f y t o
7
t r anspor t at i on i ssues, so I t hi nk he coul d answer t he
8
quest i on as best he can, but he' s pr obabl y not t he
9
r i ght per son t o ask.
10
THE WI TNESS: I t hi nk our accessi bi l i t y i s
11
f i ne.
12
13
Q And perhaps, I'm just wondering if that's
14
one of the reasons why you feel that people can
15
jaywalk successfully, is that the traffic might be a
16
gridlock in the area, given the level of traffic?
17
MS. BROWN: Obj ect i on.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: No, no, no.
19
20
Q No, that wasn't a reason.
21
MS. BROWN: Obj ect i on.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Obj ect i on sust ai ned.
252
1
MS. FERSTER: I coul dn' t r esi st .
2
3
Q I have just a couple of questions about the
4
community center. So this is an aspect of the
5
project that will be accessible to the neighbors and
6
will it be owned by the developer, a developer,
7
privately owned?
8
A I coul dn' t t est i f y t o t hat , I t hi nk we have
9
some peopl e who' l l be cl ar i f yi ng t hat af t er me.
10
Q Which witness will that be?
11
A Aakash.
12
MS. FERSTER: Okay, t hen I ' mdone, t hank
13
you.
14
15
quest i ons.
16
BY MS. MERRI TT:
17
Q Could you tell us -- this is related to the
18
jaywalking comments. Could you tell us what the
19
projected average daily traffic levels are on that
20
north court street?
21
MS. BROWN: Obj ect i on, he i s not t est i f yi ng
22
t o t r af f i c and t r anspor t at i on.
253
1
MS. MERRI TT: He t al ked about j aywal ki ng,
2
t hat ' s what i t was a r esul t of .
3
MS. BROWN: J aywal ki ng doesn' t necessar i l y
4
i mpl y vol umes of how many peopl e ar e goi ng t o be
5
goi ng t her e.
6
MS. MERRI TT: Okay, I can ask anot her
7
wi t ness.
8
9
Q There was a map that you showed, I think it
10
was early on, and it was when you were talking about
11
the evolution of the plan. And it showed that at one
12
point, Cell 20 would be focused on as a potential
13
cell for preservation over on the First Street side.
14
Why was that plan changed and why was Cell 20 no
15
longer decided for participation?
16
A Wel l , as I ment i oned bef or e, wi t h your
17
mast er pl an, you' r e t r yi ng t o bal ance a l ot of
18
di f f er ent t hi ngs. We f el t t hat a par k on t he
19
sout her n si de of t he sout h ser vi ce cour t achi eved a
20
number of i mpor t ant obj ect i ves. Number one, i t gave
21
t he communi t y a bi gger par k, whi ch t hey want ed. They
22
obj ect ed t o t hat pl an because t hey f el t t he par k was
254
1
t oo smal l , number one.
2
Number t wo, by put t i ng t he par k on t he
3
sout h si de of t he pl an, we coul d have t he most
4
dr amat i c r endi t i on of t he ber m. So t he ber mi s most
5
acut e and, you know, t al l est on t he sout h si de.
6
So by vi r t ue of t hose t wo t hi ngs, we f el t
7
t hat i t woul d be appr opr i at e t o l ook at a cel l t o
8
r et ai n ot her t han Cel l 20 and use one of t he cel l s
9
t hat was par t of t hat par k st r uct ur e. So we f el t
10
t hat i t sat i sf i ed a number of t hi ngs at once.
11
Q Could you turn to the slide that showed --
12
I think it's 36 and 37, it showed what you're talking
13
about? Yes, this is what you were referring to?
14
A I t hi nk so. Thi s i s a por t i on of Cel l 20.
15
We wer e showi ng i t s r el at i onshi p t o t he gr ound l evel
16
of t he communi t y bui l di ng.
17
Q So am I correct in understanding from your
18
presentation today that there would be no public
19
access to the underground cell, the preserved cell.
20
People would look through the window at it. Is that
21
what you're describing?
22
A No, I t hi nk what we' r e sayi ng i s exact l y
255
1
what Mr . Met t amsai d, whi ch i s t hat we wi l l be
2
l ooki ng at a var i et y of opt i ons f r omwhat you j ust
3
descr i bed l ooki ng at t o access. And we' r e goi ng t o
4
have t o eval uat e t hat and see how t o make t hose
5
t hi ngs possi bl e.
6
Q Okay, I was just trying to interpret your
7
slide because it didn't show any human figures in the
8
portion that's called "Preserved Cell," and I didn't
9
know whether that was part of the goal or whether
10
part of the goal was to preserve it to look through
11
the window.
12
A I di dn' t hear a quest i on.
13
Q Is the goal to try to preserve it to the
14
point that people could actually access it from the
15
lower level of the community center?
16
A I t hi nk t he goal r i ght now i s f or us t o
17
eval uat e and see what t he opt i ons ar e. The mast er
18
pl an cal l s f or i t i n t hat l ocat i on, so t hat we have
19
t hat as an opt i on avai l abl e t o us.
20
Q Am I correct in understanding this diagram
21
to show, to mean that the lower level of the
22
community center would not represent a preserved cell
256
1
or preserved cells, it would be excavated and built
2
as a new structure? Is that correct?
3
A Let me see i f I can cl ar i f y. Thi s i s new
4
const r uct i on at t he l ower l evel of t he communi t y
5
cent er .
6
Q Okay.
7
A Thi s i s t he pr eser ved cel l - -
8
Q Yes.
9
A - - showi ng sever al bays of i t . So I t hi nk
10
t he i dea t hat we wer e seeki ng her e wi t h t he
11
ar chi t ect ur e was t o have an ar chi t ect ur e of t he l ower
12
l evel of t he communi t y cent er t hat was sympat het i c
13
wi t h t he ar ches of t he pr eser ved cel l s, so i t ' s not
14
t he pr eser ved cel l .
15
Q Thank you, that's exactly what my question
16
was directed to. In Cell 29, will there be any --
17
it's designated as a partial preservation cell. Will
18
there be any -- what will be preserved, let's put it
19
that way?
20
A Ri ght now, t he l andscape ar chi t ect ur e pl an
21
f or t hat cal l s f or t hat cel l t o par t of t he gar den
22
and por t i ons of i t t o be engaged wi t h t hat gar den.
257
1
We' ve got t en t o a concept pl an f or t hat t hat doesn' t
2
necessar i l y speci f y exact l y what ' s goi ng t o be
3
pr eser ved, but t he i dea i s t o have t hat as a ki nd of
4
anot her way i n whi ch t hese cel l s coul d be
5
exper i enced.
6
Q Would there be, is there an intention to
7
preserve anything overhead or solely the bottom of
8
the cells? I think there was a slide on something.
9
A Yeah, go t o t he pl an bl ow- up t her e. Wel l ,
10
t he way t hi s i s desi gned i s t hat i t mi ght be possi bl e
11
t o pr eser ve some aspect s of t hat al ong her e, but
12
excavat i ng al l of t hat t o t he l ower l evel r ai n gar den
13
i s what t hi s concept pl an pr oposes. I t hi nk i t ' s
14
f ai r t o say at t hi s poi nt i n our concept desi gn, we
15
woul d l i ke t o i nt egr at e por t i ons of t hat cel l i nt o
16
t he par k desi gn.
17
Q Okay, so just the bottom of the cell.
18
A Yes.
19
Q One of the earlier witnesses said that the
20
footprint of the community center would not overlap
21
with Cell 28. That's not right, is it? Because it
22
looks on this map like it does overlap.
258
1
A That ' s al l new const r uct i on and t hat ' s a
2
por t i on of Cel l 28. I t woul d be vi si bl e f r omi nsi de
3
t he communi t y cent er .
4
Q So the community center footprint would be
5
located within the footprint of what is now Cell 28.
6
A A por t i on of i t , a por t i on of i t .
7
MS. MERRI TT: Thank you, I don' t have any
8
f ur t her quest i ons.
9
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you have any i mages of t he
10
pl an f r omt he nor t h, f r omMi chi gan Avenue?
11
THE WI TNESS: You mean per spect i ve i mages
12
f r omMi chi gan?
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Yes.
14
THE WI TNESS: We do, we have per spect i ve
15
i mages.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk act ual l y, t hey' r e i n
17
t he book.
18
THE WI TNESS: Yes, I di dn' t i ncl ude t hem
19
t oday, but we do have t hem.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Wel l , I ' mokay, t hey' r e
21
t her e, so t hat ' s i n t he r ecor d, I ' l l l ook at t hat .
22
Okay, t hat ' s al l I have. Thank you ver y much.
259
1
2
MS. BROWN: Next , we' d l i ke t o cal l Adam
3
Weer s f r omTr ammel Cr ow.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Bef or e you do, bef or e you do,
5
so i t ' s evi dent t hat we' r e goi ng t o have a
6
cont i nuat i on and I t hought t hat i t mi ght be good t o
7
di scuss when we can have a cont i nuat i on and maybe
8
t ake a shor t br eak so t hat peopl e can check t hei r
9
cal endar s and t hi ngs.
10
The Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Of f i ce i s a
11
l i t t l e bi t l i ke Amt r ak, whi ch r uns on f r ei ght l i nes,
12
and so t hi s r oomi s onl y avai l abl e on cer t ai n dat es
13
and I ' monl y avai l abl e on cer t ai n dat es. So t he t wo
14
dat es t hat we' r e t hi nki ng of ar e Fr i day, Oct ober
15
24t h, or Monday, November 3d.
16
MS. FERSTER: I ' mi n a t r i al on Oct ober
17
24t h, commi t t ed t he ent i r e mor ni ng t o possi bl y i nt o
18
t he af t er noon.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Let ' s t ake a f i ve- mi nut e
20
br eak her e, i n any event , and you f ol ks can check
21
your cal endar s and see.
22
( Wher eupon, a br i ef r ecess i s t aken. )
260
1
J UDGE BYRNE: So how does November 3d wor k,
2
doabl e?
3
MS. BROWN: November 3d wor ks f or VMP.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, gr eat . Okay, t hank
5
you.
6
MS. FERSTER: So l et ' s get some
7
cl ar i f i cat i on because we have wi t nesses t hat I f eel
8
woul d l i ke t o l eave r i ght now i f , i n f act , our case
9
i s not goi ng t o go on t oday. I s t hat saf e t o say?
10
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk we can do t hat
11
because we can t hen compl et e t he Appl i cant s' case and
12
we can hear f r omMr . Cal cot t . Ar e t her e ANC f ol ks
13
her e t o speak?
14
MS. BARNES: Yes.
15
J UDGE BYRNE: So maybe we can do t hat , as
16
wel l , and t hen we can st ar t your case at t hat t i me.
17
MS. BROWN: And Mr . Byr ne, i t shoul d j ust
18
be t he peopl e t hat ar e i n t he r oomt oday t hat ar e
19
al l owed t o come back, as opposed t o new peopl e
20
showi ng up.
21
MS. FERSTER: No, I - -
22
J UDGE BYRNE: No, I don' t t hi nk t hat ' s t he
261
1
case. We won' t al l ow any mor e par t i es or anyt hi ng
2
l i ke t hat , but she hasn' t gi ven a l i st of her
3
wi t nesses.
4
MS. FERSTER: I have not and I ' mnot
5
r equi r ed t o do t hat .
6
J UDGE BYRNE: So I t hi nk we coul d al l ow - -
7
MS. BROWN: I mean t he publ i c.
8
J UDGE BYRNE: The publ i c? No, i t ' s an open
9
event .
10
MS. BROWN: I ' mj ust used t o ot her
11
pr oceedi ngs wher e t hey set t he par amet er s - -
12
J UDGE BYRNE: No, her e, i t ' s mor e i nf or mal .
13
Okay, so when Mr . Bank comes back, we' l l set t l e,
14
we' l l get t he r oomset and we' l l do i t 9: 30 agai n so
15
we make sur e we get done t hat day and t hen we' l l be
16
r eady t o vot e.
17
MS. BROWN: Our next wi t ness i s AdamWeer s
18
f r omt he Tr ammel Cr ow Company.
19
Wher eupon,
20
ADAM WEERS
21
22
f ol l ows:
262
1
2
BY MS. BROWN:
3
Q And Adam, could you please introduce
4
yourself?
5
A Good af t er noon. My name i s AdamWeer s, I
6
ama pr i nci pal wi t h Tr ammel Cr ow Company.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: So t her e s no - -
8
MS. BROWN: He' s not qual i f i ed as - -
9
J UDGE BYRNE: He' s not qual i f i ed as a
10
wi t ness. Okay, ver y good. You' r e goi ng t o be
11
t al ki ng about - -
12
THE WI TNESS: Some t hought s speci f i cal l y
13
about t he heal t h car e f aci l i t i es and t he speci al
14
mer i t of t he publ i c benef i t s i ncl uded wi t h t he heal t h
15
car e f aci l i t i es.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: Excel l ent .
17
18
Q And could you clarify, Trammel Crow is the
19
developer of the health care facilities?
20
A That ' s cor r ect , so we ar e one of t he t hr ee
21
member s of Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s and we ar e t he
22
devel oper of t he heal t h car e f aci l i t i es.
263
1
MS. FERSTER: You' r e t he devel oper of t he
2
what ?
3
THE WI TNESS: The t hr ee heal t h car e
4
f aci l i t i es.
5

6
THE WI TNESS: Tr ammel Cr ow Company i s one
7
of t he l ar gest and most successf ul commer ci al r eal
8
est at e devel oper s i n t he nat i on. Our devel opment
9
pl at f or mi s ver y di ver se, cover i ng mul t i pl e pr oduct
10
t ypes. I n r ecent year s, heal t h car e has become one
11
of our most i mpor t ant and f ast est gr owi ng component s.
12
Ear l i er t hi s year , we wer e r anked t he
13
number one heal t h car e devel oper i n t he count r y by
14
Moder n Heal t h Car e Magazi ne and nat i onwi de, we have
15
$4. 3 bi l l i on of heal t h car e devel opment s compl et ed or
16
i n pr ocess.
17
The nat i onal l eader of our heal t h car e
18
pl at f or m, Er i c Fi sher , i s al so a Di st r i ct r esi dent
19
and he has wor ked wi t h me on t hi s i ni t i at i ve si nce
20
day one.
21
Fr omt he begi nni ng, our t eamhas vi ewed
22
McMi l l an as an i ncr edi bl e heal t h car e devel opment
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1
oppor t uni t y. Heal t h car e devel opment i n t he Di st r i ct
2
has a uni que set of dr i ver s f or what makes a
3
par t i cul ar l ocat i on desi r abl e.
4
Wher e ot her t ypes of devel opment s l ook f or
5
empl oyment cent er s or popul at i on densi t y, what
6
at t r act s heal t h car e devel opment i n t hi s ci t y i s
7
pr oxi mi t y t o hospi t al s. Thi s map i l l ust r at es t hat
8
poi nt wi t h ci r cl es i ndi cat i ng t he concent r at i on of
9
heal t h car e f ocused r eal est at e. The l ar ger t he
10
ci r cl e, t he hi gher t he concent r at i on.
11
The bl ue ci r cl es r epr esent t he Di st r i ct ' s
12
hospi t al s and t he l ar ge yel l ow dot at t he cent er of
13
t he map r epr esent s t he t hr ee and a hal f mi l l i on
14
squar e f eet of hospi t al s l ocat ed at t he i nt er sect i on
15
of Mi chi gan and Nor t h Capi t ol .
16
McMi l l an i s di r ect l y adj acent t o t he
17
l ar gest concent r at i on of hospi t al s i n t he Di st r i ct of
18
Col umbi a, i n t he Washi ngt on Hospi t al Cent er and
19
Nat i onal Rehab. , Chi l dr en' s Nat i onal Medi cal Cent er
20
and t he VA. The si t e i s l ess t han a mi l e and a hal f
21
f r omt wo addi t i onal hospi t al s i n Howar d Uni ver si t y
22
and Pr ovi dence. When vi ewed f r omt hi s per spect i ve,
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1
McMi l l an i s, i n our opi ni on, t he si ngl e most
2
desi r abl e heal t h car e devel opment si t e i n t hi s ci t y.
3
Our st r at egy f or McMi l l an was bol st er ed i n
4
November 2012 when t he Mayor publ i shed hi s f i ve- year
5
economi c devel opment st r at egy f or t he Di st r i ct , a
6
f oundat i onal component of whi ch was t o f aci l i t at e t he
7
devel opment of a best i n cl ass gl obal medi cal cent er
8
at McMi l l an.
9
The pr i mar y goal s f or t hi s maj or i ni t i at i ve
10
i ncl uded est abl i shi ng a medi cal hub t hat br i ngs
11
t oget her ar ea hospi t al s and r esear ch i nst i t ut i ons and
12
l ever agi ng t hose anchor i nst i t ut i ons as i mpet us f or
13
gr owi ng t he l ocal near by economy.
14
I n addi t i on t o hel pi ng t o suppor t and
15
expand t he Di st r i ct ' s heal t h car e sect or , l ocat i ng
16
t he epi cent er of t hi s i ni t i at i ve at McMi l l an has t he
17
pot ent i al f or not onl y si gni f i cant economi c
18
devel opment i mpact s on t he sur r oundi ng communi t i es,
19
but f or si gni f i cant publ i c heal t h i mpact s as wel l .
20
J ani ce Posey, wi t h t he Of f i ce of t he Deput y
21
Mayor f or Pl anni ng and Economi c Devel opment and t he
22
pr oj ect manager f or t hei r hi gher educat i on and heal t h
266
1
car e sect or s, t est i f i ed t o t hi s at a McMi l l an zoni ng
2
hear i ng, not i ng t hat , quot e, " Di abet es i s t he number
3
si x cause of deat h i n D. C. and number seven l eadi ng
4
cause of hospi t al i zat i on. Di abet es i n War d 5 af f ect s
5
12. 5 per cent of t he popul at i on, t he second hi ghest
6
r at e i n t he Di st r i ct . I ndeed, War d 5 account s f or 21
7
per cent of al l Di st r i ct deat hs due t o di abet es.
8
Addi t i onal l y, War d 5 has t he t hi r d hi ghest obesi t y
9
r at e i n t he ci t y.
10
" The Di st r i ct suppor t s heal t h car e
11
devel opment at McMi l l an as a way t o encour age venues
12
and spaces f or r evol ut i onar y advances i n medi cal
13
t r eat ment f or chr oni c di seases. I n t hi s way,
14
McMi l l an i s about mor e t han j ust t he r eal est at e. I t
15
i s a pl ace t hat gener at es heal t hy out comes f or t he
16
War d 5 communi t y and t he Di st r i ct , as a whol e, "
17
unquot e.
18
As had been f r equent l y r epor t ed, t he
19
physi cal pl ant of many of t he Di st r i ct ' s heal t h car e
20
pr ovi der s and hospi t al f aci l i t i es, even some of i t s
21
most successf ul oper at or s, ar e si gni f i cant l y aged,
22
out dat ed and i nef f i ci ent . Thi s out dat ed
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1
i nf r ast r uct ur e cr eat es t r emendous i nef f i ci ences and
2
as a r esul t , can cr eat e ext r eme f i nanci al pr essur es.
3
However , because of t he compl ex and
4
i ncr edi bl y demandi ng uses of t hese bui l di ngs, maj or
5
upgr ades and i mpr ovement s t o t hese f aci l i t i es can
6
of t en be cost pr ohi bi t i ve, i f not downr i ght
7
i mpossi bl e.
8
The cr eat i on of appr oxi mat el y one mi l l i on
9
new squar e f eet of cut t i ng edge heal t h car e del i ver y,
10
r esear ch and admi ni st r at i on space wi l l have a hugel y
11
posi t i ve i mpact on t he abi l i t y of sever al of t he
12
Di st r i ct ' s l eadi ng heal t h car e pr ovi der s t o del i ver
13
car e t o cust omer s mor e ef f i ci ent l y and ef f ect i vel y,
14
t her eby posi t i vel y i mpact i ng t he heal t h car e syst em
15
of t he ci t y as a whol e.
16
Much of our vi si on f or how i mpact f ul
17
McMi l l an can be was di r ect l y i nf or med by r esear ch we
18
per f or med on 17 di f f er ent medi cal di st r i ct s acr oss
19
t he count r y. The heal t h car e component of McMi l l an
20
i s cl ear l y i t s economi c engi ne, gener at i ng t he bul k
21
of our pr oj ect ' s 3, 200 per manent j obs and near l y $1
22
bi l l i on i n f i scal i mpact .
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1
I n st udyi ng medi cal di st r i ct s f r omBost on
2
t o Houst on t o Chi cago, we have f ound exampl es of
3
ci t i es t hat have capi t al i zed on l ar ge concent r at i ons
4
of heal t h car e i nst i t ut i ons by encour agi ng f or mal
5
medi cal di st r i ct s t hat ar e now gener at i ng economi c
6
act i vi t y i n ar eas l i ke t ax r evenues, empl oyment and
7
r esear ch f undi ng t hat have dr amat i c i mpact s.
8
By way of compar i son, t he Longwood Medi cal
9
Ar ea i n Bost on, whi ch i s home t o si x hospi t al and
10
r esear ch i nst i t ut i ons, as wel l as sever al educat i onal
11
syst ems, i s about t wi ce as l ar ge as what an
12
equi val ent medi cal di st r i ct at McMi l l an coul d be.
13
I n 2011, Longwood publ i shed r esear ch
14
showi ng a combi ned economi c i mpact , i ncl udi ng t hat i t
15
empl oys appr oxi mat el y 43, 000 peopl e, sees an annual
16
aver age of 8, 800 j ob openi ngs, gener at es an aver age
17
of 1, 200 net new j obs each year and pr oduces
18
appr oxi mat el y $113 mi l l i on i n annual t ax r evenues f or
19
t he st at e of Massachuset t s.
20
The medi cal di st r i ct s we r esear ched have a
21
f ew key el ement s i n common, i ncl udi ng t he combi nat i on
22
of hospi t al syst ems, uni ver si t i es and r esear ch
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1
i nst i t ut i ons. Al l of t hese i ngr edi ent s cur r ent l y
2
exi st al ong t he Mi chi gan Avenue cor r i dor .
3
Despi t e t he exi st i ng base at t he Hospi t al
4
Cent er , a medi cal di st r i ct i n D. C. has not spr out ed
5
or gani cal l y so f ar . The addi t i on of one mi l l i on new
6
squar e f eet of heal t h car e densi t y at McMi l l an i s a
7
huge st ep i n t hi s di r ect i on and VMP i s al r eady i n
8
di scussi ons wi t h t he Di st r i ct gover nment t o begi n t he
9
f or mal pr ocess of cr eat i ng a medi cal di st r i ct at
10
McMi l l an.
11
Hi st or i cal l y, l ar ge scal e heal t h car e
12
pr oj ect s acr oss t he count r y have been devel oped by
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pl aci ng l ar ge, spr awl i ng compl exes on ver y l ar ge l and
14
par cel s. You can see t hi s phenomenon l ocal l y i n
15
f aci l i t i es l i ke t he Uni t ed Medi cal Cent er and
16
Pr ovi dence Hospi t al .
17
Successf ul heal t h car e devel opment pr oj ect s
18
bei ng bui l t t oday i ncl ude many mor e smar t gr owt h
19
pr i nci pl es, l i ke t al l er bui l di ngs, smal l er f oot pr i nt s
20
and under gr ound par ki ng when possi bl e. I ncor por at i ng
21
t hese new f aci l i t i es i nt o mi xed use pr oj ect s wi t h
22
r i ch ameni t y bases has become i ncr easi ngl y i mpor t ant
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1
t o a pr oj ect ' s success. A new f aci l i t y can pr ovi de
2
many benef i t s t o a heal t h car e syst em, i ncl udi ng
3
oper at i onal ef f i ci ency and cost r educt i ons.
4
But syst ems occupyi ng mor e smar t l y desi gned
5
f aci l i t i es ar e f i ndi ng t hat t hei r bui l di ng can al so
6
assi st i n at t r act i ng and r et ai ni ng t op f l i ght human
7
capi t al . Vi br ant wor k envi r onment s at t r act t al ent ,
8
whi ch gi ves an empl oyer a si gni f i cant compet i t i ve
9
advant age.
10
A gr eat l ocal exampl e of t hi s can be seen
11
at G. W. Hospi t al , whi ch has i nt egr at ed i nt o a
12
t hr i vi ng mi xed use envi r onment and i s seei ng posi t i ve
13
ef f ect s f r omt hei r empl oyee base as a r esul t .
14
We' ve i ncor por at ed many of our l essons
15
l ear ned i nt o t he f aci l i t i es l ocat ed at McMi l l an. By
16
usi ng hei ght t o r educe t he bui l di ng f oot pr i nt and
17
pl aci ng t he gar age under gr ound, we ar e squeezi ng
18
ar ound 840, 000 squar e f eet i nt o l ess t han f our acr es.
19
The bui l di ng' s f i nal conf i gur at i on has been as much
20
i nf l uenced by t he McMi l l an si t e cont ext and by
21
communi t y i nput as i t has smar t gr owt h pr i nci pl es.
22
We pushed back our bui l di ng f r omNor t h
271
1
Capi t ol t o pr eser ve bot h Cel l 14 and a speci al vi ew
2
i nt o t he si t e, t her eby cr eat i ng a 260- f oot buf f er on
3
t he east er n si de of t he si t e bet ween t he bui l di ng and
4
our r esi dent i al nei ghbor s i n St r onghol d t o t he east .
5
The buf f er i s t wo and a hal f t i mes t he hei ght of t he
6
bui l di ng.
7
And heal i ng gar dens can be t r aced back t o a
8
sal on sessi on at Bi g Bear Caf e, wher e a communi t y
9
member asked us poi nt bl ank i f we woul d shr i nk our
10
bui l di ng f oot pr i nt even f ur t her t o make r oomf or
11
addi t i onal gr een space, whi ch we di d.
12
The mi xed use nat ur e of McMi l l an i s
13
di st i nct i ve, not onl y i ncor por at i ng housi ng and
14
r et ai l opt i ons, whi ch ar e pr ovi ng i ncr edi bl y
15
at t r act i ve t o pot ent i al t enant s, but al so pr ovi des
16
di r ect adj acency t o a t r emendous par k syst emand
17
pr eser vat i on asset s.
18
One of t he most si gni f i cant aspect s of t he
19
heal t h car e component of McMi l l an i s t he del i ber at e
20
and compr ehensi ve wor kf or ce devel opment pr ogr am, a
21
maj or component of our br oad set of publ i c benef i t s.
22
One of t he advant ages of t he j ob cr eat i on
272
1
at McMi l l an i s t hat t he maj or i t y of t he per manent
2
j obs cr eat ed ar e wi t hi n t he heal t h car e spher e.
3
Heal t h car e j obs r epr esent a di ver se set of opt i ons
4
f or Di st r i ct r esi dent s f r oma wi de r ange of
5
backgr ounds.
6
Fr omhome heal t h ai des and EMTs t o
7
r esear cher s and physi ci ans, car eer s i n heal t h of f er a
8
var i et y of ent r y poi nt s t o r esi dent s wi t h advanced
9
degr ees, as wel l as t hose wi t h hi gh school di pl omas
10
and equi val anci es.
11
Whet her one i s among t he unempl oyed
12
popul at i on or si mpl y t r ansi t i oni ng f r omanot her
13
i ndust r y, heal t h car e pr ovi des many at t r act i ve car eer
14
pat hs and oppor t uni t i es. But many of t hese
15
oppor t uni t i es r equi r e educat i on and t r ai ni ng pr ogr ams
16
t hat t ake t i me. We need t o get st ar t ed r i ght away
17
f or f aci l i t i es t hat wi l l open i n 2018.
18
McMi l l an i s pr oj ect ed t o gener at e mor e t han
19
6, 000 j obs, about hal f of whi ch wi l l be per manent
20
posi t i ons i n t he heal t h car e and r et ai l i ndust r i es.
21
J ob cr eat i on of t hi s magni t ude f or any pr oj ect i s
22
r ar el y seen, but t o br i ng t hi s ki nd of empl oyment
273
1
i mpact t o a war d wher e unempl oyment i s st i l l hover i ng
2
at near l y 12 per cent i s pr i cel ess.
3
To many of t hese 5, 000 unempl oyed War d 5
4
r esi dent s st r uggl i ng t o make t hei r way i n an economy
5
t hat i s not r ecover i ng as qui ckl y or as evenl y as
6
many of us woul d l i ke, access t o an oppor t uni t y l i ke
7
McMi l l an coul d be l i f e changi ng.
8
VMP has commi t t ed t o f undi ng $1 mi l l i on t o
9
f aci l i t at e wor kf or ce devel opment i ni t i at i ves and
10
schol ar shi p pr ogr ams f or Di st r i ct r esi dent s and
11
r esi dent s of t he sur r oundi ng War d 5 communi t i es. We
12
have devel oped a compr ehensi ve st r at egy, i n
13
conj unct i on wi t h t he Communi t y Foundat i on of t he
14
Nat i onal Capi t al Regi on, t o di r ect t hese f unds
15
t owar ds t r ai ni ng, appr ent i ceshi ps and j ob f ai r s f or
16
bot h t he const r uct i on and t he per manent j obs
17
gener at ed by t hi s si t e.
18
We ar e exci t ed about t he possi bi l i t i es t hi s
19
pr oj ect cr eat es and we bel i eve t hat by coor di nat i ng
20
our ef f or t s wi t h l eader s i n t he Di st r i ct gover nment ,
21
agency heads, as wel l as counci l member s and t he
22
Mayor , wor kf or ce devel opment and j ob pr epar at i on at
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1
McMi l l an can be a t r ue pr i or i t y f or t hi s ci t y.
2
Whi l e t her e ar e many power f ul aspect s t o
3
t he McMi l l an pr oj ect , t he heal t h car e component i s
4
i t s economi c engi ne and, i ndeed, i t s hear t . We have
5
spent much of our f ocus and ener gy st r i vi ng t o shape
6
McMi l l an i nt o one of t he l ar gest and most i nnovat i ve
7
devel opment s f ocused on hi st or y, heal t h and wel l ness
8
t hat t he Di st r i ct has ever seen.
9
For t he past si x year s, we have wor ked
10
cl osel y and col l abor at i vel y wi t h t he l eader shi p t eams
11
at heal t h car e syst ems t hr oughout t he r egi on,
12
i ncl udi ng MedSt ar , Chi l dr en' s Nat i onal Medi cal
13
Cent er , t he VA and J ohns Hopki ns. Thi s mar ket
14
f eedback has been combi ned wi t h TCC' s exi st i ng
15
knowl edge base as t he l ar gest heal t h car e devel oper
16
i n t he nat i on and t hen pour ed i nt o t he desi gn of
17
t hese f aci l i t i es as much as possi bl e.
18
Wi t h near l y one mi l l i on squar e f eet of
19
heal t h car e f aci l i t i es, t he cur r ent pl an encour ages
20
unpr ecedent ed gr owt h of one of t he Di st r i ct ' s most
21
i mpor t ant i ndust r i es and empl oyment bases. Si nce
22
2008, we have had count l ess meet i ngs wi t h t he seni or
275
1
l eader shi p t eams of mul t i pl e heal t h car e syst ems t o
2
di scuss t hei r occupancy i n t hi s pr oj ect . Sever al of
3
t hose conver sat i ons ar e st i l l ongoi ng and t he
4
advant ages of t hemoccupyi ng t hese new f aci l i t i es i s
5
becomi ng abundant l y cl ear .
6
A r edevel oped McMi l l an can, as i t once di d
7
mor e t han a cent ur y ago, ser ve as a vehi cl e f or t he
8
Di st r i ct ' s gr owt h, expansi on and bet t er ment . Thi s
9
new ver si on of McMi l l an wi l l pl ay a cr i t i cal r ol e i n
10
i mpr ovi ng publ i c heal t h by al l owi ng f or t he expansi on
11
and r ei nt egr at i on of some of t he same Washi ngt on
12
Hospi t al Cent er occupant s t hat i t s or i gi nal
13
i ncar nat i on hel ped t o cr eat e and suppor t .
14
The new McMi l l an wi l l agai n spur t he
15
cr eat i on of new, much needed housi ng f or a gr owi ng
16
and expandi ng set of Di st r i ct r esi dent s and t he new
17
McMi l l an woul d del i ver one of t he l ar gest and most
18
amazi ng par k syst ems t he Di st r i ct has ever seen, a
19
nod t o i t s hi st or i c and not abl e publ i c space her i t age
20
and i n a way t hat pays homage and honor t o t he past ,
21
pr esent and f ut ur e r esi dent s of t he nei ghbor i ng
22
sur r oundi ng si t es.
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1
That concl udes my t est i mony. Thank you
2
ver y much.
3
4
5
Q I have one quick question for Mr. Weers.
6
You mentioned that you're talking to a lot of health
7
industry leaders about tenancy in the buildings.
8
Would one of those potential tenants actually sign a
9
lease or a letter of intent this early in the process
10
or is that something that's usually completed after
11
the entitlement process?
12
THE WI TNESS: Def i ni t el y compl et ed af t er
13
t he ent i t l ement pr ocess. The f eedback we have
14
r ecei ved f r omever y syst emi s t hey wi l l not si gn a
15
l ease commi t ment f or a pr oj ect t hat doesn' t have
16
ent i t l ement s yet .
17
MS. BROWN: Thank you, no f ur t her
18
quest i ons.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, Ms. Fer st er .
20
21
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
22
BY MS. FERSTER:
277
1
Q So to follow up on that question, that you
2
do not currently have a tenant for the health care
3
facility, in terms of the type of tenant you're
4
looking for, are you looking for a nonprofit health
5
care provider or a for profit health care provider or
6
either one?
7
A We ar e t al ki ng t o bot h.
8
Q And let me ask you about the million
9
dollars that you'll be providing for employment
10
training. Is that going to be in the form of a grant
11
to a nonprofit organization?
12
A I t wi l l be a ser i es of gr ant s, so we wi l l
13
put t he capi t al i n a f und t hat wi l l be managed by t he
14
Communi t y Foundat i on and t hey wi l l dol e out gr ant s.
15
Q And they will provide individual grants to
16
Ward 5 residents, to the District of Columbia?
17
A That wi l l be - -
18
Q I mean what are the criteria to be eligible
19
for this grant?
20
A The det ai l s of t he speci f i c cr i t er i a have
21
not been wor ked out yet . We do have commi t ment f r om
22
t he Communi t y Foundat i on t o wor k wi t h us i n t hi s
278
1
endeavor and our commi t ment t o f undi ng t he mi l l i on
2
dol l ar s i s a par t of our PUD appr oval , so we ar e
3
commi t t ed t o t hat .
4
I t wi l l be a combi nat i on of schol ar shi ps t o
5
i ndi vi dual s and I woul d t hi nk gr ant s t o
6
or gani zat i ons, wor kf or ce devel opment or gani zat i ons
7
t hat do j ob t r ai ni ng, cer t i f i cat i on pr ogr ams,
8
et cet er a.
9
Q So at this point, it's really not possible
10
for you to say that the individuals who will be
11
benefiting from this employment training will
12
necessarily work at McMillan, isn't that correct, you
13
have no way of knowing whether they will or not?
14
A I t hi nk t hat ' s cor r ect .
15
Q So just in terms of what you mentioned
16
about smart growth principles governing your view
17
that this is a good location, are you assuming that
18
the people who go to these health care facilities for
19
treatment or to work there will take the Metro there,
20
even though it's located over a mile away from the
21
Metro rail station?
22
A I t hi nk t hat t he maj or i t y of t he peopl e
279
1
t hat wi l l be comi ng t o t hi s f aci l i t y wi l l be dr i vi ng.
2
Q Thank you.
3
MS. FERSTER: I don' t have any ot her
4
quest i ons.
5
6
f ol l ow- up quest i ons.
7
BY MS. MERRI TT:
8
Q In responding to Ms. Ferster's question
9
about seeking a nonprofit versus a for profit, your
10
answer made it sound like you're just looking for one
11
or two tenants. Could you clarify that?
12
A So t he way t hat we ar e appr oachi ng t r yi ng
13
t o f i nd our anchor t enancy, t hese bui l di ngs wi l l
14
pr obabl y be anchor ed by one or t wo hospi t al syst ems.
15
Ther e wi l l al most cer t ai nl y be many, many
16
i nst i t ut i ons i n t hi s what wi l l , bet ween al l t hr ee
17
bui l di ngs, be a mi l l i on squar e f eet . But I do t hi nk
18
t hat t hose ear l y i nst i t ut i ons and t hose anchor
19
i nst i t ut i ons wi l l l i kel y t ake t he l ar gest por t i ons.
20
So we ar e f ocused r i ght now i n t r yi ng t o
21
get anchor i nst i t ut i ons because whi ch anchor
22
i nst i t ut i on we par t ner wi t h wi l l set t he t one and t he
280
1
f l avor f or a l ot of t he r est of t he t enancy.
2
Q Is it your intention or understanding that
3
the goal would be to have an institution, whether
4
it's for profit or nonprofit, that would be oriented
5
toward patient treatment, as opposed to, say,
6
research or something that's less interactive with
7
patients?
8
A I t hi nk i n our mi nd - - and I ' l l expl ai n why
9
I put t hat qual i f i er on i t i n a moment . I t hi nk i n
10
our mi nd, an i deal out come i s a mi x of pat i ent
11
t r eat ment space, r esear ch and l ab space, educat i onal
12
space and what you woul d pr obabl y cal l t r adi t i onal
13
medi cal of f i ce, doct or s' of f i ces, dent i st of f i ces,
14
et cet er a.
15
So i n t hat way, you' d al most have wi t hi n
16
t he heal t h car e component a campus wi t h sever al
17
di f f er ent t ypes of uses. And I t hi nk par t of our
18
desi r e f or doi ng t hat was shaped by t he r esear ch t hat
19
we di d i n l ooki ng at ot her successf ul medi cal
20
di st r i ct s acr oss t he count r y.
21
That ul t i mat e mi x wi l l def i ni t el y be
22
af f ect ed by who t he anchor t enant i s. I f , say,
281
1
MedSt ar , j ust an exampl e, not sayi ng t hat wi l l be, i f
2
MedSt ar wer e t o be t he anchor i nst i t ut i on f or hal f of
3
al l t he space t hat we have, t hey woul d have a
4
si gni f i cant say on what goes i nsi de, what t ypes of
5
uses ar e i n t he box and what t he ot her uses ar e i n
6
t he space t hat t hey wi l l occupy.
7
Q And what's the ratio between employees and
8
patients in terms of the coming and going, driving?
9
MS. BROWN: I f you know.
10
THE WI TNESS: I don' t have t hemof f t he t op
11
of my head, I don' t have t hemof f t he t op of my
12
head.
13
14
quest i ons.
15
16
Q I had a follow-up question prompted by one
17
of your responses to Ms. Merritt's question and that
18
was that I did not -- you had mentioned that you were
19
speaking about medical office space as being part of
20
the space that you're responsible for. And I guess I
21
had assumed that you were only dealing with the
22
health care facility portion of this project.
282
1
Are you also responsible for the leasing of
2
the medical office buildings?
3
A They ar e one and t he same.
4
Q Okay, so there is a health care facility
5
that is in a separate building from the medical
6
office building is my understanding.
7
A No. When I say heal t h car e f aci l i t i es, I ' m
8
r ef er r i ng t o t he t hr ee commer ci al bui l di ngs t hat
9
ar e - -
10
Q Okay, so that includes the --
11
A Yes.
12
Q -- medical office building. Ah, okay, I
13
thought you were --
14
A None of t hemI woul d l abel as t he medi cal
15
of f i ce bui l di ng, t hey ar e al l t hr ee t he heal t h car e
16
f aci l i t i es.
17
Q Okay, okay, I did not understand that your
18
testimony went to the medical office building, as
19
well.
20
So just to follow-up on that, has your
21
evaluation of the leasing looked at the fact that
22
there are numerous other medical office buildings,
283
1
you know, Walter Reed and others, that are going on
2
line, that will, in fact, be fully constructed before
3
your medical office building, is that --
4
A Ver y much so. So i f you r emember t he map I
5
put up i n my second sl i de, t he bi ggest advant age of
6
havi ng a si t e l i ke McMi l l an i s t hat t hi s i s what r eal
7
est at e peopl e woul d cal l mai n and mai n when i t comes
8
t o heal t h car e devel opment . We ar e acr oss t he st r eet
9
f r omt he si ngl e l ar gest concent r at i on of hospi t al s i n
10
t he ci t y, so i t ' s a ver y, ver y desi r abl e si t e.
11
So t o t he ext ent I have t o compet e wi t h
12
ot her si t es, I t hi nk we have a bet t er opt i on f r oma
13
suppl y and demand per spect i ve.
14
I woul d al so say I do t hi nk t hat t hose
15
ot her compet i ng si t es, wi t h t he except i on of about
16
200 or 300, 000 squar e f eet t hat ' s i n t he Ar med For ces
17
Ret i r ement Pl an set asi de speci f i cal l y f or heal t h
18
car e, we' r e pr et t y f ar away. So i f t her e ar e peopl e
19
t hat want t o be cl ose t o t he syst emi n par t i cul ar ,
20
MedSt ar and Chi l dr en' s and t he VA, whi ch ar e al l
21
pr et t y bi g and power f ul syst ems, I have al most an
22
unbeat abl e advant age f r oma compet i t i ve st andpoi nt .
284
1
2
J UDGE BYRNE: How si gni f i cant woul d i t be
3
t o have medi cal school i nvol vement i n t hi s pl an?
4
THE WI TNESS: I t hi nk i t ' s a bi g par t .
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Longwood has, of cour se,
6
Har var d r i ght i n t he mi ddl e - -
7
THE WI TNESS: They do, t hey do, and i f you
8
l ook at t he Texas Medi cal Cent er , t her e' s a l ot of
9
uni ver si t i es t her e, t oo. I t hi nk i t woul d be a bi g
10
par t of what we want t o do and I t hi nk t hat t hat
11
coul d i ncor por at e t he Mi chi gan Avenue cor r i dor
12
school s, so Cat hol i c or even Howar d. I mean t her e' s
13
a l ot of ver y - -
14
J UDGE BYRNE: A coupl e of ot her
15
uni ver si t i es.
16
THE WI TNESS: Wel l , Tr i ni t y I t hi nk coul d
17
be an opt i on, as wel l .
18
But you coul d al so go out si de of t he
19
Mi chi gan Avenue cor r i dor I guess was my poi nt . I t
20
coul d be any school i n t he ci t y or i t coul d be
21
school s t hat ar e r i ght adj acent t o t he McMi l l an si t e.
22
But I do t hi nk t hat ' s a bi g par t of i t and
285
1
I t hi nk t hat havi ng an educat i onal component , al ong
2
wi t h havi ng a r esear ch i nst i t ut i on, l i ke Nat i onal
3
Rehab. or Chi l dr en' s does a l ot of r esear ch, as wel l ,
4
i t changes t he f l avor . But i t al so can do l i ke what
5
you see at Longwood, whi ch i s at t r act i ng r esear ch
6
dol l ar s and havi ng al l of t hat sor t of become - -
7
McMi l l an becomi ng a magnet f or t hat , i t has a l ot of
8
f ol l ow- on ef f ect s, posi t i ve f ol l ow- on ef f ect s.
9
10
much, I appr eci at e i t .
11
12
MS. BROWN: Next , we have Mr . J ai r Lynch.
13
Wher eupon,
14
J AI R LYNCH
15
16
f ol l ows:
17
18
BY MS. BROWN:
19
Q Please introduce yourself for the record
20
and proceed with your testimony.
21
A Okay. My name i s J ai r Lynch. I amt he
22
pr esi dent and CEO of a f ami l y of r eal est at e
286
1
compani es under t he br and J ai r Lynch Devel opment
2
Par t ner s.
3
Q Speak up, they're having trouble hearing
4
you.
5
A And I amal so a member of Vi si on McMi l l an
6
Par t ner s, as wel l , our company i s.
7
Q Okay.
8
A We ar e an ur ban r egener at i on company t hat
9
f ocuses on r ei magi ni ng wal kabl e ur ban pl aces. We
10
have been i n busi ness f or over 15 year s and have
11
devel oped t hr ee mi l l i on squar e f eet of nei ghbor hood
12
asset s, t ot al i ng near l y $700 mi l l i on.
13
I ama nat i ve Washi ngt oni an and I have been
14
dr awn t o t hi s i ndust r i al si t e si nce as a young boy, I
15
was t ol d t hat i t was not saf e, not accessi bl e and t he
16
def i ni t i on of bl i ght .
17
Thi s of t en di scour agi ng st or y was r epeat ed
18
t o me t hr oughout t he ci t y i n t he 1980s and f or t hat
19
r eason, I i nt ent i onal l y r et ur ned t o Washi ngt on t o
20
st ar t my busi ness i n Shaw, i n a r ow home, wi t h a
21
l apt op and a cel l phone t o speci f i cal l y wor k i n
22
emer gi ng nei ghbor hoods. Thi s pr oj ect i s a di r ect
287
1
ext ensi on of my per sonal and pr of essi onal gr owt h and
2
I ' mher e t o put f or t h a r esponsi bl e pl an of a dr eam
3
def er r ed.
4
Whi l e we br i ng our vi si on and r esum, we
5
al so br i ng our own capi t al t o execut e our component
6
of t he pl an, t he mul t i f ami l y and r et ai l component of
7
t he pl an. We ar e pr oud t o st and shoul der t o shoul der
8
wi t h t wo ot her nat i onal l y r ecogni zed devel opment
9
compani es as t he l ead sponsor devel oper of t he
10
mul t i f ami l y component of t he pr oj ect . A l ocal l y
11
owned company devel opi ng i t s own component , mor e t han
12
20 per cent of t he pl an, i s qui t e f r ankl y al so a dr eam
13
def er r ed and of speci al mer i t .
14
VMP has cr eat ed a mi xed i ncome housi ng
15
pr ogr amf or not onl y nei ghbor hood r esi dent s, but al so
16
a wal kabl e al t er nat i ve f or t he wor ki ng popul at i on i n
17
t he sur r oundi ng i nst i t ut i ons cur r ent l y who l i ve
18
out si de t he Di st r i ct . The pr ogr ami ncl udes mi xed
19
i ncome r ent al housi ng, as wel l as mi xed i ncome f ami l y
20
housi ng wi t h t he f or - sal e t ownhomes.
21
Our af f or dabl e housi ng st r at egy f ar exceeds
22
t he r egul at i ons set f or t h by i ncl usi onar y zoni ng at
288
1
80 per cent AMI by r eachi ng 20 per cent af f or dabi l i t y
2
acr oss t he housi ng pr ogr amf or househol ds bet ween 50
3
and 80 per cent ar ea medi an i ncome.
4
Thi s pr ogr ami ncl udes a seni or housi ng
5
component t hat t ar get s deeper af f or dabi l i t y bet ween
6
50 and 60 per cent AMI and f or - sal e t ownhomes f or
7
f ami l i es at bot h 50 and 80 per cent AMI . The
8
r emai ni ng apar t ment s wi l l be a nat ur al ext ensi on of
9
t he cur r ent mar ket of wor kf or ce r ent al housi ng t hat
10
i s al r eady i n t he nei ghbor hood and ar r i vi ng near at
11
t he Br ookl and Met r o st at i on. We def i ne wor kf or ce
12
housi ng as 80 t o 120 per cent of ar ea medi an i ncome.
13
Our combi ned pl an wi t h over 120 new
14
af f or dabl e uni t s i n a si ngl e mast er pl an, compar ed t o
15
t he 430 af f or dabl e housi ng uni t s bet ween 30 and 80
16
per cent AMI and t he 530 per manent suppor t i ve housi ng
17
uni t s t hat wer e awar ded subsi dy f r omt he D. C.
18
Depar t ment of Housi ng and Communi t y Devel opment l ast
19
year , t hi s i s a l audabl e pr oj ect .
20
The agency' s t ot al s wer e spr ead over near l y
21
20 pr oj ect s and t hi s pr oj ect r epr esent s a hundr ed
22
per cent i ncr ease over what was appr oved by t he agency
289
1
l ast year i n War d 5.
2
I n addi t i on, we ar e pr ogr ammi ng a f ul l
3
ser vi ce gr ocer as par t of t he r et ai l pr ogr amas i t
4
benef i t s t he nei ghbor hood. Accor di ng t o t he USDA,
5
who def i nes and t r acks f ood deser t s, t hi s ar ea has
6
mor e t han a 20 per cent popul at i on i n pover t y and mor e
7
t han 33 per cent of t he popul at i on has t o t r avel mor e
8
t han one- hal f mi l e t o get t o a super mar ket . Ther e
9
ar e si mpl y l i mi t ed r et ai l opt i ons wi t hi n a wal ki ng
10
di st ance of t he si t e and t he sur r oundi ng
11
nei ghbor hoods of Bl oomi ngdal e, St r onghol d and LeDr oi t
12
Par k.
13
I n addi t i on, t he over 15, 000 empl oyees at
14
t he hospi t al campus have l i mi t ed f r esh pr oduce and
15
f ood opt i ons near wor k. We i nt end t o change t hat by
16
kni t t i ng t oget her t he dayt i me popul at i on wi t h
17
exi st i ng vi br ant nei ghbor hood popul at i ons t o cr eat e a
18
dynami c r et ai l envi r onment on t he nor t h ser vi ce
19
cour t , anchor ed by a f ul l ser vi ce gr ocer .
20
The r emai ni ng component s of t he r et ai l
21
pr ogr amwi l l i ncl ude nei ghbor hood- ser vi ng r et ai l wi t h
22
i ncent i ves t o f aci l i t at e busi ness st ar t ups on si t e
290
1
and l ocal l y owned busi nesses. I n addi t i on, t he pl an
2
seeks t o connect t o a mer gi ng cor r i dor and el i mi nat e
3
bl i ght on Nor t h Capi t ol St r eet wi t h a f acade
4
i mpr ovement pr ogr am. Ret ai l has consi st ent l y been
5
among t he t op t hr ee r equest s f r omt hi s communi t y i n
6
an ef f or t t o cr eat e a wal kabl e nei ghbor hood.
7
I n concl usi on, we ar e ver y pr oud of our
8
housi ng and r et ai l vi si on f or McMi l l an. The pl an i s
9
r esponsi ve t o t he communi t y- at - l ar ge and not t o onl y
10
a subset of a pr i vi l eged f ew.
11
Our housi ng pl an pr ovi des deeper
12
af f or dabi l i t y t han r equi r ed by i ncl usi onar y zoni ng,
13
as wel l as t he speci f i c t ype of housi ng f or seni or s
14
t hat i s a di r ect r equest f r omt he communi t y t o ensur e
15
member s of t he nei ghbor hood can age i n pl ace. By
16
bui l di ng apar t ment s as an ext ensi on of t he exi st i ng
17
nei ghbor hood, t he mar ket r at e uni t s wi l l r each a
18
wor kf or ce cust omer .
19
Fi nal l y, br i ngi ng a capt i ve dayt i me
20
popul at i on t o t he si t e al l ows f or t he r et ai l t o
21
t hr i ve i n a r el at i vel y l ow densi t y communi t y and,
22
t hus, t hi s i s a t r ue nei ghbor hood r evi t al i zat i on
291
1
pr oj ect . That ' s t he end of my t est i mony.
2
3
MS. BROWN: No quest i ons.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: Ms. Fer st er ?
5
6
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
7
BY MS. FERSTER:
8
Q Can you go to Slide 6, please. So I'm
9
wondering if you could spell out on the affordable
10
rental senior apartments, 85 units, 50 to 60 AMI, do
11
you know how many will be limited to people who are
12
50 percent, earning 50 percent AMI and how many 60,
13
do you know the breakdown of that?
14
A We do not know t he br eakdown t oday because
15
i t wi l l be r esponsi ve t o t he mar ket st udi es t hat wi l l
16
be done cl oser t o const r uct i on.
17
Q And in terms of parking for the people who
18
are living in any of these units, either the for-sale
19
-- well, particularly the rental units, will parking
20
be a separate charge for the tenants?
21
A Par ki ng wi l l be a separ at e char ge f or t he
22
t enant s. Par ki ng wi l l be avai l abl e f or t he r et ai l
292
1
cust omer s wi t hout char ge, at l east wi t h val i dat i on
2
f or a coupl e of hour s. But par ki ng i s a separ at e
3
char ge, cor r ect .
4
Q And what will the charge be to the tenants
5
of the senior apartments for parking?
6
A We have not det er mi ned, but we wi l l f ol l ow
7
t he l ow i ncome t ax cr edi t pr act i ces f or what i s
8
avai l abl e f or char ges f or par ki ng.
9
Q Okay, and that is?
10
A I can' t t el l you t hat t oday.
11
Q I'm asking about the practice. You don't
12
know what the practice is that you're going to
13
follow?
14
A No. You can char ge f or par ki ng i n cer t ai n
15
si t uat i ons and we' l l f ol l ow t he appr opr i at e
16
si t uat i ons f or t he pr oj ect .
17
Q And in terms of the tax abatement or
18
credits that you're going to eventually comply with,
19
can you specify what they are? These are abatements
20
or credits that are available for affordable housing?
21
MS. BROWN: Di d you t est i f y t o t hat ?
22
THE WI TNESS: No.
293
1
2
Q You just testified that you're going to
3
comply with the tax --
4
MS. BROWN: You asked about par ki ng.
5
That ' s a l i t t l e f ar af i el d.
6
MS. FERSTER: You don' t want hi mt o t est i f y
7
about t he t ax cr edi t s or abat ement s?
8
9
Q I mean you've talked about affordable
10
housing and I just, you know, would like to specify
11
whether or not, in fact, there's going to be --
12
MS. BROWN: Wel l , I t hi nk t he poi nt i s i t
13
doesn' t mat t er because i t ' s af f or dabl e, i t ' s got t o
14
be r equi r ed under any ei t her a Mayor ' s Agent or der
15
and cer t ai nl y under t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on or der .
16
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , i t does mat t er because
17
i f you' r e goi ng t o qual i f y f or cer t ai n abat ement s or
18
cr edi t s, you have t o meet cer t ai n gui del i nes and I ' d
19
l i ke t o know what t he gui del i nes ar e.
20
MS. BROWN: Wel l , he di dn' t t est i f y about
21
t hat .
22
THE WI TNESS: I ' mnot an exper t , yeah,
294
1
yeah.
2
3
Q So you don't know what tax credits or
4
abatements that affordable housing --
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Wel l , I ' mj ust t r yi ng t o
6
under st and what t he quest i on i s. I s t he quest i on
7
whet her t her e' s a f eder al t ax cr edi t deal ?
8
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , what ' s r el evant her e i s
9
t hat i n or der f or housi ng t o be af f or dabl e, you don' t
10
l ook j ust at what t he r ent i s, but you al so l ook at
11
t he addi t i onal char ges t hat t enant s ar e goi ng t o be
12
r equi r ed t o pay. Because i f you cr eat e an af f or dabl e
13
uni t , but you char ge t heman exor bi t ant char ge f or
14
par ki ng, i t t hen becomes l ess af f or dabl e. And t her e
15
ar e par t i cul ar r equi r ement s t hat need t o be met i f
16
you ar e get t i ng a t ax cr edi t . So I ' mcur i ous - -
17
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk t hat hi s di r ect
18
t est i mony st r i ct l y went t o t he pr omi se of 20 per cent
19
af f or dabi l i t y, end of st or y. And you know, how i t ' s
20
compl i ed wi t h i s not par t of hi s di r ect t est i mony.
21
MS. FERSTER: Okay, i s t her e anot her
22
wi t ness who' s goi ng t o - - because I know t hat your
295
1
pr ehear i ng submi ssi on di d t al k about t he, you know,
2
t ax benef i t s t hat ar e goi ng t o be gener at ed by t hi s
3
pr oj ect and i n t er ms of t he Gr een Door Advi sor s. I s
4
somebody goi ng t o be abl e t o descr i be what t ax
5
cr edi t s or abat ement s ar e goi ng t o be appl i ed f or , as
6
wel l ?
7
MS. BROWN: I t ' s i n t he Gr een Door r epor t
8
and you' ve hear d t he l i st of wi t nesses.
9
MS. FERSTER: I s somebody who' s pr epar ed
10
t he Gr een Door r epor t goi ng t o t est i f y?
11
MS. BROWN: You' l l see.
12
MS. FERSTER: I wi l l see? Can you t el l me?
13
MS. BROWN: No, j ust as you sai d you don' t
14
have t o t el l me who al l your wi t nesses ar e, I don' t
15
have t o t el l you t he scope of t he t est i mony t hat my
16
wi t nesses ar e goi ng t o pr epar e.
17
MS. FERSTER: Okay, t hen I woul d l i ke t o - -
18
I have a wi t ness i n f r ont of me who' s t al ki ng about
19
af f or dabl e housi ng. I ' d l i ke t o be abl e t o ask my
20
af f or dabl e housi ng quest i ons.
21
MS. BROWN: I t ' s not par t of t he scope.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: So you' ve been t al ki ng about
296
1
par ki ng. Does your bui l di ng i nt end t o use f eder al
2
l ow i ncome t ax cr edi t s as a par t of i t ?
3
THE WI TNESS: I t may, i t may.
4
J UDGE BYRNE: I t may, you haven' t
5
det er mi ned t hat yet .
6
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, f i ne. Okay, so I t hi nk
8
t hat ' s t he end of t hat .
9
10
Q Okay, and there's also tax abatements that
11
are available under D.C. law, as well. Are you
12
intending to use those?
13
J UDGE BYRNE: He hasn' t det er mi ned yet .
14
15
16
Q You don't know. Your answer is you just
17
don't know.
18
MS. BROWN: I t hi nk he sai d i t hasn' t been
19
det er mi ned was t he answer .
20
21
Q All right, so going back to the parking,
22
then, is it also your testimony that you know the
297
1
price that tenants will be paying for parking -- you
2
do not know that?
3
A I t has not been det er mi ned yet .
4
Q And do you know any other charges that
5
tenants will be charged?
6
MS. BROWN: Agai n, I t hought t hat we
7
nar r owed t he scope and got out of t hi s r eal mand I ' m
8
hear i ng t he same quest i ons agai n.
9
MS. FERSTER: And agai n, I - -
10
J UDGE BYRNE: What ki nd of char ges ar e you
11
t al ki ng about ?
12
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , t enant s, you know,
13
par t i cul ar l y t enant s i n af f or dabl e housi ng, i t ' s
14
pr et t y t ypi cal t hat some l andl or ds wi l l char ge, wi l l
15
cr eat e an af f or dabl e housi ng apar t ment uni t t hat
16
r ent s f or a cer t ai n amount , t hen char ge t hema l ot
17
f or par ki ng and char ge t hema l ot f or ot her f ees and
18
ser vi ces, you know, conci er ge, what ever . I j ust want
19
t o know, get out on t he t abl e what t hese t enant s ar e
20
goi ng t o be char ged.
21
MS. BROWN: Wel l , per haps a bet t er quest i on
22
i s i s t hat somet hi ng t hat wi l l be devel oped at t hi s
298
1
poi nt i n t hi s ent i t l ement st age.
2
THE WI TNESS: The answer woul d be no.
3
4
Q So you don't know. That is my question,
5
you don't know at this point what additional charges
6
the tenants will be charged. You don't know at this
7
point, is that correct?
8
MS. BROWN: I ' mnot answer i ng t he
9
quest i ons.
10
MS. FERSTER: You wer e, you wer e aski ng t he
11
quest i on.
12
MS. BROWN: I was suggest i ng t he quest i on
13
t o you.
14
MS. FERSTER: Okay, and I j ust asked t hat .
15
Can your wi t ness answer i t ?
16
MS. BROWN: He di d.
17
18
Q You don't know.
19
MS. BROWN: But t hat ' s not what hi s answer
20
was.
21
22
Q Okay, at this time, you don't know. Well,
299
1
can you just answer it, then?
2
MS. BROWN: Go ahead and r eanswer her
3
quest i on.
4
THE WI TNESS: Okay, i f you coul d r eask t he
5
quest i on - -
6
7
Q So is it correct that at this point, you do
8
not know what additional charges tenants in the
9
affordable housing will be charged, at this point,
10
other than the rent?
11
A At t hi s poi nt , we have not devel oped any
12
addi t i onal char ges at al l , j ust l i ke t he base r ent
13
wi l l be changi ng f r omyear t o year i n accor dance wi t h
14
l ot s of di f f er ent f undi ng sour ces.
15
Q But it is possible there will be additional
16
charges, you just don't know.
17
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s enough. I t hi nk
18
you' ve made your poi nt and I t hi nk he sai d he hasn' t
19
det er mi ned what char ges t her e ar e and he doesn' t
20
ant i ci pat e any.
21
22
Q You don't anticipate any charges?
300
1
MS. FERSTER: Because he di d not say t hat .
2
J UDGE BYRNE: He sai d he hadn' t pl anned
3
any. Okay, f ai r enough.
4
5
Q So the representative from the Deputy
6
Mayor's Office said that she believed that an
7
affordable dwelling unit would be agreed to in this
8
project. Are you familiar with the terms, the
9
parameters of the affordable dwelling unit that would
10
be entered into?
11
A I don' t know what you' r e t al ki ng about .
12
Q Okay, so you're not involved in that.
13
A No, no, what you j ust asked was an
14
af f or dabl e dwel l i ng uni t . I don' t know what you' r e
15
t al ki ng about .
16
Q Affordable dwelling unit agreement, it's
17
called an ADU agreement. You're not familiar with
18
that? Because I did ask the representative from the
19
Deputy Mayor's Office about specifically whether an
20
ADU agreement would be entered into and she said it
21
would be.
22
MS. BROWN: Okay, so you have your answer .
301
1
MS. FERSTER: But t hen I f ol l owed up and
2
sai d - - and t hen she sai d she' s not i nvol ved i n t hat
3
and you sai d t her e' s anot her wi t ness t o t al k about
4
af f or dabl e housi ng who I can ask t hat quest i on t o.
5
I woul d l i ke t o ask t hat quest i on. I f he
6
doesn' t know, he doesn' t know.
7
THE WI TNESS: You have t o expl ai n t o me
8
what an ADU i s.
9
10
Q Okay, so you don't know anything about an
11
ADU agreement, is that it?
12
A No, an ADU agr eement i s a gener i c t er m. I
13
don' t know what you' r e t al ki ng about .
14
Q Okay, okay. Are you aware of any agreement
15
with the District of Columbia relating to affordable
16
dwelling units that will be entered into?
17
A Ther e coul d be a var i et y of ADU - - of
18
af f or dabl e housi ng covenant s and/ or a var i et y of
19
ot her agr eement s. I don' t know whi ch one you' r e
20
speaki ng of .
21
Q Okay, can you describe all the agreements
22
--
302
1
A No, I can' t do - -
2
Q -- relating to affordable housing?
3
J UDGE BYRNE: What ' s t ypi cal f or an
4
af f or dabl e housi ng covenant ?
5
THE WI TNESS: Ther e coul d be a pl et hor a of
6
di f f er ent agr eement s.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Di f f er ent agr eement s wi t h
8
di f f er ent agenci es?
9
THE WI TNESS: Exact l y.
10
11
Q With the D.C. government, do you know
12
whether any agreements are going to be entered into
13
with the D.C. government for this process relating to
14
affordable housing?
15
A That ' s f or t he Di st r i ct t o deci de. As t he
16
sel l er , we woul d be - - we wi l l ent er t ai n and be abl e
17
t o compl y wi t h t he agr eement s t hat t he Di st r i ct set s
18
f or t h f or us.
19
Q But you don't know what they are.
20
A No, I di dn' t say t hat .
21
Q But if you do know what they are, could you
22
tell us?
303
1
A No. They need t o pr esent t hemt o us.
2
Q Mm-hmm.
3
A And we wi l l r espond.
4
Q And they haven't presented them, any
5
agreements to you?
6
A Thi s i s not t he appr opr i at e t i me t o be
7
goi ng t hr ough covenant s, pr e- ent i t l ement .
8
Q Okay, so they haven't presented any drafts
9
of any kind of parameters? You don't know what
10
covenants are going to be required?
11
MS. BROWN: I ' mki nd of concer ned about
12
t hi s di r ect i on and I t hi nk he' s been asked and
13
answer ed t he same quest i ons si x or seven t i mes.
14
MS. FERSTER: I s t hi s your onl y wi t ness on
15
af f or dabl e housi ng?
16
MS. BROWN: You know, we have anot her
17
wi t ness who can t est i f y t o i t , but you know - -
18
MS. FERSTER: I ' d be happy t o ask t he
19
af f or dabl e housi ng quest i ons t o a mor e knowl edgeabl e
20
wi t ness, t hat ' s not a pr obl em.
21
But I t hi nk i t i s ver y r el evant because
22
when af f or dabl e housi ng i s one of your cor e speci al
304
1
mer i t ar gument s, i t i s r eal l y r el evant t he t hi ngs
2
t hat woul d nor mal l y be i n t he covenant s on af f or dabl e
3
dwel l i ng uni t s i n t he Di st r i ct , i ncl udi ng t he
4
dur at i on of af f or dabl e housi ng, how l ong i t - - you
5
know, any ki nd of covenant s t hat r un wi t h t he l and
6
t hat woul d r est r i ct r esal e t o an af f or dabl e pr i ce and
7
t hat sor t of t hi ng.
8
9
Q So I'm happy to direct my questions to
10
somebody else if that's not something you're
11
knowledgeable about.
12
A Thi s i s t he f i r st t i me t hat you' ve act ual l y
13
expl ai ned what i t i s t hat you' r e t al ki ng about , so i f
14
you wer e - -
15
Q Just tell me --
16
A You can wal k me t hr ough t he r est of i t and
17
t hat wi l l be hel pf ul , t oo.
18
Q Are you the right witness to talk about it
19
or is there somebody else? That would be the
20
question.
21
A We ar e per f ect l y qual i f i ed t o t al k about
22
af f or dabl e housi ng as i t r el at es t o t hi s pr oj ect .
305
1
Q Okay. Can you tell me the affordable
2
housing covenants that you would enter into with the
3
District of Columbia that would ensure the
4
affordability for resale purposes of this housing?
5
A I t hi nk i t woul d be i nappr opr i at e f or me t o
6
suggest an af f or dabl e housi ng covenant when t he
7
Di st r i ct i s r esponsi bl e f or pr ovi di ng t hat covenant
8
t o us.
9
Q And they haven't provided you one yet, a
10
draft?
11
A I have not r evi ewed one.
12
J UDGE BYRNE: So l et ' s t r y t hi s. So what
13
i s t he ant i ci pat ed dur at i on of t he af f or dabi l i t y of
14
t hese uni t s and what ki nd of assur ances ar e t her e
15
t hat t hey wi l l r emai n af f or dabl e f or t hat per i od of
16
t i me? I s t hat a mor e wor kabl e quest i on?
17
THE WI TNESS: As i t r el at es t o t he seni or
18
af f or dabl e housi ng, i t woul d be our i nt ent t hat t hese
19
uni t s woul d be af f or dabl e i nt o per pet ui t y - -
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Per pet ui t y.
21
THE WI TNESS: - - t o mi r r or t he i ncl usi onar y
22
zoni ng pr act i ce.
306
1
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, good. And assumi ng
2
t hat , l et ' s say you sol d t he pr oper t y t o somebody
3
el se, how woul d t hey be bound by t hat , by a PUD?
4
THE WI TNESS: Typi cal l y, a PUD and/ or
5
sever al ot her covenant s t hat woul d r un wi t h t he l and.
6
J UDGE BYRNE: And you woul d expect t hat as
7
t he pr oj ect mat ur es, t hat you wi l l ent er i nt o a
8
var i et y of covenant s wi t h t he Di st r i ct gover nment
9
t hat wi l l set mor e speci f i c par amet er s t o t hese
10
quest i ons, i s t hat f ai r ?
11
THE WI TNESS: As t he pr oj ect mat ur es and as
12
we pr oceed t hr ough t he LDA pr ocess, yes.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght . So i s t hat what
14
you' r e l ooki ng f or , Ms. Fer st er ? Do you have mor e?
15
MS. FERSTER: Yeah, t hat was def i ni t el y
16
par t of what I ' ml ooki ng f or .
17
18
Q And I also was looking for not just the
19
covenants that restrict the rental price, that
20
restrict the resale price. I'm wondering whether or
21
not there were going to be covenants in terms of the
22
for-sale units, whether or not the resale price would
307
1
be restricted in perpetuity, as well, if you --
2
A That I can' t speak t o.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: He' s j ust t he r ent al guy.
4
THE WI TNESS: Ri ght , t hank you.
5
6
Q You're just the rental guy, good, that's
7
the only thing you can speak to. And then in terms
8
of the covenants or the agreements that you would
9
enter into with the District of Columbia, in your
10
experience sort of as a person who is generally
11
involved in this type of project, what other types of
12
restrictions would the District of Columbia require
13
in that sort of agreement?
14
A Why amI goi ng t hr ough t hat ?
15
Q Because I would like to know what other
16
protections there are --
17
A I t depends on what you ask.
18
Q -- to the tenants.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk i f i t goes beyond
20
af f or dabi l i t y, t hen i t ' s not wi t hi n t he scope of - -
21
MS. FERSTER: Wel l , I t hi nk t hose
22
pr ot ect i ons do go beyond. I mean, t ypi cal l y, you
308
1
know, t hese agr eement s do have a number of - - shoul d
2
have a number of pr ot ect i ons t o t enant s t hat ensur e
3
t hat t he uni t s r emai n af f or dabl e, not j ust i n t er ms
4
of r ent s, but ot her char ges.
5
6
Q Do you have anything you'd like to --
7
MS. BROWN: You know, I t hi nk he answer ed
8
t hat .
9
MS. FERSTER: And t he answer was he di dn' t
10
know.
11
MS. BROWN: No, I hear d " per pet ui t y. "
12
MS. FERSTER: Yeah, but t hat was f or t he
13
seni or housi ng, yeah.
14
15
Q So for the other affordable rental units?
16
MS. BROWN: Do you know - -
17
18
Q I mean it would be easier if you would just
19
look to me --
20
A No, I can l ook t hi s way, t hat ' s f i ne.
21
Q I mean your attorney knows how to object
22
when she wants to.
309
1
MS. BROWN: Can we hear what t he pendi ng
2
quest i on was?
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you want t o r est at e t he
4
quest i on?
5
6
Q Okay, so you talked about the restrictions
7
in perpetuity that are on the affordable rental
8
senior units. How about for the other affordable
9
rental units, are there restrictions in perpetuity on
10
those units, will there be?
11
A That has not been negot i at ed wi t h t he
12
Di st r i ct yet .
13
Q Okay, so you don't know.
14
MS. BROWN: He answer ed t he quest i on.
15
Asked and answer ed, l et ' s move on.
16
17
Q Well, I guess I just have to ask you a
18
question about your certified business enterprise
19
status.
20
A Mm- hmm.
21
Q So which of your affiliated entities is a
22
certified business enterprise?
310
1
A Wel l , l et ' s st ar t wi t h t he f act t hat I ' ma
2
Di st r i ct r esi dent .
3
Q Mm-hmm.
4
A My busi nesses ar e l ocat ed on E St r eet i n
5
Washi ngt on, D. C. The maj or i t y of our busi nesses ar e
6
- - t he maj or i t y of our busi ness i s done her e i n t he
7
Di st r i ct .
8
Q Okay.
9
A So t hat al l ows f or my compani es, our
10
compani es t o be cer t i f i ed by t he Depar t ment of Smal l
11
and Local Busi ness Devel opment . And I own a
12
devel opment and ser vi ce - - an advi sor y ser vi ce
13
busi ness, whi ch i s cer t i f i ed.
14
Q Okay, and what's the name of that? Is that
15
Lynch Development Advisers?
16
MS. BROWN: Don' t l ook t o me, she' s aski ng
17
you. Go ahead.
18
THE WI TNESS: That i s Lynch Devel opment
19
Advi ser s.
20
21
Q Okay, and that is your certified business
22
enterprise, and is that --
311
1
A That ' s A. I have a second her e.
2
Q You have a second one, okay.
3
A I own an i nvest ment company, al so, whi ch
4
i nvest s i n our hol di ng compani es i n a ser i es of our
5
r eal est at e pr oj ect s. That i s al so cer t i f i ed.
6
Q Okay, and --
7
MS. BROWN: I ' mgoi ng t o obj ect at t hi s
8
poi nt because he t est i f i ed t hat he' s a CBE, t hat he
9
wi l l be qual i f i ed f or t hi s pr oj ect t hat s par t of t he
10
package; we' ve hear d t est i mony t oday t o t hat ef f ect .
11
So what l i st t hat you have t her e t hat you' r e wor ki ng
12
t hr ough i s i r r el evant because t hat ' s goi ng t o be a
13
r equi r ement of t he deal .
14
MS. FERSTER: Mm- hmm.
15
MS. BROWN: End of st or y. So you don' t
16
need t o - - i f you have an i ssue wi t h what hi s CBE
17
st at us i s, you t ake i t t o t he Depar t ment of Smal l and
18
Local Busi ness Devel opment , not t he Mayor ' s Agent .
19
MS. FERSTER: Thank you f or t hat l ect ur e.
20
I appr eci at e bei ng i nst r uct ed on how I shoul d
21
r epr esent my cl i ent s and how I shoul d pr oceed, t hat ' s
22
ver y ki nd of you t o pr ovi de t hat .
312
1
2
Q And let me just conclude by asking you this
3
one last question about your certified business
4
enterprise entity, which is are the two, the entities
5
that are certified business enterprises, are they
6
part of the partnership of this Vision McMillan
7
Partners?
8
A J L EM I nvest or i s an i nvest ment hol di ng
9
company, whi ch i s ver y much par t of VMP. Lynch
10
Devel opment Advi sor s i s an af f i l i at e of t he ent i t y
11
t hat ' s i nvol ved i n t hi s pr oj ect .
12
Q Okay, thank you.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Ms. Mer r i t t ?
14
MS. MERRI TT: I have a f ol l ow- up quest i on.
15
BY MS. MERRI TT:
16
Q We were told by one of your earlier
17
witnesses that -- I think the word was like
18
"unprecedented use of CBEs" or something quite
19
extraordinary like that.
20
And I was wondering if you could tell us
21
what the overall percentage of the development
22
opportunity allocated to the CBE is.
313
1
A So t he quest i on woul d be i n t er ms of
2
dol l ar s of t he whol e t hi ng? The CBE i nvol vement i s
3
one of t he t hr ee par t ner s i n t he pr oj ect , and I don' t
4
- - i f you want t o know what t he al l ocat i on of shar es
5
ar e among t hem?
6
Q There is a budget statement that a certain
7
percentage of the overall development opportunities
8
will be awarded to CBEs. And this is a follow-up of
9
the earlier witness who testified that one of the
10
community benefits is this extraordinary use of CBEs.
11
And so I wanted to find out what the
12
percentage, since this is the only main CBE we've
13
heard about, what the percentage is of the overall
14
development.
15
J UDGE BYRNE: That seems f ai r .
16
THE WI TNESS: I bel i eve you' r e descr i bi ng,
17
and I don' t know, t hat you' r e descr i bi ng goods and
18
ser vi ces i f you' r e l ooki ng at a budget .
19
20
Q I'd be happy to read the sentence from the
21
budget justification from the city's FY 2014 budget.
22
It says --
314
1
MS. BROWN: I ' ma l i t t l e concer ned about
2
t hi s goi ng beyond t he scope of hi s t est i mony. I
3
t hi nk i f she want s t o br i ng evi dence i n her di r ect - -
4
J UDGE BYRNE: I t hi nk she' s t r yi ng t o ask a
5
quest i on about t he ext ent of CBE i nvol vement i n t he
6
pr oj ect . And I t hi nk when t he l ady f r omt he Deput y
7
Mayor ' s Of f i ce t est i f i ed, you sai d t hat l at er on,
8
t her e woul d be somebody who coul d bet t er answer t he
9
quest i on and I had assumed t hat Mr . Lynch was t hat
10
per son. I f t hat ' s wr ong, we may have t o t hi nk about
11
who coul d answer her quest i on.
12
THE WI TNESS: No, I can answer t he
13
quest i on. The quest i on i s - - I bel i eve she' s r eadi ng
14
about goods and ser vi ces, whi ch i s t ypi cal l y t he way
15
t he Di st r i ct t hi nks about CBE. And f or t he l ast 30
16
year s, unf or t unat el y, t hey' ve been t hi nki ng onl y
17
about goods and ser vi ces.
18
Over t he l ast f ew year s, backed by
19
l egi sl at i on, t her e i s a desi r e t o have owner shi p
20
pot ent i al f or l ocal busi nesses i n l ar ger pr oj ect s.
21
Thi s i s one of t he f i r st t i mes i n whi ch t her e i s
22
l ocal owner shi p t hr ough our company i n act ual l y
315
1
component s of t hi s devel opment pr oj ect .
2
J UDGE BYRNE: So what was descr i bed, t hen,
3
as an unpr ecedent ed CBE i nvol vement was speci f i cal l y
4
r ef er r i ng t o t he owner shi p component of t he pr oj ect .
5
6
Q So what's the percentage that corresponds
7
with that ownership interest, that CBE ownership
8
interest?
9
A The per cent age of t he FAR t hat we' r e
10
devel opi ng.
11
J UDGE BYRNE: And what i s t hat ?
12
THE WI TNESS: Appr oxi mat el y 25 per cent of
13
t he FAR.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Appr oxi mat el y 25 per cent of
15
t he FAR, okay.
16
17
Q So one other CBE reference in this budget
18
document refers to 35 percent of local contracting
19
opportunities must go to CBEs. Do you have anything
20
to do with that or is that somebody else's bailiwick
21
entirely. Since you're the only CBE that's been
22
identified, I'm wondering --
316
1
A Act ual l y, agai n, as I wal ked you t hr ough
2
t hat , t hat ' s r ef er r i ng t o goods and ser vi ces. Goods
3
and ser vi ces st ar t wi t h any and al l busi nesses t hat
4
ar e wor ki ng on t he pr oj ect , Tr acer i es, Per ki ns
5
East man D. C. , t hey' r e al l CBE compani es. And t hat
6
wi l l cont i nue t hr ough t he pr oj ect as we get t hr ough
7
f ul l desi gn and const r uct i on.
8
So agai n, i f you' r e l ooki ng f or goods and
9
ser vi ces, you can act ual l y see t he CBEs her e i n t he
10
r oomnow.
11
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any mor e
12
quest i ons.
13
MS. FERSTER: No quest i ons.
14
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , Mr . Lynch, t hank
15
you ver y much.
16
17
Wher eupon,
18
AAKASH THAKKAR
19
20
f ol l ow:
21
22
BY MS. BROWN:
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1
Q Mr. Thakkar, do you want to start your
2
testimony?
3
A Good eveni ng. My name i s Aakash Thakkar
4
and I ama par t ner and seni or vi ce pr esi dent wi t h t he
5
f i r mEYA. I amt he f or - sal e guy.
6
My f i r mhas been i nvol ved i n t hi s pr oj ect
7
si nce 2007, when we wer e sel ect ed f or t hi s si t e i n an
8
ext r aor di nar i l y compet i t i ve pr ocess wher e f i ve t eams,
9
al l wi t h good and di ver se backgr ounds, f r ankl y, al l
10
qual i f i ed, wer e, you know, put t hr ough t he wr i nger
11
mi ght be a way t o say i t , by t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a
12
or t he NCRC at t he t i me t o sel ect a f i r mt hat had,
13
f r ankl y, t he bandwi t h - - and when I say a f i r m, a
14
t eam- - t hat had t he bandwi t h t o under st and t he
15
compl exi t i es of t he si t e and put t oget her a
16
devel opment pl an and t hen i mpl ement i t .
17
So what t he Di st r i ct was r eal l y l ooki ng f or
18
at t hat t i me, as I sai d, we' ve got t hi s bi g, you
19
know, wonder f ul oppor t uni t y and we need a f i r mt hat
20
has exper t i se i n a number of di f f er ent ar eas t o
21
addr ess t he i ssues, sol ve t he pr obl ems and put f or t h
22
a f i r st r at e devel opment pl an i n par t ner shi p wi t h t he
318
1
communi t y.
2
So i n 2007, a t eaml ed by bot h EYA and J ai r
3
Lynch Devel opment Par t ner s wer e sel ect ed by t he
4
Di st r i ct . And I wi l l come back t o t hat CBE quest i on
5
i n j ust a second because I do t hi nk J ai r Lynch' s
6
par t i ci pat i on i s unpr ecedent ed. And we' ve been i n a
7
l ot of pr oj ect s wi t h CBEs and I t hi nk we have sor t of
8
a good vant age poi nt about what ' s unpr ecedent ed or
9
uni que about t he par t ner shi p wi t h J ai r Lynch
10
Devel opment Par t ner s.
11
A l i t t l e bi t about EYA. We wer e f ounded i n
12
1992 and our goal , i n a nut shel l , i s t o do
13
out st andi ng ur ban i nf i l l devel opment and
14
r edevel opment . We' ve done over 4, 000 uni t s of mi xed
15
i ncome housi ng i n t he r egi on, we ar e a mi xed i ncome
16
exper t . We do pr edomi nant l y f or - sal e; as I say, I ' m
17
t he f or - sal e guy. We do some r ent al .
18
But i n t er ms of t he qual i t y of t he
19
pr oj ect s, you know, we' r e ver y f ocused on i nsi de t he
20
Bel t way, i n t he Di st r i ct and i n t he sur r oundi ng
21
communi t i es. And I say t hat because t hi s si t e i s one
22
t hat needs bot h, as Mr . Bel l sai d, kni t i nt o t he
319
1
sur r oundi ng communi t y and be uni quel y McMi l l an. And
2
I t hi nk we' r e wel l si t uat ed, based on our exper i ence,
3
t o do bot h of t hose.
4
We have a l ot of exper i ence wor ki ng wi t h
5
communi t i es and a l ot of exper i ence i n t he hi st or i c
6
pr eser vat i on pr ocess i n t he Di st r i ct and i n t he
7
sur r oundi ng communi t i es.
8
Thi s i s j ust a qui ck pr oj ect I show because
9
i t ' s i n t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a and - -
10
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s Sout h Car ol i na Avenue.
11
THE WI TNESS: You' ve got i t , you' ve got i t .
12
And I l i ke t o show t hi s sl i de because when t hese
13
houses wer e del i ver ed or t o be del i ver ed t o t he
14
r esi dent s, t he i nspect or came out and cal l ed over t o
15
t he of f i ce and sai d, " Unf or t unat el y, t her e ar e no new
16
homes t o i nspect . You know, I ' mnot sur e what t o
17
do. " And our pr oj ect manager cal l ed hi mup, dr ove
18
hi mover t o t he si t e and sai d, i n f act , " The homes on
19
t he r i ght ar e new homes and t he homes on t he l ef t ar e
20
exi st i ng Capi t al Hi l l r owhouses. "
21
And I show t hat because i n t hat i nst ance,
22
t he pr eser vat i on sol ut i on t hat was cal l ed f or by t he
320
1
HPRB and by t he communi t y was one of sor t of an exact
2
r epl i cat i on of what was i n t he sur r oundi ng communi t y.
3
And we t hi nk we di d a good j ob of addr essi ng t hose
4
concer ns and t he communi t y t her e was ver y happy wi t h
5
t he al t er nat i ve. We t ook t hat same appr oach wi t h
6
McMi l l an.
7
So t he pur pose of my t est i mony, I can
8
cer t ai nl y t al k about t he f or - sal e housi ng. I ' mgoi ng
9
t o ki nd of t ouch on each of our communi t y benef i t s
10
and r eal l y f ocus on t hose t hat have not been
11
ar t i cul at ed i n any det ai l t o dat e.
12
So I ' mgoi ng t o st ar t , act ual l y t ake i t out
13
of or der and j ust st ar t wi t h t he CBE par t i ci pat i on
14
quest i on, t her e' s been a l ot of di scussi on about i t .
15
So why do we t hi nk t hi s i s unpr ecedent ed i n
16
t er ms of our par t ner shi p wi t h J ai r Lynch Devel opment
17
Par t ner s? We wor k a l ot i n t he Di st r i ct and what we
18
f i nd i s we have devel opment par t ner s, l ocal
19
busi nesses t hat ar e par t of our t eamwhen we' r e
20
devel opi ng a si t e. And so t hey get t o t ake par t i n
21
what we do, t hey get t o l ear n f r omEYA, whi ch i s a
22
l ar ger company i n t he r egi on, and r eal l y be a par t of
321
1
our t eam, but not have t hei r own devel opment par cel s.
2
Li ke I sai d, we' ve been i nvol ved i n a
3
number of pr oj ect s. Never once have I had t he
4
exper i ence wher e a CBE wi l l have i t s own capi t al and
5
devel op i t s own i ndi vi dual par cel .
6
So why i s t hat i mpor t ant ? You know, t he
7
Di st r i ct has an of f i ce t hat f ocuses on l ocal
8
compani es and i nsur i ng t hat l ocal compani es can t ake
9
par t i n t hese pr oj ect s.
10
Mr . Lynch i s humbl e, but he r eal l y i s sor t
11
of on t he f or ef r ont of l ocal compani es t hat do t hei r
12
own t hi ng. And why i s t hat i mpor t ant ? I can' t t el l
13
you how many peopl e say, " Oh, you know J ai r ? Can I
14
meet wi t h hi m. I ' myoung, I ' ml ocal , I want t o get
15
i n t he busi ness and I want t o f ol l ow hi s t r ack of how
16
do you become a bi g, successf ul l ocal busi ness?" Not
17
bi g yet , but get t i ng t her e.
18
But , you know, " How do you become a f i r st
19
cl ass l ocal busi ness and how do you devel op si t es on
20
your own?" And he' s one of t he f ol ks at t he
21
f or ef r ont of t hat . And so when we say unpr ecedent ed,
22
i t ' s not as i f he i s i nvest i ng i n EYA or i nvest i ng i n
322
1
Tr ammel Cr ow. He i s f ul l y devel opi ng what i n my
2
opi ni on ar e cr i t i cal , cr i t i cal pi eces of t hi s
3
pr oj ect , t he seni or housi ng, t he gr ocer y st or e,
4
r ent al housi ng, cr eat i ng pl aces al ong t he nor t h
5
ser vi ce cour t .
6
As J ai r sai d i n hi s t est i mony, he i s
7
st andi ng t oe t o t oe wi t h us. I t hi nk our per cent age
8
of t he FAR i s ver y si mi l ar t o J ai r Lynch' s. The
9
medi cal of f i ce i s t he bi gger par t of t hi s pr oj ect .
10
But my poi nt i s t hat we do bel i eve i t i s
11
especi al l y mer i t or i ous because i t i s one of t he f i r st
12
pr oj ect s t hat I amawar e of , t her e mi ght be a coupl e
13
of ot her s, but I can assur e you t her e ar en' t many,
14
wher e t he CBE devel oper has a par cel of t hi s si ze,
15
scal e and i mpor t .
16
Wi t h r egar d t o af f or dabl e housi ng, I ' d l i ke
17
t o addr ess a coupl e of quest i ons t her e. Fi r st , t he
18
f or - sal e af f or dabl e housi ng wi l l be f or sal e i n
19
per pet ui t y, j ust as Mr . Lynch ment i oned t hat t he
20
seni or housi ng woul d be.
21
I n t er ms of covenant s and such, we ar e
22
cur r ent l y wor ki ng t hr ough, and t hat ' s why we can' t
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1
si t her e t oday and t el l you t hat i t i s f i nal , wi t h
2
t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on what t he f i nal l anguage wi l l be
3
wi t h r egar d t o t hose covenant s. I can assur e you,
4
havi ng wor ked wi t h t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on on covenant s
5
many, many t i mes, t hey' r e goi ng t o hol d our f eet t o
6
t he f i r e and we want t hemt o.
7
We devel op mi xed i ncome housi ng, we know
8
how t o devel op mi xed i ncome housi ng. I bel i eve t hat
9
we have a pr oposed covenant i nt o t he Zoni ng
10
Commi ssi on r i ght now. Ther e may be t weaks t o t hat
11
back and f or t h, but my sense i s when t he Zoni ng
12
Commi ssi on t akes f i nal act i on, we' r e goi ng t o have a
13
covenant i n pl ace t hat i s r est r i ct i ve i n keepi ng wi t h
14
ot her Di st r i ct pr oj ect s of t hi s si ze and scal e.
15
They' r e goi ng t o mandat e t he 20 per cent , t hey' r e
16
goi ng t o mandat e t he gener al af f or dabi l i t y l evel s
17
t hat we' ve l ai d out . That ' s how t he Di st r i ct does
18
busi ness. So I can assur e sor t of , you know, t he
19
br oader communi t y t hat our af f or dabl e housi ng pr ogr am
20
wi l l be enshr i ned i n t hat PUD, enshr i ned i n t he
21
covenant s and wi l l be del i ver ed. So t hat ' s
22
af f or dabl e housi ng.
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1
Wi t h r egar d t o t he r est of t hese benef i t s,
2
and I wi l l t ouch on each one, I t hi nk what i s
3
i mpor t ant her e, l ooki ng back agai n t o t hi s sor t of
4
ver y hi gh bar t hat i s speci al mer i t , each and ever y
5
one of t hese communi t y benef i t s wer e suggest ed and/ or
6
put f or t h or mandat ed, f r ankl y, t he Ci t y, t he ci t y
7
counci l member i n War d 5 and t he ANC, who' s act ual l y
8
been ki nd enough t o wai t her e t oday.
9
And so when we t al k about communi t y
10
benef i t s at l ar ge, what we di d i s st ar t i ng wi t h t he
11
Di st r i ct and t he counci l member who r epr esent s t hat
12
communi t y at l ar ge, sai d, " What woul d make t hi s
13
pr oj ect speci al f or you, not j ust an ever yday publ i c-
14
pr i vat e par t ner shi p, but a uni que pr oj ect ?" And I ' d
15
l i ke t o say t hat we have addr essed a vast maj or i t y of
16
t hose i ssues i n put t i ng f or t h t hi s compr ehensi ve set
17
of publ i c benef i t s her e.
18
So I ' mgoi ng t o t al k a l i t t l e bi t about t he
19
publ i c par k. I know we' ve had a f ai r bi t of
20
di scussi on ar ound i t and so I ' mnot goi ng t o r ead
21
t hr ough t hese agai n. But I wi l l say havi ng been
22
i nvol ved now f or ei ght year s, a vast publ i c par k i s
325
1
somet hi ng t hat i s i mpor t ant t o many peopl e, many
2
peopl e i n t hi s r oom. Some f ol ks want i t bi gger , but
3
i n ki nd of wor ki ng t hr ough t he r i ght si ze of a par k,
4
we f ound t hi s t o be an ext r aor di nar i l y l ar ge and
5
wonder f ul space t hat can be enj oyed by t he communi t y.
6
The communi t y cent er . Agai n, I ' d l i ke t o
7
speak about t hi s one. You' ve seen t he pr ogr am,
8
you' ve seen t he sl i des. Wher e di d t hi s r equest come
9
f r omwi t h r egar d t o t he communi t y at l ar ge?
10
The si t t i ng counci l member , as you' ve hear d,
11
l i ves acr oss t he st r eet . Our si ngl e member ANC,
12
who' s si t t i ng her e t oday, and many f ol ks i n t he
13
communi t y sai d, " A par k woul d be one t hi ng and we
14
want a par k and we need a par k. But t her e ar e ot her
15
communi t i es t hr oughout t he ci t y who have excel l ent
16
communi t y cent er s and wi t h t hi s excel l ent oppor t uni t y
17
t o devel op t he si t e, we want a communi t y cent er
18
her e. "
19
And so agai n, t hat r equest was made. We
20
wor ked wi t h t he Di st r i ct t o i ncl ude f unds f or i t i n
21
t he budget . We wor ked wi t h Mr . Bel l and company t o
22
desi gn somet hi ng t hat ' s i n keepi ng wi t h t he si t e and
326
1
wer e abl e t o del i ver on somet hi ng t hat was of
2
si gni f i cant i mpor t t o t he communi t y.
3
I want t o t al k a l i t t l e bi t about t he par k
4
i n t er ms of cont ext . We st udi ed t he best par ks
5
i nst r ument t he nat i on, per i od. And so I ' ve got t wo
6
pi ct ur es her e. I ' l l st ar t wi t h t he bot t omone,
7
act ual l y. I t ' s Ci t ygar den i n St . Loui s. Thr ee
8
acr es. So, you know, al most a l i t t l e bi gger t han a
9
t hi r d of our ei ght acr es. Hi gh densi t y sur r oundi ngs,
10
as you can see, desi gned by Nel son, Byr d, Wol z.
11
And we haven' t t al ked about t hemmuch.
12
They ar e our l andscape ar chi t ect and, f r ankl y, a f i r m
13
of i nt er nat i onal r eput at i on. Thi s par k, at t hr ee
14
acr es i n downt own St . Loui s, was awar ded t he Ur ban
15
Land I nst i t ut e Par k of t he Year Awar d i n 2012. And
16
what I ' l l not e about i t i s i t ' s got gr eat l andscape
17
desi gn.
18
What we t hi nk makes our par k and par ks wor k
19
i n t oday' s day and age i s some l evel of vi t al i t y and,
20
yes, maybe t hi s i s a di r t y wor d, but densi t y, because
21
you do need peopl e ar ound a par k t o make i t vi br ant .
22
So you' ve got t he communi t i es t o t he sout h,
327
1
Bl oomi ngdal e, and t o t he east , St r onghol d.
2
But what we ar e doi ng i s r eal l y gi vi ng t he
3
par k, f r ankl y, a saf et y and al so a vi t al i t y t hr ough
4
devel opment associ at ed wi t h a par k t hat you see i n
5
bot h Ci t ygar den and t hen a mor e l ocal exampl e, t he
6
2013 wi nner of t he Ur ban Land I nst i t ut e Par k of t he
7
Year Awar d, a f i ve- acr e par k i n t he Di st r i ct , and
8
si gni f i cant l y mor e densi t y t han McMi l l an wi l l have.
9
But i f you' ve been her e on a Fr i day ni ght , you can
10
see par t of t he vi t al i t y of t hi s par k.
11
And what we' r e t r yi ng t o cr eat e i n McMi l l an
12
wi l l r esul t f r omwhat i s ar ound t he par k, as wel l .
13
So we want t o be t he best , we want t o be speci al
14
mer i t and we t hi nk our par k wi l l be on par wi t h t hese
15
gr eat par ks ar ound t he count r y.
16
You hear d Ms. Cor bet t t al k about an
17
expanded t r anspor t at i on net wor k. I amnot a t r af f i c
18
engi neer and I ' mnot t est i f yi ng t o t he Zoni ng
19
Commi ssi on r epor t t hat was submi t t ed. What I can say
20
and what I t hi nk Ms. Cor bet t was t r yi ng t o expl ai n i s
21
t hat whet her i t ' s pr i vat el y- owned shut t l e, Bi keshar e
22
docks, shor t and l ong- t er mbi cycl e st or age, a
328
1
mul t i modal t r ansi t hub, a number of i mpr ovement s
2
ar ound t he si t e wi t h r egar d t o r oad i mpr ovement s, we
3
have pr oposed a hef t y package of t r anspor t at i on
4
i mpr ovement s t o t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
5
And what ' s i mpor t ant her e i s t hat we' ve
6
wor ked wi t h DDOT f or mont hs. DDOT has appr oved our
7
package of i mpr ovement s. The Zoni ng Commi ssi on has
8
t ent at i vel y - - or pr el i mi nar i l y, I shoul d say, not
9
t ent at i vel y - - appr oved our t r ansi t i mpr ovement s.
10
And we t hi nk wer e br i ngi ng a l ot t o t he t abl e i n
11
t er ms of mor e oppor t uni t i es f or peopl e t o exper i ence
12
t he si t e and get t o t he si t e i n di f f er ent ways t han
13
t hey can t oday wi t h r egar d t o t he bi kes.
14
And what el se we' l l do wi t h r egar d t o t hi s
15
i s, as t hi s devel opment happens, al l of t he pl ans f or
16
t he ci t y i n t er ms of t he st r eet car and even
17
Ci r cul at or assume t he devel opment of McMi l l an, and
18
what DDOT has sai d i s once t hi s pr oj ect comes, " We
19
wi l l st ar t i nvest i ng i n t hose ot her f or ms of
20
t r anspor t at i on. "
21
And what we t hi nk wi l l happen ul t i mat el y,
22
t he l ong- t er msol ut i on, i s t hat wi t h st r eet car or
329
1
even mor e publ i c t r anspor t at i on access, l i ke t he
2
Ci r cul at or , get t i ng t o t hi s si t e wi l l be easi er t o
3
get t o and t her e wi l l be di f f er ent f or ms of
4
t r anspor t at i on t han t her e ar e t oday.
5
We' ve t al ked about l ow- i mpact devel opment
6
and so we want t o be cl ear on t hi s poi nt . Ther e' s a
7
desi gnat i on cal l ed LEED ND f or mast er pl ans and we' ve
8
scor ed our si t e and we meet t he base l evel s of what
9
i t means t o be LEED ND and we i nt end t o exceed t hose.
10
As you can see i n t he Power Poi nt her e,
11
t her e' s a number of di f f er ent st or mwat er management
12
t echni ques we' l l use. As Mr . Bel l descr i bed, we' ve
13
got a gr eat r ai n gar den f or r unni ng down t he nor t h-
14
sout h st r eet s, what we bel i eve wi l l be best i n cl ass
15
wi t h r egar d t o envi r onment al desi gn.
16
Anot her sor t of l ar ge component of our
17
pr oj ect and of our communi t y benef i t s and of our
18
speci al mer i t appl i cat i on t hat we haven' t t al ked
19
about i n det ai l , as par t of t hi s pr ocess we went
20
t hr ough a ver y det ai l ed conver sat i on, maybe
21
negot i at i on I ' l l say, wi t h t he Advi sor y Nei ghbor hood
22
Commi ssi on t hat i s wher e t he si t e i s l ocat ed.
330
1
And i n summar y, we came up wi t h a communi t y
2
benef i t s package. Because as i mpor t ant as i t was f or
3
us t o i nvest i n McMi l l an, t he communi t i es ar ound t he
4
si t e sai d, " You need t o i nvest ar ound McMi l l an. " And
5
so you can see t he number s on t he scr een her e, but
6
economi c and j ob oppor t uni t i es, we' r e maki ng an
7
i nvest ment . We' r e maki ng an i nvest ment i n al l of
8
t hese ar eas and I ' l l t al k a l i t t l e bi t mor e about
9
each of t hese.
10
So economi c and j ob oppor t uni t i es. A t ot al
11
of $1. 425 mi l l i on goi ng t o wor kf or ce devel opment ,
12
j obs f or t eens and seni or s and busi ness st ar t - ups, as
13
wel l . So t he poi nt her e i s t hat t her e' s a bi g
14
devel opment pr oj ect t hat wi l l be happeni ng i n t hi s
15
communi t y and we want ed t o ensur e t hat peopl e wi t hi n
16
t he communi t y, t he communi t y at l ar ge, woul d have t he
17
oppor t uni t y and t he abi l i t y t hr ough t he use of t hese
18
f unds, wor ki ng wi t h nonpr of i t s, t o act ual l y access
19
t hese j obs.
20
Mr . Weer s t al ked a l i t t l e bi t about t hi s,
21
but her e' s some mor e det ai l wi t h r egar d t o t her e' s a
22
mi l l i on dol l ar s and t hen we can wal k t hr ough some of
331
1
t he ot her s.
2
A schol ar shi p f und of $300, 000. 00. I wi l l
3
t el l you t hat we' ve been i nvol ved i n schol ar shi p
4
f unds i n War d 5. Ther e i s a need f or , you know,
5
br i ght , young chi l dr en who - - we al l know how much i t
6
cost s t o at t end col l ege t hese days - - t o at t end t wo- ,
7
f our - year post hi gh school i nst i t ut i ons. The
8
$300, 000. 00 wi l l be used f or War d 5 st udent s t o
9
at t end col l ege and si mi l ar .
10
We al so want t o be suppor t i ve at t he hi gh
11
school l evel and so agai n, i n di scussi ons wi t h f ol ks
12
who r epr esent t he communi t y at l ar ge, i t was
13
det er mi ned t hat t hese school s r i ght ar ound t he
14
McMi l l an si t e, Dunbar , McKi nl ey and Langl ey, shoul d
15
r ecei ve dol l ar s so f ol ks at a younger age coul d get
16
i nvol ved i n t he f i el ds t hat wi l l one day be
17
r epr esent ed at McMi l l an. And so a ver y t ar get ed
18
appr oach and a t ar get ed i nvest ment t o ensur e t hat
19
f ol ks i n t he sur r oundi ng communi t i es wi l l have access
20
t o al l t hat McMi l l an wi l l be.
21
Facade i mpr ovement gr ant . So agai n, t hi s
22
$150, 000. 00 does not r epr esent anyt hi ng t o do wi t h
332
1
t he McMi l l an si t e. I t hi nk par t of our suggest i on
2
wi t h r egar d t o speci al mer i t i s t hi s pr oj ect wi l l be
3
a r evi t al i zat i on pr oj ect .
4
Thi s pr oj ect i s not downt own, i t i s an ar ea
5
whi ch st i l l has a hi gh unempl oyment r at e and needs
6
r evi t al i zat i on. The f acade i mpr ovement gr ant s ar e
7
f or busi nesses sur r oundi ng t he si t e so t hat t hey,
8
t oo, wi l l have t he economi c oppor t uni t y and dol l ar s
9
needed t o make i mpr ovement s t o t hei r busi ness, so
10
t hat when McMi l l an happens, t hey' l l be par t of t hi s
11
l ar ger r enai ssance i n t he ar ea.
12
And t hen f unds f or si gnage, t r ees and t r ee
13
boxes. Agai n, a di r ect r equest f r omt he
14
counci l member and t he Advi sor y Nei ghbor hood
15
Commi ssi on i s, " I f you' r e goi ng t o do t hi s pr oj ect ,
16
our sur r oundi ng communi t i es need dol l ar s f or
17
beaut i f i cat i on. " And so we' ve come up wi t h an
18
al l ocat i on amongst al l t he ar eas i mmedi at el y
19
sur r oundi ng McMi l l an and t hi s i s t he al l ocat i on of
20
t hose dol l ar s.
21
Ther e was a quest i on r egar di ng pr ogr ammi ng
22
and mai nt enance of t he par k. And so l et me st ar t by
333
1
sayi ng, and I t hi nk we' ve sai d t hi s a number of t i mes
2
publ i cl y, t he par k wi l l be owned by t he Di st r i ct of
3
Col umbi a and be open t o al l Di st r i ct r esi dent s.
4
So I ' l l st ar t t her e. The devel opment t eam
5
i s not pur chasi ng t hat l and. We ar e, however ,
6
because of our exper t i se, char ged wi t h desi gni ng i t
7
and comi ng up wi t h a l ong- t er mi mpl ement at i on
8
pr ogr am.
9
And so as par t of our PUD, we have pr oposed
10
$750, 000. 00 t o cr eat e var i ous pr ogr ammi ng f or t he
11
par k and t he hi st or i c r esour ces, var i ous busi ness
12
i ncubat or s, mai nt enance. And t hi s i s, f r ankl y, j ust
13
seed dol l ar s. I t i s our char ge, l onger t er m, t o put
14
t oget her , as Ms. Ei g t est i f i ed, a BI D, a busi ness
15
i mpr ovement di st r i ct , t hat wi l l r un f or t he ci t y not
16
j ust t he par k, but t he communi t y cent er and t he
17
hi st or i c cour t s and t he act i vi t y t hat goes on t her e.
18
I t was ver y i mpor t ant t o t he ci t y t hat we had a good
19
pl an on t he t abl e, but t hat t hey woul d r et ai n
20
owner shi p t o ensur e t hat t he par k woul d be publ i c i n
21
per pet ui t y, as i t i s pr oposed t oday.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Wi l l t he ci t y own t he
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1
communi t y cent er ?
2
THE WI TNESS: The ci t y wi l l l i kel y own t he
3
communi t y cent er . And I say l i kel y because what we
4
coul d do her e, what t he ci t y coul d ul t i mat el y do, i s
5
say, "Ther e' s a BI D f or med and we t r ansf er al l t hi s
6
pr oper t y t o t he BI D, wi t h t he covenant t hat says you
7
can' t do anyt hi ng but what i s appr oved by t he PUD. "
8
Ther e' s a number of appr oaches. Publ i c use i s our
9
poi nt , t hough, al ways be publ i c use.
10
So t hat concl udes my t est i mony. I ' l l j ust
11
cl ose by sayi ng t hat i t i s not one of t hese publ i c
12
benef i t s t hat ear ns us, i n my vi ew, speci al mer i t ;
13
i t ' s t he combi nat i on of al l of t hemt hat addr esses a
14
pl et hor a of needs, desi r es and benef i t s t hat t he
15
communi t y has r equest ed and we l ook f or war d t o bei ng
16
abl e t o del i ver on t hose pr omi ses. Thank you.
17
18
MS. BROWN: I have a coupl e of qui ck
19
f ol l ow- up quest i ons.
20
THE WI TNESS: Sur e.
21
BY MS. BROWN:
22
Q You began your testimony talking about the
335
1
affordable dwelling unit covenants and the PUD
2
covenants and how the Zoning Commission will hold
3
your feet to the fire to make sure that you get
4
there.
5
I just want to make sure that we get the
6
record straight.
7
A Of cour se.
8
Q The Zoning Commission will put conditions
9
into the PUD order requiring you to meet the
10
affordable housing requirements, correct?
11
A Cor r ect .
12
Q And from there, you record a PUD covenant
13
on the property, which makes those conditions in
14
force, correct?
15
A Cor r ect .
16
Q And you will have a separate covenant with
17
the Department of Housing and Community Development
18
on the affordable dwelling units.
19
20
MS. BROWN: Okay, t hank you, t hat ' s al l I
21
have.
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you. Ms. Fer st er .
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1
MS. FERSTER: A coupl e of qui ck quest i ons.
2
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
3
BY MS. FERSTER:
4
Q So you're basically relying on the Zoning
5
Commission covenants, then, to provide the
6
enforceability in terms of your commitment for
7
affordable housing and that sort of thing?
8
A No, one, Zoni ng Commi ssi on, t wo, t he
9
Depar t ment of Housi ng and Communi t y Devel opment , and
10
my sense, and t hi s i s what Mr . Lynch says as wel l ,
11
t her e' s al so a l and di sposi t i on pr ocess t hat we ar e,
12
f r ankl y, j ust st ar t i ng t o go t hr ough. Our sense i s
13
t hat t hat , t oo - -
14
I mean t he Di st r i ct i s goi ng t o be sel l i ng
15
us par cel s. Of cour se, t hey ar e goi ng t o have
16
covenant s t hat I i magi ne woul d be t he same covenant s
17
as t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on and DHCD, because we don' t
18
want sor t of di f f er i ng af f or dabi l i t y l evel s. I
19
i magi ne we' r e goi ng t o have sor t of one set of pol i cy
20
goal s enshr i ned i n a number of di f f er ent pl aces.
21
Q So your position is that the Mayor's Agent
22
should rely on the fact that these other entities are
337
1
going to include these covenants, even though these
2
covenants have not yet been entered into.
3
A The Zoni ng Commi ssi on t ook a vot e and t hei r
4
vot e on t hi s past Monday eveni ng i ncl uded our
5
pr oposal of 20 per cent of t he si t e bei ng af f or dabl e
6
housi ng, as we pr oposed.
7
Q But in terms of the specific covenants that
8
you talked about --
9
A Ri ght .
10
Q -- you know, to ensure that it's in
11
perpetuity and that sort of thing, has the Zoning
12
Commission specifically voted to approve those types
13
of covenants?
14
A I bel i eve t hat t her e' s a pr oposal on t he
15
t abl e i n t er ms of - -
16
Q Not yet.
17
A - - t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
18
Q Not yet.
19
A I t ' s j ust t hat t hey haven' t t aken f i nal
20
act i on.
21
Q That's right.
22
A They' r e awar e. But I want t o say t hi s.
338
1
Ther e ar e gener al l y accept ed nor ms wi t h r egar d t o
2
af f or dabl e dwel l i ng uni t s i n t he Di st r i ct of
3
Col umbi a, t her e' s pol i cy t hat has been - - we bui l d
4
houses l i ke t he J ai r Lynch Devel opment Pr oj ect has.
5
We' r e goi ng t o met t hose same - - i f t hose ar en' t
6
sat i sf act or y, you know, t her e' s not hi ng t hat we can
7
do about t hat , but t he Di st r i ct - -
8
I ' ve been hear i ng a l ot of t he quest i ons
9
and t he bot t oml i ne i s, even wi t h r egar d t o your
10
quest i ons ar ound AMI , t he Di st r i ct det er mi nes t hat
11
bet ween zer o and 80 per cent of AMI i s what i s
12
consi der ed af f or dabl e housi ng.
13
You may not l i ke t hat , I may not l i ke t hat ,
14
but t he mat er i al i t y i n my vi ew i s t hat bet ween zer o
15
and 80 i s consi der ed af f or dabl e housi ng i n t he
16
Di st r i ct of Col umbi a, pur suant t o i ncl usi onar y zoni ng
17
and DHCD. And we' r e meet i ng t hose r equi r ement s
18
t hr ough a number of ways wi t h t he appr opr i at e bodi es
19
who we ar e supposed t o have agr eement s wi t h.
20
Q But just in terms of the specifics --
21
A Yes.
22
Q -- of the affordability, your position,
339
1
then, is that the Mayor's Agent should essentially
2
rely on the fact that the government agencies are
3
going to include the specifics that will ensure that
4
this affordable housing is available to, you know,
5
the required number of tenants who meet the
6
particular income eligibility, that it's
7
enforceable --
8
A Ri ght .
9
Q -- they'll be monitoring. All that stuff
10
is going to be done in the future and the Mayor's
11
Agent should rely on that.
12
A Wel l , l et me say t hi s - -
13
Q In fact, everybody else is --
14
A That ' s a good quest i on, so l et me say i t
15
t hi s way. I ' l l consul t wi t h our at t or ney. Ther e i s
16
no i ssue wi t h us meet i ng our af f or dabl e housi ng
17
r equi r ement s, so you know, we' l l - - I don' t have t he
18
answer because I act ual l y don' t know exact l y what i s
19
r equi r ed by t he Mayor ' s Agent pr ocess. Because t her e
20
ar e so many ent i t l ement s i n t hi s pr oj ect t hat , you
21
know, I t hought t hemcover ed el sewher e.
22
But I ' l l say i t ver y si mpl y. I f i t i s par t
340
1
of pr ocess t hat we make t he same commi t ment t o t he
2
Mayor ' s Agent t hat we have made t o ever y ot her
3
ent i t l ement body, of cour se we' l l do t hat .
4
I want t o be ver y cl ear t hat t her e' s
5
not hi ng t o hi de her e. As I sai d, al l of t he
6
devel oper s on t hi s t eamhave devel oped si gni f i cant
7
mi xed i ncome housi ng i n t he Di st r i ct and we' r e goi ng
8
t o do so her e. So what ever t he r equi r ement s of t he
9
Mayor ' s Agent ' s pr ocess ar e, we' r e happy t o do t hose.
10
Q Thank you, I appreciate that. Okay, so you
11
had mentioned that DDOT had approved the package of
12
transportation improvements that are on the site.
13
A Yes.
14
Q But isn't it correct that DDOT, in the
15
context of approving this, has also said that
16
significant transit capacity improvements are needed
17
to accommodate the expected increase in travel
18
demands, including 1,100 new bus seats of capacity,
19
and that DDOT has made no commitment whatsoever to
20
fund Circulator or streetcar?
21
A I t ' s a good quest i on. So as we submi t t ed
22
t o t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on - - and I t hi nk one of t he
341
1
r easons, f r ankl y, t hat t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on di d t ake
2
t hat vot e i n our f avor i s DDOT sai d, " Look, t hi s
3
pr oj ect i s a number of year s away. We can' t commi t
4
t o i t bei ng Ci r cul at or ver sus st r eet car ver sus
5
expansi on of t he WMATA bus l i nes, whi ch ar e al so
6
goi ng t o t he si t e t oday. We don' t know yet , i t ' s t oo
7
ear l y. " They di d commi t , i f you' l l not e i n t hei r
8
r epor t , t o enhanci ng publ i c t r ansi t ser vi ce at t he
9
si t e now.
10
Now, what we sai d i s, " Look, we can' t r el y
11
on t hat , and t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on was sayi ng, " We
12
l i ke t hi s pr oj ect gener al l y, but we ar e concer ned
13
about t r af f i c, " and f r ankl y, we ar e concer ned about
14
t r af f i c, ver y sel f - i nt er est edl y. We don' t want you
15
or Mr . Nor man si t t i ng i n t r af f i c, you know, comi ng t o
16
t he gr ocer y st or e at t he si t e.
17
So what we sai d was, We wi l l f und,
18
r egar dl ess of cost , t he amount of shut t l e seat s, t he
19
1, 100 or what ever i t ul t i mat el y i s. We wi l l f und
20
pr i vat e ser vi ces t o f ul f i l l t hat demand i f DDOT does
21
not f i l l i t .
22
I f you want my opi ni on, my opi ni on i s DDOT
342
1
wi l l f i l l much of i t , but not al l of i t , and we wi l l
2
have pr i vat e shut t l es, as wel l .
3
But i n or der f or t he pr oj ect t o move
4
f or war d, we sai d we wi l l f und al l of t he expansi on of
5
what I ' l l cal l a pr i vat e shut t l e t hat i s necessar y t o
6
f ul f i l l al l t he t r i ps t hat our pr oj ect i s causi ng.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Shut t l e t o t he Br ookl and
8
Met r o?
9
THE WI TNESS: What we' r e t hi nki ng i s
10
Br ookl and and Col umbi a Hei ght s, sor t of a pr i vat e
11
Ci r cul at or , i f you wi l l , yeah.
12
MS. FERSTER: That ' s al l I have.
13
MS. MERRI TT: I have a coupl e of f ol l ow- up
14
quest i ons.
15
BY MS. MERRI TT:
16
Q You testified about the community center
17
and the park.
18
A I di d.
19
Q And you said that EYA's responsibility is
20
to design the park and to implement the programming.
21
What about constructing the park?
22
A Agai n, l et me back up. When I say " our , "
343
1
when I say "our , " I mean Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s.
2
Q Okay.
3
A So Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s i s t he t hr ee
4
gr oups, EYA, J ai r Lynch, Tr ammel Cr ow. Anne Cor bet t
5
i s our pr oj ect di r ect or . And so as par t of t he
6
pr ocess t hat we ar e cur r ent l y goi ng t hr ough, i t
7
obvi ousl y i s and was and wi l l cont i nue t o be our
8
r esponsi bi l i t y t o desi gn t he par k, as we have
9
desi gned t o dat e t hat you see.
10
Q EYA.
11
A No, no, speaki ng of Vi si on McMi l l an
12
Par t ner s. EYA' s i nvol vement i n t he si t e i s t hr ough
13
Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s, whi ch i s a devel opment
14
par t ner shi p, r i ght ? So i n our capaci t y as Vi si on
15
McMi l l an Par t ner s, one of our t asks i s t o desi gn t he
16
par k.
17
To answer your quest i on, we ar e st i l l
18
wor ki ng wi t h t he ci t y t o det er mi ne who wi l l act ual l y
19
bui l d t he par k. I t ' s t he ci t y' s r esponsi bi l i t y t o
20
ul t i mat el y bui l d t he i nf r ast r uct ur e and par k and
21
communi t y cent er . And we' r e wor ki ng wi t h t hem
22
because we have t he exper t i se t o bui l d t he par k and
344
1
t he i nf r ast r uct ur e and t he communi t y cent er i n t er ms
2
of t he agr eement of how best t o do t hat .
3
Q So at this point it's uncertain about the
4
degree to which the city will do that or --
5
A No, i t ' s not uncer t ai n. I t ' s t he ci t y' s
6
r esponsi bi l i t y t o bui l d t he i nf r ast r uct ur e f or t he
7
si t e and t he par k and t he communi t y cent er , r i ght ?
8
The ci t y has commi t t ed dol l ar s i n i t s budget t o do
9
exact l y t hat . I t ' s j ust a quest i on of wor ki ng
10
t hr ough t he f i ner det ai l s of t he i mpl ement at i on of
11
t he bui l d- out .
12
What I i magi ne wi l l happen i s t hey' l l say,
13
you know, go t al k t o t hr ee or f our of t he f i r ms t hat
14
do t hi s t ype of const r uct i on on a r egul ar basi s, get
15
bi ds f r omt hemand t he Di st r i ct , i n consul t wi t h us,
16
wi l l act ual l y sel ect a f i r mt hat has exper t i se i n t he
17
const r uct i on of par ks, communi t y cent er s, t he r oads
18
and so on.
19
Q What's your understanding of the amount of
20
money that the District has set aside in its budget
21
for that work as you referred to?
22
A I know t hat t he Di st r i ct has $50 mi l l i on i n
345
1
i t s budget f or capi t al i nvest ment i n McMi l l an.
2
Q And it's your understanding that's for the
3
park, the community center, the roads, et cetera --
4
A Cor r ect .
5
Q -- and construction.
6
A Cor r ect .
7
Q One other question. You mentioned that you
8
negotiated with one of the ANCs and you outlined some
9
mitigation measures. Which of the ANCs were you
10
referring to?
11
A We negot i at ed wi t h I bel i eve t he 5E, t he
12
ANC t hat - - wel l , t hi s i s an i mpor t ant poi nt her e.
13
We negot i at ed wi t h t he ANC wher e t he si t e i s l ocat ed
14
and so I bel i eve t hat ' s ANC 5E. So we met wi t h ANC
15
5E, Ms. Cor bet t di d, I di d and Mr . Lynch di d, over a
16
sever al mont h pr ocess.
17
And t hei r char ge t o us was, " Thi s i s a good
18
pr oj ect , but we want t o see mor e communi t y benef i t s
19
out si de t he wal l s of t hi s pr oj ect , " so t hat ' s how we
20
came up wi t h t hat agr eement .
21
Q One of the earlier witnesses mentioned that
22
there were three ANCs involved in this jurisdiction.
346
1
A Ms. Cor bet t di d, so t her e ar e t wo adj acent
2
ANCs. But i n t he way devel opment pr oj ect s t ypi cal l y
3
wor k, we wor k wi t h t he ANC t hat i s, quot e, unquot e,
4
"most ef f ect i ve" and t he ANC t hat i s most ef f ect i ve
5
i s t he one i n whi ch t he pr oper t y act ual l y si t s.
6
Q And did you negotiate with the MAG, the
7
McMillan Advisory Group, did you reach out to them?
8
A I mean wi t h t hemand agai n, I ' mnot par t y
9
t o al l of t he det ai l s. But we met wi t h t hem, you
10
know, I woul d cer t ai nl y say t ens of t i mes t hr oughout
11
t he cour se of t he year , we t ook t hei r i nput , and we
12
pr ovi ded a benef i t s package t hat we t hought met t he
13
needs of t he communi t y.
14
Ul t i mat el y, t he way t he pr ocess wor ks i n
15
t he Di st r i ct i s you do wor k on t hose t ypes of t hi ngs
16
wi t h t he af f ect ed ANC.
17
Q You mentioned at the beginning of your
18
testimony that there was an extraordinarily
19
competitive process and that five different
20
development teams were put through the wringer.
21
A I di d.
22
Q Was that in response to the 2006
347
1
solicitation --
2
A I t was.
3
Q -- by NCRC?
4
A That was.
5
Q And do you know who the other five teams
6
were?
7
A I knew you' d ask t hat ask, I ' mst ar t i ng t o
8
t hi nk about i t . Ther e' s a f i r mcal l ed Ket t l er , whi ch
9
has a gr eat r eput at i on her e l ocal l y and nat i onal l y,
10
t hat was one of t he t eams. Ther e' s a t eamI deal t
11
wi t h named East Banc and I t hi nk t hey act ual l y t eamed
12
up wi t h a nat i onal f i r m, so t hat ' s t wo. I j ust don' t
13
r ecal l t he names of t he ot her t wo. I ' msur e I coul d
14
f i nd t hat i n t he r ecor ds, i t was a ver y publ i c
15
pr ocess.
16
Q There are significant differences -- I
17
don't have a copy in my hand, but there are
18
significant differences between some of the
19
parameters spelled out in the 2006 solicitation and
20
in the current plan. I wonder if you could address
21
those differences.
22
A I can' t , I don' t bel i eve. I mean we' ve
348
1
wor ked on t he pr oj ect wi t h t he Di st r i ct , who i ssued
2
t he sol i ci t at i on.
3
Q Do you know what any of the other five
4
teams proposed in terms of their concepts?
5
A I can t el l you, when I sai d " put us t hr ough
6
t he wr i nger , " I was havi ng memor i es of t hi s pr ocess.
7
We wer e i n t he basement of a chur ch r i ght of f of
8
Nor t h Capi t ol and al l I can say, t hat t her e wer e a
9
number of communi t y meet i ngs, dur i ng whi ch t eams
10
pr oposed bot h t hei r qual i f i cat i ons and ver y br oad
11
concept s.
12
And agai n, I t hi nk what ' s i mpor t ant her e i s
13
I t hi nk we wer e sel ect ed f or t hi s pr oj ect not because
14
we had t he r i ght pl an; i t ' s because we had t he
15
wher ewi t hal , t he capaci t y, t he bandwi dt h t o br i ng on
16
f ol ks l i ke Emi l y Ei g and Mat t Bel l and Anne Cor bet t
17
and Hol l and and Kni ght and ot her s t o put t oget her ,
18
t hr ough a ver y communi t y or i ent ed pr ocess over many
19
year s, t he r i ght pl an. I mean t hat ' s what we wer e
20
sel ect ed t o do, not t o say, " Thi s i s t he pl an, "
21
per i od, t he end, but sol i ci t t he f ol ks who ar e t he
22
exper t s.
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1
That ' s t he devel oper ' s r ol e, t o be t he
2
conduct or and pul l t oget her somet hi ng t hat at t he end
3
of t he day, we t hi nk, you know, i s t he r i ght sol ut i on
4
f or us. That ' s what we do ever y day.
5
6
quest i ons. Thank you.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: Do you have anyt hi ng f ur t her ?
8
MS. BROWN: No, I don' t .
9
10
much.
11
12
MS. BROWN: We do have one f i nal wi t ness
13
and I hope t o be out of her e qui ckl y, Mr . Li ndsl ey
14
Wi l l i ams, and I ' mpr oposi ng hi mas an exper t i n
15
pl anni ng and zoni ng. I have hi s r esum her e.
16
17
Wher eupon,
18
LI NDSLEY WI LLI AMS
19
20
f ol l ows:
21
22
BY MS. BROWN:
350
1
Q If you could introduce yourself, Mr.
2
Williams.
3
A Good af t er noon. For t he r ecor d, my name i s
4
Li ndsl ey Wi l l i ams. I have been act i ve i n pl anni ng
5
and zoni ng mat t er s f or qui t e a whi l e her e i n t he
6
Di st r i ct of Col umbi a.
7
My hi st or y her e goes back t o when I moved
8
i n 1966 t o t he ar ea, i n 1970 t o t he ar ea. Shor t l y
9
af t er t hat , I had a r ol e i n t he l ocal communi t y,
10
somet hi ng l i ke what Anne Sel l i n di d l at er on wi t h
11
t hi s par t i cul ar si t e. But I was r esponsi bl e f or
12
nomi nat i ng t he War dman Tower compl ex i nt o t he J oi nt
13
Commi t t ee on Landmar ks at t he t i me.
14
So I have some hi st or y wi t h hi st or i c
15
pr eser vat i on and I r ever e i t , but I ' ve al so t aken on
16
ot her r ol es t hat ar e consi st ent wi t h my t r ai ni ng as
17
an ur ban pl anner and t hat ' s what I ' l l t al k about
18
t oday.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: One moment . So any obj ect i on
20
t o hi s qual i f yi ng?
21
22
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, Mr . Wi l l i ams, you' r e
351
1
qual i f i ed as a exper t wi t ness.
2
THE WI TNESS: The assi gnment I have t oday
3
i s essent i al l y t o show you, Mr . Hear i ng Exami ner , how
4
t he par t i cul ar appl i cat i on i s sat i sf yi ng of t he
5
r equi r ement s r el at i ng par t i cul ar l y t o t he
6
Compr ehensi ve Pl an.
7
The way I went about t hat i s t o show you
8
what t he pr ovi si ons ar e t hat expl i ci t l y r el at e t o t he
9
Comp. Pl an i n t he many vol umes t hat ar e t her e and t o
10
say how I see t he pl ans st acki ng up agai nst i t .
11
So f or exampl e, t he pl an says, at MC- 2. 6 i n
12
one of t he subsect i ons, 2016. 1, i t ' s f or communi t y
13
devel opment pur poses. Thi s was what was st at ed at
14
t he t i me i n 1987 and t he McMi l l an Pl an pr ovi des
15
pr eci sel y t hat .
16
The McMi l l an si t e, as not ed i n t he next
17
sect i on, has had a l ot of communi t y f or ums. We' ve
18
hear d about t hat mor e t han per haps some of us want ed
19
t o r emi nded of t oday. But i t ' s gone on and on and on
20
and now we have t he pl an r ef l ect i ng t he ext ended
21
ef f or t s of t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a t o r eal i ze
22
communi t y devel opment and t he hur dl es i t ' s f aced
352
1
si nce t he t r ansf er of owner shi p i n 1987.
2
Not e, i n par t i cul ar , t he f act t hat t he use
3
i n 1980 was ut i l i t y and t hat ' s what t he Compr ehensi ve
4
Pl an even i n ' 89, ' 82 r ef l ect ed - - excuse me, i t was
5
r ef l ect ed l at er i n one of t he ear l y pl ans t hat I ' l l
6
show you.
7
On open space, t he pl an says t hat i t shoul d
8
be dedi cat ed, a subst ant i al por t i on, a cont i guous
9
por t i on of t he si t e, f or r ecr eat i on and open space.
10
We' ve had di f f er ent ki nds of number s showi ng how i t
11
went f r omdi f f er ent st ages, f r omsi x acr es t o ni ne
12
acr es, up t o as much as 12 acr es. Thi s pl an has over
13
hal f of t hat i n t he sout h par k ar ea al one and i t
14
sat i sf i es t hat cr i t er i a.
15
Under hi st or i c pr eser vat i on of t he McMi l l an
16
Reser voi r , t he pl an says - - and t hi s i s r eal l y
17
i mpor t ant , I ' d l i ke you t o f ocus on t hese wor ds. I t
18
says t wo t hi ngs. I t says somet hi ng about what we
19
shoul d do about t he above gr ound el ement s and what we
20
shoul d do about t he bel ow gr ade el ement s.
21
For t he above gr ade el ement s, i t says,
22
" Rest or e key above gr ade el ement s. " Ther e ar e a l ot
353
1
of sur vi vi ng t ower s, t her e ar e t he pumps t her e, t he
2
met er st at i ons. Ther e ar e ot her f eat ur es of t he
3
bui l t envi r onment whi ch ar e vi si bl e on t he ext er i or .
4
And I t hi nk you' ve hear d any number of
5
r ef er ences, f r omEmi l y t o t he ar chi t ect , showi ng how
6
each of t hemi s bei ng gi ven ver y car ef ul at t ent i on,
7
t r yi ng t o bui l d somet hi ng t hat wi l l be of l ong- t er m
8
val ue, not j ust t o t he si t e, but t he over al l ci t y.
9
And most i mpor t ant i n t er ms of t he
10
cont r over si es her e, t o my way of r eadi ng, i s what i t
11
says about what goes on bel ow gr ade i s, " Expl or e t he
12
adapt i ve r euse of some . . . , " some, ver y di f f er ent
13
wor ds t han what i t says above gr ade.
14
And t hat ' s exact l y what t he pr oj ect does.
15
I t t r i es t o say what i s t her e t hat we can wor k wi t h
16
and br i ng t o t he communi t y i n some f ashi on. Whet her
17
i t ' s goi ng t o be occupi ed or not i s not yet
18
det er mi ned, we know t hat . But i t i s expl or ed, i t ' s
19
been eval uat ed and pushed as har d as i t can be and we
20
have as much cer t ai nt y now about t hat as i s possi bl e
21
at t hi s st age i n t he pr ocess.
22
As t o t he i nvest ment i n t he r euse pl anni ng
354
1
and t al ki ng wi t h t he communi t y, Ms. Cor bet t and
2
ot her s have t al ked about 160 meet i ngs on her par t and
3
ot her wi t nesses have sai d over 200 i nst ances of
4
col l abor at i on wi t h t he ANCs, wi t h t he McMi l l an
5
Commi t t ee and wi t h ot her s. That sat i sf i es t hat
6
condi t i on.
7
The scal e of t he use i s t he next subj ect .
8
When devel opment t akes pl ace, i t shoul d consi st of
9
moder at e t o medi umdensi t y housi ng, r et ai l and ot her
10
compat i bl e uses. That i s what we' l l be t ur ni ng t o,
11
wi t h pi ct ur es i n j ust a f ew pages.
12
Ther e ar e a f ew ot her pl aces wher e McMi l l an
13
i s ment i oned. I t ' s ment i oned i n par t i n t he Rock
14
Cr eek East El ement . I t ' s not a r equi r ement t hat says
15
what t he si t e has t o do, but i t ' s acknowl edged and I
16
woul d asser t t hat i t i s behavi ng sympat het i cal l y t o
17
t he obj ect i ves t hat ar e st at ed i n t he adj acent
18
el ement by l and ar ea.
19
Okay, l et ' s t ur n t o t he pi ct ur es. The
20
f i r st pi ct ur e whi ch you' ve seen bef or e i n t he bookl et
21
i s what i t i s t hat shoul d be t aki ng pl ace, medi um
22
densi t y r esi dent i al , medi umdensi t y commer ci al and
355
1
par ks and r ecr eat i on and open space.
2
The si t e i s col or ed wi t h t hr ee bands of
3
col or . I t ' s got a gr een r i ng, t he gr een t hat r uns
4
t hr ough i t , and i t has t he t wo ot her col or s whi ch
5
r epr esent t he medi umdensi t y r esi dent i al and medi um
6
densi t y commer ci al t hat ar e cal l ed f or squar el y
7
i nsi de t he pl an.
8
The next pi ct ur e i s t he Compr ehensi ve
9
Pl an s adopt ed, gener al i zed pol i cy map. I t
10
essent i al l y says t hi s i s supposed t o be an ar ea wher e
11
t hi ngs change and, boy, woul d t hey change. I t goes
12
f r omt hi s ut i l i t y use t o t he t ype of uses t hat have
13
been el abor at ed on her e i n some det ai l .
14
The next pi ct ur e shows you how - - i t ' s a
15
sl i de you' ve seen bef or e, but i t says t he same t hi ngs
16
t hat we' ve j ust been t al ki ng about , r esi dent i al ,
17
of f i ce and communi t y cent er . The communi t y cent er
18
doesn' t show up ver y wel l i n t hi s par t i cul ar sl i de,
19
but you' l l r emember i t f r ombef or e.
20
I n t he hi st or y of t hi s, we go back - - i n
21
1980, NCPC f i r st publ i shed as an assi st ance t o t he
22
Of f i ce of Pl anni ng what ar e t he l and uses i n t he
356
1
ar ea. And i n 1980, t he NCPC cl assi f i cat i on of t hi s
2
si t e was as a l ocal publ i c f aci l i t y. Wel l , i t was,
3
i t was cl ean wat er .
4
I n 1985, what i s somet i mes cal l ed t he bl ob
5
map, t he gener al i zed l and use pl an, whi ch was done
6
al most i n wat er col or s, i t di d col or i t gr een. But I
7
want t o emphasi ze t hat whi l e i t was col or ed i n gr een,
8
gr een was t he col or of al l ki nds of open space.
9
Cemet er i es ar e open space, ai r por t s ar e open space.
10
And t hi s was a t r act of l and t hat was open.
11
I t was st i l l bei ng used f or ut i l i t ar i an pur poses i n
12
' 85, but at t hat poi nt , i t wasn' t yet any par t of t he
13
di scussi on about f or sal e.
14
By 1992, when t he pl an t hat was st ar t ed i n
15
1989 was publ i shed, i t had moved t o somet hi ng l i ke
16
what we see r i ght now, a combi nat i on of commer ci al
17
and r esi dent i al , al ong wi t h par kl and, and t hat ' s what
18
br i ngs us t o t he pl an t hat I showed you on t he f i r st
19
pi ct ur e of t he t hr ee uses.
20
The next f ew pages t hat I have essent i al l y
21
go t hr ough consi st ency wi t h t he gener al gui di ng
22
pr i nci pl es of t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an. The l and use
357
1
el ement , whi ch i s sor t of a pr emi er el ement among t he
2
many el ement s of t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an - - I ' mnot
3
goi ng t o t r y t o r ead al l t hat i n t he i nt er est of
4
t i me.
5
I woul d asser t t hat t her e i s sweepi ng
6
consi st ency wi t h t he pr ovi si ons of t he Compr ehensi ve
7
Pl an, al l of t he ones t hat ar e ver y speci f i c, al l of
8
t he ones t hat ar e i n t he l and use pl an, and a ser i es
9
of ot her s, i ncl udi ng t he housi ng el ement , t he
10
envi r onment al pr ot ect i on el ement , t he economi c
11
devel opment r equi r ement s.
12
Whi ch br i ngs me t o t he end of t he
13
pr esent at i on wher e I essent i al l y say - - and t hi s i s a
14
wor d t hat I was goi ng t o use at t he begi nni ng, as
15
wel l . I t ' s a f our - l et t er wor d, epi c. Thi s i s a wor d
16
whi ch t r i es t o capt ur e, i n my vi ew, t he cul mi nat i on,
17
t he absol ut e summat i on of what you' r e get t i ng i n t hi s
18
pr oj ect , whi ch i s somet hi ng t hat i s, t o my way of
19
t hi nki ng, somet hi ng t hat goes way beyond what I ' ve
20
seen el sewher e i n t he ci t y.
21
Now as a smal l asi de, you asked ear l i er i n
22
t he day whet her t her e ar e any of t hese cases t hat
358
1
i nvol ve st r uct ur es and t he answer i s t her e' s at l east
2
one. I sat i n a r ooml i ke t hi s and i t was a case i n
3
t he Sout hwest wi t h cur ved canopi es over par ki ng
4
gar ages f or t he - - I t hi nk i t was Capi t ol Ri ver f r ont .
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Oh, yes. That ' s par t of t he
6
l andscape, yes.
7
THE WI TNESS: So t hat ' s my answer and I
8
don' t know t hat i t adds t o my exper t i se, but i t does
9
show you t hat I haven' t got t en compl et el y seni l e.
10
So wi t h t hat , I woul d wr ap up and hope t hat
11
we coul d get out of her e bef or e t he CSX f r ei ght t r ai n
12
comes t hr ough at 5: 00 p. m. Thank you.
13
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you ver y much, Mr .
14
Wi l l i ams.
15
MS. FERSTER: No quest i ons.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, any quest i ons?
17
MS. FERSTER: J ust one qui ck one.
18
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
19
BY MS. FERSTER:
20
Q You mentioned that the land use element is
21
the premier element in terms of your review of the
22
consistency with the Comp. Plan. So you would say
359
1
that the land use element will control over the more
2
general policies if there is a conflict?
3
A I don' t know i f I woul d say t hat i t woul d
4
cont r ol . Ther e i s not hi ng absol ut e t hat I know about
5
anywher e i n t he Comp. Pl an t hat says, not wi t hst andi ng
6
any ot her pr ovi si on, t hi s t r umps what ever .
7
I woul d say t hat wher e you have speci f i c
8
di r ect i ves per t ai ni ng t o a si t e, as we have her e f or
9
McMi l l an, you' ve got t o pay at t ent i on t o t hat . We
10
di d pay at t ent i on t o i t , we sat i sf i ed t hat .
11
You t hen t ur n t o t he l and use el ement and
12
t o my way of t hi nki ng, as t he pl an i t sel f says, i t
13
has a speci al st at us. And so I agr ee wi t h t hat
14
st at us. I ' mher e as an exper t . That ' s what i t says,
15
i t i s i mpor t ant . But I ' mnot t r yi ng t o say t hat
16
educat i on, housi ng or any of t he ot her t hi ngs ar e t o
17
be di smi ssed as t r i vi al .
18
But i f t her e' s a conf l i ct , I woul d sor t of
19
speak - - I woul d t r y t o def er and f i nd a r at i onal e
20
t hat sat i sf i es l and use bef or e I woul d go st r uggl i ng
21
t o f i nd somet hi ng i n one of t he ot her el ement s.
22
That ' s a vague answer , but t hat ' s t he way I
360
1
see i t .
2
Q That's helpful, thank you. In terms of
3
hierarchy, then, you're saying that the hierarchy
4
would be first would be the specific area elements
5
that relate to the site, second would be the land use
6
and third would be general policies?
7
A I woul d say t hat t her e ar e some over ar chi ng
8
pr i nci pl es whi ch ar e descr i bed i n my mat er i al s as
9
wel l . And so t hat and l and use t oget her ar e f ai r l y
10
i mpor t ant and t hen I woul d say t he ot her el ement s.
11
But agai n, I ' mnot t r yi ng t o say t hat
12
housi ng i s somehow not an i mpor t ant t hi ng or t hat
13
economi c devel opment i s not i mpor t ant . They' r e al l
14
i mpor t ant . That ' s why we have a comp. pl an and i t ' s
15
why we have a Zoni ng Commi ssi on and ot her gr oups t hat
16
t r y t o bal ance t hese t hi ngs out , t o make sur e t hat
17
even t hough you can' t be somet hi ng f or ever ybody,
18
t hat you ar e not i nconsi st ent wi t h i t .
19
The zoni ng or der was appr oved, t he deci si on
20
was appr oved, knowi ng t hat i t woul d be not
21
i nconsi st ent wi t h t he Compr ehensi ve Pl an, Di st r i ct
22
el ement s and f eder al el ement s. And t hat ' s t he
361
1
pr ocess her e whi ch we l i ve wi t h and enj oy or suf f er .
2
Q Okay, so just to bring it to a very
3
concrete level then, if, hypothetically, you have a
4
specific policy relating to the McMillan site or any
5
particular historic site that specifies what the
6
level of development or use would be on that site,
7
and then you have a general policy saying historic
8
preservation that says that, you know, we should
9
preserve and protect the District of Columbia's
10
historic resources, obviously, there might be a
11
conflict, right?
12
A Yeah, a t ensi on.
13
Q Right. In terms of what would control, if
14
there's something more specific, would that control
15
or is it more general?
16
A I don' t t hi nk I can answer t hat quest i on.
17
I t hi nk i t ' s a bal anci ng t est t hat you have t o l ook
18
at t he f act s of each case. And I ' mnot goi ng t o set
19
up mysel f as a subst i t ut e f or t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
20
I wi l l say t hat t hey ar e char ged wi t h
21
l ooki ng at t he ar r ay of el ement s t hat ar e out t her e
22
and I bel i eve t hat f ol ks her e woul d be knowl edgeabl e
362
1
about how t o br i ng t hose ar r ays i nt o f ocus i n f r ont
2
of t he eyes of t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
3
Q Okay. But as an expert -- you are an
4
expert --
5
A Yes, Ma' am.
6
Q So if I would ask you to render,
7
hypothetically, an opinion on the consistency or
8
inconsistency with the Comp. Plan, where you had to
9
look at two factors that were potentially relevant,
10
one was a specific land use policy, an area element
11
that specified that a certain site would be available
12
for mixed use development and a general policy that
13
-- in Ward 1, say -- and a general policy that says
14
in Ward 1, we want to preserve our architectural and
15
historic heritage, which policy is in control? And
16
that's going to be my last question.
17
A Okay, i f i t wer e t o a speci f i c si t e i n War d
18
1 and i t t al ked about why some par t i cul ar l ocat i on
19
was of pr emi er i mpor t ance, I woul d t hat woul d have t o
20
be pai d pr et t y cl ose at t ent i on t o.
21
I f i t ' s j ust sor t of a war d- wi de wi sh or
22
aspi r at i on, I woul d say we' l l do what we can, but
363
1
we' ve got a whol e ser i es of ot her el ement s t hat we
2
have t o l ook at and go f or war d.
3
MS. FERSTER: Thank you, t hat ' s i t .
4
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any quest i ons.
5
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay.
6
MS. FERSTER: I have one pr ocedur al
7
quest i on and t hat i s t her e' s a number of Power Poi nt
8
pr esent at i ons. I don' t know i f t hey' r e par t of t he
9
r ecor d, but i f t hey ar e, can t hey be pr ovi ded and - -
10
MS. BROWN: Yes, we pl an t o do t hat .
11
J UDGE BYRNE: I was goi ng t o ask t hat f or
12
my own pur poses.
13
MS. BROWN: I j ust need t o get t o t he col or
14
copi er .
15
J UDGE BYRNE: That ' s f i ne. So do you have
16
mor e?
17
MS. BROWN: That concl udes our di r ect
18
wi t ness t est i mony.
19
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght , I ' mconsci ous her e
20
of t he t i me and I ' mal so consci ous t hat t hi s l ady i s
21
her e f r omt he ANC and has been si t t i ng her e al l day.
22
And so Ma' am, you' r e her e t o make a st at ement , I ' m
364
1
sur e.
2
THE WI TNESS: Yes, I won' t be l ong.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Why don' t you come up, so
4
t hat you don' t have t o come back on November 3d, come
5
on over her e and - -
6
THE WI TNESS: Thank you ver y much.
7
J UDGE BYRNE: - - l et ' s hear f r omyou. Have
8
a seat i n t hat second chai r i f you don' t mi nd. Di d
9
you si gn t he wi t ness l i st ?
10
THE WI TNESS: Yes, I di d.
11
J UDGE BYRNE: Excel l ent , okay, wonder f ul .
12
So pl ease st at e your name f or t he r ecor d and t hen
13
when you' r e comf or t abl e, pl ease pr oceed wi t h your
14
pr esent at i on.
15
Wher eupon,
16
CELI A DI ANE BARNES
17
18
f ol l ows:
19
20
THE WI TNESS: Okay, my name i s Di ane
21
Bar nes, t he Advi sor y Nei ghbor hood Commi ssi on f or ANC
22
5E- 09 commi ssi oner , i n whi ch t he McMi l l an Sand
365
1
Fi l t r at i on Si t e i s l ocat ed.
2
I l i ve t wo bl ocks f r omt he si t e at 41 Adams
3
St r eet , Nor t hwest . I ama r et i r ed empl oyee f r omt he
4
Ar my Cor ps of Engi neer s and I have been act i vel y
5
i nvol ved wi t h t he McMi l l an i ssues r el at i ng t o t hi s
6
si t e f or at l east 30 year s.
7
I ' ve been ver y act i ve i n t hi s communi t y,
8
ser vi ng i n t he past as t he pr esi dent of t he
9
Bl oomi ngdal e Ci vi c Associ at i on, t he f or mer chai r of
10
t he ANC 5E, and cur r ent l y, I ' mser vi ng as t he chai r
11
of t he McMi l l an Advi sor y Gr oup, whi ch i s cal l ed t he
12
MAG, and r epr esent i ng my si ngl e member di st r i ct ,
13
5E- 09 i n t he ANC.
14
I have obser ved over t he l ast seven year s
15
i n par t i ci pat i on i n t he Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s'
16
ef f or t t o wor k wi t h and f or t he communi t y t o
17
concept ual i ze and devel op pl ans f or t he f or mer
18
McMi l l an Sand Fi l t r at i on Pl ant .
19
Today, I amher e t o t est i f y i n suppor t of
20
t he VMP' s pl an f or t he McMi l l an si t e. I ' maski ng f or
21
you t o appr ove t hi s appl i cat i on f or par t i al
22
demol i t i on of t he under gr ound cel l s and subdi vi si on
366
1
of t he l and i nt o seven bui l di ng par cel s because i t i s
2
necessar y i n t he communi t y' s i nt er est t o const r uct a
3
pr oj ect of speci al mer i t .
4
I t r ul y bel i eve t hi s si t e meet s t he
5
def i ni t i on of speci al mer i t , based on my exper i ence
6
whi l e wor ki ng wi t h t he VMP t eam. I ' ve seen t hemcome
7
back, agai n and agai n, t o addr ess t he ANC concer ns,
8
al l owi ng t he communi t y t o voi ce t hei r opi ni ons and
9
shar i ng what t hey want t o see on t he si t e.
10
Speci f i cal l y as a r epr esent at i ve of t he
11
Bl oomi ngdal e and St r onghol d nei ghbor hoods, t her e have
12
been a f ew i t ems t hat ar e const ant l y ment i oned by my
13
nei ghbor s as ameni t i es t hat t hey f eel t hey ar e
14
l acki ng t hat woul d be ser ved by t he Vi si on McMi l l an
15
Par t ner s.
16
Fr ommy home on Adams St r eet , Nor t hwest , i t
17
i s at l east over a mi l e t o t he cl osest f ul l ser vi ce
18
gr ocer y st or e, somet hi ng t hat woul d be dr ast i cal l y
19
di f f er ent i f t he Vi si on McMi l l an Par t ner s pr oj ect
20
moves f or war d as pl anned.
21
But as we l ear ned t hr ough t he many meet i ngs
22
and di scussi ons wi t h t he devel opment t eam, no gr ocer
367
1
wi l l bui l d a st or e under gr ound. And i t i s not
2
f i nanci al l y f easi bl e t o enf or ce t he under gr ound cel l s
3
t o bui l d somet hi ng of t hat magni t ude above t he
4
exi st i ng cel l s.
5
Anot her ar ea t hat our communi t y i s
6
par t i cul ar l y l acki ng i s t he cent r al communi t y
7
r ecr eat i on cent er , wi t h a 17, 000 squar e f oot pool ,
8
pl us par k space abut t i ng i t . Nei t her of t hese
9
t r emendous benef i t s t o t he communi t y can be
10
const r uct ed on t hi s si t e as i t cur r ent l y st ands
11
t oday, wi t hout t he subdi vi si on and demol i t i on pl an
12
bei ng r equest ed by t he VMP t eam.
13
Fi nal l y, as a l ongt i me homeowner , 40 year s,
14
wi t hi n t hi s communi t y, I want t o be abl e t o see my
15
nei ghbor s and my f ami l y who cur r ent l y l i ve wi t hi n
16
t hi s communi t y get t o st ay, wor k and pl ay wi t hi n t hi s
17
communi t y.
18
Wi t h your appr oval of t he VMP' s appl i cat i on
19
f or t he subdi vi si on and demol i t i on pl ans t oday, due
20
t o speci al mer i t , t hey wi l l be abl e t o of f er
21
af f or dabl e housi ng f or bot h seni or s and f ami l i es
22
above and beyond what i s r equi r ed f or a pr oj ect of
368
1
t hi s magni t ude.
2
Al l of t hese i t ems t hat I have ment i oned
3
t oday ar e si gni f i cant benef i t s t o t he communi t y t hat
4
cannot be i gnor ed. I n t he l ong t er m, t hese ar e
5
benef i t s t hat woul d hel p ever yone wi t hi n t he
6
communi t y i mmedi at el y sur r oundi ng t he si t e and wi t hi n
7
t he 5E- 09 si ngl e member di st r i ct on a dai l y basi s,
8
pl us f or f ami l i es acr oss t he Di st r i ct of Col umbi a,
9
t oo.
10
I ask t hat you not i gnor e t he pot ent i al s
11
f or t he sake of pr eser vi ng unst abl e and unusabl e
12
under gr ound cel l s. I hope t hat you wi l l t ake my
13
t est i mony i nt o consi der at i on when maki ng your
14
deci si on t oday. Thanks agai n f or al l owi ng me t o
15
t est i f y.
16
J UDGE BYRNE: Thank you ver y much. May I
17
ask you, di d ANC 5E t ake a f or mal vot e on t hi s?
18
THE WI TNESS: Yes, we di d, i t was si x t o
19
t wo.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: Si x t o t wo i n f avor of t he
21
pr oposal .
22
THE WI TNESS: I n f avor of t he pr oposal .
369
1
J UDGE BYRNE: Okay, t hank you ver y much.
2
THE WI TNESS: You' r e wel come.
3
J UDGE BYRNE: Any quest i ons?
4
MS. BROWN: No quest i ons f or me.
5
MS. FERSTER: Yes, I have a coupl e of
6
quest i ons.
7
CROSS EXAMI NATI ON
8
BY MS. FERSTER:
9
Q So when the ANC took its full vote, were
10
they specifically directing their resolution to the
11
Mayor's Agent for Historic Preservation?
12
A They di d i t f or bot h t he Mayor ' s Agent and
13
t he Zoni ng Commi ssi on.
14
Q And do you have a copy of that resolution?
15
A Not wi t h me, but i t ' s publ i c knowl edge, so
16
i t ' s out t her e on t he si t e. But I can send i t t o
17
you.
18
J UDGE BYRNE: I don' t have i t .
19
THE WI TNESS: I can send i t t o you.
20
J UDGE BYRNE: You coul d send i t t o Mr .
21
Cal cot t , t he Hi st or i c Pr eser vat i on Of f i ce, he' l l make
22
sur e ever ybody get s a copy.
370
1
THE WI TNESS: Okay, wi l l do.
2
3
Q So the statement that you delivered today,
4
was that statement approved by the full ANC?
5
A No, t hi s st at ement i s f r omt he si ngl e
6
member di st r i ct whi ch I r epr esent .
7
MS. FERSTER: That ' s al l t he quest i ons I
8
have.
9
MS. MERRI TT: I don' t have any quest i ons.
10
J UDGE BYRNE: Al l r i ght . Wel l , t hank you
11
ever ybody, i t ' s been a l ong day, but we' ve gone
12
t hr ough a gr eat deal of mat er i al .
13
We wi l l r econvene on November 3d at 9: 30
14
and I l ook f or war d t o seei ng you t hen. Thank you.
15
( Wher eupon, at 5: 05 p. m. , t he pr oceedi ng
16
adj our ned. )
17

18

19

20

21

22

371
1
CERTI FI CATE OF REPORTER
2
I , PAUL R. CUTLER, Cer t i f i ed Ver bat i m
3
Repor t er wi t h Cer t i f i cat e of Mer i t , Mast er , do her eby
4
cer t i f y t hat t he f or egoi ng pages wer e r ecor ded by me
5
by St enomask and t her eaf t er r educed under my
6
di r ect i on t o t ypewr i t t en f or m; t hat t he f or egoi ng
7
pages ar e a t r ue r ecor d of t he pr oceedi ngs i n t he
8
above mat t er ; t hat I amnei t her counsel f or , r el at ed
9
t o, nor empl oyed by any of t he par t i es t o t he act i on
10
i n whi ch t hi s t est i mony i s t aken; and f ur t her , t hat I
11
amnot a r el at i ve of or empl oyee of any at t or ney or
12
counsel empl oyed by t he par t i es her et o, nor
13
f i nanci al l y or ot her wi se i nt er est ed i n t he out come of
14
t hi s act i on.
15

16

17
18
PAUL R. CUTLER
19
Cer t i f i ed Ver bat i mRepor t er
20
wi t h Cer t i f i cat e of Mer i t , Mast er
21

22

McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor's Agent Transcript 2014 10 06

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McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor&#39;s Agent Transcript 2014 10 06

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McMillan Sand Filtration Site 10/6/2014

Washington, D.C. Baltimore, MD Florida

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McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor's Agent Transcript 2014 10 06

McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor's Agent Transcript 2014 10 06

McMillan Sand Filtration Site Mayor's Agent Transcript 2014 10 06