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How to start a snake farm for the preparation of a Reply

by Frankie on February 15, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Hi Everyone,

How does one go about getting started in this field? Obviously having adequate experience with hots is a
given, but where can I find information about this seemingly unique field out there? Permits, etc.? Actually, I
been on the internet/Google for a few days now and have come up with nothing.

I'm about to retire from education while I'm still relatively young and my hands don't shake, and since I've
been into herps from just about the time I started kindergarten, I thought I might want to do something
seriously productive with the hobby. Considering the AV shortage worldwide, I'd like to be a significant part of
increasing the production of anit-venom. Thank you for whatever help you may offer me.

Frank

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Phobos on February 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Frankie:

Let me address the part about increased productions of "Antivenom"

The reason there is a shortage of Antivenom is not that they lack venom, There are already many established
labs producing ample supplys of venom for this reason. The real problem is that Antivenom production is
expensive and not profitable to the pharmaceutical companies. They can re-tool the antivenom production
line and make something more profitable...like Viagra. Too bad for the 8,000 or so people bitten by
venomous snakes annually is the USA. Also the FDA oversite(inspections & lots of paperwork)into this kind of
work could just drive you mad. I know from experience working with companies that produce pharmacutical
products.

Sounds like a "blackhole" for your retirement funds to me.

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Frankie on February 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Phobos,

You seemed to have missed the focus of my inquiry. I'll repeat my question: "How does one go about getting
started in this field? Obviously having adequate experience with hots is a given, but where can I find
information about this seemingly unique field out there? Permits, etc.?" "I'm about to retire from education
while I'm still relatively young and my hands don't shake, and since I've been into herps from just about the
time I started kindergarten, I thought I might want to do something seriously productive with the hobby."

While I did refer to the shortage of antivenom worldwide, I was looking for an answer to my aforementioned
questions, not a discourse on the politics on why Viagra has been subsituted for antivenom. Not at all. I would
appreciate it that if folks can answer the question at hand, not go off on a tangent relating to something on
their own agenda. Thank you.

Peace,
Frank

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Phobos on February 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

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Frankie:

Getting started should begin by knowing State Laws pertaining to keeping venomous reptiles. There is a link
on the coastalreptiles.com website which leads you to a summary of the state laws. It is also a good idea to
check local city laws too. For instance: You can't keep a Hot Herp within the Philadelphia city limits but
outside the limit is permitted. There are also some forms on the SHHS website under the "File Library"
catagory.

Next find someone to "mentor" you where you can gain experience under the watchful eye of someone who is
experience.

I hope this gives you some insite to where to begin.

Al

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Deuce on February 16, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Hello Frank, I'll try my best to guide you, and everything I tell you is based from my own experience. I've
decided not to go this route b/c the equipment and the building rent/buy deal can crush your money situation
off the bat. That's just the truth. If you want to make a run at it, here's want you'll need. First off, you'll need
USDA and FDA permits for importation of AV, in case of a bite. Then, a doctor that knows how to administer
then AV, and knows the deal w/ a bad bite protocol. A 10 grand AV investment is a average start, and an
insurance policy that will cover it. You will also need a husbandry thumb, as in, how to take care of sick
snakes(ie, ophidian pathogens). A vet might need to be involved with your ophidian investment. The
breeding of snakes will also help you in the future, as well as, the breeding of rats for your snakes. Buying rats
and snakes will suck profit, so pull the profit back through genetic education. Basic venom isn't worth a crap,
so rare snakes are needed, which you must find. Then you must advertise your product in professional
magazines to sell venom, which costs money. That's just if you want to sell crude venom, you could fraction it
off to customers with certain genera. If you start and make a mistake you will die, or lose a finger, or an arm.
Or, have a fat medical bill that really sucks. It can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it right, or do it
sh!tty for a low cost, then not sell b/c you're a putz. Schooling in biochem/chem really helps, along w/
microbiology for husbandry. There's more money in breeding snakes. With education and a strong passion,
you can do it, I have choosen not to do it. But that doesn't mean you can't. I have choosen to be a mason b/c
of great insurance and a ripper pension. But, I love to inject snake venom, mainly mambas.(2004, Annals of
Immunology). Best of luck Frank, Tim Friede(mason).

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by LarryDFishel on February 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Dude, Phobos wasn't trying to push an agenda on you. He was just trying to make the point that this may not
be a good choice for you. There are already people doing this, and not a lot of demand for the product. You
would be investing your retirement in a business that would probably not succeed. You say you're retiring
young... Young enough to start a new career if you go broke? I hate to sound like I'm trying to shoot you
down, but you really need to consider this possibility. I'm one of many people on this board that would LOVE
to do this, but have come to the conclusion that I don't want to be broke.

Like someone else said, if you wanted to breed snakes to sell, you could do that with a reasonable investment
and if it doesn't work out it's no big hairy deal, but a viable venom farm would require such an investment that
you would be in trouble if it didn't pay off.

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by biff on February 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!

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Kudos to Phobos...when "attacked" he answered calmly...

good job,
Steve

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Frankie on February 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Hey Biff,

You use the word 'Attacked" loosely. He wasn't attacked. I was honestly stating the fact that he did not answer
my question, but went off in another direction. You may also not that at the close of my letter, I wrote "Peace,
Frank." People who attack other people do not offer peace.

All that being said, I believe he had very good intentions and was only attemting to offer me some sound
insight into the workings of the antivenom industry. My being frustrated at not being able to find any
information about the workings of the snake farmer, left me little patience. And so Phobos, I would have
made a much better student in your course after I had completed the first course. :)

Therefore, my humblest apologies for not being more patient and understanding. Hope you'll forgive me.

One more question, if you feel like answering it: where in PA are you? I have lots of family in southwestern PA
outside of Johnstown, near where the 9/11 plane went down. Just thought I'd ask.

And thank you everyone else who offered your invaluable insight on the subject. I appreciate it a great deal.

Sincerest Regards,
Frank

RE: How to start a snake farm for the preparation Reply

by Phobos on February 17, 2004 Mail this to a friend!
Hi Frankie:

I live in Lansdale, PA

As for being attacked..... Life is full of mis-understandings that get out of hand. However Frankie, you started
with:

"You seemed to have missed the focus of my inquiry. I'll repeat my question."

Which ment to me....hmmm maybe I did miss the point so I thought about it, then chose to answer the
question again as I understood it. It was not worth to get into a pissing match over a trivial thing. There are
lots of topics we could all get wound up about but not this one.

This is a very useful forum that is invaluable to "experts" and " neophytes" alike, so lets just all learn from this
experience too and move on.

My best to all who responded to this thread.

Al Coritz (phobos)

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