Logic of phantasy 08

Jacques Lacan

雅克 拉岡

Lacan Seminar 14: The Logic of Fantasy 07

幻见的逻辑

Seminar 3: Wednesday, November 30, 1966

There will be one next Friday at 10:45, which is what is called, I have been assured, a "peak listening

time" (laughter). I am thinking: not for those who are listening to me here at this hour, precisely, because

I think at this peak listening time, they are at the hospital.

下个星期五，十点四十五分，将会有一场谈话会，有人告诉我说，那就是所谓的「颠峰倾听时间」（笑声）

我正在想：不是为了那些目前正在听我演讲的那些人，确实的，因为在这个颠峰的倾听实间，我认为，他

们是在医院里。

Anyway, too bad, you can organise things as you wish and I hope after all to be able to communicate

this text if the Ardio is willing to give me the authorisation. There will be another one on Monday - you

can see that they are in a hurry. For the first, it is Georget Charbonnier who is kind enough - I will not

say to receive it - to give me a place and for the second it is M. Sipridio, thanks to whom you will

perhaps have something a bit more lively than the first one, since it will be a dialogue with the person

who is most qualified to sustain it, namely, Francois Wahl who is here and was kind enough to agree to

carry out this exercise with me.

无论如何，这是非常遗憾。你们可以随自己愿望来组办事情，畢竟我希望能够跟你们讲解这一篇文章，假

如雅迪欧愿意给我这个授权。在星期五，还有另外一场谈话会，你们明白，他们很迫不及待。对於第一场谈

话会，那是蔡朋倪帮我安排接受，谢谢他的好意，让我有一次的几会。至於第二场谈话会，那是希瑞迪欧

女士安排，感谢她，你们才会有比第一次更精彩的内容，因为那将是一场跟一位学养丰富的飽学之士做对

谈。他的名字是佛兰科斯。他人在这里，很感谢他同意来跟我做这样的对谈。

Now then, (in the audience: "At what time?") Well it appears that it is at ... I (5) would not swear to it, it

appears that it is starting at 6:15, only they are not going to be speaking just about my book and I

cannot very well tell you at what stage it will appear between 6:15 and 7PM, each one having his

quarter of an hour.... What then, is there another question? It is a peak listening time (laughter) which in

general is accompanied by exercises in gymnastics. There you are, anyway, we will see how all of that

works out.

（听众中有人问：「什麽时间」？）似乎是，我不大确定，似乎是六点十五分开始。只是他们不是完全要谈

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论我的书，我无法清楚告诉你们，在六点十五分跟七点之间的哪一个阶段。我们每一个人的时间分别是十

五分钟。那麽，还有没有其它问题？那是颠峰的倾听时间（笑声），一般来说，它们还会伴随着健身软操

等。就这样，我们再看看结果怎麽样。

And now I give the floor to Jacques-Alain Miller (the audience: "Oh!").

现在，我将现场交给亚伦、米勒主持。（听众驚呀声！）

I am going all the same to communicate something very amusing to you, which was brought to me by

one of my faithful followers. It is a little paper done by a sort of special journal, linked, I think, both to

IBM machines and what has been done on an experimental level in the Massachusetts Institute of

Technology (MIT, as it is usually called) and which speaks to us about the use of one of these high-level

machines that are being made now, to which there was given - and certainly not for nothing - the name

of Elisa; at least it is called Elisa for the use that is made of it - that I am going to tell you about ... (Elisa

is, as you know, the person who in a well known play - Pygmalion - the person who is taught to speak

properly; she was a little flower seller on a busy London street and it is a matter of training her to be able

to express herself in the best society, when it is noticed that she does not belong to it).

我仍然要跟你们说一件有趣的事情，这是我的一位忠实的听众告诉我的。有一个特别的杂志，登载了一篇

小论文，关系到IBM 的电脑机器及麻省科技研究所（通常简称文MIT）。这篇论文跟我们谈到这些正在制

造的高科技机器的使用，这种机器被取名为「艾丽莎」，真是名符其实。至少，它被称为艾丽莎的原因，是

跟它的用途有关。现在，我要跟你们谈到，众所皆知，艾丽莎是一齣名剧「卖花女」的女主角。她被教导如何

讲话要得体。她原先是伦敦街上的一位卖花女，然后一位语言学家训练她成为能在上流社会表达自己。

It is something of this order which emerges with this little machine; in truth, what is involved is not

properly speaking that a machine should be capable of giving articulated answers, simply when one

speaks to it - I am not saying when one questions it - it is something which now proves to be a game

and which puts in question what can happen in terms of obtaining responses from the one who is

speaking to it.

从这台小小的机器，类似这样的事情就出现了。事实上，所牵涉到的，严格来说，並不是一台机器能够提

供文辞表达的回答，只有当一个人在跟它说话。我的意思不是说，当一个人在问它。那是我们现在证明是遊

戏的东西。而是它会置疑事情的后果，它会从跟它谈话的人那里，得到它所要的回应。

The thing, faith, is not absolutely articulated in a fashion which would be completely satisfying for a

situation, in effect, that is so usable for us - which gives us such an interesting reference in the

discourse pursued here - it is not properly speaking stated in a fashion which would satisfy us

completely - in other words which takes into account the framework into which we might insert it -

nevertheless, it is very interesting because, when all is said and done, there is something suggested

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which may be considered as a therapeutic function of the machine and in a word, it is nothing less than

the analogue of a sort of transference which can be produced in this relationship, about which the

question is raised.

信心这件事，在这种情况下，绝对无法用完全令人满意的方式来表达。事实上，这对於我们是那麽有用，

因为它有趣地关系到我们所追求的真理论述。适当地说，它並不是以让我们完全满意的方式来陈述。换句话

说，它考虑到我们可能会插入的架构。可是，这仍然引人興趣，因为当我们说过及做过，会有某件暗含东

西，被认为是这台机器具有治疗的功用。总之，它道道地地是在这种关系下产生类似某种「移情」。关於这种

移情，问题就产生了。

The thing did not dissatisfy me. I would like simply in this connection ... - since moreover it is not

unrelated to everything that I am leaving open concerning the fashion in which, in short, I have to

manage the diffusion of what is called my teaching - I could say that what you will find in terms of the

handling of a first symbolic chain (designed in its time, for me, to give me the notion that (6)

psychoanalysts are required to conceive of ... the notion to which their mind should accommodate itself,

to centre in a proper fashion on what Freud called memory (rememoration), to give them a sort model

that is suggestive of that), in the construction of this symbolic chain and of its own kind of memory, that

is undoubtedly consistent and even insistent, which is articulated in what comes now in this book, in the

second, let us say chapter or moment, namely, in the inverse position in which the Introduction to the

purloined letter which precedes it is fixed in this book, namely, just after The purloined letter.

我对於这种状况並不满意。在这方面，我只是想要、、、而且，它跟我展开的一切並非没有关系，总之，我必

须处理所谓我的教学的扩散。我可以这样说，你们所发现的是，在处理一个初起的符号的锁链时，这个锁

链被设计，为了要给我精神分析师所被要求构想的这个观念：他们的心智应该接纳它自己进入这个观念，

为了要以适当的方式，专注於佛洛伊德所谓的记忆，给他们一种有如此意涵的模式，在建构这个符号的锁

链，以及它自己的记忆。无可置疑地，那是具有一贯性，甚至是持续性的。这是将要出版的这本书的内容。

其次，让我们谈到章节，换句话说，採用倒转的立场，在它之前的「偷窃的信的导论」，在这本书中，被修

正过来。换句话说，它出现在「偷窃的信」之后。

I recall to those who were listening to me at that time that this construction, like all the others, was made

before them and for them, step by step, and that I started very exactly: first of all, from an examination,

starting from a text by Poe, about the way in which the mind works on this theme: can one win in the

game of odds and evens, and that my second step was the following: to imagine a machine, precisely of

this kind - and what is effectively produced today differs in nothing from what I articulated then - simply:

the machine is supposed by the subject to be provided with a programme which takes into account the

gains and the losses.

我回想起当时听我演讲的那些人，我的理论建构，像所有的其它建构，都是在他们面前，並且都是针对他

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们建造的，一步一步地。我脚踏实地开始：首先，我先审查，从艾伦坡的一篇小说开始，关於心智对於这

个主题的运作：一个人可能在精打细算的遊戏中获胜吗？我的第二步骤如下：想像一台机器，确实是这种

机器，今天我们所产生的这种有效的机器，跟我当时所表达的机器，没有什麽两样。仅有的差别是：小说

的主角认为的机器，供应有一种程式，这个程式会考虑到所有的利益跟损失。

I mean that starting from this: that the subject might question the aforesaid machine, by playing the

game of odds and evens with it – starting from this single supposition, that it preserves, at least for a

certain number of throws, the memory of its gains and its losses, one can construct this sequence of: +,

+, -, +, - ... which encompass, united in a parenthesis of a typical length and which is displaced by a

notch each time, allows us to establish this trajectory that I constructed and upon which I am founding

this first most elementary type of the model ... (We do not need to consider memory under the register of

the physiological impression but only of the symbolic memorial),...

我的意思是，从这里开始，小说的主角可能置疑到前述的那台机器，用它来玩精打细算的遊戏，从这个单

一的假设开始，它保留，至少投掷几次后，它保留了获利跟损失的记忆。我们能够建构这种系列：+, +, -,

+- ...。这个系列涵盖到某个长度后，会用括弧把它们联合起来，每一次都用一个刻痕来替代。这样它使我

们能够建立这个我建构的投掷的轨道，也是我目前正在創建的这个最基本的模式、、、（我们不需要将记忆

放置在生理的印象层次，而仅仅放置在符号的记念层次。）

It is starting from a hypothetical game with what was not yet perhaps in a position to function then at this

level, but which all the same existed as such, as electronic machine, namely, in fact, something which

can be written on paper (this is the modern definition of the machine), it is starting from there - well

before, then, this got onto the agenda of the preoccupations of engineers, who devoted themselves to

these apparatuses, as you know, that are always progressing, because people expect nothing less than

automatic translation - it is starting from there that 15 years ago I constructed a first model for the proper

use of psychoanalysts, with the goal of producing in their mens, mind, this sort of necessary detachment

from the idea that the functioning of the signifier is necessarily the flower of consciousness, which was

at that time to introduce a step that was absolutely unprecedented.

它从一个假设的遊戏开始，使用可能还不算是这个层次的运作的立场，但是仍然是像这样的电子机器，换

句话说，实际上，某件能够被写在纸上的东西（这是机器的现代意义）。它就从这里开始，然后，这样进

入工程师全心贯注的工作进度表。你们知道，工程师对於这些机器会致力研发，总是在进展当中，因为人

们所期盼的，道道地地就是自动的翻译机。就是从那里开始，十五年前，我构想一台第一部这样的模型，

来充当精神分析师的适当地使用，目标是要在它们的「心智层」，产生这种必须要的观念上的疏离：意符的

运作必须是意识的开花结果。这在当时，算是介绍了绝对是史无前例的一步。

Over to you ... (There follows the presentation of <b>M Jacques-Alain Miller</b> on Boolean

logic) <b>Doctor Lacan</b>: - I am not going to add any commentary. I consider that the work

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which has been pronounced before you as being truly able to guarantee by the perfect ease of its

presentation, something which supports, grounds, corresponds to what I introduced the last time as

being the absolutely necessary starting point for any logic which is properly the one the psychoanalytic

terrain requires.

麦克风递交给你、、、（接着是亚伦、米勒对於布林逻辑的讲演）、、、我不是要妄加评论，我认为，你们所听

到的这场讲演，真正能够保证讲演内容的丰富充实。它支持、支撑、並对应我上一次所介绍的内容，作为一

个绝对需要的开始点。适当地说，开展精神分析学的平台所需要的幻见逻辑。

This commentary is not to be considered as a reduplication. It showed you something in the

confrontation with the first of these sets, in the mathematical-logic sense of the term: which was given

by this Boole set and the confrontation of this Boole set - in so far as it finds itself apparently much more

homogeneous with classical logic - You have seen that from this set itself, we are allowed to construct

this logical precedence, this necessity which radically distinguishes the status of meaning and its origin

in the signifier - I find that you have had there, at once a very elegant demonstration and at the same

time this constitutes a which was necessary for the assimilation, in a way, and the complement, the

control, the configuration of what, the last time, I succeeded in bringing before you and which you will

have the continuation of the next time.

这个评论不应该只是被认为是内容的复述。它给你们显示某件跟这些集合的前面几组的冲突，用数学逻辑

的意义来说，这是布林逻辑的集合所提供的。而布林逻辑的集合的冲突，它发现它自己显而易见地跟传统

的逻辑，更加具有同质性。你们看的出来，从这个集合本身，我们被允许建构这个逻辑的先后顺序，这对

於区别意义跟它在意符的起源是有必要的。我发现到，你们在那里所听到的，既是一种高雅的证明，它同

时也建造了一个小客体，作为吸收、互补、控制、及整合我上一次所呈现给你们的，下一次，我们还会再接

续下去。

雄波译
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