Interview Transcript – Salman – ZOOM0001_TrLR.

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00:24 LOUISE: Thank you so much again. Can you tell us a little bit, like before when we were
in the jungle, where you’re from and what you are doing here in Calais?
00:36 SALMAN: My name is Salman, I from Pakistan. I 23 years old. I leave my country, I
00:52 have worse problem in my country, the Taliban and police also. When I leave the
01:02 country I come to, I cross the border to Iran…and two days three days I don’t know, but
01:10 so hard and when I come to Iran border after Turkey border, I walking 17 hours the
01:24 snow…and its too much hard this also…and some friend, the snow is down, and some
01:35 people is gone also, and I crossed the Iran border. Then I come to Turkey, two days I
01:45 stay, and after I cross the I go to Bulgaria, I cross the border to Bulgaria. This is
01:57 walking…car, bus, everything. And after Bulgaria to Serbia, and four day in I…live, four
day, four day and night I cross the border. The day we sleep and the night we are
walking. Bulgaria police is so bad. One time they arrest me and they deport me to go
back to Turkey, and they take my also passport, ID card Pakistan, they take my money
02:37 they take my…everything; energy drink, biscuit, and I go back to Turkey, I try again.
Second time I cross the border, four days four night, the day we will sleep the night we
02:53 will walk. When I come to (?) afterwards I will come to a border go to another country
03:07 Serbia. Like Serbia same like this, and when we go to near to Serbia border, Serbia
police and military are coming again to Bulgaria like this and four, five times like this and
03:22 so hard. Like Bulgaria also too much cold weather. We don’t have for eating we don’t
have for drinking, we don’t have it for sleeping…and Serbia border also like this. And
four five times I go and try again and come to…Hungary, I’m living…sorry Bulgaria
police take my finger also, I don’t want to asylum in Bulgaria, they take my finger for
03:57 money for everything. And Serbia police also like this, and Hungary police also like this.
And Austria police also like this. They take my money and I don’t want to asylum in
04:16 Bulgaria, Hungary, Austria...and um also…Serbia also, I don’t want but they take my
04:26 finger. When you don’t I don’t asylum in Bulgaria they sent me back to truck to Turkey
and Serbia back to truck to...like this and I cross to Hungary border to Austria and after
04:45 Italia, and this like two three border is easy, not to different like Bulgaria Serbia and
Turkey yeah not like this. When I come to Italy I walk two night to Armenia, one bridge
and some people stay in the street like bridge. And after I come to the mountain after
05:21 walking one hour and to France, Nice… and after I come to Paris. One night two night I
sleep in the (?)…and after I come to Calais, and when I come to Calais, I see lots of
people living to try to go to UK..and me to try to…I live in 11 months in Calais Jungle,
05:54 for try to UK, but it is so hard. Come to Pakistan and France, this is two months, and
Calais to UK, like eleven months I will stay, like every night we would sleep the truck,
inside the truck we will go in the boat, the police check in and police say you go back
06:37 Calais, the Jungle into the Jungle every day like this. WHY I want to go to UK, my family
live in (Cardiff?) my Uncle, and my friend also. And in English also little better, not hard
too much like French. Like easy for *RICHARD SNIFFS LOUDLY* people.
07:01 And like this is I want to go to England, like before and na na, now I don’t want to go to
07:11 England. Eleven months every night I will try, everyday I will try not good sleeping not
good eating not good shower not good…like bad luck every time.
07:26 And police also spray and also fight…and we we going to England to *NOT SURE* and
cut the tree and *NOT SURE*…Why we have so different situation such hard situation.
07:48 We want to England, and we don’t cross the border, and police also his work, he
want..this is international motorway, like highway international, we block the
international highway, this is so bad for France also…this all car all people say, this is
 France like this, but I’m so sorry for this time. Why I want to go to England my family
also live *BACKGROUND NOISE*, but why I start to try?
08:25 Me and my friend, we every night go to try together, we sleep together *not sure – one
car one?* we eat together and err and we go to try and err *FRIDGE TURNS ON* some
people road the block? And truck is coming so fast, my friend don’t see and he also run
too fast to another truck and he accident to truck – he’s gone. I see and I also cry, but I
09:03 er I say to him my life is why I leave Pakistan for my life, I don’t want to go to UK I stay
in France I asylum in France. When the jungle is finished demolition, I take a bus and I
go to another city *SHUFFLING*…its name is Maubeuge I live four months in
09:39 Maubeuge…I learning French, no I’m sorry, when the Jungle demolition I work also in
volunteer like Utopia like Help Refugee like just translating English and Urdu…and, my
some friend he’s admission in University Lille, I’m so sad I want to start to study again,
10:06 and my 90 people they admission in University Lille and they go. When the Jungle
demolition, I think two weeks before they will go…and I’m so said and my friend also
stayed with me and my, English volunteer also..but he er he said to me said to me we
will find the solution better than you will go to another University, another city no
10:48 problem we will help you we will help you…I say okay no problem.
10:54 When the jungle demolition 10,000 people we will just *PROJECT INFO*
11:14 They promise me first you learning French, after you learning job, after you work in
France no problem *PROGRAM NAME?* promise me….When I go to Maubeuge three
months I learning French, after I’m learning job, and four months I’m learning job also
11:42 and three and for seven months and I do exam, I pass I have a diploma, I have contract
to one office *DON’T INCLUDE OFFICE NAME* And now I am working in France, and
I’m so happy to stay in France.

12:19 LOUISE: So the project Pelot?? Its from the University du Lille *SHORT
CONVERSATION IN FRENCH* Salman talks more about project and journey to
Maubeuge
13:33 SALMAN: Now I coming to Calais for volunteer, for helping refugee..why why? I was
also refugee before and the people need help They are not terrorist they are not
13:52 anything, just big problem for country they will live *potentially problematic grammar*
14:00 LOUISE: Do you think the refugees here don’t see France the way you see France?
14:10 SALMAN: My 11 months I live in Calais…why? I asylum in Paris I go to and I go to
another city and I am learning French and job also. But France not like Calais. France
not like Calais police, France is very very good country. They love refugee and people.
14:44 And not like you go to Paris you go to Marseille you go to Lyon you go to another city, in
France you find a job you find a work, you find a good house like before I was living
Calais 11 months, not good sleep not good eat not good everything. Now I am so happy
I have big house, I have nice work and I have everything now.
15:21 LOUISE: Where do you live?
15:22 SALMAN: I live in *** check with Louise.
15:25 LOUISE: How did you come to live in ***, what bought you there? *French
conversation*
16:10 What are the differences from when you were in the Jungle before it was demolished to
know?
16:24 SALMAN: I think the difference is before have a shelter *MUFFLED NOISES*, have a
room have a caravan have a tent…..like two times they give you eat from government,
and the shower also the system good, the toilet also. Before like not too much hard to
16:56 live in Jungle. Why they have for sleeping for relax and also have a room have a lot of
 people, now it’s so hard its -5 degrees now, -6 degree, -4 and they live like not good
17:24 tent….now I think so hard for these people, but the people don’t know in France very
well, when they will stay in France they will be like…*FRIDGE TURNS OFF*
17:52 MOLLY: What kind of health and medical problems are the refugees facing or maybe
you faced when you were in the Jungle?
18:18 SALMAN: …
18:38 Like police spray, like damage feet, you jump the truck and also police beat me here in
my face, there is damage also like...danger damage…like when your hand is broken
19:04 your feet is broken all time and you’re hitting also…this is big problem, for health. *CAN
HEAR MOLLY INHALE TO START NEXT QUESTION*
19:16 MOLLY: And when the police attack you is there a reason, have the refugees done
anything wrong or do they just attack you because…
19:30 SALMAN: Now refugee don’t want to stay in France, some people, like I before I don’t
want to stay in France, I want to go to UK. And police, like I don’t have a document
before and I not asylum in France. When the police take you he say to you, show me
20:00 your paper also, but you don’t have a paper what you say? You say I don’t want to go to
England I want to asylum in France. And they say like go to jungle all time like they call
to me like go to jungle go to Jungle..
20:25 And police real make wrong…like police also coming, police beat you, police spray
you…police work, this is his work and err I think 50% we’re wrong and 50% police
wrong, like beat and this is not good.
20:58 LOUISE: When you started your journey how did you know where to go, when you got
to France did other people tell you to go to Paris/ Calais?
21:11 SALMAN: No….I think I go to England for my family, my cousin cousin my uncle like
21:27 this, like English is easy and some people have a family in UK, those people want to go
to UK. Another refugee, a lot of refugee want to stay in Italy and some people stay in
France, lot of people stay in France.
21:56 My, a lot of friend stay in Paris stay, they asylum in France and Belgium also some
people going…
22:10 LOUISE: Reiterates question about how Salman knew to go to Calais.
22:34 SALMAN: I didn’t know anything, come to Paris *LOUISE UMS* I asked to some
people I want to go to England, they say you go to Belgium, also some people try you
will go. They say to me you go Belgium police so bad, when they take they will deport
another country, and France police good like this, they don’t deport they will say to you
like go to Jungle. I don’t know in the jungle when I come to Paris I live two day I live one
23:09 day I live in La Chapelle, and I asked to another refugee, they say go to Calais they
have big Jungle you will ask to another friend and you will see everything. *SLIGHT
INTERRUPTION FROM LOUISE AT END*
23:26 LOUISE: And you had your friend with you at that time?
23:28 SALMAN: Yes, my friend when he was died we go to try, he with me also.
23:36 LOUISE: What’s his name?
23:37 SALMAN: His name Hassan *LOUISE REPEATS HASSAN* I don’t know his surname.
23:57 MOLLY: I was wondering, because in the UK in the news and media we don’t talk
about refugees anymore…why don’t you think people are talking about the refugee
problem as much? *SHORTENED FOR CLARITY & REPEATS QUESTIONS WITH
MORE EXAMPLES OF WHY PEOPLE ARE IGNORING THE REFUGEE CRISIS*
25:27 SALMAN: …The UK people, some people, every country some people is good some
people is not good…everywhere. Some people want to welcome to refugees in UK and
some people don’t want to…the refugee camp. But err some people say to welcome
25:58 refugees, and I think these people very well refugee…..And other people they think
refugee not coming, they don’t know refugee life…
26:30 And when the…*DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND*
26:50 MOLLY: And what would happen in the Jungle if there were no volunteers for the
refugees?
26:56 SALMAN: Ahhh when there not volunteer *LAUGHS* we all is dead. Why? They bring
too much clothes they bring too much shoes, but like we need something they will bring.
27:15 Big big problem like all people like…like when I come I don’t have nothing, not for
money for eating, not money, I have nothing like, when there not volunteers some
people like family is reach to send to money……and another refugee I don’t know what
27:52 he doing like…
27:58 MOLLY: Because the Major of Calais said that if there were no volunteers, there would
be no refugees, because the volunteers are causing the problem…
28:10 SALMAN: No, the volunteers, some often tell to me, volunteer has come 2016, 15 and
before I think not volunteer….When the volunteer is coming I think
like…helping…before people is coming umm…like Calais…and they one day cross the
28:44 border. Mmm a lot of friend tell to me, I, in 2013 in 2014, 2012, 2010, they will come to
Calais and they will cross the border, one day. One hour, two hour, three hour like this.
29:17 This time not volunteer not problem, not media. It’s too much media, I think like this too
much media coming, too much volunteer coming and they make like shelter, house and
they will help but err, when you show to the media something, and I think there is not
too much refugee before like 2014, 2013. Like now, not too much refugee, when the
29:50 media coming to show…UK government don’t know how many refugee here, they show
too much but err I think UK gonna make close the border…like this.
30:10 LOUISE: And there was also the war in Syria that bought a lot of refugees to France in
2014 and 15 right?
30:18 SALMAN: In Syria also big problem everyday, 2013, 2014 I think our country also big
problem, like 2013, 14…..in Pakistan, one school ??...no army police the school, this is
and some Taliban. Four, five people I don’t know they inside the school, they will kill
300 40 200 40 I don’t know, they will kill like children like this *MUST DO ACTION IN
31:15 VIDEO* and bomb also blast to city to village to every place…..When I don’t have a
problem my country I live relax, when I have problem I leave, I coming here.
31:39 LOUISE: What did you do in Pakistan?
31:44 SALMAN: No er, I was study high school, and college also…and I work with my
father…*INTERRUPTION*…to bring material for house…*INTERRUPTION*…and
sometime I will live with my friend.
32:10 LOUISE: What did you study?
32:14 SALMAN: …like second year. College in Pakistan, family school, high school and after
you go to college….My study is civil engineering.
32:38 MOLLY: Do you think the situation in Calais is improving or getting worse from what
you’ve seen? *REPEATS QUESTION*
32:58 SALMAN: I don’t know, I think they loose everyday, like I think this border is not open.
33:07 Yes, and some people good luck, like one hundred car come in, and car is not
checking. So so lucky is this man who cross the border, it’s not easy to cross. Why I tru
eleven months…
33:31 LOUISE: And do you think it would be good to open the border?
33:34 SALMAN: Yes, open the border in like, other Europe. In other country like Belgium,
France. Like Italy, France. Like Germany France, like open is good not..like the UK
government think like this – refugees is not good people they close the border, they
very intelligent people, they are honest people they will love work.
34:12 I live in France three month I learning French….I don’t know English I learning in Calais
Jungle five months, I speak English after I work with volunteer with helping volunteer.
34:40 LOUISE: I wanted to ask something different, I wanted to know in your spare time do
you like to do things that are artistic like singing, watching movies, do you do that is that
important to you?
35:05 SALMAN: I like travel *LOUISE: Travel* I like travel, when I see to movie I find boring.
Yes I don’t like very well, and err singing *LOUISE: Music?* Yes I like music and I like
dance also, but I don’t want to dance…..I don’t want to but I want to see I like, and I like
too much travel and I like, I take the paper and I go to the UK, just travel in another
country in Europe. Just travel I like travel yes.
35:56 LOUISE: Why do you like travelling?
36:02 SALMAN: Travelling is when you have holiday…..travelling good for health also, you
move and your mind is changed, when you go every day same time work, come back to
home like boring. When you travel your mind is fresh and like this…
36:33 LOUISE: Do you like to meet people from other cultures and see new places?
36:41 SALMAN: Yes err, I like to meet in other culture people. Yes I like to meet yes I like to
talk, like to share talking everything.
37:00 LOUISE: Did you like to travel when you were in Pakistan?
37:03 SALMAN: Yes when I’m Pakistan I like travel, I like travel all city in Pakistan…..We have
a big car we would travel all the time.
37:18 LOUISE: And what do you do when you’re not working?
37:23 SALMAN: Ah when I…*starts talking in French with Louise*
37:48 Ah when I’m at my house, I love cooking *LOUISE: Cooking?* Yes, I’m cooking very
well….And to..cooking, and do games like football games *LOUISE: Fifa?* Yes I love to
see football match…I see football match all time.
38:30 LOUISE: And when you were in the Jungle did you have much time to cook, play
football?
38:42 SALMAN: I have everyday, cooking *LOUISE: But when you were in the Jungle you
were cooking*…When I am in the Jungle I am everyday cooking, it has too much
38:53 kitchen In ? kitchen I was cooking, in Belgium kitchen I was cooking. And another one
kitchen I was cooking I forget the name, and I also cooking restaurant in Jungle. Yes,
and also cooking in my caravan. Yes, everytime I was cooking in Jungle.
39:14 LOUISE: Did you know how to cook before in Pakistan?
39:19 SALMAN: Ah yes *LOUISE: Who taught you* Yes I see my Mum and am
learning…*LOUISE: And do you mainly cook Pakistani food?*…Yes I cook Pakistani,
Hindi, everyone.