Jim Garrison - Shaw - Cuba File PDF

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H E H 0 R A Nu u r·l
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October 9, 1968 ... ...,
TO: JIM GARRISON/ District Attbrney
FROM: ANDRE\v J. SCIAf.lBRA, Assistant D. A.
RE:
* * * * * *********** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
. ·. . .
with MR. JANES J . . PLAINE
!v1R. PLAINE said that -MR. WHITE was only one of the
rnahy oil ~nd import people that he had occasion to talk to
from New Orleans regarding Castro.
MR. PLAINE also informed me that he thought that the

picture of CLAY SH.I\W >·Tas very familiar and that he may have I
met him in Houston/ either at his apartment or at the Normandy

Club which the oil people of Texas frequent. ·
.· A rnerrio in the GUY BANISTER file indicates that there

· is information which reports that DICK WHITE, a high official
of Free2or_t Sulphur and CLAY SHAW. were flown tQ Cuba probably
I
taking off from the Harvey Canal area in a Freeport Sulphu-r-

plane piloted by DAVE FERRIE._ The purpose of this trip was .
to set up import of Cuba Is nickle ore . to ®::cana~~.
<G:::orporat-i -6t"!:> which would in turn shipt · to the Braithwaite nickle
plant. The plant was built by the U. S. Government at a cost
of about one million dollars.
The report is that the combine of Freeport Sulphur,

\illiTE, and SHZ:\~v purchased the plant ~a....._m_illion dollars and
intended to get ore through ~adian corporation they ha
~d. There · is also a report that GUY BANISTER . lre
and JACK NARTIN - as investigators to check out the nickle plant
deal.
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October 23 '· 19"68
TO: JHl G_'\fu-:>.ISON, . District At~orney
FRON: ANDRE'i;J J. SCIAr·'iBRA, Assistant D. A.
RE:· FERRIE & WHITE (Freeport Sulphur}
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' ·' I contacted Mr. PLAINE · by telephone in-reg~rd

to .ViR. HHITE of Freeport Sulphur and DAVID FERRIE~ - PL.si~E
t:_old me that he distinctly remembers either StLi\;·r or FER..~IE__
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Western tin of Cuba. He says he does not remernher exactly
the gist of the conversation, but he distinctly .temernbers .
~hat it was ~eg~rding the~e nickel mines. He said he cannot
positively say that FERRIE knew \'irliTE or vice versa, but he
somehow feels that. they must have kno,.m each other.
Alcock and I \·Till call in HR •. l•lrHTE of Freeport

Sulphur and ask him about our previous memorandum from
KIMBALL vThich mentions SH..'\\•1, · FERRIE and \•iHITE being together.
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April 28, · 1969
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TO: JIM GARRISON, District Attorney
FROM: ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA, Assistant District Attorney
RE: SHAW LEADS - 2 Interview with WALLACE FASSM.-1\N

Phone: 821-1870
3522 Louisiana ·Avenue.Parkway
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MR. FASSlvtAN related to you and me this morning that >thefe ·_is no _:. ·.;.: .:_·
doubt in his mind . that the name : ,''BERTRAND"· is in ... th~ SHA.W family~
He also suggested the possibi:J_ity · that the SHAWS · co~ld be · from ,
Birmingham; Alabama •. - Friday,he and I will go to ·H ammond, La.,
to talk to . his sister-in:-law, . · MRs~ · · SMYTHE·, . who told:- hl.m .~ that ···
BERTRAND was a SHAW . family name. , His sis ter.:..in..:.law lives one ;:::· ';
block from CLAY SHAW 1 s mother •. · . . ·· ·· · :.:~·}''
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· · · ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA .....

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l iTRA~SC~IBE;
Iii This will be a · tape recording of .··an .interview · made .on :' July 12, <:·~ :.: :· ···~·· ·.
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}11967, at exactly_·· 4:20 P.M., __ interview c9nducted .. by William Boxley~-
~ of the District ·Attorney's .. Office ·. of New Orlean~ and bi William
!;Martin, of the District Attorney's Office of New Orleans. · The
jjinterview will be conducted in the Wynne State Farm, · Texas ··
j!De r ent of=-~ections. The interview is conducted with Mr.
filliam A. M~ an inmate at said institution. , . . .
1----------- ==---- ~-------------------------~----.:.___ -:_________:_____ _

!b. ' Wl1a t we would 1 i,ke to know about first, if we could, BILL
are you called aiLL or BILLIE?
!A. BILLIE. .:.:.:.:..
I our introduction to
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[ Dj d you
i.:..~~w or~ ?~-~:i'L;_ .'~_ ·:', ,·r>~;l~l~:;;:~~-
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Well. I met . a man i ntroduced to . me . as CLAY '" BERTRAND
You met a CLAY · BERTRAND? '

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I met a ci.AY BERTRAl\JD. · The name CLAY SHAW was ·never ·
r· mentioned or used to me.·
-Alright, can you tell me the circumstances . of meeting

BERTRAND? "·
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I ·certainly can. I met him at the Masguerade Bar. I

"'wa~., t:aKe!l=-t~h-e.:..r__;_e...:.,.b-y~-G.:..E.:..N.:..E.:__.:..D.:.::A~"i.:.:.T_I,;;.;S'-"-f-:-o.:.:.r=-=-t~h.;;..e.:.:...:.:._•e..;;x.=.;p;:.;r;;_;;:;:e.:.::s;:.;:s~r=e:.:::a;_;s::..o-n-=--to
-=meet him. "-o A-v-:J.~ .../rsn ~~ -r--: · :

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It was some time in June of 1958. . .r,:-. ~·
June of '58 and what was the occasion of the Masquerade ,< . .-.
ball?
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!£tle Masg_u§rade Q
Bar~ I beg your pardon.
On St. Louis Street. It's a homosexual hangout.
Okay.
It's now ·when I left called the Cove. It changed

names.
The Cove? C-0-V-E?
Uh huh, it's on st. Louis Street. Between Bourbon and

Dauphine • .
Q. ...
Now why was GENE DAVIS interested in introducing you to
BERTRAND?
A. We 11, for sexual purposes...

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A. That's right. , .
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Q. The:r:e wasn 1 t anything else suggested? -
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Q. Okay. Now then, what age were you at that bme?
A. ._J_was 18
Q. You were 18. And where did you live in New Orleans at
chat time?
A. oh, I was living on Dauphine Street, right across the

street from the Dauphine Restaurant. A little - old hole
in the wall restaurant. There's a littleapartment house
there. I was living with a guy named ART.
Q. ART.
A. He worked for GENE DAVIS a-t the Court of _Two Sisters.

GENE DAVIS at that time_-- I read in the paper about
it naturally, and they say·he owns Wanda's Bar-- but
at that · time he just .worked for the Court of T~o Sisters.
He didn't· own nothing. _ .He _didn't own a car.·
Q. What was he doing at the Court of TWo Sisters?
A. Some kind of maitre'd or something, he wasn't just any

everyday bimmy you know. He offered to get me a job
there and I'm sorry I didn't go to work, to be honest
with you •
Q. . Okay, and in traduced you .to ~e e.r:;;. BERT~

-you identified in your own mirid CLAY BERTRAND from
_p_:Lctures that yon' ve seen in the naper or did yoy ever ••
A. I never seen -the picture in the paper, to be honest with

you, but I seen him on T.Vo once .and I thought maybe •••
Oh, looks like, well, somebody I'd be .... Well, I thought
it was somebody I'd tricked with when I was in New
Orleans, and then I kept thinking •••
Q .. . When did you see him on T. V ....:1
_A. Oh 1 it's been a long time ago, three or four months~
Q .. In what connection?
A. Well just something about Jim Garrison's stuff. They

-had him coming out of the, oh, uh.he didn't s~ nothing
he was just going in something. you know.
Q .. In a building or ....
A. Yeah, in a _building, you see, I just seen him.
Q. Then what you say then is that you saw on television

_several months ago photographs of a man going in or out
_9f the Court building and this was the man you knew as
_9LAY BERTRAJ\ID?
A. ,It looked a lot like him, I'll say that. Seeing a · man
on television-~;ng him in real might make- a
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Q .. Yeah.
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A.
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You understand what I mean?
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Sure, sure. Was he on television as CLAY SBAW? Was a
r~ference made tQ him on television a s CLAY SfiAW?
A. ~Y.e_f!_, yes •
Q. Tl1is man was identified on tele>dsian at tbat tj,me as

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- Y=--S=HA=-=..;W...:.?_
A.
. ·--As CLAY SHAW.
Q. I see.
A. 'l'hey said he was a New Orleans businessman or something.

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told me · he worked for General Electric. I remember
that. _ ·
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Q •. · -:· wne·re ·did you ·go with him from ··· there?
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A. . We went to·: GENE DAVIS 1

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Q. Okay • . Was this at night or in the da!{tim~?.
A. _This · was at ni gbt.
Q. Do you remember where GENE DAVIS' apartment waaJ
A. J · remember wher~- i t was · but not . tbe exact address. It

Jcl.iiS hzo or three doors Clown further fram the Court of _'IW
Sisters. On the even side of Bourbon, of course, 6lQ o:c_
612 Bourbon, i t could have been 608 or 614, you under-
:.:.stand what I mean? _ ,_...
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Q. · Yeah. And did you go up there with CLAY BERTEAND?_
A. CLAY BE~TRZU>rD,
yes. We went in a little efficiency ... i!j_
· ~as a · little efficiency· apartment. I had been there
· before with GENE DAVIS, of course •
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Q. · . Alright, now, . did you ever see him after · that?
A. Uh, I seen him, uh ••• Yes,- I · saw him two more times when
. we went to GENE DAVIS I . apartment; I . saw him on MR. BOONE I 'i
boat; and then he entered my apartnent one night by ·

mistake. But that would take . just a little explaining to
explain ·· that.
Q. Alright, you saw him twice more at DAVIS' apartment •• ~-
A. Now, sir, at · the Masquerade and we went · to DAVJS .'

apartment. We always met at the Masquerade to have a .
drink -- I - don 1 t even think he drank I don 1 t
remember-- but then we went to GENE'S, GENE DAVIS' l i t t l
apartment.
Q. You think · he did not d_f._:i~k? . . ..

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A~ I can i t rememi)er whether he drank beer:-:or what.·: I know

GENE DAVIS was a lush, a lush. ·. He drank some~ · you know
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Q. You met him on BOONE'S boat, you said?
A. On a guy Matter of fact, GENE

DAVIS is to BILL BOONE.
Q. l~1at kind of boat was it? Do you. recall? ·
A. All I recall is it was a big boat. It was big, you know

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Eor a bc:iat, but I . ••• it was big to me i t wasn't uh

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I think GENE said it was 80 feet.
Q. . It \vas a yacht then • .
A. . Oh, it was a seagoirg yacht, "' . It t::;. co~ld go, you know,
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can go7 .:;'(- •• - h_,~·u>--' / .
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Q. What did . BILL BOONE do?
A. :
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Q~ · · . Alright. :
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A. He never .did telL me·. •·. I · never ••• .; ''"'
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Q. You -knew BOONE, though~ . I
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A. . \'Thy, yes, I know MR ~ BOONE • .

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Q. Alright, can ou describe to me the man you

---"kne\17 as CP~Y BEBTB~ND How was he? You're 6 '1"?
. <How tall are you?,.
. A. Well, he was not .quite as tall as
Q. Wait just a minute • .How tall are you?
A. 6 ab~6', 6'~":~
Q. ·. Alright, and then how tall was he in relation to you?
A. .He was ••• he was, uh ••• · Well, .actually- he was about my

size, only he was, you know, he wasn't skinny. -
Q. Yes, · but this motion (flapping elbows) doesn't translate
A. Oh, well.
Q. He was about your height?
A. About my · size, about my height and he was built like a

weightlifter. You know what I mean?
Q. I understand.
A. While I've got a little old pidgeon chest, he's got, you
know what I mean.
Q. What color eyes did he have?
A. Oh, my god. I'm sorry, but I reallydon't .remember that
. Q •. ::~~" ~l~ight, - how did he, _ ~~ar his ·· hair;_ h(")w JM~ '? Hi t · cJjt?
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A. Uh, like yours.
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·I o. - o n the tape, we have to have that.
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!I A. _yrell, a bnshy crf;n.rcnt.
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Q.
A• .
A bushy crewcut. alright
Greyish-brown, greyish-reddish-brown
What coJo~ hair ajd he have?
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Q. Alright, did he ever wear glasses during the times you
s a w him?
.A • . I Gouldn't say one way or another on that •
Q. About bow . much do you think he weighed?
A. About 180 pounds, 185.

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Q~ __ \~mt.'s ':'• the ;i, longest. time :you were >with him, . I mean .in
·.:-..:· cl~se reiatic))i~hip like we're · sitting here now
<'-~ might . at:~ a
bar?··· · :.- -~:- .:· ,-;;J.i-:~-. :, . ~ .. :· · -- · ... -
·A •. .~-~:· 11.":~:\:;;~i::~;ever hung~- - ~ ~~u~-d the Masquerade .much.· ·we '--:j us

·. had one.:_drink or two and then split, you understand?
I '11 say ·::about a period of about three hours.
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Q. .,. . · : ·.· AboutH. three.hours. · Alright, you say you met him for
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sexual .pu:r:poses. d ·j d he pay you for this..?
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A •. $20.00.
Q. . He payed you $20.00.
A. Each time, agreement, he just •• ~ Gene

. ' ust told don 1 t c unt ·on him · :.·
for nothing 9
Q. What .dld the :- ~ex~al practices ' consi~t of~ would you mind
describing them forme, to help in our effort to
. · identify the .man? · · ": · - ~ . -·- · ·· -· ;. ·- ··
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A. _Well. aCtually .iJ::·makes no difference to me, cause it's·

no secret with me. r 'm down here on an · homosexual
.Qffense so it's I=lO s;ecret ·with me, To him maybe i t
might he Well , I don't know the terms to use, legal
.terms, but he -just, he £--ked me, you see.
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Q. Alright • .· It was anal intercourse then.
.A. Anal intercourse, yeah, that's the legal term •

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Q. Now did i t consist of anything else?
A. Well he, he alsways ••• as I remember i t ••• that was jus

about it. Well, he wa s n't exactly the butchest thing
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· in -_· th~:· world, you- ·~·)<;n<;:>w .. - He -_was, he ¥was __ hoTno~e~uaJ-, _____': a_ · -
by that -I ··mean,yo~ know. - .. -~-::~·f·:_ -.-
Q. d ';) ~;}i9U mean·-by the butchest · thing ·. in .the worl~--;~·:,~-\~:··,· -'· . ..
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A. :-·: Well he -gets yp in· it, - you know. '_ : Do_you .understand what ·
I mean?
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Q. Yeah. _Okay,· .now then, in his . conversatioiu,;- with you did

he ever disclose anything that would lead you to believe
wha t type of work .he was -engaged in?
A. No.
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Q •. .1\.nything about his personaL life?
A. No, you mean where he ·lived? He told me he lived with

his mother. That's why we went to GENE DAVIS' place.
Arid that's a natural thing. People live .with their
mothers. Or maybe they're_even married and have a wife.
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What · ki~d: -of. voice did : he have? · Was i t -llke mine, or ·-
. · · yours•- or Mr. : Mar tin's, was he harsh 1n his speech?
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Q ~ - ~- . .I knowit',s been a long_ : time. ·
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A.- .:\:_-- - -Well, . I . .mean, ;~ he never · said "heard" or "Knowed" or : -"dis" . -~
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Q.· He spoke : ~ood ~nglish?
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A. He spoke good english.·
Q. Maybe :we can help, rather than-sayhe had a voice like

yours . or mine, did he have a high voice or- a low voice? "-'-·
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A •. · Jie wasn I t · ·o~e . of them "Hi; dar lin II (in feminine voice)
typeof homosexuals, if that's what .T
~s a. John. If you'd meet him
snap ..... You -could f ·
say he's a homosexual, he's not one of those, you know

what I mean, limp wrists. He's a · butch. /
Q .. was he a cultured he a working . man, is th_§_

what
type of economic life a _man talks.
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Th__at' s wba t .l 'm after. •;
A.:. Oh well, . I'd
like a slob. He rna~ dress nice now that he has that bar
qnd got a 1 i ttle money hut back then he dres~like a
w - - : . .:.•_.,, -q : _;s.lol) :.__: ~-_Ac_tually~·-- ._ he .: ~~~ :;a slqp.:~~ ~No_ t:,_·· tb-o_f=:~} YJ=l ~-· got_.--~"'~ -. : ':~: ~<·:~-::
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- ·-
. anyth{ng again-st "J:iim.--·:;. _--:..... :_ ' . _; / -.' : ·.
' ·, ··<'- -;~~;.~~·:,.,::,, · ., ··:': :,(_,~,~,~·;._ '" - ··--;;.':.;>j /;~-~)}i.-;.1~- --~- ~; -"~ ·,,·,~:;~1?.{;_&.\~::
·~~~~ ;',C}~i~~$, ' ·. . · :o~ii,~l::·~tf,~;~.:~cg;{<t:$~t~&fc~';~~;~~1;~)! ,~;;~

~· '
NW 12640
' ·"' -.~ . '· .
·. ···. · :
, .I
Q. I've never seen GENE DAVIS Would you describe him to
me? HON. t6lll '~dOUl€1 yotl :;;sy GENE DAVIS is?
9
•
i
A. Well he's shorter than I am. definitely short~-~
n
-· How much shorter?
A. Oh, not a great deal. He's not a short man but he's not
a tall man either. He might be grey headed now but he
had coal black hair then and he's a black headed person,
with black eyebrows, and black eyes and he . was kind of
hairy, on his arms.
Q. .. t·Jell, how tall would you say he is, is he 5'5".or 5'10"?
A. WelL he's about 5'8~" or 9" or 10" • . Not no midget.
Q. How much would he weigh? _

~ G-IENii'- Dfr"'tJ)
teeth. · (~ . . ·. ~
' ' I
A. He had false ..
, -.·:
~--
-~
. . j·~~~~---
Q .• He had atthat . time false teeth. I-E he had Uw:m then~ he _'
ff.iS ot to have them now. You don't grow 'em a ain.. I
__guess I just might as well go and get mj ne 9 Alright he
· l:LC!_d false teeth, he's ahou t 5 'a!:," or 5 '9" and how much
dl' d h e we1g
. h? ·
: ''-~
-------------L ·; · :·
-
I'm not to good at guessing weights? I'll say as best

I can, I'd say he weighed about 160 pounds.
Q .. •- About 160?'
A. He wasn't exactly fat. He had a little pouch.
Q. ..._N~o::.w::_;..h:.::e::.__J~·-n:..:...:::t:.:r:.:o:.:d:.:u==c-=e~d=---=yLo:::.u-=-...:t:.::o:__..::th::·.::i:.::s:_·..:.m:.::'a::.n::_~a:.:s:..._:C::::L:::::A::..:.=Y:.__:B~E""'R"""""'TRA-"'=;.::.ND=-==i::.:n::_
the bar?
A. In the Masquerade Bar.
Q. The Masquerade Bar. Did BERTRAND wear a hat? .
. A. No. never have I seen the man with a hat on. Never ..
-I don't know 1t he wears one now, but I've never seen
one.
Now do you remeber what you drank? At the · first meeting.

I'm not talking about the subsequent meetings but the
first time you met the guy in the Masquerade Bar when
GENE DAVIS introduced you ---
A. What did I drink?
Q. Yes.
A. I know what I drank. If they were buying, I drank a

stinger. If someone else is buying, I'm going to drink
a mixed drink.
Q. Now it's your memory we're trying and not your drinking
habits. We're trying to see what you can defil,l.itely
recall without any question in your mind.
~ :- -~ · . ·. ·-·.- ___ ., __ . .... -. --· -· . ,. . ~
-7-
-- .'
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• . •.
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-
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:. •:: ~. ~ ~: l. ·'~-...,. ..
; .··
,. A. I can't · recall what the name ef -th~- a:nJ~e .:~-f the drinks.
- we re but · I kn.mv
And I
wasn't about to go to his pocket.
Q. ---1'he first time you met bjm Ivas EER!I'RAND wearing a suit,
ol.7 -was he wearing s 1 a ck s 'or ·IAzh at?
A. He was wearing a snit everytime I met him.

-------
Q. _§_yerytime you met him he ·wore a suit.
A. Well maybe sometimes he was wearing a sport coat but he

a-lvvays had on a jacket. ·· · · . . .. ·:··
:' • ··. . ..·.. ..
Q. · To get .· away from this a . little . bit, we .' l l :: come .-back ·to .-
i t later I would you telL me ab~u t the 'p e r.iod of time :- you . ··>~: .
A• . .•··. :::e:•. :i::a::::: :n;~:~J~!~~~~,}~t0~~~~~~"f~~~c:~J~[;t~:;;£ ~1t~

::t:::~ yo: ~t+'~};tf&~~'? .
• ~ l ·.
Q. with
. ::· .·- · ..__ · · :-~:2~~-:~..~~~~~t~w-~~~-.i~.~: ~- .. .·. ·
A • .· -I was _wit:h a "' salesman/ _·f rom the : company~ _I was w~-rking ': for
but he'sstrictly · straight, don't :. know;_none of_: these ······
·· .-...people~ --\VJust .- as :-~ old wino~~ .. ~ His -. name -- is - WALTER s ·• . SMITH. ,- '
The p~lice·:·. liked· to have :bea:t .h1m to d~ath_ whe~ he told ·
·-.··
. - ·>-._them that;: ·,'in :Beaumont. c;:;: They ·had ~eon an alias · and they
. J <got · him and they asked him what's your name· and ·. he said
-· ·· SMITH and -~ they like - to beat him t~ death but· that was - ·.: ·,
. . . his name, Smith.. '· ' · :::; ,. ..
. 'V\~~:: ·- ..· ,(
o#, ••
· Where _were you caught? _, .

o~... •·.. . -· ....::' :- t:" .
;~J
... ••
. . . .
•
.·
~. :-~.- .
. I was · apprehended in · Beat1mont, · Texas. :· . ,_

·:· .: ·- ._: -'. ';-·;. .
Q. . No, I mean, where were you '•'in ·a motel room, a car ·o·r .
where ·were .- yOu? . , _· -.· ··.--. - ~ . .
•. • •• . ·:· · · ,. '" • •• . •• • • • •• to • • . . :· .
~ .
- ...: .. . ,, . , _; - •. ·.·.. ' ··.. ·.· :.... .
No; I·was - out in the woods;.
•, -:'--·· ....•. .
-- . ·. ~ .. .. . .
Alright~··;:: : And · you didn ~ .t '}(now :anyone .· around Beaumont?
... -··:...... - .. .·. . ~ -· ·:,~.::-. ::::~.-- :_
__
A. Not a ·soul.- . Well I went _: there . to work for a company~

Allied Continental - Automobile :.Association, '<··l232 Baronne
street · in New Orleans and . 808 Orleans Street.in -Beaumont.
But I believe they closed : their Beaumont o~fice · down • . I
wouldn '. t know about · their - oi:her. . -
.. . ,· ~-
. . . .. .
Q. Did someone in New Orleans reconrrnend you to Beaumont _for
thatjob? .
A. I was sent out there purposely to go to work there. You

know to run their sales up. _ I'm a pretty good salesman •
Q. . Who sent you there? _
A. Well, TRO! HEIDELBERG, the .manager of the New Orleans

office, and LOUIS RO.l'!fANO ;· the · owner · in the Houston - office
at 1803 Pea·se · street: in'<HoustC>~- :~::.:::_c ~~:-~. -::,_ , __ __
o.
:nw 12640 Doc d:59168006 Page - 11

A.
•
Oh, no, . no. Those · two parts of my life were entirely
s eparate. This was in 1960 I'm talking about; I ~as
t a lking about 1959 just a minute ago. Those two parts O ·
my life are entirely separate. TRO:Y HEIDELBERG is
ma rried and has four children, is a Mason, cne of those
t_}l pe of people. . I worked for the man. Oh I might have
<JOne next door with him and drank a bottle of beer at
iu.nchtime. He knew I was homosexual.
Q. Hovv long did you work for that company?
A. About eight months.
Q. IIa d you known HEIDELBERG be fore?
A• . I never saw him before I walked in the office.. I

answered an ad in the paper. That's the reason I walked
in.
Q. Alright, can you tell us anyone ·else in New Orleans in

1958 who might have been introduced to CLAY BERTRAND
as CLAY BERTRAND? , . . .
·::..._ .
. .. ., .
A. Well, I . could tell you a gang ' of " people~ I don't know
v1he rEl you ' d hunt them up ..
Q. well, I say who might have been. Do you know_ anybody

who did know him as CLAY BERTRAND other than GENE DAVIS?
A. . BILL BOONE.
Q. .. . ~ I LL BOONE, the owner of the yacht~
A. Yeah. : ··- - ~~- ._...,

.·-·· -
Q. Do
: \ -.
A. It was out by the My-0-M

of it nut 1t was by the My-0-My.
Q. It was the yacht club next to the My-0-My?
A. Yes, it was - right over from then~~
Q. Do you .remember anything . about the bartender at the

Hasquerade Bar? _Do you know who he was?
A. CHRIS GOODYEAR, if I remember right.
Q. _91EIS GOODyEAR Did he know BERTRAND?
A. Now I found out later and this is getting ahead of

myself and I'm going to confuse myself and confuse you,
too, probably, but I ...fm;!,nd out later than BILL BOONE
owned that bar, I didn't know it then. But he owned it.
CHRIS GOODYEAR ran it for him.; But he sold out. That's
when they changed the name over from the Cove. You know
~ 1958, the summer of 1958, they got real ro~~
homosexuals in the New Orleans area, and dope people.
I'm not a dope person but, well, most of them got their
h a tboxes and headed for Miami. About that time BILL .
. -.· __ '"· ·:-~:: : · _]300~E • ~-- _,when" ~:J: got:~ b~cJ<, 't~e -,..V~~ _-1~-:~~·Qders:tood :'."hen _-_j · -_ :- ~-~~
· got back he sold it. But · at the t1me I met BILL BOONE . · 1
.
I didn't know that. The time I met BILL BOONE I had beeri ·
living Ai.~p,p:ew Orleans_:~r just a couple ~f :onths. ~ .• ·!:..
".JW!":~~,g!~~~~~~~~~~~~l!!l
M E M 0 R A N D U M
May 9, 1968

!I
II
I,'I RE: BARBARA REID interview of May 9, 1968
Jl
--.~---------------
BARBARA informed me that after she had further discussions with

GEORGE HIGGINBOTHAM, he came up with some additional facts. The
ti!:SRE meetings that \vere held at the Italian Hall were bugged by
M. A. GRZ\.HAM who was an investigator for the Sovereignty
Commission. HIGGINBOTHAM said that while attending an art show
at the Barony Art Gallery at 1405 St. Charles he wa~ told
(possibly by GEORGE SCHINDLER) that after OS~VALD passed out
leaflets in front of the International Trade Mart in August of
1963, his apartment was bugged by an investigator from the
Sovereignty Commission, namely M. A. GRAHAM.
q BARBARA says the Sovereignty Commission may still be in possessio

1:
of the tapes. GRABill~ now lives in Nolan, Louisiana, and may have
II some connection still in Baton Rouge.
I'
There were also meetings in 1963 by the NSRP at a place on the
I' corner of r..J:agazine and Penis ton which is in the general vicinity
of OSWALD's apartment.
II
I/ DAVID GRAYDOM who was a very close friend of WILL BRADY is in
'j
II town and willing to talk to us.
I!
li BILL CRAIS may be con.tacted at the Myna Crais Dress Shop, 1410
r! Beacon Street, Brookline, Massachusetts, a/c 617, 566-7737.
il
I!
Also BARBARA said that CAPTAIN MARTELLO of the New Orleans Police
II Department had several ....conl.'act_s_ wi.th·-,-OSWALD and also that she
I
may be able to get the log of the S/S MARION LYKES which was the
!L.)
ship that OSWALD left on op September 20, 1959.
I Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CLAY SHAW at

the Kennedy speech at the Nashville Street wharf.
Attached is a partial list of the INCA members in 1963.
NW 12640 Doc~d:59168006 Page 13

·.::-___ .. .:. .: - - -~ -- -'- - - ··
• •••
·...·. :; .. -- .'\. = ·-~ ..o....;~=-
·._
-- ~-
.·. .
.:. .:- : •• .:.·• •
--
- - ,- -. i .
. .· .· ·
··-· ·-- ~-- --- -
.-·- . - -
M E M 0 R A N D U M
---------- . --·- ·- ·------- - ---------------- ------------- - ------ -- ---- -~
,:·_
--- ------ - ----- - ----- - -- -- -
Hay 9, 1968
. . --- .. ----- --- ------ . ·: -. ::.:- ;···:_ ........ ::-.·-: --- · -·-:-_--: ·· :-.-- ~ ····; -=-·-.:--· .•..:.-:. -·- -·-···-· _: _____ . ------- --- ---- - --- - . ---- .:-- - -::·
/
.... -· -;-- -- --- -- - ----- --- ---- -- --- --
~ •' .
TO: JJ)l GARRISON, District Attorney

·-·· . .. ' .. __ .... ....
'-
FROM: - ··- ANbRE\v J. SCIAMBRA, Assistant District _Attorney ____ ~ ------
;E~:· '-~ - ~~~~· · ~~~~~· . ·:0-~~r ~i~~;~ ~f M-~ c'J','c]_96iJ/:~!'"~/'"7'~~ .• =···

···-. -·-:-··--···-······ ·--;.. ----- ...:~~:
... ... :~ ....t.-~-- -: :.-.·... .•.
'_/
--------------------------~--------------------------------------
. ~'
---::.:_____ __ H-~E_Q_RG_~_JJIGGINBOTHAH, he came up with some additional facts. The
NSRP :mee-tin~~~- that- -were he lcf-at--Ene -·:n:alT2innalrwer~-bugged ---by--- -· ----
' . - - - -
- .. _ . _ M. AJ GRAHAM who was an investigator for the Sovereignty . ·_
~-----~--- · _:-_· ----,Commis_;;_iPD • _____j:liG_(;):NBOTa:Ar1 said th-a t while· attending .a n art show
--~- ,- -·_, __:__~_:_,:.:. at the Barony Art G~-liery --at -1405- st~---ch-arTe's"" fie" -was ~--told--------
·· :_______ _ : .: _:_ ___: __
- ~·:..,:;. . __ _.:..:.'...':__ _ :_(,possibly by _GEORGE SCHINDLER)' .that after OSWALD passed out - . .. .
_ ~- ---- -~-"-;' ,-- -",- ·- leaflets in front of the___l:nterna-t{oriar · Trade-- Mart in August of
1963 i his apartment was bugged by an investigator from the
Sovereignty Commission, namely M. A. GRAHAM •
.. -- __ .:_ ... -· . -
. ;..:.:. :·- - --- --.. ~- BARBARA says the Sovereignty Commission may st{ll-be in possessio
of the tapes. GRAHAM now -lives in Nolan, _Louisiana-; ·· and may have
some'connection still in Baton Rouge.
-. ..- -----
._, ---
-. .. . __There were also _meetings in 1963 by· the ·- NSRP at a place on the
corner of Magazine . and Penis to·n--which is in· the -_-general vicinity .
of OSWALD's a par tmen t. __ __ __ _ __
-_ ... . .
..:)
. . . -
·· -· ·--- ·.· ·- ~c- ., ·••'••
DAVID GRAYDOM whowas a very ·close friend of WILL BRADY is in
-~~ · :.
6--- ---- - - - -- - - - ... -... town and willing to talk to us. _ _-
-·- - ---- - --- - ·-- - ----------- ------ .----·--·::'-'---------'- ----;---------- -- --------- - --- ------ -- --- --
-----· ··· ·- -· -· ·· - -----. - --
--- -----~---- --
.. --- -·- · .: ...:... .. ·----,
- -BILL CRAIS may be contacted at the Myna Crais Dress Shop, 1410 .
.·· · ·--. Beacon Street, Brookline, Massachus~tts, a/c 617, 566-7737 .
_ _ _ _ ,.._ --
--- ---- --- -- - - Also BARBARA said that CAPTAIN MARTELLO of .the New Orleans Police
-Department had several contact~· wi-th OSWALD and also that· she.
.· .·. -'
- : .. .
: ..~· -:·-------· -..:.:... .:. ____ ---··-
., _.
·,
..
.. ...
-~-
·. : .. , ;:.,: · ·: · '
s"hip- that· OSWALD - left on on September 20, 1959~ - -· ----- c- - - - - - - - , .
.·. :····
···... .:. iI
.. ~ .. -~ .. -:· . Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CL~Y SHAW at
the Kennedy speech at the Nashville Street wharf. \ - ~.
-Attached is a partial list of the INCA members in 1963 .

. ·· .· .. ..... -- ---- -· .. . .. ·.. ..· . .. _, ,• .. .. ..
. -- ."-: ·· -:-··. ·-- ------- · :_, .. . ,_
. -:-.--:.-.:. , _-
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- :· . ·. ,,._.. ··.:- -·:.:-.--....· ..-;·. ··....

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. ____. ..... .
. _........ .
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: . . . .:;..... -·> :" :.- -}-
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..... '
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I
i
.!
i
:nw 1264Q Doc d:59168006 Page 14 ... - . . .
7(
1<a • Stti-IAV (.,-Prr"JII.Il.ltl'l C.IVoJIIPI\o f .

·· - A.a~-=-~...,..,~.r ,.Ilk-)
.rHA "..J : { - _,, 1Jifl(iMNI1 '~
§fLi."\l•l' ~-PLIGHT 'l'O Cl\NA DA \'liTH FERRIE: ;;;;?7 ()fA"'~ f-l. - 1'\.t.. w•c-lrT}
~
The man whosi name we first thought to be WHITE

apparently is WIGHT, Vice President. of Freeport
Sulphur who reptitedly made.the fli ht. Currently
ane-' ·orL lS eing made to locate lHGI-IT I \•lho now
iiv i:; s in New York, by a contact of Mark Lane's.
!2.~:s pite the fact that the oricrip a l snnyce of this
.i-E_for rna tion >·las JULES RICCO KH'l.B LE a man with a .
,£_~cord, this lead k ee ps grmving stronger. From
the ver outset it h a l eoorted thct the fli ht
had something to do with the import of 1ickle
-following the loss of the· original import supply
-~rom Cuba. Recent · information developed on
tVIGHT in a separate memo, indicates that he is nmv
on the Board of Directors, of the fieBPort Nic~
~,_a subsidiary of Freeport Sulphur~ (The
separate file on this is a rather detailed report
£r6m Placquemine Parish and should be included in
the new. SHAW file.
would appe ·.s willing

down from Cl and have him
leads for us his regard.
9) TAXI CAB DRIVER:
Went out of his way one night to drive by FERRIE'S

house and told the passenger that he had taken S~ffil~
to that a4dress on many occasions. I have more
details on this coming in and will dictate a separate
memo for the file on this taxi cab driver. I am
including it ln this listing in order to insure
follow-up.
10) "BewrR.Z\ND LIBIU\RY c.!\RD" :
It will be recalled that some tin~e ago l.ibr~..Y....,

emnlo ees -~..,hile going thm ugh their records came I
~~ a library c a re. ma e out to CLEN O£. CLl\Y _

BERTHAND of the "IntetnationaJ Trade !vlart". l'le
~
discounted thj c; l ,._, a cl a~; l1cinq n egative becr-1use the
_phor~::nber turned ou. t to hav e no mean ing hov;eve r
. entlrely
.
- I
------
j::JJi s l,p ;~ cl. may_ deserve re-exar=li :Bt ion.: J..t. lS
-·-· ~::_ :!· ' _:::·. - ··- · · . .:::::.__ _.--:...:·..::.-::-:-. ·-:--.. ·- ... - ..... .. ~ ~ - ":·- ~-:::·=-.:.· · · . ..::·: ~~::: ··----~ -. -:: · . __ _ ._ _:_
··:._·--:
.. . ·-·· . .. . .
.- ·, .; -·
-·· 3--
. :,
! -' ~ ·-~ ·:
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 15
·...;._ .....
.·
.. .,. ,I -
nossible that this librar_y, as well as others, \·Tere

( ~1sed ~s meeting plc,0es by SHJ:\l'l and other individ~s.
The Slqnature apnears to be ln SHAH'S handw£i.t~- ~
l~hermore, this card was not- thrust upon us but
came to us through an official on the Library Board
who had been informed about its discovery by a
iibrary employee. We may have here~ situation
--
flarallel to that in \·.rhich SI-IAv'T signed his name CLAY
BE:RTRAND at the V.I. P. Room. ·.In the latter instance
(
~~e- st1:ong _possibilit~ exis~s that he was the.re on
· that occaslon for an lntelllgence contact. I suggest
tlli! t we keep our minds open to the possibility of ·
the _libraries having been used in the same way. .
NOTE: Wherever pre-existing memos or information

can be located concerning the above leads,
it_ is suggested that they be located and
placed in our new jackets for SHAW LEADS.
JIM GARRISON
~-
-·: ..... ··- -...

.. ·· .. -----.---·:···__.
..
-4-
·r ":.· . _?.· ~ ..;·

NW 12640 DoC!.I.d: 59.168006 Page 16 . ~ :·.:...:·:-.··.
:;.. -- ·_.; __ .
•
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.:
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~ ~
\• .. - . . .
~
. . ..
ll .. ~·
i· .
' : '. .
'I . .·, . . .
. -;:_
·. I
' I lived in ·New Orlean~ for a· total of aboub~. three months
··· '
and by . the time I got... to living there, well BILL BOONE

II was kind of wellknown around ••• some homosexuals know ·
him and the time I met . him I didn't know him from Adam's
housecat, the first time .I was introduced to him, if
you understand what I mean.
Q.
A. v•Tel:l, this guy I lived with, ·. namedC::TER I·;ILSON.
Q. ( t'iALTER
-----
,,.,.,...-__.... ...
'·-------
A. Yeah.
. .,
Q. Well, what did he do, = where can.· we find him?
.:.. '
. -·~-- --~ ~
A• . ' Well, I lived with · hl.~ · for quite a while~ : -·.::]:·· know he .· ··.;.·:
Q.
::::=::::: sooNE because he .runs .a· bn;Erf~~,f~tf~~·.r.:_.(•f~.:-~ _.·:\!~.:_i'.• ~.·~,.~ . .'.'
. i_." ..•·_::,.•:..•
·. ~. ~·;·~~;:.r ?·:f-_ ,~·:; :; :-~~: ...

·A. ·A bridge ~lub~ '.·· .. ':.- .~:- .. ·.. - ~ ; . ' ._ . _;• ~- .
!~ •• • ~ . • - : . -~--
.. . : .... . . ..:'. i
Q. . ' 'l'he cardgame Bridge? -;'·~<:..: .
A. . . Yes, at 117 University·Place • . BILL BOONE Has been up .·

· there to play bridge and he kne.w him through bridge • . ·..
playing. And he might know GENE DAVIS just very
casually, very casually. · But._ I. don • t know.. if he • s . ever
· · met this other guy. ... . . .. · . . ·.'. ·. . .. >--:>"'i·· . -·
.
:. ;. ·
,..:,.
..
·-- ..
I
Q. Before we get too far off tre < subject of BILL . BOONE,do ·
· you know, I . want to make · sure we 're pronouncing and . · ~;
· spelling. that right~ · do ·you .know how to spell it?
· .-.-.·: \
A. Like Daniel Boone. .. -~ .
.··
Q. Li~e Daniel Boone.
A. B-0-0-N-E. . ... .
Q. · ~t can you tell us some more names of any homo- ·

· sexuals · that you knew in New Orleans?
,_··
A. . AMOS McFARLAN, CANDY LEE . I . don 1 t know where . CANDY~

_at right now. CANDY knew them an, CANDY knew GENE,
- GENE DAVIS. I don't know if she knew this other one.
.
Q. What did she do, · was she · a stripoer or wbat? ~·
A. She worked at the back bar at Tony Basina's, CANDY LEE.

v
Q. Do you know if she knew CLAY BERTRAND? · __.
A.
Q.
-.
No, I'd have no way of knowing whether she knew him.
But she .knew DAVIS?
.. Oh,-- yeah. I'm sure .- -~··· And there's .th9, t big ·f:a t- -gal .,_t:hat ·
J?. ·:. ... . -
.• · -J:.:.. ; ·:·· "
· ::·< :~s~d ·to r~~ arol.md .. the - bar--~ everybody called ·h.e'r · WANDA. :
I • ve seen BILL BOONE in there talking to her. · So I know
she knON s BILL·. ·~· J · ' • • ••
· ..... _.'":_"
-10- - . .• . - ·. t;.;..... .··; ·; _.: ~:-~
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NW 12640 Page 11
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Q. Where is Wanda's Bar?
A. On Iberville betwem Royal and Bourbon, I don It knmv the

exact address, right next door to . that garage where you
c:an park · and the de par tmen t store.
Q. ·Exactly w~ere?
A. On Iberville between Royal and Bourbon.
Q. Okay, did you know DAVID FERRIE?
A. t don't recognize the name.
Q. Q!.d you ever know LEE HARVEY OSWAI.D?
A.
living jn by mist 0 kp and this guy looked

.:1 , ,. , ,
· .. :.an Dallas wh o s h ot OSWALD, RUBY He 3.11a s a uapper __ _
Q].e man. They came by my apartment by mistake
. ';,.,
~ ,,
Q• . _How could they do that by mistake?
•· ·; ~ :· .
A. lvell, I sure hate · t ·o involve ole WALTER WILSON in any

<g_f this because · he was· tbe guy I 1 i ~e__d with · you know and
.· bo ran the bridge club. · You all can verify this _with
· .· him if he • s still in New Orleans. I don • t know you see,
I've been locked up in this · place going on .seven years.
~ILL BOONE owned some property on the corner of st~
~ter and Dauphine • . Being from New Orleans you probably
know the place. It J:cE four apartments in it. But
aithough he owns the place, he doesn't manage it. On
the corner of Bourbon and St. Peter there's a Chinese
"lady and don It ask me her name. I couldn It . remember i t
and she manages this property. _Now me and WALTER WILSON
we went. to Miami some:fi:ime in July 1958 and we came back ··
in September sometime and this is when I met MR.·· BOONE
on the boat. Now this is sometime in September' of 1960 •
. Nea.nwhile I had lived in Miami, Atlanta and Nacon,
Georgia. Now me and MR. WILSON are back in New Orleans
and we · rent an apartment from MR. BOONE, the'chinese
lady; · but it is MR. BOONE'S apartment. Gave the Chinese
lady the rent. After we were living · there for about.~-~
this guy EDDIE who works for MR. BOONE came by there and
. said hello, you· know. He wanted to borrow some bedsheet
from me. And I said sure and I loaned hici · a bedspread,
some sheets and pillowslips and he brought them back a
couple of days later; they were laundered real nice and
he said thank you and I said thank you • . But there were
a lot . of comings and goings in the other apartment but
I didn't know what was going on, I didn't pay it no mind
But I thought they were going in there tricking, having r .
·sex. I seen EDDIE going .in their with the kids hustlinlg .
I figured that one time. But there was all kinds of ·
people going in that place. · So I lived in that one .
apartment for one mon~h. ~e]l . ~happened to be going~ ~
past there au ---'~..1. I saw EDDIE J.nr-et ere cleanJ.ng
· r·-=
up an d d o · n I
things and I looked in there and it was a .much nicer
apartment and I said why don't you let me rent this
. apartment. EbD:tE said I don't see why_ npt • .It~? not_s9
. .. riiuch. it WaS nicer :{: jusr llf('e d .:i·t : there::.- ·rt . was Cone . ·' ·. .
1
big room. My · rent \vas up .in .two· or three days so I aske~

WT about it and he said it's only $10.00 more so go ahea •
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Page 18 · -11- .- ·.. . ~ ·_,.::•:'§~!.._ .~f' •'1:·~,\~~
NW 12640 ,:
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HT?
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h .. i A• . HALTER THOJYlAS WILSON. He won: 1 t give· you his name,. just

a couple of initials. So I got my stuff and moved over
\
I to the other apartment. _I hadn't been there over a _
night or two when here · comes this quy BERTRAND just \.;,alk!
I in, he had a key. He said well what are you do:ing over I
-...~re. And' I said well how are you. what are you doing 1:
here? And I was surprised to see him because I ha 1
1me but I still knew
·-····-~~;;..;~~:.;:.~~-.::·:.;.A:;n;d;;h;;e~s:.;a;.:l~·d:_;:-~w:;.h~a~t:7::;a~r-:e=-:-~~-?:::'~~~=..r_
you wa1 o rneet BI And I said no
}~ie said you live with BILL? And I said no I moved in
tLere. He walked out. He had a man wit'rJflim.
Q. Who do you mean by BILL?

:;: l
A. BILL BOONE .. When he · said do -you live with BILL well· he ..

thought I had, well.~. y~u . all work' ~. -with • the D.A.'s
office, you ·know how i t is with homosexuals. < Evidently, >·
if. you're investigating this you're ~ealing.with GENE - :.'; ~- ~--

<I-- .and them • . He _ thought. :them . I split.. up with"',WT ··and had .·_··:
.;
. ··· . moved .in with B~LL BOONE. , .;~1~1€!\;:gpt.:·fr~~~~~~;f ~5'
Q. Now can you : describe · the :·man ·. he ·had with him? :; :.~~;? ·.: . ~:·_. ~ ::,~ ·. ·;· ·
.· .~ . r . .. . . :i ' ;·,::'.·:.8f.·. . . ~-::..
A. Just a dapper lil'ole·:·man.. _..... ;: ··· :- ·.
·' "
Q .. . A what lil'ole man? . ..- .

:i
_
...
A• . A dapper. •.: .- ., .....
Q .. Was he wearing -a hat?

',':
A .. ·... _; . ¥.eah, he was .. . One of _. t...l-iose straw hats with ·

bill on it. .. ~:
Q .. Short band?
,... ..·
A. No.
Q. Short crown?
. ·.\
A. Short crown ..
·•, •, I
:.;; .
Q. About how tall was he? ~ -
,.__ ·~ ~
..... ~-
.. ·
A •. There we go agai~. What I call short. . · ~ ~ -;-
Q. How short?
.· '.
A. Oh, I'd say about 5'6" or 5'6~"~ About this man's size
her, but a little bit paunchier • . (Indicating BILL MARTIN
A lot older than you.. I
; ; _ 1":
I
Q. He's older than I am and he Is my height • .. What age would

you say he is?
A .. About WT'S age. But that don't strike up nothing-..
Q. Give us close as you can to how old you think he was?
... ...
.... ' . . ~.. . .... ( .
.. :~·
- • -11.-
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~ ·. ,: .
.· ..·_,
.. .·
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II A.
i!
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About 45 ..
I
I
II Q. Did he keep his hat on the whole time he was· there?
I A. Hewas only there abcut three minutes ..

I 1,.,
Q. Was he wearing glasses?
A. No, he wasn't.
Q. . And he weighed a little more than Mr. Mar tin?
A. He was heavier~ .. ~ .
Q.. We ought to have the record show that I'm 5'8~" (wm·..
. Martin) and also he said he was about my height and
weight_.except he had a. hat· on.·
._ .·
-· . ...···
A. You haven't·'·.. got any hat on.
~ ·"- ..
Q. _How 'much do you weigh?·· . '··.
· '. . .._,
.... .,._
,. ·About. 170 (Mr. Martin).
'' " -~~-
I'·guess I •m: pretty good. at 'guessing ~eights

.. ., . ,
.. · .,
. ·'\.
-- This man with a hat w~s::he wearing _a suit? >,

.. ...
~-
·,· ...
1Tice :looking fello~ .. -- A reaj. nice dresser and wh~n ·I·

say dapper, I mean dapper.. He vv.as all dressed up,
_you know ...... suit .. _He was wearing a black suit.'
-·--·>:.
' _.,_ ·....
Q. Alright, how was BERTRAND dressed?. I
;_ . ~ ' -..... ··
A. Suit .. :
Was it a'light or·dark suit BERTRAND was wearing?
It's funny.. I can remember.what suit this other guy ha,

on but can't remember- that, but I'll be honest with you,
I just don't know what this man was wearing.. Everytime
I ever seen CLAY BERTRAND be's been p~tty nicely fixedLf
~, dressed up in a suit.. Everytime I ever saw G~N&_ . I
DAVIS, Qe was dressed like a b~ ·
-- ·,.. ._- ... --·1
Q .. Did you ever spend any time around Dallas?
A .. Never been to Dallas ..

:..",_.
Q. You've never been to Dallas?

I.
A .. That's right ...
I Q. You'll can stay around here and talk for a while and
I'm going to go out and get some pictures ..
(Martin':to Boxley) very good. . You've got the whole set that I
sent you plus some others? .
Q .. (Boxley) Yes. Are you going to make notes for me?

''! · ...::- ::' <-
··A~ (Morris)~- ·· ~ -··YoU're· no·t- USed tO--thiS. h9at.--?·
Q. Uh?
':· · ·
·-··.
NW 12640 Page 20
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A. You're not used to. this heat • . I haven't been· in an air.

'• ! ·conditioned room going on seven years. I t don't phase·
·'i me.
I!
Q. Is that right.'
A. Yeh, it's bothering you.
Q. ~iave you stated here in this interview· when you came

·,here, what date i t was when you were first arrested?
A. I was arrested on Janua,ry 1, 1961.
Q. And have you.ever been free since then?

. - . .
. A. Yeh, ·I made. 'bond. But the· last free day I saw was .
•. February 6, · 1961. That was the _last.-free day ~·saw and
i t \vill probably be, the· last·-free.day I seE3 for, three
.. ·fo~r ~o~e\years •· ·. :·:·~. ·· · ..
.· · ~ay: :ow ~o get back to, . ther pei;t1~i~f~'t~iw; who

.... r:~.k~ew BERTRAND .',\:-:Now are '·y~u ~·pre tty well :~satisfied. with':::·.
·. your.·mennory::on·,:·tha t?<{".Do -·you know anyone 'in. New Orleans.
<:<~,vhb ··may·. have. ·known th:i."s ..man~ CLAY BERTRAND ·.·. ·' · ·· · ·
. -~ . •. <:·"i~K~::·:::_::o.::.;·: }:~:;;·;} \ :.;j\'' -~,";;,!:-fv:.::·-': ·. ·· ··"'/,'-.- · . -~ · · · - · -·-· · · · 1 ·. •
A. .·. No,.i.'Sii~.~--I· don't~

.. ; Now'•let: me. explain how this situation . ·..
goes ·The three •times_:'I,met.>him at. the~Masquerade Bar 1-
i t wa~·, ' GENE DAVIS took. me . all i~. three times,· -it was kind .
'of a_thingb~tw~en us~t'~nd·•;theriwe·went straight from . '
there}' to MR_: DAVIS 1 .• apa~tmerit,'~ GENE DAVIS, well ..
actually, it. was kind ·o·f~-~.very<private, you know what.·
I mean.'' It wasn • t like going -to a big party with 100
pt3ople ... there 2md CLAY BERTRAND was ther~ ~ · Now_ this guy
EDDIE who w9rked for· BILL BOONE. . • • '-.y:·,;
·,_.· ..· ( .. ,._. -·
. ...... ·-.--· . '.: ::.. . ;· ."':"_ ·•· ' ~ ' ··~
.; ·.:'.Now about EDDIE~ •• tell me something about hi~.

. .' ~- . :.,,,r .·' .. '· ;; ..
- . ·. ·-: .··.. · :_.,.·.
A._ Whenever he was in traduced · to:· you, . he was-- BILL .

flunky, and this is it. · · ·' . , __ . .. .~ •.
: :-'·
. : ..
~..·.- ... ·
Q. About BILL BOONE ••• ':'
. '_;.
~ : . :
... . .. ·..:·- ...
I I 11- te i 1 . you_ . who' .•;ne t, ;·BILL BOONE : iri't.~oduced -.• i:~--

me.· · I met.- •• ~~it doesri:•t have·anything_ to_do with this
.•-•• he -used to· come down-: every-year and visit with him~.·~ ..
Tennessee Williams. ···--
. ·-·~ .· .
Q ... TENNESSEE WILLIAMS .knew BILL BOONE? Visited him, was

intimat~ ~riends with him?
. '
A. They were intimatefrierids. They were in _1958 or 1959.
and '60. He was famous then, he's got a little more
famous now. That • s who showed up, TENNESSEE WILLIA.J.\118 •
. .. ~
Q. Did you ever run across, in all -the friends of BOONE,

BERTRAND's and SHAW's, did you_everrun across .a Latin·
American.· tall. spanisb___spa~t h~_s.poke._~ngli.Sh
y i t h a very heavy s.pan.is..h. accent. · · · --
A •. pow, · r J<irnte..._you all_ a li ttE3r ••• ah, evidently you all

gat, cause • 4_ but th?re was iil Cuban persor:1 on t:hat boad
i.!:L.S.e.ptember, i.n-la ee SBptem.bsr lii'hen I wont ·out th7l_E:='._ 1
and I v.1rote you ~out that.
---:"""
-· -~·
. I·
Q. . Yes. ·. ·. :·
IIII. . .
--~
• -:- < ~ ':;. •
•
·...:· .
·-· · .. .: . . ·.
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A. I know a Cuban cause I lived in Miami ••• Somehow I can-..
i!
ij
-- just tell thJa--differnee bet\•Taen a Cnhan and a r4ex-i.ca.Q.
I.
Q. _s;_~n you telLJ::h.e.....--£ferenee bet;woon a Cuban ~ a
Venezuelan or a Cuban and a
I
A. J}w, no. You might _haye me there. I
I Well, I just wanted to get that clear. Can.you describJ

.. --
--r.-J1Ts La tin A'Ile rica n for me? Prim~. riJ y, what v.zas his a.ge,
~Erroximately?
,'
A. was approximately 22. He was young. He wasn't ••• ·
r:£(':1
uh, I just figured i t_ was somebody BILL was ••• you know.
Q.; Uh huh.
A. You understand .what I · mean? ..·..
I Q. I understand • . · Are you . any relation to · a .· young man in

Baton Rouge . by _the name of PERRY RUSSO? <: . '
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:: ~
·· .. ::
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·::-,:
' '\-·
A. Who? . . • _'!
. ....
. . :(!"· · ,:·_
Q. RUSSO. < ·. ·! ...... :
A. Any relation? Any kiri? Why, no.

.. . . .
Q. ':l,he reason I ask is that · you look so damn much like 'him.
I've been noticing since you've been'.. talking. and though9
you might be a relation to_him and I didn't know ·anytfuing
about it.
A. Oh, no. The only kinfolk I got ~ in my mama. · My daddy __·

is still alive~ but he disappeared years ago. My mama,
two aunts and my grandpa. I haven It everi got any I
brothers, or sisters • . I'm the . only child and my mother's
the only child.
Q. Any cousins?
A. Well, I've got some real distant ones but they certainl~ ·
wouldn't be named RUSSO. I;'m the only disrespectful / one
in my family.
I didn't mean to impiliy or relate the name RUSSO with

disrespect.
A. Oh, no. ' There's nothing wrongwith the nameRUSSO but

I'm fron: ~Tennessee, and people up there, you know, ·I
it's a common name down there in Louisiana~ but in
Tennessee, I can't even say that I've even heard the
name.
Q. I see •••
A. Of course, it might ••• I think I read the name. in the

paper in the New Orleans bit. -· You see when I get a papJr
its two or three days old and it's all cut up and all.
Q~ Can you remember anyone else in the New Orleans area,

·~ ·- :- ~-. ..:.. ,_._ · aside from TENNES$EE WILLIAMS wh9 used .to knovv BOONE _?
., I
TI . . .
NW 126'4 0 · Do Id: 59.168006 Page 22
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CHRIS GOODYEAR worked forhim but CHRIS GOODYEAR left
town wheri BILL BOONE sold the Masquerade Bar. ,.
Do you know if BILL BOONE ever sold the apartment you werie
l~ving in?
A. I have no idea. He might have sold i t in 1960.
I o•.. J)Ci you know if he was a native New Orleanian. or ••• ?
,A..
I
____
He was
(~·J1iLL
.....____
coast..., · He lived on the West Co..il._st. ·
on the West Co..,?st.
Q. Hhat kind of work had he done, ·ir1vestments had he made- or~>

;...S'ome thing? ,I_,
., .... -,--;; ,~·'
; -.· ~;.: ... -.. :. .
. ·. ;·,.:·-: .....,
~--· .··'
A. It just·· never 1.ras discussed. He was just one· of those
• ~ind of 'guysr. I suppose~· Always wore a little whiJ:.e_
·sailor hat, a little white cap. yon know,·. <I 1 J J tell }lOU
something else· about him.\ He wears ·
Q •.• . •Ho~. _can' you _tell?
A.
Q.,....
. ... i.
A. "J_.
~": .:::-. :~·' . '-' .r· ,\" {"~ :-··. ~:. !~ .'.··l
.·.-:\..:.- .....• -.--.
Q.· ··Are.' they._obvi6us?.
·· .. ·.·.·· .·
If he Is at a distance,. he·-could get· by. But if. you

shake him down pretty good; you. can see ·:·them~._. ·
Q. What a'ge marl ·is _he?

,<:___ ~--
...)... ,. ... ·. .-·. __ \ ,.;_
. • •; . t' .
.•· .
•. -•·- ·- .......
A •... .Well at.·~the time I-krie~ hi~· he was _pretty close. to 60.
years.·old~ ·· .. ·...
·- •. ·...
.. .
Q. About 60;,; .. ·. '. ,:'
. . ,· '·c.
. ..
. :.
.
· .. -· .. ·
A. · He wasn 1 t no young man thE:m. ··:. ·
Q. Burned on his face and •• :·?

,··.
Well, his.forehead. It looks like he might have had a
little plastic surgery done on his face .due to the burn
and his head, he wears a toupee though-.
Q. A complete toupee? ·
..
. A. No, no, he might wear ~ complete one now .... He wore one
like that {indicating top of head). In other words, he 'sl
got a bald crown.
_Q.: In other;wor(ls, .. a bald.·croWn. ·.with a .friri._ge.

, , ······•···~ ..,,., , ,._., ····~-'~~-', . .,_._f~.;.... " ~--·-;· --·~-~--· ~" •• ~~~-~:._,, -~--~ . ' .... :.··c.··;;.--·-·c···
···\·
..
A. And he's- brown headed and he wears a brown toupee. ·-He ~s
.~ B·~~.m~.o~~~.'.~~.16B~~2.::2:. ~~~~~;.,~~:'e'·~,:~!~·=:':~2;;1!J~:.~~~~~~~~L
1
~ -·
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fl
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I Q. Is he · burnt ·: on the arms?
.. .I!
i A• He's just burnt, on his arms, his hands •••
.!1
I Q. His hands • . And he'd he about 60 now, you say?
A. About 60.
Q .. You started to give a physical description of him.
A. ·~ye ll, I can give you a pretty good one of . him because
fJE.~is so tall. He • s taller than · I am,. while most
p e ople aren • t. So he • s 6 • 3" or 6 '4". He • s · skinny •••
thin .. :. -: • .
Q. Ah·ight, I •ve got some pictures here and I'd like · von
-::--EO·look at them and wi tho11t turnj ng them · over ju~t-- 1 ook
and tell me . if you know any of these men. ·
'--- ,I), ,
.. . :.., • i;' .
. .
Well, now;. I'd be a smooth fool if I . didn • t t~ll you

that • s JACK RUBY. You can sea the Dal-1~ Police___ thing L ·.
"l_J./24/63, . After all •••.•.: :·. · .. · - ,·' . ·,,.,.: ;.,)' .z._::~if,,]i(;·:.,. ·.,. ·.. ·
·',' .: ' :. _-~ ~.-.. .; ~·::.. ., , .·_.·-.. :.~i~~ -::~;· - ::~(·, · ., ·-,~t-:::{~.·-~- -... .
Ca n you make out any of the - others:?
I don~':-t=:-'k'-'=n::::o:..:.:w:_,...::a::n.::Y!..:b=o::..::d:£y_.::e::l:.:s:::e:;.~h.:::e:..:::r~e~·~·~·b=u:.;:t=---:t:::.h.!..:l~·s::!...,...'~o~n~e:..L.J._._.l..:;i_ong I
pause) Boy,. if that's him,· he •s has. 16 k~ . l_ i.~~
he's on dope hab,i t, :~. ~ - " l j ke~ · ··· ·•'· I.
...··
:· . . ·. . .
A. CLA.'Y BERTRAND • . He has aged .. CQ]Jrse that .could be ....

--H~ •s aged a lot. Course thatsp ... It • s been seven year.&_.
~rhis one, this one, this one,.this one I'd say definitely
I've never seen them but this one, now that could he
..CLAY BERTRAND, the man GENE DAVIS introduced me to as_
..s;.r.AY BERTRAND IL.. ' ,. • . .· • . . ·• .· •.. ;. : ·_. · ··
. . . . .., . ·.:. '{• ..
Q. ..Jrl.QlJJ.d you read in to . th9 . microphone . the PlJ. . r . of this

__an_d_ _t_hS!_J]ate of the m~n you.ideritiried as maybe being_.:
---
CLAY BERTRAND?
~
. • , •'
·-. -··
. ~--
A. J:. 2 5-3 88 and then · th,.:::e:....-:::d::.:::a::;..t:::;e:.:._.:!:;i,=:s~t:::h.:.:e:::..,_.::::t:..:h~i;.:::r:.::d~m.:.:.:o:=.;n~t'*"h:.!:::s:....~··'--..:t~h~e~·-=f:..::i:.::r:..:s::.t:::.)..l

d a y of 1967.. .·.- . . ·1·:·-
Q. >·lhat does i t sgy abont it? · "• · • . . .. ' .. · ·
A. J:J~w Oxl.aans, Loa.isiafra. 1

·,· ·.
- :···
.._·..- · .; ' :.; ~ .
Q. ~ it_a mug shot?
A. I've been mugged mys.elf, an..d i t looks like · one to me.
Q. Thanks. Let the re~ show that the photograph_jJ.:t.s..E-

identified was that taken of CLAY SHAW on tbe . date of hi-&
-arrest in thi£ .investigation.
J Now this. man here. does he 1 oak to you l ike the man taa t
BERTRAND brought to your apartment by mi st.ake...?
A. As I stated Qa_had_a hat a~
Q. ~.9ht, he had a_hat on, let's coveu:, up the toE of his I

head_,____AD.d he >-zas d r essed jn a snit~you recall, so let's - --·
cover up his open C..Q~!.lar.
. -· ..
~:'j -~.;:'/~ .
.. ·~; ~. -: ' ·"
I .. .
~J:~[~!~~~~.~~d!J:t:~~y~~~~c"~~~A~J~~,.TB\W.Jf~"U«i~~·~~'IX~
. . . . .
ij
II ---e . .. .. .
... _,. ·,_ ·.
H
I'
·J
I
.;_18- · e
A. That very well coula.be . him. I just couldn't swear on
it • .
II ·, ...
I Q. Okay.
II A. You know what - I mean ? ·_•
Q. Alright let me show you a different group of pictures

~md you can tell me if any of these ••• .
r '.. •
.· . .
A. Dc.tllas Police 36D98. -llth month, 24-th day,~ --
Q.
-
arrest
....
. Here • s anoth~r _·grm1p of··· ~ictures • .. Do
....
,:_,· .. · ', •,;·, "
.' any of : .these ·-people? -

·· -- -·:.. :. , .. .. ' ·, ~~ .
· ' (. ... ... - .__ . : ..• -·.·r -
-,· ?: . .--_:_: _;-~:~.~.~::: - :.:.:.-:~r< _.-.- . ·--
·'. (yery ·long"s'il~nce) l . _.: .·.
-._, __ ...._.
\
· ~air\~·-
. .,.- ; ' ';
' A. .· ,,_;hat boy_; s is Davis.

··.. .··.
.. ,,-- · ··.-; ...
Q. :qAVID? . ~ -·- .. .. . - _.,.
A. :' DAVID. . _; - .•; .

..
.
.."-.·'
· '
Q.. · .. Where : g;i.d; y;u know him .from? ' . ~
-. , .. ,.
·A. ·:-I know him from New . Orleans.-.

·/·.. ....;·.
';• i ,._ .·.:-.~~- ; . '.. ·' t :•
Q. Do_ you. know w~at he did ' in New ' orleans? ;..
· . · .. · _- __,_.-, . __:
A. Now, I just._seen~ •• ye~h,_ him~ . . He hustled/ ·· on the,. •• .·

. ,':
' : .
Q. · ' What ' do you mean hustled, -· was he ahomosexual? · He ·.,._

recruited or arranged dates or what? _ What .do you mean
. by hustleri . I t mea~s a · lot of different things to _a lot
of people. ' I'd like to know what· you mean _by i t.? · ·
-o.; .
. -:~: .
.
A. . Just ·going around and . having sex with ho~osexueil's a-r id · _
·· anybody who'd pay him ••• to make some money~ ·· .-; That • s what
he did. DAVID, · :r believe th~t.~~except · those · whiskers~
he never had whiskers~ . I believe that's a boy named ···;
DAVID I used .to know who was a hustler ·iri .New Orleans.
Would . you know the last name .if you heard it?
A. Try five names and I'll -see if I could pick i t out.
Q. Alright, let me give you some. . . .. ~ .
DAVID FINLEY? · ·
A. No.
., .
Q. DAVID HALSEY?
A. --_No • .·
... ':
II
I.'I
••
f&'·;
-19-
-. ··.·:.. ·;_ ..:·.
II
II Q. DAVID DURAND?
.
•
l
II
'
A. No.
il
'
Q. DAVID GRIFFIN?
A. No.
Q. Dl\VID GUTBRIE?
A. .No.,
'-;"
Q. DAVID GERiY1..AINE? Okay.
A. Boy, this is hard. I .know his name was DAVID~ Irll

b::1ll you all that. Now I don•t know his name might no.t
even be DAVID.··.:·
t~O.t' the record YOU I Ve been talking.·. about.·. a' -photograph

. ··. . . '
of DALLAS GRIFFIN ffiUTHRIE.'
A. Who'? .·'; ••. • .••

..
', J
,:.,
. ' '
Q. DALLAS GRIFFIN HRIE. Photo raph made in the
0 -Police Department No. 40547 in-1.966~--
--------------·-------...-----
A. ~vell, when I knew this. guy, I. ·knew him as DAVE.

. ·•:.···
Q. Alright. Did you ever hear the name .of a man called : ·
GORDON NOVEL?
A .. No I I say thato ... I •m almost cert'ain •• •.
GORDON NOVEL, he 's a French Quarter habi tua·e, · a bar

owner, etc. ·/.·.. . · ~j
Do you want to take a look at one la~t gr~~P ;,·f picture~· .

Do you know any of these people? 1
·•·• ·
A .. Never saw any of them before. Never saw any of them ·:

. ..
before ..
Q. Have you ever heard the name. DEAN ANDREWS? . · . . .·. ·.··.:
-
A. Nope, I•ve never heard.it.
-I . . .
Q. Have you ever had occasion to meet an attorney who 1·

sometimes would take cases of homosexuals who were · · I
arrested ar have you ever been intrnduced to an attorne1
of that kind who would help you out of trouble if you I
ever got in any of that kind?
A. (shakes head in the negative).
Q .. Have you ever done any female impersonations?
No, never. I'm just not that type of, you know-·
I've just never done it. Besides; I•m slightly too
hairy.
Let's get a phys.J.J::al descdption one mare tim. of the

~et &s. CLA¥:-BE.R'l']?_Al\TO ..::no·,: __talJ. do _-¥Oll.~~
he--was~.--·-:·~ :::- ·- ··'· __ ., -~ "·
·.:_ .. :
".e "
. ~ . ·.-·
. . ;:. =-~
-20- , .· .. ·. ·
.• A• About my height. ·
i .
·w hich is· what? .. '·' -·
. A. -·-~lel 1. ' I'm approximately 6 I . He might be just a little

,......b:L t shorter. than me somesbor.ter. ·
Q. A ._ little shorter than you. Okgy, and how much would ~o9:
\
J2.§.y_he_we.;Lghs ? '
He was stocky and well built, about 180. He had a nice I

. 15~~·t for a man hj s age. And r 'd say he was about_35
aoo
__Qr 40 ypars oJ d
·· least · r
h@ was build nice for his age., · At
tbangh-t;-so. .... ..
·~· ·_
-
.. . '' ' . i ·' :
Ok~y, : he was 35 . to 40~ :· a 11ttle bit shorter than au, .;·

_g,n didbe l-ave a fu]l · head of hair, ·thinning hair or
whaJ:.? · ~- · ·>-.: .... -. -·· p:•-;; ·· · · ·.. -·-·:···..:~-. ~-~< . ... · · ~. ··:;·.~- ·-·-·- · · ·
' ~. -
· - ··. .
' : •' .....
.. . ·.··.: ..•· : \;,~>~;~;:,-.~;. ;~. >·.:~: :i~Sr1~_:.\": · · :·.;:··';i:F;:.::/ :..;.:.::.<::,t~}::;>:. ,:.:·
..A ·. , .:. ...:•: .; .He - had. .·a .head . ' of
-- . - . . . -· ': ;... ~. :• ....... - ,.

· .-:. ,·,· .·._,. <·_:_:;:::·~;-\:~~~~~-~-::~-:Jt:f%··<··- ·:: ·-.·_:; ~-~<,;:~::;:/;. ~_ ·- -. ~ ·::~! ~ . ··.: :• !·.- ' . '
'.· .· ..·KinCI.<'o'f ·'' reddish~brownich-grey'> ' yoi:l : know what . I . 'm~a~ .'
l · _, . '.
·A • .
\ Q. ' . _. ·: · _ ~. ·.= :Ke~h;~: : :j::zid·- d:i~~--'~: ; . c~r;~; ~2-his ~~~i~ht '·' . ·. Ha~,; ·:. ~u"~~; . would:';~u• · . ·..
· ·., · ..•.·.'·< ' say he : Weighe~ .. ' . ~·
~- ' . "
",i : .. 'i'', ..:, _. ..... . -;:.:-:-:·-
. , '/·!
-, .
.. ,-
.. Abou t •·- 180 •· ·, . ':. : - ~· . . .
~-~~~_:_ :·:. ._·;_\:T." -·.. . ; . ~: .

• • J • • "
f' -- - • -···. ·:· ..

: •• h ••
'.Q.'
.,__
A. ·· Abo~t';_i8o • ..· ·; .· .,· .. ..

· _, __:'
. . -._·
•• . • • • " • ,.. ,. ~- .. : l
.•.... .0~-.· ' •...

·.. Okay~:::... One : thing that I · w2m ted . to · ask you.~: . Do you ,
' know i 'f . any ' of.. these men. that . we talked about . so far·:
; \-1ho knew · CLAY ..BERTffi:Nn, do you know if. any of these ~..
·.. A.:. . .. .
i :e:::~:: :n::l::: ~::ord of anyo:i::: ,._.
th: r ey di~ 't~~, 7
th. '',
·. ,- _::.. : ·. - ---~.... :-. --~ - ·.·1.. · .
: .· .. .·: ·..
:- :~.
· . an •' t.;k.now. · . ··" ·~·:.- . .<···:·· .
.o. u•d . ~-. .. . -.:..... ··
Q. .y ~::··;· :·.,
. .-~ : ' '.. . :· ·. : ;_:··-:_::.~.-

_ __ .. . .._.:_..
__ .. :.·· . :··,:
·.· A • .
I hav~ ~. ?~· id~a·. . .,..._~.:_; · .··. ·:·· · ~ · . . ···__
·• Q. ~~ow·. ~ef~re ·~ :~~ · co~clude . thi~ · inte·r~ie:·;· O: i ,-~ ~~:e· to ~sJ· .I .

. you if · you have any objections at all _to ·· the way · this ·
· interview was conducted and whether or • riot i t was given · '
· of your .. own free will? · · . . .·. ·f · , . :
·A. It was . given o'f my own free will, and uh~': i.t . turned . outJ
pretty fair, I . thought. ·
Q. · Thank you.
' Q~ Thank you, Mr~ Morris • . · • J •• .•
. ·. '
THIS INTERVIEW WAS CONCLUDED AT .l4 MINUTES AFTER 5, · P.M~, 12th

DAY OF JULY, 1967. CONDUCTING THE INTERVIEW ~'JERE MR. WILLIAM
BOXLEY OF Tire DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, ORLEANS PARISH, AND
I
WILLIAM R. IviARTIN, ASSISTANT DISTRICT ATTORNEY OF ORLEANS PARISH.
~1 .. . . .. ·' ,..._ .. -. .
· . ~~-~:
. ___; .__ .:
~1'
' II
MEHOEANDUM
-----~----
October 21, 1968
. .
TO • JIM GARRISON, District
FROM: ANDREW SCIA.MBRA, Assistant District _Attorney
RE: 'I'RAVEL TO MONROE, LOUISIANA
* * * * * * * * *'* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
____ :_Steve -Bordelon · and -r· traveled · to· Nonroe, · Louisiana; in
an effor.·t . to locate our deaf mute . and GAIL HALL and talk to
. "-
BARBARA MESSINA~ Because of certain complications, our travel
W(:lS ·. not an overwhelmin~fSUc-cess; ,- how.ev~r, some SUbstantial contac S
were .made fo~ future reference. ·' . < • .
.j3ARBARA . l1ESSINA who · resides' at 1507 Spencer street,

.11---=-~"""'-~,_._-->~L..Q_Uislana, phone number . 387 64] 0, bad_12-revi~"-Us1y toia
-11----..~~~"---.~....0IING that sbe did bavo "occasion to meet JA.CK RUBY in
. . . ·.
She sa1d that .RUBY caTied her severaL .times.
. .
She said tha
~
she had."'occaslon to have dinner with JACK RUBY sever l times~-"-

§lle also said ·that on thes.~__£ccasions . she was . picked. up by an · .· .
_e der y·~g~ay:~If~~na'ta"'ken-t07e;t-~--=-~~ -.
sfie- does i10-tknm·lth'e ~~:e~'O'r'"'tfie"'C1rlv~EY-a~n<rt"h.'ave""""
·. any pictures to show ' her~ - she also said that RUBY had a nice .
I l?oking young man with hfm on these occasi?n~. S e a so _said
1
· -·< • 1 - · tnat ·..-she happened to meet a :erson. whose p1cture she saw on.·
f-t:elevlsion after the · assassi nati an · She does not k~w anz_ of th
people • s names . .· She said that RUBY offered to . get her a job in
Dallas with a ~octor.
We tried to locate BARBARA MESSINA for two·days · but no

one answered her phone and ·AUBREY sa.id. that he . thought that she
had left town because she was terribly frightened and knew that
we were on our . way up to see her: ' . .
. ·.·· --· ...
-·
We contacted SHERIFF BILL CAUSEY in regard to GAIL HAL .
and he said that the n~me was ~ot famili~r to him. He did r~fer
us ·to . ROY LEA. .LINER who- r .uns- -- a · shoe repair--shop--at 1.208 Cypress
·. Street . in w. Nonroe~ Louisiana, phone number 323-29ip. LINER's
parents are deaf mutes ar1d he holds classes for . the ~eaf mutes
in the Nonroe 9rea. . .I gave him all .the_ information that we had
ori- -our deaf ·mute .and said that he would make · an effort to he .
loc~t~ hi~ for _us.
SHOR'IT BELL w!-lo "t"Uns the Red Ball Pool Hall at 5709
· Desaird Street ; is <:mother person who has some contact with the
dea:f -community, . and who - is attempting to help us.
~we talked with JACK HESNI who iuns the _Majestic Hotel
on Sixth and .Desaird street in Nonroe and he said that to his
knowledge he kn6ws- of no deaf mute who h~s stayed at the hotel.
He said that he has a bi~ turnov~r-in night clerks and perhaps
-.-.they may have seen o_r_ . h~ard: o[ 'the deaf mute;" b-{i t :that he· :h~~n· t .
. ·.·
. .' •
; ~;
. ~· ' '.:· ·.• .··.,··..

NW 12640 Doc ·d: 59168006 Page 28
I
I
••~.: SlflttU.
I ( -~~~ Ct-l11TcV
'~A~) ..
April 30, 1969
TO: JU1 GARRISON, District Attorney
FROM: ANDREW SCIA.Mf3RA, Assistant District At·torney
RE: SHAW LEADS II

(Shaw in St. Francisville)
* * * * * * *'* * * * * * * * * * * * * *"* * * *"* * * * -~ * * *

· · · · Bill Alford and I went to Clinton, Louisian~, to talk
to ~=SYLVEsTppwho works as a teamster. for ED GRADY PARTIN •.
SYLVESTER seemed very· coopera·tive and. said that he would try and
help us in any way that he could. He said that he· is a good '·,
friend of JOHN MANCHESTER· and if. MANCHESTER· said·. th.at·. SHAW was:
.in Clinton, he b~lieved it. ~e said that~he wanted to be-~onest
with u~ and tell u~ that he does not have ariy ~ersonal knowledge
o:f SHAW being· in Clinton or St .. Francisville, but that' he ·would
talk to some people for us who may be able to help. He also .
said that he checked.with EDGRADY PARTIN before hetalked.to
. .
us
and that he would tell PARTIN what we discussed.: He said that
he doesn•t want to do anything that would hurt PARTIN,and I
assured him that all we were concerned with was SHAW. He gave
us his telephone numbers and said that he would talk to some
people for us and get.in touch with us in a few·days~
t/Uv-~~~ ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA
I
I. . -..
. ..
Doci~J59168006
·.:-.c., '.,. -· : .
~ . . ..
NW 12640 Page 29
Somctim(~ in 19GJ. Gary's hou:::0. on ·the lan~l he shm-.'ec1 us Has
built and he mov e d · fror. l the French Qu;:n~te-:r· to Jcffcl-~;on P.:iri.0.h"
(In enr lier \·Jri ti. r1~·;s I .· s Lltcd Gary li •.reS. in I-:err::w.r; that is in
etTor: a lctte.1~ I Hrot-c- or> I'Jc·p Yc~nr' s 1),,~, nf 1 00? ·in.Jj catc:s t-lvtt
Gary's lo.nd and L"!9u~;c ,.,ere iD · .Jcffct'SQI!:_j:~~j~sh .. )
from Jcs sica 1 s f nnily hm:v~.. ~·lith her parents .. ) · .-

~~~==~~======~-==~~~----~----~--~----~-----------~
It H.:ts :1bout thi~~ tim·?.'. that the. only intcr::1ction \·iith G;y·ry •
occu1:~·ed. t'?\·.rhich l ~~.m ::~tiLL unable t? alt:cilY;.tte 7 J:~SS·oact:i.:ely:;
~ny s1~n1fLcanc2: I attempted to obta1n some ab6rt1cn-taus1nz
pills throll;[.h Gary ~
Slim a-rid G.-rcy took me from one pl::~cc ·to anothcT for hcrurs., I
do not vividly rcc:all \·.~here all He ,,.- c ;:lt -- it ,,7 as fo 1.· coffee~ hc·rc. 7
on an e\-rand in the car to a house out by t:hc~ lake thc-.:.r:e, ;::m<l fin:::lly
. ~·.'C drove to a rern.otc. spot under a tree out :tn the. coun·tryo 1 still
. do not kno\·J ~ihy ..
/~ll this t:i.rr.c ~ tho1.1gh Slim had inforrn::~cl Gary in advance -.;.rhat J.
wanted 7 Gary had s nicl nothing about the pills.
Once He reachc~d OlJT i.sclntc:~d rural de~~ti.nation the ·thr<.~c of us
go ·t out of the car ;:mel buncl1ed do~·m uw~Cl' th0.- bi.r: tree.,
G;:1ry then gr;~phically explained ho-.1 .such pill~ uorl·: by poisoning
1
the,·. Homan s body so ;"ts to cou~:c it to reject the fetus . and toler me ·
the locntj_on. of n <h.'ll[~ ::;tore. h'll e rc. n d:i.r:hcYncs l: d :n.l[~ g:i. ::; t \/OUld seLL
Uwrn to me 'nthont .::t _ prc[;cript:i.on.., I sil.·~ntly dcc:i<:lccl c.1r~ainst
0 bt,Jining th~?- p:lJ..ls QiCaUf.>C thf-~. y ~;ounrJcd SO clan[;erous ,,
...
~-:r
J
'
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.....,.. ·
···'
..~.
:'. ·-.
.. .... '.
~.· ··. .
·.; · .~
' .. '
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-..·
-·..
·>· .
---~ ,
,· .. ,. -~· . ;' ··.

. . ~-....-- .....= -· - - --=--- " =~-- -=-=--:. ·=-- --~--- ~-~ . . .. : - " ·::.~-: - .. :-~~~--- :"<.-~~.............. ~~~ . - -: .: - • _- =-- ~ .' - ~ - - ~ -~..:;.;:.S ... ~-~-~:~=-~-~..:;::.::.
' . . .• . · .:._~~.··• :" ~\__ " · ·- . ,· fi._., -

- -~ _._ - .. -. ·: : - : •- .. .: ....' . ~ .
. ... .... . . .... •' ' -~ . . . . .:· - .....,.: . .· . ·.: . ··.. ·.
. .. : . . ·- '
~
~ .
..
: :--.: -
. . _. _:_·_
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·,· - •·'. -"'"-..:- -:· · ...,
: __;__-'""-'$~-'::'"~-~...,...._
.. . - __. ..:.- .·: :. -. -~ ..;...
-- ~~ - . --- .--_-- :... _·-- -:.~-=:--=~ --
. . . - ·.. .
. · -~· ... ~ : .
. ::.-: -.. _""-··-· . _,.:: ~-- ~--=--:-:.~==--- -·- ·-.-. -: -. -=--=-----· __..:_. ::. ..·.-. ·-~~--~_ .-.·~.
.. -~..: ·?:' -~": · ·: ~ :. :· -: ~-- - :.-: :·· ~- -::·.. ·.-::."·":·;. . - .. . . - . .
~=- -· :.~ _
_-;__-_ :::·:{ ::.::_·· ~:.-~::~-~---=.;::~ ~:~:~~·~~~~---· ~~~<~-:~-::.:·:· ~;_:~
.. .' To - Jitl G'lr.c-ls:Jri. ·- fran Ea=old. ~-rei."sberg · · -4/, /63 ·.. · . ···; ::-·:::; ··::.· ... ..-,:.:.: .. ·.: .
. ;-·-_.;,;.:___ _,__ _
:.
. ··; •' ·' . .. .

·! ··.·... · -~ •''" ... ·.,; ~_ .: .. : •./ :
--.·-;-: .•.. .
.~ c :: ~~~:.:: I_~tervie..,- ;.;:L th Tom.::ry Batl!:ller, _ :Jac~: :Bur!ls,ide, Barbara Reid :;<;•:_;;:~;:_: ~ ,., ..... ... , .
.~ ..,.- _.-., _ g:(i•jh-_;~:~;~;i~:ff~~~~rf·:~~~-· cir;~~·i -·6e~ ~~;~-{ - _-~;~; i~·~-~·:.~~ : ~~~~~~:~- - ~~i~·;· i-~s~·.: -~~;~rdni _-_ ;,~·,_,:,_ .
__, -. -; '':·-~-~-=-::;;::;::~-:' ~~~-~;:nig_1:}t. By ·_!) rea.rrangeoent I met Tommy Baumler _there· a little · before sir~ ~
. - -_;-·"':T:~:: : ·~; :~~::~c: _He~;was . ac companied by an a t tractive girl friend, ~ FrE!Ilces.· We chat,t ed in -- "'''· .--~~;
-:-;:_: g~;;:Q,erali ti es fo_r _an ho'.lr, ·..--hen he 3ild she ·. rs:i.t .to dirL'ler-, t~e:a. l-1~ ~..-as ,.. · :
-to ~·
-- -~- -- ·~ ~ ·:- - · ·;.~- r~-~~?·-- .:BEfore he did, Jack B "±it side stopped_in. ·~;~::-.::'::::::~:~~~:·~::::~. ::~~_;;-· _- ,:'_F:"·' :::c:,:
. ---~~ . Last y~J.tr in - - . . ,: : r ' had seen;:~~-: .atJ..rnold Eckluncl~~ ·~ ~i~~ussion ~o~;,
< ~he first h c lf of November. On that occasion I
explained to tb=- . gr-o1..<p
· : - ~errer?l.:.'y a.:n.d to hio, among o :hers, sepa.rate)y , ;h at our interests are,.
-•-- · · ·- ._ · .E_articulaJ..;lJ with resuect ·· to Thornley~ I r·efres!l~d. Jack's recollection. in .
. ·:::::: ':';· ·:::: February 1rhen he said he culd recall-nothing, an~ again Sundayci-ght, -whe.n _
·:~:;-tfi;:J,.);~!Ja~; ~~;:t~h:~"::r:~: .~:.t:~~:~: :~Lh of

::-:-.~-;;~;;~~~~:-:~:::~.;~·; r-~turned wh~ile I was intervie,-ring Jack.In' behreen Jack working ca!!!e
vhat · ±ommy said;· id~inTommy:.· ·
<- -·;. _, . .. . ~:t.tf1 a young woman named work:m:an. -I had spoken to 'J"ack also last year •. :Before ..
l(e ~could do much lfe had tom;ait .there departure~ He returned after -he ~ f1i lc
.. -...:: ,__ . .;;.. he~ to school, but· W'aiJ, for the most part, then silento ... -.· .. .
:>~-;:::<?\':_;~ There is · so much. ~ha::tero and ramblin:g, r' i l have to 'li~ten ::to -t~e taped
: p_~ to adequately report. That wi: ll take a little timet! I •'112- also ask . Bar-
. . ··
... :_qara to make a short ~emo itemizing the · more : iopo_9.tanttbj;ings~ I just got
... theti started. and. onc e ,in a while char1ged directions. It was mostly free ·
B.ss_:ociationtJ.. When Tor:Ely wanted to be off th.Cl-ecord, he. ei~her signaled me
. .;·.. ·~ . ·( .-. . '
to. _turn the tape off or asked ne to, on the t'apeo Some of the times I wasntt
:taping,. ala s , because I just did.n' t h ave enou; h tape. _,
0 - - - - ·- - - ... ·. :·
·. He delineated a setf:-port.rai t . of an . unab a shed fasci;t, congenital and

co~scious •
.He . is a·,;are of the mea..."ling of -his beliefs e.cl . consid e rs what he
describes
•..,._. -• ._
a s his beliefs
~ . .
as
•
proper.. .
·:rre
.
is• iban exponent of the. .rights .of po·. .-er •
·Re ' saya that . whatever happens, the -Shaw case rill end without punishment
..... X.for hln because :federal pOi-ler- will see to that. "J;his, he · says, wilL also
~ . : . ..
· be·:the destinies of Andrews, Thornley, ifue is convicted, and any others,
. • .•. ... - - . and he is unconcerned about -tE..-;..import, edti!ely ,.,i thout indignatl.on about
,.··injustice .and the failure of justice. He -~ quite illuminating about Guy
E8n::ister,
m ·. . .
said Dion Turner . .
is . !lis .. cl ent.
and. is ·..
legally insane,. -
met
..
Ke:i-:Ly ~
:.a.:_pQrnley, but he doesn't know ·where, disputes Rocco di N>lcholas's story

..iJ:lat he saw OsHald and~ I · think, if the occasion arrose. ·just might help
...
-··us.- in some ~ays. He is close to Courtney .arrl a nu:nb"er of la..zyers represent-
•. ... ...... ~~ --:;::' _:::~:. . _._,__ ___ ·~ - .. ___
.· _:_
; _ng_ clien i: e in -.rho m you have interest.
....-·~- ~
:.--ili1
.·. _. · . i . .- . . ... --...

There·.Ta g, it t :rns · out, s_till ano t her discussion group, oy a ~:<0~2-r...
.- - , \ , 1" ' - . . -1-- 1-, . .. l - -'- ~ ... ..., •
I t: ;.;as mo :.;n e.s i'I: e c er s • .t. e-r C)_ a::e lS J.n .•.• e . s--u ss '- :..J..S v o : .. .c.e :~.ya.er, O.L
_co
•• • c, . .. :vd:l.J.ch Louis hc: s a · co?Y• I had. got te:1 this . frca B·r9.b 2..ra zo::e ti.::e ago.-· J.Jouis
•
·· ,. · · just h2:ppen8C. tq give it to n<? to retu:;:t to he::- yesterday efternocrr. Ls ·.:e . .

___ _; ,___ · searched. if .8t::'-1-~~~~=, ere fo:.1.nd he::c-' s~ -rit.8·re it is s;>elled cor.:-e ctly •
.. _ ·· · _ Ee l t:.st n e2e is
sone thiii€• li:O:s~ Ofla. It is ::m _tl:e :t.e._;: e: and -~.-ill. be in
. ) ___
'
:_~--_ E_·-~~-~.'- ~·-_;:c_.:-~_-'~:Ji~.~-·-s~_:_·_-c:-r:c~. ~_·-h~i-~·_ - "5~_-=-~_-t;:__h~_:::~!,~;s.~~~.}i;s~SSE::~:~s~:"_;o_~-_f;:~;_;~~-"'
• ~
_
-- • 10_:' 1...!_ · -
__
~
guest - book-,·.-.-~-. - - . .... _ .... - ~,-~.:~ ~-~- ...
___ .,.,...c.,__._ ,_.,.., __ _._ ....•_.,._ _..:·---·-:-.:.:~--~--=-=~~::~·-~
•. ... .... ·,_ · ·· · · ·- --·.: : ....
----'···- ------ - - ·~- __ _,:_c_.__ .___
. ..
. --_~-:;:-~------~-~~"' ·~=~·.-. ~ ---.:~.--;~~;-.o: . . _._:. .__ ~---:
c.. -;-··--· ..
-~ ~
..•· . . ·'...: .· .. --~-
·;·.-:-:-;. ·;:;:.-:--- ....: · ·· -· · · ·-· . . .. •

. ·:~
• 1"
. .,__. ', • : •;- •, • -·,,w;•: " • • ~:- · •--.
·.j~~~~i_~~~~:.~~i~~~~~~-~~:~-C. "~i;J-~-~-t~,~· ::~-~~~Z-~=~ji::=:~~~~~ ~;.~:~;; .-;,- - -·· -------- .,_-

. ·.·
.. .
·- ~- ·-: :.~.<-"- -._ ·_; ..: .·:
:;-· . : .. ..... --· -...
··--·- · .:.-.. ~.- - ;,.'-' ... n exenple_0.!. _0 8 wfLI;.d. s - hen""..,-_.._tL. .5 a.D.d . sho..,_u ~t to me. I-t . ....·. _-~ ,.
.~ ::. -COn.:;,tl-u-d -
- •-.· / -.c .. is the ~/-j 'i/61. l8tte:- fro:J. l·:oscol.f " 'tdconnallj. '.'I'h~ sinil8..r-ityis ' over: '- -,.;- - ::·
••·.··~;~~&i··~~2-~;;;~~~e::::~:;~~::· o::::~::.~:::h:::::C:.::~~tC~~::er·,.•.·:,;: ~:".~';?~

----· :-::;.· o:,"";:• :c '-'•'·.-c -, . . _.c.
. _·;:.,>u ._~:~;-·.-~-:> --_-~_·:__·:·:_> :-~- There
bille<t::as a-~LTJe~er, no one rece:IlS h~s haVlllg ever sa1d e.njth~ng. · - -::c ·: c: .· ..::.-:: _, ,._ ._,
is . r~f~~ence to Philin. G~fuci and a ce:np .on the- ot~--;;-;i~-~--~-·;_:-~::··:·:~-:',:::_;.c .-.
,:~~~::-:-::t::'/~::e;·{;_-::;~~::_::~~~· strangely, as Philip's ca.m_p .. I ask.eq Tol!IE.y which t!:f his . clients
· · · - · _·_·,- •· . .. · I might welJ,.__see~ ancl he asked me if I had snol::en to Le·..rallen. At firs~ · ·
--- · . __ when I ask e~, him about Dian:!.~, he e:rplc.ined. that she •..ras legally inconpe- ·
tent an:l th!:O':n said, "go a_'l,.ead .and see her", or ,.,--ords to that effect. Iio;; it
.. happens tha t 9rior toZlack Burnside's _:a_-rrival, I 'iras going over a record of .
. :: . .· _things Dion had said, !rlx£ri::6:db: in ·a convers.e.tion 1-rith Je.ck \forking, on · .
. . .-. "Uhich there -w-ill. be separate memo,- ;Whethe:::- or not I see Dion, . 1\hO v.·as- a
·.,: __ scheduled to return at 3 a.m. or later- this oor:ning," from a trip to· Florida •
•-.. • - - • •• • -~-- • • •• f/1":
. _ , :_ _ · ···· .· -:- ( .....__. :--: .. ~ ~·- .._. :..:· ·~-~ -_ -: _. __
_ ·: ·- -~ ----·.... ·-- --·-,. --~-- ~ - - - ··-- - :-· -- .· - -.:-:..
· :-- · · j. -~\~~ J' { .
Toward the e-nd, whe:l we were goJM over the Ryder book, after 1 a:.m~ ,· · ., ·' · .
:
~j,_Y\J·. _'!;.:,l~n~~iL 1 :Barbar-a read off tn naine of a man a?paren:tly well knorm ·to Tommy. I apparently ~
.n" ,..., forgot my notebook at :Barbara's and canriot recall it na'\;~- ·save· that i t was- ' . .
an Irish name~ .:md a junior. Tommy, literaiy, ··rolled off the slightly-elevated
d~se on which he had been recli~ng, · rolled rapidly over to where Barbara ·
.;:_ ·:was sitting, took the book from her, uttered a slight curse when he . saw ' she
had read ac~ul·~tely~ . and immediately '~ffered to bu'!rl it,. offering a ~h6usand
dollars. Thls JJn.medJ.ately recalled to me what he h~a s~d about Ban1sterr s
files and their value, about hoi~).;' they were coded so they'd have no value
·without the code, and the inference that their value included black!:lail of .
· .his clients.
.. .- . -. • : :?. _·.
',
' ...
.. . . .. . ... ·-·-· ·· .. ·. ':-" --- .::: ..• . . · /.\ .. ;.', ...
I told 'L'oliiiy i.t wasnit Barbara' s~ to seli • . We told hi~ that page was
- recopied. Nothing discour<:.>.ged him, arid he made a number of pho'ne calls
about it, right then and. there.r:;:he first didn't go ;-;ell, ~nd -he en.listed the
. help of the operator. It Has to 944~:::517. Ee add.ressed the pers~n who answered
::~ : - ~ as- ''-~oobtt·, and h<; :spoke as h~ might ~o. -~ wife. . ., :. _ <--~~::::::'~:.::/·j__~;_i_~~:- ;':::' / ./ .·
.•. ·- ~--~_·- · He spent sooe time d~scribing th activities of a man he said had to
.. - ... - .:::~ . ' : : ..· ~· -
..'be CIAxand eng·•ged in what he wanted me, to understand was a major propaganda .·
A:al!lpai;gn, designed to influence public opinion here, inclu -. :ing t2at of jurors__
. . _:.. -:-
· -and about _you personall!• .He descri~ed.hiri as a "nondescript" zn:-nO.n two""":"'T)f:~)
.. ways on dJ.fferent occas1ons, as a ourklng....;class man and as a "r:uddle-class"
-- . ·.
. _.,_ ·~-- :':::_: .businesS!.lan,. Gray hair, skin olive'"'to ruddy, . medium height and build. KD.o~:i:...
·..__., ... - - ledge of case "tremenduous", atti t~qe ~very antagonistic:' It- is Tom:::y' s thought
-- . thet if the CIA could put 500· !!len l~ke him working throughout the cow.itry,
. ~·
it .would lr...ill. the probe. He is, according to Tonny, "fabulous". He has seen
· _him at Honteleone "s Roofton Terrace .· at riight and at Pete's Place at about 3 nro ,
He once also se.~-r hio · in university section, at a reatanrant-bar. O.ne of' thes~
is on :b!- St. Charles. He t al:<:ed like a local man. . ·
. . . . . . I
e - TO!llBJ" met Fer'::-ie brice, · once •..ihen he ~·:as taPdng to t r,.-Q art:ly colonels
in a dining rOC:J., 'When ha gave ai'b:-:flliant" uiscu:ssion on inte:-rratiOn.?.lla·..r
(~d. gave Too.:::ry his "u..."llisted" phone mnber-) a"ld once at the Lakefront
,.; ·h.::>
·- .,.. " .;.~ _
d· _~. . c"'---"Y•.
)""-" .,1.1 ·; d no
:;.,o _c._ · t . rec oc-ni
- • +-=
CU.rlJO" ·- , ,.;-,
·'··e'-'- ~eCvg:l..:..ue 5 •__ --
_,_e 'hi
1._- n. ·
he
.... - :. ··~·-~-~ .. .'· ~ ..
.Altbugh he says he had her interdicted, sa:-·s that he a~p:::-oached -
he-r on it and that it has not been accompplishedo Tor;my told Barbara that
he would. do it if she cane ~? -w-ith the noney. He made it clear_ to oe
:_ --- that the purpos~ ~ould .-b~ t1make - ~t impo_ssible for _her to be a wit~:. ~~-----
_·_ ~-~· -·with what has ha'1pened since and wha!~~ere is grounds for -- suspecting,
this have been the beginning of a str ~e kind of play involving her . -
_that have been intended as it see~s, as a diversion, or as a booby-
le _ain~~.t~_~rZ\..,_- -- ---- - ·· - -
·~· - -
~ ... ...--
: -~
•
..., '
·'
M E M 0 R A N D U M
----------
May 9, 1968

)
RE: :·".BARBARA REID interview of May 9, 1968
--------------------------------------------~--------------------

~ meetings that were held at the Italian Hall were bugged by
M. A. GRAHAM who was an investigator for the Sovereignty
Commission. HIGGINBOTHAM said that while attending an art show
at the Barony Art Gallery at 1405 St. Charles he wa~ told
(possibly by GEORGE SCHINDLER) that after OSWALD passed out \
leaflets in front of the International Trade Mart in August of
1963, his apartment was bugged by an investigator from the
BARBARA says the Sovereignty Commission may still be in possessio

of the tapes. GRAHAM now lives in Nolan, Louisiana, and may have
some connection still in Baton Rouge.
There were also meetings in 1963 by the NSRP at a place on the

corner of Magazine and Peniston which is in the general vicinity
of OSWALD • s a par tmen t.
DAVID GRAYDOM who was ·a .very .close friend of WILL BRADY is in·
town and willing to talk to us.
BILL CRAIS may be contacted at the Myna crais Dress Shop, 1410
Beacon Street, Brookline, Massachusetts, a/c 617, 566-7737.
Also BARBARA said that ~~...:.:.....~""...;:;.~.:..;.....~~~

CAPTAIN MARTELLO of the·- New Orleans Police
Department had several contacts with OSWALD and also that she
ship that OSWALD left on on September 20, 1959.
Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CLAY SHAW at

l\NW 12640 Doc d: 59168006 Page 35

......
' '
M E M 0 R A N D U M
----~·-------
May 9, l96B
TO: JiM GARRISON, District Attorney
RE: . :BARBARA REID interview of May 9, 1968

·'·---------
BARBARA informed me that afte.r she had further discussions with
:tjS.RE meetings that were held at the Italian Hall were bugged by
M. A. GRl\ffATvi who was an investigator for the Sovereignty .
II Commission. HIGGINBOTHAM said that while attending an art show
at the Barony Art Gallery at 1405 St. charles he wa~ told
(possibly by GEORGE SCHINDLER) that after OSWALD passed out
I'.I leaflets in front of the International Trade Mart in August of
I 1963, his apartment was bugged by an investigator from the
,/
BARBARA says the Sovereignty Commission may still be in possessio
III' of the tapes. G~\HAM now lives in Nolan, Louisiana, and may have
some connection still in Baton Rouge.
II
There. were also meetings in 1963 by the NSRP at a place on the
I corner of Magazine and Peniston which is in the general vicinity
of OSWAJ..,D' s apartment.
I
I
I
DAVID GRAYDOM who was a very.close friend of WILL BRADY is in
I town and willing to talk to us.
!
i
III! BILL CRAIS may be contacted at the Myna Crais Dress Shop, 1410
I' Beacon Street., Brookline, Massachusetts, a/c 617, 566-7737.
I!
i '
Also BARBARA said that CAPTAIN MARTELLO of the New Orleans Police
Department had several ....EoriiaCts w.i_"t:h''()swALD and also that she
!!.)
ship that OSWALD left on on September 20, 1959.
Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CLAY SHAW at

NW 12640 Doc!i! d: 59168006 Page 36

• /
• ...
M E M 0 R A N D U M ~~~of~
c~. 4- ~aRL·v
---
October 5, 1967 ·
FROM: TOM BETHELL
RE: INFORMATION FROM MARTIN WALDRON, NEW YORK TIMES

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Martin Waldron, Houston Bure~u of the N. Y. Times,
gave me the following information today. Rece:rft1y UE New York
Times were sent two memos by one of their local stringers regard-
ing a possible SHAW-FERRIE connection. However, the New York
Times has so far taken no acti6n to verify the truth of this story.
Accorsling to these memos, RAY SADLER, a University

of South Carolina professor did a doctoral thesis on an abortive
invastion of Cuba from New Orleans in February 1947. The purpos~
f this invasl.on was to fly bombina'.missions over Cuba to et rid~
of Batista. An a1rpor was eased near Venice, Florida, and the
~an who l~ased the airport was named SHAW. The man providing this
information, when pressed for the first name of SHAW, became
nervous and refused to give it because he was .involved in the
invasion plan. This man lives in Monroe. ~wo others, SCOTT WILSON
and a Latin named RALPH J. URRUELA, both connected with the 'lorade
Mart were in on the plot.
'!
One of the pilots who was to have engaged in the
mission was allegedly D~JP FERRZE· When the invasion plan was
discovered, the cover was Used that their intention had beeri to
fly the planes over Brazil as reconnaisance .flights for making
maps.
. RALPH J. URRUELA resigned August 13, · 1947 as City

Director of International Relations. This post was created by
CHEP I'-10RiUSON. URRUELA died aged 70 in Miami on February 24, 1952.
He.was consul general for Guatemala in Miami at the time of his
death.. URRUELA • s appointment to the International Relations job
was sponsored by RUDOLPH HECHT. URRUELA was succe.eded in his job
by MARIO BERMUDEZ.
Waldron added that the New York Times investigation

of the assassination was killed without warning or explanation
in February 1967.
"·
NW 126,4.0 Docld: 59168006 Page 37

..
•• ·- .
·~~ gtttW. + ~
.
M E M 0 R A ND U M
~ ~ S_ffftE
. . . ·. . .
+- ~ ·.,
(~t'Zftl~
~: ~~·'t'" . .· .
October 9, 1968
FROM: ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA, Assistant D. A.
RE: CLAY SHAW

* * * * * *********** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
During my recent interview with MR.· JAMES J. PLAINE

of Houston: Texas, MR. PLAINE informed me that he had been
contacted by a MR. WHITE of Freeport Sulphur in regards to a
possible ~ssassination plan for Fidel Castro.
MR. PLAINE said that MR. WHITE was only one of the
many oil and import people that he had occasion to talk to
from New Orleans regarding Castro .
. ~1\R. PLAINE also informed me that he thought that the

picture of CLAY SHAW was very familiar; and that he may have
met him in Hous·ton, either at his apartment or at the Normandy
Club which ·the oil people of Texas frequent ..
, A memo in the GUY that there

_is information which official
£L_Ereeport_Su1Qhur, and ~X: • HAW were flown to nrobabl
ta~ off from the Harvey Canal area in a Freeport Sulphur
plane pilo·ted b DAVE FERRIE. The urpose of this
·tose-:t l im t of Cuba ' s nickle ore to nadian
~on which would in turn shi~ to Braithwaite nickle
plant. The plant was built by the u. S. Government at a cost
~out one million dollars.
The report is that the.combine·of Freeport Sulphur,

· WHITE, and SH..l\W purchased th..§~.J2lant_foF a ~~;:t~~ dollars and
intended ~e throl:i'gh a canadian cor;0;;;;;m th;y
had:::.J ..
~ There is also a report that _GUY BANISTER, hired FERRIE
and JACK IvlAR'riN as· investigators to check out the nickle plant
deal.
. • .'
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 38 . "-''

# .lf··
i.
'
'.
i, .
• I
J
:'-- ..
. -.·
·_·. :: .. .
·e
. . .. ·.
-:.:·:··
. ·,. _ . -, ·
-··
. ;.
f. ...
.l-1 E 1·1 0 R -~ 0:" D U ?·'l

. - .. ~ .
: .. .. ~· :o~ftAr A rv:o.Rc~-:-_ :
,:_ -- '. .: :• ' .. ~- ' ·. --
' April 22., . 1969 ~ ': : .::.-. ~:-

. ::. . ·. · ·,.· ·-. - -.. . -: -
. ~ ~ i~- ... _..
· :---::..:_ ..
·- ..·· _. :· -~ .'. ;· . : _·:__ .... ~
. ~·
... . . . .. . .. j '
~. ·. ~ ... : ·. .· ·.
i
. TO: . .J.'1r.tES L . E:-:ec .• Assistant District Attorney ·
... ,· .··I·
I
FROl-1: · SR. .I
i
RE: INTERVIE'i'l WITH AL CLARK

Item # 2
* * * fr ~ * * * * * * * *' * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * · *· *
.
Iri answer to ~ - s~b~oe~a I inteiviewed AL CLARK who .
gave I
his correct · name as .'1LFORD GRAYSON CLARK. . He appeared to be
. relaxed and inferred that he t.-~ould like to be cooperative . . ·. He
i
· stated that the WEISBURG Report . is corr~ct except that CLINT
I BOLTON '.vas never the owner but an. employee of AL CLARK. CLl\RK
stated· that BOLTON · is no longer q_ffiliated \·Ji th Preservation Hall
but is employed by The Vieux Carre Carrier, a FrenchQuarter
weekly publication.
]illQth~r
point of errQr lS tbat 8I, cr,,R![ was nor Ce"taiJ
that DEAN ANDR.P>,!S :i:-r=rt:r:oduced ...;urn to . I.FF HP.BVEY OS\'l,ALD • . I::Ie s_fated 1
that this could ba ,ze haool3n~c!', bu·t he.. i c: not ·certain becau.se he · 1·
knows DEAlfANoRm·JS i.•i el 1. "~tul- did mgot I.ER HARVEY OS~'JALD at _.. ·I
Preserv~tion Hall Elaboratina curther on this ooint he stated i
nfu_~ec~t. .= i - - ._
that .he Soml' _
_ ._L.l·mes c·o
· osr,.,'_!l.
. LD ·
... ,·1_·
b_NDRE~·iS introduced to him in regard to haying a c:<=>grnent oL_
..._L.h GORDON NOVELL who DEAN
~;a ·t~or: Hell di Qpl :::::ro --1 a"':: th2 . :::2·. · Yo,-'·- ;,rm;:_lds -Fair. .i
I
.I
CL..~RK
verified the fact that . he tole \·IEISBSRG that
BOO'I'SIE GAY was conducting so:c:.e 8usiness at' G. ~7AY GILL's office
··: r
and' she saw a chart, that had. bel6n~ed to DAVE ·FERRIE i.... . J
.L- ~- L...
~.:. ~:.....
• I
indicated ·. - ~ .-L
, ..,,
. . . .
ALFORD G. CL~ RK o:.-,•o:..:ld gladly coo9eiate ahd

stated his business adc1ress lS Dixieland ~all, 522 Bc•J.roo!:! s-;:::: ee t: 1
i
.r ·. ." '·: ' ...
. •, .· ...
··. ·.
NW 12640 :Docid: 59168006 Page ''39; -

({at
kef4.. tie...'I
!! MEMORANDUM
'1/-1!J ~ N~'f
I May 10, 1968
I .

I
I
I RE: ' ..TIM SERIO
I .
I --------~--------------~-----~------------------------------------
1 .• . . .
I JIM SERIO informed me trn t SANDY KRASNOFF's wife, DOTTY, used to

,I be employed by an automobile tire company. .sJ;l§ s-'gj g tt;Jg,t Q.S);o{7H.~
I
• 1! came into her com an driving a pi~ku tr~tk with HIDELL's name
. ~1~ .
~-':" ~itten o:a he side of t~e true . .o d
QJ~~ JLcharg~q,_l;.l;;illl.l.· Later on 1t was her JOb to try and collect the
I money for the tires. She . said she called OSWALD on the phone
II two or three times and the last time she called him O~WALD told
1/ her that he was not responsible for the tires and that she could
jl talk to his . attorney who was with him at the time. A person got
I! on the phone ~nd talked. · to her and identified himself as DAVID
ii FERRIE and sald that he was OSWALD's attorney. FERRIE informed
11 her that he knew the law and that OSWALD was notr~sponsible for
1 the tires and would not pay for them. They argued a:bout this
1 point and she later commented to FERRIE that he had the right
iI· name . .because he so~nded. like a fairy on . the phone. She said ther
~·
1 are records that should verify this and she said that on the day
1 that DAVID FERRIE died a writer from Time magazine came to her
house to inquire about this story. (LOU IVON has already checked
I into this.)
i
I'
i!
II
il
!J
I•
I! ~ .- · ~
I
I
NW 12640 Do~*d:59168006 Page 40
..------- ····-------------·-'•-~ · -· ------ - -- -------· ----~ - , - -- -- - .,..~-- --~--------·-·- --~- . --....._-· - - ~ --·----- ···*~- _..___ ~ --···-------- ----<·--=--·- --·-
ii !.
I!
!I
,. I
... !-
') '
. II! .-.
. .J N E L! 0 g_ . A N D U N ·.. . , ·..
.....
···
i - . . ... .
. - :·: . . . ·. . ·_·_ ~ ~- . .. .
i :-- ·. . . .
' . ·- ~-
.March 14, 1968 . • . : ! '~ . .

.. . . .- .
., .. ·. .
. .·.-· .
TO: JIM GARRISON, District Attorney :-•.--·.· '
·· - · .. ;. ... .
..
. -.... _- . ·.··· .... -~ ~- . : :·· .... : .
FROM: ANDY SCIAMBRA, Assi~~ant District Attorney

.. "( ...S~~ ~~tffR ~t>VJAI -~
RE: ~ -.~ .. ~l't1 1 i.P~~ -
P!S~N!APJ) (rOLPSflltl1ft ~ l,.oi/IJ/'4' . .
-:·:- -. ~~~tr:~-ff.¥J ..--- -
' . . .
· Harold Weisburg and I talked to WALTER CRAFT who use
to run the Griffin Club with ROGER LOVIN. CRAFT arrived in
town 9round .June of 1964 and· never· knew THORNLEY 1 ·however 1 he
was associated with ROGER LOVIN. ... .
_
CRAFT said that he had heard the rumor around the

Ryder club that OSWALD had passe? through the_Ey_der Clu? and
stayed there a c;ouple of days ..L~be~~~!!.~2£_stairs'. _ .·
. ~-~r:.:rr "'..,. ·i c1 t b9.t ~E...W:.U.N:....:ts;>lg ,uim.;tb.~.t...-b.e.. ..: I.lQ:i.l.J..N-..,g~
-
~lJ.l,.J;z;:>re- at-iQ..uwJ,. th.e..J3.jt.£l~h at..... .tll~m,~ . ti.m,e and that is
·· . why the Distiict Attorney's office is interested in him .
.
·.~
ROGER also said that the C.I.A. was interested in him
because of his Cuban activities. CRAFT said ±......~ RO'iE.B also
~im the,_ ium.r..~~~oll_tb-at he. ~·'-~-.s ~nvo_:!,;~ll,_§.Q..llie. ;!~X.. ~n _ -, .
the anti-Castro movem~u;t:~.:..- . . . .. .
-.- · •.
- . ., ·
. .. ~-
: -- ..... ... ·.· : -- ....

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. :. .. ..
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NW 12640
. Iil
Doc~d:59168006
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Page 41•
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.. .. ·.. '· .. ·. . -. -- . ; . .. ..... -; , : :. -.·.:. ..

..· ·- •'
.· .
. ., .... -~ . ~- . .. . . .
March 14, 1968 --. _··. ·
., ·-.- -. .' .
. .· .
.... -:
.
TO: . JIM GARRISON, District Attorney ~
: -· ..... .
.. . ·.· :; : --·· ~ . --- . ·! - .,. ···- ' .. . ,. ..
FROM: ANDY SCIA.HBRA I Assis~ant District A~~brnei .
~ .J~ f>~<t~R ~~V#N_.:.. ·
~~~.ojZ~~ : .. -. ~~ . ''~, '''~~ ·
_ _n ___ :. • •• •• • : (
RE:
J'$iRMAf\l) · CrbL&>SMITIT.,..., 1-oWAI'r,
- - · ~ - - ~~~~t~-1'(.~-J..----
. .· ......
~ . - -: .
-~ . ..
Harold Weisburg and . I talked to lvALTER CRAFT who use
to run the Griffin Club with ROGER LOVIN. CRAFT arrived in
. :· -town around June of 1964 and·never knew THORNLEY, however, he
was associated with ROGER LOVIN. ·
.. CRAFT said that he had heard the rumor around the

Ryder Club that~LD had passe? thro~pe Ryder .. ~~b and
_ sta.x.ed there a c;ouple of days _jth~ad a roo~~ upstairs~.· .· -
· ~&EX.,.s.a.<i.Q.. tbai:.li~~;L,N"..,t~lQ. ...0j.m thi;tl;._.b,e, I..O'iJJ;J;~1-~
~~L.bl - 1:/..ex.e..ax;ounQ.... tU..~e"""-CJJ.Jb a.t .. ,t.he-.s<:w:J.e ti,m?? and that is
why the District Attorney's office is interested in him. ·
ROGER also said that the C~I.A. was interested in him

because of his Cuban activities. CRAFT said t..h.:~
,.5_3!.V!L.b).rn .,.t[le_:i.Jrm.r:..~s_:Lon tb:..at he wq_s ~nvo]JL~~.QJDe '''~X ~n _
_____
the anti-Castro movement.
__;.__;:--'~-----···--·a---,..--·-.,.--
. '
.. . :~
·. , .· . . -· ·
• I: ·_ .
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 42'
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._· . . · ··.' ·: :· ., . . .. ... . .
~ -
·· ... ·. -:.·· .
. ' .·.·
.March 14, 1968 ·:.. .. :- -~-
; . I • ' ' a -~
... . ·.·
';
TO: JIIvl GARRISON, . District Attorney . . .- ·::·:. ....... .. . ...- .. , ' · .. . . . .
- ·..,.
- ·-··-·. ·.
··a
.. -..... ~: ' . .. . · - , ·, . ·..
:, · . ...
•-.
FROM: .
ANDY·. SCIAHBRA,
.. . . . .
Assistant District Attorney ,
,-_( j~_,._ ~~!-~a ~ClvsN ~ - :,
RE: - ~~~~~!.~- ··. . ~~~''~,''I!~"""'- - _ ·. ::
". -. ·. -. IJ~RNAA!l . trOLPS~IT/f. ~ ·t..ovtN'.r· .·· .
- - - - - -· ~ - - - . :. .... .. .
~ -: ~~~ti~-1-t':..,..~J
. · .·':": ·
.- - - -
· I-Iarold W~isburg and I ta1ked to · WALTER CRAFT who use
to run the Griffin Club with ROGER LOVIN. CRAFT arriv:ed in
town ar·ound June of 1964 and ·never knew THORNLEY, t10wever, he
was associated with ROGER LOVIN. . ..
CRAFT said that he had heard the rumor around the

Ryder Club that OSWALD had passe? throug_h.tjlELJ~y_der Clu? and
stayed there a qouple of days j thel...E._c;s a_roo~,ups~a irs1 . . ··"
. £.E ~F':I' c• a:i Q t.bQ_j; EQG~R J.JQYiN tQld ~im tl:!at .he. l .•~J..N......~ -
~Ul-1t.e:r:e .. a,.:~;;Qun.d-..:t.lle ~J n.b-a.t..,;t.hfi\,..S.<3Jlle ..tim,e and that is
why the District Attorney • s office is interested in him. ··
, ..
' ,. -. ROGER also said that the C~I.A. was int~rested in him
because of his Cuban activities. CRAFT sai _ __. _: ~
:_;;___.:..
the anti-Castro ..
movement. ___
~-m t h L..~§-'i~ i_o n tiJ at_l}.§_ll_<;i_S_ i n>cO,).o2.~g,..,jJi..~.2..Il1e w ~ y in_
__________
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. . ..
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., ..... ... .
.
. : . ·. : ., ,.. .. ..
· .· ·· .·
. ·. ·' .· ·
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·. . ·.
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NW 12640 Docfd:5~l68006 Page 4j: ..

I' .. : :~_- :' .
lI i
··1
-.- -· . - - ~- .
M E M 0 R A N D U M
- ------ ---
TO:
F'RON:
•f "'~ • . •• _:.. _ - •
. . . . _., .
------------------------------7-------~--------~-----------------
.. :'. ·. -~ --.:.. - :·.
at a place on the
l?enist6n- which fs in : the _·general vicinity -
_- ---- . ;_:_· . , ~.: ·~~~~~RK~r~~ - - -_
-
-· BILL CRAIS may b E; contacted at the Myna Crais Dress Shop, 1410
-- Beacon Street, Brookline, Massachuse_tts ·, a/c 617, 566-7737.
· Also BARBARA said that CAPTAIN HARTELLO of the New Orleans Police
_ne_-eartment had several contacts with OSIVALD and also that she
may be able to g e t the log of the _S/S MARION LYKES which was the
s"hip that OSV7AI,D - left on on S e ptember 20, 1959. -- -- - ---- -- ----- - -- , .
- - --
Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CLAY SI-:U\W _at
· Att~ched is . a p~~\~\~...;'!,,.f.~.,J~ rn.=_r.s~ 1963 ...( N"!:

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... -; -. ~ - '
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~ ---- ···. - -- . ----
·/ -
·- ·· ··· -·;· ·,
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1!
~ 12640 Doc~d:59168006 Page 44
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::.:·;- · . ·:-·-- --.--·
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. ... •· .. ·- ___ , . . . - ··-- . .. ·: .. - . __._ :- ·::
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I 1-lEHOHANDUN (.i)___(S~: _QSWtilc~'P

___ _ ' .· -_.. _._ -_· ·_·: _: --__· ~
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. _: . (.~·~- ~·~~ ~v---:--v - ~ , ::.7 - -- -------- ----
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TO: JUl GARRISON, District Attorney
.. --··· ...
· ··· ANDREN J. SCIAMBRA, Assistant District _ Attorney ·- -------~---- _____
. C::- ····--·· ·· · -- · ...... -
FROM:
----·- ... .. --- ·-··---- - ----·· ~ .·. ) . . . . .. . . &!_ . .. .. .
· ~- -·· - . . _· RE: .. (BARBA~ -~~~~ i~-~~;-~i~~- --of-~~~---9·,-i968·~~~~-== 1?-«-:,;·7.:-_,-- -- -~, -
. . . . .. -~_J .. . .. . . :; z. J.it.:..-- . . .. .

~~QRGFt_.f¥Q~_J;NBq'l'Hhl:l, he came with some - additional facts ·. · The up
"-~~ NSRP ;'m ee t:ings that -were helcCattne IfaTiaj'i-HaTr:-were-·bugged--by--- ----,--
\~.)?,:¥' ..,~ M. AJ GRAI-tA.M who was an investigator---for ---- the Sovereignty _ .
-~~~-- _____ commissiop, ___ 1 J.IIGGINBOT~'\1 s~1d --~AA~--~~-~l_e a_- ~_-~:~~~~~-- - ~n
_______ a-rt" show ·. .
~- : __ . ,:, .__ at the Barony Art _Gallery at_ 140~ __ §_1::_~ -- -~h.~£~.~-s __g.,~ was ~'?l,d ·----- ---~-::- ·---
-~7 ~-.,- ----- ~.---- .. _(possibly by _ GEO~GE SCHINDLER) __ til.'-J.t afti?L:r:.. QSYll\Mp passed out ·.
--·-"-- :" · l~aflets in froo.t Qf the Interriid;i~oal:;:t:r~de-Mart · i11 Au;rus,t of
i963, his anar tmen t was bu ed b · · · -v-esti a to-r from the
~vereig;ht Comm · GRAHAM .- .•
.. -. ·- · -- - .. • - ...
BARBARA savs the Soverei nt Commission ·rna still- be in __poss~ss
Qf the t,cw~s: GRAHAM now lives in Nolan, Louisiana~ · and may have
~- sO'me connection still in Baton RouSe.' • ·- ' · -..--..:~ _.,. · - ....
. .. . ~ t , _ ...' ::·.-·: . ·: :.:~:· -~-~:..-· .-- ·-., :: .. ·. ·. . ·
There were al.so met?ting!:j_in 1963 by. the NSRP at a piace on the
corner of Magazine and Penis ton wh{ch _i s i _n - the _-general vicinity
of OS\vALD' s apartment. . : . - ~ : ._--: .· · .._: ~hi>A h.~ K'""f t-"' .
. :.. · - "'.' - " ~"l/OliR -~'-f.IS · _•
- DAVID GRAYDO who wa~ a ve _.·friend ;~f LL BRADY is in
-~2.wn and willi_ng to t~l;. ~--(~~--~H ~- ~). - . . _.
. . --:--------- ------ - ··-- ---- -""'":'"-------- -·--·--: ---
. . - .....
_ . . ·.· . ' -· . ·. .
· -BILL · CRAIS may be contacted at the Myna Crais Dress Shop, 1410
Beacon Street, B~ookline, Massachusetts, a/c 617, 566-7737.
AlsoBARBARA saic1 that CAPTAIN MARTELLO of the New Orleans Police

. Department had· ·several contacts with OS\'lALD and also that she
may be able to ·get the log . of the . S/S MARION LYKES which was the
· s"hip. tha f OSWALD · left on on September 20, 1959~ _ -- - - .... -· · ---· ---- _.
Also, she is in the process of getting pictures of CLAY Slli~W _at·

·.r--- the Kennedy speech at the Nashville Street wharf. ·
~
.·_· .. ,~_ -. ·_.
. ·.Attach~d i~ . a partial list of th~ nINCA members in .1963. (N~

__ _ _
n .
.
_, ,-.8 ~
. ~ ~-"'
.._ 0 -.f.~ _-v.-..~, ~ - - .: ~~r111 efH.
.. ..._ _
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~-
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···. ·: ->·· ;_ · -.-: ~
.---· : ··;· .· .. .-· .·::
-·: ... .---· . ·. .

.. . .
. .... .. ·>. -~ •· .. · :-_ . _·_: ·. ·. ... ,...
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. IIII
NW 12640 Doc~d:59168006 Pag-e 45
-·-..,-·---..,---··----------------- _. ·-----·-- - ---- ----------------- -----·----------- - ----:...
___________ --- -- -····" -:-·-·--'·•....·----------- ---~----- --~--- ----~-- - · ...
li"···--.
·- ~-
·... ·-·- "'· ....; .... ... .
201 . ·1963
.·
Hlli·10 RE: Clint :Solton and Other French Qu2.r .ter Personr:.e l
. \
,r
.. i
. · C ,.- (0 A . •
,@n;~kneci:
s::::: _...:.._ ___ ... -- . .
.·
. 1. •. Ke rry Thornley
2. Juanita Ab}:)ot (friend of Dalzell's)
3. Bill Dalzell
,·
4. · Dave Chandler
. 5. Clint Hall
(Y.\1 . 6. Ronnie . Caire (Cigali Bldg.)
f"':<-·;-~ 1 c--\ • 7. Jesse Core
" ·~ ~J V\) 8. Ray Be r g (Cigali Bldg.) (Cairci and Berg are enemies.) .
1
~ g j~'i
·~3'. --~Ji 1~: ~~~~ ~~~:ne
11.
·12-
Frank Phares (writer)
John Dodt (700 block St. Loui"s) ~:;--~~ ~..,;.,.
Al~, · do•T(}/'1~
~~
\'
rl. ~
.. _ j""
lC · tCT·(~.•• ·Ki!f- 1 ttl~":
<•) \) - ~..! was \vith Reuters (India) and Unit e d Press. §"et~ .y;,·~~·--. )
11
# t_, ~1)
.~ :.{<\ .)\ During the month Of the assassination, Barba';ji.had .T~
~- ~~ giving Dinner. lJ , '~ o.~w.ro,4·-· ~ K7) ...,........ ~ ·
. . ') ~t-r~;:~)t!)~~..,.,;_..-=~4 lfli{
'}c....:{ Gregory H.iJl . \vas.. v.f!!.ry . close to Ker.ry Thornley. Entered
f ~ Army. Prob a bly back on West Coast.
(:
.
.!(
~
\.
Lou Trent knew Banister real well. Leaped to his defense
after the Absinthe House incident.
l rf~
Hugh 0ard used to hang out at John Georg e 's liquor store
in Ma~amoros. ward took off from Matamoro~ with Chep on
the fatal flight. Morrison had a large amount of money
(suitcases) with him, according to Hok e May.
,~c) 'j d Frosty Morrison (niece of Frosty Blackshear) ran off with
\i 1 ~~ Russ Conger. Nm..; in California with him. Thev were always
..~ l)'
<f' .
~~\<74 0
V' ' .
with Cubans in green fatigues..; tt-JJ.-- ~ 9: ~~ . . .~." ~ ~ ~ ?,
Helen Gladstone operates Jewish Civic Press.

and many o~hers. She was often
\-..:..
-'"Toomma ce -·
His father owns much land around Slidell.
playing in the band at the Gunga Den.
William Crais was lawyer, but never se eme d to work.
Jerry Halford might know some of thesi peopl e Bill Crais~

for example~ · Will probably be helpfuL.
Ivan Kotteman. Is artist ~t Jackson S~u a re now. His brother

\ was co-author HithShaw on ."Hen ~'lithout i·io r..e n". to
~·lent
Warren Easton.
3.
--~ 12640 Docid: 5916a'oo6 Page 46

... '-. ~--_
Kottc"'an r.,oved fro:n his "Salle d';,.rsss" anc opsned up a
Mexican Res t au rant. Cubans hung out thsre. 522 Bourbon .
. (JacK. Frazier \·.'Ould kno'>v hm·: to contact h:i.:n.)
Buckley, r -emittance man -(claims to be brother of Hilliam .

· B~ckl~y:_· _ Is a :Jr~~:f:mo~la~ ~ives_lt ~2~ck .-.
DauphJ_n .....
..
( v•
,_ C~- ~.,-- ...L,. ~;~
. ·:'' . ,..,., ' - · "· · .~J~A...'~
~ .. ~ ~I - g- I~
I
/.
'
. -tf.. .-..-"' . . 't~,,~~
i
Will Br'ad_IL is bel'ieved by Barbara Reid t~ ha)(e li)lJ::1 close -

--· It - ......:~.. . . an "DY ..&... '/'O!e · ~(.~/~ -
to Clay Shaw.,~~~~uon . " _. ; _ - __ _
Martin McAuliffe had book published by Doubleday. ·Knows

Bolton. Hung around the Bourbon House (Sally-sayers-Nelson
would know). Reid believes he was with Allen Johnson or
Ronnie Caire. He called B~rbara about something soon after
she sa\v Os\vald.
,·
Glenn · Douthitt may knmv ma_ny of the persons and happenings.
Noel Jeffries, graphic arts studio, same thing. .j

Dave Chandler and Thornley had to kno~ each ofher. Dave
was close t_9 John__McEacbron.. ana Cap] i nger (-Gwce...L wa_s c:j,_~
_.!o Thornley. John rna i ~d Grace;.. r:=
....:
,.
\
\ \
:nw 12640 -- -Ducid :-·§91-6-8006- -~·-Pag:e : 4:]..:._', __
- - . ~-- ---· - ---~-~---· - - --· - "· ..:...-- - - . . ---- -- ·--- - --- · ____ .. _____ .. ---- - . ..
.I
:i
r- _,, .. · . : ;l
.. I
f
. II·- '·.
. I . ,
·'
.HE.t"10 RE: Clint Bolton and Other French Quarter ~ersonnel
I.
.i
--~
.: - :~0-) ,;
1·. :. Kerry Thornley

. 2. Juanita Abbot (friend of Dalzell's)
'3. -Bill Dalzell
4. ·Dave Chandler
5. Clint Hall
6. Ronnie Caire (Cigali Bldg.)
7.
8. (Caire and Berg·~re enemi~s.)
Lou Trent knew Banister real well. Leaped to his defense

after the Absinthe House incident.
Hugh ~ard used to hang out at John George's liquor store

in Ma~amoros. Ward took.off from Matamoro~ wi~h Chep on
the fatal flight. Morrison had a large amount of money
(suitcases) with him, according to Hoke May. ·
Frosty Morrison (niece of Frosty Blackshear) ran off with

Russ Conger. Now in California with him. They were always
with Cubans in gree_n -~atigues.: ~~ ~ 9: f!)~~··t-..~ M ?~
Helen Gladstone operates Jewish Civic Press~· .Kpew Thornle~
and many o~her_s. She was often at __ t_~1.e ~yd,e_!-'t_(:lub~ ·
. : . . . . (,j.·;..v:..t ~~.
]-Q.gg;;;J&4[in is ~e l¥,?st on the frin~ Quite likely
that all the storie_;~y-,c~~Fting him ... Oswald his
'toomma te r:;r:t;::;:;:;;; ~ .. ~ -~ x:.-... · '"'
His father owns much land around Slidell. R-ight now is
playihg in the band ~t the Gunga Den~ (>
Wi1li~m Crais was lawyer, but never seemed .to work.
Jerry Halford might know some of thesi people Bill Crais,

for example. Will probably be helpfuL.
Ivan Kotteman. Is artist ~~ Jackson Square now. His brother

was co-author r.-Jith Shaw on ."Hen Without Homen". ~'lent to
Warren Easton .
.. ,.
NW 12640 Docid: .~r9t68006 Page 48

~
! .
- . ···--
•
Kotte~an ~oved froill his "Salle d'Armes" and opened up a
Mexican Restaurant. Cubans hung out there. 522 Bourbon.
. I _(Jack Fra~i~r would know how to contact him.)
Buckl~y, r~~it~ance man (claims to be brother o~ William

· B~ckl~y) .. . Is a ?run~!¥lal • . Lives at /20,?"" ~ock ..· .
. \.
Dauph~ne. 1<~.-L
. .~, - . ·. .
· ~ ~. t~.o~
I~~'
&~ · . . :. " "'"
-~ .k;J!:;:;:':)~.A. - ·~j..-:!J ,~~~~
t .
jYill Br'ad':L. is bel ieved by_ Barbar2 Reid t~ ha~e li~(l close . · .
1
to Clay shaw.{~~~~ li~ADY + KYI1C'I( t:'U~J_ . · _ ... ..

. ~...
'·' Martin McAuliffe had book published by Doubleday. Knows
Bolton. Hung around the .Bourbon Hou~e (Sally-Sayers~Nelson
would know). Reid believes he was with Allen Johnson or
Ronnie Caire. He called Barbara about something soon after
she· saw Oswald. ..
Glenn . Douthitt may know ma_ny of the persons and happenings.
Noel Jeffries, graphic arts studio, same thing.
pave Chandler and Thornley had to know each other. Dave
~
was close to John.-McE,.achron aqd Caplinger Wrac;e) was close
to Thornley. JQhp
-
mq~ried Grace.
. .. . -
.~ ... - .. ·- ....
I .
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 49 .

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-··. ~ ;:' :·
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, ~;i;,;r: ,~ No~#.r ' ... ....· ~,;~· :, ,'.~: ···:- ...
---:_-~_:.:_: :.' Q -•
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·. The. date?
.
. _·· _ · -';.---·
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·> - ~~ -~ . :.:- r ---·.·:.~- -:·'__, _ ._
: - ~ - ~ --.'· .-:.-.
. :z\:::~0·:~ " ; - - ~~~ ·-. ·:<:::/: >·_ ··- ··:_: ·\\;.;· .- .
': ·, . .,. 'A• • , -~ saturci:"ly, . right · after the. J?tesident. g_Et
·, : :·~: • ·. ..-'---",---'----"'-'--_,...---:-:........
· ~·' ' ·/ . ~ -;,\_ ,> ·', .. .
. was oswald .·ii.virig a:t_this_:_t.~ii11~-? ··>.

·.:. ·- ·::;- ---: ··-·
· : " . I d<;m' t · know ~h~ther he wa.'s'·~· or he ,.,rasn' t. :-:: .

:.--. . - .. ..·,-
. .. :.:-. ~--- ·· .~ -'" .
...~-~- . ·.
_he -v.ras liv:ing ~
. .. :. ..
NO'Vl 1 what wa·s the nature ·~f, }'~:ur ;~~ing .contac-ted ~
'~~ . ..:. ,.~ ·:·:.:' . ':.:·: ..:; - : . '
Bertra-n d
.....
at ·th j s time? .
::._ ···.' ·•::-.;=:: ~: ~-
·:.r
:...._
-,., __ .
You. are th~ · '·or:tly__gyy ·in
-~-J:.hein --.. -·--:ev2r
:Y: , - .. . . that - ~..._.__ -~ ,....---.-~--·---------
(~.!;1
'I' 11 elucidate . like in Enrico Caruso -
·. ;: :.Q . You mean that-you have_nev:r})een asked why c~ ~

· .. . .·
.. · .. ·- . ;~- -:~· . ... ·:.' .· . . .· .. --- ··...
. :. :_<·-. con·tacted ~.ou? :·;
.::(
You're the first one \'lho ever ~ ~·
A.
. Q •.
. That's right~
. How about · the Warren_C.onmli-ttee'?: ,' ·· · ··

·'• .; , -
l
contac.~ed it a different. way • they~~ ·

· .~
·_ No, they
answer . out of m~ but they ;!n~ver got the-:;. 'I.•Jhole~-,,

w.r ;:.'--,.,-(Y'
~
- All r.ight ,;,ould you tefl. us ...
,, . :. _;.,:· -~~ : '-. ~.;:~:~<:;~ ~-: :.- ;-·.' .· :_·.-.:=.:_:~.;.. :

Dallas nobody: ever asked me about a fee or .....~~"""""'
_:-~h~e:.~_E.s~a~i~a~.. . :..·=I~··.·..!'-~.,o~u~l~d:!:.-
·' . .
· -~c:i1~e~t=--:!r:.:e=-~a~l:.._:f~a~·~~n~o~u~s~·~a!!r:::1d~·
,., - ·
!.!h.se~'a:.'~o~·~u...,.l.;.d.l..-:~~F.;_'""~""'
'·'
. ~----:-"'-~;;\.__..
. touch \vi~h r.ee
. : .
~~<>~wald so th~~, :r·· ~a,;Jd ~epr~- 4-·--· :
~:·
.. ,_ . .~
:· .• · ·'i -:-- ' . ~
;
. ,.. . .~.....
·.- .. ., ._
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.···_. ·.·· .:.: ·

... . . . ~ . :- - . ·-· .. --.o p- - -- · - •- ' " • ' ' --- ""•- - · · - - -- · -- , - • , _ __ ._,7 .. ,.,,,•..:, .... •• •·- ;"•:_
.-· . .
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. •... .·.·
·.· ..
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19 - - _, - '''·" "-
That • s the part qpbody ever asked !lle.

.
As so~~ as i::,:;\"LL,~,{',{~:i
. . .. :,·;. ,·: ..''·~~-:~/\::" ·~· ·'i?l
·. said I heard the voice of c'iay Dertra~d - blump - ~~~---.-{/-'}.":;-:·t-1{~·}';·:£; t~f
· ··.: :,.:..... . ;:-,.·: ~: s:'r·:. -~~
·.• they all cut off. You're the first one ·who ever . asked :· ~~-~~ -:'<:)1J;.,;:~:: ~~;
,1/1£::.t::a:h::: :::·tell thfs sQbject? . , .· ',~ '~,~~;; xi· l

ll.. I told him I wa!l in the hoSpital and C01Jldn't go·. · . .: '. ·:•·:.i,l'::i;ht
.·: ..
rr { ~0\'1
·~
you stated that yot; reco~nized
·<::. :
the voice
' ___i-~~e:::r~t:r:=a:n:.d=:.~D:.:i:d~y-=o~u:._,.:t:_:e~l~l:_·_:a:_:n:::y~o:n::e:_c::.::+=a:!.y-=B;;:e;::r001t~r-=a~n~d=-=.:.:::::::....c...,;...
.;;..
called you?____.
. , .. ,·
Yes.
Who Wc;)s the first person you told? If you cc;)n

-.___'-:--:=-:-:..,..:._:..,...:_;:----~~·:-'"';, · . :"--- .. · ··:-.:.·L
__::__:_,_..:.: ":··_;__ _____,--~~
.....
. A-. Let•s ·see called rny secretary, right after
her we were going . to Dallas to defend Os\\--ald
wanted to quit
... .. ·· to quit i rerneml-:>er novl ·;_ _Eg_!:_~__l:)avi.~, my off~c:e mari, .

·, .. ... .
came in ~o visit with me i told him, I think l call~d
Monk on Sunday - told Non~ Gould he go cover • .. for. me.
· \
'"---...... Dalla9
·. '!
~~--_ ........ :
• ••
_Q. Now did you tell ·•·
Nm.,, \va it a minute, I'm running it dm·m I never told <
Monk Clay Be rtrand called me.
Q. You never told r,~onk? . :, .;.

: i ' ;: ·_,~ :;:;:;!,~:,:~
. .A • . .T he first one I spoke to, I think, ancl told them .· · . ~; -~~: -:,,;: :. that <~;:
--.---·- . . . ··.-.·-· -·-··..c~:-- ·~·: . ;·"tY ;'}rA}I
- .· __.:· was John R~cf~ • s Secret service on Monday, Regj,s Kennedy •, · ·,-:r,~:· ~: ;.l~
- -- - --- . - -- -- ----- -- ------ -- ---- - --·-·· - ·· .. - --- - - -- --· ·- - ··- , -. i ::-_-, .••
: .·· · . :· : - ' :-·:-:·.•· .:•. . ;··. -} f"
. .... <>t·~ '. ,·~t~

-·· · :, ·. . of the FBI on. Honday. .-
•• 4 .... _ , ••
.---------------------"':------: -,- ··::_~ --- ---. ------- ~-- -·-~· -·-- ----·-- ' , 4' ,._.·: ··
.-.-:·--·
.. , .. : •.:-· -·
.. --~ .:_ - -~ ..... _...:._.
:uw 12640 Docid_: ~n680Q6 Page .51

'' ~ .·
. ;• ·_::,_: .
. :. ··___ _._.:·._:__. ~ .:.::· --~ _.:.~ ... -~-·..:_~-.:.:.~~-- .. :-~ ..--- :_ - --- .. ::i .. • _:_ _____ .. ~· -~----. ::........_
: ....·
~ .. .-·
2~·:.- ·:
'....
:····.
,·.-
'· .<F~:?···
.: -··
. . ~ ..=.: ·.
Now no~ Refreshing. my memory
.·.--··._: __ .. ··:·;
:i: I d take a shot' .. c . :,~::.,;,:;.·;/
,:_..-·:-.
and say they ~;i~~f';bl.ue· ~--~n;{oth~er ·way I. would·

:" ·.:.;-;:.:: ·.·-~:. ·. .: ;._·... ·.-
have t-~- tell ycn.1 flat;·· sti.":a'i:ght ~~-:~ ...

: ~:~ ·,
-~~ :.:.. . . .
. -· .
. '·.:·_:~ . .
·.. of clay Shaw, whom I believe . you have · seen on TV, -· ...
~ . ~
. . .·,.,
. ~ - ..
·..:
Yes~
;,.~
t·. ~ ~- -· ..
·.. I§ the~·e·· any~hi-~g -.,..,... .. ,-.,.
,;, ,·
..
.two men? ·:·.
. . .
'· _... : .
· ..
. _,_'A.· . He is taller.·· ,-
.·.':: . ._::_·.... . \~-- · ---:• :... ·. .)
-·, ....
. '-:_ ,·:··... '·
... , . ·o.· Who is taller?
:_.·
.··-- _•; .- .1
..•.'
.
..
·;
'.:. -~ ~- ·... . ..., ·- ... .' .
: ..--
.A. . ·. -:·
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......
-·
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,.;
Q. . ~
' ··~.:·
. - ("-
·... A.
;-.•
t.
Q. Well',· can't you give an ·approx 4.imation?
:,. ···-: .- ,c
A. .. An approxima~::t.bn.
·. ;- -.--~~
HO't<J tall·.· is Clay Shawi I
..":·
.. ·· . - ...
. "<. :·:...· .. ,.
··know Shaw is. -·:. _____;·
-'. . .-.·:
_,.·· .idea about how· much taller
-.. :~ . .;;:. .
·. :;. ,
· : be. than _clay shaw?
-~
I . see him on TV.. - he is a

-~. (
,.:--: . the cperso~. I J~n~w as Clay ~.~ertrand ... is· as tall• as himf·:
. . . .· . - ·•.. ..·. __;·-
: •. I don't. knov;.; I cai1 • t can't

. ..
-· -- '--·---·~-----·..::-·-
. '
i'
·)
44. ·.\. ·.·

·''·
As God .is my judge. I have to go back to the same

.r · .
thing I am telling you - I go to a fag wedding
reception- he is standing up and he is well dressed .
)I don•t measure the quy then, I don•t measure him now.
I don•t even think about the guy. Just like you go
·- ';.
to any wedding reception, you mingle, you drink, you
talk. I had no occasion to to hnv~ this guy im;_:>ress . ·

. ..·
~
·. · ... :, . ~ .
. me.
.• . . Q. Hr. Andrevls, you stated that Clay Sha\.,r is taller. · ',' . 1'\
Hell, I am assmning that, I don't knm". I see him

. ~- :.·
tower over peop~e whir. they put the TV camera on him so ~
... ...
...
;'
:~: . ··! ~: .
.. ·. '; ·. . :- : . ·
I figure he is a tall cat. '· .
Q. About how much taller would you say he is?

·;.~.
. A. · Th!;! general build is thc :·· s~rne You are asking fue for -:. : -··
height - I can't tell you

. ':- ' •
Q. \'lell you can tell me \·J hethcr its closer to one inch or ·1·:.
. '-~ ~ ·..
.. /.
closer to 8inch2s, can't you? . ~-
._.,
. -+
. . .
A. Hov can I tell you that. . .: ;~ ..
~
Is ha as much as a fopt
t~llq~?f~~~
Q. Well is he closer to 4 inches?
A.
. l ·. 'J " .:
~: ·. ' . ~~; ;:: - - ~~
' Q. Is he as much as half a foot taller?
. -~ - .:' .·
A. You see, man, . you arc li}tc . all th('~m people, you push
and push for something that's h0\'1 I got two descriptic~s "
know. All I kno·.., is Clay B~rtr\'md, the one I knc._t,
NW 12640 Docld: 59168006 . Page 53

::.
• J., ·.'~ ·...... ,.;: ·•. :·.
. .. ; .
. :·
• .. ·_l. :-·;
' .
~-··
·.• ... -.~ ·; ·"··
·. 45. ~
has a voice I know a5 an individual-- now this was

' .·
~· --· .·· :
• 64, 7 years later when I go look for the guy that. , ··

;.:·
·~. ~-~ :
, , ·,
:
... ..;. : '. ·
jumped up and ran out of the place - is sitting do\.m •,
..
::
and I told them 5 '8 - .I get in

. •:.
a 11 kinds of inconsis- . '
· . ·tencies, I can•t give you what you want in relationship ·

.-·.· :·• ·
to height except the man is in my opinion that I knqw ·. . .. . ~ . .
. ~ - ~~
. ·. as Clay Bartrand is 6'1,6'2, could be·

~· ; ; . :
. ·: .···. 2 inches short, I could be 2 inches different, I was ·

·· '
:
guessing, I was guessing then and · I am guessing nm.,.. . : ~~
\o. :po you knm-J Dave Ferr i,c?.

- - --- -- --- - .. -. . .
- -·· ·- ~- .: \· '
Yes. I kno-v1 Dave FCJ:rier.
Q. vrnat were the circu.'1lstan,c~s of knm\ring Dave Ferrie?. \:.·
. A. '<54 to '59. I re~resentcd C~rlos Harcello in his immi- ·

·. ·_ .·
;; .
·_. ,.. ' · ..
gratJon matter and I left his employ in November, · Oc·toher
. ;: . ..
of '63 - they shipped ~lm off to Guatemala and he
•, '
Ci1me
back from Guaternala and the Qover:nrncnt had him on trial

,,
,. ,, ·
...
for somcthing.Dave Ferrier - I mot, I think, with 'Vlr:ay
~ ·:,_\
Gill and Carlo!:~ and they \'Jere asking me points in the'

: :~
··\. . . ·.. ..
facets of the Ma rcello v. U. S. that I nandled . in his
d.epo.rtati':::n proceeding. ·.
. ·.
Q. Hz.ve you ever had occ:asion to do any work for Dave Ferrie?
(~.~~t:::r~+ : ·'
·-·. :···
-:· .
A. No. '
·"": /
.... ...
Q. You never reprcserlted him. on anything? ·
A. No.
Q. · ·. Has he ever called you in behalf of a client? • ·
NW 12640 · Docld _
: 5916800:6 Page 54 t' , ·
... '.
/";
: ... ., :·
,!:'
. ,_' ~· ·. .·. •.: \_4
·.:~
.. ~-- 46.· · .
A. No. \.Youldn' t use him if he did;: he ain't the best • f~·
. source in town, :. you know.·

.. Q • .
.·.
·. Has he ever r~quested you to do anything for .a . subject · ~ · .·
. ·: . ·~
.. . ~- .'; :
that might have been arrested?

~ ~·· ~ • • • • ·.1 '
·A· No. No. The only thing I recall doing was recently·,
·.•;,_i ~ .<- ~//~: ):~~ . f~.~.- -~":. -·. .. .
.·~, ·~·· ~-~>~:·- ~. ~-· .··:~ ~ f~ .:; T_-··.:·~M~ : ·..:...·.:- ::;:~~:·~~!!-~~_:.~,-. '·
· . ·. . I don't kno\'1 how f~r back, but he ·had an·. expired brake · .
, .... .
taq ticket - and I used to run a traffic court, but I :'

.. '
..
~··
.... .
· have been suspended I don't run it no more-. think I ·
nolle prosequ.ied the expired brake tag, the reason ~s

. ~-f/'~ .
· the . windshield was broken, they put a new windshie J d < · . ,
on it, something · like that, an~·:ay I recall nolle

.. .·;
; ;-;- ~ . .'
pr()SC(f-liing the cxpi.rt;c1 brake tag the car was not _h.J.s,
he had borr0\'/:2c.l.. it from somebody else.
That \\ras for Dave Ferrie ~nd you dismissed the case?
A. Right. Declined to prosecute him.
o. Did you have occasion to P:~~. ole anyone for him?
A.,. Ho.
,·:..
Do you kno,..., \Jhat pnrole pO\ver is?
A. You got to be joking. You ask me an irtelligent qu~stion

•.; . · .
.~ -:-··
and 1 give you an intelligent answer. Sure I knmo~ ·~ .
..
;-;
.
what it is. '
.• · .
<!. ·
;...
·. ·· Q·. \lill you tell. the gentlemen \<Jhat parole pO'I:Jer is? <
·' .
A. In Jefferson Parish Assistant District Attorneys prior
•·
· to Jan. :{, 1S67, \.Jere autliorized· to parole for purpqses
·of making bond persons arrested nnd incarcerated in. . ..
jail.
.. .. .. . ·.. .
~ ~.
. NW 12640.. Docid: 59.168006 Page 55 .

·. ' !: ' ,: .
" - -··-...·
... ~ ~ '.
" l:
.,_·
. ...' ..
. ·.. ·. :
.· ·' ' ·.·<,~~2'~~:l~~~~~i~~7m~;J{:~~
~· t. \ J,, t~~
. ..:. · :t,· ::11

$, • •....
.· - •... ·' . , }.1,(
47.
Q. You never p~roled anyone for David Ferrie?

' . -· .._-.. ··.
~
. ·. . .- .
; ·;
Not to my knowledge. . ". ; ·_
. :. . ~
..: ·t'-1
~'·ttl
. Q. Do you kn~u a Tommy Cla~;~!
. .·,:·: ·
. A .• No. Don't recall ever meeting anybody by that
o. Thomas Clark?
r·~
~~~
·;·.
·.·A. No, can't recall~ No present recollection.

..
.. Q.
' · lA·
¥-- l~;:t~
You did not parole a Thomas Clark, or Tommy· Clark
.-: .. '>~
. l)ave Ferric? . ,· ;~
.·. ~ ..
··. A. I would have to look at the books, man. You parole
been 2~ years ~ it must have been - I must have pnrol~d
thousands of . people- if I did, I did- if I didn't,
I di~rt't- I don't recall _- I have no present m~~ory ~
of paroling anybody forDave Ferrier.
· · at the E~)st Bank or HeF.st Bank would shov1 \'!ho I paroled ·
for, I l':ould . have to go check them. You a 11 probably .·
checked them alrc.:::ldy, asking me that question, I probably
did, I h4lve no present memory of it.
.o. ~ But ,you stated while ago th<1t you did not?
A .• .{ . ~vell, I stated while ~go I dirlnot - what ci.'ifference,\'.Yhat

_.- . .
difference does it make whether I did or 'not.
Q• Nm<~ my question was had you ever performed any services

. ·.: _. ;c .
\. ."
.for Dave ·J:"errie and you: were emphatic in that you had not.
_!,
. . ~ ~ :,
. A. No, I am interpreting your question seJ:vices for Dave
Ferrier - legal services, not parole services~ Anybody
that picks up a phone is entitled to parole I parole .t i1.em .

·..
--~ - ·\ :
Page ,56
, ·: ' ·. f.
NW 12640 Docld:59168006
. : -~. -:: .
.' . . ...
} ..
4· .
''t"- .
·,
.. : ... ·. ;._.
,.· . .
..
-·.. ~ ..
... _ ..
You recall of_ course that in our intervie'" _.

.
. ... . .. . . .
~ -.- .·
~:·:_·.~-. ' .
··( . ;r.• .·. '• -~ . -· .
~lell, I didn't_--do it .. I ~hut. ,my. eyes like Murnu said · ·'·'
·.-.1;-
. ~~-.
.·.. -~: _._ •. .- •• _""<" .· .. ~ ·. ·.-
in a-voice-
'·/:·_- : ~: .
.-.· /.
'
. 'j;, want roe to I . break my codti. ; __ and I }jo in and . ~~~:. '
. rJ ..the
. . -. ,._ "::>·:: ·~--; ·-~-~:
guyo ... I :~i~· t never d{d ;hat in my ·.life why,. shoJid~-> ·. . ·~ .

.::·
.:,.;;,···
.'J• ....:- .~ : .. ....-
J::i:d~ -it now?.
.. ~ ·. : ·' •'
·- ~-
.. ' ·." . . . ;;~ .
~: -~<~~~~~.:- -,. ·~: . . .'.' J -
. \.-·
·_ . .:;_
Q. You didn't agree to do it 1n our office?-··
. ~- .. :. .
A: ·Ah, \'lhat difference does· it: ~a~e,' man~- you all want
.. ·.. ~·
·..:-. : ' ~ ...
··· .. ,
·:-' .·.-?··· ..
.. · .. ,
"·_'., ·:
' .. Q~
~'lht.t do you mean you can't say it? .. ~~·
'•
- ;_v;. :;,;.__ -.. -· . ·-

···:.-:-,
. .,~~
I get the· impression yo~ 'all want me to identify· clay·}::~'-:
\ --:y}- :r-,:;:.:
'·, .. . . . -.· -. .· -~ /·:-.' .2 . ;. • .
shal,., as :I 1 be honest 'Vli yo~~

CLcayFr1ertrand.-··:_ls~;.......
:.=-.==-:.:___:=-~~.;:::-::=-===r--=-,s~~:.:::==:-F=.=----=-~~~---~.'-,.
ll th
:,:·.
,;:•':
--.·..,
':-__Q •. ~vell? ::--·,.
.: ~ . . .
.
... .;
~- - .
·And I can·•t; can't.sayhe is and I can'tsay h~, aint.

· .. ·.__-. ·.
,·. ':
-~
;
. ~'
.. ~ .:
Right. i ·.
-}:
. -... -.:- -.:
. ··.:.
'
And that is· \•7hat ·you told. \is· in our· office?
.. -· ........
.:· ...·
. ... . ·,:
Right and that is v"lhat 1 am telling you no\11 •
. :, . ·-~ ...
1: ..
·-. -~- .;·;- ..·:.
say positive_ly}~ under oatlf>?t.liat

. ·- ~
·he is c).ay Bertrand :or,
.. . :'.~.. . '..-.--~:~· :·.
he is not. ·_.· Eve~ \>lith me listening ~o .the guy's v~ice}b~ 7

.,._._.
,-·
~ . . ·.- ,. __:;- . •. - ~-!.~ \·:-: __-_:. __. ~: .. " . ::: <.~- ~-:.·._,_·-.;~-.t_./_.·;_:L_:_.
-- -. l
';·.::.;the phone~ -~the:·voice. I re~Jtll ···is somewhat similar ;i:_p':~h:.i.s
..:J/.1-·. ~-:~(: >·._ . ·~.-. ..- ... ~::,:··:._;_---~
. ::-cat. s voice, _p~t hi.s voice has overtones jlst like l·lu~nt.{"~/7 '
'
..f.-.-
..: ·: ,~-- :-:~ :· .

-._;·.'
·.-. -- ~ -.
. ·.- ~-
~ ·:·. ~~~:-:::·. ,_;__ . ~T
.; -.. -__ ;_:_: :-::~ .
·...... ·· ::·. :-~ • •,.r •.. • .'· •
.: .... :: .;:.~,-_·
·.·.-.•··
~- - - · : -- .
__
. ·.; . - ""-1.;: -. ~ •.
• ,, • ·'. <.' "< ... ..
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····· ·:·
.,
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~.
.·•·. ..
~- .. -... " .•··
... !<
,. ·~ ..
._ . ,.;..
51.
,... :::~ ·· .. .
s~id, the voice I recall on the phone as Clay
'"·, :
Bertrand is a deep~ cultured, well educated voice

·.-. . .
'
I
he don't talk like rn~, he used the King's English.
Everybody thinks I am holding something back -

I . .
. ' .
they think I have th e/key
1
to who killed Kennedy -
I wish I did I'd sell ~t and make a million dollars.
.. Mr. Andrevls, did you mention ~lay Be:trand's name. t<:>
anybody .at any time prior to the assassination of ·
Preside~t Kennedy? To the secretary, investigator,
Of' anybody? ~- < • •
A. Had no occasion to. . ·;_._ .
. Q. Did you have an investigator at this tiine?

..
Yes.
pid you indicate on a11y office file the name of Clay

. .. ~·::-
Bertranq and thht he \vO"l}ld be good for . . the fee?
A. I don't waste :paper . on people - paper cost rnoney

.. ~-~
Q. You mean you kept no records of these clients?
I had \'Jhat you Ceill a running deal - Clay Bertrand ·., , .
\<TOuldn't appear on it in any way. Let's say that X

~··· . ·.•
was one of the 3 people came in - take my little notes .. ·
put them d.own- that's it. I don't waste 17¢ opening

it .:. - ··1f:., :~: ~:-
a file on them people - put/in the running file.
Q. You didri't mention Clay Bertrand's name to anyone
during the time you knm.,r him prl.9r to the assassination
· NW 12640 Docid: 59168006 Page . 58

' i".· . .
.. ti·
;. .
' ..
,· .. :
·... ':. >~·
. i 53 •..
.,
I make some note$ and put it in there. Wh'3n other .....
· . ··
. l.,.
··. . . .
· people are 9oing to be represented !:ly the qffice
·;: .. · '' ...
.. ( ..·
we open up a \tlorking file·>
-. ./£
. _v •. Q. was Prentiss Davis in your '· office the same day you
. . .: . .
.. ·.··· .. .' ~: .: . . ..
· received a call?
.· .··· ....
..
·. A_. I think he came in shortly after, probab.J~.y while I
.. .. .
. .
.
' .,_ . ~<- ··reqeived:>the call~: . right around that time.

. ,.
• o. Did you mention Clay Bertrand to him at that time?
··. A. . All I told him we were gofng to Dallas tocefend Os\·lald~
ci. · You didn't tell him it was stlayB e rtrand?

.. ~· . . . ..
A.M M,an, I'm the boss - . I don't tell my flunkeys all my
. !· ••
. .\.-: ..
business. I pay • em and they do what I tell tt'~em to ·~· .~·-~· .
·~ ~ ; .
:. :, ··. do or the·y hit :the road. ·I have no confidant \-lith all .· r:·····.
: ..
. ·. •,
my people. I run my office, the tail don • t \•Tag the
dog~ .,.....
Q. I • m not asking you \<lhy, I am merely af.:iking you ..

~
A. The anm-.;er is no. To the best of my know·ledge I don't
recall telling him Clay Beitrand called me ~11 I recali

•_j..
telling him was that \'le \'lere going to Dallas and defend
'.
•. .r'
.
~-
.... ·
' .
Q. Did you call your secretary and ask for a file?
.. ~ ;
.· .;~ ·. .' ...
A. I said so one place, Eva · teJ.ls me no, )l.ll I tolcl.__Q_e~-

· ~· . ·.
was we.. ·--··-\vere

.... .
-~··-·- -· -·
going to Dallas to defend Oswald.
. ....... .. ·- ··- _,____ .. _.... . .... ....... - ........... .
~ ~--;-·- - ·
But I·----- · -
..(.
did call her.
- --·- ----· i;
'·
·=·
.; .. .·
.
·' ..
~-
>
·' ,.. ·...:

... . ·• : ;'·.'·.
~: .'·
• ,::~ 1 •
. 'OP.·
.i
··
. . ··(; ·· .·'
.· .LJ-
NW 12640 Do.cld: 59l68006 Page 59
. ! .
···.r . .
.., . '~
55. ·:}--:_ ...::

. ,;
· .. ' country style. ~' Money don't move me, if I like the
case and I like \-.•hat' ~ in the office, I do the work.
If I get paid, if I don't get paid, that's all right

,· ! ~-
. ·, . . -~
too •.
. ..~·-.: . ' ·_;
Q. You were willing to go to Dallas and in that case

·---
....
that wasn't a .little . expenr.Je, th~t vould h..ave been
... _______,.--
a big expense •••
::.'
. I
A. l•lan, I would have made nothing but mo~ey on that case.
I could have vr.cote 4 or 5 books •••

: .. ~
You \-Tere going on the basis of a phone call that he
....__would guarantee the fee •

. .
91u{~anteed
. \
. , ·. ... ·.
A. A telephone call never a fee, that's an .· ''.
-. ~-
ass:umr>tion on Dpmcbody's part. I never said that •.
Q. You said this man caJ,.led you a!ld \'1'-'nted you _t~presen:i;:__
----·~-- . . ~.,.
Om.,ald?
A. Yes, but
...:..___:,_ __
he never ' saicl
~--------,-,-. -·-
af!Y_thing~bout guaranteeing a ·
----·-·-·----·- - -:---- ..-·- ----.--- ....-......
. .
,.,
~ ' :
·-, ~
.
fee. •.. ;';

.·.·
. .. !
,. Q. _Yog __mc.an yon wc•'l J d g.o • c •
A. On a case like that - you better believe it - I \\10Uld'
go for nothing - I would become famous. ' : •·
· Q. BY !li.R. BUn.Nl~S:
.nr. !mdre\'lS, didn't you tell us in our office that ht<:: ,
said don't worry about a fee?

--~-- "'"\
..•. ·
.........
. ·· ·: . .
... .-~:-- -· .. ;. .
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 . Page 60

. i .
.. \
,_! ~-, ~ ..~~- •.. --~ ' ~--
56~ ·.--
··· .: ">.'
A. : I don't recall, Dick.
.. ~..: -
You people got me at a
disadvantage. You don't k~ow how I work in my

'".
. ---- -.. -·- - off ice. You don' t know how I handle my books and
. .. . . if you ask anybody in town I'm the easiest w~rk in
the world ... if you need help I~go help. I can
you a tho~sanqs -and thousa.nds of people I got a :c:ase :} . '--

'''. :.- . '· . :. · . .;·.'. · '· · .
,:.:•-#'
. . . . --~---:·~·-:·
-: , going to the Sui.?reme court now, oht of my pocket ~.·-; .- ~ :<<.

·,:: ...
'.; :_ . -~- ·
.:: :_<,:: ~ ·.
· ;.
_.-
c- been handling it 2~ years out· of my pocket. There~s
more action for churches I been handlin<J' than Carter • 8

. ' '
.·.<•
'~ •. 1·., •
-. : ::.
got pills I need money like anybody ~lse, its ju~·t~
· :·· :·· .· .
the \·m y my particular offic~e runs. These people pay
they usu;:llly do.
Q. _ f.i.r. Andrews, you made .a reference somevrhere pernapf3 in . ,.
:-· ·... the Warren Repo~~ - that _at tl1at J:ifne__this man owf:1d yo~ _ -
------ money and at that t~me you ae<=<t_t_o-±hCnlLmoncy wa" .~f

' ., ·
'" I
·: :::
..
-c o, ·,. •' .'; ·:·.:.~:._ • ---. I
. --=---
impor tan\:. -
- - - -- ----·...:....-.:-- --;---· ·-
e
. i_
- 1S
. A. No, that/the conclusion you drc:n..,. ·
. ...:~·.
.. .....
Q. That is not a conplusion ;,.. · that is what you snid. ..- , . ..
·. · {
· :,(.'
__
·}
A. \'lell, \';here · is it; at in there? I don • t think I said it!'· ·
\__ ... .
exactly.
Q. You said if you ever found him you would hit him \oJlth a ~
chain. ·r· ..,
A. Sure, I like to collect my nloney. If Hr. Labiche t,/Ould'·' . :;

. .· :-
look in his file I ot..,red him $17.00 \>Jhen it "V-ras Labiche & j'
. ..
~
, _,; ·
.· .·:' .,: .· .
. ·-· )~~ .•.. . . .. .~- ~

.- . ·. ~j,~ _;.. .
~ ·::. · :-''~~ -~ ,· ~ '·. ·::!.};,, • . •:·:~·:·: .:. . • , • '.
. •·.· ·.' . .'·. :_.
't. ' .
.' r ,
. i .
62.
I told the boy I ~~u~d I

have to have a serial humber, ·
l• •• I . ~ .
· · and the place where Jie got his discharge, three . or four
i.
I " '
·· other things - I am ~ositive t made some notes - went ' . · · ·

I
I
. 1
· thr"?ugh thsre and normally I have about this much garba~e . :.>·
. · in the file, had 2 pieceS Of paper 1 that V S all 1 everything},

. . -
: ~, .. . _,~ . ; . ·.
,.:.· :;t~ ' .
'l.4" l
·.. ... ·~; .
else was gone. I had. asked Ev.a abou·t it and she said. . ·~·
. ..:'... '. '
I ·~::~;: ' . - • .•:,. •. ~
well you stupid idio·t, you got a desk that if you straight~R:._,';.~, :~
. .
it out I can't find nothing, bu·t if you le~ve it,you kno"ri·.
. .
piled up I can reach right in ,. and pull · the paper up.
But if she struightens my des !'~ ()Ut I I m.in trouble.
ro. Mr. Andre\·v s, I understood you to say' e u.- ...rlier

·- ·-..
that you , .\
,.
"::. .· -- - --~ ---.- ~' "t '"-- - ~~-.
.. ~.
- .·
A. . t'lcll, · I think eve rybody would lik<.~ t .o find him -.... -·the
.-...,..-,--~--- -· - - ·~-"-··- .
emphazis pl.nc:ed on him he apparently has oo.m_Q_~_9JJ.I1.~-~-~j.ol!_

. '
*ith •• that I don•t associate at all \-lith this ..-case •..

-------. ... .
--·-:-··· ..·-·.. ..
.. ·.-: ~
·-···~- ~- _· --~. .
·. Q. If you \<!ould like to find him, hm·1 \'lould you knc."" it w"as
..
-- ~·--·-· ·- - · ·--- -""7"-~~ - jt' • .
<
Clay Bertrand }Then you found him?

·:. ·. ·· ::
A. ... yes, I couldn.•t

Hell, you've go-t: me - I coulun•t- sav
X•d have to go on instinct. ~~. ' .,' "
Q. Yet, \'Jhcn you went lookil1S for Clay Bcrtr.a nd in the l?'ar!~
ilnd this man ju:~~d __~.P....?t.I19 .....~gl1__9J:!.t.,t-Y.?U_ sai? that this
A •.
. _
· No, I said a man who . I thought \'!aS clay Bertrand, who
.. ·-·--. ...---· ~------,-----
.----·- -·--·-·-c---~----- ---·-----,----.~
appeared to be C}ay. Bertrand - · I forget the word choice · .
..-::-;---- -.- -
that I used- got up and ran~ stepped out the side door .
. ·: ~ . ' . ... . ·:·· ;.- ·--·· ·--·-- ----···-··- ·- - -·-'"' .
.·... ·
·~·
.···
:ntf 12640 Docid:59168(106 Page 62
·- ..· .
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•,~ . • ·r·;- ' - .---; ··; ·· '·
. it
.- ·. .., ..
-~ _.
-_ --:··.. ..
..
·v
./
~ ·..
and lef~ the sc~ •

. .. ·.
.·..o·. So you mean
. know hil'n?
" . .' '>,~ t
, <(..
' . .
.:Instinct only.; . ·I'd really be as bilffled· as I am n~f:J~·- ;:·,-;-;:;;.; -~:1:: ..: > .
He is like the Holy Gra.il. to rne~ you know you · ca·n se~ .Jt·.~·.:/ ,
; •·. ,·;;: ·- ..- ;}
.. and you can never get 'it. ·. The pictur~ I get from
. at· you .- I guess in 3 . or 4 daya I could describe

··.. ita- that kind of problem. The interest
pl~ced on Clay Bertrarid I bnve never associated with

man. · In othe~ · \'lords, ' _the e~phasis placed. today · an& · at' ·~;· . :· '~· -·
' . . . ·• - . ' ' .• ... . ' ' !';' ·:
:··.. _ :·· ·. ·' •, ·
the time I met · this man the fi:t:st time ~ saw .him, :the .;: ,._ :
; t
second time I saw him, and . the trans actions · I

. . ~ .
with him I never plac~d
. -.
-.ar~y · particular emphasis
'
Q. · When you t:old the \';~arren coromj_s:Jion there were 3 people

~:>. .
you "-'anted to . find _a nd hQ \>~as one · of them, did you · think ~t.
.\;
·\
that time that if you found
.
him you could have, recognized ' . •
' ..
... ~~--
A•
could, but I \-!Ould have tried. Because i t was my
. . · .· .
·/ ;
impression from Regis that they felt that th~s man played
•· -~
. , ·, :
. ·: :·.,- I
·I;:: ·an lmportant part in its value or perspective :in the ove:t"-
. \ :·- {';~ -. .
. .- C_~ all investiga't:ton of Oswald~ · but he never guaranteecl .

...
.· .
- ' --
.. ·-' "'
.. ~- ..,- -
. . t; . ~ .
·-t - .
mf 12640 . J)oci_d ; 5916~_ 1)6 · Page 63

~ ...- .
·_ _. ..,.
___ ..;~-- --:. -·

. ~-
~--·----- -- ---~:
,. '·
--·------- ;,. - -·=-~ _·_ :_ _. _._:-2..._._-:: -
.. -.
'-;~_::-_.:.-.-::._ ... -~..:.:..-: --·"~·--·-··"·- ·:-~-~~-:'. '. .~,:~-~,:~i~~:·~:tt~~::i.\+::::0.~~·~:_:~.-.- -·. ,. --". ~"·"·.
- •• • • . - :':,;.. • •:·
~ ·, '
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.
. i ·. ·~ • . \. : . ·:
.-_·
·:~' :
.~ . . .
. . . . ¥_,..._. .. ~:;>~..-. --.·(··
. . ..... ; ~ .
me that
far as I
... .
. .. . . :.:.:· .. ·.._
Did Clay Bertrand, the voice ,on the phone, .·:· ...
··J;._· -•.. -~--
for anyone after the time o£ the _assassinati'on? .· . .;;' ..

- .-!.
·.·.·A -··x ain • t never seen nor· since ..
f~ whom he gu~ra:nt~ed
' ... ,. ·.
' >c.:-_.1 _. any of the. fags who came to you

· . payment t;, Y~\1• come to y;u· si!l<:e ·that . tilT~? .•.···' . ·}~· '
._ • • r•,"" • • ".< :•-~ • .·
'~ • •·.L·.
:.·. •
Never thought of that,· -- . thought
·never .
of that., '.
·"" -. -' . .· .· ~ ..
.. ·~ ._: :' .. .y.
' -~-'
say since I ha~e been_ in tl;~ D.. A. • s Office
. -~ ~' .
·i
J:: cause I can It. practice. ~rin1inai "ta\'i I would

:_.,:::··,-:
becalJ.Se I would have ·to tell ·them
..
...no. . And ·'
. '\r.
'63 and have,· but I
..
If one of
,,~-~..
. \'lhere could :I' find ~lay .:r:·
. 'fr.
-t-
I wouldn't know because I didn't pay any ·'j· •.
i
.. - .. - . ...:_-:"-;-. _t·;-
can make :·
~.
···:"'·-·; .. :-- j ... - .
·.,-
:financi~l- arr~ngements: I about ~ ' ~
{· ..
..
- . -~ .
~)
propounded never
that. I'll go back and try.to do some skull if- -·.;:-
. .· •' .. . ·.
never . t.hou~hi- of .·
-~
,i'
I is a very good questi.ono_·
. . .····.· . .' .:
-~
:,· -: ..
·. :·1 .-: '
ask me that. Tha.t•s the
. h,eard. -'- ·-....
z.tr. Andrews·,
''.
:cmild you·.· descr lbe ·.the· color .
. . -,•..
;
. -"'.· _...
·my ·eyes,
.. -......· . '
. . ~ /'.
. - .....
,,
•'· - -,~-- -- ---0:-' - · -- -· ·. .:.-~·=~ ,.r._::-__ :_ __ .,:..
~··-.:'"·:'•;--! -~~'t'.."·:l.i-:'!--:-:._,..~-.: ~, ~~-.•
.;::. . ~,..:-~~.:••·
• -~~ ..l-_-· ~
,: .·
.. . : ... ·.
: . ,. - .
. '·,<· ·:. -~
; .. :-: ··:·
...
,·
.+· • • :.:.. ·
,.
: · . ·· -·. ,.•
I a·ini·f··tao · s~re~ · Real dark ·· ~ra~ge

~- ·_ :: : . ~ '.
: ... . . ~ ~ - .... -:·...
. ..
~
~. '
·' .. ·. -
·- .··
• _ , l • •• • ··. · "
.•. -
,. ... . · .....
' ..
·.. ·people? ·. -
.
'
:
- ~- . .
' t
---...: ' ... ., • : - . --· .
<' :' . <· · . ·. I could not ~()_ :it 7 my ~-~~rtal opi.n;on jf you
- ·-
in:
. . .. ..:· ~ . .
· ·. i >~~-!~(~· ; . . ,., _. ~ > :_'; interested x::'ll giv~__ .l ( }o yo~. - - .t . .
, :~::-~::!~~:~ y _, :::(;·,~·j q·~ .

r • •.• . • •• • • ~::· :.::. ,.·, •
_. · All
• • .
right~ · .we ~re interest:ed .-in your. personal
• . :· . . ·' . • .• ;.· •' . •• :-- .
\ •.
. !
I
~~, ~~*'fm;1~1·:t ,.:a:a::~ain · J:~~ ln·r iy_f·- _. . ,.-'-:-':~:- . :.;,. .;.,.:.s.c

.. ,
;>-•-.j
t J 't here is • -:-cmc:"i_n-:'_d_- ·.,___

::_ : - : • • • ,. · -- • ,• ¥ , . -~ .:: . ~~~·;/ :_ .•- . : . :
,;·.·.-:..-·._- ·-:· connect the t\>10 ' - but if ypu ask: me under· oath I .can't
c--· · ·--.-. ---.-· ·--- - --~~-
.. - -·- .
.'·9 i ve .l'-ou_. my_:_~P-~i~~ona~-~op.in,io~,:-:.·_.,..:..~·--~-~~JL:'u::.:s:.t::;h:::a..:v;.e~·_:t::o~s:,:a:_:y:__t:h=e:r.:ei•._
is no \"my· i~- t~~ ' world ,I cad ~connect the two. ..The only__
. ·,· .• ~ -. -:-,__ .. ____. . ~--=-.~~· -~ - _-;-:- .·· · -.--~ ~- ·.,•.
~ ' . ·;
. ' ;( · difference .:..·' I : would
...... .. .. ._ .
have to go along' with Dick and l-iumu
. . : .
cause I fourid out there i~a difference -).you know on the

'.
'
:·. .· · ... . ;_ :~.

~ . :--. . ; .· \;.-something in the transmission of the · voices. .. ~ :': ·· ..
..
,_
.. ~- . :-· : ·.·• · . '
. . ·;.~ ~ : ..
_: · - ~- -~
.._. __ _.
. -· · ... f-1¥ ._ BT]_RJffi.S i · · }:· ..
The·r~ :is:· a··~·d:i':fg~rence .· in. T~~;-~riJ· ,_th~ . tedeph?ile.

. __ ,· ... -·· . ~ - ·.:. ·'
' .
How yo\.l all found out I '11 . n.ever · kno\•1, . but I . asked a .. ··
. .
·. -~-
.· . :·-.
· -_.: friend of mine, ·\<lhO handle.s .. 'flhoeneti~s ~ at . Southern Bell

..-... '~ : .-:-:_·:... : . . .
·... . ~ - . . .. :· . .- :., :··, . . : . .. :'/ '
~ . :' - .. . :·· .. . .. . -.-. ;' ,_- · ':
. . l<..e . says there

.and ·-
is a very~~:
... · - .. ·,._ :· ·-
strong ... possib.iiity
. . . .
..·there
.
. could . . '• .
. -·· -. . :. .:·-:.-·· '. -, ~; ·: . :·:_~ . : . . ; ~ :- ...... .. ·"-..

.· .. .· .. .
...._ ' ...
.~ ~~:,~.;~:~.~~~~:+~-~;L~: -~~:__:L_~~- -~=- _ · :.~ . ~ . .,~. ,., ,c:- - --,
- :.
. ;· .·' , .. .
. ._,. _ - .. ·.·. ·..-·

..
.·. } .. •• l
;;;;~~ 1:_2:~_;~-o __J?-P.~"YJ~~9.l-~~9,R~.:.: t.~ -~~~~~~-~-~;~..;...;::_.•.·.: ·: _ ~::~,~:.-,~./.:~~L~'~~~;.;.~ . ..: ·: ~,- -.:. . -. .:;.~ . - ~ . ·, ·. ...• -.t~-~~-~~x
i . .__, ·· \ c. { •: · :...; · -
\ . -~ ,_ ,Y"
1.
~ HL L. LOISEL
FRO:·t: l~ICII i\IW E.
THE NEW YOR!( Tli'f!ES, FRTDA Y. MARCil J, 1967
J---:· <(-'l"'Q11flt V0 . . . I
Clark _ / J. ,.. I ' J .- a Slzaw C onsp1rqcy
- - ---------· ··- -··
..... ny r.onr:r;:r :n. Sl·:.'l'-'i..l·: ,}r.l fn:i:n th~ \'v'an·en Commission II offer only:~. terst> "no commenl"
s:>r-c;.,: t? 7ia t;!,,,; Ys-rA; ·::1: :...... R';.f?~ 1 rt.'', · . ·. to any inquiries regard•ng the
t.\e \\ :trren Comma:;.;wn Re- S~aw cas>!.
\VASHINl.TO:-: .·\\ _ .• . ''···-
. • · • ·~ ' . t.<.ol •· pm·t did not mention I \lr The tliscr'?pancy between these
I
Aclan~ Attorn<~y L~mer : ~\ tCL<ol- Sh . ·.. . . ·•n • ·
sey Cl3.rlt !;~;d · t~<lay t.:t:t::, oa( :t•V"' n:•me .once m .....;:,._ vol-p<ccount,; :tnd Mr. Clat'k's stale•
the basis Gf inqui:~:-; l:v tiael ~me:. Pr e:;um;tbly, ~[r. _clat'l(j m"ntll th•s mornm;:t. however,
Fcc:ler:tl Eure~u o[ ln • ~~ti ;; :.t·l"l:~·'t ,to conve~. by his re-,may be mnr~ . apparent than
tion therf" a e:t·•d t 0 ~ •.110 ni«tk.L•·•t the F.RI. and the real. . ..
con~ection';· pect>~';.. 11 °c:t.;y i •.l''~n~mlc;~,u.n d1d r:ot thmk_ the An e)(amina~ion of ;>apers ia
. S!law and the assii.Ssina~i,;a of : c•J•. l~n~:e . ;. a the red on l\[t·. Sha.w the a rchlvf's, . tnr ex :llnpltl',
Presiu~nt Kennedy. . w o l·thy ot mduslon. , :;h~>ws . that the F .f3.L. did in.·
1\tr. Clark inade the ~t:Lte· s ..ys l'·.u.r. Ch~cke•l. ·silaW quire mto Ut.? actLVltaes of a
ment to ni!Wsmen in a •;orddo r . man · named "Clay . Bertran.d .''
of a Sena-te offic•! h•Jiluing . "';$kt'{i Llit'ectly wh~ther there :Vlr-. Gar~!son, says .that ." Clay
moments after the ~· · · ; : .t.e Ju-l \~as any connectiOn between Bert•a.nd was an alias used by
diciacy Committee unaniwously 1 Mr. s.ha.w_.a.nd.lhe ~ination, Mr. Shaw. If t!1is is so, and
approved his nominali<o:l <.L> At-'M~: Clark t'ep•L_ed:
torney General. I .· . ·· . Clay Bcrt.and an~ ~[r:. Shaw
On the . .evidence . tnat the are the same man, tl ·1s .nought
:::.rr. Shaw ~ :New Orleans F.B.L had, there was no conncc· then that ·the burea11 did indeed
husines:;man 'who i;; 'rc;Ure.l ·(lL· lion· found.". • · inquire into. the activities of Mr.
r<~ctor · ot · the Inter!l .• tioni<l . "He was .checked out and Shaw. \
Trade 1\tart in New Orlean;;; found cleu, more or,less ?'• 1\lt'. A Ju :otic,. Qs:p.lrtment oWr';tl,
was i\l'rt>sted yesterday in con: Cl~r!< .was ~ked ..· ·,. ,.· . . · said toni~ht tJ"~t ";s it;•'ncy
nection with the ino;est•o::ation . Yes, th~t s r1ght, ·. he · •e-, was convmc•>d th'] r }l!r. B'!(-
of the li:en!l~dy as;;a:;;s i:1atirmjphed.· . , ·· · ' . - · . t~nd and 1li <;l11w "'"!'~ the
h.~ing conducted by thtr . New Mr. · Ciarlts sta.tement t~at ' sam~ n :m ~ .. . t: · • •\ ·
l
'"'S
0:-lc;m;; rli:;;tnet attorne:,r, .lirnlth~ F,B.I. ·ha.d conducted an m- <le Jf.'~ J i:i for ;-.r~. Clqr'k's ?.s.-
Garrison. . · . ,ve., trgatLOn of Mr.. Shaw caused, sertwn;; ·tilts t"ommg. . .,
\Vhen 1\lr. Garr! ;;on an- how~ver; a c~•tam amount of · · )
nounr:ed the arrest. tlie fir·st in 1 b<".VIlderment ..m some · quarters' Shaw .Sei"n in· San ·. Fro~m:isi~o:J.
his five-month inve5l i!;:tli~m of ht>Treh.. • . . ·.
th o~ aS"'l5 ';(J>' .Lon he ... \' (:1 Ill· .
. ~. ' '>• ... • . N l.
I ch th
en. IS no record· (.!her lnl
\Y. ., ·- .
• t ·. .
' '
SAN FRANCISCO (U?I)~:
'Clay
.
~haw the .man nanle.d by;·
• . '
1Ir. Shaw would b~ r:h«r::; •:d 1 e . . arren comml..Sl~n l.~port . - • . _. _ . _ . . .,
T .. · r · t · · . · · or m do··uments rela.tm"' to th"• tile New· Orlean::. Drstnct At-.
,w .. n ptar .lClpda ronJ. .m ';~ 1~!1 :1 · nss:.\:i3in~tion in the National i torncy .'Jim Garrison, as"' con-l
~.para ey o mur.. er onn .t' . . en-
ned _..
y. . '
. A t·chl. v~s of ·a·n · F.B.I. .invest.iga-
· · 1spll·· ·
lion of a ·man ·na.med ..Cl3.jl · L. as:sassm;<twn, wa.:~ <tounng the
sl
at?r · t f! p rt~s1·d ent· K ~nnet1y , . ·
l•eply From. Clad.; Shaw. · San Francisco \Vorld Trade!
This mo1·nin~. whr:n ::~ :;k .,.. l· ,, . (' L' L' · : .. n
1
· Cent~r when tile Presict~nt was.
wheth"'r he hntl anv ini'<>rrnatiun ••" .onumm ··rom '.u. · 1 shl)t. ·
t:cg-ardin;; )lr. Shaw, M:·: Clarl< :;\-loreuv .. r, usually well -in· J . Monroe. Sulliv:tn, then ex~
rE'pliecl: . · .fnrm~d Government .· .suurces,.ecutive director of .the center,
"He wa.s fn:vofved in ;on J.'.B.I. who asked not to !Je identitied,lsaid today hi~ . wa~ with Mr. ·
investigation in the N.:··.v Or- said th;1t to the hest of tlt~ir Shaw when they leamed of. the
leans nrea. in Novemh~r ;md linowledg~ the. F.B.I_. had riot 1 a:~ ,.a.s:;inatinn. :r.~r. Sullivan said
D~ccmber, 1~?3 . . We h :\ve the . c?ndu .ctet~ an mvest1;::at10~1 oflhe h .1.d arranged ·a . special
cvrdence th :h~ th e re ln vol ·;eo:l.,Clay L. Shaw. The F',[U. tbelr .luncht>on for Mr. · Shaw bn
and you c;m ass Lmae th .<t th eir rnaintain"d a. . complete ofiio:ial)Nov. 22; 1063, th~. day the Pre-S-
[ the VB.l. 's] conclusions we ri' sil<"nc<' on U1t~.malt<"r, . . and wouldoict?.nt di ed. . ·. ·. . .
f
l
i
I
I
!
QDJ/';Lf)
3. Du r inq th e s ummer of 1963, F;:::<&:.lt-- cam e in to ·t he off ic e of
attorney Dean Andre\vS from thre e to five times (XI, 325 et.
seq ) .
In I
Andrews' parlance/ thisman "could go to 'Fist City' pretty good:
I
if he b a d to" little and then only in ~panish.
II
I
/\.{l.. ...-r"-A o~l ..:Q
i[
li Nevertheless/ inner of fice v;ith P a ·tsy and s·.:o:-t !
I
,,d ·{~; 0
_,.v_...A.)/-\...J'I. I
!l there wit.hout comme n·t w[::;;,:~-:"'::3 Pat s y discussed his le g al problems I
!l
i: ·,('n !..... -.-] ;?
•"' i I
[!
with Andrews.
H
li ,.
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~I 4. During thi s period D1 th e
I
ii I
i!
Habana Bar with a man who spoke Spa nish and or~£~equil a
I
ji
;I (XIr p. 341 et seq ) . He identified him self t.Q__J~;v <c!r i_,s_:I;:..Q_B.o_dr_:h-
I
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.JR~~~o~c;_;I~d: 5916800 6 .
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• • •§I'III?.. Page 67 I
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" .. . ......'
·: :.
·, .. .
.··:
·.·'·
.. ' .
~. ·~""~t· .. ·.:.·
~ .. .-. ..,;,_ . ' ·::. ~ ~: ·.-:~··:. ~.,.; -:
CLA'f -.SHA t;J . (~)
-1·· ••• ••
DAvJ ~ rr~ f( \\te:" -·

-HEMORANDUM
- - - - - ·- - - - t>e/"lN . f'rNf;~twJ
<+~+ ~~~-<-T
~ :J ...... r''\ 016--'-'S)'-""""" .
September 18, 1967
To: · JIM GARRISON, District Attorney
FROM: JAMES L.-ALCOCK, Assistant District · Attorney
RE: EDWARD JAMES WHALEN, W/M 43

F.B.I. #346-8982
* * * * * * * ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *' * * * *
_ Edward James Whalen was borri · i~ Phil~~elphi~~

Pennsylvania, on December 10~ : 1923. · He · left school after the
9th grade to help support his family. · · From that time on .he has .
consistently been in trouble -with the law, and has spent most .·
of his adult life in prison~ His s~ecialty see~s to be armed \ .·'·' . ,.
. robbery , and burglary. He has -served time in the state -penitentiary

in Pennsylvani~ three times and has been selilltenced to the Federal
penitentiary a·t Atlanta, Georgia once. Since March, 1965, he . has
twice been declared incompetent to stand trial in the Federal
Courts by 'members of the staff at the United States Medical center
for federal prisoners at Springfield, Missotiri. Whalen also ~tated
that he had received some psychiatric treatment at the _state peni-
·. tentiary in Pennsylvania. He is prE;!sent1yawai ting a competency
f.- hearing on a federal charge of assaulting a United States Marshal
and escape.
- .... :.· , •.
After being paroled on December 10~ 1964 from the

Pennsylvania state penitentiary at Huntington, Pennsylvania, ~dward
Whalen went to Philadelphia to spend some time·with his family.
While there he became involved in some very serious criminal activity,
and had to leave town immediately. He stole a car in upstate
Pennsylvania and drove to columbus, Ohio where he met a friend of
his who told him he could make some big money. His friend, who~e
name he would not give me, placed a call to DAVID FERRIE in New
Orleans. WHALEN . spoke to ....FERRIE
-~ "-... . .- .
and FERRIE
~ ·. . .
asked ·--......-.
him
~w o~.lea~s~: :::~ ro~-e:re~w2;n9 Qolurobus'" WAI,EI~L~&JS toJ o. .tb.at thi:
'
..to CQill~
- -.--
, _. ~~ . '. ' ---
big money was to _be made by hi ttins; 7he Jul2_V!?.te Lend _a S!Jls.!..!::
~=~t§!i. ii:t...:{h~.::~if~F,:;>.ec,;tj,.Qn .c.L.B..gronll:...~.:O - Gravier §tre,~_ts..,.:. _
WHALEN definitely recalls being in Columbus on _February 21, J965...
EDWARD WHALEN drove to New Orleans in the car he

stole in Pennsylvania. It was a 1964 Chevrolet Impala hardtop.
This car was abandoned in New Orleans immediately upon WHALEN's
arrival. Shortly after his arrival in New Ot:'leans, .Y:fHALENmet
J2b.VE FERBif et ~ _absinthe...JiQ.!J.se. QO Bourbon Street. · FERRIE, who
was shabbily dressed, appeared intoxicated to WHALEN. At this
first meeting, FERRIE spoke of his flying ability. WHALEN told
FERRIE he needed money since he was on the run from the police.
[;t;;E;BIE S!,SJ~_\gec!_.him h~_£?!-lld earn._a ~arg:e sum Q~... mouey,, anS!.-e.2-!..
need beL he, FERRIE, WQI.JJS fly b.im O.ll,t 9..:t the _ co.t;ntr.x_. This first
. .
· -. ..._. ..
~
·-· ·
.'- . '' :,~;·-· .,·:-~t~ .·· . ..., .. -.... - •. ':!.,... ·,
-=--· . . - ·:---·:
··-, .
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 68

' ·. ··, . .'
"-'4 ' • . • ~.
meeting lastsd ab6ut 30 ~ ~iricit · thout FERRIE actually ~el• ing _

WHALEN the specific details o .. .' , .. ·
After this meeti spent the-night. a an

apartment provided by FERRIE. T · e ent ·, - as .WHALEN rec lls, .
was located near or on carrollton
with Tulane Avenue. FERRIE also p ovided
Galaxie Ford for his use while he w was-to meet
FERRIE and someone else at the Abs" ht at
... .. ..
a out 11:45"""" .........
P.N. -~
·. :·
l'lHALEN arrived at . nthe House

night. · Shortiy thereafter, FERRIE and C
_i?..troduc;_ed S:t-J.Ni._:to ~I,EN.
CLAY SHAW. At . this mee·tin
~-- -~ . . - ... .. . . .
felt SHAW was s~zing him up. urin _the co c QVE:!rs_at,to:Q:, · ··
~R-~_I,? £~fer.J?:~d ;to Sjg\W a~c C~Y BEI}T.,RAND. S~ hecgmg gp,y;i,g14s~. . __ ,. :·
i,_:p.:i.t.e.t..ec1 'Pu.t_s9.;iq _.nothi,n_a. $f.br£-s,t:l,Y ;J:o...f:I;:BRIF,; . . >' Upon · leaving -the · :<. ·. ·· · ·
bar, ·a 11 three · drove to · FERRIE s apartment ·: in· the . car -~ being... used ·_ :_~. - .c.. · · -·
1
by WHALEN. . .· .._._,~~ ~..·.~.~~ _,. •~- · ~-- . ~--. : ~:;(:(( .~::.: .. ·· ·. -----, ·.
. . / ·. _ . ~WHALEN n~~· · recalls : -- FER~IE- 1 s a artm~n~- ~~s·· :~~ ···:.· .... :

. / Louisiana Boulevard an . reened · .· :..
_. .f.r&Prt !a!?ESh. . They entered the rear _of t~e first floor .apartment . ..
.land remained ·in · that·· apartment . the entire . time. • ·_ However, . WHALEN c.:<: . . . _ .
· ~ecalls- FERRIE -going upst~irs occas' io~al~y' by t.t:ie - use of a :stairway '·-
. ~n the room next -to the· Jone they were us~ng. : WHALEN also remembers
PERRY RUSSO walking through the room on ,one ·occasion.. However, _ he ··
did not say anything to anyone in the room . . WHALEN stated that the
furniture in the apartment was old and inexpensive. Also, that•the
apartment was in a generally shabby condition.
.... '··. ' .. ,-;__
FERRIE finally got around to 'w hat' he and SHAW wanted_

- WHALEN to do for his money - they wanted someone killed~ . -· SHAW wa~ ·- ·-- ·· . -.;
to pay WHALEN ten thousand dollars before the job was don~ a n d '
anoffier :tifteen th~~s;nd dollar; '"after its completion. Upon ~om-
. Pfetion of the job, SHAW ~as to . prov~de LEN w~th ony pass- a
per a:r;... RRIE .~as to fly ·. ~m to Me~~~. · SHA"___~ __ c:., E:! ....._,.--.-- --- , ~.:,~n
!_o .he ~il!e.Cl.,.li~~-iJ19.. j:~.'"'9~~s.s ""!a~~~-t.__ l}i,IJl . .fg;r;,. ..~~~t_h~.!lg _
~C!t ~~<:t.B.~en ,d9,£e"" ~~.e.. ~,.i~~~ the....Ds~~.~i;,.J.f~ th.iE,J m,~l1-;l"a~ ....
,!;~'t;-......k':~.ll.£.-51 he wo .. · . ,.the Pi.lPWUt;I;~:t;Y fQL.Sl..l<J..I}S. t.~lU~ · ·_ . •
The intended victim 1 s name was not mentioned at this time. . WHALEN _ -
_ ~-9 D.o..)~~0::: c):e"J~),~_=J~~:E~~:R~;t~a;d,:to::§};;F~i~.::ii9~i,·'~~e -
" ~~..~IJ,g.t. .$tf?\l?L gq_~;_~~!:',§.:~r ..J:hree__hund:r:ed _d.?lla~IL~l?.~.~?:_~n,g,~?:t:l;..
WHALEN spent that night at a motel on Tulane Avenue ·

near the Fontainebleau. __ He did not use his real name to register _:
and cannot remember the one he used. ·
Thenext da ,_FERRIE met WHALEN at · oran 1 s Restauran

at 10:30 in the morning. FERRIE suggested they take a ride and
talk. While in the car FERRIE asked WHALEN if he had ever heard
of Jim Garrison. WHALEN said he had not. FERRIE then told WHALEN
that Gariison was the District or the man
·
............
w and e wan e
- .._...,,.,. - ..
~ led.
....., -
WHALEN at this time told FERRIE he
.. • r • .,.. -· ..-..o~=;>nQUf enos~ 7191::rr 4 ...
wanted absolutelX nothing to do with the deal •. FERRIE attempted _

t~ talk WHALEN intb"'goi~g 'th'roogfit w1tfi tTi;-plani but WHALEN per-
sisted that he would not have anything to do with it • . They then
--~-- -- -~ - ~- -
. .. :. .. -.- --~- ... ... _.
. . --
-. ~ - .
·:--~-- ----- ~- ·- ·;.:~ ·: _. _ __,.. ..-- ..... ,._ ...... - ·- -~ . ·.:,.,..··. ;> __.._
-2-
HW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page . 69 _.. ..·. .. -.- . ·.. ·-, ."·: ..-· - . :0-
~*::~',_
... _, <·: : -~ .
..,.:,.,...·f:~ :-.~.: ,) ·•
·. -~ '
·.. '•
parted with the agreement to meet the next night at the Absinthe
House. WHALEN spent that night at a motel on the Airline Highway.
He does not remember the name of the motel or the name he registered
under.
WHALEN and FERRIE met at'the Absinthe House the next

night as planned. From there th~ ~ent Qirect1g t~.SB~'s gD@Ibc~
/~men,!: +g_.,.t!;e !~~0 blo<;~. of n?l'H?fA~. ];~ej;, .. ~EN rw~m,b§E~-
/ a artment was on the f1rst but not the color of the front
door. He did not remember the courtyard until. specifical y -asked
about it. !!S:~ does not r§?.G9ll f)nx__ oJ... th~. ipte:r;io..r .Pf ,.tl;l~ apartn:..ent
~];:s:§Et tb,at, j.,t .. »'.alii '!.era: .!,.~vish.,. .. -_- . · ~ ~""" bl~ill .
. t\~1)~1fW,J""
Af first only SHAW, FERRIE and . in the

apartment, and SHAW and FERRIE were trying to persuade WHA:C _to
go through with· the plan •. About one half hour after nd
FERRIE ' s a r r iva 1 ,, ~a_··~s~h~o~r,_t!::._.:!::.f~a:.;t::...·~m~a:!.:!n:.=.L:a.s.JOU....!-I.~_u.,O..L..A.-->:;-w:L~.s::..;:,~u...Jt...L.~~-
~his msm wa~ iu.troduced to ..~L:tf~ by SHAW as_nt;~~~;~ug~§ 1 ~W~
~nd ~HAW hadJ ~orw conversa;ti,on awax ~;\;.QW. E~1ILU.E~4'JFL anL
'.. 'short! thereafter- t. SHAW then returned
to WHALEN and continued to try:to persuade him. 'SHAW said that he
~d ,done some,., cb;?._~kj.ng on WJ:.Jf>~••:~N an~ t,~a"!= .!;1~ k.Jle':'l.'o~-WHAL~N 's . ...
9r.fppled daus.,h!;.,e:r; .::-.-.AU.~- ,sl¢....t,{~e.9-, Jrgrn, .12.Ql~o,. , ~,SHAW ,.§ltid that 1~f
,!'JHAL~-~~u!:~ Si~- thr<?.~gll--~~t;.h,j;lJ.$ ,.. f.?l8JL .. b.fi \'l.O~. g.at a ter
· ~E!: f1!1~.~th ~edica.~....:!;,ref!tmep~ rpe~Y _co~ld b~~~ s,ee tor'it _ . - . . _--_ 1
that she was sent to college.-· However, WHALEN insisted that "ne ___:_)
-ouid-not. ki!I .. a:: District Attorn~.¥.~ and he and FERB,IE left.
on.ce o~tside, FERRIE to.ld WHALEN that CLAY BERTRAND

could do a lot for him andthat he was making a mistake. -Also at
this ti~e FERRIE spoke of . LEE OSWALD. He sa.id that SHAW. (BERTRAND)
had done a lot for OSWALD, and that it was.only because OSWALD ,· .·
fouled up that he was killed •. He intimated that SHAW had given .·
OSWALD some ~in~ncial. support: and had cor;t~d so~p~e~ple in . -~.
cuba· and MexJ:.co. for. h1m. · ·A~~~ ~. ~Y
~- ' __.- _.~-·- -<- . ·:· ... _ ·_·- :.
· · .. -. -At· this ti
. JOHN TOWER of Texas· and
o mentioned the nam~ of SEN
NTE 'MAROCHINI FERRIE boasted - t he .. ~lf' )>.
had set up the assassination of John Kennedy. WHALEN s
( ._ _·__A he did not believe these statements~ He felt FERRIE as merely . - _ ~ ~
l~ boasting and nam_ e-dropp-ing. in an attempt- to get hi to change his
ted thatJ. r
«\ 1 J:?
n
~~ · mind. F IE also mentioned the m§?etin _ e . . · .J CK UBY . t!~
f'_:H:::~!:~LEE R,ARVEY O~~~!;D.-~;n.Baton .Rouge~ ~~~~.~~a:p,~ _FERR!E sta-ted .· t-~ ....
~,:.,..>) th-~t ?_s"!!'__~ \vc:_s_ ,a';' .~.-g.ent __-~_f --~~-e. _c_ _IA_. ~_ e_ _ _ i_~~~J:!~_o_ n_ey_·_·-··f-·r___ o_ _ rr.t__ them fl_-.kJ_-~-+
:L(;'~, ~~~~~~~~ -~;~\k;<f1~.~:;~~-~~ .~~~~e{:~5:~~Y J~~ 1"
l~ J / et_<;>._n~_ time~C[.tr1~t--~_J <:~~~,E]__I!e'd- oT'V€1'6
ir:,) p .. FERRIE al
~f ,~h~t_cr._oy"'~n_!.- f ~
...
tated that they haCf13e3i1
tfie reacter _
,;i s1de"_ 1nf<:_?rm.at_1on
~~ REWS that Jim Garrison was about to start an investi- .
~ .. -) t d • WHALEN
~0 ~0 - .
Yf
\
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·_-;.:
~.r -~'1?.H~:;:;1:i"\:,. . .. . ·. :. , _. '.
.••.••..••• , .. !.
£• • ··
f . ·:~· , • .
.. . . . ..
.. : ~
: . ~.. . .
I;". . ;; ~ - '-~ ·~-
: -_. .. . ': .· .. · ... .• • - >';I
• ·- ·: -_·. .. ,. ··-. ·· . · .. ':.. · ·
. . ·~: ' _:
while being transported ba~k · to Miami for ~etrial, he escaped. ·. He ·.
was quickly recaptured and since ' then ha~_.::Qe .e~~.u.nci:u..g bac~·.
· .forth }?.§tween ·t~ Duva! county jai1 in ~sksonvi].le, F~ori.~ and ; .;_ ·
·.. the @nited S!=ai;e~. Medf9.il S§~t~r. at SJ.2r~ngf~e~~·. Missour};.) It was ·
·. at Springfield that he was twice found not competent to stand . ·
· trial. WHALEN told the doctors that people were putting things . in · ·
his food, and that the riourt, defense and pr~secution attorneys ·
and SENATOR .•JOHN TOWER of Texas were all conspiring against him.
EDWARD JAMES WHALEN identified the . following pictures:
1 .·. PERRY RAYMOND RUSSO
2 • . DAVID W. FERRIE s~anding _ by an airplane •

. -· '
·3. DEAN ANDREWS -. ' - · . . ~ : .
.. -. .. .. ., ·
. . ·-.-.. . -~
.·
·: · ·- . : :.· . -... ·:;
: . .-. 4. CLAY. SHAW · ·.·. _·, :_ ..
.--:'
.. ~ ·-.
. '
. •.· .
5 ~ . LEE . HARVEY OSWALD ..
·., '.''; -·,· ·.- ·.

·_ :_: .... _.
, . '• ... ' . . 6' . . JACK RUBY .·:'-"
.. ·
EDWARD ~AMES wHALENdid not - identify the · follo~ing
· ·.' pictures·: ;.· . ·.: · . · .. · .· .. . ·· ..
. . .. ·.·. -:.·. •' ..
-·:: -
·"'. :
JACK MARTIN ' ' .·.. . JAMES PHELAN ' : ~- _ _,.-:_
.. ·.. . GORDON NOVEL ·..·· JULES . KIMBLE 'p-. ·
LAYTON MAR'l'ENS . . ·· .. .. . IRVIN . DYMOND

H. H. ANDERSON . · . BILL GURVICH
-. ·· ·.: .
SERGIO ARCACHA SMITH WILLIAM BLACKMAN ,
GERALD SEELING DAVID GENTRY
SYLVIO RIBEIRO DE CARVAL . DON DOOTY .. .. . :..~
'· ~.
ALVIN BEAUBOUEF & BURTON KLEIN . MARIO . BURMUDEZ

PEDRO GUTTIERREZ ROBERTO CORTEZ
JERRY. P. HEMMING · . JESUS GUAJARDO .. ' ·
..•. ROY HARDGRAVES . SANDRA MOFFETT
JAMES LEWALLEN .. . BATILLO .( F • N. U. ) .
THOMAS COX JOSE DE ROMARI
·wiLLIAM DALZELL UNKNOWN :,.· '
CELSO HERNANDEZ . '• WILLIAM ZETZMANN · ·· •. ·...
. : JAMES HICKS . .
DONA MARIE D ANTONI . . . :~ ...:.
I
LEOPOLDO GUAJARDO ·· LAWRENCE HOWARD

DIAZ LANZ LORAN HALL
STEVE PLOTKIN GUY GALABADIN (& 3 other :·w/subjs.
.· WILLIAM SEYMOUR · in .military uniforms (USMC) ·'
DALLAS BENTON GUTHRIE CARLOS BRINGUIER
JULIAN BUZNEDO
:,..i_
. ..· .
WHALEN's attorney i~ THO~ S· I?IGGS,_JR., B<:;rriet,t .. .. ·.

Bank_~ui~ing, Jacksonville, Fl~rida t~~ep~one 35j-3645.
...... · ·.·:--· -:. .. · .. ... ···-~: ·- ;.~

. · -.
.'- .' ., ' :: ·-~~ ·. ·' ··~.- ·~~·; ·...
,.' ·
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 71
- ·.· _.. -------·· -~-·· .. ·- --.. -···· · -t \ '"
.· ~: SH~w (~/ :
. Nam cfl anti nd!"lrelisrs civilian phy s idans ,.-ho have trcnted you ft • Ric!<ne~s. dlseal'e, or injury, prior to,
during. or sinf:o your scrr·icL·7
3·1. X ~~--~-=--=--------.-J-.-.-:1;.>-r..-::l:-'.:._-•.-:~-
,_, -l·:_
i'i_T-:A-J)_O_J_o_'_
s3--------,-3
-ll-J.-l-)-xs-·~~-~-~~-,-
.I-1'-Y------....,.-:l-7-.-l.-)A-.--r-r-;-,---
D~-<~== :£'}> '~~~===~=~-l-~·_I:__/:_.:_l__::~_c~-·-<,~~-:_,·_:_(_;_··_,_:~~~~~~=~-~"-",_:-~-,_~·- ~.,. '~:~_-~'- ,_'-_~- " '·_[" ;~-. ·-~_r=· _-i~n~_·_::t_L_j__-_-_-_-_-_~r-c-)·_v_.~·_1_9_:_;_6__
;-
Names :-.nd ad;l n, s ~ e :; of nll !JeTSOllf; other t!tan p;lysidans who know nny facts nhoul uny sicknel'ls, dii<CIIIie, or injury
which you hnd prior !o, during, or f'ince your >;crvicc.
~~: N A~t ;; ·- -- -~~-~----·___ J_-:-3::-!l_• . ,.r.,. I_,_~.,:__s_:·:_i'i_T_-,-A_t_li_n_t_I>_r;s_·-·-----+-:::·1_0_._J_).,..xfl_,._'-=·'_n_.x,.TY--:----=,-----111. DATE
J.:l:;i~.__i~:ti.G.p__~;:,_:;::__=~-=~~----/j3±-~:;¥~t b • o~:;~'t~;;c~~j nal 1n year of 1 ;,
3
Jf you sen-cd in \\'orlu Wnr I or II, ~ivc the nnmc:s nnu :lildresscs of cm;>loycrs nnd your monthly cnrnings for the 24
months precedint: you; i!lll;:unce into the active military or navai ~< e rvice. If self-employed, so slnle.
12. EMPLOYr.n Ni,;·fEl !d•!D ADDREt!S 143.
.
Occul•ATION
EAHNINOS .
AND 4•! . DuTIES l'BuFOR:O.IEu 45. DATES
..
i{c -~r.l.ic1c lc~ c Lrv

To:)_ ~ .s . t o 1/19!-.?.. .
; :: ..
·······--- J!G. Ii you served in \Vorid Wnr II, at.ate tho fo llowing: liip;hest. grnde completed in:
\ . . . ..
("--....... ClllAJHIAR 6<:HOOL ilWH Sci!OOT, COLLKO» U"IVKR61TY 47. Stnt.o nny special study (ns business, professional, trade,
academic)
. ~~ t h ll ~-. h -·
---~--~--------~----------~--------.---------------.-----------------
48. State where yoF st ud ied 19. Length 50•. Did you graduate 51. Did you complete
of sp ecinl f ro m special special study? -
s tudy school?
52. What is your t.rl\dil or voc;.tion7 53. Are vou 54. If employed, state ernplo)~cr's ·nnme
employed?
l/{1 11-::.;-=-,_ :r - Trz:.de: Asf3o.c1ation Ycr.5 Jnternationo.l Tr:.:c18 L:.:n·t

---------------------------~----------~~----------------.-------------------
55. What ls your entire income per month? State sources of your income. 55. What is the value
of your es tate from
· all sources?
..... .
( _$
...... _
5-fC' , ,•ee-,_
'. . :;;;;'
I DATES OF EMPLOYMENT . Tl;\IE LOST

NA ~iE AND ADDRESS OF EMPLOYF.R
•.
I
--c,--,----..,--.--~,--,,.--.---,.---,-~--.-.,.--,----t--,B,-£_o_I::mrN_, __
. o
I ENot~o \VT.EKI.T
!
1 Mo,.Tm.T Mo>n'lls DATa
·. .
/-,\ ~(~l)~:r__;_1_·t_.~_.. J_:_:•_.;_~·_0_:i._o_i_,_~_l___T_~_·c_\_rl_c___. :_~_tr__t~.,~l_!_l~-·~'-~l._}_·J_._c_t_:;_·~-s~,~~~/~"~·-r~'·~~;~:,~·~·:L·r~~~)~~~·"~'c~~~;(~"~u•~l·t~-~~---~~12~~·-1-----~~'-~-

~~-----· ----------~---~----------------"-'· _"_'_·_________ r----------\~:!__;_·,_o________~------~~~----~r-~---r-----
·~(3~)____________~-----------,--------~------~------~---1----~--~----
liS. Are you being furnis hed . hospitali 7.ation If so, Htn.ta what institution and :WdreBS of same
or domicili:uy cnre by the United States
or nny political s ubdivision thereof?
!I'
l:i9. J\1: n r i t n I GO. T i 1n e fl Gl. Date, place, nud nnmo of spou«e of each marriage
Gtatus married
C ·j l" r}:
~J .. A~~~··----,-----L---------~.L----------------------------------------------------------,-------------------
' . G2. Dnte .:.nd place of dissolution of your mnrriages
G::l. Times your present wifo G4. Date, place and name of spouse of each of her marriages
l~ll':l bee n marriea·
----~----------------
G5. Date and olnco of di si:!olutioo..of wifo'a former 1nnrringcs
68. U sc ··~his sp r.ce to continue (by box number) rcmarl~s for j)~>gC8 2 arid 3. See bnok for further cont.inuHtion.
- --- ·- - - - - - '--_ _:.._____.::____________.________________ --:----'-~----;;l&-11;:::::;;~1><r3
... .:...~·-- -·~.~-. : ___. .

Nanw s :;nd ntldr<~ SSC':l nf nll pcrsonEI oth er Utan p:lysicinus who know uny facts nl>out any sicknesR, diseal'e, or injnry .
which you had jli"ior to, during, or s ince your ~; c rvicc.
3 8. N..un; j30. Pn~;si>NT An t~I_t_t:~_s_s_·------·f-:::·.1_0_._D-,.-I._A._\_,JJ_II_.I-::-T_Y-:---=-----',_,~_,u_._D_A_.'l_'_P._ _,.,..
.l.:>:o_. __j>)i-""---'' 1""' "--_~--~t~,'tG-.-· ____c~; :;:,:;~e~~jnal fin your llJ of
If you scrv;,d in 'Yoritl \Vnr I or II, give the names and addresses of employe rs and your monthly curningH for the 24
months preceding ·yL>-..r. entrance into the actin! military or naval s ervice. If self-empioyed, no sta te. . .
42. EMPLOYI;n NAMB A ND · ADDREss 1•13. O,ccui•ATION AND •H. DoTIES P E UFORMBi> 45. DA.n ;s
},AUNINOS ·
r~ c · ~(l :L c1c Loc t1:o· I3u::.·c.:::u

T'o :..i :..~s .. to 1/19!~2 .
I
· · - -~ - 1G. li you served in World \Yar II,-st.nt~ tho fol1mving: Highest. gw<le completed in:
GnAlJ)IAn ScHooL iliGH Scrloor. COLUOJI UNIVK'RI!ITY 47. Stat.o any special study (u..<l businc.ss, professional, trade, .
ncademic) · · ·
. ~ ·:=
· _,.
llt h :
· 4.8. State wbere you s t,udied 10. Length 50 .. Did you graduate 5L Did you com'{'leto
of ape cia l from special special study
study · school? . .
·-
~ .•
52. What is your trade or voct•tion'f 53. Are you 54. If employed, state employer's ·name
employed?
Internation:.'.l Tr :.~dc L;::1.rt
55. What is your e~ tire income per month? State sources of your income. I 55, Whnt is the value . . ~ . . . ..
of your estate from
all sourccs7
~----------~---------------------
··.t :rt~tcrn:l t, i o·:~n.l Trac1~
.
;.
,. . .... · J
~- ·
.
DA'i'ES OF EMPLOYMENT F.ARNTNOR TI;\lE LOST
NA?>IJ<: AND ADDRESS OF EMPLOYJm
'
IlEOlN111NO ENOrNo Wr-EKLT I ;l.tosrm.T Mosm.'! DAYS
(1) In t;_ ~r 11:J. -~:to n a l T\ ·ndc . :.a rt, J"i;_~ ·. ·.':.. C:! · J(.~ ~-~.r! s , 1/F·-'. () 7 r1 1~r,. :.; cnt $ - i~
.. .o~ '). ')
J .: · i. • -c ~L.~: 1c
(2) I
• (3) I
If so, st.n.t.e whnt institution and addresa of tJa>:ne
58. Are yon being furnished hospi ta.l ization
or domiciliary care by the United States
or any political s ubdivision thereof?
No
59. l\Iarital GO. Times 61. ·Date, place, and name of spou:;.e of each marriage
-
..
sta tus m arried ;
cine).; - -
. 62. Date and place of dissolution of your rnarri::lge11
..
63. Times your present wife 64. Date, place and name of spouse o.f each of her marriage.~
l:as been rn~Urie<l
65. D1\t.e a nd nl &ce of dissolution ..of wife's former marriages
\ .· .. .
OS. Use ··~his ~;pace to continue (by box number) remarks for pagca 2 m;d 3. See back for further cont.inun.tion.
------·-----------~--~--~~~----~--------------------------------~~--~--------~-----ltl~~~~ ~~~.-- ..
.,. . .
: ~ ::t~
. ·. ,:;· ~·- .
. ·. . y~.
···:· ---- -.. -- .. -· :·--~- ---~-;-:_s;~:;,;J - {~;- ··-!
. _. .Nanl Cfl. and ndilri,Rf:le;> ~ ci vili:m physi<:inns who !:ave treate<l you f< Ricltn ess, dlse nfle, or injury. prior to,
dunn:,!, or s snco your :;ervlc'-' . ~ . . . · .
l'ra;:; ENT /35. Anom,ss I3G. DI:;Anll.ITY :H. DATB ·
-------------------------------~-----~
D_l:_._i!.l!:L:_ C ~ t_t~t:--';~'-':~~-:-. :_·1'------
I I O o:-~ . ···: r·
0; J:. . :·"
CJ:~n.:c, :;r;\! Crvsl ·~cd 0pinetl 'ov 1Q'6
1'--_1_,•:_'-·--------------jf---1'-;-_rt_r_·t_.l_·._l._r.l..::f:!..;.n_,___________+--·--· ___ ----~"
N:tllW S r.nd a<ldr;isses of nil pe rson!! other than pilysicians wlw know any facts nhout nny sickne."R, di!!Cal'e, or Injury
which you lwd prior to, during, or .::ince your ~:;crvice. · · . .
38. N AMJ-; 30. l'm-;c. r,:NT AurntEc.s 40. DHlAilll.tTI 41. DATP:
J.:l':.;}_..__D._;li__;~~~ k 1'·'' ----~----=L,~-«5'-'7-..:1::..:.c-:::c.::_-•.n. ;_~:~-=·==·-=:=============~=0:;:·-,=;_:: _"s:. .: .r-c:.c~-:...""~-P....,.:i,.._l_l_u...,.l:-----t-_,I,..n-y-~

., -r.-.o._r_o_f 19
- - - -- - --- ---- ------+-:: :i_:...l..:._ ~: ::::_<_~~-~0_:' t ,._ l_.::.:l.-=·------t- :. C_;_·.l_··_t._:i._J_.c_,g"->c - ------r-----·--- 1"3
If you s erved in \Vorl'd \Yar I or II, t,:ive th e nam <•s and addresses of employers nnd your monthly earning~ for the -24
months preceding Y•lilr e ntrance into the active military or naval service. H ~;e lf-employed, so stale.
43. OccuPATION AND 44, DoTIES PEnFORMBD
EA!I N INOS .
Lu c Kc ! ~i ck Loctro Bu~csu ·
':.' < , --;
4G. 1i you served in World \Ynr II,· st.ate tho folrowing: Highest. grn1le completed in:
- ~- GnA>HIAR ScaooL Ilwa Scnoor._ COLUOII UNlVJ<R81TT 47; St.nt-c any special study (n.a business, profess ional, trade,
( . '· . : . : \- , · academic) . ··-·f .
..::·· ·'
· · · 48• .State where you studied · ·.> 49. · L~'Tlgth 50. Did you graduate 51. Did you complete
of ape c i al from special ·. . specsal study? . . ,
study school?
.,. . - :f' '
52. What is your tmde or voc~tion? S3. Are you 54. If employed, state employer's ·name·
employed? . ; . ·.
55. What is your el)tire income per month? State sources of your income. 56. What is tho vnlue --.
of your est-at.e from
all_sourcC8?
(J~/t:;~
s /' _;·'~.J_. . · 0-:0~- --' ...,,_. -, o, •.L~1·
·I.,,
··"'•:1, ~..I"'
J • • .. lJ J
r.c_,, ,lC.'"J'
J '·'--'".•\ ' '
· • -;·J T_ntr.~Y'.l1:t tl·a·:, , ._-_, .l
- .. 'Trade~ ''
I
57:'--B~IIk II!Uh ~-5 ILIH~ .dthe.,.jC3"0F Fomiet Cllijl:iJ) U:! r. "V"" '•
DATES OF EMPLOYMENT F.ARNmos T TIME LOST
NAJI.U! AND ADDRESS OF F.MPLOYF.R
E:-mrno
(2j
. (3) I
58. Are you being furnished hospit,alization If so, stnt.e what insti tution and addreBS of same
or domicilia•:,• cnre by the United States
or any political subdivision thereof?
------------~------_J~o
59. l\f n ri t n I GO. T i m e B 61. ·Date, place, and name of spou<"e of each marriage
·status married.
Sin;)~
. 62. Date and place of dissolution of your marriages -~ ~
- /~~~\· i l~-,-·r-:9--......:.
. · :.· ,F_·_
--------;-------.--'-___:____________:___--:-_~--~------:k/:-"_-'+·.:-?'--"
'. ·:::..._,.-_-"=" "'-' / :c-.':'
63. Times your present wife
b•ns b ecn marnecl
.
64. Date, place nod name of spouse of each of her marriages / y· ·. ..1.;>/~') ..........
~'::;/
- .-~ 1
--:_ _ · , · :'•
., 1':::-{_ '.:1 · ·~-..,.. •· ·.. '·' .
· "-·<'· ;
65. Date and ul ace of dissolution ..of wifo'a form er marriages

. i~ ~;:.·:;>~~;?~;~ /
' y
. _l U__...,..I/~ /.-.-. . ,·,.:
._,-\ .; . . / ? ~ ·~/*l :.
-- ---'--~-----------'----~-------------·-.,.r_..-;;\~-c'
, -.?}.LL-t
- ,.. _·_- (/V.· ··
M. Do vou lin-, l G7. If not, state reMon and your wife's pre.~ent-addresa
t og'cther? !
· f' '~"----
,, --~ - \ \ v
<:
_ -·_....... ,· . v_ '_;,_·"-",___c:, ;.
I
i
68. Use ~his ~;pll.ce to continue (by bo:c number) rcroarka for pngca 2 and 3. See baok for further cont-inuation.
• , . .:.:..:· ,.
..· ·
------ --~--------~--------~~----------------~--------------------~--~~~------~----~1~~~~~~~~~
. > .;:-~ ~t~:~i{~:{i-~- .
.. "" .
:~
".'{
, ----·---------- -------------- ---- -;- --- -----,,:·; ----:-- ----; _,_,_r·---,.-;:-··-=-·:;_-:;.:~~~7-~:.-
~
.
.
.
. ...
c;
. (·
_··
i I .
.
•
...
.r\.e~:;1.ni t.ula tiQ.D.___QJ:.. ....:1S~tivitv in New Orleans

On Sa t:J.rc1..::ty, Dee 17th T c o ntacted Judy Ande rson, an ex-dancer at Sid Davilla 1 s club,
and ,-::;he maintains that sh::. met Jack Ruby on hro se parate ~ccasions in t he Spring of 1963
at tbe Hnrdi Gras club. These occasions 1,;ere, she estimates, tHo \Jee ks apart. She said
Ruby 1.-/'lS tltere doing bw:;iness with Sid Davilla.
On Sunday Dec 18 t h , I at t ended t he Nass Ra lly of Cuban: exiles at City Hall, and spok~
to Frank Bertucci and Ed. BLltler of INCA. I late r \:ent and spoke. to Butler at the INCA.
office on Camp St. I H<:W or:ly t he re a short time as he had to leave, but he gave me a
cop y of the re cord, 11 e~:>W.A19: Self Portrait in H.eda , which INCA has had published. This .
record contains the i:·IDSU co nfrontation bet1.;een Butler, Oswald. and Bringuier, and also an · , ...
11 analysis" of Osi.Jald 1 s Communist trained debating techniques by Butler. At one point But--,::,,:;'\': ··
ler claims . to have made s. 1'l tudy . of.Oswald, and claims .to .have met .·other .Cub8.n~ refugees.·~-""'"';t,_~~s~;~~
besides Bringu.ier ~..rho knew Osl-iald. I had an appointment the next clay to see Butler, t-ihen :-' : . ;:·: _; ? .
I intended to ask him >,;ho these people Here, but he did not show up. I 1-Jas a little sur- :. . ·
prised to see that. they had the complete 26 volumes of testimony before· the lvarren Cornm--- -sir:
ission in their offices, .as · well as many back number magazines pe rtaining to the assass-- .
- inat.ion. It i s m· f e eling that th ir~ n.,..qa nization, and in particular Ed Butler would be ·
~+ _uorth checking 011t :nore carefully in re gar ·;o Gne a ssasc:ination, I think this ,,roqld >
have t o be done disc reetly hm<ever.

I ~; poke to _[\rs. Capps_,9n l·!onday about her knowledge that F'errie should be investig-'3.t"'J
regarding the assassination. She said s he had read in the Times Picayune of Dec. 1963
th.'3.t he i.Jas one of the peo ple interviei-Ted by the FBI in connection ~.ri th the case. She
had met Ferrie once at some kind of a girl scout n eeting attended by her daughter_ Hary.
Thi ~; ,_,ra.s about 10 years ago. The Capps family a re also fri e n1ly Hith the Brownlees, and
E3.ry kne1..J Horris Brm-mle e q uite 1.rell. Hrs. Capps said she d id not thi.Rk Harris could be
Ferrie 1 s godson, as he, Bro•ml e e, tJas JeHish. 1:.-lrs . Capps identified l-irs. Robert J. Durr
of 20!l- Shrei-JSbury Cotlrt an ;~ omeone \-rho kne'"' Ferrie, but not, she thinks, ii\ recent years.
Another name mentioned t.Jas I(ay Cunningham, not.J married and living in Texas.-'(I<ay's moth-
er is appare ntly the Postmaste!" of Hetairie.) ·
1
A.l though I do not believe the Capps know t:ur thin;r of imoortance a bout this case
Har.i Capps told :.-:J.e tha . s ·1e oe le·1e3 3he also met anothe'C man 1-1ho knew Ust.Ja~d and 1.--Jas 0
t. d :i.. strlu Utl ng leaflets 1.Jl t,l, lt~! ;l . ~I•.-"'k ·/,;;) 1' she :is vague a b oat it and cannot rene;nber ius
name. ln case you 1..Jant to 3peak to her about this, she can be contacted at the Depart-
!7lent of Sociology at Tulane Universit Yo
Volwne VIII of the vlarran report d isclose s that one ether person 1-1ho kneH Ferrie
0 1.-ras Sdward Voebel, o ne of 0sHald 1 s fe~.., h igh school friends. As of April?th 1964 ( vhe n
his testimony v:as taken) Voebel lived a t /~916 Canal S t. As I mentioned, Frederick 3. · ·
0 '3 r:.lli·van a lso knew Ferrie and . Os Hald, ~:l nd testified that, after Fe rrie ~.ras arrested,
he ,.;ent out T,._rj_ th Lieut. Pau.l Di.,rye r from the Ne'.,r Orleans Police Department to Ne'.r Orleaij.s
Air port to see if Fe rrie 1s plane was flyable, t-ihich it ~..ras not •
.. •bne
n n .I spoKe ' · ~uav1c,
-co · 1 .c.,c;HJ,::>
-- •
on ' ec l"ry""h , 11e
' gave r:;e some f ur t',ner 1n.1.
. 0rma t.10n '-·.rnlc
' . h -·
·o· . J:' •
he d.·i r] l"'r')+. __ ;r,p"",r·i r. n i -., hi,. De c 15th intervie l·.'. He said he b:=tcl lT1 Y'P roe<:>> .1.__, . h~.:::>.,
, .L s. t , ~~e·v lnvollled ~vi:~~l hi: in ano:th~_ ?.nt,i-_ ~
.~h-'"1 •--:- !..)":"Tt:l
:<
. "" :::'lnt~-h:;::~'P.'l ~ ~mp. .J..t ho .. d fip c _,q1(· ;1 ;}e' _:cnn n~
~
.., ..o.._
. . t:r... t.qr?e'-'-'l''t::-~··..... ~ '
·:1· . . - ~-"':_n cn c;o I 8 r ;~r~i ~: . ~ 1· Y'., ~"'~ •
il.f ter errivl" -~ in D3.llas, I contcted Hr. and Hrs. Buck •- ~P.rrell
~ r,~.·~·.-~6 •Ho1~lar.d)
Lf-':f'Y-' •• as
they had told a frit:: d of mine in N.O. that th8y were willing to help on the assassin-
ation. Buck Ferrell h::d. 1·torked at the D8 ·.-mtowv. Lincoln Hercury ca r f irm., and he uas
res~Jonsible for orovicli~'' the Lincolns for ths motorcade on l>1ov .22 nd 1963. The nain
epi~ode ~-1hich' he , discuss~ ..- is r eferred to in "Ttw Second 0 sHald 11 , -by Richard Popkin,
(page 64 ). On No,remb,~r 9th,. ~ _.. 3, ~·rho sa:i..d his name Has Lee OsHald came in to
~- _.....P\
(t/i~,l
( ( <"&
~- . ~ .
cJ_r-
·.
. ~ .
' .
. . _, ., _.-.:. : . ~ , ...
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 75
r
c· '
buy a car. He T.-Jas handled by salesman i'l.l'oe:et Bogard, 1.-:ho took him for a dri va, and
Os1..rald also dro7e, (although supposedly a non-driver.) This episode is no'..r quite 1.-rell
kno\m and has been dl.sc u:::sed in more than one of the assassination books. However, the
follo'Aing ~e:.r information has' been given to me by Bob Teter, a friend of Buck Ferrell's.,
Teter ~mrh:ed at this ti;na sellirig cars Hith Bogard. A~9nt. ~ . ve.aks bs::fore thR ~r;assin~tin·A
a......_r:e'·' sales man Has h:ir.!~.d ._ by the na!7l.p of {acy:k L..~JiJ;J~nr;r::.: LaHr~nce HaS frQm ·l~.i~-L)Yrl"eans 1 -
ana dv.1 1)~~11 disqll<lr;,,::~ej._from tne US Armv fnr 1•"'inrr an avoued Cast:r:'o sv:mpathiser Accord-
}"ng"to T~Jer, he had-e~ bee n r.1.1sin.ng out lj.te:r?-t.ure of a lef't vr:i,r;g__ t" e ln ]\feH Or- eans-~
t(S t§t-vrrence was ne1."' to the establisnmen , hey did_ nC?_t . end him a car, QJl;t og he c av Oi
tJ · + • , .hL Q 1· t:31.- 31.· ·_.r ~~ .•·r
~"'~<lS);.::~~S?.-_:j;~~~~bon ... h 1,fl , - -~. one f orso m~
1~:-p " t !1tT,o ~· t., ·
1 A e -~so .:~
(3. ?se.s .sinal~Ton Ls-vrrence _ ~~~'rae · .<; Jin,.,. 'n
1 • t. of breath sayinP" that hP '"' ~ ,::ro:l. n<Y to q i·'-
his iob tfp hn.,_ n t 1v~er> ahl·B because of the traffic SO a noth_e r
~lesm"ln .. ,_,'ent ou,.t ~~n :.ll n :!.n: aw Jney go" the car. -,_.rhlc 1.ras p3-rked near the assas.::;ina t.:i l'\
_J,.it.r~ Short::.y afterHaru.s Jhe FBl iritervie!..;ed Lawrence; t he n et him go, saying -L~ey
Hould be back to se~.. However, when they came back Lawrence had gone, and, according
· to Teter, they are ~~ looking for him. He.Jmo,..Ts this because t hey periodical,ly come
round. :=tnd question !nm about La',Jrence. Lawrence 1 s name does ~ appear in the 26 volumes
of the ~Jarren Report, and the la1.oryers questioning the 2 salesmen Hho did appear before
the Commission, Jl.lbert Bogard and Frank Pizzo, did not Ollf)Stion th=-m r;hntrf-, L.:n.rrencewi Sub-
sequently, Bogard has e,lso :lisappeared, and Buck Ferrell said he heard he \.Ja.S now dead.
(In his testimony, Bogard states that he was born in Cowshatta, La., and raised in I-iall
S u;nrni t, La • ) · . ·
The Ferrells, Hho have been ver-tJ helpful indeed, also attempted to get Frank Pizzo
to come rou..t'id ostensibly for a cup of cof'fee, but then to bring up the subject of the
assassination, but he Has out; however it shohld be possible to do this
was sales manager and also sa1,.; the alleged Os'" J,
a~lo + ~1lk.. to' "' l r'ZO "l.~' <Jc•r·or·'li"'"' T
1
l.L v v~ J ... rJ ..J . C.: '·~ ' l..- • .- ·..J '-A. ,.
.... don 1 t need to eri1phasise vha t a valuable contact the Ferrells are, in a city 1...rhich
,., . tends to be v-ery unfriendly to people 2.sk.ing ques·tions a bout the a ssassination. Hrs. Fer-
rell is the headmaster's secretary at Greenhill College Prep., c.yschool at~ended by sever-
a l childre n of pe ople Hhose names come up in the Index of the ~.Jarren Report, and. she
believes it Hill be easy to contact them. The Ferrells also know several friends of Y:ar- .
ina OsHald Porter, and they imagine it -.,.Till be possible to arrange a !lleeting with her.
(EoHever I am not bank..i..ng on this!) (Narina, and her ne>.J husband recently bought a beer
· tav'ern close to -~-~here the Ferrells live; apparently they a re on the. verge of divorce.)
Returning to Jack La1.rrence, the only description I ha're of him is that he <.Jas about
24 years old at the time. Of courae, one problem is that he rr..ight have been using an
alias., However if you have any photographs of anyone you think might be him, I can show
the:n to e:L ther Frank Pizzo or Bob Teter for iden·~ifica tion. ~ f'"~ ~ 1\\ &
a.
•r_
information has come to light "f..lhich mi1l!"t 'e valuable in in~res tigating the Ferrie..
·~~ct of the case. Harold lJeisburg, in his book published tt-To vreeks ago, \,iHITE~JA.SH
~THE FBI -SECRET S8RVICE COVER UP, has tL'1Co" pre11iously unpublished Secret
.3ervice Report by Charles E. Kunkel, (Docurnent 5.33 in Eile 87, Folder 4.) This report
covers the period from Nov.24th to Nov.JOth 196.3, and of particular interest is a lengtht
intervie'-'1 Hith Ha.rina Os i·Iald on No,rem.ber 24th, the night Os~.Jald Has shot. The intervie\o~
had appa~ently ended, l·~rina having complafuner:l of fatigue, \·rhen (quoting from p.l9 of
\-IHITE\JASH II): 1 This note, attributed to no-o ne, appears:"Due to further information
having been phoned from Hashington to Inspector Ee lley 1.-Je have more questions to be asked.
of l-1rs Os'.-Jald. ~·fe Hill continue. 11 The questions phoned from~ashington in such great
""t.' excitement were, di::l she kno~.r or k~o1.-1 of a Leonard B,eisrnan at Tulane University; the
"'''.- {Cormnittee for Peaceful AlternatiYe~ ... or 11 ~ ffr, F'.nrn:; 11 . H~r qnsHep w:p·:; n;'!;7Rtive. 1
· No such person as 11 Fetrr' 11 is l~sted in the inri<>x in V DJ Q~ ' " ' t··, ,... H.enort
;c.us v sm·e." re1.'er to Fe: rie Tho c uec;t.i • tvhich came to m• rn~· ·"~ v:- <· • T-T '· did
ln \~ashinrrt. 0 knot.r a'oo •x v ri. to · · ~st?
\feisburg him3elf J.oes not seem to have realised the significance of this, and so
am \,Ti ting to him to see if he can dig up any mo::-e information on it., He has been d.oin_3
a great deal of research ln Hashington on this case, and lives in that area, ana so he
.:-- -
·" = .
·
.. :·'·-·~~· :_ . ,·
NW .12640 Docld:59168006 Page 76

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ffiight be able to fin[( out e~~actly hoH they kne1-1 abou.t. Ferrie:· He is a close friend of
(
Penn Jones and. they oftr:m s!mre inforrnation. Leonard Reissman is mentioned in the
testimony of Lieutenant FrcJ.ncis L. Vartr3llo of the .New Orleans Poli•-;e Department. ll·Iart-
ello had interv-ieHed Csi:riiTd after his arrest in Ne'.-T Orleans in Aug. '63. Reiss::-1an, a
member of the He~·/ Orleans c~mncil of [';:;aceful Alte:c-natives, Has DOSSiblv connectofl 1.-iith
Us wald 1n connection ...!L~-~~ the Fair Pla y for Cuba Corrunittee, as Lieut. r·iartello suggests
:tn lns t,estimony, (if ol Jf p. 54-55). Hr Adrian Vial of t he Secret service intervie'.-ied
lvfu.rtello on liJo7 .2Jrd 1963, 1-rhich explains ho'\v they c ame to ask about Rei;,sman, but .does
not explain about Ferric, ns his name is not mentioned in the testi-;nony or the police
report of ivfartello. f~·~ ~ l\VG-USVJ! (CPfO!.r ~t,1!)
G-JJ.JI.t[U" .
_ ......- . . ..,._:o;.... .
If you have!! 1t a l ready done so I belie7e vo 11 sho·Jl:-1 r::ont::J.Ct. D:r _ ilu;:ustin Guitart,
1
.-.rho, 1,1~0 ~years ago at.J;lil~Y raua 8 t'IU;S ~Ph'3!aipcs instruGtor at Xavier Univ·~ ·~S.L1-'Y· r1[ _s
'Sfr'.ivla •J::t;~.o Is uncle. · ;\n FBI report by special ::>.g':mt :Jtephen l1. Galle nd .-r .-1"'+,,~ .s,.,-, 23rd
f9b4 conta.ins the curi ou." -i .f' "m"' ~ t.ha• Gnit.art •·ra~ . re:~~n in the l'luniciDC:tl Co•J.r•.J in
Ne1-1 Orleans a t the · .J..rrti.') vs1:a. Lct '.·:a s cnargecl. 1;rith disturbing the oeace. The YT.tl018 episode
b. lt.i~ ·g • ,.. , lf,
.t • I •
) • ., • l ' • - SSt$
• ...... -.
1nvolv1ng .::.ylvla.uo.lo J.~ .. J..ramense.Ly.compllcated, .ouo:, J..mrolvJ.ng as lt does-Cuban refugees
. ap.d possibly OsHald ·himself discussing the assassination of the President 2 months
before it happened, and literally one day after Os1.Jald left Net/ Orleans, alleg-edly for
1-'I:axico, I think some a ttempt should. be made to link it to the Nen..T Orleans aspects of
the c2.se. . .: · .
?er.n Jones has told me that a 1-roman by the name of _Pe~r~on Has, holding meetings
prior to the assassination in, or near, Manny La. wi1.i..•..:lr' 118 ue1ieva;J ude c onnected ,,,ith
·---:£he assasslnatlOd. ::..pjJarently ua1las sherrif Bill .Uecker atcended these meetings. I do
. hO't; nave auy hc5re information on this, but it is one of the aspects of the case uhich
r-Iartin . Haldren of the Ne•.1 York Times has been Harking. on. Haldren lives in Houston a nd
1 1
hiJ.E; recently been to NeH Orleans, and he also has been on Ferrie s tail. I haven t had
a chance to maet '\1/a.ldren since I saw hL"Tl In Dallas a month ago but a t t hat time he had
three typed pages of questions he 1vas going to R~ . a s k the l:Jew Orleans Police Dapt.. .
Apparently he g()t them back mostly_ anstvered noon It know. il or 11 No comment. II As he frequen riy
contacts Penn Jones, I believe I will be a ble to see hL'll very shortly if any of his
questions cover any area;J u_nfamiliar to us.
1 believe rriy time he re 1-rill be fruitful as not only can I chec~-;: out leads in Dallas
but also through Penn Jones am in contact •ri th such people as l'ieisl:mrg, Shirley 1--'Tartin
and-othe rs Hho have spe nt the le.st 2 years investiga ting the cas e. He also gets mail,
rJome of it anol)ymous, providing le<:tds to follow. Cne such letter arrived yesyerday all-
eging that one Virgil Black knew that OsHald a nd Ruby knew one anothe r, an:i . so testified
to the Secret Service soon after the assassination but la.ter told his fri e nds he kne'..J
nothing about it. I 1-Iill check this man out to:norrm.-.
Further items; Penn Jones i s having breakfa st Hith Congressman Gonzalez on Friday
11he n he
ho pes to get further inforGation on the destruction of evidence on Connally 1 s .
jaeket; tha reb::-uarJr i ss m~ of Ramparts l-Iagazine 1-iill contain ne~-r material on Ruby and
also one of the Ruby letters s_Inuggled out of the Dallas je.il; I incorrectly stated that
Seth Ka nto:::- had disappeared. He i::; i n fact Horking as a r •3 porter in ~~ashington.
To:n Bethell,
December 25th,'26th.
'Hidlothian, Te:xas c
NW 12640 Docid: 59.16B006 Page 77

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E"·/A i...t..:·A7 i NG CR.IlO·t·f
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. i2 762 3/9/55 L. 3/15/65 1FIRST NAMO:
3 AND INITIAL... . T~ i NED F .~0~1 S bU?..-:=:.5
i..A3T NAME A~O TITLE SPOUSE OE=:~1E!? ?.EL! ASLE. 7H=:-
ACCU R,l.. CY ·. OF W HIC H
THIS ORGA.':/lZ ATTCN :::r c :::.:;
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PERSO!'f...\.LLY R.E:S? CN$1 -
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FOR ANY
FROM
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MUST BE HELD IN STRiCT __
~': sEE REMARKS - ~. 7·~ . ··~ . ;..l,_ ·., ·· · . <: . ~ .. :c· :)~<:". CONFIDENCE AND i..IUST
~ :· POSITION ·; . ESTIMATED M.ONTHLY EARNINGS ..•. . ' :_:;./ 1 ~;::; ~~~JERC=;~ELPe:gRT~g
~-:· · • •• ~-~ -·· - - ~- ~- ." - -( . , ;. ~ -:' ·-· · :~ 4 -: •, ,: ' 0N . .. ' OR ANYONE E!...S E
~:- ·· , __ . . ~ -~_: • _:· __ ... - .... . .......i_,;· •:.- -~ - · · .. -·., •. . ···. • :-· . ::-: - {,~~.~-- ~: · THE INQUIRER MUST NoT
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CURRENT CREDIT RECORD·-'
~£,..8EA NU~8(A
AND -TAAO£ LINE
DATE OF DATE OF · · HIGHEST .TERMS OF AMOUNT AMOUNT . MANNER
SYMIO\. ** FIRST SALE LAST SALE CREDIT SALE . . NOW O WI NG PAST DUE OF PAYM ENT .-
2614 MS '60 00 00 AA
2 70 7 FN 4/61 00 _ 00 yy
·- 1979L BK 4/64 00 .· 00 yy
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2173C BK i I CLOSED CN
2819 MS .•: .., 1 ..... !. -- ·· REJECTED
·' 292 8 FN . --.. -::l "' ··REJECTED
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-"ALL REFERENCES WER~ CONTACTED FOR RATINGS. ANY NOT SHOWN ABOVE ·. I;
· EITHER REPORTED ::' 1 N0 RECORD' OR FAILED TO REPORT."
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DATE OF DATE OF HIGHEST TERMS OF AMOUNT .AMOUNT MA!'~NER
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INFORMATION DESCRIBED IN THE REMAINING SECTIONS OF THE REPORT IS RECEIVEO AND POSTED DAILY.
SUITS. JUDGMENTS. AND F:FAS FRC·MORLEANS, ST. BERNARD. AND JEFFERSON P~R;SHE:; .
SUIT SYMBOL • • .• . I DOCKET . · JUDGMENT FIFA .
NAME OF PLAINTIFF · NUMBER , DATE AMOUNT DATE DATE
NONE ;.· · ·
. 0
NEWSPAPE~ CLIPPING DATED 2/17/62-- PARTY BY SAME NAME AND ADDRESS ARRESTED ON
....
·MORALS CHARGES-- 2/28/62 FOUND INNOCENT.
NEWSPAPER CLIPPING DATED . 11/26/63-- PARTY BY SAME NAME AND ADDRE~S BOOKED WITH
BEING A FUGITIVE FROM TEXAS.
FINAL DISPOSITION OF SUITS AND JUDGMENTS CONTAINED IN THIS REPORT .W I ~L BE CHECKED. IF POSSIBLE. ONREQUEST AT.$1 .00 PER SUIT.
COLLECTION ACCOUNTS WITH THE BUREAU:
NAME OF CREDITOR : DATE AMOUNT AMOUNT OWI!'.:G
SOUTHERN BELL TELEPHONE COMPANY 6/13/62 $104~83 PAID 11/6/63 . • • ".SUIT SYM SOLS
A C., • ACC:JUNO
LOUISIANA POWER AND LIGHT 10/26/62 15.2 8 PAID 11/6/63
!'viAHO RN E R CLIN I C . •J 11/19/62 71.00 PAID 11/6/6 3
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MORTGAGED ITEMS SYM SDL • '• ' . .. i D~TE .. · ST ' • S EO'.JESTR.f.TI ON
NAME OF MORTGAGEE T'- .
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HH WAGNER . FINANCE . .. .. FEB/1.96 3 ; ·'
• • • .• MORTG~. GED ITEM ~
HW - ? :OCT I 19 61 SYMSGLS
. HH .METAIRIE -: SAV,INGS · BANK .. ... j• <MAY/1964. ·· .· • At.: ·• A~":"C "4091t..i;;
-NE't!SPAPER-CLIPPING DATED 11/27'/63~~ PARTY · BY SAi'-1c NAf,iE AND· ADDRESS

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I have .bad credit deallnsra with the following firma: Balan.,. D,..
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ASSIGNMENT OF SALARY, WAGES, COMMISSIONS .-AND OTHER COMPENSATION FOR SERVIC:::ES
.... .·. . . £24-S
. _. Loan No .. l~t-- ....... Ass i: oer·s Name and Addres3
Date ;:;·~:e n;:t•.~Af~-~-:):~:::::::r:::·. . . . .:. . __:___ ~ 19§2 . . Mil.· DAVID w. F';;;iUU!!:

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~: HERB WAGNER FINANCE SERVICE, INC. '·
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. 1905 AIRtlfiE HIGHWAY KENNER. LA.
·
Date
.FEq!NAF."I ~
ot AsStgnmen't.......... .... ........................................... , 19 ........
64
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Aetual Amo~~t~an $ .... 3~~~~~).QO.OO . . ·- .. . .. This 13signment is eucuted ami tJelhcred

-u security lor a loan made to me by said Assi.g.nee -:.on 'the date .hereof, the · a.mounl ot which loan was paid 1o me slmulianeously wiih the exec~~;·on ot . this assignment. in the nm~unt indicated
. . .and described
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!he ~ctual Amount Of Loan payable in .................................. mccesslfe monthly instalments Of $ ......... ~.e.;r.Y......................... :~.Ji00 each, which include interest at the rJte of
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TO MY PRESENT EMPLOYER OR TO Al'IY FUTURE EMPLOYER, who shall be indebted. to me tor salatY, wages, commissions or other compensation:•.
FOR VALUE RECEIVED, I hereby assign, transfer, eonJey and set 'CJer onto Assignee indlcatcrt ahOJe, ten per cent (I 0%) of a!l my salaries, wages,' coml!lissions anol · oti"r eomponsation
lor seniees heretofore earned by me and also, in additl011 thereto, th~ like part or my· saiiiJ")1, Wages, commissions &nd other eompe113ation tor senices to accrue lo me at any time hmaCtt•r, until
lbe loan seeored hmby and described belo"' shall b&Je t .. n fully dlseh:lfied.
I a.uthortze and direct' said emplo>·er or any future employer, to pay said sa.larj-, Wages, eommissions and other comvensa.tion tor sen ices, earned or · to be earn ed, or surh propnrti11n thereof as
may be legally collectable by the said assignee, di!ed to said assignee a.nd I hereby release and disc.l-:large my Slid emplofer or any future emplo}·er from all liability. to me· on aeenunt of any and all
moneys paid in a.ccordance herewith. I authorize said assignee to demand and recehe and receipt tor the same or any part thereo f in my name.
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Tb!J assignment lJ made, exeouted and enforceable u proJ!ded tor in Title 6; Section 5il, et seq., ot the . Louisiana R"ised Statutes ot 1950 and 0.1let:i:!.ll)' Section 5Si :hereof.
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NOTICE TO EMPLOYER
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(Employer) · (Address)
PLEASE TAKE NOTICE service is · hereby made on you of a eopy of the ass ignment appearing on the reHrse side hereof . together with the verified statement gh·en below re .:5pc rtin~ t!:•· amo unt
or prineipal und interest dui! and unpaid thereon, tor the purpose of demanding pa}·ment of the sum as si ~nr.U as salarL ·~· agt:s , etc. now due IJt shal! herearter ace; rue each p.1~· d:w , due rtcei1 :t.l for
. whieh payments will he furnished you. ·
~_: HERB WAGNER FINANCE SERVICE, INC.
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MANAGER'S AFFII:;IAVIT
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-· ·: ' · Tb<1.t he is the ·agent. ot.. .... :..~ ..-.... .'.: .... :~ ...... : ........ :..... :............ ~ ....: ... ~ ............. :...... :.:...... :......·.... . .. .'...... :...: ......... •.. :.......... ~.................... .'::.:. .': ... ::...:.':... :...... ' ... :.. ; a l!e,;n~ee ~nder th~ Art described
. ID the· assignment on the merse hereof ·an~ that the abofe and foregoing is a lull and true eopy or an assi&nment executed by ..... ,................,. ............................ - ................................................ ...... ..... _
. · __-___ :: .......·...................... _::... :.;..... ........ :.~ ......... .... ........ :............................._.. and 'del~fered to the_s~id as:; i:n t" e for ,the. Purposes therein stated': that the orlg!:1al of said assi&nment was executed by the
-.. assi;;:nor ht:rein named; thut the amount now due, pa.:,·a.I.Jle and unpaid upon the loan therein described is $ ............................ ···--:-----Of principal -.·ith interest thcreun from ......... ~ ......... .. ..
................................... .... .. .............. .. 19 · .... .... , at the rate of 3.¥:!% per month on that portion or the lo:tn not in exre a:1 of $150.00 ~n1l on th:1t portion in excess thereof. interest at th~ rate or
2% o/o per munth provitlcd that after an e:t;>iration of a p~riod of t\\·elve ( 1::!) months lolJuwing the la.;; t cuntractual .i.D.stalmcnt · d<ite, the intl!rest on any balance still unpaid shaH be ci:,;llt ( St'fo )
per cent per annum ._·_
Sutlscrihcd and :;\\·orn to before me this ......... ............................................. day of.. ............... - .. .... ............ .............. ............ ID
Notary Public
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.CHATTEL MORTGAGE <.
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·1. to.an No. ·-- ·-.:~.;:.i-~------·--
~.'~ ~-. Date Pa}11leois Due _____ _~. t-----------------------
_··-·-·--....,..-..·-~;!.:,.....!l;'i-V-ID... .s:..... JtJ.:£'9Y':;£........~..........:.. ~. ·

HERB WAGNER FINANCE SERVICE, INC.
. 1905 AIRLINE HIGHWAY KENNER, LA.
··~.::--~-~--~----YJJG··· r:~:g.rs-1-H~-~~'p; ..: ...................::..:.........:...
nate of MD.df fl;.'TIA.H.I...Z?-:.. ____-· .tL..64
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'·-·-·.. . •-~t ~-an $ ..... ?-:};:,;I:.,....':QO ·;._:::.t;.l. ~') .
··;.>.<:~·-,·~· · .Mortc~~~:ors berebj' dtciate . and ad:nowledie that they '\" just}j· ,' trulJ:and legally ind<bted to the Mort&_Oiee . in _the ·actual ·_&mount of _loan stated &!Ju,·e .-h!cb
j:_;.• · loali iJ ropayable ..to ' the Mortca&ee at its ~mce in · said ci_tY _ u;:.........:l,2 .......... ~.-..successi•e month II inst:lh!'ents of ·$. . ...··) 0;; ~ ........ ::..~:.. .": .. ·~:·: ..i !·~o: _e,;,h.: ·":'h ;rh ·indu(l; i"t~rc~t ~t the nte or
..:.::.:..i.L~;;j· . ·.(.~ .-:·.,~::~:-% per month on tllM part ol the unpaid prlnelpal bal.aee 'n ot ill ucess ol $150 .ad~-----·----2-~.'........ _'-~__.:.'.........~~::•.:..% per .month on .ay · remainder ot suth .
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unpaid - printipal balance, the l!rst or which Instalments payah!e on Is the:.................. }t:t, ........:.day ot ....... j..?.r.{117 .......: ..... ,.:,: : ..:: .... : .... 164.. .' toaethl!l' with a final instalment; co•~rtng' any u.npa.hl
ba!J.Dce, induding interest as a.toresaid, which instalment i.!1 due and owing on the final. date shown abiJ,e, and mortgagors further declare· and acknowledge that for the disbursement :or s~ic..l loan 3.nd as
eridence of said indebtedness, they bate made and subscribed a certain promissory note ot even date herewith, said note bearing interest alter ·maturity at said rate; and providing that alter the expira-
tion of 12 ,.months following the last contractu:U instalment date the Interest on any balance still unpaid shall not exceed 8% ·per annum; and .-hich said promissory note ~·as· delimed . to · said - ,\!ortga·
cee, who bela; P"""nt by its duly authorized agent, acc epted this act of mortgage and acknowl edged due rece ipt or said note. . · . . .. · · . ·. " · · . · .
. Tbi.; mortgage is made pursuant to the term• aod conditions of Titie 6, Chapter 7 of the LouisiaDl Revised Statutes of 1950. which, act is considered a part hereof as · if and "' th ough copied
herein in extens1, and in the event of a con!lict between the terms and conditions or this chottel mortgage and said act,· the tenns and cootlitions or said act shall gomo. ·
The mortgagors · agree to waive notice of seizure by th e sheria, constable or justice of the peace, and the three (3) days' delay provided by Art. 655 of the Code o! · Practice, said mott~ a gors
expressLY agreeing to the i.r.tmedbte seizure or the property described below· in the event or ~su:1n1.."e of a \Hit or execution. · ·
AI'"D ~0\V, in order to se~:ure the full, punctual, an(J flna.l P<i)'ment of said note at .maturity together \lo'ith the . irutalments of principal and interest pUrsuant to · the tcnn3· here of u.s s:~.mc: shall.
acerue, said murtgagors do by these presents especi n.lly rr:ortg3ge, atrect and hypothecate unto anl1 1n ra,or of said ~lo rtga;;et!, its successors and assigns. the personal property desaibed below in a sche dule
mwked "A" which Is hereby made a part hereof by this · refere nce. . .. . · · . . . ,· .. . . . · ,. ' ..
Tbe s:tid property to remain mortgag £cd, atl'ected a.nd hypotheuted until the Cull and nna.l paymeot · or. said note : and instalments therel.lt, principal :Jld interest, .as aforesa:d . o:nd the mo rt ~;J: o l!
do by tbese presents hrrcby bind and obligate thcrDselres, their heirs and aEslgns, not .to sell, alien.1te. dt!teriorate nor to en~umbe r the said. property herl'in mort :;aged to the prejullkc or this ~ll1rt1;a:;~~
aor to rcmme said property out of this :••r!.sb without the -..-ritten consent ot S.'lid l!ortgOiee llrst obtain<d as prorirlcd in Title 9, Chapter 2, Part Ill of the R.S. of 1950, and su~kct to tile P<n:tltie) .
theroto attached." . : · . · . . ·
And the said mort~a~o" further declare that they consent , agree and stipulate. that in the eYCnt that sold promissory note or any lnst•lment or interest or princlp:l is not P"id ot m:o turit r. then
tbe ~ntire uns::1id balance of the princip3.l or the note and indei.Jtedness secured hereby, together with actrucd intere;;t thereon, shJll imincdiate!y at tile uption ·ot the ~lo rt~il~e e be (.!uc. Jl:\pble a..rtd
uig:ible with;J!1t notice, demand, or putting in default, and the said Mortgagee, its suCcessors and assigns, may cause all and singular the property hercinl.Jdore descrii.Jct.l and mnrtga:; c.:l tn h seized
111d sold aroonling to law. ·
It tl..ii.s mortgage . includes a motor .nhlcle, mortg.1gors covenant, in ca.se~or seizure and s:Jic :lS abofe described, that they ~·m assi:;::n . or endorse to the ~lort<;:;:1gec, or to anr prr ~nn rle:-;i:;:n:trd by
the Mortga:;:ce. the rcgistra.tion certificate to said motor veh icle and to do any and all acts required by the Motor Vehicle Law or Lol1i.s:iana to \'CS t title :tnt.l pos.:;ession or said rrwtur \"chide, it.; number
plates or rc~;istration certitlcate in the Mortgagee Or any person designated by the Mortgagee. ·
If this mortgage includes both a motor vehicle and · other pe:rsonal property and it there sb:tll occur ally ot the conditions of dcfault as :~bore descrihcd, .\tort:;a:;ce, :~t its nptinn. m:\y td:e :~ny
a.etinn it may deem . necessary against said motor Yehicte or against said other personal propert}' '1\i' itbout in an}' war prejudicing its right·to take · an}· action :lt' a later date to enforce it3 ·u\!n or cbim upon·
the part or the S<!<urity a~ainst. which action has not been taken. -
And the said mortgagors hereby especially declare that they are the true ·and lawful owners o( lite propert)' hereinabove described and that the same. bas not been· heretofore alienated by them.
SCHEDULE "A"
A certain motor rehicle, complete with all attachments and equipment, now located at the address or tho Mo•tgagon indicated abote, to wit:
MOTOR NO. SERIAL NO. BODY STYLE MODEL YEAR OTHER IDEiiTIFICATlO:-i
Certalll ehatteb, Including all boasebold goods, now located at the address of the Mortgagors indicated above, to wit:
l bookcase_ 1 ~e?retary 1 chair'1- piano 1 table 1 rugs 1 l::uffet 6 chairs .1 table 1 radio
·1 stove 1 wasl,ing machine 1 refrigerator 1 vacum cleaner 2' beds 1 chifforol:e 1 :·chiffonier
l dresser 1 dressing table
. . . .
•. • ....:-:..., .• .:_ __ • _ _ .;:..;: _ _ _ _ :_. _ _.. --~--- --~ - ' - - -- - - -- ·:.._ _ _·: - • ...:.··- ·· .-:':'.·~·-~~;·.!,.~ .._.;·:.
·.
. • ·._
and in addition - thereto all other goods and chattels of like nature and all other turnllnn!, fixtures , carpets, nr.:s, clocks. fittings , linens. r.hlo a, crockery , cutl;;y"';-·uretis lls;...:silrerware: musical -instrul'!eot' '
&Dd household goods hereafter to be acquired by MOrtg OiO" or either of them, and kept or used 1:1 or about said premises or commingled with or substitut ed -lor any property herein mentioned . said
pniperty · aow. be in& and nmaining ill the Mort~a~ocs· possess ion. . · . ·
•• dl t
. IU.COr nc o
certt-..~cate
.• I '! rt .• d I b p . h. t . ORLEAl\15 . . . . . ed b" .· .. .
o .. o gage JD an or t e :lns o ..........·.. ·--·-··---·-----·--·---------·-------·--.. ·-----~ ·-··--------·--·········----------------•• azwex . ereto, it appears that s:ud property lS cle31 ot all encum-
br:uietO, except ............ ~............WA:rv:ED .....................:.................·......................... ~:...............:........................... :.... ,................................................................'.......c.................... ..... ~....................... .
............u.. u;~;;,--iie--'Oiiii··-o;;~··;,;oii.l;;g-o,-·iO-iiiil...liiS.ini;,;~;~; :·a.u ··tii~rai··;;;;ct.; --;;;·ti·· hireiii ..iii!iJ...rei'e;e·ac·; ·1;,··;,;'Qiii;g'Qr;···;h~ii. ·b~··c·;,~;;;~~ct--iD.. i.b~ ··;i;;g·~w: ·············· ................ ······ ·... ······ .... L · ····•· ·.. ·· ·· · ·
THUS 001'-'E k-;D PASSED ~t. Kenn.r. in the Parish of Jefferson .. State of Loui siana. on th~ ....... ??.~.~.................... dO\· of. • FEBRIJ ARY .
A. D. 1/!:!... Ill the presf.ce o! ..... //..~.R~.. }-JA.QN.f::.~.......................:.............. ~~ ..........-ao.: ....... ~ ....t1A~ ... .J..~ . :tl?.9.~}J~............~..-: ... : : :.-.:·.·. - . . . . . . . . . . . . ~=o ' rompe;~~·; . ~;;:;~~:.
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who _sign ~~-P.!~.':..~.:...,~}t~. app~arefs;,after due: . r~~li n, ot the whole.
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(Witness) • · . (Witness) ·
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· HERB. WAGNER ,FINANCE SE.RVICE, INC.

··,.··.
(Husband or, Wile) . ·
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STATE ,OF· LOUIS!,"''iA,'-
, PARiSH OF . Jl."FTh'RSON
} . :!··· (A~ent)
BE IT IL'iOWN that on this day before me, a ,~otano Publi•. pei'Silrrol!y eame and appeored ...... .: .... ~.ft.~...~l.A9.~.~........:.~ .......:.c .. ~.....::........:,.........:..... ~ . .:. ,, ............:..:....... :....:..:.... ,.
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or ~battel mortgage ~as sig"ned in the pre:ience or amant and the other parties thereto. 1 · '/
' or' 'chattel mortga;e, and th3 t · sa id ui
. (It the mort:;:a.:cr eiecutes the affida.rit ·the Jollowinos pa::.Lgraph should be used.) 't ·. f: ...
. . ·. . . HERB 'n·'.t.GN--;:R ,. . · ·.
.. That be 13 ................. , ............. ........ " ....... ,.,........ , ......................... the Mortga~or In tbe abo•e and foregoi ng act o~hattol m~~~. 1&lld that he stgned aod execu ted such ,;,t of chat to! mortg•ge
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in the· ~resent~ of _the sub3cribing witnessu and the other ;>artles thereto. /~ ,--~( / / ... 1 f
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DISBURSEMENTS FOR ACCOUNT OF CUSTOMERs

$ _______________
PRINCIPAL. BALANCE ON PREVIOUS LOAN NO· - - - - - - - - - - - - - " - - -
$ ________________
TOTAL 01" ALL MISC. CUSTOMER C H E C K S - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - .. 1
LIFE
3trl
INSURANCE P R E M I U M - - - - - - - - - - - - - • - - - - - - - - - -
LESS REBATE-----~-------~--·~-~--------
RECORDING FEES _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __;__ _ _..:__ __;__ _:__ _ _ _ __,._ __

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$ _ _ _ _ _ __
OTHER (SPECIFY) _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _~--------------------
FORM NO.6 AMOUNT DUE CUSTOMER AFTER DISBURSEMENTS
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+
APP~*iTION i ~
-· -. ., . . _::···'·· ..
7
To: HERB ~AGNER F~~~:~~~:R~~::~~NEC~: .·. · ··· ••: , ~
+
+
I apply to you for a h~reby
$.... ....:... ......:.......... For the puthrpato:a:t.
· repay the same and to induce t/OU to grant said loan, I hereby declare ..,
Io·~~ ~f .-.:~ o1f.·t~~0-·0f·~- a~I:~I.m-~y·~-d-~e-~b-~t~s~-;~a~·!; tit
i:t
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liabilities is b follows:
I +
+ NAMES OF CREDITORS AMOUNT +
+
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TOTAL $
0
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i+ Be sure to include all bills owed on real estate, automobile, furniture, etc. and
debts to loan companies or banks as weU as other obligations; Indicate with
+
+
+
+ . an ."X" those obligations you will pay with the proceeds of this loan. +
+ ot• .
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My salary it ; .........;;...per:..... ,............. . My income from other sources is $........... ~ .. per.: ............ ~ ..... .
:+ +
+
I hereby state, affirm, represent and warrar~t to you that my total ·indebtedness and liabilities· on this . +
+ +
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· . . I
+
. date do riot exceed $................... - ...................• +
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. ADDRESS
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,T E L , E P H 0 N E 7 2 I - .6 2 52
' KENNER. . LA_·:
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MI-. Frank La.ngrldge,

District Attorney
Court House Bui:difl..g
Gr~tna, La. ·, .
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:. '; · . Hone, District Atty. U..ngridge:
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_____.....-"-'-.~~ting this letter in behal! or numerous friends or
Ferrie.· \
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· It ~rould be deeply' appremated it ;ou would reconsider the charges
which are pending against him.
We have known Ca.pt. Ferrie for a nu."nber or years arid just can't
believe· that Cap~. Ferrie could possiblp be guilty of suc.'l acts•
~ . . •..!. ·- .• . ' -!- :t"· ••• • . .: ~- . :.,
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Respectfully1
Herb Wagner .·
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·; V --SECRETARY .: ..... .. ..
·
CHAIR
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· SERVING TABLE ··/ .. WASHING MACHINE . •J
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___·_'___ v._:~~-~--·:- -::;.:; ::••~~::-:~ _--;:~•:. •-• •~ •... " _. ,-..; APPL-ICATION
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+ I hereby apply to you for a loan .of $.... $:~-~--.:=::-: ....,... For the purpose of showing my ability to
-- + . .
_:t · repay the same and to induce you to grant said loan, I hereby d6.;!are that a list of all my debts and
.+ liabilities ie as follCws: - ~
1~-- ---- -~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~=N~-A~~~f~E~S~_O~F~~C~R~E~D~I~T~O~R~S~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:~~A~-M~O~U~=N~T~~~~~- +t

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. I hereby state, aff'irm, represent imd warrant
My income from other sources is $...
to you that my total indebtedness and liabilities on-this .

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++++1-+++++++++++++++H•++++++++++++.++-t•+H+•2-0:•+++-+++++H•+++++++++++++++++-t·++•!•.j..{.+~·O:•O:•O:•+++-t•O:••:•'I._~,+·:·+-
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FINANCIAL STATEMENT , __ :
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.To: HERB WAGNER FINANCE SERVICE, INC.
Date... ~!?:.-::. J.f..:..~?.:.............
!+
I hereby apply to you for a loan of $......~ .. :.~..... For the pU.rpose of showing my ability· tq £
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repay the same and to induce JIOU to grant said loan, I hereby declare . that a ..list of .!ll, my debts and +
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;I liabilities is as follows: +
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;,: NAMES OF CREDITORS AMOUNT
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i TOTAL $ +
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Be sure to include all bills owed on real estate, automobile, furniture, etc. and
+
...
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debts to loan companies OT banks as weU as other obliga tions. · Indicate with +
an "X" those obligations you will pay .. with . the proceeds of this loan.
...+
-t· ·
+.
~...... · My income from other sources is $...... :..:....per..·-··,·:·;~·~····
My salary ia $.....1..£per....
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to . you that my total indebtedness and liabilities on this
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},;{·L~· . ·: ·~·:. ·- r' :,:. <::;.~r·· :_ : f. ·.:t:_ ~;,N;:::_:)i: ': u~ten to' The 'State~~~t~~ Chiin'es at . '~··
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'~0 ··: '215 · .The . ~s~oclated

. Press, North •American · News-
· 'SATURDAY,· FEBRUARY Secoitd-Ciass rosfage l'nhl
. ~ ~ ·. · .. ~!. . ; ·paper Allhmcc, . NEA :Service and AP Wirephoto ~. .
' . 18, 1967
.· . . . ·at_ Now Orlca,ns, Ln. 10c .
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. . . _lly ~OSEMARY JAMES
• .
·· · rison's office 'has launched an :intensive inve'stigation .into

· ' The States~Item learned here today that District Attorney.. ;. the murder of Kennedy . · · ·
•
e.ro·us
_.·DA is believed .to have. fled. the ·couplry-to Cuba, .hi
:. Hico or possibly the 13at)amas_:_a few steps ahcnd !:f __
.
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cuban '811' i!Yi e;«Ju1r1 .
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Jim ·Garrison· and members of his staff were in Miami in ·. : The· investigation is reported to be centered about a. vestigators, who combed the Miatni area, and parU· · t _.
January looking . for _a Cuban man described as physically .' . /.' possible a.;sassination plot involving a person or . persons the· Cubari colony there. . . . .,
._powerful and dangerous. , ... ..... · . . . , ·. _:; ill. addition .to .the accused slayer, Lee Harvey Oswald. . · · ..•. ·It is kno\vn that. the disti'ict attorney's invcsligaUonJ N
. . ' ·'TM m<Jn ·is being sought · by ,the DA in connection with _: .:. , ·:. ' Garrison has refused to confirm Ot: deny the existence . included ..a· trip_ to San .Juan, :Puerto .m~o. : .i, :. .. · .· . f(~~
..:.: ,
,";·
.' · de_ath ' of President: John '· F .. Kennedy'. He · is_ ~belie~ed '. \.'._ of s_uch an investigation. or to discuss . any .. information · ·.' .· The 1,nvr~stlg~,l~rs ~vho_ . sear_c.hec~ M~amt_ t~s tdc .:i;~n
-r- · to~e one of agroup ?f Cubans _who reportedly h1d behmd ;:._received by The- States-Item. . . for the Cub,m . \1 cte flashmg lu~. 1:~:tu1_c, t~!c-::.1..of1,/.:V<'·?
!
~ ;:
, , . ~ p1Uboard on the parade route m Dallas Nov. 2~, 1963 . ... ·•I·: · . ; . . · · . . .. . . .• · · .. Orlea.t,l~ ._s~rcet.- whtle · _he. \\'85 otsloibtt~tng . ,fDH I -~~,., f t;::
,, .. '' . . . :-·· .. ,. RELIABL~ SOURSE. WHO_REFUSES to· be quoted __i:_~_:_ll~Phlcls \l' tll~~wa~~---~__:_:--~~L_::_:_, •:;: '1
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.....: .- told The States-Item that the Cuban sought by the ' Turn to Page 2, Column 5 i· · · · · · i ,.
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HanoiSays·. Lo _N noN (AP)- A:
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~ :mi-l· DAVID Sl'~J_Y_~?ER . ·
.• .. .· , · . : {: ~j;~~;~ltl:
··(Copyright 1967 hy the ' S tcite~- llc m ,. Tlie Times-· _· ·.d-h~~!
. : ' ~ ' ' .: ~- . . ... . . .. . . .. . ·... . . :-:;;· ·~~'
' · · , PiCayune Publishing Corp.) .. .
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_. the_Americans.stop t.he.•· ·
of North . Viet-
>. riiun; the c om m u n i s.t
1 ,. ~ _ • . • • . ..
·; A New Orlt;.an.c;'_ pilot .hils ·rev~alecl to t.he Statesf '
Item that Dist: Atty.·· ,lin! Gardson's 'chieLiiiVest!!
gator :said -last ~ monlh lhc DA's··orfice hns'·:<•posf
l 1.· . ·; .: d~g~ ··i_ ~t~ ·theN Hi,:t cl~(i'ate i~is tn?t~i:~'- :. · ra~nillg Star rep_o~te~. to-.. ' tive!Y: uncoven~d a- plot :iq New Orleans to ·assa'r;s!:·:Nr'!t.
,. p·: · · -\1(li1sh <1n arn1ed man. who ' had' been ·holed ;
1 • · · . · ·. · d t d d · · t" h
nate ~(e~medy :': . . . ,; ' : ··:·:. ~: >· ". ·.' . ·:· .
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50 . 1n an ·u n a e Ispa c , 1· Da vidWilliam Ferri c, who [las ;a flying serviCe - herd;;:Jn:;:,
, . 1, '!\ , .l.tl e1 n1g 1 spa or . mmu cs.- - .
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, •1 1 • • • • 1, re da Coo k 1·ts correspon den t
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• and is a part-tip1e investigator, said Garrison <1nd his staff.~[~~;~
.·.. j: : .. 1 e -cqnvergcu__ on th? elub · :3 t Bo~n·.!Jo~ and :in Hanoi, quoted the · spokes- · arc conducting m1 extensive iiwes tigation into the dc;1lh !)f-'~~,{~1
' I;:: , (?-)~ :.N~grr; ~~~~pe~,.~~~'!:9~gh . ~~_:.:door , man' as s~ying: . . ; . :. _. "' , -~ ~- :. ~ President' Jo!lri ' r': i<eim~d)·. aitd Ura t he' :lhrl some·
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, l· · · c~!··tod,n ~ 1 • • - • .- •• •• • " , •• • • • ·.':TIIIS 1s not .a new Ime b~1t /. friends have been ~~~c!jlinnci:I. by_ theD!\ 's .. officc: .: · ... , · ,i ,:;J'
~~-f'Y"t ilton: ... 1'--·<md ·lits:·~rot~H:!J:;·.~ pic~!ded·. ·a·"·new ;,nppro; ch <.. to. the .c1 ues-· _-_;l;l ~~j~j~~(\':\i'~ill~~i~~~~-~)~~~-~~j\~\'J~,~~~~~t~
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~:~l~l lhe ~~~~~wn not t~ -s.'JOoL , . lion ~~~~::._2:!!_e Unitc~_Statcs

Ferrie' g;We the. Statcs-Itcri; _dclails of why ·• the.· dif:: · ·:
, lrict attorney':> , offi ce bci:1JnlC inlci·esti;d in him. , '' . ' . '.; ;
,:- ) .. · : .! lt': hjng r ,l.he Jhc Ncg10.· h.ad a : .t0 1 1 ~!,; ~:~C,f: • ,NORTH SOUTH MEET? . · 1
Th v· t . ''Supposedly 1 have .been p cggtd as tli~ •get-away r,;\,t,-.:

·., i.-I! . .-:'.· ·~-'!-:;
! ..;:';' ' •..•.. ''the pi st·o]i': ' ~i:·' .; , ; . ;··; ;; ·;-.r"i'.:: i'•' TOKYO (AP) ' .
i!·r.·_~--i-.~.~- · - :· ·.. : ·.,·.. ·~ -·- . .·.· ·· . _.; _· .- ~. -··: . _ · ·~ ·G· · ·.:·- ~ _. . .- · c· ..•c ·
in '·hn . elabora lc plot to kill Kennedy, ~ ! he said . . ' · :.. ·., ,\~:· · ,
~-,.~;. ' , i-\(}l~Y$\ih:-o hL!: ..· Seeing Wtliternarsh; 'the :rrialr . :. Cong snid t·oday they ·made 1
. Ferric flew·· lo Texos witldwo fde1:1d~ close ~'to ''tilc. t.iif:$\~( /:
· ~~:l . ,, -~lh'Jl<;: tall. 1-,i 1Lback .. ih~ide, Hc '\va~~sinl · _con~acts
. i-i:' · j9ffi\i'j(!{;h. ·tile . .· ·t'i · · : ' t i(f' oo ,,- •: . · · .\~-·~-~- rnese olficers during the Lli-
witli. South Vietna- : · ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ of the assassination:· ':~ ---."'. · . · . ·· · .. · :'(/· · ,_. . ..·.:~? :r-
.nfl~~ :,. ~ti~·-:_:,ul)otll: . ,Ill·;_Jqr~ ~a~~~~~-:~:.:
'. :··:~>r:i~i~. =:-~~~;-~~i~~a-~~a~r~v"eC: ::)~d~~e~~: ,. . '' . ·. .:-·._ .·
HE CONTENDS, HOWEVEB, THAT he clid not gel f.d ;;c

. . _· -~ ~-
' ;
·. i\llll ]lOi!ll.ed Fortner Pius.~: Ad~i_se.~_' i:_ : . _, : nntn.e. ~e. ca~ settle t~eir own Dall as: . · . .. . ·· . .. : .. • •·. ·: · . . _. . · ··• · . 1 • • -~~~~
and m:hed ,. R L. ·b. · ·D · ·· •:•··.·:·. :·.. ' .:affmrs. Th1s assertiOn · was _ Ferric explained ihC~t ·in November of 10G3 he was wr: rl;I \ ~
1w tha: linn" · . ev. _I~ _er, ... r.e,s ~\·:;;· :;,; _:_made 11)' the · spokesman for .· 'i
ing as an investigator for New Orl eans attorney G. Wruy . ' lt'J
-
. .. HOME .J AP.) · ~- , 'fhe )~~.V:,· -~ the. Viet Cong's National Front.
:. · · ' Gill , who wns l!:ying a f edcrtil court \!asc involving Carlo:('_ .. ;::
· ·: "1k 's. · il9t_'!'Hobert. Lieber·, ? fl! 'ad_ . v~:'1er_:._ to _, for_· Libe•:ation . and broadcast . Marce llo~ . .·. . . · .._ · .. ._ · . .· . . . . · :. >;·, ~
.., .; . .. . !the late ·Pope . Ptu_s XII .on . by Han!)J radiO. 1
~: . . . · · ~. ; .· . ·~ - , Gern1ai1 .affai rs , ' died today';in · ·h· · . t t 1 ft · h J\1arccll(i and his brolhet' Joseph were acquitted h_, .. ··-: :~:
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sH Jcl thn
• . . .
I f' · ·.- 1osp1··ta 1··· ·.· ... ..···.-. ··~·.-.. ·•. . as
· " 1 a ,ome 1 ·· · ..pro ·es e<
· ·o· en· .enoug federal jury of charges that ,-they cni1spircd to defrnud Un\ ';_ . 1'~
· -I•~ nt~cr :.~ : :as= illdi- ··.:.~l\ t;~ it!Jfl\ \ l\ \lil~ \~!jil!\!lj~ ~:~ ~i l i [i ~;~;~ [~(~! i ! !i 1i! li!lj'l
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government on the day Pt:esident Kennedy was tmirrlcrr:d, · :-<~;
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..; ·,cd;him · . . · . ·Letbcr,
" · ·. · . · :·· who •: was
. · ·,_.::: ·th(lt'thcre is the
1t wants . to slightest
talk as soon
· <.'<·li:·t',;;;'~ · horn
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_near ' Freiburg, met Pius cation that Hanoi is willing. · : Ferrie say$ he,was at the fcdet·al eo:n;t.hcre tlwt day. · · ..-'~
=·
• · '' · wh~n· 'the··.- latter was ·: papal_. · ' :•very wen· let Uie-bomb- ~:::WI-:'I ? /d\b@~(f: ?> :;;i;}.\j • 'l11e jury 's verdict came in at 3:20 p.m. · .· · . . . ..
d·er·1111't.e-_. Ferdc had done ·investigative work. 'on . the case foi.'(-·;~?
.. ,, -1., .··1~ho
·. w:1s .nuricioin
. · : .-....
Germ<iny
. . •. . Laterhe
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· ·g·.-,. o· r •t·he ·nor'th sop
t· ,..,.; . . . .. -st" tos-llcrn oMto.
·.Je i1;;ill\ 011 t.. : :;:me ~~ }~~ · ~at}c~f ·~n: h~e;:- ... , ,: sec PEACE-,-Poge 2 .JEFFERSON PARISH· SHERIFF'S detectives answer · ca Iler~ placing hcls . on .em; who was · one of . Marcello's 'au_orncys. ' . , . ·· 1 }:~·-n~·:
1
~;:,· in and . :· ~;.~'e ;!~ ~t~l~O.~~nt\r:~ rif.G:!" ':
1
·· .;· · · ·.· · · · ·.horseraccs a
after raiding what tl~cy .tcnm~d .multi' million- (Iollar. h~_ndhool< . . . .. . . .·. . .;• . . .. ..· ·, -~- :: . ':!·.
;-urn,ort..· ,
i!
liE SAID .THAT AFTER THEY ,vion the case, .he and . ~ ··,
. ·;, . gorian Institute. . •' . nR (' w· . operation 'spanniJJg the nation .., Three men were a n-ested when nfftccrs burst two fr iends decided to go t6 Texas on ·a· plcas.urc trip. . .' . ·~ .. 'Z
_,Yll: ilcn~arsh \ ' _Continuing ,-his collaboration ·
' l!rtl]~· ~dll_ f:: .wtlhlhePqpe,hebccameone.· JoDi' . . .. . ..... - .- ··,· .
ii! hi to the building .? t· 3644-46 Airline hwy>. (Story on I ' age 3.) :.
,,·
·. It w<Js a spur~of-the-momcnt_ d eci~ion, Ferrie cla ims. ; : ;,~&_.
,. :. . "We went _to _Ho_uston, Galveston and then back to Ale~;,~~· f;··';.
.. . 'lrlup m'm or .theclosest·pararactvisers' _· :·_,. . . . . -- : . · .
···· :~li !Je ~ ~~d ?ur!ng t.h9 _-pcr:ioct of increased ~f ~~neJJ 0 :t;O . ~ . ..~ ·n 4·- o·AY· EN. EMY TOL·L ·- r·- op·s 1 oo· o-~ - . -· · . andria , La.," Ferric -said. · . · -~.. . · ' · . · . . . .'.;··~~;
.. . · ·_ . · · · ·. ; · · · /. --.·: ,, -~
When he' returned to . New Orleai1s, "Ferrie said;.; ha;:\~;:
• ! .· · ~"
n·g n (: r .I n.fl nn{:SJ. ..A. . n. .. .'D_

·:; . emergmg . . mtc!'naiiOnal te~s1on gener- 1\~\dOU \Ul &U ·GJ() !'~ ,, . . , . ·.. · .· · . ·: . called Gill to see what was· goit1g on i:u1d Ciil informed :tri!)\\fii§
~- > . . :· . Ji. -::
. rrri1 Nil u -~ n ,.
a ted by . Nazi Germany and .. , .;· -: . . . . . . . , ., . 0 . . ' ' ·.
that ·.the district'· atton1ey's . office. \van ted. to ,question hlrn~l
...;·r·
• • • " . ; •: ' .. ' J I
.,;,,1""'""''"'0 f\,,, ·n,fhrrdr l'lf W()l'lrl Warli. 1a .;"; ' ... ~ .!1 . _; . -J'Q ., 'n .~-1- ID' Ilff"O :~ ~ : ~-
about the assassination. '
...
.. .: .
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. .:.
' .
.
·_.- .
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}F ·}ir1~!~11is' !lands' I thc''ciU~.b~~~~-of.~~~~l,(i::.~t,~;·u~~·.{,~~~~~-"Mo''·r· re'··"·"~~-~- ...·~.:1-i.U sr r 0 I 0Ctfl :s·- i:J'U l4-d {;;/ Mf~ ·u u;;,) II ' . .'. :..~, ... ... ~.•:. --~ ..'; .,:.,',: . :,./~~ .,. ., . tJ '' ·. " :· .....,, ' . ..
"':ASH CITED · ·:' · ·· ·:ti::·;>)i' .. .. f VV'VJ J .. ·· ..
.70 °·n-.:sQI '\r.-
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ur ''Br;· 'f' fli e.·
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FERTliE CLAIMS THAT WHILE HE WAS in 'ft•x
CL
- M . . . .c··. ::_;·\>·. ·--~~·~:;:;,r: : r·'l . . · .·· . ··. · . . J·~·of·J 13law officers,il1cluding Gar:risClll · and · forrnern,;:;h)
. h. u n
· ·S.·'. ,.
u. ~! . . ';' ; . . : . · ; ,' ..' :._.. . -r:: . ->::; >. ALBU(ltlERQUE, . N. M.'._ . . .. l1 .· . . ., 19 /?"~' 'jf dislri~ t atloriley .Frank Kl ein, broke into his _hnlik <;.
· ··jjl. !~ · ·.(A'P) - U.S. Sen: Wayne. ~- t1 ·.· · .. · · . ,/\. ; ·. · V · · _lil.,;11 . IJ · · · c~1rted. of[ books; photographs and ; some other pc nw:
·; ... .. , · .· ·. · ·.. · Morse D-Ore. sa s he will . . : · ·. · . . · . . . . . · . . ·.. · · . · ·,·
~~1 su o;t Sen: Robe~t' F. Ken- . SAIGON (AP)- ,Australian aJ:d Austra_hans:-have clasl!ed troops c~nlmue~ hunlmg for belo~~IOI.,>'s. . ... '•. :· ' ... . . .
· nc~p . . ·, · .·. · , . .· .·; ' lD-N Y. ·.for · the 1968 troops bypassed 3li enemy am- . .w1th :guernllas or North VIet-. the1r fJe emg adversanes. · .stths~d11lJal. am?un~ B~:''Pe• ~~~X:·~f~ , . fhey tooK a
. .'
·of -n1y;,
. : .. ,.; ;;r-
.. ...
; ''I i:; i .: . n In( '': '' ·:. . . . . .
·. r De~~crati~ pre~ldential no mi-. ~ush ~nd killed 70 Viet Cong . ' nm:1ese regulars. They have . . . < ~ : fulal_le an~! Broad (l~c~l!on of the dlstnct att?r~r.y s l.'!l~;;,~::JNt.
r9 g r, a. q1 '' ·'~a~~~~e .· ~n sa~~~~:~~~ !6~ll~h~ei!~r~~~~~. - ~~~~e~~~-~~;~~~~~: - 1,0~~-emy }:i)'~~~;:~I;~~~)E~~:fr;~ri~~~ .Fer~~r~t~?~.aiJ'\)~::_~<;ve :~ f(J~in ·_ .imeticl~lol:l~;;_ ;~c·c~i: ~ \: . I'~~··.
. . . ' ' .. · .
~-,~1!_~, . ,·; r a
11
lr'
m said he cannot sup- ;;
.: n· ,_.·. . .'; . ' . ·.··: . . ..•·:· .··.,-.:,;. . . : port anyone who favors :cs- · tralwn Task Fmce announced . ThiS W()ek s battles raged this ea'r seve l' ;i [ hilttles or hiS .tnp .111~ th~ n J(~em had hun _booke~.. as , J lli ~,L.! . ......~··;,;-;
·:• :o;: · · · Uy ·N.biL SANDhRS : . . ·. •! • . · ·c·al,at·1· 011 of t11e· .y 1·etna'm \var · ·· today. ··. , . ,· -.from . · the Mekong ... Dcll.a to were. Y.. : t (' d ·1JY
Ill! 11<1 ,~
· vOlll111UillS · . lS from . Texas .. J.· e.tTic· . s:ml tha·..l he _,asked· c.ul to cui, ·· ; t '·:~\::r, ··
.:.;!'• c · · ·.. ·• .. · · · •. · ··· · .. •
.:s'. Lcg<"~l 'Aif.l Bureau \v imts11othi~g ·to do 1_vith a ( . In a 7,000-word ~pee~h . deo · It 1v~s t h{ .' fourth st.rai?ht ~orthern Quang Ngai Pr?v- tr ·in to overrun allied J~si-
·· · · · · ·
FBI · aud ~he Secret St'rvicr:. ·: :: ;- :: . . . ' : . . ,-:!;, ti~i;:~(
·· . ~.. .
;.:;·' . r:~5'!•!!10_ proJc?t that w?uld.'' pr?vide fr~-~ - 'l~g~I :' ·. hvererl · a,t the U~Ivers1ty_ of .. day allied um~s- South _y1et- .. mce and although the act~ on t.i~ns gor blocking posts J
the : . · He smd that he . had mterv1pw~ Will~ both orgm!_l Ai';;\v
.j-\. 1 • : ,q .cii.y spoor. . .. · ., ..' · · ·' .,. ) , '··.· . 1 :·': , .: New Mexico last mght, ~o~·se · namese; Kore,ms, Amei1cans tapered off to d a ·y, alhecl · othei·s started when probing · tions and . subsequent .to these sess1ons was r~.~'i'S!;.
:.,:'rF' · ····, ha ~ I'~!fu c; en to . supp()rt or parti?lp~t~ Ip t!1e ac~u~ ed ~ongr_ess . of giVIng .
\ ' . i '~IJ~~;hy _lol l! New Orleans L~gal Assistance Corp, up . Its . fmancwl check~and- Ko.· , s.y··g • ..:u.s. En VO.Y·..·
. , . . . . . , :< . . allied uni ts found the enemy
and hemmed them in. ·. . - . .
" Turi1 In Page 2,. Column li ; · . ,_·f''·+."·:\'
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e' e·.. t o· n· Arms·.R~ce·. . YIET-Png~ :t~. . •) "' "'!!»~
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11
..• · '•"'T .•.. · · . . . ·' . . · ·. · votmg , money . to ... . . ·, . .. · . ., ... · · ·- - - - - - - -
':; . . :. .• .,._ ".kill boys in Vietnam;, are thc · M .· . . .Sec 2 •. .•
··~r, • , . .
I .
''f•:;\j :· · ;;t~'H apjll:oved . · One . teenage girl to·· .ones who. are letting the boys
- •• • • • • I .- .
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- .
· 1 . .. . . : . ..; • • • • ,.;;: ··, ••, •• · :.:b? f
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':d\ ~- ; · g4~ecks would 1'1,' •·· ' ,> , , .:., down.

: g1rl_, ~..·· ..•·.....
. ··· . · · · . . · . .· · . . ·. . . Sanitation Dept.:· · -"'~~ .--- ~~--....-.: : · · A r:1uscmen·t'~'":' ·. . (''~[ti
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·cen. •...•. · f· .1 ·r·
o 1s 1- ( ..a n.o t l1 e r..=' If.·. a,-.r., '.'I , consider . (the ·.·VI..e.tnam · K MOSCOW . · (AP)-Premicr
·. ,, . · ·.Al exei ;N. · b Kosygm d .·L·l!'llet
· llm the E . 'VI • 1y ·no t' bonow · . . an. 1'dea . c .ty. Hall. Report . . · .·. ·: ... ·:.. .· .. ... ··. · ... · Bmge -'. · ~..,
.,··. •>. ... . ·.. . , ....
~iie"7feder;ll _Gf·.. smart; ·. sh~ :.cloesn n h~~~ · ;.~var) to be illegal, _iin'?_oral,
. .
remhn t oday _Wlt~l Umted States Am assa o: . C\Ve yn . . from.Taos, N. M.; wllcre lit· : ·,·. ··•·· .~ . ·: . : . .: :•..::~Page. 7 , ( Churche~· :·/, ':'.';:. ·_.,-_j ·:: ~:1i:. ~
. . . o~c Opportumty. to )layc :brams.". ,' .· : .i•~: .:~ .. ,·and . ~omplet~ly unJ~stJfJable : Thompson _to discuss a perso_nal appe:al from ~I _esJdcnt Lyndon . ter rec~pta~ les such as we
1
... , ·. • ' . . . , . ·. ; Classified ' . : • . .. ;.i.,:.fr}~VJ!J:.&:
1
.._the rub. · * . :._ * ··

_.*
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·
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· . , · · .·
. .. . : · . . ':... ., : . ·· .. :.· : :):• . · .. >tlon m Asia, he said: . : .. . ,
.* · ; Amencan
· ·
m11Jtary
· , ·
mterven- · B. Johnson
· .
fQr
· .
a slowdo. w n
.
m _ the aims
· . .
race. ·.
.
VIetnam was also behe.ved to have been d1scussed .at the · gaily. pam ted by · local art-
.·
have .
. m .
New Orleans are
·
·
.
.
.
. .
0 11110ns D1ffer nei e .·
.~ 11· 0 . A · \V'lh·· . : ,
. •t ... ..- . •c··
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. .... :·•. ... >Jj.'l;r::;::
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and 01~0 do anti-pov~rt{ agency' requires ~· . He sa~d the. U.S .. was not ·. 'first form:1 l· meeting of Kosy' •· . . . . ists? ·• · .~ o~ngl C wllay : ~ . .. ·: • · ..: C c. · ·d· · · · · · · · ·.:~·-: : : ' . .().; r,
3 .1
<·' . . .~\yeon tl1eo-· b · .tl1a t one -th . n·d. or·. the . .memb"rs . . -: .. · f1ght1ng 111. Thailand . , · .. toproec t t . -ginwithlhenewambassador,
·· · t
sysems,Is · unmeres_e
· t t d ··JUS t· . . . ElectOI· a · o· ege . . : ';. ~.>· · · .·· +·· ,, rosswor · ·.·. s:.· ·· · ..· ......
. •! ·" ,, ·:·•.·6 ··:& •
'·: '
.
.. .. . ,. .;. :-JlOSOJJIIy
• · of . a of
• .. boards.... sponsor.mg legal
.. aJd ·· freedom
.. . but
. · . we are . pro- It 1·· t d · I'll!
ase a . I emo1e 1an . . tl ·. J·n· an ABM moratonum· It · Thcv'rc . prelty· ugly thmgs . · · I age 13 . ·, LdilOllciiS
- 11 . .. .. ·
· . . . . ·,· · · · · ~oC'r:.. ::·" · ~ .. , : alii·
·\;,\;;}J ram:.· · ,. . progran1s. ~e poor people, ·: or. ·. tectin~ · a .· . diet~torship . \Vith ·· two hours ..· , -.reportedly is . only interested as they no~v stand, b~1t c?uld , .. . · •· :: ·. ·, : .: . · o roscope :: ' : · ·. -;· '' : .;.:,~ ~?
· :ij; •. _•: . .vh!ch has been ·representatives ·,of__P??r•:; pe;?~· .1,Amencan : hves. . He .refu_sed. :. The U.s .. embassy said..lhat in . a . mor~toriUIJ1 · as . ~~rt of. . be made .1~1to .c?lorful htter . What s D?mg In N._.0:. · ·: ·. ;; o;c: ~he RJVCI . : -1_:.:, : ~-· .·:'<>t;<
. , ·:··· '; 'JPY}iligation 01 ~. pie. •. _. , .• . : . · ';. .·y_,~·', : , : to speak further o_n ~e subJect . ~~subjects of . mutual interest general·· dt~armament.. Many .boxes ~v!11ch .. m1ght ha~e . _a, Are_~, ..~Igl~ Schoo,ls .. . . ..·. · • ·:: R~diO ~· ',···· ··:\:X,;· : ~3,:;;~
_.~,; :. ~ 1 nce the e<~rly. .·.. . , { 'i , •. . c·.':: ,-:, ·• .: ,, . '~ .because he said 1t IS t?P sec- ·were discussed., yea n; of East-West talks on psychological effect on l1Uer- . · •· · · : .... > . ·;:-!'age __32 · :. Schools : . ..... ... " :·: :··:, .,20
· · . :Ar.:· tlvi~e and ,: L~GAL_AIO. .: q.as. ba.I.k~d ~t :ret .by the Senate Foreign Re-.· . Thompson brought to Mos- that _ have failed _to produce bugs.. . . " : ·• · ;. . : Sports ;: _.: .. ,. .. : ·· \· : }J·t~g :;
,o get lls own .:~cstr~ctunng: J,ls. ,bo(l~d :. this :/1'( .• Sec MORSE-'Page .2 cow 'last -moilth a. message. ,agreerr.ent. ' ·'.. . ' . . ' . . .. . ·. ' : .·· ·. . . ·' ., , .Womcns News ._.., , . .H.~~·>~e~
.:d legal -~tid pro- . way, co.nten_dmg s~c11 a shake- . ;. , . , . · . ·. _from Johnson to K 0 Ygin s Th~ . Joh11son Adtmmstratwn _It li .worth a tr~. a_nd .may- . ':. ·.: '\:· ., ;..· .. .· ~: )~~ather . :: .. .. ~·:. ;;;· :-, ~;,:
·J_. !l.Y om. .. ~P would..ma~e, the body_ USOO ' LOSE HOMES IN 'FIRE . .which was written about sev- · feels .that an ADM system . . be. F1,ench Qumtet ?.rttsts 1 • • • : · . · •• • ~- , _ . . • :: , ~ · • .· • ..:_ ·· _ , . _ ·. _ • .... _.; ~ :
'·; . ~~t.t1ng, the first . un;.ecogmzabl~• . and :d~stroy_ ·-: t BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) en webks ago .. It is under- .'Yould be a . wa~te of m_oney wpuld·. volunteer t~ pamt a .;'. THE W Tii fA E R: Hour .,~. ·I 61 1j 81 9ll0[!!_112l:!L~l •t(.
·~~: :·. Legal Ai_d . . lt~. a!Jtonomy: · ·: .· :.; . '· : ... ' l..More than 500 persons lost stood to ii1clude an appeal for since ' attac_km,; ~nt?rcontmen- . : bo~ ,01 two; . ... . : . ., . .•. .·. . .. . '• Temp.,,. •.l50j49I~OI50I I rl I· ~~
.. . g1:g lll?mhers -to ·. · ,,- W? f~el: our. ·boarq,·:;WhJch :,'their homes in . a . two-hour · .talks· on banning anti-ballistic. : ta.l balliStic . miSSiles . could , .', :.;. .. : . .. . ·' . . :'. ' . · · , ; 1: · ., · • . , .. . . -. •· · • . • , . . ,; o
( \11._J._l·W.Iul? .!JC3!'d, .. con tams . rpres~ntatt~..~.s · · ,0~, . rblaze )n suburban .Bangkok ·:missile (ADM) defenses.: : . , still ?a use catastr. o p~IC . de· · : .' ,::.. .· . . . ·.. ~· ;. _.: . . · · P~rlly cl~udy · •and
. . c
. ·ool . .·through : ton}. O rr. o w. North?a~ljJ) . l~.~.._.:. ..
· rune; tlu~ \~ould · 1fo_u~ 1 ~Y. ag~ncies, 1 " fair .)last mght: , Two _days earlier , · Communist sources here s~ruchon. It w~nts. a morato- · .,. lA. _ t · ·. ~: ,· ' )vwds 8 to 16 mph becomwg varmblc .tomorrow. Low tom_glt·ci)::
i,; ' P.~.P- gwdc lme~. . Y.. 1eprese!Jtattve of the, ·total ·l another blaze left .1,000, home- , 's.ay the Soviet Union,· which : num , now,· feeling 1t would be :· · · · \.,l.H : . ~ · · : 46 ·to 50. High tomorrow 66 to 70.; Humidity at iO a.·:mtt:i~\"lt
, !1 • t; ·-sn,uspcd. ·The :c;TurrHo·Page 12,·- Co.~. :;~ ·. .'~'' ~J,I~~s .. . · . ·. . ·. ·' , ·:,,: · .' ·. .is . already constructing ABM '. ·· ·1;, ·... .See KOSYGIN-Page 2 ' .; ·. ·.: ·· · ; per· cent. ·. (Det'ail~ (m·Pagc a:) .. ·. · : · .. · · ,. · .<,. :-;.:~i~:t:Wlg;~;~
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: · . ·.. . •. -- . . . . , , . . . ...... . · , .· , , . ·. .. ·. . · . · . .. . ,~t~reBRUARY 1a,
' . ' 1967 ·- ;·· _
._ - .. .
--- .· :_· . . · ..· · ., ·· _.·,--_
. ·;
--·,:-:'
__ .;.._ · ~._·-~~-_':·-~k-_· -.•,:·'_: -,_·.~-.:~.- ·_:· ~.:'-~ -·:.
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IMiainiCubiin . JFK.Plof :Fourid1/Peking's Subs rr"?::tf;·~l!'

'·~: 1
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B Garrison .·. .Ki.:/·': J . :,coo;~~~~tl~·m~ ~~:;~ . . . · At War's Start "C :~
J.ntinu~d
' ''
o_ ,fro.ni Page l
1\II.UH POLICE . officers,

.' ' .
.· b
. e ore e r eans arts . ran '· ury. ' .
fFer;~e g~ently_ Pwa~ hse~ved
dwjth a: subpena to appear . . By ALBERT AXELBANK . .
' 'I COULDN'T FIGURE OUT WHAT rt was all about,·~ . China's . submarine fleet has
. :.: TOKYO, (N_ANA) "--. - Red
:·· , : re;l,
. 'i • ! ; - . ~al ·
I
~
rr .
L ~ith }Jne ex~eption, were told·
1
· · · · risen to~ 50, or . approximately · ·t

I the man \vas ·.wanted in New Ferrie ·said. · ·
. · When, he showed up · for the grand jury call, he .· said
O_rle~its o~ ·.': a ·narcotic_s _war- he' was intercepted_ at the door and asked_ to come up to ·: Germany _possesse at t e out-
.. · -;. , · ·
· -· · · ' - the · same number that : Nazi
·
·
break . -of , World War. II,
d h ·
;~ :
··a:";
~';::..:. i~_:- -_iii_:·
.Ii-J.:
ranb'~ . · ,-. -_· •· :. o : •:"_·· the· office of First' Asst. DA Charles Ray Ward. . .. ·.. · . . 1~ccording to Western military n. -~1
· ·· ·1\liianli Shite Attorney Rich~ He was asked to go to Ward's office by chief investi- · t ;: - · •
-~id ·Gerst~in,· however, was gator Louis. Ivon. Ivon; Ferrie said, led him to an office - exf~ 1 ~· none ·of the Chinese ( 1· ·u+
asked b.y Garrison to aid in . where John Volz, a trial assistant, was already waiting. subs is .presently identified as - ;_ J - lr,.::.~
~· ~-- . . ·.• I.e~
I· .. ·
_, purpose ·of the VISit. . ·
·
the s'earch and k~~w the real few questions about 1963. "
·.
· · Ferrie · said Volz told him they wanted to ask him "a equipped with . nuclear-armed
. . . . _ ,'~- · ., missiles, this event is said to
, According to Ferrie, he was asked to recount all· of - be only _about 12 or 24 months
-~ (
:_i
aq;,'
. prJ.~
·1..'· The pictures shown by Nev/ his activities in the· week that PI;esident Kennedy wi:is shot. - · awa.y at" most. Indeed, Prime d . .\p•~
~~ - Orlea~s investigators -were ap- 'Because he couidn't·- ·remember the events of th <J t week, Minister Chou En-lai himself : J -... asJ
~ ·parently· t 3 ken with telephoto Ferrie asked if he could go to the FBI to get 2 copy of is quoted as . saying that his t ~ .· . t
the statement he made_. immediately after the slaying. , nation will ·acquire a subma-. ; ~- i
lens and blown up with care, rine nuclear strike force prior \ ~ ·. 'S,\\l
rendering good detail of the FERR~E- SAID THAt WAS : THE LAST H'E heard of to 1970. . · . .; f · -A;lj;
man on the street with Os- the matter until "friends and acquaintances qegan: calling Not surprisingly, it is . Pek- . . .,
wald and other Cubans. me saying they had been questioned and, among · · ot her I in 0"'s subm _ arine· "threat" · ··ff
t · GAitRISON himself spent · ·.things, questioned about me." · . ·.. ~7{i~~r;~!~d~~~ceJi~~c:i~~ ~;~ . . _,;1
.. . abouJ four days in . the Miami Ferrie said he could . not remember the exact date Vietnam w_ar. ·. . •Intelligence .- ·-}~_l, _· . Jaw
- area .. in mid-January and that he was . questioned by . the. DA, onlyt that . it was in sources . disclose -~ that -China ·,·, • ·SS!l
stayed .at the Racquet _Club, · November, 1967. · . . ·. ·· : ··· · . ~ · ;. . has been improving its subma- · .- ' -~
- -~ plush hideaway on the Mi: . · Last month, Ferrie said, he called Ivon and was told rine -bases and fortifications on ~] - ..
ami causeway frequented by that the office had · "positively uncovered a plot · in New Hainan Island loc-ated in -the .~
3 wealthy .visitors. Orleans to assassinate Kennedy." · · · ·. . · · . . G~;~lf o(T<inkin. · .~(
:l He and his investigators- . Ferrie contends that the FBI became interested in him· ' "-.. . . - . · )" .
d 'combed the Miami ~vaterfront after a man by the name of Ed Voble of New .Orleans saw · ·BECAUSE OF these subs as r,.-,:··_~,: '-
n and along a 50-mile strip -of Lee Harvey Os\v~ld on television following the slaying and well as the presence of' short- .;
. coast extending to West Palm told a local television station that he served with Oswald range rockets · on Hainan, .. · . ·._j ,·· .
~- Beach -looking for Gonzales. · in a Civil Air Patrol unit under Ferrie. American , commanders have -:·/
t- The Cuban repairs ship5s in- ·, \- · ., . been taking the ptecaution . of S:iJ
1t struments by trade.
~~ The States-Item learned that
:· ACTUALLY,- FERRIE CLATI\l~, VOBLE was in the Moi- keepin~ naval ships well clear
c
. OS{E
a~<:
-r
.he . was probably in a small
·city about 25 miles north of
sant' squadron and "_I was in the Lakefront squadron." _
Ferrie denies knowing Oswald. .
Asked i-f. he thought Oswald had an accomplice, Ferr.ie, - ·let--
. - . ·. .
of th_e_I_s_Ia_n_d_.----'---
_-, -,
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v·
Miami: at· the time
tors were searching for h,im. investiga- · k . 'bl
who has been loo ·ing mto poss1 e 1oca 1 t1e~ms o t e mur er · · · t h · · d .... __Coniinued ·fro . m 'Page i
. _He ' apparently got wind of on his· own said, "I believe it would be fruitles~·to look for . 47.. miles southeast of :saigon
the hunt' and fled. . . an accompiice." . ' ·, . .. . . . .. . : .'today and said the:{ had killed
Ferrie, who lists himself in the city director as a psy~ 70 men of the · Viet- Cong'3 · ·S<J
1 ... ·HE IS reported to have chologist, said, "My a ssessment of Oswald is that he would veteran D445 Mobile Bat~ )S!i j
lived between New OrlP.ans be .incapable of conspiring because he would be incapable . talion. · · . -pt-• .
e and .Miami for' ' a perioJ of of any interpersonal relationship, especially ~nything . as The action capped . these
rt !
a vears. .·
~: Others . known to ._ have been_
: in Miami were Asst. Dist.
. delicate as a cons~iracy to kilL"
. ASKED ABOUT. FURTHER INVESTIGATION, Ferrie

·
· '· .
. major fights that started Tues-
:day: ,.
. South Vietnamese rangers
_
•, . Atty. John Voltz and several said. "I think it's an utter was~ of .tin.~:·· 'and infantrymen killed 331 _ Pi"'
d members of the New Orleans
e · Police Department, believed
. The States-Item attempted to interview· 'Miguel·. Torres, - guerrillas in two days of figh t-
a 26-year-old Cuban who formerly lived only a block from ing ·in the delta southwest of ~~~
to have· been sergeants on the Oswald's last known address . Torres is serving three con- Can Tho. _ .. · ·' JO j
....... idJ
e · force . .· current nine-year terms for burglaries in New Orleans. He. Korean marines killed 243 ·.
h Until _·the States-Item story - was sentenced in 1954. . : '· · · · ·
i~ of yesterday reveal[rig the• in-, ., -_Torres was removect .i fro~ ·Angoia state' penitentiary · a three-hour battle Wednesday
'· North Vietnamese regulars in f I
-n~ ~
. vestigation , l\-Iiami area police·' J a_n. 30 os_tensib)y ··fot~ the. pu.rpose ·_o f testifying in a. trial :_· near. Quang Ngai city on the · . ; . <Jl t
1n. -continued to believe the _man · · t ·a! ast ·
- on a S12 robberv case. The case was 'continued Jan. 31, _,c_e_n__ r_.· eo ._... ·_..'·.·.,·-- ____·. :· :,: __-_~- · _.,.··~- - - ·.. a. 1
;i; \vas. \vanted by Garrison on a Lut T~rres has i10t beeri returned to Angola. .. . - l l ' ,.'
Jt . .·nar_eotics ·'charge. ::- ;~ · . · , · He ·is lnown to be - connected with the 'DA's -investi-' · · ·.A' BLOCKING . FORCE ': of •. i ~~
,.
f ·,:
-.. ,. .'_ ·g_ation . - South Vietnamese ·. ar_mcired ..-. \ ·
::r p· _. · -· ·· ·.: ·· ·i
.. -- - · _ ,, ... ·. -_.· ... = .• ·
personnel carriers _and rang<_.-;_ ' f
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eace-:-:- .. . . _- .··.. .·:· I . .
J . . ·; . , ••_ •• •
r- . _CIUi\UNAL SHERIFF LOUIS ' HEYD gav~·- the States~ ers' killed lnl'fleeing Com~ - . '!· '.
- ·,
!
Jd. _, . · Continued _from Page_ r , · -j muoists the next day. '
!d. . . . ._ . . . : Item . ;:erinission · to talk !o Torres and Torres was advised · .. SOldiers of the 2nd Brigade, · i _
n- ly· and .talks co-uld. cominen~e, oLhts n ghts. . . . ~ .' _. . ... . "- -'· . U.S:- 4th- ';Infantry .·Divisidll. · !. ,.
. - -~ without, however, any sug- Torres, who a p;Je ar~ h1ghly nervous, . thought about 1t . killed at least 123 Nort~! iV. t~f· · .. _..... ·t
F r gestion that Hanoi will budge for a moment a_nd tilen declined -to 'answer the questions . . l namese Wednesdaya!id-Thurs·-·
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.. Toxicological· tests were ·run

Wednesday and will be resumed .
. . Thursday to deter~ ·ine_the~ ·
cause of the death of David
-William Ferrie,. a· .central. figure
· · in District Attorney Jim qarri-
:;;;;.:;~'k'<' .son's : investigation into . the
death of President John F. Ken-
nedy. ..
Dr. Nicholas Chetta, Or·
leans P;uish coroner, . said
anatomical findings showed ;·
that Ferrie suffered a rupture
of a blood vessel at the base
. of the brain, which caused 'a
hemorrhage. , . · . -. :.
a
Garrison said at press _con"·
ference Wednesday afternoon · ....
that he· had decided Wednes-
day morning, before he learn-
.----~J:t ed of Ferrie's deat..lf, to ar·
rest the man next week.
The DA would not elaborate
on what charges he would have
filed or what evidence he had.
.·.
'·
·-:--.~~-~-~- POLICE
OFFICERS remove the. body of Wednesday. ·The body was· removed through
-Photo bv Th e Tlmes-Piccvune
, ....;,:} David William Ferrie from his second-floor _the rear entrance of the building.
-.
·. ~:~.;"j apartment at 33~0 Louisiana ave. pkwy.
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W. FERRIE
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say
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~::te, bt;~ declined t0 ·what
1t was. . · . _. J '
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_. · D;. Cheda · said althouo-h
.1 f'"errie had an assortment ~f ~ I ,_
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' j·.- arugs in his apartment,. he f
'j,,did :J.Q~ krrc \1 whether Ferrie
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·r.H~ TIMES-PiCAYUNE. NEW ORLEANS.
.. -- > - - - - - - - - - - -- - - - -- ·-
LA .. THURSDAY MORNING. FEBRUARY 23. 1967
-·- - - -- - ----- - - --·-·----···- ---------~~
..·. •.:: · ...
;,~:-TEsr·s ONT . B·on·y· House Where Ferrie's Body .Was Found -I h~m Mo~day, an.d also asked ' yt~ulh lriHI~r q~t~sti~ning ~~·as ..n:·lm
_,•.(-_- :·.. · . . . ..u _ . : .. ·. ' . · '· . . ';' ' . . fncnd of l• erne m:d one 'o( IllS WM ' 111~11 for mformahon aho~Jt ccr- ._\
(.~·:· .: .. :; .. .------~ · . · . tam people ~onnccled w1th Os- co-workers. He satd the youth ~~
; -E:l~" ::'} Continued f~om Page 1 wal~l. ~erne seemed "very. fmt~HI· hody· a•~d- .notifi.ed ~$' '.'!'c .
}; :: . t F .. ' . t tf " aOXIOUS to cont;,Jct them, the poiJcc.·. rhc ..youth IS z.t With (:(~
.,.,___,... · at' ·etric " s apar
tl 1·men ht · orF some · ·· source sau, ·1 amI a!ld C!1 th a t samIy· · ll1 onr I · ·11a1r, · · ·!'Om 11e11· ~ ·~.
.,..
l. ca,;, :· 1me t ·sawt · 1e 1gt st mlt erne s··' "F•erne · was 1n· t 1ccp trou 111c.' • .1ong. · 11 c 11ad · long s1dcburns ·- · 1
: ;F. _apar men go .?u . a_ P· m. . The man· said . he too called and wore · a J!laid shirt. · · · ··~ I
\ ~(. : :- However; George La~d:cr, .· the district a_ttorncy's office Ferric Itvcd in an upstairs I i
i~·; . . : arcportcr f?r the Washmbton to report detmls of thc.\"isit. apartment.' ·: . . <::.. _ .
; ~ -' . Post and Tunes-Herald, here . . Ne1ther source would reveal! "' · · b d ·' ·· . ~~~ ·
'··;,~c ·,. . .:·; t o covtr . Gan.·1son ' s mvestlga· · ·. . · .
what people Ferne was inter- .. erne
. : .·. " · ·, . · taken
s o v was · · ·. lol "".
W1 •·
;.""; - . , tion, said 'he went to Ferric's estcd in. . . ll.he co.J ?net s. offtce ~bout_ 2 ~.m.
tr > residence about. midnight to ·. 'VlltAL ENCEPHALITIS' . A P.olice det.Jtl_ wa 8 put ~I. ~h_e
!'': : . .., . )·,1·111 .. ..~ntl
:·,,:·.,. . · J'nter,,,·,., . reina•"ne!l. Accon1·mg · t.o po 1ICC,
- F• crrtc
· ' 1doOJ. of .the• IIofftce.
, , ·and· no • ·. VtSI· .
,.i ....· .. until ••Jhout 4 •a · m · "Once was c,.1scovcre d dCC1 d .1n bcr I .111 l.otTs wet . c. " Oil eel . IIISHic. ~~-· .
1;.;:. you get him ~alldng it's hard his <lparf.ment at t1: 4o a. Ill. . he mys tery wtlncss was tak- ~
.·
':.·.: -:to shnt him off," Lardner Ferric was nude and a hcd- e~ l~ h<;adquartcrs by ·r~et.l :~.
!..-: ;. . s?hl before ht! learned of Fer- shcc( was pulled over his head. -J:i~l1C~ Alphonse of _the homtclde
p o1·1ce ques t·tone d C1n umclen- 1
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~~~ - ·' • ';- r1e's . dc·1th···
-' · · · . . · . · · : :·· ·. · · . ·. · · · · . · 1, :1;.•
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•· tt · NOT: DEPRESSED tificd youth who , one detective I · Ccro_net· s lab tcc~ltuci ~,n·s _- wcnll ~
The reporter s 8 id Ferrie ap- . satd. found the . body. How-llo wo1 k on the case. Bureau of i:c:.
. pcared to . be. neither. excessive- e_ver, -the youth. said 11c didn't !~~~111 f 1 cnl1~n. ~~~rsonne] ..: began
fmd the body, d1dn ' t know Fer- ldkmg ftngct ptlnt~ · and : other
,_, ;
.Jy , excited nor depressd and
.
there ·was. no indiCation that he··
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rl t
<~ppene o wan- "
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. .
·' .:· ·• . ~I·
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might be _¢6titcmplating suicide. dcr in.·: •· . PEflSONAL EFFJ<:CTS . I ~ ' ·;

· D~. Chdl.a, questiqned later, · Fcr_ne harl said Satunlny Mora1~ ope1:cd Ferrie's . per- ~~ .../ ' .
··said that ,rigor mortis bad set !nornmg that he was suf~er- so11~l el~ec ts , 111 the outer coro- \' : ::_y
in nnd that th1i time of Fcrric~s mg from. ~vhat. he c:~lled VJr;tl ncr s-- olfH.:e.: Jlc got through the ~ ,;· ..
death Ji,,d· to be before 4 a. m. cnccph_ah~ts. lie salfl he harl wallet and · then . picked · up
. Lardner,· ·,meanwhile ,. insisted been lllSJrle the ~~.~use "f(or everythin g_ and . \:·cnl into the "
that he had visited with Ferrie about three weeks. pnv;tc.v of D•·. Chcf.la 's office. IWI
until' thnt hour.·. · Gar rison's office · immediate: Noted among the. cfkcls were ~
·:;' . Garrisun .told · The Times- , . . . . -Photo bv The Tlmos-Picovunc . ly joined. in . the investigal.ion , a number · of identification ~·
:: Picayune .late· Wednesday _that DAVTU _WILLIAM I• ERRIE was found tlcnd 3330 Louts1ana ave. pkwy. The body was I though I.I_Hs 1s not. usually the cards. ·. Apparently,· no . money ·_; I. , .:; . f ~
<the Urne ·of Fcnie's death·, Wcrlnesday ht the bedroom off the upper · discovered in bed by a youth at 11:40 a. m. ~C1se ·unl.ll a coroner's · verd1cl w;~ s in ]he ·wa l!el.· There · were , .. ,
·:. according to lhe coroner, and· front porch of this two-story ·stucco home at · Iii rendered . Det.cct1ves D~u~- pieces of. p.1 pcr with ·nam.::s ·and :~ · ·
,.:\ : the time thnt Lardner says .---- . , . · · . las W<Jrcl and Lester Of.1llio phone numbers on them. . J
: .:·:·.: he wa.s wi_t.h Fct~rii;_ rqir;-sent.s ltl~i~ morning we ~cached a de-/been ~een "pacing his flo_or ~nd- IC1ted _details of th~ visit, which took. nnmcs of all who stood . In the r1J~art~1cnt 1\'Crc founil .
·.>. ·_.a maJor mcons1stcney m the ctswn to arrest hun early next lessly' and that be had md1c<01t- he sa1d occurred "sometime in oulsl?c the ~wo-story ~tucco at least. Ia p1II b!!!l.lc:;; some ! . .
:.. :··· ·-case, and ''is one of the week-apparently we waited too cd to an investigator that he the morning." · bmldmg - netghbors, cunous with <:<lp~· on them and snme :1 · ·., ~
· \', ·mysteries we .. <don't· under- long.'' · . · ~as thinking e~bout taking his . ASKED SAME DATA passers-by, reporters <Jnd pho- empty.- It . was not. 'diseloscd G · ' '·
. . ~stand."· .. _.·,::.. . . Garrison said the "primary life. . . . . Bringuier, a Cuban exile, said lograph:rs. . . . what ltintls of ·medicine, tht!y ~~ - -.: i;._: . _, ...
,·i:
:·_.:.·Dr. Chetta·. said. he , had 111- rt.~C1son for the planned arrest . GatTtson satd Ferne knew he that Ferric met him in a res- Dr. Chcli.<J arnvcd on the rcprcsculcn . : . · ·
'formation. tha~. ~errie talked ·of Ferric was hccau~e we felt wa~ the subject of an inve~ti- tau rant ncar the former's place s_cen? and took over the invcs- Ferrie r:m·. h· priva!.e flyi_ng 1 · ·' , : --::::: · .·
·· 1 • __. ~ ·•·
1 I t J. ·
._. ·. about endmg his life two .weeks we had reached a pomt where gat10n and had cooperated With of business at 111 Decatur. . ttgatton. . .. : . service .from a ·cpffce shop at . .. ·• · · · ·· ~
. · ago. He would not elaborate, we had enough information to his assistants . Garrison's office had contact- ·FIUENI'l, CLAIM New qric .llls Lal<efronl. Airport. I' ···: j • :· · ·:\. , •.
·. except to say the man ~vho said move. " . . . Wh~n asked whether he will ed him some time C1fter he had ·Also ·at the scene were Police "lie was nlways v:-ry n;c c. ,·,, 1 :·.: -~, ·.:,]4..:·~
.·: . · .this has a first· name -· of . "Jo- . " Although my of_flc~ has ?ccn now ask for help ~rom the fed- heard of the investigation. News Capt. Henry J\•forris; Lt. Cor- and ocv?n:ot. out ul lint:,~ rc:· j , . · ~ , :d~\<, ::
': -:seph. '' . · ·: .' ; . , · . ,m\·e~tlgrttmg . Fern·e mtens1vely era! ~ovcrnme!1t m the pro?c, of it came to him in early Jan- nclius Drumm , chief of homi- c~llcd ·. a · ~'';ufn~;;.. wh~ ...~lc- · ,. ~~~: ~ -
111
· ·:. -~ '· ·. Garrison said of 'the · a~·s f~)r months, we have not ~en- · ;;amson , rcplwd by askmg uary, he said, but he would not ~ide, . and Sam Moran, chief ~~-'"c~ ~n:~ h_::r: !!:1·:1:- · i~~-~ I ... ·.;.,!:~~~:t>. t(: .
,! death, "The apparent . smcJdc jtt~nc,d hts . ~.a me }_)l~bhcly up to What ." ould be th~ . purpose reveal how. .. . mvesflgalor for . the coroner's ,,,.s .mtc!hgc:-t ·.-I'.'· '\ol ! c•. ·' i '· •·:.f;•"'~-,':;·;
.-,~ of David ·Ferrie ends. the life this pomt, Garmon added. of seclong federal a1d, t~,ie· The other ·source :;aid that office. . ous ahnul . ft~·IT!~ .. ·;,:c:--·~-~ -~tw~"·:t: . 1 : .•.
. . ,· ol. a. ~1 a~. ,~ho;>:~n ·m~ ·jn!lg-·'' "The uniqt~e nature ?f this c~se . ~~~ the it~,vc~ti,gation ;l'ee. ~~-~ subsequently vi~~cd____~--~o!ic~-~~~!!·ce said th!! Conti'niiCtliit-scZ-i-;-1:. 116.;_:--J:;;:-/ i ·:.:-, ·
...... , ............. .. r l,,,,., .. .,,~l>lnrnv lr;,vp~ nw no orlwr colll~.el J.H•re vcars: \\c vc done# JOre .. ". . .. --·--------------------·-----~------,...... ,
~· .'
, . :::::ent, was on\! oi stor~''l\ now leaves me. !10 o"tl~er , , . l_;'e'v~ ·?one 'f;:ore ·'
rnost irnp_ortant indi"l·idua!s.';< cf..'lc~iul;.'' . ,n !Jl.J;:ee m«~tns w1tn a :;'n:all "'~"""'...--....,...-
.
. ._.
. The n,;. 'said -that "evide.~,:J .Asked i: :-,., :·,,;_; i..:i,( rt:;bQJl: :na~.f !han i.!Je . governmt1nt •. .:.·:_":';!''·· . .• I .· .·...·
de\·eJoped bv our office ,;;1;(s to b2iic·.·e · <'''i'c·ody but Lee! did in three vears with 5.ubo f ·;
!ong since c~mfirmed he.·vas ~~.~r:~~~y ?sw;.;:? t?ok pan in_ther..r~L:n ..;'.. . . · -'.· · ·. · ·, ··
, . m,·o!ved in evenis culmir,at- ;c·C•UaJ a:sas~!nai;o.!l, Ca:TlSOl!i:"~'i 11e o_:stnct attorney d1d say, ....__
ing in ihe. assassination of !replied: · . . l::owe1·er, that he \\ill ask Gov. ':'.: .·
l"r~>sident Ee:::u.::dy·.".·:... , · . . !_ .'_'I 1!<!Ve no. rea;vn tr. bel:eve i .iohn."~l.--.McKe-jthen ·for ·a few
., He said investigators. who had/. at tbi§ point that Lee Ha~\:'ey .. h1'lo;·e men to a'id tne inve · . -::
·:~ conducted the .stake-out at Fer: I Oswsld killed an.:vhoct;· in Dsl- j tion. '. · · .
!
rie's_ ap<q·tment had informaticn/la~~-that ria.y." ·.·· . . · ... . : · NOT OB~IGATED ..
"wh;c~ had .caused us " 10 be-·· . ~~:hen as.Ke? \\~heii1er- . F~r~ -_David L"'wis, ~ who had sai.d · >·
come !ncrea.smgly concerned aG ~1e s. de~th w1U hu~d~r lm ~~- 1!:~onday that he. feared for hJs ,·~ I· ···:, i
our mvestJga~JOJ~ • progressed \esl!gatwn, :he rcphe~., "N9 i,lile bec~use .of what h~ knewJ
,,1_
?bout_ the possJb1l1ty of his kill-/ comment." · , ·· - ~ · · j about. ·'tne plot," could not be)
~ -. ! .
· . . . .. 1· ·. · 'P.~CI:,·c . FLOOR'· . . ! 0~r~? !hursday for comment onl ..

mg hJ_msel£."
"DECIDED TO ;~RREST . He. saJd hJs men had noted 1r -;, .Je. s de.~t~. : .
B;,~ause ?f t.h1s, he contm-/ .extreme nervousness" in Fer-/ L e. JS a ~ll!ppJng agent at a
L . , . ..
: ...
~-
ued, m a meetmg at my house ne for the last.lO davs. He had! bu~. ]me here. : . . ..
·-· ·-,~·~.. - --:'"·"·-- -.:--..,.,...,..·'~----~-- ---~ .. ·l·s;·~m2\:,;:eJon~l ~~~\\?~~h:;.:tJ~~/-
) '
r
•!
F
i
. .
. ···-·
•
:.
'1
--· . . ---.
.. . .
;
.
:·i:;_.r.:-
-~
~-
. \ is and don't know when he will -I
.1 1be back - and that's officiaL"
! 1 Neither Lewis, nor his wife i.
1 I a!1d four children were at his
; / residence Wednesday night.. J
·.,. ,._
I Neighbors on both sides of the: \ '

I bouse said they didn't know· J ~
I[ -: .. ·
t
i
;
.-.: .· 1 where the family was. . . _. :
! At the press conference, Ga_r- ·~ . ;:
< .. . .···<·
. f
_-;.· i rison refused to allo\~1 photo-. . •· : .... . -..~
j graphs to be taken, saying .that _.::-.> _..,: "'
..-~-~-- .· ... - l pictures would- ''create some- .. .. -;:.~~~ .: ._:·-~ ·_ :. ,.:
~:~:~:: 'i:,;~~~u~~~i:s:'~; b;:,~. :, ':: · "'.·.·c:;~ ·.;;? ·•·.·. ; } i •

'].
.'
1
)
_.. _·~·~:~~ ~~j.{~;~:-E;~-~·~

. - I
.-~--: ·;
j
i Asked 1f he was taking steps
1 1- ........,--:.7 -,:; "· _o;_• .:·-·· .. :. - ·.·,· ;:
-- · ·1; to protect other principals in the ,.--..- ·. f 'J;: _":;-. ··-:-.- ,~;. "'·: ·;-;_ ·'. :- - ·....: :· , ·· :::.;·•:
-:..
, ,lS under
ca<" he said his office -.'. ·.:;"~.f,:::._ -.-::...-~,...-:---
:; _ ._ ..., ·;. ·.· ~-., r - ... :_:;,.... ~-"-;."~
-;~'·· .:·,. ·..:.:- :·\-'.,,,·;r.-:~ ,-:.:~- .
l, • • • • ....
· ;J I,no ~~bligation to protect anyone

· 1
. ·~: .:·.'':·):~~;;,_;~ ' ..:'.-:,.~_.::>:;.\;:~::. ~;,;~"'! --~ ~'.:-:':·.,
__ .; and that the size of his staff · .. . ·:: .---'<:·~.:.·: . ·,:·.~~.; :_-:··. :... _ · ~;~ -· · · .. ~
1
•i ;.~ J!;~ft~; ~;:1~ ~1! :·lfi~J±1 ~~t."I{~·~i,~~~;'
1
I~~o;~~s~~n~~n~a~i~~~-:~e~~c~r~~· ;::~,-- ;,'·. . :'· :~{.':,~ · ~~ .._: -~_., .. =~ - ..•.

. '
the 4o pages are c.lass1hed · _. .,
-~- ·~
secret and are not available to .· .. _ -~' ·
local inves~igators, he added. 1
,,:~~ •:-. ·"
:, I Garrison sa1d the names of per- ;~ ·· ..
·_·
sons mentioned along with Fer- . !J. · ...: .. ....:~:: .
I~~-J~d ~~~d~~~~~~a~:-~e~~e~u~;~ r~t~~-~Ii'::~~{-~i~::~i-H?:{~~:~- :~ ·.' .
tioned He d1d not elaborate on ~:;·::·-'" .. ::: ._.. :::.:--·, .-:\-··...· .. :
-~ - ..
. •. man of. mountains and. val- r·o .,·_•.

levs." The district attorney · ·,'
said he "felt sorry" for Fe,r·
rie . .·· · - : ... . .;:.
During his last h_ours ?f·lif~,
-_. Ferrie sat in a chair facmg. hls
opened front ?oor Tuesday.: At ...,..,"·'··*'~.-
-~-
·about 11 p.m., he ro~e and put_

out the lights; :accordmg· to a: re: .-
, port·from Garrison's inveshga~ :,,
tors. on stakeout duty. ~ear Fo~r,
rie's · residence. The mvest~ga- "
Itors remained· for a -short .tlme:
.I af~er the lights in the apartment .
I
were out, . and. then lefL assum-
ing 'that. he. had gone·to. be~:,
During the mght hours-Tuesda_y~
\ no one entered or left the. apart-
!ment \\' h i ! e the .investigators '.;
.... ,. ' ~.-
1watched the r~sJd-ence, .· they ;::~-
said. · · · · · · - ·.:" .: I<
·1 · .·· WANTED HELP : <
1 s-inffu;er and another man,! ·
/! 'j wh; ~~k~d 'th~t ~is identity. not ..:
v !'" be revealed : sald that Vi· hen ·.

.,. . ..
c.~· - . ·~
""'-:--.. •• : . , . : :
-- =-;;':'?=2:. .~•. -
--~--,....,:,.·,·. , •. 7.
·
-
.. -- '•
,,, •
• i..-:,
. . .~~.._1 iFerri~ i~~~t~~,:t~G~~i~~ay~~~ ·:· - -~-,~~ .
NW 12640 Page 120

.. . ::ii:--..
~. '· .. '
r.
"·' . .. _-; - . ·- ·.: - .-:: · i..
-..._.f~ ...
~-·:{ -<-·. · , ·::-i~~:---- .
. . .... . ·. . .·
.TESTS ON BODY :..· _..-· - . ~-: ~ .. f
:·.
f.
.
.. ·.
~ ,:: <.· ::~ :_-:~::::~~~ ·:·~-- Continued-from Sec. l, Pag~ 17 ~
•· ~'~1z;~wi~~~~~~~E:F:::LY~··
..· •.-~ -:. .. ,,. :_~,- --H,,{ . ··.· ·.,. Ferrie talked freely with re: .
·. ~: '::··--:_~.: ·' ::t/' port~;s from both The State:::-· ·· fii;i di'\
·. ·. - .. -- ·. . ':· :-•· · Item and The Times-PiCayune ·
~·J~~'~,~~{~~:·~E~r;.~"'i;,:ir;:~~~· ·
··.:. ; :-':' " " ·- ··.~:...:-.-:;,:.::·: this was ' becaus., · he felt· he
:_ :~r( :{~ :'_i·: ' ·~f{i}·. ~~~~~~~t:r~ :.·''an ;Tisympathetic .•
.
. ~ ' .... "
~- ·---.
-:_
... •'
-··
-:·
. ·: :: .. "'"{:.
.::::·:·. · .. .. :.. << . -·· · The former airlines pilot ·....

:,~;:.;;~;- ···:..;. · .;'1 . . · had ' said Saturday morning
Y;~.:;· · _, . >~\_i .
that he was told Friday night
' ··-- ,_ .. . .. -: that he would be indicted by
· -~;.:_;:,;::;_. ,--- ·::::· · ~ . .".:-_ , the . Orleans Parish Grand
. · ~:; :~·_:/.:-: ' :· \:- j· • · Jury in regard to tlie Garri-
':~?~l?:~:: __ <.' ·.: ~:;j : <: · son investigation · of the pos· :i . ·· -:.;- . ·
: '::~~;-,;" :-~· :: -~ ~l ·.··' sibility of a plot to kill Presi-
:::t~:i.Lz·::y: ~-:~;: ~{:· ·\:: ::;t. w~:n~:iYiotXe~r~e. .didn't.
: ~j~f.:'-~ -_-~··--:::_::;·. : ·. .. DENIES OSWALD LINK
-~--:~:~:-~~-~ :-_:::":./·<. He denied any link "\vith Lee
····· · ·.· _-,'" ·:::< -. · Harvey Oswald, President Ken-
_::-~ f ' · · · ~ nedy's accused assassin. "I did
·· ~ .- not know Oswald," said Ferrie,
who had lived in New Orleans
for 15 years. ·
He told of the circumstances
. .{ · · • surrounding his arrest in 1963
. ·/ : :___·;-;~'/ j' a few days after the assassina-
, .} . tion of President Kennedy. Ac-
.·... , '·' · cording to Ferrie, he and two
companions decided that after-
noon, Nov. 22, 1963, to drive to
Texas on a pleasure trip. -AP WIREPHOTo .
. .. "We went that night ta Vin- READING AN UNSIG:'-JED NOTE found in the home of
··~ ton, La., then .to Houston, Gal- David W. Ferrie. afte-r his body was discovered Wednesday .
· veston, Tex., where we did is Dr. Nicholas Chetta, Orleans Parish coroner. Ferrie, a
some , goose hunting, and key figure in the district attorney's investigation into the
finally bck to Alexandria, assassination of .President Kennedy, was found dead in his
La.," recalled Ferrie. "It was home Wednesday l!fternoon. Dist-rict Attorney James Gar-
. there I discovered that Garri- rison said he planne_q to arrest Ferrie next week . in connec-
.--....:_.,; . ...... .·, ·son·. and his assistant Frank tion with the case. :'~ · · · ·
:_ ·-~l Klein ·bid broken int'> my .---.::.:::::..:::_~__:_:______..::._-'----_._-----'-~-'.--:-- _, .
1 apartme?t a~d carted off a . testified, was i~ :cha~~e of air_,.,·"" ···.. :.'"""~~--:---- . .
lot of ~hmg~. . . New Orleans CIVIl Air Patrol .,, .
.' . . Ferne. sat~ he ~vas ar-res!ed unit, but O'Sullivan was not sure .
.by G~r;~son s off!ce_as be~ng whether he was Oswald's com- '
a. f~gthve. J~om Tex~s. Af.er manding officer. .. . _ ... .· ' .·. '
glVlng Gar:nson .a. ~mnute a~- O'Sullivan was asked by the
. co?nt of hts actiVIties, Feme commission if he knew whether (".
sa1d he was released. . Oswald was a£sociated with or
·.-.- ...~ ' -~
- GRAN_D Jl!RY CALL knew Ferrie through the CAP.
But Ferne satd he ~ot a call "No 1 am not sure," O'Sul- ,.
from ~he Orlean~ Pa:1sh Grand !ivan ~eplied: .:._
-;.5
· ,., · , :· :;..•.;· ..~.~-~.- :.
.·· •
_; .
Jury m January, L67, to _ap- O'Sullivan said that after the E .. - .. ·--;
.,... ~
pear. As he go_t ~o th; Cnm- assassination he \vent through Ic

mal Courts b~t!dmg, .:e_ w_as all the old CAP files that were~~
asked t~ ste~ lnto the distnct available, trying to get any in- J
attorn~y s ~fftce. . , . · fo;mation he could for the Sec- .l
·..•
. Ferne :;a;d Ga~nso~ s mves- ret Sen·ice . . ~-
tigators ~alked w1th htm exten- . "We found papers sicrned bv - 1
cI ·,, -·--- ...
sively about the· November _w~~k Ferrie . but ··nothing '\·n _ r;, ' _ · o · ·.: . - -- ~-· .. . - ~ .<·. '..:· •: .
.! • leading .up to ·the mur?er 1 Iation 'to Oswald,'' O'Sullivan ~~ . ,..
!n
. . •: ··.· . . . Dallas, Tex., and h~ a2;;:ed _.o testified . .: . ..·. . . : : ..
·,. , , be allowed to see a transcnpt · . . CHECKED PLANE · . ·, ·. ·. . : -
; . : . . -'· '·· ~ he· ga~e t?e Federal _Bureau of O'Sullivan went on to tell thel·
, . _ . . .·: ; -~- --I~vestJgatton. Accordmg to Fer- . commission that he believed 1:
. ... . . · ."_;_ .· . . :te, that w.~s t_h~ la~t he ~e~rd i Ferrie had been arrested after.. ·
. ._·_. ·. _. ·<·: ·.'
.. :··; .. ... : _:-:;,
~ f~om th~. ats~nc~ ,atrorne}: 5 of-~ the assassination in connection
f1Ce_ unti.t his rr,e~_ds ~~arte~ . with "this Oswald situation." I .:- ...
.·.::: ·.. .
.· ~
callmg h1m ~n~ tell~g {11m -~r 1; "I don't know just what he
.1'. • . '•
. .. :. . : .-. - ;:..i
. :·.- -- :·· . ,; recent questwmng by the dr::.- ·\"as ,·narged \\· 1··h 1• be'ie"e ·ust· : ..
. .... -. -~ ': .· -. _ ,·:·•'f· tr·!Ct a tt.orn~y ' S Ot·r·.ICe. _ <, ·• under • c investi!!ation '· ' 1 f~
'- · Oi WhJteve; . ··' : .
'•
· ··
'.: ,.;-·.- ..;\ :.
. Fe;ne was C}'1Hcal_ab0ut_the i" ·was I don;--t know.·:
. .dlstrict·. attorney's· mve_stlga- ' .L ...... ~- • ·~· '· : . . •.• ~'
.
. ·: ; •
I( :. ..-..:.
...
" . f .·
tion of the supposed p~ot. Re-I . ., . .

~mg •,h" /?'esll,a~.on °·.
i' ... ·,'
.:
. . · .. ·. garding a list. of th.e e:-penses :e~rl; •• 0 ~u!.r::.a~ . said, _ '~~ li
" . . . -. ; !·" .. (}{ the DA's m•·estigatcrs, he
-:_•~··, ·· : : .:·: ·1" . •
:. ; 531 ·d·
•
"Look •
at t"n ".::. l'"ami·
1 ~. <Hl
· · ..:.~~-_ :..;___~.''" · . that's a good place ic.r the !Ii~n ~.,~~ ·: "' ~~::-Ie___::_ ~-~- ..,
'
New I
a?il L>. Pant lJ\•_.Yer:_ of Lilt: ;
Orleqns
t " k d F . ' JMIIce . depart~i
!
I·· ·
. .. ·'' .
..-.
':.
!: · ·
..
' '· '
' -·.~ :..:.o;:. .. :. · a~sistant attorneys tQ go in , P;·-ne to se" If_:• ."':s ur ·
· ·· · · · ,,;::,,~,.. · ' •h winter " · 1 an!e, to see poss1ulv wnetber 1· ~
- ·: .':,·~>,~ '.':!~_ ;;: . . wt~ . • •· • . .. h3 d h '"' fl . ; a h t"''"" '·
'
· :, •· .-~:~
.. -.._·· '·~-:-:--:;.~-~:;·~. -:~ ·.... · :.-:,·"-· •·" · · ·
·::... ~~~ \ ;. J
' Cn tlte
....
probe• • ·~ ~ • u--c: • ·• - ~r ... e1"th ·t'Mtl _e....
itselt he ""td • }'lth~:-
r~f\HIVb+ ll;; -- -- ,,_,. ,
t.c , _ __ ¥. ·
\
. ;· ' '··· .< .• ,.';-: · z !'l~'S a DJg "'Ke til'>t· ~ What I W. ~ ·'-'· •'•·-·-- ·• •.• . ., - · •·• •·
-~;i~~ ;~::!~-~:~~~i:;~r~{f~~- -.~~~/~-- ·-~~=l~i· :1-~~~!-~~)~t ~~~:=~:,: ::::::::.:._ .

~- ,. .... ' . .. ~ .
. ....
l,.
-" l . •
• -~ -""' ~..
... .,. ,.., . -
a.g- ... . .
'. . ""
•
.
94TH CONGRESS
lsTSESSIOX
H R'•ES 432
0 •
. IN THE HOl~SE O.F HEPHESEXT.\TlYES ·

..ArmL 30, 1D75
.Mr .. DuwXIXG (:for himself, 1Ir. 1YH1TEHU~ST, and 1fr. H.\m:rs) sulmtittl'tl the
following resolution; which "·as refcnell to the Commith•e on Hull's
RESOLUTION
1 . Rcsolccd, That there i:-: hereby crrntcl1 a ::;eled culltlllittt;~
2 to be composed of seven Jfemhers of the House of Hepre-
3 seutMives to lJe :1ppoiuted by the Spe<lkt:'l', om' of \Ylwlll he
4 shall de::;ignate <lS cllainn:lll . ..:\uy Yilc<HLcy uceurriug i11 the
5 membership of the committee sh:dl be filled in the ::::u11e
7 The committee is nuthorized and dirC"cted to coriduet a
8 full and complete investigation nwl stncly of the circnmst;mces
9 surrounding the death of John F. Kennedy.
10 For the purpose of carrying ont this resolution the
11 committee.. or mn· subcommittee thereof nnthorized hv

~· .. the ·
12 committee to hold he;uing-;:;, I:' anthnrized to :'it and ad
v
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 122

Citizens Commission of Inquiry
103 2nd Street; N. E.
Washington, D.C. 20002
{202) 546-7500
Suggested Readings
. J.1ark Lane, Rush to Judgment; New York; Holt, Rinehart and ·

Winston, 1966
Citizen's Dissent, New York; Holt, Rinehart and

Winston
Sylvia Meagher, Accessories after the Fact, Indianapolis; Be>bbs

Herrill, 1967
James Garrison, Heritage of Stone, New Ye>rk, Putnam, 1970
Josiah Thompson, Six Seconds in Dallas, New York; Bernard Geis

Ass •. l9o7
Edward J. Epstein, Inquest; ·The 'Harren Com.rnissbn and the

establishment of truth, New York, Viking
Press, 1966
George O'Toole, The Assassination Tapes, New York; Penthouse

Press, 1975
NW 12640 Docld: 5916~:1006 Page. 123

· . . ·: c-:_·.
~ -· ·.. "
·- · ~ ·I·:. - ·.-: - . . -..·.. :::: .. :: ...... "
. ., .
.-.- ....
. . .- :
.. .:... -. . . ._, _J
:' -: .~ .·..
.. .·.~ 214 TilE KENNEDY Co:sst•t~t.\C\
had offered to testify that hchad coD.ferrcd with Shaw,Jack Ruby, and
Lee Oswald from two to nine in the evening, on September 2, 1963. The
meeting purportedly took place at the Jack Tar Capital House Hotel in
Baton Rouge. Rumors indicated that assertions were being made that
Mr. Shaw cm1tributed financial support to Mr. Johnson's campaign.
Garrison's office also claimed that it had unearthed evidence of three
'
.
rendezvous between Shaw and Oswald in small, rural Louisiana towns
during the late summer of 1963.
i
it . .
... . •.·..-.
The New Orleans States-Item then ran a copyrighted story It by Hoke l
. ,. :-
~
May, David Snyder, Ross Yockey, and Rosemary James of its staff and
R. I. Endtcott of the Da ton Ohio Dail' News, which beoan to crack-..
1c s 1e, of denial r o ' ·nvolv . ent in the case and wit
some of the principal participants. Gordon Novel had already announced
that he intended to hide behind the cloak {and his famous "Mr. Weiss
letter" suggested even the dagger) of the Central Intelligence Agency in
the face of the looming Garrison inquiry. Now Shaw himself was seem- ,. .
- ingly revealed as haviog Gannectioiil& with that mysh:riGm;...Q.-.:partmront of -. · Ir·I ·..:·
the United States government Certainly he wa" assnciatcd with two or- L
. . ! :~
- gapizations which were widely ideotifi,d h)l--rec:ponsible figures as b e ing
·.-:_~- ·. _. .
arms, fronts, or financial condnits fadts..ac.tivities Et ·.
r
_.
:<:: -;·: ·.
·_:_;- . .
Rather than draw on the excellent, but necessarily secondhand, report ·
Of the group of star journalists mentioned, the autho:: established com- ~ f '
l
mumcahons w1th the original source, the ncwspap.er· Paesa Sera of Rome-:- ·
\Vhat follows is the result of tha<t line of inquiry.
..
'
I
·. i..
-rhere was established in Rome an organization named the Centro !-'
Mondiale Commerciale. Its origins, functions, rotating presidency, geo- j
graphical displacements, sub-, subsequent, and alternate designations, . l
I
were so complex and labyrinthine as to make a comprehensive and com- i
prehensible description of it in anything less than a moderate-sized book f
I
impossible. Nonetheless, the essence of its activities can be sketched ..
I
here, and as they seem to deeply incorporate Clay Shaw, a former OSS l
colonel, Italian Fascists, supporters of the far, paramilitary right in Eu- i
I
rope, the CIA, and other like subjects, it is vital that the fundamentals of j
this situation be clarified as much as space and the entire business' innate
irreducible ·confusion permit.1 2 ·
In 1959 another of the mysterious figures who appear to comprise
the major portion of the persons somehow related to the investigation in
New Orleans, a Hungarian, George Mandel,at one point Italianized to
II New Orleans States-Item, New Orleans Times-Piwytm!!, and Dayton (Ohio)

Daily News, April 25, 1967 . .
~~ Paesa Sem, March 4, 1967.
· ·:
;-.-.
··-i
m~· 12640. Docid: 59168006 Page 124
...,,
·Clay Shaw. Accltsed 215
Giorgio Mantello, created a Societa ltalo-Americana, the purpose of

\Vhich was announced as industry and commerce. On November 14 of
that year he inaugurated what Paesa Sera regards as his most important
"creation," ,the !tala-American Hotel Corporation. Its stated object was
the construction of the Hotel du Lac of the EUR (Exposition Univcrsale
Roma). The largest of its shareholders were three foreign credit groups,
"represented in Italy by the Banca Nazionale del Lavoro, UJe D~ f<WH\Co .. !,
Astalde Vaduz (Swiss the Miami Astalde Vaduz (American), and the
of Basel. The.De Famaco and the
L
! i 1.11 ~: l · -~:::~·
! lr:\YJ ·3~~~
....
k 'II'·' ,.··· 1•" . .·__ ..
The board of directors was interestingly assorted. Several respected

Italians were present-Christian Democrat Depl!ty Maria Cfd:avolo and ·
former_Social Democrat Deunty Corrndo Eonfantini, Listed as president
VaS Carlo D"Amelio. la\yyer and arlministrptor gf tbo fgrme~ ro}'al f;unj:
,'s interests. The remainder of the board consisted of non-Italian names.
wiss Minister Ernest Feisst; Swiss Professor ·Max H~gemann, owner- -. :_ :· -·.'
' . -· .··
.-:.:_._ .-
ditor of the newspaper Naz.ional Zeitung (not to be _confused with the
eo-Nazi German Nazional· und So/daten Zeitung); Hans Seligman- . ·; --~ : . :_.; ~. .-...... -· ·:. .;
: ~-~ :. -·: .,:. ::,: ... · ··:: ~ . ;~~ ~-. :-::'·:
Sch.. banker- Professor Edgar Salin, president of the Faculty of ,; .;·· ~~' . ~ .. .· -
Economics at the University of Basel; Dr. Enrico Mantello tirothec of
. I George Mandel (Mantello), the power behinq t~e ~Qsiehi: ltet!EJ A merjg
cana; Ferenc Na former Hungarian remier and e t\ ·
-.
and landowner of oddly totalitarian turn of mind, related through his.
ilaughter-in-law to Adolf Hitler's notorious Minister or'Finance, Hjalmar
Schachttried as a war criminal at Nuremburg; gnd Clay L. Shaw, of New.
Orleans,t-t ·
~~hat of these associates of the "old-fashioned liberal of th e
W!lson-Roo::;evdt p ersua;;ion"? What kin.d of persons did they seem to
b:.::? Again, space precludes a full examination of each, or, for that matter,
even a cursory individual analysis, but we certainly can look into the
background and activities of a few.
13 /hid .. . - .:= ·~- ·'.-."'...· -·

.
I I I hid. : :·.
"' l ·
~- ~ ::
!i
~.•!'
! ; -
i j:.
; ~ :~
: ·.. .·
·... ·...~ .
~. .~~-.-;....·.;..;;]/:i_.:, :·-
.
gii~i1'6:4o:- : ~~'lA'!-6.9l66D0.6~ ;': .Eiage" ~1~, :-' :· · ~ ·:. · ·. " . . :.· ·: .; .:: · . .-.-.. : '· '··. ·· , :--- ·.
-:..:·~ .: - . :. .-·:"- .....:,-.._-=----~'", =~/,/ .. ·: : ·, :.. .• ' 7 .. _.;:,, ~..., - - • ' ~ ' -· · ,;. ' ••
·.. -· ·· ...·. · ... ·::·. . · · · · .. ·,
~ ·· •; ;
..
.·.:·
. ·:···<::--·.: ·: ._._.
.. c
... , ·. -~
···:· .. .: : .
·-.· .. .. ·.·.
. . ·. -:·- ·•. ·:-·:·.--~:: :·
·: .. ·· : ·.
.' ", . .... .·:. ::
-··..
.._ :· ·; ... 216
·. ·.
, .:•.: ''; · -
. l
:....-·
~
,...;/,..:first there is Giorgio Mantello (Mande)), a Hungari~n refugee. r\u\-
~ . ···~ f: 'l . · trian citizen, functioning in Italy, Switzer.lan d, and elsewhere with fin :.: :1 . ..·
._: ·. :~J·{- }: J .~;! ~l

~-
:··-.-· ._. · cia! transactions reaching throughout Europe, Africa, and Americ~!. w:in
...._. :- ·-~· >{j l. f has, according to Paesa Sera, been condemned for his "criminal activi-
' ·. : : ··:': . ·,~. ':J: i !;!I. ties" in Switzerland. This latter revelation was originally carried in the
: ~. .:.· -~~ ~:r · \:-:; f t 1'
August 19, 1961, issue of the Basel newspaper A -Z, which fc;J.-
. .._- ' :,: . ::11' r. ';;:
turcd a report about directors of government agencies, ~aying: "In rn;:m

articles we have justly spoken of the criminal activities of Mc.>!'-r;
(Ferenc] Nagy and Mantello." Mantello initiated a suit against the Swi~s ·
.. .... :::, ~ :- ·
journal, then abruptly abandoned it, causing A-Z to observe: "Too bad ·
we would have heard some great things at the triaL" 1:-. . •
_Ferenc Nagy was closely associated wjth Mantell a iu l~i~; J;aig~· 5...crrr ~
financial-pol itical maneuverings. When Man ell r
....
the ead office an ot er ace of the Centro Mondiale Commcrci+·
···:: . Nagy became it<> president. He was the Na~y accused of "criminal ccri,·j- "'
: ., _... .-:. .
·: ."<·..
·· --
~- ·· :
; t .
:·
~ ~-
tTes" alan \' · Mantello · · · · · " ~
pendent" of the CMC in Rom~ .
. ·,. :;'·. ·;·.· . .-;.~~ · ::r.i !1 ~ i,: TI!
. .<:··. ' . '· ... ·
····:·'. .. , .· -}~:·-~:1-n~Hi ;a'n
·• · : ·. ' ,.,, .. ," " ·r·· --· i ~. <:
- "As president of Perm index, I would like to thank the Italian govern-
ment for the good will and sincere interest shown toward our great under-
.•. <";~; :' ".' ~<; •\l lllll!t~l

taking, the pem1anent industrial exposition and the CMC," orated Nagy.
as the operation he fronted began. It was all very grand and impressive,
but to ,9.l.1J~-Prl~r-8c~;--.--:::::=:::::=;;:;.__ _ _ ___,..________~--
·
· ·· · ·
.
· · .·· ·:,:·;.
. ._._.. . .,, .. l1 ~ ~
·:~~:~; ~~ ~ n ;.ill'l 1
r,.1
1
reached the point of the grotesque when the lawyer
' -- • • '
,. . ·l•t ' ~ ~ HP'
• ... , ' •• t..,.- • ~ .I '.j
. D'"Amelio, praising Perm index as 'a capillary organization located in the
principal cent.e rs of productiQn, with its head office [CMC] in Rome' (an
. ._; .._:·. ~---- ·.-: .. ~.....
._·.·.·:·.·.· ... ~..·· . .. :
:.
.
,---~~. .. .
.
·,' ' . . _.. '- ...
. . .: organization, all the while, virtually non-existent), brought all of Italian
~- ~. ; .·.- . ; -. •' ,·
civilization into play by affirming that thanks to the Centro [CMCJ.
'Rome will recover once again her position as caput mundi, as center of
the civilized world.' " IG
"twas soon to bee vast, mighty
structure was 110t a rock of sQlid<ltity, of super 1c1a ny; not ·
' :.;.; .,.;, 1i tl g,, 1,1 j ~1cted with mass snpporting promiss:, but comons::;d of c~
·k~1lH '~ l-~i~i~
:~::,rx,, I 1 ~ ~ f
J
,
. .J,!J.Irull!h which money flowed back and forth, "lith no cme knowing tb!:_ .
_.§.QUCCe Qt tbe___destinotjgg of these ) ir!uid.asc:ets.
···'•. ,... 1 ·1 ,~ .1
~-li .l' t i ')
l .l~ '·Iii I
: 1
.Ferenc Nagy, who, while premier of Hungary, was "compelled by
Communists in key government positions to expel from his party various
~Jtl'; ·ll11 ifl :!
'·>'i· .:r;.• '·
' of its members who had been arrested for plotting : . · _ against the gov-
ernment," 17 and who, while on a trip to Switzerland on May 29,
lftHi; ' IBiU II

~~· l 1-~· · .
''.·'· .. < ' · ~ . ' ,;., ~,I.,
-~~
15 /hid.
16Jbid., tv1arch 11-12, 1967.
If·• t·jJ.. jillh .·.

17 Uni1•ersal Standard Encyclopedia,. Vol. XVI, p. 5,974.
\i·' 1 '.• ~~!

·££:'J ~ ~ ' ~ I
~. . .;~.·:·..i ' ;i. .~. ~ ~ ~ Ut I

'if;i:! '· ·~ il ~ l ~ i~ !
~"j 1 a1~ ,·t i} ill
wr,~) ~ 1'1~111~
~.,.-;, ....~J .i lit ]r
··' _ : - ~~---_·- ~-~7:- :..'?; ...-:-t: F~~:;t .. ":."'\'. t·_~~-.:.~: - ·':; ·~~-.?-~-~~;: . -- : ~ - ~.;-! .. ,._._ _.:--_ .;.· ..._. :• ~
: .._.
:.~
· ..
~---~
-' ·'·'
,,
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 126 ·'-

· ·>
- • ·~r·• ·• ·.~
:......." . , ~· ,b!S.I;dl '*'*" lkta: _t .;<M:~~~~.'!S~:..~~:r?.:"..:~-\i.:-s:t!.-;.,.e~~~>1'~.:~'r"d~"';::~~~:.:;.~~~.:~~r:,:::.:-~jj
.,11\q' J·~
. : I~~ i:;.~i. :::·',:~
~ I • ~..
1''/ ,. __;. . -. ,
Clay Slww, Accused

217 i I~ l l:~~- .:.'~i s ..
1947, telephoned his resignation to Budapest, moved in shadowy ! 1j'~ ·1 . :.1
areas of finance and politics. "President of Penn index and Board Mem- i ·,i' ~- ·. €~
bcr of the CMC," re orts Paesa "' · lllil l ~ ;p.,J ·
~~~::~:~~}~~~~~~: ~d" to
Ccrfamly on.: 1s Jed tO wonder why, of all the hundreds of nations on
II.1,,fltr ~ 1,, •. ,
~~::~1~;;r~;;~~~~;sg~;g~~z~~~~~;;;g~4~ .
!'i i ili't i.
::i;~~r{5~~;r~~::::::~~~~::::.:~::::::::
Prince Gutierez di Spadafora, Undersecretary of Agriculture in Mus-
l lI;!ltl !~,i :
~ jl f'f1f:~if··
solini's Fascist government, was another. After- his wartime achieve- ·.HI, i.l ~.J_ ·'. ~--· . '_.:_:;: .~
ments he turned his talents to his vast landholdings and commerce, esp~- . - . , .. , ... ... ..
cially to the ·establishment of a corporation, wit.; himself as president,
which constructed a huge refinery at Milazzo, in Messina, Sicily. He is
also president of the Sicilian Compagnia Armatrice Industriale Petroli-
. fera Armatoriale, which is involved with arms and oil. The prince also 0
. owns what is reputed to be the largest hothouse in the world, in Pachino,
Syracuse. The more than a hundred employees were for some time super- .. .
:!~~~~~~·~t~:d;::~:c~~~;~~t!~s~~t=s~~~sr~~~:.~~u~·~J~e~v~~~a~~~~ ~~i: ~ ~ ~--· · .~fi2~.; :_· .'_:~~-.~- ~-

. and high black boots, with fancy revolvers flashing from their belts. Ac-
cording to Paesa Sera "the Syracusans, unaccustomed to these Mafia-like
habits, held a great general strike in protest, in December, 1962, and
h
If'
"'
·fJt
1
.• lj
.. .,
t I! - • · ~· ..c'''
;r:i - ~$
! ~- '?t:":: ~~
..
·
·.. ..
. ·.· .
.·- .•
the Mafiosi of the Prince were forced to return" to his more feudal prop- .. · . . ·.:
erties.
The Centro Mondiale Commerciale boasted another interesting name
· in its background. He is Giuseppe Zigiotti, president of the Fascist Na-
tional Association for Militia Arms.
"Another fact whic~-~ may help us understat!d certain things about the
personalities around the CMC," said Pai:sa Sera, "i;; th<:: presence in this
group of H . Simonfay, Hungarian refugee, who directs BO-DA, an
agency for provocative information from and for the socialistic countries.
He is director in Italy of.ACEN (specializing in hostile activities on the
L! ' f
18
PocsCI Scro , !\larch 4, 1967.
' · .
·-: .
~~~~411 ·. :~~-~~:.:.:,~?.1.~.8,~~~:\:~~.9.~{1~i;.~~-; ·~::..._. .·. ;. :::. :.. :..· ~.: .. ,: .· .:'

?' •. .. . ··:. ':. ~--~ ..-_ . '· . .. ; ..•
~
,~ -- -· ~ . .::..:·( < - ~ ·~: . . . --.:·:_-.. · ··:. : ·.;;·:~ · >-~-< . :-. - -~~·J :~- .
-·:: :.
218 THE KENNEDY CosSPIR\n
confrontations of socialist countries), who had an important position in

the field of public" relations for the c:MC, for which he received a SCCCt:l
fee of half a million lire a month." 19
However, no behind-the-scenes figure is more intriguing than Maj.
L. M. Bloomfield, formerly of the America!l OSS, and later suspected by
Jim Garrison of having some affiliation with the CIA.
On July 21, 1961, Giorgio Mantello appeared at the Italian As-
sembly representing all the stockholders of the CMC. These includ::u
himself, his brother Enrico, another Hungarian refugee; Joseph Slifka
and Fellender Erwin, banker Hans Selig:nan, and lawyer Carlo
D'Amelio . . . holder of 500,000 lire worth of shares. And Major
L. M. Bloomfield, Viho held half the shares or 250 million, for party or
parties unknown.2o
Now obviously the activities of these Shaw associates were closely or-
chestrated, considering the financial-politicc:l manipulator Mantello was
permitted to ~epresent. not only himself but the six other stockholders of
the CMC, including Bloomfield, former United States espionage agent .
and now a banker in Montreal, who is reputed to control Le Credit Suisse
of Canada, Heineken's Breweries, Canscot Realty, the Israel Cont.inental
Company, the Grimaldi Siosa Lines, Ltd.;etc.zt
Even Montreal is not without significance, for to quote the Canadian
journal Le Devoir:
~'Buthere is where the affair assumes stranger aud :-tranger character-
. ~ics. It has just been H::arned that the name of Clay Shaw3'<:~ · 12~
; ·--r-_ :;- ·- among that of eleven directors of a comoany which 11!_" nnW 1962,
-had its headquarters in Montreal [italics arl • 1 "' d~ --+p.r:~
Rome, it is known as the Centro Mondi;:~!e. Commer.c.iale... . . ." 22
- Shortly thereafter, while alluding to other directors, Le Devoir reports:
.'.'<-: "Ferenc Nagy, exiled head of the Hungarian Peasants Party .. _
..... -__ ...':---~-
_
maintains close ties with the CIA and which link him with the Miami
. -- ~:. •' --~---. Cuban colony." Also liste~ are th.e previously mentioned Fascist Giu-
··.···o·.': ··.:: ·
seppe Zigiotti, Bloomfield, and an Egyptian, Faruk Churbagi.
~ .... . ·: ::·: ..
_ This particula,r episode is worthy of me.ntion for various reasons, not
the least of which is its exemplifying of some of the tactics which seem as
.. -·
· common to forces behind the CMC and its activities as to those of other ·
forces halfway around the world.
The CMC or the Italo-American Hotel Corporation (into which part
19 /h id.
1fr:: .· ] r1 ~ 111:1 ~I' 20 Ibid.
. fu:{.J :· J!1~~:! 1i t
2lfhid., !\larch 14, 1967 .
i.
~.c·:·J : ~ :.'.~ :d:' 1;: l~
22 Le D<•l•oir, March 16, 1967.
~>/t ~: ;1 f 'l :d it
~L::t ..~ . ~ ? . :; :1 .~ 'll i
~~~:.,·:..,:1 ,·.~ mm~ ~ I

\
i , ~ ;' Ht
j l:i
~tr J1h·~: iir ~
-.~ . ~--~ - ~J ~ l til. r . •
.
·
- ':'-. '" ~/.~~~~~:~
.· .' ~.- ~.?--·--..~~--~·--: .~:-r:;~.•.-:·.~
. -....i..r
.:.'·-~
.· .·.\~~~--~-. :.:.-•..'P:"'_."'~·"":-~·.'""'~:~"<·~
" : ~.·-.--•".',:)?~:-
... - ;:: ·;'.--::.·.'~.~.·.· ~ ·~ ..~'"--: ~.-:-. ;.~:.·:-- --~~~ ,~: :~::7~-;:r~_~:_~
- :.- .-:,!~_~:0
. . -~ :.':7:. -=:-:.:-:.. : '· . -·- ., ' i ; --~
j
.J
NW . l2640 Docid:59166006 Page 126

Clay Shahi, Accused 219
of the former turn~d) arc, relates Paesa Sera, "also linked to other names
which have appeared recently in the yellow press; another sign that,
taking part in the same groups as the CMC and its former members, arc
persons who are quite suspect.
"One of thes,e persons is Faruk Churbagi, the young Lebanese-Egyp-
tian industrialist \vho was killed in Rome under still unexplained circum-
stances. It is said in groups around the fom1er CMC that shortly before
he was killed, the young man had turned over 200 million lire as clues for
participation in the activities of the Centro. . . ."
And then there was the German Christa Wanniger, connected to the
CMC b~ business dealings and "personal friendships," who was stabbed to
death in Via Veneto under [apparently inevit~bly) unexplained circum-
stances." 23 \
However, to ·return to areas of CMC endeavors about which a frag-
ment or two more: is known.
Le Devoir elaborates on Bloomfield, noting that he was active in the
espionage arm of the U.S. government during World War II and "was at
the time the principal shareholder in a society having headquarters in
S\vitzerland and affiliated with the Centro Moncliale Commerciale in
Rome, lno\vn as Pcrmindex. Other shareholders in Pennindex were
banks ofa m01"e or less shadowy character with headquarters in Licch-
tcnstein, plus Miami Astaldo Vaduz, De Famaco Yaduz, .and th.e Credit
·1 .
Bank of Geneva. Among the directors, the name of Max Hagemann was
noted, eli. rector of the Nazional Zeilllng, a newspaper specblizing in anti- .
. Communist diatribes. ·whatever the case may be, the Cc.ntr.a_Co.I!J.::___I
merciale and Permindex got into dift!cultics with the Italian 2nd Swiss
· govern:nents. They refused to testify to the origins of considerable
--amouHts of money, the SQllrces of which arc, to sav th e least, uncertain,
ynd they never secme~l_..!..~i2Re in actuaL commercial tr<\D.Si\Qiops..=--
These companies were cxpelle..<L.fr.Ql.IL.S.~tlf?erlan:,:l <•illL..!.Siy in 1962--
ancl then set 11n h'·ad:;Pir.ters in Jnh>iJl!\G:;burg ." 2-t
Another individual described by Paesa Sera as a "high level financial
backer'' was one Dr. David Biegun, "national secretary of the National
Committee for Labor Israel, Inc., whose off1ces are in New York. Biegun
was the person who actualiy handled the liquidation of the agency
·. · (Cl\;lC), receiving comiclert!bk credit for this, thougtt offici::.d!y 'unknown
"A short tim e [aflc:r its inauguration]," reports Pw::;a Sc:m,

. ···.
ZJ l'ucsu Sa11, March 4,_1967.
21
I.e D<T(Ji r, rvl :\rch 16, 1967.
· ::';, l'o csa Sera . i\-1 ~ rch IS, l_907.
: ·.·· .• ·
··.-: .;. . · ... _.,._ . ---- -~:;- .-
~ -- # ••• • .. : ,.
·.·.,
.. : ..
when the enormous Ce11.tro began to show the true filcc of its organiza~
tion with very precise goals, which were anything but commcrci~, ccr~
tain persons in Parliament became interested. Odo Spadaz.zi presented
the question to the Chamber. But when the news carrie out, Spadavi
. ..
~ quickly withdrew. Shortly thereafter, he became [the newJ president o.f
theCMC. .
While under the presidency of Spadazzi, the Centro W<!S again qucs~
tioned by the Christian Qemacr?t MarioCeravolo, who asked for an
accounting of all of the activities of the Centro. Ceravolo, a member of
t
. :..·. the C.MC's Bmird of Directors . . • had been a member of the board · ·!
·........ . \ ·
since its founding . .§_ince then, he had.J;e"cn monf<y spent left and rishb i
I
and had also seen that no commercial activities were being, concluc!£fj. . I
.: ....... .
J:Ie wanted to know where the money was going and where it Wa§.. - ~
:I
c mi o fro, u - es onse. At this point, ii1
,1962 .. he returned [sic; resigned?] from . the ·board an directly .I
demanded the bankruptcy of the Centro, obtaining a confiscation of
two million lire. 26 .j
'• '
I
The Centro's attorneys immediately assured one and all that "the
.·-:_ .-:·.- .. CMC is straightening itself out" and was "now in the process of complete
recovery." A recovery which never occurred.
It was these curious and_ mostly untraceable manipulations which led
eravolo to make public the following Jetter:
,
-
-
-- ~
.; 1
~· '
~ I refer to the article concerning Clay Shaw wl~ich: appeared in your
- -~ paper [Paesa Sera] of 4 March · 1967. My name was mentioned
.· ~
therein. ·
To avoid misunder"tanrli.ngs and f<>!<J: interpretations, I ask that you
please publish the fnct that.J ]~ft. the w]ministrative baaed of the CMC__
-on 25 July 1962 because it was no longer possible to understand
•• ··-. 7"
the sources oi.gre.at sums of money o~tained zhroi:ld hv Mr. Giovanni - ·
· ..:·: [Giorgio] Mantello: and the real desqnru.inn of this money-:- _- ·
I was the first to call for the banhuptcy of the CMC and of Mr.
Mantello, which paid their representatives, administrators, employ-
ees, etc. according to their own pleasure. The I'RoagiSWJ.te did not wish
. l!Uirant the_ reQuest for bankruQtcy which I, first of aH, pce!i~nte!]
aji!ainst the Ceatra 27 ,
"'-
2~ Ibid., }\larch 11-12, 1967.
~7 /hid.
NW 1264.0 · Docid: 59168006 Page 130

. . . . .
~~~-~=t.~~_t-;!:fi~}:~~,.?..;~~:;i$-·t>':'-:~~':.~~w~ :.;;!:..""!;..;;~-t..~~~~:~;~~..:;_~~~:;}1~~::-::::~:~~:~~~
. , , --
-·~ · -
'I ':f i! J-~

i
Cl<~h:';•:;,~:.:c~;: ,
for what?
"''d so L< tho qno<tion it ro'<s \YJ"'-'"as_givion :,:
tually unhmited swns of monev to th.~ C~ ·1C ;n-l.cLJ.I:hw~os <""ttinc<j:? And
./ · o o
]. ~· '·:~. :.~_-:·,j. 1_:.__:~.-·
I . ,
~
1l ·1,..._ , ..,,_..
:_ .._._ .
l-
i In less th~m five years of activities which seemed to begin nowhere, go
~.
nowhere, an,d accomplish little or nothing, while receiving from unnamed
sources and delivering to anonymous persons and causes vast sums of
money, the CMC found reason to 'change its presidents or directors ten
times, or on an average of every six months, although the men controlling
its destinies-whatever they maybe-are alw.ays the same. ~Among ·its
possible involvements (supporte~ the presence in directive mts of
~nen deeply comrrutted to Europ~an or2.anizatioJ\:> of the c~e.me rir.ht}," ~.?.>
com~ents Paesa Sera, "is that the Cc . ture of the CIA i~(-
. . . set up as a cover for the transfer:_ of CIA . . -::::._~:
illegal political-espionage activities. lt still u~mains to clear t!Q thtlres- . j· · . j,j
-. ence on the administrative board of the CMC of Clay Shaw and ex-Major l!llt !.·,_, ·,,_ ·. ·r2r
Bloomfie " 2 6 ·
"It is a fact," the newspaper subsequently commented, "that the CMC
. . is nevertheless the point of contact for a number of persons who,
in certain respects, have somewhat equivocal ties whose common denom-
inator is an anti-communism so strong that it would swallow up all tho:.e
in the .world who have fought for decent relations between East and West,
· .. .
. ·ncluding Kennedy." 29
A mysterious financial manipulator and a forni.er Hungarian premier
't~.
._.:<:>
who supported the military right-wing OAS, kept close ties with the CIA
and went halfway-around the world to live in Dallas, bot.~ of whom were · . ·.
~!.I~ accused cif ."criminal activities" by the Swiss press. These are two of
·{£ . Shaw's European associates. A former member of Mussolini's cabinet, .. .. .
~~- father-in-law to the daughter of Hitler cabinet minister Hjalrnar Schacht, _ .. · . ·, ·.

and the leader of a national Fascist organization. Two more who sat on
the CMC board with Shaw. A mysterious ex-spy and a man who resigns
from the organization out of conscience. Two more of Shaw's compan-
ions in business in Rome. ·- ... . _
Surely a strange assortment of colleagues for an "old~fashioned liberal

of the Wilson-Roosevelt persuasion." But then, the Centro Mondiale
Commerciale and Permindex are curious operations, as has become evi-
dent. · · -.~_;~_·w:: :
1' ~ ;? :h
;I
.. - "'~--
£L'!:Y-~~~~-~~~: ~~~..ill.?~cl.~ Il th e })._ •Jn1e I l~'.Y;i2.~~-p t>-r:~it~~oi::____:_·--~ :~':::
n
·.~. : r!·
slup_ to the CrviC on~O.'>, i!Lp,, ,.w 1ie ra._llli.t..•...auhat ) ·. j);:· •

!f_l'''1 l._,.
._·.
·· ..
·- ·... .
Fj=_:i tl - ·- .:::
!: ·:1 !f
n Ibid., March ·;, 1967. ·- .· ..
29
Ibid., March J4, 1967.
fr·
~1
1• ·.·.. .-.
T'tr!\'' [l
<J
:_~:: ..
'•· ~ ·..
- ~ -:
. ;_ ~\~
.· .
-·; .·
.·. ~
.· :: .-
·.· . .
. .,.•
-· . : ..· .
- ~·
. .· t : .·.
. . :-
···_', .
~
. ~·· . '.: ·. : ·-
• • . .
.·. ,·. • --.•~ • • . .-: •• • • •·. ! • . . . .. • • •
···. · .:;.~~·~'"j-. . ~;i.;;:-:.~:;;;;::.:;;:;;;L~;./.,,,,<,<.:. .~,-~-:..:_;;~~.:.~,.;,,. ~; ·. :.:.,,,;;,;;L:.;.;. ;;~"'":;;;:~.,.,;i::...,.:;,:.:.:..-;:;:,;.'~~.;~~:: : ;..~~. ~;.;,..i:.~~~
;-- 222
journal itself s'l.id, his "name clid not hr.vc. at the ti.rll.Q.,~
nificance." Later that was to alter, of CD.J.l!S.C.
·:.'
~ave been great repercussions from the revelations of F;acs·!~
Sera," remarked that publication in its March 6, 1967, issue, "con-
cerning the connection between Clay Shaw, the man incriminated by
D.A. Garrison in the Kennedy assassination, and the \Vorld Trade Center
.. (CMC) which was [until] recently working in Rome. 'rhc information
• "· . . I . • :•: :. ~ :·
• ..
we published was amply followed up by all the Italian dailic~. [[

Giomo of Milan, La Gazella del Popolo of Turin, De La Sera in Rome,
even /1 Tempo, which wrote 'the businessman accused by D.A. Garrison
was among the administrators of the CMC. . . .' " 30
·: . .· . the lawyer d'Amelio," continued Paes(J Sera; " . • . confinned
Shaw's presence on the administrative board of the CMC at the time he
[d'Amelio] was its President." Subsequently d'Amelio called Shaw "the
inventor" of this type of com~ organiz::l tion . Unf0rt11narcJy, no o..n.e_ .
.. . ·.· .. \ ._:_
? .~ _,. . seemed to knovv quite what kind ~;anizations t]Jr. CMC cJ1 rLP..er~
• I" : .·:_ , · ·
index were. One of the few things public about them-if on~
_was that G:lay Shaw of New Orleans was a member of both of their
.·.. ·· bQaLQ§. .
"D'Amelio has tried to justify Shaw's presence (in the CMC and on its
.... ,·:
.
.. . : . ·. . . __ ...
Board of Directors)," says the newspaper, "by the fact that Shaw 'had
· . .....
'•
·
··.
organized' in New Orleans a permanent trade exhibit like the one which
we wanted to set up
in Rome; and therefore 'through courtesy, we of-
fered Shaw a position on the administrative board.' · ·
"D'Amelio did not speak of the activities of Ferenc Nagy who, through ·
the CMC's head office, Permindex, had fmanced [Jacques] Soustelle and
the OAS; he did not know that several Swiss newspapers had called the
... -:· :·
.... .._.
activities of Nagy and Mandel [Mantello] 'criminal'; and he did not
:: ...
~ :.
speak of the completion of the CMC (nor could he, since [in terms of its
.. .
publicly announced intentions]) this has turned out to be nothing but a
tremendous failure." 31
On March 14 Paesa Sera observ~d that Clay Shaw had .J.Q.uliu-n.er!
cverythin_g" it had rcoortc:rl regrrcling ltis...Fnwpee>n alli,.,n.-es "Thrlt j.:; t.Q_
EY·" it wro.te,~·clanvl !b;>Lb.c.J)arl h <> en iD-clfuft. Hdmiois:_
~adviser to ~~b.;nv, ho).1!J;.1,!.G.<1~~c..~
_ portancc ofth~ing thtit he hac.Lacccpted t1w position 'in exchang_e for
two New Orle.J)QS-l~mne airline..l.ich·t.s.' "32
C~;,;;rt~ Paesa Sera: "According to America11 sources, Shaw left the
30 1bid., 1\1 arch 6, 196 7.

31 ibid.
3 2 Ibid., March 14, 1967.
~-·~~-;
- ~·:
Rtf 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 132

-~-/~::·.
~f:~£; ·_
::}\0~.
.t;i'~ .-.-~..-... ., . ·ct !ajj"-~.\>~Jd~~~>SI'i~~~~~~~~~~-r~=t::" · ~~~;.-~-=:~ ~7,......:-... ~
'
:,,lj n.r ::1: ~
!' ····~
' -~
L~
: ;-1
'I : ··· ~i
1 j<3
=
=
~4
:.,1
C/((y Shaw, Accwcd 223
U.S. two days after the assassination of Kennedy and came to Europe,
visiting, among other places, Italy." 33
-Further, it reports, "Clay Shaw, by his own admission, came to Rome
during the time preceding the disbanding of the CMC."
iJlfLi
11'1' '4 t"'iel
Two enigmatic organizations, shadowy figures of finance, nco,Nazi,
Fascist individuals manipulating interests in various areas including
. amls and' oil, untold funds from unnamed origins fun!leled to unspecified
ends-the inform'ation piles higher and higher, and one senses that on·e
has barely begun to climb the mountain of mystery atop which these men
sit a net direct their unknown acts to unknown ends. However, to sum up .
very briefly play Shaw's role in this extraordinary drama, a final quote
from Paesa Sera of March 6, 1967.
It is certain that Clay Shaw, who was arrested in New Orleans .: '··
(and, therefore, whether ontrue grounds or not, is a person who

is certainly not limited tci the quiet pursuit of his profession as a direc-
tor of industry, but who must therefore have his finger in the pies of it
. is not cl.car what political activities) had a position on the board of the
CMC in ~orne. .. ·
It is certain that the CMC (taking advantage of the good faith of
d'Amelio and of other Italians who were involved' in that disastrous
(_enterprise) has not fulfilled any of the activities for which it \vas origi-
nally projected .
.It is certain that an important shareholder in the CMC was an ex-
. . .......··. ·
officipl of the American service. .~
.
. Concerning the CMC and the organizations fortned by Mandel, it is .: ... ~
. not clear on whose account many Hungarian refugees who were impli-
.-:- ·
cated in espionage activities were working, nor through what agencies .! "·, -
large financial dealings in European political movements have been

taking place.a-t
It was stat'!d at the beginning of this examination of Clay Sha\v's

European participations and alliances that the entire matter of the CMC,
P::rmindex, and the various presidents, directors, members of the
bo~trcl;;, share1w1clers, theoretical and actual intentions, cxtm- and int<:r-
lr ~~ ·~ ;!,..•• . ~--"..,_
~,: •! 1\I -~~i · ··:>:1{;:~,-i:{' . ·.,

•. • • , •• .•. . _, . . . . . . . . . .: · •.
\llll~.
organizational financial manipulations, far- and military-right sponsor-
'',·'
ings, and so forth, was so complicated as to require a book to cover what
is known about these subjects, and that, even then, the most one could
draw from would be iceberg visibility. However, it was felt that to under-
11!'1
31 I hid.
J .: /hid., 1\larch 6, 19&7.
,·, · .. _ .. _. ·. .: : . . ·. . ·. . . ; : . ·, . ·. . -·· ...... . - ~-~ .
~
. .· .. ..: ·. ·,. •' ·· '. .. . . ·.·:_,··1__

··..••.•...·_._.<: ···:_:
:-. ~' . ~~..:-~~~ -·-~~~-:~~ :. ·.-·.. ;..;;;:_;;:;,,;"
. . . . ·..;,j,"';,.~·::~~
,;;,_.,...;:.::_..,,;;.:;_;;"',;;."·''. .
. :- ..;,; ,_;~~:,.;,~<';,; .. ·, . . ..'.:.~;.:;;-,;~""',;;;.
.· ..:..:.,·:.:..~ ....;:,:.:.';.~ -
,,
.·:.-- ·
!
..
I
22·1 THE KEr-<NEDY Co:--:SI'lRACY
\i
stand anything of this stra ;'l ge man, Clay L. Shaw of New Orleans, and {
who knows where, the simple two-dimensional sket-ch offered to tl_w pub-
. ;
1
( lic should be given the depth a more concrete mass of material would
reveal. I
i
One last point must be noted before we leave this particubr area of !
in·quiry. Seeking more infom1ation regarding the Centro Mondialc Com-
mercialc, the author telephoned the office of the Italian Consul General
in New York. After having received silence in response to requests for
information in three successive steps, the author was turned ovef to an
apparent superior. When the question "What can you tell me about the
CMC in Rome?" was put, for the fourth time, to a man whom the entire
. · ... . series of exchanges indicated to be of considerable authority, he replied:
. :.··
"Why don't you contact the American Embassy?" "The American Em-
bassy?" edwed the author, not a little surprised at the candidness im- .
plied. "The Arneri~an Embassy in Rome," the anonymous informant re-
.....;- peated. "But we are interested in the CMC as seen from tlfe Italian per-
spective," the author explained. "Try the American Embassy, I can't
help you any further." The gentleman was thanked for his assistance and
the conversation concluded.35
In New ·orleans, Clay L. Shaw is a distinguished citizen.
In Rome he was a key member of the boards of two highly recondite,.
·· ~· ·
clandestine organizations, numbering among his colleagues persons ac-
cused of "criminal activities" on an international level, Fascist$, and vic~
tims of European assassinations.
· Are they, in any way, reconcilabl~ images? ... I
!
. .,
· The c;mplexity of Shaw'~ associations does not end with. the Centro \
I'
f
Mondiale Cominerc.iale mid Permindex, but extends deeply into his per- !
sonal relationships in Europe. His private address and telephone book, i
;, for example, carries the name and address of the wife of a well-known. .'
English Fascist, as well as the name, address, and private telephone num-
ber of Principessa Marcelle Borghese (nO\v Duchessa de Bomartao), who
is related to Prince Valerio Borghese, sometimes referroo to as "the
. Black Prince," or ." the New Duce," leader of the Movimento Sociale Ital-
It
!
iano, the anti-British, anti-American nee-Fascist organization. The
prince was a much-decorated midget-submarine commander during the i
lI .
war, following which he was tried and sentenced to twelve y<;ars in prison
for cooperating with the Nazis after the Italian armistice with the Allies j
was signed. However, as he had spent four years in jail awaiting trial, ;
after sentencing, the remaining prison period was suspended.3G i
'
a; Author's pri·;at::: files.

Dennis Eisenberg, Tire Re-e mcr~:ence vf Fascism (London, MacGibbon and
35
Lee, 1967).
q , ... . ... . .,_ .,,, ,., 'I 'l ·II .

.· .. .. .
. ~ ... !~ · .· ---:. - ~~·':'7,~-~:~r~:~. -~~\~~:-:
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~ ·._. . , ._ ._ ,_._ ..._
-= .. \o.~ ...""'--~.~~·.-·
. - -~- :-. · ·,-. :::::: ....._~_._--~_ ,. = .· ·-;'- ·. ·-_ : ·· ~ -: ·· . _. : .. . · . '. - : - - : - . . - - - .. .............,.
... _...
. .,.,..,.
.. · .o-:-.~..........~
_ "":'?''"'' - ~-~~
·.- ~ .. ~ ':.(· ·
.·. ·: .i . ,. , .,
:·.
1M 12640 Docid:59168006· Pa.ge 134

""·· .: -..
· ··.· -·-- :.·' .•. -~- =--;.·. :.. :.:·.• ·· ~ --·-·· .. · . : . ~~. '. .' "'··
~~~~~~!~~j:~b0~~
::,. . ~ :':..:c.--:_ ~ -:~ ::;~'::~' :_:~~:::nfg_ht. By prean-angeraent I . met Tommy Baumler__ there a . little ·: before sir~ : . .., ---~
>···~_ -:>
:::,:;:~::.~ ~-';~.:-~~c~::~.]fe_ was .accompanied by an attractive girl friend, Frences. we chatted in ~ . . " .. !.
:< , -_\.h'~··~';,;:~.~~-:;_;:;;~.:_:·g~~erali tie3 fo_r. an ho~. ·...-h~!l - he .md . she ·.;e:it dir:L'"ler, t~en: Iii; ;,·as ~0-:: to
_:.: ..:::::-:..-~-; ;: ,::::,. ;~; ~- ::;.;.: :-~~-~~-~ Tie fore he _:id=r J~-:~ ~-~side stopped . in~ ·_· :.~-- ~ :·:'':::;::'~~-7'~:=-~~~~J~:-~~-- }::~ ·,::;-:''~-~;;,.~:~::e:~:::
-- :.:::=---~:- ··· , ·. ':;::_· . Last yfi.~; r·had seen .L:ck~ at .Ai-nold Ecklun~~~ s · di~cus~ion gT;:;·, --~~ - -:_.-.-_, ..
~-' : ::: ~he. first half o_f Novenber. : On that. occasion. I
6:z:plainecl to th;o: grou.p ·
. -~--~::...gel!'2ral:~:y and to hio, anong o ~ her-s, se:parate),y, .,~;at our interests are,.
... - ·.'' ·EB.rticula:rly ~ith resnect '· to Thornley~ . I refres!:ted Jack's recollection in
.. . ~-~ ... -~ \ .. . .· Feb~ry· 1-1h.e n he. said he · culq .recallnothing, a.ri·i agai.n_ - Stinda~--±ght,· -;.;hr::-..n·
· , ,..
7
_~:~:::;>=~_~;j~ ·::-r:::;made 8.. b::.~ie:' a-n:Jearance. at A::cnold' s agein.
,:::-: ·· · · · - -~ ·. . . .. ·· ·. ' ..·.
:-:~_':~'~::;z:~~L~~~<;':f:~i:Ii }~I -t~;ed wh~~~ he s~i~d last ~lght/~~- much .6f ~hat ':.£:6·~;'-~~~:'-: i6~ T~rn!ll~.,:
0
.-. .·
-~~--~-~:::·~~;~~:~~'')~~:{~_,·:;_:'r~fiL-rned wh~ile I· was intervie..-ring Jack.In betr;een Jack Working came in . . .
·/':;:::~~ _: :··· :::_; ::.:_~,~~- ::_,~nth a yow1g woman named Workman. -I had spoken to" '-Jack also last year. Before.· •
'.:; ~-·· ~~ ::~: ; ':-_;:· _ ~~could do much we had to awal t .there departure~~: He returned .after he ~k fn I(_
<:: - ~·:.: ::; : .'. '.-::• 'her
to school, but waw, for the mos't· part, then silent. ·. .... .. · < . ,· .:·:s~f<·:.:- _ ..:____'
,. , - .. ·:>-' · :·.::i'-:L?~f:'';- Th~re is· s~ much· ~ha~t~; end ·r~bl.ing,. I~ li .ha;~ to ·li~t~n ·to ·tl:e ' tap~·d : . ·-
_.: ; ··' >~- iaft to adequately report .. That -,;2:11 take a little time~ · I •'i~ elko ask Bar...,_
:;:: ,., ,: : -~ara ~o make a short ~e:no itemizing. the· more :impostant t~ngs. I just got
··. .·
thei:i started and. once .in a while . charlged dire9tions. It was mostly free
· asSDcietions. When Tom::1y wanted to be off thl;'record, he. ei~her signaled me
1.:..: -•· _:· to turn the tape off or asked oe to, on the t'epe .. SoDe of the· times I wasn't
. taping, aias, because I just didn't have enou;h tape. . ..
- ·-------' . .. ·- - ·. He delineated a. self-portrait- of an
imabashed fascist., congenital and
con;scious •. Re i~3 e:r~are of the meaning of his beliefs ani considers T..rhat he
describes as his beliefs- as proper~ ·He is an ex?onent of the rights of power
. -Ii~> says that . whatever: happens, the ·s haw case will end without punishment
·-.. :~-~-~~~-:-:-. :~·:·.~,:~-~::·~:~· .<E.r9.r hll:l because·¥·:re.deral power --wili· See . -to· tha.~. ~his, he ,·~·sayS, _wilL· also.·
· -~ ~~·.· :.:_:...:... • ... -- •. :.~ ·.
be::the
. .
destinies
: . ..
of
.. .
.Andrews,
. .
Thornley, . ifhe
I . .
is convicted, .and·.·.any. others,·
.
. and he is unconcerned abo.u :t. t~im.port, · entirely .w·i thout indignation about
·-· _, ··_ :: ·· · ·~:- filjustice .and the fallure of justice. He~ quite il!.wninating· about Guy ·.
·-:. . .. '·. . Bruuster, said Dion Turner is his clent and is legally insane, met Kerry
-- ~-~~ -,;~:.~: , . . .. TJ:u)rnley, but he ,_~oesn it know where, · disputes Rocco di H~cholas' s story
~·;:::.: ···':'' ·:~~ ·. that he· saw Ommld and;. I think, if the occasion arrose,· ·just might .help
. . ... uS. in some ways. He. is . close· to Courtney anl .. a number of la•,zyers re:present-
• . :: : ,_ , ;:pg_ clients in '1-rhom you have interest. · ·· _ _. _ , " ___ · ,- .. ,: :_ ·
.,;
. . .: .:
..-·";._:....
.: :,__ :..: .. - -~- - ·· -· --· ·-· .... ...
.. ..·- .·
-:- .··· ·:~ ·-· ·:--- :... . .-,.,.,._.·.--:·-. - ·
· ·. ; ~ ·course interne~iijfiA ti. bec~e· clear that B·::>rbara

Fecollection of' seei~g a~ no"€ unn=.~er?1
C. 8 n q ""·" _ i_n ... o . .,...~ .... nis ~s ~n.
~ccor~ ;1:i.th ~-rhat Barber:- ._tol? _::Je a year 2..g. -his tiDe so/~•as able, to pl::.ce
the t~m.e and date by ot.qer tm.~gs of a person?..l nature. -q-e an·i Jacn: each
recel T e-:mdb;. '..rhere the '.· 't{~re sitting (not togethep~ -
---- .
There\ras-, it t ::rns.out, ~till another-discussion group, by a ;;o}J:!2n.

.
-:-· ·--·:~ -.·.:·I · -- .. - . . ~.,... ·· ::: .,.... ¥\':)-a·- .;
..· --. .. . ··•· t .. as ,mo }. .-n as ... ~e ·-1-~t- +-"'r. (~ c--~ 1'"~+- ·
-_ e .. ., • ._e ... ~ --'--- l~ ~n ... .. e 6-u-.::> _
+.
- . ~0- o_ :"ne ~~~~,...... T
--:fu-~ , _ o _
7....
_, ..:: _:-~_: ~<--':_· ~-' ~~ ;:· :which Louis h.ss a · co:py. I :C.acl gotte!lthis fron 3-rabara so:re ti..::e ag~.- .uo'li3
::-~-:;:::_:·:_· ~, ' justh2.:ppened to give i t. to!:'!'? to return-to he::-yesterdayafterriocn.; As ~.:e .·
· . · ··. · ~- ~~ - - _. , ~ see..rch~d if fir~~.o.i9-=-....::... .. ~, v1e fot!.~d he!"' 1s, ·rlhAre· it is spel~ed correctly.
~ · :_;~:. - He l:S.3t na!:le i~ ·sonetci!:ig~ ll~e: Ofla. It L:; on tl:e .t ape a~d ~.rili be in
0
~;"f~::~~i\~~=~~;~~;~£~I:IFK~c~;~~~;uz,~~~~~J~~~¥;~~~~~Jf~B~~-
. .-. ~_::·~·- :.~.. ··:·:--:. ·:-:.--- -- ·.~ ... · ...... ..~ .. ~ ... -..... :·r~ .-\·: ~ · --- ...... ·.· .
. ----=----~ .·. · .•... ·-~: ~ ·:-> . . . : .·.,. ·.--- . ~--; . ·- .. . . . .,.. . : .
._L~~[i~~t;iff:l?~~1.~t;~~;~?;~;~-~~~~-~~?2~:L•· ·:~·-tf}}~~~~;~ -:(, --~~- -- ; .·:·. ~ . :···. - ·-·· -----. ·-1•- _.

""::~~--·-- ·-- -------
....
:.: . -:·> -- . ._,.. , is the t./"2(/:;il lett e:-- fro:1 z.:o sco~/ tdGonnally. T~·e si!n.ila:d ty is·- over:.. ' ·.
·---- ·.. "'!::: ·:.~:: " -:-:.::.· ·. vb.eiming to ;:tn non-e:r.Jert. 'l'his entry is _that ..sisned by the :" outsid.~r" -
;_-:1~i~~)~ii~~:c-~:::~r.ei- 6di;~:·,~r~~f[~~,~~t~'~'s~:~i~hG.-:;·~··· how

,.. , ~ -,.._',.,c.,c-::~_:.,·.~-, -: :> billed as c; ..soe~er., ·no one reca:IIs h1.s ha~g ever saJ.d a.njtliJ.ng.
" .. :::. .._·-:··....
~·.-·.·:-.-.~ .
·.·· ~-·- -· ~- --- . .. - -~
- ... · . :c--.:c· - ~Thereis reference to.Philiu Ge:Eaci and a camp on the other side- -.- :.. . . . ·· .
. ..., ...
·:~~ :.'~::; ·-=--:::·:::-~:-,;{-:'~~:·, ;:~:~· of' the-T~s trangely, as lihilip' s c~. I askeq Tcmm;c which Iilf his clients ,; .· ·
.· ····:~_ ::. :\>· ~ >·: I might ;;ell see •' t and he asked ne if I had suo~en to Le·.mllen. !.t firs) ,· · .· . · ~ - - ._:-~.
· > : when I aske~ him about Dian~~, he explained that she '..ras legally inco::n.pe- .
.. '· ·· · tent ·2!Xl then said, "go · a.'head . and see her", or . i..;ords to that effect .. no-.. it
_ · happens that yrior touack B~nside' s a...-rrival, I •ras going over a record of
- ~_:,:.;:_ .: : ·.· things Dion hnd said, c:1:x:;:::rt:::::"• <3x- in a' conversation 11ith Jack \forking, on
.·. : __ -:- which there will be a separate memo, whethei or not I see Dion, · w:ho was- .
' · ,. -scheduled to return at 3 a.m. or later this ' morning, from a trip to Florida.
~~j~l\~-~~\,4,f-.~. B:~a:w2~t!:/.t~·:~='.o;e
'-J .-r_>--''(
r, I.
aw:: ~-~:e~.v~- · :~~R~-i~b~~-kTo:;yt:r.~l ap_a_;~;n_~-~y··,· .
yr
J'l"
jj. ". ."" _·.
forgot my notebook at Barbara's a.~d - c' -
a nriot recall it . nOii~~· save· · that ·· i t · was- ..
an Irish name, and a juilior .. To!!lillY, ltteraiy, ··rolled off the slightly-ei.evated
d~se on which he had been recli~ng~ rolledrapidly over.to where Bai.-bara
·x·-." ·:eras sitting, took the book from her, uttered a.· slight curse when he saw "'she .
had read accurately, an:d. i!lL1Iediately ~ffered to bu';i) it,. offering a ~h6usand
·. ··.·
· ·: ·. . (
.. dollars. '!his immediately recalled to me what he hlra sal.d about BanJ.ster' s
files · and their value, . about ho ...i they were coded so they'd have no v2.lue
·without the code, and the inference tha.t their value included blacbail of .
.~ - - ·:. .. his clients. ' . _ . . _.., _ ,._ . . • ·' ·. ·
..·- ' .. ·.
··. -. • t•' , • . . • • • • ... . • .. .. - . •·
. .::. . ..· I told Tommy i.t wasn't Barbara's· to seli. : We told him that page was
· · ---, __ __ .,,.:_ · .·.· recopied. Nothing discouraged him, arid he made a number of phone calls
. . . ·. about it, . right then end. there•'.i'he :first didn't go well, ~nd ·he ezi.listed the
· :::' ><<=.-{ \·~ , - ; help of _the op'::?rator• It Has to 944-3517. Ee addressed the person ·who ans'llered ·
., · __:_:> ':::·::. ·_:- ~ -;:_ < asc · "Boo-b"-, and he spoke as he might to a wife. · --. -· 1 .
___ :.::·: .. :.:::i~::;::~_;_ : ·: ie'sp'~~t·s;me· tim·~- d~~c;~bing-t~ ·a~~iViti-~s ~f: . a man to, ·\ ·· .
'he- CIAAend eng·:ged in· what he wen ted me. to understand was a major propaganda .
. ... . . R:ai!lpaign, designed to influence public · opinion here, inclu ·.: ing t2at of jurors_ . .
·· ·. _.. · .· and about _you person:lll!• He des~ri~ed_ him as a "nond,escriyt" ~nCJ.n two.C..,.,;;:c>J
. .: ... .: ,· . > vays on dJ.fferent occasJ.ons, as a o.H rkJ.ng-class man · and as a · "m.J.ddle-class"
::·--.·.,:. :.~·- -· .. ::_ __ .bc.sines~an. Gray hair, skin olive"' to ruddy, l!ledium height and build. Kno·ri-
. ' :__ ~=-=-·. - ~.._._ledge o:f case "tremenduou9" 9 _attitude "'very ante.gonistic:' It- is Tomoy' s thought
--- -- . thet if the CIA could put 500" me_n like him working throughout the country, ·
_it ,would kill. the probe. He is, according to Tomr:iy, 11 fabulous". He has seen
··_him· at Honteleone'·s Roofton Terrace . at ri.ignt and at Pete's Place at about 3 pm.
He once also se.;-; him in uni-versity section, at a reatanra.rlt-bar. One of" these
is on ±z St. Charles. He talked like a local man. .
0
TomBy met ?er:-ie t~-;ic e, once •,.;hen he ·-;as · tal~ing to t-w-6 arr:uy colonels
in a dining roan, -when he gave a"b:-illicnt" 6iscussion on international la·,.;
(end gave Ton:iy his "unlisted" phone mi::n.be:::--) an-i once at the Lake front
.. alrpon,
· ~ ,
~·:nen
.b·~e recog:u:ze~_
. . · 1 m
- .!.02:::y,
'h
·<i.~O .
d J."d no~.
. "'- recognJ.ze
.. ·b_J'.m • ..
·.-·..·
.: --~ ~ ,- _·::'/ Toosy se.is he n2~~r met O~''C!-~d,: -~hat Rocco · pi' l·Iocole.s is '.-rrang ;'an·:! he
-.<... .::c:i.t:•,.; th~·- s ourcewas 'd in • .- .... ~>: .
~..:.: .:: . ~;._c·_: -· , :~_:,/'
····_ · ·: .·
n;> p:::-o ache_d
To~y told B2rbara that
made it clear to ne
for her to be a witnesso
'l. -- - - - --··- -- -
.. -- ~ -- -- -~-- --~--- · . -~ -·-·-·-·--- ·- ·--------· - - · -- - -~ .·-- ·-·--· --· . ·- ·-··---·- -~·-· -.·,--:-·-· -------,- - - -:-·.-:r----:-:-----:·:-:!'""-..~~~-- ...- -7-""d ·.--:----:- -·---:--~-:- ·-:• - .,.- ·-.--- ···· -·:- -'"';- - -: - :·:~":-- - -..__,.- - - -......- -- --
·.• 1-· ·-. :_··:·:·
I':
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- "':---
~ ~ /(t£{tfty -1P~~ilt.~
'1 ~ '~1 0 R A N D U !1
'·1arch 4,1968.
TO: LOUIS IVON, Chief Investigator
Gl\RY SAND'SRS, Investigator
R ]:;'.
'-Jo •·HSS ROSE CAVALI~R 918 Upperlines
899.:..3519
SUBJECT: KERRY THORNLBY
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ' * * * * * * * * *~ * *
-·
· On Friday !1arch 1, 1968 , I contacted >HSS ROSS CAVALISR on
the instructions of Assistant District Attorney Andrew S~iambr~.
!'!iss CAVALIER seemed quite n -2 rvous and r~luctant to talk to me.
' Miss CAVALIER explained that she kne~ that the OSWALDs had lived
around the corner on Nagazine Street and that ~-1RS. 'OS'dALD used
to Halk her baby in the neighborhood. Hiss CAV}\.LI~R 'said that
-
-::-"
-n-fouGt!-T
s-::>metirnes a Man, >)lbQ she eed.t~} l.o'~S :r..-=-r p;'\'0\l-;:;>'{ osr·l?\l D, IJS-"'d . tG
accompany :-1RS. 05~"<?\T.D an har Ha]~~- !1iss C.Z\VALIER said that
s-::>~etimes the couple would return from their walk carrying
what looked like grocery bags ( the most logical route to the
~inn-Dixie Store in the neighborhood is Upperlines st. · )~ Misi
CAVALIER said that

. . . she
•. ~
sa~ MRS. OSWALD about 5 times but she
nev·~r spoke with her.

-·~ ·
...·.
. ·· ..
,.,;
I purposely showed Miss CAVALIER a picture of KERRY THORNLEY
and h~r re a_s;:tion Has " he lP c:: heavier then " I then showed
!-1iss C.t:....V.ll.LISR a oicture· of LEE H.n.RVEY OSWALD and she identified·
him. ·while Mi~ C.I\VZ\I.I&,R Has holding both pictures she never
realized they were of different oeopl~ until I eiplained £hat.
fact
::
to her. At that point Miss CAVALI~R beca~e quite nervoui
~-
and confused and began to ramble about not getting mixed up in

'
other persons busin ess . . I asked Miss CAVALI SR _if i t ~a s oossible
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 138

"t( ·.
\~ '·-.
-::~ b" u :1 PAG2 2
.RE: t1ISS ROS!::: C,; .VALIER
.·.:. ·-
for her to see into the fenced-in . back yard of 4907 Vagazine·
Street. 11.i.ss OW.Z\LIER explained that there v1as a . building block- .
ing the V:!. C IV.
I thanked >1iss C\VAL!ER for her time and excused myself.

.. . ~
. ' ~:
_NOTE:
I do not know why 1/oj

-
ss CAVALIER idPntj fjPd THORNLEY's pi cturg_
~rst pl-3-ce, but from watchinq her I believe that i·1 iss
_CAVALIER may have an eyesight problem although she told m~ that~
she did not wear glasses.

. ..
a
.
,'l?
.
.
r---. . /7
\_ -- / / -
_,...,~-:r?vv /~
f. V/'vfc__/K.-v ~L---.;
.
.
.
~.
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/ Gary,:t
7 Sanders
.,. . . . . .
~c: Andrew Sci-3-mbr~
·,
-·;.. ..,
. ..
. . •. .
··-··.: .. ·. : ..
;'· ·
. -
.· .·
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 139

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,/
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MEMORP.~NDUM
Decembe.r. 12, 1967
TO: J"IM GARRISON, District Attorney
FROM: GARY SANDERS, Investigator
RE : I...EE HARVEY OSWALD
Mr. · EDWARD A. BRAND, 1924 Riverway Lane, Dallas, Texas (a/ci 214,
227-1495) was working for the Tower Insurance Company, 1045. N.
Zangs, Dallas, Texas (a/c 214, WH 8-7596) at the time of tpe
assassination. Mr. BRAND told a confidential source in Dallas
that a man he later said was I...EE HARVEY OSWALD had asked him abou
buying automobile insurance ~a~-;k ;; s.o~f~ the .
assassination of President Kennedy.
This is an interesting piece of information since it would ~e~m

to verify the testimony of ALBERT GUY BOGARD, (l0H352) a salesman
for Downtown Lincoln-Hercury in Dallas, that a man who said he wa
~ ~~~W.~...l~?·d approached him about purchasing an automobil~ on
®.2:e __ er __2,_:j}l63;>
It is also interesting to note that 1045 N. Zangs is on~ a f~w
doors
.....,. •
from
' --··....
1026
..
N. . . Beckley
...
.
-:=-:::~~ · ::- ~:--,:-.·: ~ .,-: ~~- :.:-:;:::·\": -"~;.._
As far as I know, no one from this office has talked to Mr. · BRAND
and he should be contacted for any further information thati he
may have such as a signature of the man he talked to or an order
form which might have been filled out in anticipation of the
insurance sale.
GARY SANDERS
cc: Bill Boxley
·I
;.,·
· NW 12640 Doc~d:59168006 Page 140

Decembe r 4, 1967
TO: JIM GARRI~ON, District Attorney
FROM: TOM BETHELL
AL CLARK
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
on Sunday, December 3, 1967, I spoke to
AL CLAR...f.\ at Dixieland Hall, and asked him about his state-
ment to HAROLD WEISBERG that he . had seen DEAN ANDREWS
talking ·to LEE .HARVEY OSWALD.
CLARK stated that when he saw OSWALD on

television after the assassination his immediate reaction
was that he had seen him before. After thinking about it
he came to the conclusion that he had seen OSWALD with
ANDREWS. ·ANDREWS, CLARK recollects, was in the habit of
bringing his friends into the back door of Dixieland Hall,
and he believes he saw ANDREWS and OSWALD sitting together
in the patio right behind Dixieland Hall.
CLARK said be did not mention this before

it
becaiJ..s.e..-he.-tboJlgh.t. __s__
was 'common knowledge . that AND.RE.w
.,.knew OS.WA.LD, anQ. he didn't thiok i t was import_g,nt. ANDREWS
had alwa_y_s told him that he knew OSWALD. and there.k,ore he
------------·
attached- ,no significance to ..i!;..:
CLARK did not see OSWALD on . television in

New Orleans when he passed out leaflets in £rant of the
..'
· Trade Mart.
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 141

- • ........ ------ -- -- - -·. - - -"·-·-- ---- --- - ··-- -·- ·------ --- ---·--·-.C... - - --- - - - --- - -- --··-- - ---- · ---- ·- •---- -- - - ·---
"
r---~
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• •· .
~- '~.
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M E M 0 R [l N D U M
. i..fltJ!_JitEY . ..-!hAl A Cl
A-L1J I •C.
~~'1f~ "'<:;,
~- A~
.-
i
Decembe.r 4 , 1967
FRQM: TOM BETHELL
RE:, AL CLARK
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
On Sunday, December 3, 1967, I spoke to

AL CLARK at Dixieland Hall, and asked him about his state- .
ment to H.AROLD WEISBERG that he had seen DEAN ANDREWS .
talking to LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
CLARK stated that when he saw OSWALD on

television after the assassination his immediate reaction -
was that he had seen him before. After thinking about it
he came to the conclusion that he had seen OSWALD with
ANDREWS. ANDREWS, CLARK recollects,was in the habit of
bringing his friends into the back door, of Dixieland Hall, ·
and he believes he saw ANDREWS and OSWALD sitting together -
in the patio right behind Dixieland Hall.
SLARK said he . did not mention this before

because he-..thong.W: it was common know] e.dge. that ANDREWS
;knew QSWAI,D~_2fig he didn't think j t was importsnt. ANDREws :
-----
had alw~c:; told him that he knew OSWALD, and there.fore he
---.._,_
attached no si~nificance to it.
CLARK did not see OSWALD on television

New Orleans when he passed out leaflets in front of the
Trade Mart.
'' .
mt 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 142

-- . ---- -- -· ' -·· ..: -- --·· · -·-· -- -----------'--- ~ -- - --- -
e .·(Y
,._ ,
•:'} . .
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,(
MEMORANDUM
I
----------
~ July 7 , 196 7
TO: ~fiM GARRISON, District \ Attorney
FROM: ,JIH ALCOCK, Executive Assistant District Attorney
RE: Clifford Joseph Wormser, Rt~ 6, Box 584, Old Gentilly Hwy.
242-4418 (B~siness & Residence}
Owner of Cliff's Junkyard
On July 7, 1967, at approximately 3:00 P.M. I interviewe~

Mr. CLH,FORD JOSEPH WORMSER in the office of Louis Ivan. During I.
0
our interview MR. 'WORMSER S attorney, SALVATORE PANZECA, was
present. MR. WORMSER is the owner of Cliff's Junkyard located at
Rt. 6, Box 584,' Old Gentilly Highway.
·. . ?
' · • "'itt_"
m... ~ ...JJ.__.,,...,-.~--·-·,.~
the rummer of 196"r MR. WORMSER owned a J'unkyard
.. · n
\.,.u.;_ ~
Y
I ..-:..---
~· bearing the same name at 3800 s L Fe.rdiuand ~e t in the Ci of tx
~t>11i'~ New orl_ea1:1s~ t\.s remembered by MR. WORMSER, ~t}"ffi.e ·rD::~'El:)
!"\~'+'{ j'j(i 1.)~ ,o he;P~::et!;JPf~E:k~;~~Y~-~=~d~ -~~~ Zo!!~= ~..·.

\.J\ J.(~
" .. ~~~
r ~ntJa£]~QtiQn~~gon~£o_; j';!n~. MR. WORMSER cannot recall the
specific date this . transaction took place.
·~,;:r~~
.,.......~-.. I?~ ~w~,
his two compan~o~s and hi~ w;j.fe,. cwd, ~~.-~y cc:rr~J
~ ~~- the junkyard}.iW:lii ..P:J:>Sl mQda!:-G:ar a(:absnlt k.QQ P.M. Upon arrival,
One Of 'oswald IS COmpaniOnS 1 a,, dark COmpleA_iOn~d male 1 (probably Of
~ · a;Jo
Latin extraction), addressed MR. WORMSER by the name of "CLIFF"
&,.~~ . 1 and said that they had an automobile that they wanted to sell for
~ ~, · . ~~_d junko The stationwa?or:. to be sold was pushed to the junkyard by
. ~~ ~~~Wthe car OSWALD was r1d1ng in. OSWALD was not the driver of the
car. ~--±:!atin indicated t,h~.. car to be sold belonged to _osw~
OSWALD and his other male companion did very little or no talking
at all.
At one point MRSo WOfu~SER started for the car in which

MRS. OSWALD and the baby were seated in an apparent attempt to
strike up a conversation with MRS. OSWALDo h_t this t;tme,t:he _f.a..t-!3-
told her than the woman v76uld :: not :,tinderstand her because she was
~and did _not ~ - 'it~Y· Engli~h=:-- ' - - ·.., ' * "-
... •L · iilf e;cl · , ·•
. The car was sold for $15.00 after OSWALD and the Latin
took two tires from it. All told, OSWALD and his companions and
wife and baby were in MRo WORMSER'S presence for about a half hour
MRo WORMSER has never conveyed this information to any

Federal Agency.
MALE #1 DESCRIPTION
About 5 ' 6 " ta 11

~ compi~~~~-0n
Black curly hair
tYEP
.I Ap roximately 165 lbs.
tocky---n'am
e y 23 to 25 years of age
II .
Doc~~:59168006 Page 143
- r ')
\ I'
:.--·-· r,.·
'-~ . .·)
lvearing dirty clothes, somewhat similar in

appearance to a mechanic who had been working
on automobiles.
'I'his man spoke English without an accent.
No noticeable scars.
MALE #2 J1f!SCRIPTION
Long Blond hair and long sideburns

About 5'10" tall
Very slender Build
1\.pproximately 22 to 24 years of age
No noticeable scars
OSWALD Is Dl~SCRIPTION
Slender
Blondish, Sandy hair
@""£he~~=:o~ ~
Wearing khaki pants and a sport shirt of unknown color
Appeared to be approximately 27 or 28 years of age
No noticeable scars
Neat appearing and no'growth of beard
MR. WORMSER stated that the woman in the car with the baby
appeared to have black hair but could not furnish any further
description. !.!;_~ baby appeared_ to be a very tende;c ag~
!-1R. PANZECA at the outset of the interview informed me

that MR. WORMSER would probably be used as a defense witness in
the SHAW trial. The obvious strategy here being that if the man
identified as OSWALD by MR. WORMSER was, in fact, LEE HARVEY
OSWALD, and he did not have a beard at this time, it could be
used to impeach the testimony of RUSSO who described OSWALD as
having a slight whisker growth at the meeting in DAVID FERRIE'S
apartmento
MR. WORMSER does not believe that he could identify

either t:he Latin on the other male with the long blond hair if he
saw them again today.
NW 12640 Doc! I: 59168006 Page 144

,.;. . -- __ _.1
•
r
" I.•
-~ ~ D lJ
~ ~ ~ ~
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() 1\
----------
July 7, 1967
TO: JI~ Gl\~ISO~, DistrictAl\ttorney
F~O~: J~ 1\LCOCK, ~xecutive 1\ssistant District 1\ttorney
~~: Clifford Joseph Wormser, ~t. 6, Box 584., old Gentilly Hwy.
242-4418 (Business & ~esidence~i
Owner of Cliff•s Junkyard
On July 7, 1967, at approximately 3:00 P.M. I interviewe

Mr. CLIFFO~ JOS~PH WO~S~~ in the office of Louis Ivon. During
our interview~~. wo~s~~·s attorney, Sl\LVl\TO~ P~Z~Cl\, was
present. ~~. wo~S~~ is the owner of Cliff•s Junkyard located at
~t. 6, Box 584, Old Gentilly Highway.
date this transaction took place.
SWl\LD, his two companions and his w· e and bab carne to

the junkyard in a o t abo P.~. lJpon arrival,
one of oswald s companions, a dark complexioned male, (probably of
1
Latin extraction), addressed M~. WO~S~~ by the name of "CLIFF"

and said that they had an automobile that they wanted to sell for
junk. The stationwagon to be sold was pushed to the junkyard by
~~~the car OSWl\LD was riding in. OSWl\LD was not the driver of the
car. !he Latin indicated the car to be sold belonged to OSWALDL
OSWl\LD and his other male companion did very little.or no talking
at all.
1\t one point ~~. wo~~~ started for the car in which
~~s. OSWl\LD and the baby were seated in an apparent attempt to
strike up a conversation with ~s. OSWl\LD. ,a!: this_ time the Lati~
told her than the woman w0uldonot.nlln&erstand her because she was
, _!u~~n and did ;no~ak.=a·;=y_~nglish. ·
The car was sold for $15.00 after OSWALD and the Latin
took two tires from it • . 1\11 told, OSWl\LD and his companions and
wife and baby were in~~- wo~s~~·s presence for about a half hour
M~. W®RMS~~ has never conveyed this information to any

Federal 1\gency.
Ml\L~ #1 D~SC~IPTIO~
1\bout 5 1 6" tall _ _ _ __

@?k Compi~xionJLatiri t~
Black curly hair
1\p roxirnately 165 lbs.
tocky~m
l\pprox1rna e y 23 to 25 years of age
~ NW 12640 Doc! : 59168006 Page 145

' 1
Wearing dirty clothes, somewhat similar in

appearance to a mechanic who had been working
on automobiles. ·
This man spoke English without an accent.
No noticeable scars.
MALE #2 DESCRIPTION
Long Blond hair and long sideburns

About 5'10" tall
Very slender Build
Approximately 22 to 24 years of age
No noticeable scars
OSWALD'S DESCRIPTION
Slender
Blondish, Sandy ha±r
@: ffe a2! of RCfrr:::>
Wearing khaki pants and a sport shirt of unknown color
Appeared to be approximately 27 or 28 years of age
No noticeable scars
Neat appearing and no growth of beard
MR. WORMSER stated that the woman in the car with the baby
appeared to have black hair but could not furnish any further
description. The baby ~peared to be a very tender age.
'
MR. PANZECA at the outset of the interview informed me
that MR. WORMSER would probably be used as a defense witness in
the SHAW trial. The obvious strategy here being that if the man
identified as OSWALD by MR. WORMSER was, in fact, LEE HARVEY
OSWALD, and he did not have a beard at this time, it could be
used to impeach the testimony of RUSSO who described OSWALD as
having a slight whisker growth at the meeting in DAVID FERRIE'S
apartment.
MR. WORMSER does not believe that he could identify

either the Latin on the other male with the long blond hair if he
saw them again today.
NW 12640 Doc! :59168006 Page 146

. ,_:r_~::,,,~,~~'!~~""'"'~~"?'~1/S~!~'f·,r:''!i~5~~~"t~/2'*""'~'''r<i:l
l
11
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I
~~ H E l·! 0 R -~ N D UN ' .. !
.
-·· . ..
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·- ~ .·.. --: .:: .. ·· . · ..: ··· :=·: . < ·"''·, ." •.· . .
..-: .
June- 30, 1967 ... ' •. • :~
. : :. . ·- .-::' .· . . -:-: . > ·~ ·- . :·;·.~ .. ·-· .. .--: . .. . .. . - . ·...:'::- . -..

..
. TO: JI.H GAR..T{ISON, District Attorney

·.. - .
. ·.. .·
::._ : . :·- ·· .·.·· ...... ····
FROM: . . .'l'OH BETHELL .. . ·.:
. . . . . . . . . .
------ -- --------------------------------------------~------------
.<.·----
. ._~Jb_~EY, .l.329. St. ·Andrew Street, called . aL
1:30 P. N. and adv1se hat__he h;:,d kno;,'] gdgo t"' th? effect that
GENE D.AI!..i.S.-.Xli:JS lying when he said he di c1 not knmv LEE HZ~RVEY _"'-·
~--· His reason for saying this Has that · a friend ~
whose n_Q~'1_e he would . not disclose ("X") used dri.nk.irlg·
. ...--·--
-wi tb DZ'UIS. and i
·-::-~
__ h~ . Of) 'ff;"~':J DAVIS wi ·th_ Q_;->~'7}\LI:J :_-.in
.c h · S
:. ti 11
in Russia_L.
· B~DLE"'£ sa~d t 1hat "X" had a· grudge against DAVIS and_\\

for this .reason "X'' ·wants to see DAVIS get what's coming to him.
_For this reason) and beaiing in mind that the caller

\vas obviously unaware that OS~iTALD was in Russia at this · time,
(he stressed he was positive it Has early 1~62) I do not imagi~e
that there is anything more than a personal vendetta to this
story.
.. -.-··.
11
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NW 12640 Docld ::59168006 Page 147; • ~ ! • ; .. ;"•
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· · · · -!;-~::)'JJC~~~~~~~~~~3f>,,0,%;3~~~!"7~~1'L"r
I' '
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A"nJ..n i'lL~Y
f ('{Vi "
i
I
--~MEMORANDUM I
~ -.- . :
__ _ _. ·
-~
·. ·· ' . ;·.
:,.
. - __ ., .• .. :.- ...
.
June- 30, 1967' .. .. .- ..- -- · -. :·.:·~ - -·
-:.·.· ..
-. -_
'·
··.····
. . ... ..
.-. -· . _.
....·..· ~ -
· -.·: : __
: .. ·.
TO: JIN GARRISON, Di-strict _ Attorn~y

. -·· ·.
-· . ·:- ··
_:· .. ....
· _
. ; ..: -__ .·-.::·.: ._:· .
FRON: . '£0!1 BETHELL ...

·.· - . . ·.. , _
.·.
----------------------~-----------------------------~------------
i~!1L._~EY, ~9 St~ called ~L Andrew Street~

1: 30 P. i>L and adv1s ea hat_b.e h "'a kno;.:J @GgG to tbe ef.fes;;t that
GEt.'E Dl\~.fSS·zas lying \vhen he said he did not know I.EF._ H..;;RVEY _---..
~ His . reason for . saying this \-las that · a fr i and nfbi?~
whose n 2r:t_e . he would not disclose ("X II) used to go Cm t-
~itb D~~n-~~~~~-4~~~-LU-~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
, ... - ----- ___ _h~ _.. (1n
~,~~':1 DAVIS
1n Eussia_L.
· ffllDL.!:..x said that "X" had a grudge against DAVIS and .._
·"/
· .,,
for this reason "X" ··wants to see DAVIS get 'l.vha·t' s coming to him. ·
For this reason) and bearing in mind that ~he c~iler -

\vas obviously unaware that OSWALD \•las in Russia at this time,
(he stressed he was positive it was early 1962) I do not ~magine
that there is anything more than a personal vendetta to this ·
story.
MR. I-Il\DLEY called a~rain at 2:00 P. H. and . said --t hat ·

11
X" does not want ~.::o discuss this ma ·tter any further at: present, I
. and as he, HADLEY, had no fur-ther information, he does · not . wailt
us to approach him further on it unless . he calls · again • ... .
. _.-·. · ·.-_ _ . fL~- ':~ . f:i~C't(}l.f)f?
. . ·. . v-#l~~ ;,;.;) . . '.
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+-~:- ' . - /.
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:nw 12640 Docld; :59168006 Page 148 -
( ' ('
. ~
· ~ ~ KtEA.ty · r~~ilt!I'f
. '1 ::. ;--r 0 H. A N D U I 1
r.1arch 4, 1968
TO: LOUIS IVON, Chief Investigator
FR0!·1: GARY SANDERS, Investigator
R]:'.
'-J. ;·HSS ROSE CAVALIER 918 Upperlines
899-3519
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *~ * *
. '.
-·
On Friday r1arch 1, 1968 , I contacted ~1ISS ROSS CAVALI:SR on
the instructions of Assistant District Attorney Andrew Sciambr~.
!'!iss Cl\VALIER seemed quite n:?rvous and r~luctant to talk to me.
Miss CAVALIER explained that she kne~ that the OSWALDs had lived
around the corner on J.1agazine Street and that r-1RS. 'OS'dALD used
to Halk her baby in the neighborhood. !:Jiss CAV_l\LI:::R \?aid tbat
--- ntouGHI
s·~metirr.es a r:~an, Fho £>he eai& PSI.• I::'F H7>. 0 VT:"Y OSI· 1DID, llSPd t.o
accompany MRS. os;·vi\J.D on har uzaJ::>~. !1iss CAVALIER said that

-
so~etimes the couple would return from their walk carrying ~
what looked like grocery bags ( the most logical route to the
Winn-Dixie Store in the neighborhood is Upperlines St.). Mis~
C2\V.n.T:!ER said,__}::.l!.at she sa-.;v-. i~RS. OS\'71\LD about 5 times but she
never spoke with' her.

. -. -
I purposely showed Miss CAVALIER a picture of KERRY THORNLEY
and h~r . lction was " bo

re.'__#___ •.,pc: h<=>avier
. the.n " I then showed
!~iss CAVALIER a picture of LEE H.I\RVEY OSWALD and she identified·
him. 'dhile i"iiss CAVi\I.IER was holqing both picturPs she never
realized they were of differ2nt ceopi~ until I e~plained that

--
fact to her. At that point Miss CAVAL~3R became quite nervous
and confused and began to ramble about not getting mixed up in
other persons busines~. I asked Miss CAVALISR if it was possible-
NW 1264Q Docld:59168006 Page 149

~ S M ,0
c
( __
R A N D U M PAG:: 2
-
RE: MISS ROSE CAVALIER
for her to see into the fenced-:-in back yard of 4907 >':agazine ·
Street. !1iss Ct\V_l\LI"2:R explained that there '~las a . building block-
ing th e view.
I thanked 11iss ClWALIER for her time and. excused myse~f.
NOTE:
. . .\ .
~
· I do not knmv why Mj RS CAVALIER id~ntj fied THORNLEY's pi ctllz:g_
in the first place, but from watchinq her I beiieve . that ~iss
~-------------
CAVALIER m~y have an eyesight problem although she told me that,
she did not we ar glasses.
cc: ' Andrew Sciambra
- ·:-
.. '
,-.
...
. ;·
-'
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 150

Re~ort is that combirie
purchased plant for $1
ore thru Can~dian Corp
'l . :... :--_: ~ ~.- .. . .

- · · _::·. I'I.Check ..P.Jlt Kjck~go~, Forth Harth: Reputed vice-lord
... .: -
_. ,· of Fo r t Ho r t h a n d c 1 o s e f r i e n d o f J a c k Ru by • . . : ---. .. ..
• ·:·;:_=
··.-· - ·'
· ~--::~ . · :-:_· ~ -:o . III. Check ~!\X ., Daily Star - Hammond., La. supposedly
: " -· · a Graduate student, (presume Southeastern) says Ferrie
·.
. ~-' > ·:_>) ·· . Hid out the night of the assassination in a dorm in ·-
.· ;, · · ·-' >·-::< ~-~_- - Ham mo n d . Th e r e i s a n a <D r po r t · i n Hammo n d ( a 1 s o hom e o f · . . . i,
. :-. - .·..: :.· . . .· Shaw•s mother) -. Athletic Dir. Grady Martin might have· some · .~- '
.· : · info. .' - · 1 . ·• ~ t
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D:~PtEJiii 1S Flother ca.mo to the c.oox- ·c.ncl ·
Sl1e alEO sc. .icl

I .
she (E 8S ~ STAPI,T;;TOH) HO'lt.lcl Eot let hEn·. (:OAPillTB) talke to U~~.
·.
ot :>:):;; ': of' D.s.IJlr:te 1 8 fo:::·i-:.:er friends that Hrs .. Stapleton· agreed
to J.e~~ _ nH;:\;Olil ~ iil ·:_ to -tftll: 't·ri~f!. ner da.t~.g1:;:ter, thin 1::as· also
on.1y 2.i':t0r I had given he::.' the imp:;:,'ession tha·t I Has a former
friend· of hei' clc-• .ughters. As '5. t Has 1 :·rh~n Scia,:ubra. and I
.
minuter; ( t·) g1··ve Dap h..rH~ ·t:;:,we
'. t o me>.1se .her::J8lf :presentabl,;)
..
SClJ..Q
Not surprising becausa
obviou.sly p:re:perocl to be cooue:.·ative.

" ... .
'I·he only problen Has
the mothe:r, \-.:ho ~.:::o pt inte:ru.p-ting a..l'ld telling Daphne · it Har-m' t.
sr:wr-'~ to get invoJ. ved.o
the hopes tha.t Ila!Jb..-'18 \·: ou..l.d spo-t some fa..-:riJ.i~r faces a.nd that
it migltt tri g:ser associations, boc2.llse she: did Scy a~ t11~
. . , '•
b eg:1.n;1111g s.n.o t.ras
been to tho oculist the c12~r b~for·e a.ncl bec<".use of tl:!.e d:rops
~ ··r··.:.
used rras unable to focus either.i'see the pictlli'~s or to reacl

I
,;.!
nw 12640 Docld:,59168006 Page 152

p2.ge . 2
. . .
~\;:;C;in.c:; 1_;j_-t;~:
~-::-:,~~~:-;~ i:··::.P~)l~::.~--.,2~:.·C t:hi~:1::; ·~:o l!.;"j
. .
irt z~~:J.:t ~12.y possi bleo this
.. _.. ..
L10_t,her:. :--:: r.u::li ble o bj0ctions
-·~
·. "Ahi·::l:I' Of Th~ Dec:,d 11 Hhen
l1a:ph:.'le Has V8X'Y co:::c:Lous of

the time beca.use she uas 'l'icdting for the ma.i·l delivery and a
check f~om her mothero Sh "'"' se>.J.. d "Cite
_ e ~:r1m.r~ ,_, reason .f or p·a·c. .1.vy
:r.·em?.inj_ne there: He.s a.l so the nail cleliv0ry c>..:nd thoug!! it H2.sn' t .
specifically mentioned :Da~.)hne Hqs "sure she uas Hai ting for a
• .,1,.• .
He O.::d:h u ::.mally -::e:ee in the S2l:lEl pos:t v~On~ OUl.'
husbands HerEJ alike. 11
A :reel ~por·t~~ e2.r :pulled to stop anc. a young man goi out~ Daphne
·I like liGso" I asked. hex-. :i.f she liked the looks of' thj.s car cmd
sT.1e SC.!.:icl yes. I asked her · if the top uas d.oim and she said 1 "If
it Has it r:n!st ha·ve been de.:r}:::v (mec>.ning the top)n Olwious1y ·the
top rla.S do~:Jn b;::cause Da:ph1!0 l/2.8 sitting up on . the stops ancl
Her fil's-~ thought 'oTas 11h~r 1i0171d a mothe::e be 1rring:i.ng her son .to
this placey bocause there 1-re..s no hesi t2:tion their parts,. She
ancl hc:r: overe.ll inprossicn Hc>.s clizse..p})T.'OVal a·t the Homan's

c:~ppeil:r <~:rlcB, l-Oth in chess fmd in ~che Hay she Horo her hah'~
11
De>.p}mc said she. im.rnecli.::·;t.eJ.y thought, Hother '·rould. CB.ll her
vr.td_ E=he se.id,. 1 ~It 112.s l1er ·h.:.:..i:e.eoi_t ~??~E~ g:c2;;r •• ~sil\.r3r·~ •• ~rnd iJc
•
• . . :,. ' - ..
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. '
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Docld:59168006 Page 153

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-- -'.. ··-·_.·--··· ... - ··-·-·- -·-- · - -- ----
' .
!12.).. 2': t-rhich
~ .L
He see:neu. vo
~laB co:J.c5.ou.s of -th:i,rL1.-~in£o; he ce···tainl 'r dicn' t belon.r- j n 2. CC£_like

that boc<::.use ·ch.e cJ.o-1:-hea he Has uea..ring >-;ere so old and Horn (Short
sleaved pattcrnl3d spo:d shirt ::md black slacks) but she enuhqs:i z.ed.._
"Such 9JA clothes to be
a. :pe :r·son 1 i1:e th~ t in proud.• 11 This :C di cln' t get to
h~:. kit te:-.1s got loose of the n2.,~~w
.· apa.rtment., Ee n .: tu.rned in a feH r::oi:lents, took the kitten from her

and sat beside her on the •steps stroking it.
Os;·: ald crac11ed the cat seyine, "I lilce :petso ... I p1·efer dogs ..... but
I sure like cats too." I asked her if she h?d noticed his hair -
a·;;nile, unfortil112.tely the 1-Io-t.hel~ intersp~:rseo. Hi t:C "If you kno'.·I
'
so cold~" he thoagh·~ he must be sic!~
o:r· SOf:iEd;hing b e cause i ·t Hc:.s s-uch n rrarm clay o. cmd he looked so sa.d D
and. lonely 2.nd unhappy th.::>.t · I felt so sorry for him, he 'fi2.s.such
t0 ir~ k him -;,-;l:w.t I coulcl do to help h:i.m" u
... . .,.. _.
NW 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 154

.... - .... - -- - .. -r~- -· -, .-.-----· ·,. - -- -
-~ ..
.. : -:·- '
tm"'~il after E:ve:r:rc!:l:i..ng h~:?P ·-~1.1ed · thcd; I saH the payer again that. I
even :c<::nre:!1b:::l' er1 :i.t ?.1 1 becsus~ I 1 d b •2 en sick~ .... 11 Here things
Daphne out by telling me the details of all Daphne's misc2.r:riages~ ·

Th.t·t t b.:t:ough i ·t all D2..:phna 1·ras se>.ying Hi th determimd;ion, "Mother
I'm t:ey:ln:; to a:.i}c~"i:ar her ques tioi':t::Joo .. They aren't interes·~eU .in that 1
they k.no~·.' Hh2.t they m:m t and. if I C.?.:'1 help I' r.:1 going too .... u" This
/\\\:.j~·...
is Hh;:)ra _NLL St)T.Z:SR e;1tex-ec into ' discour::e.,
;'\
She said she dich1 r t se·::: t!1e pa:pe:c ·nga.in · untilJ. · she reonenc:cl th~k
~ te]_l t!!em (_?) I kni:!">-T O::_;Halcl." Da.:phne then said, "I kno"J he-
saH hiL1 severa.1 timcso .. n Interupticm .... "Alright!
.
positive he S2.~-J him at least once .. oHe (Bill Snl~~er) S?,icl he had _:.
.
I'd S>-lea."';".o•I'm
. .
been H_i.th hii)! several times a.n<l ·i;hat he h?.d intr·ocluced him (Om·Iald)
to J'aek a."lcl '\·Thatevor I dicl not to nrmtion it to p,nvonQ .. .,., a.n cl thats
'\·rby I thought i i; u2.s so strange l·rhen Dave Snyder and that · other
nan c2.1r,e to s8e me bsc2.uso I l:net-i the . only 11 2-y they could h2.ve
kno-..m \;he:re I lived ~·ras if Bill gave then ITJ address ancl I didn't
kno'<r 1-rh~/ he nml<l do. th2.t >-rhe~l he h2-.cl beeu s.::> £:cm~E:d. e>.nd. I thought
they Ht!l'C from the DA t s a.nrl they· ~·rere so a:'ifu.l to ne ... 0 tt
At thi.s poin·c Scianbra knod:::cd on the doo:t• 2.nd as the motb.er left
-~he room I gave :baphl1e a c2rd >·ri th my nu.rnber .on it · a."1d s::!.id "Call
.d .
NW 12640 Docid: 5916~_()06 ' . ·. . .'·.·. · ..

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,
. ~ _; . - ~-. . .... .- -..- ' -·. . .. ' : --::-. . ,. :
o.::.
door, continued talking about Bill

8<',Yir:.g -th::;:l;
. :Dill 1E:'l gone to J;;~clc 2.nd. told h:i.m not to talk about
.
.
.
rne C.~~ i Y.\ r; t !.?.~~~:..2u'K:~21I~:~-.:l_£::~}S.~-~~ll~~~_:I.~·.£]:~-.J~~:i~-;2---~ P~-~f.2.~~~~-9.~'@-_9:.~:~~Jii~~-j:o 1:.-ill~ ( Bi 1 1 )
..
·
gon.e to 1he PBI to -tell them he had ne-·.rel· met OsHalcl. but that
it see m~d the nan •·:ho se ·-o:r<!Dcl to knm,; about Os~:~~lcl >;ould be Sulzer.
orrr re·tul'7l to H0iT Orleans I ta.lked. to Jack P:r.azier that

ev<~ning. I asked him if he he,d e.pproached. the PBI and he
C',
+vl.'lp
. . .vO
. thc.t h.e hc.d mescle ·rri t!1 1-Io;-rai:'cl Col1cn in Ja!ltlax-y
of 1963. 1[,;:, insists
0 sH a1d~ 1::ut does no·~ x·u~c out possibilit;y. He seemed to feel
i~:G:::'.z that Dap!>..ne Has completely credi blc and I dicln' t detail
anything to him. He feels 'a sense of. protectiveness for Sulze:c-
or at least appears to.
It seems ])ap1mc Hould be Horth talking to some more Lf only

to find ou~.;; r:1o":e c.bout the note e>..'1cl Hether she still h2.s i-to
Even though Daplme H2.s in a vel'Y nervous state to the extent
of continucd.ly shald.ng hc..ncls; it night 'te attributable to her
mothe:r.·' s pre:sr.mce c<..nCl. it s-eems she might be differmH in other
surrou.nd.inzs.
. -. ·.. ....
. ------ ··· ·-------- -·· - - -- - ------- -- ~---

~- -- _:._ ___ __ -- ---·-· --- -- ~- - -----_:._ ___ ------~-·-·- --._._.. -_-.---
/
·---- ~---
October~), 19()) .
FIWN: '1'01'-1 BE'-l'HELL

.-·
HE: :rNFOR~lA'fiON FROJVI HARTIN \'lALDRON, NEW YORK TIJ!-IES
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
. . ' .._-
·
. '
. ' •.·
According to these memos, · R.Z\Y SADLER, a Univ~rsi ~ty
of south Carolin a professor did a doctoral thesis on an abortive
invastion of Cuba from Ne\v . Orleans in February 194 7. The purpose
of this invasion vJas to fly bombing missions over Cuba to get riel
of Batista. An airport was leased near Venice; Florida. and the
- - msl_:o__~illo__Le;::s~e.L1:=t1~e:_~~a_s narq.e0SKZ\W _ The man providing this
info:rrnation, \vhen px:essed for the firs ·t name of SHMv, became .
.
. · . I/" . .
-
TI x:ervo~s an~ reru:c, e~ ·to giv~ it ~ecause he \'Jas i~volved in.____tha...... · . t_ .j
,
1
· ~ ,!-v2_(lnvas:Lol1.l?lan. _:f.'hls man l1ves 1n HQnroe. _'l'l.vo o ·thers, ~'!:T \·~~!'~ ··.
1'J/' · and a Lat1n named RALPH J. T)RRU~LA, bo·th connected \vith __ the Trade ;,.//--
.;? J1art \·Jere . in on the f>l.~~t _ (.7l~T!~: 0·-4'lA>-'1 -f~ Jo-~ "{)~ ... !',llc<.-vv.~. ·
n) '.l' 0
~
~\ ,-IN'-;'+}
r; f1 n .1.
.J;:-i:_ ~v"'c'l.J.~ ;,_.~
.>+.. · !J \i- . .- · .· ' ·
. . ~ I ~ . .
9ne of the pilots who was to have engaged in the
mission was allegedly DAVID FERRIE. When the invasion plan 0as
discovered, the cover was used that their intenti6n had been to
fly the planes over Brazil as reconnaisance flights for makin·g
maps.
RALPH J. URIWELZ:\ resigned August 13, 1947 as Ci ·ty

Director of Int e rnational Relations. This post was created by
CHEP HORRISON. UR.RUELA did aged 70 . in Miami on February 24, 1952.
He was cons ul general for Guatemala in Miami at the time of his :·
death. · URRUEIJ\' s uppointment to the In·terna ·tional Rela ·tions job .
\vas sponsored by RUDOLPH HECHT. URHUEL.i\ · ,,; as succeeded in his job
by MARIO BEI~NUDEZ-
Waldron c.1dded ·that ·the Ne \v York . Times investigation

of the as sas sination was killed without warning or explan~tion
in February 1967.
r- . , . - ~ ' ..
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bw 12640 Docid:59168006 Page 157
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NW 12640 Docld: 591.68006 Page 158

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llli 12640 Docid:59168006 ~age 159
;
,_
·\
~7) SH!\1•7 Is
- - - ·- - ·--·-·-
FLIG:EE' 'i'O
'The man \•!hose nar,~e \·Je first though·t to be i'JHI'I'E

<tpparently is HIGHT, Vice President of Freeport
Su.!.phur Hho repLitedly made· t:hs fl:i.cht. Currently
-~iri--e:c· orl. ls eing made to locate \·.JIGI-1'1' \•Tho nO\·J I
J.ivi:s in Nc'>·l York, by a contact of JvSrk I.c1ne 's.

!?~:_::~p:i.te t:he fact that the or:i.crip2l SOll!CC of this
inform·J.tion \·tas JULES RICCO KUiBLE a._m;cm \·lith ---a
,_·-- ---
_record, this lead keeps grm·1 ing stronge r. F'rom
-~;i~~~-~~~ry O~ltset i t ha~i bPen ~p orted th~ fliqh~
hild somethlng to do wlth the lmport of llckle ·
-i;()~Llm·Jing the loss of the original import supply
:fr(=nn Cuba. Recent information developed on
l~;rcaT in a separate rno:~ mo, indicates that. he is nmv-
~he B·oard of Directors,of the ~ . or·t :thcr.;:
~:>1ar~~ ,_a subsidiary of Freeport Sulphus. (The
sq:B'rate file on this is a rather detailed report
fr6m Placquemine Parish and should be included in
the new· SHAW file.
RJ:CHl>PJ}·~OLFE_:_ .
lisi~~m~tion from ';Y"~ct of his in O~ton ; · .·

•.· jltct ~ ..:>fu.\\,ls much]:;~e t.~r }~no~lln ~llnto~ th~(l 1.t . ~~:ga
A..
·.··. ·· · v wouJ.d appe~. He .S Wllllng · br-~ng 1t;.;~is Wlt'Ress . _,~:Jf..)
\ dmvn from Cl±-~to~( ~nd have him . ~e t~p some ne\·~\•· .·
leads for us ~~h~s regard. . ~ ~
9) 'I'AXI Cl\B DRIVER:
Went out of his way one night to drive by FERRIE'S

house and told the passenger that he had taken SEffiW
to that a4c1ress on many occasions. I have more
memo for the file on this taxl cab driver. I am
including it in this list:i.ng in order to insure
follm·r-up.
10) "BL:R'L'H..l\ND LIBTU\RY Cl,RD":
It. \·rill be recctllecl that ·-'<:·nrne ._,. . .. t~rP~

. - L.l.:. "'ao l:ibl-"'r"
C.;. j ....i. -
....,_- .. ' ... ,::..:.....--
cmnloyees
--.L.--- .- Hhile cro:i.nc:J'
_J
th:ro unh :J
their records came 1
ctCJ.:'O!:'~ S a J.ibra;:y card madE~ out i.:.o CLEI·l or CL.i\Y
j!i_§..G..Ql1Jlted thir.; lec•d-.:1r.; ~ingy..:..!d~l.t..i"Y'8 becC.1i.J0f' ~

~-Dl~i1'.'q_s..r______t_1~1r~d out to h<::_~ no n~;:::ani!lCT, }~~..,..__
... ~_.:: . -. ._~ . J-h~::;_~-- ~:~'~ r:~,-~J:_:~;_:~>-~<~J~':_•: . ~~,-:-~=-=0.4-j ~~lYi?n ~ : _,,/ t .,.:t_:~;,:'~~\~3i~ \~;_::~_-:·:_7\i~~~
. ..~~-
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 160
. ;':\.:,~~~r;::=::;J~:~ ·'"'-,: ·:'-'~·: ::·: -.~:'~'~-:-~~7.~~~
-~-~~
possibl-e th at this , lib ,... ary,

( ·i:~~tir:g pl <:1 ces · u
2s well as other s , were
S•·ll\\·7 and other individuals_ ------
. ;i;·i1 e_ siqr>at.\J:r,..e. <::t~_2:-?ars to be _in SII?'~\-J' s han ch:_:r:j t:in_g_. tr~
p'~~;tl-le rmore, this card \'/~~-~- .no-t. thrust upon us but
C(':t tne to us through an official on the Library Boa rd .
. Hho h2d been info.rmed abou·t its discov e ry by a
lib~ary employee. We may have here~ situation
p <lr<:.llel to that in which SHA\·T siqned hi s narne CL!\Y
: ....... - - ----------
n :~ :WJ'Ili\ND at the V.I-. P. Room. In t~he l<:1tter instance
F_1}_{2_~> trong possi'iJi.lity exists that he v;as th~
( Ct l: ; t occ21 s i on for un intelligence cont a ct.

TT~ : t \ve keep our mind s op e n to the possibility of
t.hF..~ libr a ri es h a ving been used in the same way.
I sugge s t
NOTE: Wherever pre-existing memos or information

can be located concerning the above leads,
it is suggested that they be locat~d and
placed in our new jackets for SHAW LEADS.
JIM GARRISON
-· ..
. .
--
··--··'-'J _____........___ .--
-4--
;..\) ~'i)l~" ~ .
-':l ···;,:~:-· .
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 161

e·
MENORl'INDUM
O~tober 21, 1968
TO: JIM GARRISON, District
FROM: 1\NDREW SCIAI·IBRA, Assistant District. Attorney
RE: TRAVEL TO HONROE, LOUISIANA
* * * * * * * * *'* * * * * * * * * *. * * * * * * * ~ * * * *
·-· -Steve·· Bordelon· ·and -I · traveled to · Nonroe, · Louisiana, in
an effort to locqte our deaf mute and GAIL HALL and talk to .
BP.RBARA lvlESSINA. Because of certain complications, ·our travel.
was no-t ari overwhelming . suc-C:es's ~- :·however, . s 'o me substantial. contacts
were made · for future reference. · ·· ; . ..
_J3l\.,l:{BARA l·:lESSINA 'l.vho resides at ·1507 Spencer Street,

Mon ~.__:.L_oUisi'ana, phon_e__nu.mB-er 387-6410, ha.d_previously toTer
4--...~\.l-l-lo~,.\.,_....~...·Oil"NG tha ·t she did . haue e-ecasion tn_meet JACK RUBY in
1963 -- She . said that .RUBY- --
......__._ called her ~everaL .times·· ... . She said-.tha
she had occasion to have dinner with JACK RUBY several times. ·
~l).e also -said tha!~se .c:>cc;-asions she was ·picked up by an · ·· .'
e· er y gray':.h'aTr"'ed man i~ncr=taT<ent"'OUe;:tR~
- s heCTO'eS'~'~ ...the" n~~&TA·o'f"t"fi'e ·~frivel:"""'and"Au-B"RE'Y""'Cfld•'""ncrr""haV'e"'
any pictures to sh.o w her. She also said that RUBY had a nice .
looking young man with him on these occasiog~. said
· ·· · that ~she happened to meet a person· whose picture . she saw on ·
e ev1s1on after the assassi nati an. She does not know any of th
people's names~ She said that RUBY offered to get her a job in
· Dallas with a doctor.
I We tried to locate BARBARA MESSINA for two days but no

one answered her phone and AUBREY said that he thought that she
I had left town because she was terribly frightened and knew that
we were on our way up to see her:
We contacted SHERIFF BILL CAUSEY in regard to GAIL HAL

and he said that the name was not f~miliar to him . . He did r~fer
us ·to ROY LEA .LINER who r .uns- --a shoe repair ...shop--at 1 ,2 08 · cypress
.1{1 .
Street in W. Monroe, Louisiana, . phone number 323-297p. LINER's
,.. )~ "~Q~ . parents are deaf mutes and he holds classes for the . <;Ieaf mutes
r~.,.,......~ in the 11onroe area. I gave him all the information that we had
. \l .... ori' our deaf mute .and he
said that he would make an effort to
loc~te him for us.
. .. .
SHOR'rY .BELL who runs the Red Ball Pool Hall at 5709
Desaird Street ; is a~oth~r person who has some contact with the
deat · community~ > and who·is attempting to help us.
~ we · talked with JACK HESNI who iuns the . Najestic Hotel

on sixth and .Desaird Street in Monroe and he said that to his
knowledge he knows of no deaf mute who has stayed at the hotel.
H~ saj_d that he h~s a big turnover in night c l erks and perhaps
_,. they ·may . [lave - see'n _o_r. heard .of ·the deaf mute,· but tha·t he hasri I t •
...
:mf '12640 Doc I d:59168006

.
Page 162
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·:of·_ Cuba is ni c_kl.e ore ·to - a·. -: .· -· ·:~~-- -:_~ ..- :--~:-;~~
r:_-~ f~-~~-~-,-:~~{_.~;_:_·~·_ .\t.au.~L~~f.t._~ t.~C'..QJ::JY,. wh ·j ch \'IOU 1 d in !Urn Ship to .. ·.. -. -~ :.-~·.::~.,·~-~ :-\:/~~~~~\
.::.· ~·: ~:.-:.-:-~ :-- :_~::-;:_:.· -~:::::-:__ .§_r~ :tl t e ~N-;ck,l~nt. Plant Has bu1lt bu U.S • . :·:· ·__:~:;:~-:> .=~---~ . ~-~·:.· .~;
··._· I· ;;;:jif~:'~~:J.···::::::~: ~ \ f': /::;~:·~ ea•::u;,r:.: ~::

~.-: ~ _:::_-~._ ,--.-::-···.'~ purcha sed
:~ e.· '~-n c.~·~~~:{]~'~:iq~{?; f-:·> : ·i : t d
plant for $1 million and intended to get ·
p
· · · ·,_". ·!~· · , .:· -_
..f l._ ,:·.:;·)L:. or; thru Can~di .an_ Co:~n:;::e:a:h::r::::d F:;r~: ... ' \., .:;.;~';:\~;~;j;:~j
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\'las.in'lo1ved in ·. ro eryand _accused . o try1ng _to ·~ · -··-· ·:~: - ·' ·
_ :~ , :: -- ·, ----~:--. v>:< bribe a La. State Policeman,. Has hir e d to kill Bannister~ : : ·:: : .-. _
:[ . · ~ ; .· ~~~ Jis bury ater su~cefu llyfought ext~~di ti on tr.~:~ . .. ;,;. : : . 1
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•- .. ·-~:- ,:' . .. ·_::::;::: coast of Florida un er mysterious circumstances) is · .· < ..-·:. _:··-
- ~ -·.::.-:<:: :;.~---~-: ·: .... rumored to have been mixed up in . thisd_eal. __ ,.-_ , -,_\ ~-,': ' : / ·:' __·:_
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III. Ch eck l.l:iX · Daily Star - Hammond ., La. supposedly -· _. : .. ·:....
: .-. . ; . .: .. . . a Gr a d u c.t t e s t u d en t , ( p r e s u me S o u t h e a s t e r n ) s a y s Fe r r i e · ·
, _ ·- . __.··.::·'_ ~:.-- Hid out the night of the assassination in a dorm in -
;c ·: · · · · ,_ ._.. Hammond. Th::~re is an a6rport : in Hammond {also home of
~ .... Sh a w's moth e r). Athletic Dir. Grady Martin might have so me
-· ~, · ··- info.
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HE HOI\. !\ ND U H
~:
~:
Octobe.c 9, l <)68
TO ! ;nr-1 Gl\RRISON, District Attorney
; FRON: ANDRB~'i J- SCIAr'lBRA, Assistan·t D_

l
\
!
' RE: CLAY SR'\li'+

~ * * * * * ***********...* * * * . ·:. :-.
' . . . ..
· Dt~ring my
of ' Houston~ - Texas,.·. HR. INE informed m~.. that he·; h.ad~ obeen·;~~~:<P~~:<::<~ ::·::· :·
co~·ta~ted _ b}ra HR.- lilii ... E of Freep.o rt Sulphu-r in· regards . to----~')_-~~!\t:~t\}
possibh assassina.tion plan fo~.. Fidel. Cast~o- ·.··.• .. . ... _ ; ·;_,~i~;0~{~i;1}'~'~
. . NR. PLZ·\ ': (NE sa~d ·that NR _ _\'lHITE _was only · one of. -th~ . f_ J·:; :·.-·:··: ~·
mar.y oil and in1port people_ that he had occasion to talk to 5:v:;.-:·-'--
from Ne1.~ . Orleans : regarding Castro_ .. < ':~ ...
. . ....... _ ~ .
. ·. '•: .:.. ·-: _: . · .. -·
- l'lR. PLATN~ al~~ infor~ed me th.a t he thought
:. ·-: _ , ..
picture c):f: CL.AY SHAW :~.·1as very fa:miliar, and that ·_hemay_ have _:: ._•
me·t hint in Hous·ton, - ei·ther a ·t his . apartment at the -Normandy o.r
Club ·which ·t-.ht:~ oil ·people of Texas frequent_ .~: _ · ·
:.~.:; ·, .. .. .
.·-:;.· ·.··. .
. ~~
A memo in · ·the GUY BANISTER fil-~ indic~t~s- there that:
~a is information which reports that .. _CK vvt:J:_UE-l a high official ;:-':; :
--~a ~~p_hur, and CLI\y _;i,!-IAliL.;:zer e flgr,·m _cu_ga nrobablv2_ - _Eo
tak~ o!f f r om the H~vey Can_ a l area in a Freeport Sulphur _<:, ·. :·. ...
plane pil() t._::{.C by DAVE FERRIE. The urpose of this · --------;:---.
!_o set \IQ.__j,_~Q! r-t of Cuba's nickle ore to a <:1nadian
corpora·tion which Hould in turn sh.i_p7,.. ·to the Brai·th•,¥aite nickle · .. ,
~nt_ ~l'h e pl~y ·the U. _ S. Government at a cost
~------~
of about one million Uoi.Lars__
. .: . . . . · · -· :--; ..
The report is that .·the · combine of Freeport Sulphur, .;'

l'II-IITE, and SI·LI\ld purchased th~_:elant for a m~l:~n~ dollars and ....
. intended tp___g_~:! E :~re thro~h a Canadian co.r:-oor;·ti th~ ·-- rm
W~{~ .. ~ •_ehere is also a report ·that _G UY BANISTER. hired FERRIE
,_;~~~f~ and Ji\CK Hl\H.'l'IN as investig~tors to che ck out the nickle plan-t. _· -.
deal_
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Docid: 59168006 Page u74 ::F:.·-:
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. octo~>c i~ - .. J I 1968 .
?0: JI~ GARRISON, District At~o~ney
ANDE S;·; J. SC:U,~·: SR A, Assist~nt D. A .•
RE: SI-IA~·l - FERRIE & 'i'iHITE (Freeport Sulphur)
* * * * * * * * * * *•* * * * * .* . ·. * * * * * * * * * * *
\ . contacted Mr. PLAINE by telephone in-reg~~d
I
to i•il<. \·ikCTE of Freeport Sulphur and DAVID FERRIE •.. PLAI~TE
told me that he distinctly remembers either SKU.~·; oc FER..r<IE
·· talking _21bout some nickel mines >·rhich Here located · 0::1.~
\•7estern
---c- . - --·tin of Cub::~_
- ·. ..____._ He says he does .not reffieiT'.her exactly
the gist of the conversation, but he distinctly remembers
:tha~ it was r~g~rding the~e nickel mines~ He said he cannot
positively say that FERRIE k.neH HHITE or vice versa, but he
somehow· feels thatthey must have knor.-.'Tl.each other.
Alcock and I will call 1n ER. \·lrliTE o£ Freeport

Sulphur and ask him about our previous rGe moranclum fror::t
KH'i.BALL '::thich mentions SEAH, F'ERRIE and ~'i':HITS l::;eing
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NW 12640 Docid:5g168006 Page 165

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STATEMENT OF 11.RS. HATHILDA TADIN

•
My husband and I had gone out to the New Orleans Airport one
afternoon sometime in the summer of 1964. While waiting to see
Dave Ferrie, we saw him come out of the hangar with another
person. My husband turned to me and said "Look who's with Dave"
and I said "Who's that"? My husband3told me that the man was
Clay Shaw, a n.otor ious degenerate.
.·..
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'J?j!(_~-L£_-c:-~ ~ ~~· .
Mathilda Tadin
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Office of the District Attorney

February 27, 1969
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 166 . -· .

STATEMENT OF MRS. MATHILDA TADIN
•
afternoon sometime in the surruner of 1964. While waiting to see
Dave Ferrie, we saw him come out of the hangar with another
and I said ""\·\"ho.' s that"? My husband told me that the man was
Clay Shaw, a notorious degenerate.
i .. ·~·-.· . .
~~zLL.~ 0 ;:C-CL~
Mathilda Tadin
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February 27, 1969
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 167

•
STATEMENT OF MRS. MATHILDA TADIN
•
afternoon sometime in the summer of 1964. While waiting to see
Dave Ferrie, we saw him come out of the h~ngar with another
and I said "Vlho's that"? My husband told me that the man was
Clay Shaw, a notorious degenerate.
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February 27, 1969
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NW 12640 Docld:59~68006 Page 168

}i~~jtJW~
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• STATEMENT OF MR. NICHOLAS TADIN
1 i
I was :out ~t the New Orleans Airport on a Saturday or a sunday
afternoon sometime during the summer of 1964. I had brought
my boy out there to take some flying lessons from Dave Ferrie.
After I parked my car I noticed Dave Ferrie and Clay Shaw coming
out of the hangar. Dave Ferrie was about three feet ahead of
Clay Shaw. Clay Shaw turned to go to his car and Dave Ferrie
was coming ·to\\'ar ds me. When Shaw turned Dave waved at him.
Shaw just got. i.nt.o his automobile and left. I asked Dave Ferrie
if this was a new student that he had because I knew of Clay
Shaw and he r.~a{d ~ ·- No, it was a personal friend and the Manager
of th~ International Trade Mart, and that was the end of that.
However, I d id call it to the attention of my wife when I saw
Clay Shaw and told my wife who he was at the time. I had seen
Clay Shaw seVeral times before around the French Quarter and know
positively that this was him.
··.. . ·, ,
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Nicholas Tadin
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February 27, 1969
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 169 i.?1d!I!:P.I: L

,ij~~i~j~~
STATEMENT OF MR. NICHOLAS TADIN
I was out at the New Orleans ~irpori on a Saturday or a Sunday

afternoon sometime during the summer of 1964. I had brought
my boy out the re to take some flying lessons from Dave Ferrie.
After I parked my car I noticed Dave . Ferrie and Clay Shaw coming
out of the hangar. Dave Ferrie was about three . feet ahead of
Clay Shaw. dlay Shaw turned to go to his car and Dave Ferrie
was coming to'·''ards me. When Shaw turned Dave waved at him.
Shaw just go t into his automobile and left. I asked Dave Ferrie
if this was a new student that he had because I knew of Clay
Shaw and he t~a :ld,- No, it was a personal friend and the Manager
of the International Trade Mart, and that was the end of that.
However, I di d call it to the attention of my wife when I saw
Clay Shaw and told my wife who he was at the time. I had seen
Clay Shaw several times before around the French Quarter and know
positively that this was him.
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Nicholas Tadin
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Office of the District Attornev

February 27, 1969
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&:
,TRANSCRIBED 7 14/67 .
II "------~->·;:· ' :
/jThis will be a tape recording of an interview made on July 12,
)!1967, at exactly ·4:20 P~M., interview conducted by William Boxley
1lof the District Attorney's Office of New Orleans and by William
!!Martin, of the District Attorney's Office of New Orleans •. · The
linterview will be conducted in the Wynne State Farm, Texas
l
jD~ . ment c;.f.;'~ectic:>ns. The in~er:riew. is ~on~ucted with Mr.
IFlll1am A. Mo~ an 1nmate at sa1d 1nst1tut1on.
I --- . .
~--------------------~-~-------------------~--------------~--------
b. What we would li,ke to know about first, if we could, BILL
I ar~ you called ijiLL or BILLIE?
h
I.
BILLIE.
r
Alr-ight This
SF.l\W= Dj d you
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. Well, .I met a man introduced to me as CLAY BER'T'RAND • .
:_,_-- ,,?_-- '·
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[
I met· a CLAY BERTRAND. The name CLAY SHAW was never
mentioned or used to me.
Alright; can you tell me the circumstances of roe~ting MR.

BERTRAND?
I certainly can. I met him at the Masquerade Bar. I

~-
'wa::. taken there by GENE DAVIS for the·express reason to
--==-meet him. ~~A,n .g-.»--~ "-a
Alright, when was this?
·. .
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~~· 'i~ ~4-~4..,~~
rr
. It· was some time in ..rune ·of 1958 ..
,June of.· '58 and what was the occasion of the Masguerad~
ball?
~e Masgue~ade _Q_._.__
Bar~ I beg your pardon.
On St. Louis Street. It's a homosexual hangout.
Okay.
It's now ·when I left called the Cove. It changed

names.
The Cove? C-0-V-E?
Uh huh, it's on St. Louis Street. Between Bourbon and

Dauphine.
Now
..... why was GENE DAVIS interested in introducing you to
BERTRAND?
A. Well, for sexual purpos~
,A. . That • s right. , .
NW 12640 DoJld:59168006 Page 17i

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Q. . There wasn • t anything e) se suggested? . .. •
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J'! A. ~ - -·
Q. Okay. Now then, what age were you at that time?
A. .. . ..1 was 18
Q. You were 18. And where did you live in New Orleans at
that time?
A. oh, I was living on Dauphine Street, right across _the

street from the Dauphine Restaurant. A little old hole
in the wall restaurant •. There's a littleapartment house
there. I was living with a guy named ART •. ,
Q. ART .. ·
A. worked for GENE ·DAVIS at the Court of Two Sisters.

NE DAVIS at that time · ::-- I · read in the paper about
_ natura~ly , _ : an~ they say he O'WI1S Wanda's Bar -- · but ..
at that·. tlme , he JUst· worked for··· thecourt of . Two Sisters.
He didn't own n_othing . -~_ ;• : He ·_didn't own a car. \:
..... ,···
Q. What ·was he . doing . at the.. court of Two sisters? ·

. .... - .··
A.· Some _kind of maitre'd or something, he ·- wasn .' t just .any

everyday~ bimmy you know. He offered to get me · a job •··
there ~ and I'm sorry I didn'.t go to work, ·to be -honest ' . 'I~ ;
with you.
Q. Okay, and he introduced ou to BERTRAND have

-you 1dentified in your o'WI1 mirid CLAY BERTRAND from
pictures · that you've seen in the paper or did v:ou ev~r ••
···,. _,., ,__,._
A. I never -seem · the pictu-re in the paper, to be honest ·.with

you, but I seenhim on T.V. once .and I thought maybe •••
Oh, looks like, well, somebody I'd be •• ~·well, I thought
. it was somebody I'd tricked with when I was in New
Orleans, and then · I kept thinking •••
. Q. . When did you see him on T.VJ

,·
A. Oh, it's been a long time ago, three or four months.
Q. In what connection?
A. Well just something about Jim Garrison's stuff.; They

-had him coming out of the, oh, uh.be didn't say nothing
he was just going in something. you know.
Q. In a building or •••
A. Yeah, in a building, you see, I just seen him.
Q. Then what you say then is that you saw on television

_several months ago photographs of a man going in or out
of the Court building and this was the man you know as
CLAY BERTRAJ\ID?
A. rt looked a lot like him, I ' l l say that. Seeing a man

on television a.nd se..a.i ng him in rea 1 might make- a
difference._:_... _- --·· -<-- . -
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Q. Yeah.
You understand what I mean?
•
~ure, sure. Was he on television as CLAY SfiNy? Was a
~e ference made to him on tele vision as CLAY SHAW?
A. ~~~_s, yes.
Q. 'J'his man was identified on teJeujsian at tb 0 t ti.m.e as _

CLAY SHAW?
""""--
A. l~s CLAY SHAW.
Q. I see.
A. They said he \vas a New Orleans businessman or something.

He
....__ told me he worked for General ELectric. I remember
~
Q. Alright·, you met him at the Masquerade Bar.
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Q. · Where .did you · go with him from there?
A. · . t're went to GENE DAVIS I apartment

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Q. Okayo Was this at night or in the daytime?.
A. .~rhis . was at . nj gbt.
Q. .Do you·remember where GENE DAVIS' apartment wasJ
A., .]; remember where it was but not the e x act address q It
..lcli;l.S horo or threa doors down further from the court of TWO!
Sisters. On the even side of BQurbon, . of course, 6l.!l ox;:_
612 Bourbon, it could have been 608 or 614, you under-
_stand wbat I mean?
Q. Yeah. And did you go up there with CLbY BERTRAND?....
A. ..cr.Av BER'l'Rl\.ND; yes.

We went in a little efficiency ••• it\
little effic i ency apartment. I had been there
~as · a
· be fore with GENE DA)lJS, of course.
Q. Alright, now, . did you ever see him after that?
Uh, I seen him, uh ••• Yes, I saw him two more times when
we went to GENE DAVIS' apartment; I saw him .on MR. BOONE'
boat; and then he entered my apartrrent one night by
mistake. But that would take just a little explaining t .ol
explain that.
I
Q. Alright, you saw him twice more at DAVIS' apartment •• ~ 1
A. Now, sir, at the Masquerade and we went· to DAVJS •

apartment. We always met at the Masquerade to have a
drink -- I · don • t even think he drank I don • t
remember-- but then we wentto GENE'S, GENE DAVIS' little
apartment •
Q. . You think he did not drink?

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A. :i: ·can't.remeinberwhether he drank beer.or what,;

I know ·
GENE DAVIS was a lush, a lush. · He drank some, you know
what I mean • .
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You met him on BOONE'S boat, you said?
On a guy oat. · Matter of fact, GillE

DAVIS is duced me to BILL .. BOONE.
What kind of boat was it? Do you recall?
l\.11 I . recall. is it 'l.vas a big boat~ It was big, you know

fo~ a boat, but I . . . it was big to me i t wasn't uh
· ~ ~ I think GENE said i t was 80 feet.
Q. It·. was a yacht then.

veh.,.
A. Oh, i t ' was a seagoirg yacht, ~- It could go, you know,
.z ' / :t
i,~ C::C::..r?· g'?, i t can go 7 j_'·.. · ,i;t.·· _- " ....-"'
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Q. What did BILL . BOONE do? . . . .
A. 1 ·don' t · know, . he
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Q. . .··, . Alright~- ;t · ·
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A. He ne,;~r . did f~ll 'me . ·.· I
Q. _Yo:u _ knew_· BOONE, -__ though~- .:: ....

--. '"·::_'. ·. . :~ ,· ...
A. Why, yes, I know MR. BOO~. " ..:"
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Q. Alright, ca~_~o~u~d~e~s~c~r~i~b~e~~~~~~~-=t~o~-~m~e~~~~m~a~-~n~y~o~u~~
_knew as CLAY BERTRaND How -was he ? You 're 6 '1" ?
<:!_fow tall are you?, , -·:· .
A. Well, he was not -quite as tall as

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Q. lvait just a minute. How tall are you?

..
ab(;~6•, -· 6'~"-~ - -
·_ -
A.; (fffi
..
.··
Q. Alright, and then how tall was he in relation to you? ·
A. He was •• ~he was, uh ••• Well, actually he was about my ··

size, only he was, . you know, · he wasn • t skinny • .
~t . . :__· .
Q. . Yes, but this motion (flapping elbows) doesn't translate
A. Oh, well.
. .. _
Q. He was about your height?
A• . About my size, about my height and he was built like a

weightlifter~ You know what I mean?
Q • ., I understand.
A. While I've got a little ·old pidgeon chest, he's · got, you
know what I mean.
Q. What color eyes did he have?
A. Oh, my god • . I'm sorry, buti really don't remember that

.. ·-· · -
. -Q;:·· "-::J\l,r,i ght;' ~ how - did he .wear ' his h air, hm.i was Jt Hcll.t? ·-;
A. Uh, 1 ike yours • . ..

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:mf 12640 . - .n.r. . . d. !l rt !. . ~L M r · it . L - ~- . J AS . J 1 0k ,. J i ~ . . lh4J - 't

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·.
Q.
•
Well, now how is mine cut? '.T mean,
1 .
to be of any value__
on the tape, we have to bave that.
A. _Well, a bnsby crewcut.
Q.
A.
A bushy crewcut, alrjght What color hair Q.id he have?
....-~::;:?yish-brown, qreyish-regdish-brown.
-
Q. Alright, did he ever wear glasses durirDg the times you
sao.v him?
A. ·:c couldn't say one way or another on that.
Q. About how much do you think he .weighed?
A. 1\bout 180 pounds, 185.
Q. About 180 to 185 pounds?

. .•
:, '
A. Yes.
~nidentified - Here I've got a lighter. You can keep those

rna tches, I have more here. .
,;• '
Q. Wht's the longest time you were with him, I mean in .

close relationship like we're sitting here now or as yo
might at a bar?
A. Well, we never hung around the Masquerade much •. We jus

had one drink or two and. then split, you understand?
I ' l l say about a period of about three hours.
Q. About three hours. Alright, · you say you met him for
-::§exual :gurposes did he pg,y you for .t;.h.i..a.?
A. $20.00~_
Q. He payed you $20.00,

--·
A. Each time, No agreement, he just ••• Gene
just told m score ••• don't c unt on him
for nothing.
Q. What did the sexual practices consist of, would you mind
describing them for me, to help in our effort to
identify the man?
A. _.H.§J_l. actually it-makes no difference to me, cause i t ' s

no secret with me. r 'm down here on an homosexual
Qffense so it's no secret With me. To him maybe il:
__ might bee Well r don't know tbe terms to use, legal
Q.
- terms, but he just, he f--ked me, you see.
Alright. It was anal intercourse then.
A. Anal intercourse, yeah, that's the legal term.
Q .. Now did it consist of anything else?
A. Well he, he alsways ••• as I remember it ••• that was justj

about it., Well, he wasn't exactly the butchest thing j
- .. ~~·:in the wo-rld~ -· you_ . kr~J.Ow. -· He~-was, he :was .·a.·_ homo~exual, ·-~ -- -·
' by that I mean,you ·know. ·.·· ... - _, . .. - .,
Q., you mean by the butchest thing in the world?
NW 12640 ,,
Doc d: 59.168006 Page 175 -5- - . ·, -·
A. ·
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I mean?
.
Well he gets up in· it, . you know. Do you understand what
Q. Yeah. Okay, now then, in his conversations with you did

he ever disclose anything that would lead you to believe
· what type of \vork he was. engaged in?
A. No.
Q. - Arlyt.hing about his personal life?
A. No, you mean where he lived? He told me he lived with

his mother. That's why we went to GENE DAVIS' place.
l-\.nd that 's a natural thing. People live with their
mothers. Or maybe they're even married and have a wife.
Q. What was the man's age?
A. ~He _!:!.as in his~ .. he 1 ookea to me to be about his middle ·

thirties. · ·
Q. He appeared in his mid-thirties in 1958? ·
A. But he had a very nice physique for a man that age. If

you understand what I mean. I don't remember if he had
any tatoos or scars.
Q. What kind of voice did he have? _Was i t · like mine, or

yours or Mr. Martin's, was he harsh in his speech? _
A. Oh well now, that's hard.
Q. . I know it's been a .long time.

· .·:
A. Well, I mean, he never said "heard" or "Knowed" or "dis"

and "dat".
Q. He spoke good english?
A. He spoke good english.
Q. Maybe we can help, rather than say he had a voice like

yours or mine, did he have a high voice or a low voice?
A. . He wasn't one of them "Hi darlin voice) ·
say he's a homosexual, he's not you know

what I mean, limp wrists. He's
Q. ,.. Was he a cultured man, was he a working man,

this is the
thing I mean about his voice. You can usually tell what
type of economic life a man leads by the way he talks.
Th~t's what I'm after.
A. Oh well, I'd make book he \vent to college. He didn't

dress like one he dressed nice ]\Tow GENE DAVIS aress.e<t+
-· .__,
!~~e g~t s!o~j tt~= :~;e~r~~: ~!~~ ~~:n t~=t0 ~=~~~! ~-a_r
.-
~"~-.:~T";SJ.oi:)_i:~< .Actualiy~-, -he · was a slob. Not- ·'that I've· 'got ·._ : -·.
anything against him.
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Q. I've never·seen GENE DAVIS. Would you describe him to

me? · How ta.ll uould you :;; ay GENE DAVIS is?
\
A. Well he's shortor than I am • . def]nitely ~ hort~r.

.t • ----
Q. .How · much shorter? ·
•·.
A. Oh, not a great deal." He's not a short man but he's not
a tall man either. He might be grey headed now but he
had coal black hair then and he's a bl~ck headed person,
·~:Vi th black eyebrows,· and black eyes and he · was kind of
~a i ry, ~ on his arms.
Q. Well, . how tall would you say he is,· is he 5'5" . or 5'10"?
A. ~tell, he's about 5 '8~" or 9" or 10". Not no midget. _

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Q. ' How-·much :would ·he weigh? · ·. .' , · ·.··~ . - ·

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· _·,- _
A.· , ... _·._ . . He had ' faJ:se teeth .·. (~ -,-_·- - _ ._..· . .:-···..'h_:_~::;,~..~). . ··>
.. :-:~ .~.... :::i;~.~;~~j~l\;·§t/J;i~~~-:~5:~~:~~?:~~=ft-~~;:,~:~:.-·~~ .. ~ ~:~~~;~:~t~~~i:~:<:;. _~ .f}i:1~~- ~-_y:.:~·~:<;~~i~~/~· -:-:-~ : ··:.~-~'": .~ ~:· ?I.t;r~~{~-<t~·~t;· . .. ·: ~~~
Q • .:.·:. ·. -·'- ·,, He Shad··a t · '· that · time false teeth~ · If · he · had thm+1
has ot ··: to have · them :now.·
. ? uess ·,r -< · st ·mi ht as ·well
_:,:;;_ ~ ad ·- false .·· teeth he's ·
A.
.·;;·{~~~;~~;;:;k~!l ,c;, ~, . .. . ..
,_:}C I_'-m ' not ·,~ to .:'good .at gue.s sing weights? •I'll ·say as
·. ' •. _, _ I ~ can, :~~-.I 1d ' say . he weighed about · 160 pounds. : · ·
•< ' '
~... ~;,:f'i,~~~:ii~~~~~i~?:,;~,: . • . ·' ·: ·;·· ._ .

A~ . , wasn.~, t .exactly f~t~ ·.: He
He had a little ~6~ch. ···.:
·•'"'-' -.
. . ._; ..··
· ,·-J:~'}S\~:::~Jlii'v~~~~}';·f"~~:::. :;·.: :; · <"·-· · · · ·· · ~- . -· . ·. . .: ~
·· , :: .. Now -he . introduced you'. to ·t his -man ':·a.s :cLAY BERTRAND in

<:_:~:_· :\:-~~:.1:he- bar?-··:;::./.~,., ,_ · ·. :··· · :-·;,~t_: _:.•.~.;.~; :;: ·:~ . . , .:?, ::' • , . ·. -
-~- :·,~;r:~fr{~f-:;:,;i~•~,~~;~~\1;:~~~!~~~-:~ade,. ,_Bar ~- <;::-;·:;:. ~:'.;;~r ·.: ·· ·
' :--:~ ~ . . : ·- .. ,_ ·..
·: ~- ~:::~:-~·=r~~~- ~- 1~~:;::.:~_:_~-~:- .. :_- ~ -.
, •;',
Q. . '. The .,Masquerade 'Bar. · Did . BERTRAND wear ' a. · hat?

. ,.. ..
. A. · - _.' No. never have · I seen. the man with a hat on. Never • .
·: ~ don • t know ~t he wears one now, . but I've never s -e en
...
/" •.: ..
. _: . ...
• ·. Now do, you remebe r what .. you drank? . At the · first meeting~
. I'm not ·talking about the subsequent meetings but the I.
. · first·; time -you met the · guy in · the ·Masquerade Bar when ·1··.··
GENE DAVIS ·introduced you <· ·
. ·.· . ' . _... ~ .. ··:. ~- . .. ..
· , •
. . -· .
What did I 'drink?
Q. Yes. · ...:.
A. I know . what. I drank. If they were buying, I drank a

sti~ger~ If someone else is buying, I'm going to drink
· a mixed drink.
.~ · .
,·, :.
Q. . Now i t ' s ·your memory · w~•re trying and not your drinking
habits. We're trying to see .what you can definitely
recall without any question in your mind •
. .... ·-._' :.._· - .. ~:· '- . .

. ,. _-:· :_ - :::--- ~.- ..•:::.:
. . . ..
. ..
·
.. :.
; ··.- .. . :_ · "·>-~- :~ :
-:-7- .·. .. . ,., · :::-~ :
. .: ... . . · .~': ·-::-···:f..-.;::~~-~~-- ;:,-·· . ........,...... ,,.,.,

I
;
jt
!
-
.
e e
A.
wasn't about to go to his pocket.
Q. 'fhe first time you met ~;~ ,,..1~~ !RFTRAND wead ng a suit,
bl.- '\•laS he Wearing S 1 ack;
-~ ------ .
fwhlba;? .
A. He was wearing a snit everytime I met him.
-~·--· . ---
Q. .!::~e1:ytime you met him he wore a suit.
A. \vell maybe sometimes he was wearing a sport coat but he

alwais had on .a jacket.
Q. 'J~o
get away from this a little bit, · we '11 come back to
it later, wo~ld you tell · me about the period of time you
lived in Beaumont and Port Arthur in· Jefferson _County?
.-._,.
. . ' -.
A. Not a thing cause I was justthere · two days_and I_got
busted. . " '
Q. Who were you with at the time?
A. I was with a salesman from the company I was working . for-

but he's strictly straight, don'tknow none of these
p<.wple. Just as old wino. His name _ is W.Al,TER S •. SMITH.
'I'he police liked to have beat him to death when he told
them that in Beaumont. They had me on an alias and they
got him and they asked him what's your name and he said
SHITH and they like - to beat him to death but that ·was
his name, Smith.
, .. . ..
Q. Where were you caught?
A •. .I was apprehended in Beaumont, Texas.
Q. No, I mean, where were you in a motel room, a car or

where were you?
No, I was out in the woods.
Q. Alright. And you didn't _k now anyone around Beaumont?
A. Not a soul. Well I went there to work for a company.

Allied Continental Automobile Association, 1232 Baronne
Street in New Orleans and 808 Orleans Street in Beaumont.
But I believe they closed their Beaumont office down. I
wouldn't know about their other.
Q. Did someone in New Orleans recommend you to Beaumont for

that job?
A. I was sent out there purposely to go to work there. You

know to run their sales up. I'm a pretty good salesman.
Q. Who sent you there?
A. well, TROY HEIDELBERG, the manager of the New Orleans

office, and LOUIS RO~O, the owner in t}1e Hou_ston __q~fice
at.: 1S03' . Pe~se ~ s tree f ~' l.n flo us ton. - -·- -- ,_- ' ' :..- - - . ..- - - · - ' . - : ; -
Q. Do you know if HEIDELBERG knew CLAY SHAW?
-8-
NW 12640 Doc d:59168006 Page 178
.. . . ' ... ·-· ...· :~
' . "<: -
!I
jl
A. Oh, no, no. 'l'hose · two parts of my life were entirely

separate. This was in 1960 I'm talking about~ I was
talking about 1959 just a minute ago. Those two parts o
my life are entirely separate. TROY HEIDELBERG is
married and has four children, is a Mason, ·me of those
type of people • . I worked for.the man. Oh I might have
90ne next door with him and drank a bottle of beer at
1 tinch time. He knew I was homosexual.
Q. Ho•v long did you work for that company?
A. About eight months.
Q. _Had you known HEIDELBERG before?
A. :t never saw him before · I walked in the , office. I

answered an ad in the paper. That's the reason I walked . ,: .
Ln.
- ~=-•;> "
.. . . .·. .... . . . .
. . ' ' .... . . ·.. .. . ~ ,..: ~ .. ~ :-:~}~(-~.':. -~
Q. - · Alright, can you tell us anyone else 1n New Orleans ' ln ( ::·. -.: :
!;s~~~oB~!~~ve been . in~roduced to CLAY B:RT~~~~ .
A. Well; I could tell you a .gang· of people~ > I don • t know :
·_where yo~' .d . hunt th~m up. ,. _.-.. · .-····· ·~·
Q. .. Well, I say who might have been. .Do you know anybody · ,. ,
who did know him as CLAY BERTRAND other than .GENE DAVIS?
A.· __ BILL BOONE. -

, · ·:-
·: ·., __
Q. BILL BOONE, the· owner of the · yacht • . I ·.· .·., .. ; · ..
.... ·,
~ '•':··'
~ •· .
y:~h~ciw~=m~~~:;e~e :~~~~'t
A.
Q. ::ah; name oftbe
A. I t was out by the My-0 My club

of it but 1t was by the Ivly-0-My..
~!:, the na~e ~c -
Q. It \vas the yacht club next to the My-0-My?
A. Yes, it was right over from there~
Q. Do you remember anything about the bartender at the

Masquerade Bar? Do you know who he was? . ---.
A. CHRIS GOODYEAR. if I remember right.
Q.
-CHRTS GOODYEARc Djd he knowBERTRAND?
A. Now I found out later and this is getting ahead of

myself and I'm going to confuse myself and confuse you,
too, probably, but I ,found out later than BILL BOONE
owned that bar, I didn't know it then. But he· owned it.
CHRIS GOODYEAR ran it for him. But he sold out. That's
when they changed the name over from the Cove. You know
iD 1958, the summer of 1958, they · got real rougbt..m2_ ·
~omosexuals in the New Orleans a rea, and dope people.
I'm not a dope person but, 'l.vell, most of them got their
hatboxes and headed for Miami. _About that time BILL
· .":-.:· - .
-~-~:_ BOoNE· .- --.~-~ ----When . I -~-g6t -- back,- · th~ · \Va-y. I qnd~-~~·ttlod when ·r ·
got back he sold it. But a t the time I met BILL BOONE
I didn 1 t ·know that. .The time I met BILL BOONE I had bee
living in New Orleans for just a couple of months. I .-. :
~. - - 1 - · . · -- - -9- - - .- - _ < . -: - - -- - -- ~;~< - _·
~~~~iM.Jlf.Bgd~~~~,i~~p~.I..~-~;... SJ5. ~ Jt>e# .t£WJgi-S"'!!,l 1! ~.~-.,_,,m~<&.~!'i 1,¥1¥~~~'<'M!Ml41'1!#ifl~"a!>'!l!.!li~s:MsM~!!iJ.fi!J~~"*t~,·~-~

I'
•!
I
.,
I lived in 'New Orleans for a total of about··.three months
.I and by the time I got to living there, well BILL BOONE
was kind of wellknown around ••• some homosexuals know
I him and the time I met him I didn't know him from Adam's
housecat, the first time I was introduced to him, if
you understand what I mean.
Q .. Al:r.i
"'--·-"-·-·
think of?
.·-·--
A. Well, this guy I lived with, TER WILSON.
Q.
c~~.
A. Yeah.
Qo Vlell, what did he do, where can we find him?
A. Well, I lived with him for quite a -while. ·I know he

· . kpows BILL BOONE because he · runs a · bridge club in ·New
Orleans. .
Q. Y.1hat club?
A. A bridge club.
Q. •rhe cardgame Bridge?
A. Yes, at · ll7 University ' Place. BILL BOONE hasbeeriup -

there to play bridge and he . kn?W him through bridge
··: :·....·· playing. And he might know GENE DAVIS just very
casually, very casually. But I don't know _if he's ever
met this other guy. .... ..
Q. Before we get too far off th3 subject of BILL BOONE, do

you know, I want to make sure we're pronouncing and
spelling _that right, do you .know how to spell it?
A. Like Daniel Boone.
Q. Like Daniel Boone.

'•
A. B-0-0-N-E.
Q. __E.gbt. Can you tell us some more names of· any homo-
sexuals that you knew in New Or]eans?
A. AMOS McFARLAN, CANDY LEE. I don't know where CANDY'S

at right now; CANDY knew them all, CANDY knew GENE,
GENE DAVIS. I don't know if she knew this other one.
Q. What did she do, was she a stripper or what? ~-

v/'
A.
-·She worked at the back bar at Tony Basina's, CANDY LEE.
Q. Do you know if she knew CLAY BERTRAND?
A.
Q.
-
No, I'd have noway of knowing whether she knew him.
But she knew DAVIS?
A. . Oh, yeah. I'm -sure~ .. And there's __ that -big fat _ gal: ·_that ·
~ " : used to "'run around the bar, everyb.o dy -called her WANDA.
I've seen BILL BOONE in there talking to her. So ' I
she kn_?Y:y~~~ILL.
t,.
-1;•· .
' -10-' . ·. .
.~ ~ . ··~ .
:nw 12640 Doc d: 59'168006 · Page 180 '

Q.
•
Where is Wanda's Bar?
··'.·
A. On Iberville .betweEn Royal and Bourbon, I don't know the

e x act address, right next door to that -garage where you
can park and the de par tmen t store. ·
Q. Exactly where? ;
A. On Iberville between Royal and Bourbon.
Q. Okay, did you know .DAVID FERRIE?
A. I don't recognize the name.
Q. bid you ever know LEE ijARVEV OSWAI.D7

. .....
·:: ~ :· .··..: • ,."n ' '''• • ' - ~- •• > ....
A. No. But
B:ERTRAND
,living jn by -mistake and this guy
~i.n Dallas who shot OSWALD. RUBY
Q.le .man~ They came -by
__ .:, . ...
:,
Q. ._How could they do that by ·-

·" ...~:-.. .'
·-~'o. j_ \" • • .:~ : , .• ·;., ' ' •
A. Well, ·I ·sure hate · to involve :'ole WALTER WILSON ·; ~~-\~~y . ':.· .

· ..,of this because he was: the guy I 1 i ~d with ou know · ~~d t>
he ran the bridge club. · You all· can verify this :.with.. ·_·:-
him if he's .· still . in New Orleans. I don.'.t -know -you see~- .. ,__
I've - been locked up in this place going on seven years~ ··
.,!?ILL BOONE owned some property on the corner of st._ - ··.. ·,~ .
..,-Peter and Dauphine • . Being from New Orleans you probably
know the place. . It 1m four apartments in- ;i.. t. ,. But :
although I:-e owns the place, he doesn't manage :- it. _ ::;·0~-·,: ,:
the corner qf Bourbon and St. Peter there's a Chines~ .<'- . <;
lady a·n d don • t ask me her name •. :: I .couldri' t · remember -i t . -·
and she manages this property. · _Now me and WALTER WILSON .
we went to Miami sometime in July 1958. and we came back '·
in September sometime -and this is when I met MR.:BOONE
on the boat. Now this is sometime in Septemberof :1960.
Meanwhile . I · had 1 i ved in Miami, Atlanta and Macon, :./~ ... ,
Georgia. Now me and .MR. WILSON are back in New Orleans ·.
and we rent an apartment from MR. BOONE, the Chinese
. lady; but it.is MR. BOONE'S apartment • . , Gave the ·chinese
lady the rent. After we were living there for about.~>
this guy EDDIE who works for MR. BOONE carne by there and
said hello, you know. - -He 1.vanted to borrow some bedsheet
from me. And I said sure and I loaned hirri a bedspread,· · · .
some sheets and pillowslips and he brought them back a ' ·
couple of days later; they were laundered real nice and
he said thank you and I said thank you • . But there were
. --:· .
a lot of comings and goings . in · the other apartment but
· I didn't know what was going on~ I didn't pay it no mind
But I thought they were going in there tricking, having
sex. I seen EDDIE going in their with the kids hustling
I figured that one time. But there was all kinds of · J: ·...
people going in that place • . So I lived in that one . . . ,
apartment for one monf::h. liieJ-f-el happened to be going (c ) .
past there arrl I saw . EDDIEt'in there cleaning up and do'in
things and I looked in there and it was a much nicer
apartment and I said why don't you let me rent this
_ apartment. EOD!El said I don't see why not. It's not so .
_ -:
7
,~0 ·.~,_
: •• .. . : :: =:···:_ .· ~~<::_h_ : -~~>.wa..~ -~ nic~eE, ,- ;r __j_~?-~.--.~iked ~-!=: . tq~re·_~- -~ ''_: · :t t,_..~a~ ·:on~.- _·: 1-__
big room •. My rent was up .in two or three days so I · askep ' .. . •.
WT about 1t and he said it's only $10.00 more so go ahead~ .- ~
. ~ .; . . ,h ; . ~-~-~~~~:-.:~~:
:nw 12640 Page 181

-.: -;. -11,;.:.-,_ . . .; · . . .-~ :~:J~\:.it.lm:~~ :ii~:-~_-i:
ll~~"i;;f
'>&ill' .
-·
!I
!I
!! e
Q. WT?
A. WALTER THOMAS WILSON. He won't his name, just

a couple of initials. So
to the other apartment.
pight or bvo when here · comes this
--~E· he had a key. He said well
-+~~re.. d I said well how
_l!_C::· ~r~8~?:.·R-t-~A~n~d~I~~w~a~s~s~u~r~p~r~i~s~e~d~t::.:o~s~e~e~h~l=:.m2::~b:e~c~a~u~s~e~I~h~a;::~~~
~ 1me but I still knew
And he said what are
xou wa1 o meet BIL . · And I said no
Jj~~~s~a~i~d~~o~u~l~l~·v~e~w~i~th~-=B~I~L~L~?--~A~n~d~6-~~~~~~m~o~v~e~d~;i~n~
tt~Ee· He walked out. He had im.
Q. ·who do you mean by BILL?
A. BILL BOONE • . When he' said do you live with BILL well he
thought I had, well ••• . you all .work'.: with the D .. A.'s
. office, you know how i t is with homosexuals. Evidently,
if. you're investigating this you're dealing with GENE
and them. He thought. then I split up with WT and had
moved .in with BILL BOONE;. ··
Q. Now c~n you de~crib~ the man he had with him?
A. Just a ., dapper li.l ' ole man •.
Q. A what :1il'ole man?·
A. A dapper.
Q. Was he wearing a hat?
A. ·. :u:eah,. he was. One of·those straw hats with the short

. bill on it.
Q .. Short band?
A. No.
Q. Short crown?
A. Short crown. ·
Q. About ·how tall was he? ·
A. Therewe go again. What · I call short.
Q. How short?.
A. Oh, I'd say about 5'6" or 5'6~"~ About this man's size
her, but a 1 it tle bit paunchier. (Indicating BILL MARTIN
A lot older than
. ' .
you.
Q. He's older than I am and he • s my height. What age would

you say·he is?
A. About WT'S age. But that don't strike up nothing.
Q. Give us close as you can to how old you think he was?
... -=----···-- . ··- -·

:._ ____ ' .::.- . ·. '-;· · . ·-:::- -.. . -. -
.·-.... ;
.r. ~
' \
.~12~ .· .
• _; ~-> •.
·:"' ;•
!I
'I --=- \ ·;-:-· . .
I • • l·
1!
II A. About 45. ·
i! · ..
1: Q~ Did he keep his hat on the whole tirne.he was. th~re? :
A. Hewas only there ab~t three minutes.

I Q. Was he wearing glasses?
I A. No, he wasn't.
Q. Anq he weighed a little more than Mr. Martin?
A. He was heavier.
-._. _
. .. . . ·-
We ought · to have the record show that. I'm 5'8!z" (Wm. : ...
I " -· ·
Mdtl:.·tin) and also .he . said . he was about
weight except ~he . 'had a ..hat on~
height 'a nd ..
- .•.,
.i ·;. _
~ . . .
--~-- ~ .:
I' You haven't

I . - - ~ _: i_\ -~~ ~ .' • ~
How .'· ~uch d;· y~~·.:;~lgh

. . ' i'· ....~ ;·::·, ~.
'"1.> ·- - /~{:·._ - ·
· About · 170 (Mr. '.' .Mar

I . _ ·_; ·_
I A. ~ . . So .I
Q~ , ;
I
i •. •. -~ . .:. .• . .• '
.A •. . ~- ·- Nice · looking' fellovi~ :,. 'A_ reaJ. nic~ .

· sa.Y dapper; •· I mean · dapper. He "Was all dressed up,. ·
you know .. .;.: suit • . He ·was wearing a black suit. · .. ,
II '-.. :·:·- < ,.: _, .
I Q. ,_;:-· ·,. :·· · · Alright.; how was · BERTRAND 'dressed? .·.

.. ·. -
A.
. . -. : . ·· .··.··:· -. -
Q. Was i t a li.gh t or ·dark suit
'' •. ,.-~- r~,: :>:;·'· ;:_:;,
A. It'sfU:riny. I can remember.what ~uit this'other.guy had
on but -can't remember that, but I'lL · · ·. · · · : · I
I just: don't knowwhat.this was
I I ever seen CLAY BER
I ..QP, ·dressed . up in a suit • . Everytime I
I DAVIS~ he was dressed like a bu.m. .;. ·· ''

: . .· ·. . .
I a. Did you ever :;,pend any time around Dallas? ..

·.:.:. -·:::... ·
II A.
Never beem to. Dallas.
- :: ': ...
' I~ - I
Q. You've never been to Dallas? ''

,··: • ! . ~ .
-
-_~ ..
i A. That • s right . ... ·· ·
i Q. .You'll can stay aroundhere and talk for a while and

I'm goi~g to go out and get some pictures.
,I
(Martin: .to Boxley) ·Very good. You •ve got. the whole set that I
I sent you plus some others?
Q. (Boxley) Yes. Are you going to make notes for me?

·- - -: :- . ·- -·-·· .· .. .. ····· . - ·._··.:.:- -· ,,- · :- ~·- .-.. -·. --~- . .. . . .
A. (Morris) ; Y.OU Ire not USed to ' thiS heat?
Q. ,.. Uh? . :',: ·

I . ·'
NW 12640 Do]Id:591~~~06
I!
Page 183
J!
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n -14-
II
1/
A. You Ire not used to. this heat. I haven• t been in an air
con~ioned ·room going on seven years~ It don't phase
/! me.
·I
Q. Is that right.
A. Yeh, it's bothering you.
Q. IJave you stated here in this interview when you came

here, what date it was when you were first arrested?
A. I was arrested on January 1, 1961.
Q. .And have you ever been free since then? .
A. Yeh, I made bond. But the last free day I saw was
February,6, 1961. That was the last free day I. saw
it: will probably be the last free day. I see for three
four more years.
Okay, now to get back to the other·

knew BERTRAND •.. Now are you pretty
· your memory on t:ha t? Do you know anyone .in
who ruay have known this man CLAY BERTRAND?
' ' '
A. No, Sir~ I don • t. Now 'let me explain how this situation

goes. The three times rmet him at .the Masquerade Bar I
it, was,· GENE DAVIS took me all three times,·. . i t was kind
I of a thing be tween us, and then we went straight from
there to MR. DAVIS 1 apartment" GENE DAVIS,. well. _
actually, i t was kind of ••• very private, you know what
I mean. ·It wasn • t like going. to a big party with 100
' '', ' .· ' ' ' j·
I·
people-there and CLAY BERTRAND was there. Now this g.uy
EDDIE who worked for BILL BOONE ..... ·
---..
I Now about EDDIE ••• tell me something about him.·
I Q.
I
A. Whenever he \<las introduced .to you, he was BILL
flunky, and this is it.
Q. · .· About BILL BOONE .....
A. I '11. tell you who elSe I met •. BILL B?ONE ihtroduced. t~ . ·.·-.-•.
me. , I met ••••• 1 t doesn • t have anyth1ng to do w1 th th1s ·
·•· •• he used to come down every year and ·visit with him •••.1 ··
Tennessee Williams •.
Q .. TENNESSEE WILLIAMS knew BILL BOONE? Visited him, was

intimate friends with him?
A. They were intimatefriends. They were in 1958 or 1959

and '60. He was famous then, he's got a little more
famous now. ·That's who showed up, TENNESSEE WILLIAMS. j
Q. Did vou ever run across, in all the f~iends of BOONE,
BERTRA_]!I)_~_s_and_SHAW • ~___ilid_¥Q'\.l....§verrun across a La t1n
---
Arne r i ~C!,!L___t.all...,.__sp.anish__spe ak i n g_~_t__ he_ _spok~ng I 18 h I
_Wllh a very heavy SJ.J.ani s~cent. ~- ---- .I
A. . Now
got, cause -~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~-t~~HQ~~
irL_8_epl:embe r~_.uJ.-.--.:t:-rree-~ep..cei ~~.:wt.'tei:t-::t---:WBn-:b...-G~:.--t~.
>·and. I· wrote
Yes •
.-r------~
·, . ~- :
.--~_:: ~!1
. ____ ,
: •:. • :· •
·:-
e
•• 1_
·--·· :.·
. , -15:- ·..
·.. ..·-
·. -::··> ;-~-
~
• J . ..,. :-- · .... --

·-· : ..
. ·.·
. .
A. I know a cuban cause :i lived in Miami~ ·~ .sbmehow I can'"-'
__lust tell thra differnee bot:.I• aen a Cnhan and a ;MQxic<u}. 7
I Q• . Can you · tell · the difference beb.·.roon a Cuban- ~ · a

--v-;nezuelan or a Cnhan and a ••• .
.,__ ·.
': .. ··
A. _A_"!!_, no A ·You mi ght have me there"-
Q. J~rell, ·. I
·ust wante ou describe
-§is Latin American for roe? Prim~riJy, · what was his a.ge,
approximately?
- ·.
A. ' He . was approximately 22. He -was young •.. . He wasn't •••

uh, . I. -_just figured i t was somebody BILL was·••• you know.
·· .·_._
Q. .· ·-.~ ·. . Uh ~~h. . :. " );·_:~::. · ·.' . ·-·
A.
Q. · .
·. · Y?~i~~t~;;.f~~r,.":~,~~~~;!~~? . .
-Uriders tand ; ::i::\.Are · you) ariy :,relation to
·. .. , _._ ._
. Baton:\ Rouge '):)_i .S,the ;n'a me:..-·af · PERRY<Russo
Q.
.•:.:l·~~;;111l~~~~~,;h"ltttt: ~:rli~·· ~· ,•·
·. .• ;., ·, i~:e~~~i~~~~JH~n~5 s ~~!'. ~~~ ·~~0~~=~ .• ~:~i~;c:n~ i~~~~hcl .
. A. . . "'~' :. Any -relation?.
Q• .
.. ; -~
·. '··.. ' ' you might be . a ' relation .. to ··him .-_ and I .didn It know anytfui !g
: '::f,> ab_o;; ~·~~;E):;¢:\';~ii~ '\:0·' ( ' ...•' :,.v~{ ::;>: .•·. ·•·• ,: ,
-· ~ .' . .· A~ --~": _ --' Oh, ·. no.
, The only kinfolk ' I _got _: in · my :mama My daddy __:
is stillalive, ibut he ;_-disapp·e~red years ago;. My mama, _
.. ·. tWo c:nints _:and . ~y : grandp~: ...~: ' I hav~n It even .g ot· any : . , .
. brothers;·o:'~br_i~ sisters. the :only child and my m~~er 's. ·
the · o~ly ··child • .- . .· :::: __:. -- . "
·._ ·.. · . .. . . . ··-,.
Q.
... .. ~- ~ ·:.-~· .
. Welf,·,: . . :I _•ve
go-t some ~ n3al . dist2mt ones b~t _ they cert~i~l
. wouldn I t: -: be named RUSSO~ I}m ·.· .the _only . disrespectful·: . on;e .:
in my :O,., fa~~ly.; ~. :.: ., _ : '~:_-:})(J;:~{·,:;:- -~ -· · _ . .. _ '·.:. , ... . . .. . . . , ,~·:··
:._ .. Q. I .didn' .t .: mean to irripiliy or relate .the name . RUSSO wit:h -.
. ...:.:: ·.
disrespec~;. ... ,_. "· .
. .. ·:·
•'. . . ·~· -~;:·. ···.': ... . _-.:~ .-:~-~- .~.
__ -~. .·• .
A •. Oh, . no. ·' There's nothing wrongwith the · name RUSSO but· .. ·
.. · • ·. •. • . _l -_ •. l . .
I 1 m from ':: Tennessee,and peopleupthere, yqu know, •••

it 1 s a .common- name down ,there in .Louisiana, but in
Tennessee,· I can 1 teven say that I've even heard the
·> ..
name.
·.,
. . ... .. . ···.
. .. ;
.. .. ... ·... '
Q. I see ·~ •• ··
·· · '·
A. of course, itmight •• :rthinki ·.read the name · in. the

paper: in the New Orleans bit.' : You see when I get ·a paper
its two - or threedays ·· old and it 1 s all cut up and all.
Q. can you remember anyone else in the New Orleans area~ I

-------· -·· ---
.. .
-- ~ - ..._-.·.:_.: as__i_<;!El. __i :f:rorn. . Tf!,~E?SEE _WIL:LIAMS-·-y(l).O used -- to - kno~r. BOON~?_.- _,:1:; ~
._ .- _;:_ __".: :,;:: --::; ~:~ <:.::~:~-~~~:·;:-:;.::· ·:;.':·· .~ -::: ·· ·:· -:< -~-:-_- ·A • • . . . .- - • .; _··---:_~,;.:~ : : ' : ' • . : -:· -:~:; :~_; '_~::·.:_· ~c !.-._. !<-----·:..··-· --- ·•....~.: • .
• \ 'r ·:_~:~:-·· '¢ ~ -·. ~ . .. · . .
;·,:, 591::~'ji-iz;:'1;~~f~:.·~>-.," _,·., ._. _.co·.

I
-16-
CHRIS GOODYEAR worked for him but CHRIS GOODYEAR left

town \vhen BILL BOONE sold the Masquerade Bar.
Do you know if BILL BOONE ever sold the apartment you we~e
I
living in?
IA. I have no idea. He might have sold i t in 1960.
Q. Dcj you know if he was a mtive New Orleanian or ••• ?
A. HE1 ~.vas
from the Ttifcst caas.J;.__,_ He lived on the West C~tG
(~~riz-B0o~d on the West coast.
·-·-------
Q. What kind Q_f__,yJork had he done, hJYestments .had he mad.e o·.r1
~~~-<ii~e. thing? . _
];_!:__just ney_er vas d:i scus..sed. He was just. one of those ·

_Jcind of guys, I suppose. Always wore a little white
sailor hat, a little white cap. yon know, I'll .teJl }l_ou
something else· about.him. He wears a toupee. He's
been badly burned at one time or another.
Q. TNJ:mre? On _what part of the body?·

... . ·~
A •. I never seen hi~ undressed. ·But he's got some on his . ·
head, _on his arms.
Q •. Ho\v can you tell?
A. You··just have to look.
Q. Scars?
- .I
A. Scars, he's got plenty sc~rs.
.... ·_,
Q. _Are they obvious?
If he's at a distance, he could get by. But if .you

shake him.down pretty good; you can see them.
Q. What age mart_is he?
A., .Well at the time I khew him he was pretty close -to 60
years old.
About 60.
I Q •.
A. He wasn't no young man ·then.
Q. Burned on his face ahd ••• ?
A. Well, his forehead. It looks like he might have had a

little plastic surgery done on his face due to the burn
and his head, he wears a toupee though.
Q. A complete toupee?
A. No, no, he. might wear a complete one now. He wore one
like that (indicating top of head). In other words,
got a bald crown.
Q •. in':· _o the.r \-lords, ·a: bald crown _with . a rring_Ef. ~: .
. A. And he's brown headed and he wears a brown toupee. He's

tall •••
•.: '
-17-
!!
III)
Q. Is he burnt -. on the arms?
A. He's just burnt, on his arms, his hands •••
His hands .. _And he'd be about 60 now, you say?
A. 1\bout 60.
Q. You started to give a physical description of him.
A. 1/\Toll, I can give you a pretty good one of him because

he is so tall. He 's taller than I am, _while most
people aren't. So he's 6'3" or 6'4"~ He's ·skinny •••
I ~ . ;
chii1 ..
I Q. Alright, · I've got some pictures here and I'd like

I 7-:s; look at them and without +-ux;ning them over look .•
I ___
._ . and tell me if ·you know any of these men
.:! _
I A •. .· Well, . now. I'd be a smooth fool if I didn It ' teil you

. ·._ ., . .
I that's JACK RUBY. You can see the Dallas Police thing. ··
· l:l/24/63; After all ••• ,_: .. , .\ :' -<~:
.. .: . . ;
: . ,.
.: . -
-~ .
Q. Can . you make out a~y ~f.· the othersi?

A. · I,_ _slon' t know anybody '· ' ..
) ft pause) Boy,. ·if . that's him, · he's

he's on dope habit, more 'n . . ·.
. ... . ...
;.··
_, : .. . ·' '·
.. . . ~
... ::·::
·~ - ~; :. ·.•. ;
·. . .. . .·
Q. _.• !f~.:. ., -~-.- -_ . ~ .
... ·-·
,_ :
.• , A. ·, CLAY . BERTRAND. ··_He has aged. course ·that could be •••

l-Ie's aged a lot .. course thats ... It's been seven yeal::..§_~ _.
I This one, this one, this one, this one - I'd say definiteli .
I I I ve never seen them. but ·. this one, now that could be . .
-C_LAY BERTRAND, the man GENE DAVIS introduced me to a~
SLAY BE.E_TRANDa... ·' . - :; <. . ...•
. · -·: . '· .
..NQuld you read in to tha microphone the number of this ' ·

an<;L___th.;_da te of tbe man you iden ti fjg:d as maybe he i~ .
CLAY BERTRAND?
A. 125-388 and then the date is the third months. the first
day of 1967.
: . '
; ..
Q. What does it say about it?

1-
A. New Orleans, Louisian-a.
Q. Is it a mug shot?
A. I '\re____b_aen mugged myss;:lf. and i t looks like one tQ..__m§.
Thanks. Let the rec~rd show that the photograph~

identified was that taken of CLAY SHAW on tbe date of hiS-
-arrest in this; investigation. ·I
Now this· man here . . does he 1 oak to you 1 ike the man taa t
BERTRAND brought to yonr apartment by mi stak~. ?
A§ I stated he had a_b..a..t_on...
Jet's cover:_ up the to:e of his

in a sui t:__igu recall, so let's
, ,. _ ,
-- ;, ,,::::
.• 'r ' . • :. :~ .-
-18-
That very well coulU be him~ I just · couldn't swear on

it.
Okay~
You know what · I mean?
Alright let me show you a different group of pictures

and you can tell me if any of these •••
,. -•• ~;to •the picture you just identified as possibly being the
'·t;~;-al~7ho \'las taken by mi s take-to--¥ml a artment. Would
:Vciu · read the ;:; in f ormr.ttion on the :po~~ card?
. .
A. Dallas Police 36D98. llth...J:nonth, · 2~ .
--·--~ - . . '. ·: ' .
X::?_t the record show thatthe photograplLjust been .· ..

is that taken o:E ,TACK I?.IJBY on the da t:.e--'"'o....f__.............-'-t-
:i.r~en tified
--
arrest following the assassination.
Here's another group of pictures. Do you

any of these people? · .,
(Very long silence) .- . -- : - '
. : .. . .
' ·. . ~. -::-; --, . ;' -. ~. ·.
A~
:
'I'hat boy • s .name · is Davis. · ,..

. . ·. '::,' · ·.:· -' _ .._·' _-· ~· . ,:. .. . ·..
. · -· . . . ·.·.
Q. DAVID? ..·
'• . ..: . .- ,-.
. . - ·,
..: -~ · -
A. Dl\VID. ,·
•; < ___ :
Q. ~\There 9-id you know him from? .· .. i·
A •.. I know him from New Orleans. ·-·.-· :

.- .- -------
Q. Do you knmv what he did in New orleans?

. . '
A•. Now, I just se€m. ·•• yeah, . him. He hustled, · . on .the. ~ • . . "
Q. vlhat do you mean hustled, was he a homos~xu~l? He ··

recruited or arranged dates or what? What do.you mean
by hustler? It · means a lot of different things to a . lot
of people.. I'd iike to know what you meari .by . it? . .. . . .
A. Just ·going around and having sex with homosexuals and

anybody who'd · pay · hirn ••• to make · some money. ·.. That's what
he did. DAVID, I believe that ••• except those whiskers,
he never had whiskers. I believe that's aboy· named
DAVID I used to know who was a hustler in .New Orleans.
Would you know the last name if you heard it?
A. Try five names and I'll see if I could pick i t out.
Q. Alright, let me give you some.
DAVID FINLEY?
No.
IQ. DAVID HALSEY?
..·.:;
·IA. ~ No. ;. -. _.. . -. .: ....-.'_
.--:~- _-. --:-. ·: ..... ~ - - _. ..
. --- .. . . ---- .:-r:::
·,,
....... "'·'·"'·"··;
••,. 'I
n
II -e··
I .
I
il
Q.
DAVID DURAND?
,'..-,
..
.··>..·.
A. No.
1\
Q. DAVID GRIFFIN?
I
II
A. ].\fo.
DAVID GUTHRIE?
I Q ..
I A. No.
'
-~-
I
Q. DAVID GERMAINE? Okay.
A. Boy, this is hard.· ·I .know his name was DAVID~ I' 11

tell. yo~Xall that. Now_I don't know his name .might not.
:_:._-,.
even _be DAVID.. · · -:::•£'<·'"· -···
_. ·.: . r . . . . _ .. . ,_ .. ~--J>:_.;.~:L;J"L ~- .~\.k~:.-f:'~W:':..:: . .· : .· "
Q. .For··the record·'you 've_·been . talking<;about,;-'~.,photograph ·. ·
A~ --~~~
a.· . .. ·~DALLAS GRIFFIN GUTHRIE.":< Photograph made . Tn . '·
··o :...... ;· Police-Department. No.--: 40 54T in 1966 •
·-- -----=----- . . ... . . .. ·" -.-- .; .•...; :·=.~::··.:·•.": i<!. ·, ••
' ..'.·>:<· ~:~:,~::··\~:~:.·-~,~;-:-~: ·:.: . )~\-:::.~:~ :-. ' ' :··: r..;;;_··;~,·.:, . -~·.-' ·::\~·f ;<' • -.'' ..- 1 ,· ," .'' ,.
A. ·. .Well;: when ·I ·knew this guy,·

•: . . t ~~. ~ -~-7':\ ~~~:; ~~·. • '~--~ . . :_:::'.-:;' :~ .- ··. /•
r •'," ' ':,; •
·. . :.:·.·_..~ ~:--->\;_"·. ·._
.· Q. . · .. ·.·. · Alright'~''{i}'Did ,YQU ever hear the'name.ofa.man called
' GOROON:.NOVEL? · --· . ! .
·•.... . -.~
··~ ;
~. :>~ (:::·,~----:~- ··.: .. -__ ·._. . ._- --~-
·A. No, I- say. that~ •• I'm almost certain • .;..

. ·. ,..-
- .. ... ' ;-... ·: :<,:..:.·: ..~· ·...
. Q .·>>. :· .. :: .._.;. 0::_:GOROON :NovEL,:~_-he 's a: .irerich Quarter. habit_{lae"/,· a ba~:·:i{.
. _... _.• owner,.>etc ,· --~ :.~:?~-
..·. .. ..
', • .·
. · Do Y()U w;:m t t'6 a look' at ·.·one last. group_
.. . ..
~ke '.- ~ ' ..
~f ·picture~
·Do. you :know. any of these people?
·" .
A. Never.sawany of saw 'any' of th~m
. be fore • : ·. · · .. · ·
- .<:
Q. ·Have heard
·· ....
Nope, I've never heard i it-~··.

' . ;:
A.
-- ,·:;,-::,£( :-.>r?i
Q. Have you ever had occa-;,;ion to-.meet an ttorriey who

sometimes ·-would. take cases. of h~mosexuals~·who were ·' I .
arrested er have you ever been 1.ntroduced:to .an attorney,
·.. of that kind who would help you ·out of trouble· if you I
evergot in any of that. kind? . .
··.-.. '.---
A. (shakes head in .the negative).·
Q. ·Have you ever done any female impersonations? .:

:·;:_ j
A. :No; never. I'm just · not that:type of,.you know·'·: •• ;

.I've just never done ·it.; Besides, I·'rn slightly too
,.hairy. ~~
1 Q. Let's get a physical descrjptiQD. one mare time. of the

_ __
7
man you met aS CLA.Y l3ER'l'~_ANU. How teill do ¥0~ ...
-•.,• •• • • •• • , ,. ····-·~···.;,·.-:, • 1 •• h ·•;• •· -· --·~·...., ,.- •• ••--••·on•,• ··.•.···· :;:-;-·· ~ - .-.·;:-;,·,oco;,.:-::.:•~-;_·•'-.:'..·.:<."___ --;'" · ,-.·- - :.~ •-~ ,._., ,..,.-
···~. ~ . '··:c·~;···• ..· ·., .... ., . · "';c·-.;;· ;· , •. · .. "-·.-::-·: .. ,_,_.,,. ........... ,. o;..;c·.. ,-... ,, ...·;;c·:=cc--;::.- ,.· ... ·:.. .... ::;:.-.-.•.. ; ... :... ... ..
~Q.Jg~u~-Q~~A~~~:.~~~~~~~
,II'
- ,,
• "
lj
-20- .
'"!' ~ 'i
A. About my height.
,,
J! Q. Which is what? ·
•i
j
A. __ W_c->11, I'm appro:ximaWy 6'. He might be just a little
bit shorter than me......~_s.ome.shor..ter.
. ---·-··· . . . I.
I
Q. 1\..__iitt~o~you. Ok.Q.y, and how much WQ_~·
§_~y__h.e_w.e.ighs ? .
A. He was stocky and well built, about 180. He had a nice

. t~U:ITt fo:r_a_man his age. And T'd__s_ay he was about 35
_9J::_Ao_y.pars oJd and he Has buiJd nice for his age .. At
_J,~-~!§_LL.tbongh.t.-- so. . ., -
Q. Okay, he was 35 to 40, a little bit short~r than
_<:1Jlli-==cficlh;
te ve · a fn] 1 head of hair,
I
·.· ·...
I A. . He had a head ~f hair.
~-
.
. ... .
Q. _Alright. whatcoJor? ·· , '< .

A. Kind of reddish-br~wnich-grey. you ·know what I - m~an.
.------ ....·.. ·~:
Q. _ _yeah. and did be carry his weight. ·. Hav much would you
say he -~j__gh_e_d_?__ .: ~ ..
------ : .· '
A. .. . ..·· ·
)
Q. 100 and what?
A. About 180. ·_,.,___ ·.:: ,",-
Q. Okay.. One thing that I wanted to . ask you •• .: Do you .·. . . . '
know if any of these men that we talked about so far ·
who knew CLAY BERTffi ND, do you know if any of these
people had a police record of any kind? . .. '' .·
. A. I wouldn't know whether they .did or whet~e~ they didn 't..
You don't know. , . .

' .. . ~ .\
1 ···.
. · . : · '·
~- .
I . have no . i(J.ea. ·
. .. I
Q. Now before we conclude . this interview, I'd like to a~k I
you if you have any objections al: all to the· way this "
interview was conducted and whether or not i t was given
of your own free will? .
A. It was given of my own free will, and uri, i t turned ou

pretty fair, I thought.
Q .. Than:i<. you • ..
Q. Thank you, Mr. Harris.
THIS INTERVIEW WAS CONCLUDED AT 14 MINUTES AFTER 5, P.M., 12th

DAY OF JULY, 1967. CONDUCTING THE INTERVIEW WERE MR. WILLIAH
BOXLEY OF Trill DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, ORLEANS PARISH, AND
WILLIAM. Ro MARTIN, . ASSISTANT DISTRICT.. ATTORNEY . OF .ORLEANS
I
. . . .
.···.· •.· . PARISH. '..
I__ . · -
'
,··
•. ·: ··.
NW 12640 Do Id:59168006 Paqe 190

. ....·.. ····-··· .
. .. ...
.· ·
..·:. .' .,
. -·
11
0.K. I 1-rouJd. like to direct this to either th e District Attorn2y's
Office or the Intelligence Unit of the New Orleans Police Department~
'l'he informa t :i. on J am about to give is confidenti a l, of course, that

. .
t s
\·;hy I am ca1l :ing this number. HoHever, all this information is not
only true but: e: o.rrect, and can ·be verified by . just a small . amount of
. . ..
investigation which I'm sure the New Orleans Folic~ Police Depa~tme~f
. :: ~·
'\·;ill give thi s inform2.tion~ .

. .
There are 2 subjects that I feei Mr. Garrison has over looked iri .his
. recent probe of the Kennedy Ass assination v;hich vrould be of utrnos t
a subject by the name of who lives at 521 ST. LOUIS

STREET, New Orl~ans, Louisian a . This is in the Frendh Quarter. His
·. . .
telephone number is 525-1380. Now this subject is a Geologist, and
•'
~ graduate of L S U~ He had be~n recently char ged last ye ar with
·1 Also another subject, his name is one
CHb~ EY, however, he goes by the name of . {I believe
.- -~-=- __.,...,==--~:..-~~
this is the spelling ). This subject is a school teacher ·at·

JOHN CURTIS CHRISTIAN SCHOOL in Metairie. He rooms with this subject
~---
Tl-IOl-iPSON. Both these subjects are homosexuals - this is a fact .:..

they are both homosexual~ and hav~ been living tog~ther for years.
··- -----------------
T'ni s killing , murder - what ever 'y ou \-Jant to call it, ·.took place
at ·1435 NO. JOHNSON STREET on April 12~ 1967~ .DERIS E. THOMPSON
\•Ias charge,d \·:ith murder. Their part in the Kenne dy Assassination _.
plot - both these subjects, I kn6w fof a fact as very close ~ntir~
-- ··-...;.. ·
friends 1.·ri th I;EL CU:_ y SHAW. I· have seen th en go into his apa~!.t
·, -- . .
in the French Qua.rter on numerous occasions and ·\·Jere con stan~ th

·this subject ~o its a fact. To state furthe~ w6uld be ~he fact that
both these subjects possess a large nlll7!b er of firearr,,s and explosiyes
---·-~.,..---
- - -- .. . ... - . - -· .. - .. ·.- ·. ' _ .. . · -.. - - ! - - : · . -~ - .. : . .. .. -· .
.
.
~·
.
.
. . -~ ~
~-.
.• .· .
· -·:
...'
I
, .... "'
'
..
Mr. .L. o···1t!

(Ilt..J !.l ..c c• on. .
~-;~.._ 0\'IDS over 150 hand gun~' - by hand guns I mean
pistols and revolvers plus a hrnnber of high power rifles - plus
'
explosives at this-address at 521. Explosives in the form of half
~-----------------·----------------~ .
sticks of dyn.cuaite. Nm·.r anbt.her interesting fact is that not only
do they hanij. lt:L th l·'Ir o Clay SheJ:r but he knovrs them very_ \·rt;J J and tbey
~~~---~-'------
have gone to his apartment numerous. times. Bo~_h thes__?_§__~_Q_j_~_

_ct,s .'\·Jere
also well known to MR. DAVID FERRIE up on Louisiana Avenue. If you
would check Mrn Thompson's
....
personal phone book you find Mri Ferrie
. -·
.,-------'------· .. ----
listed as well as Mr. Clay Shaw; so I think both of these would be
- -~---- ---·-····. _. ---------·: ==--=-·=------------..·-·-····-···------···------
... =--=-·-·::;:·--:::::;----=---::::-
of interest.· SOLIEAEU is a H/I:i approx. 30 yrs. vrhile THOI·-'IPSOH is

33 yrs. They spoke on occasions to great detail about the Kennedy
Aciministration.
If you do a small amount of investigf.:tion v1hich I'm sure that the
New Orleans Police Department will do - as they ha~e in the past.
You will uncover a great deal of facts which will help Mr. Gartison
as ·t-rell as the Intelligence Unit. n
ttThank You For Your Cooperationo•o~.n
"This· is the same pc-.rty that called earlier about tho:se 2 subjects·
at 521 Sto Louis Street. I would also like to report that I failed
to gi~e some information that both these subjects are members of an
. ·-organization called SPARTICIST ASSOCIATION. They make these meeting
. -~'-'-------
once every 2 or 3 weeks ~ they are familiar with several of the
-
leaders of this organization. It should be interesting t6 note that
being homosexuals and living in that apartment together for several
months before living at this· address they lived at 1435 NO. RD:EEXci.':"~illX
JOHNSON STREET.
------------ .. ____They lived there together for approx. 3~ years in
--:..
the same b~droom. A good description of THOMPSON would be approx.

,
5 '11 11
, 16.0 lbs. _bl;lc
~
1K h.ea d ea, ana, bl ue -.
eyes.. --ROG-c'':)~.
wn SOLIE;\.EU -is
.... apno~x
• · .....
·--··- - ....
- --- -----·-- ····-···.··· -----:-···---·---7-- ..
. --. - -- ·- ···-- . '
-· -r-~
'i.
!
l
-~ . --
--
•• ~ ·--·· -· •• - O';i. • - ' . ·- .• '-· • • '
iM 12640 : Docirt·: 591;68006 .. )?ag~- -192 ':·_-

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5'11 11 , 165-lbs. black headed and blue eyes - he teacih~s at JOHN .

CUHTIS CHHIST'IAtr SCHOOL Vihich is a Christi"m school for boys and
I tr·" s1.1re
~.J. • ')C'
(.1,.._) t:.~~
,, 1-r~·,oc-exu"l
<..l~'
li'.\ .....Jll .
..__) he 1 s at a very good place \·rhere he can r:'.ake
several cdntac~s with the younger boys. I find that ·the owner of
John Curtis School himself is a homosexual. I wonder if any of
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the parents of these children knm·1 the caliber of men not only
teaching at this institution bit _the people who actually own it
themselves o THCI-'iPSOl'-J, I believe, is on parole or probation \·Ji th that
.___ .,_·. ·--~---~~----.:=~-~··· --
local chapter here in New Orleans on Royal Street; and I'm sure if
you check with him he would be able to tell y6u quite a bit of other
information. He does have a large.amount of hand guns and has
loaned these guns out at times to certain cha~acters who ~.are not
,·
of.the best charactero

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So if you put out an investigation - espicially about the·explosives -

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I am su~e it will.yeild you the benifit of your trou~le. I am hoping
to see an investigation come forth. n
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ttThank You Again For Your Trouble & Your Help ••••• "
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NW 1264<i Docld:-59168006 Page 193 1:""
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MEHORANDUH
March 31, 1969
RE: SHAvl LEADS 1\Till'lBER II.
TO:' ANDRE~vJ. SCIAJ'IIBRA, ~'1ILLIAM R. ALFORD, LOUIS IVON

and GARRISON-ALCOCK
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
I. LEON GUIDRY:
This man is indicated in Bethell's Extract of

Commis.sion Documents #75 as "a Cadet Captain in the
CAP at the same time FERRIE was in charge". We should·
make an effort to locate and talk to this LEON GUIDRY.·
This assignment is best handled by IVON.
II. PERRY BROWN:
Some time ago HRS. DICK ROLFE (June) stated that

~VILLIA.M
PERRY BROWN was also present .-c..
at ..FERRIE'S par:A;.y
£~
.
at the time that OSWALD and SHAW '"sn:e there. live con-
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tacted BROWN and he denied this. Subsequently MRS.
s-flltw; ROLFE advised that she had learned the first na~e of
the woman at the party with WILLIAM PERRY BROWN. She
f£1-"A te said that the first name was~ and that ·she would
"t"
try to get the last name. She stated that DEENA ~.-.ras a
~C-t)AL-P
lesbian and she s_eemed to be positive abo~t her infor-
( ~ '1 nE~~A~) mation concerning the party. ( lt~· S'1\>M..''}.
11
Sw\.'1'-"\~'-..,...\ ~~~~~cA.~v -~"'"""\. ~\ t."~ Sc.""-oo\
III.
_. A _rly juncture in A
Jackson, - Lo~~ana -
inq~·ry Fru e came across iAfo~ation tha~/a an at wo
Jac son - . "pdss ibly MRS. F/ED WILSON - way a fo er
pro titute an · was drivinJ' a br nd new c~ with exas
li.'ense plates in 1963"./The car it was,t indicted -
on 1nd1cated, s 1n t:J e ch.rt hat~:.1ng bus1ness. hls

ead can be check d otl by sciamb~V . . .
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NW 12640\ Docld:59168006 Page 194

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~HBRESA CLAIRE FAGNAN;;) ~
/ /
This young lady livecl''at
/~
817 Dumaine
~~~~
Street from
- ~~~~~~~
October 1962 to Ap~i~ 1963. On la s t information she

\~as living at ~Ll'I" Stephe ns (the Three O a~s Apartme ~ts)
J..n Gretn a . .J2:!j November 2 2nd she wa s vJOrkJ..ng a·t Bce J..ng
~':lt__ a.t Hichoud. She lef ·t at JlQOn. and fci led to. :r·etu-;n-:
She was mi s sing for a we e k and on h e r return claime d
-t:hat-sbe had gone skiing in New Hexico. Another
---------~~--~~~--------=---~-----------
inter ro~sting factor concerning FAGNA:N..,.r , in addition to
h e r actions, is the fact that this apartme nt hollse is
..:tJ2e same one in which DONALD DOOTY - former Army:
Int~0igence employee and close friend of SHAW -
t] staye d on his return Lrom Mexico in 1963. The 1962
)2iJ- e ctory also shows that one TH10THY J. O"HAJ.T,ORAN.
~<? of the Boeing Company, liued there,. Also .living
there, according to the 1962 Directory, was one LUTHER
P. HINES, an importer. On moving from 817 Dumaine, . ..
FAG NANT moved to the Studio Arms at 3500 Division Street.
Th~~ource of information concerning her departure from
Boe~~n the day of the assassination seems to be good.
v. THE HORGAN-SHREVEPORT PHONE
Am~ th7Jhamr/} ' l~tJ-ed i1CLAY~AA.,(.- -n~

·o eb- k is ·
?1.1~.6ed/r.1WsbR1\._"l. ~'J'RG~u·.· ph.6~~L~mbe/ . n_~~ eport .
mcll/::a)z~d
t . rf::y!.bo ·k. A lYev
l . oJ /ex/. · ERRIE' s
pho~ ca s revealed th _f.¥B-&:l£ called tha number
m his home phone. . · •
VI.
On several occas i oos we have received infOJ;miii\t ia!:L___

that a man named LOPEZ. who works at Medallion Real
Estate Company, once ni.ade a tr:ip to Cnha with S.BA:W
This note is placed herein primarily for future infor-
mation, Inasmuch as LOPEZ is likely to be a friend
of SHl\W' S it would not be wise to contact him at the
present time.
VII. TTON~
/
men were as
" . unny lookin "
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 195 ·.·
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VIII. GRORGE CL.~~K:
A painter and carpenter, 20.,9 'eventh.· Strioet, /

in 1963 w helping to pain~ sd';;~" bathroom a·t · I
his horne \Vl trf anot er. colored in'f.l
(und ;i-t_·hit plumb~r. who ha. s. /since ied). The ofher
colo1:-e man- e bel~eved to b'e named RERET. CLARK -
obser E:d two young men play; ng cards most of th~
day jm SHA\v' apartme'nt. e identif~s one of/the
me.~i~s LEE OS"/ALD and the other as an;.,unknmm/young
man.. He does \rot recall' seeing SHAW t~ere du:r ing
th s particula · day, al hough it was Sl,AW' s Jpartrnen t. ·
t
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ARK'S wife ow s a restaurant at 2039 pever:ih Street.
of this date, he i~being contacted f~r s. If
his contact is nsucfessful we will hav 1 follmv-up
to
I ourselves. The ourae of this informati n ~hould rate

as very good. ·
IX. JAJ-·1ES .WARREN: _.31

One JAMES WARREN left· New Orleans when the probe_-
sta~r-ted . .
- ' He worked with CL.Z\Y SHAW. His daughter:_
PH:(LLIS dated PERRY RTISSO and same of his friends_.
They live at 9011 Sara Lane- in Shreve,port,:. PHYLLIS
WARREN. ~s now at Southeas·tern in Hammond. (Hammond
comes up again~)
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NW 12640 Docid:591,68006 Pag~ 196
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:: N E '·1 0 R i\ N D U M ·· · . I
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Ju.ne30, 1967 · : .:- ..
·-.-:: . .· ·· .. : :-··.:- . ~- . :-~--~-: . :--:· .
· . TO: JTH GARH.ISON, District Attorney .: :. -. . ..

·.· .. .. ··
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FROI•l: . 'l'OM BETHELL · ··- : . .
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\.__:r.-u:_CH..i'~EL Hl""\DLEY, .l3.2.9 · St.
-------=-.~ .
Andrew Street, called at-. .
·.
1:39 P. H. and. adv1seG- hat__b.e hacl kt:lOidGdgG to tbe ef..fes:;.t that
~----- --- . . . . ..........
. GEt-.i'E D.AV T:1 'iviJS l vi ng when he said h e dj d not know u:;r.; H.jj.~VEY
-OSWZ'ILJ2.. His reason for saying this \•las th~t a fri ond of---:--:---J 1-ti s....._
whose name . he \-iould not disclose ("X") used ciri nkiug·
wi t_h Dl\'TI.S, an l i S ·
. ···- -·-- __h~ lli) ..;5.~':;; DAVIS . with_ o_;)li'l,ALD in . ti 11
in Ensslal.. .. . · .
!mDL.!::.""Y said that "X" · had a grudge against DAVIS and

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for this .r eason "X" 'Hants to see DAVIS get what's coming to him. ·
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in mind that the.
caller. .
was obv:i.cusly :u naware tha ·t OS~'i"ALD ~..las in. Russia at . this time,
(he stre ssed h e was positive it was early 1962) I do not imagine .
that there is anything more than a personal vendetta to this
story. · -
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NW 12640 Docid: :59168006 Page 197-:.. •.••·.; J • •·• - -~
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Route 1, Box 275 J . , ·:' -·
Yellow Springs, Ohio 45387
January _196_7 j . :. . .· . --.. :g,
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Tom Bethell .. . . .. f 0
: ':--
Dif;trict Atto r no:~y 1 s Office . --- ~ [:" " . : -:

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2700 Tulane .,\v E:
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, Ne'iv Orleans, :L:~. .. 70119
Dear Mr. B2t hell: .: •:

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For -.;.1ba t it is ~;o rth. I a:n w s~it1g."cin ·a . bit ·of ti~g repcr
frcim a friend · and admire.r of Jim Gan·ison that I he.ard
tOI1ight o .•.. ... . . . ..
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~-~D.Sl_J,l-3 ~·crlu ~~lnte.d
·wlth a man, Hhose name I ·m 1 :L. . · · · v.· · ·
,_~ot in~l ~~,~~~~l"'" , J·.Tho told mv friend t l p t his mother. · .-_. _. \j\~~~ ,~,J-/1 17 .
ln Ne(l Ort e.,aru; bad been ho:..~eel-:ec:p-?.r toClcy Sho•.y. Th1-s - < /v
lady is rep c..:c t e d as terr]fi'"'c~ e.bout the··bazrrd to rer from. ~--· 1 • - .. -
\·'hat ~ IY• f.rp 0''' <::' c• }n 0"• • rf . ,.;::; . I
~~a9ia't:r:ib~;,j. tb Q 1'w r_·f.t. knou ec.g~ of Bcl~ist ic stuff . ' the

.... bd<lps, etc) J.n th2 closet, and the mysterlrus death.. . . _. ..- .J · ··· •·•·
or killing of so<ne body in thehouse, \·lhethe.r an associa:te ·.
·or not is not knmv"TI. 'l'h<:Te had been no police. inve.stigatio~, . . _
'
:·. but a . coroner m d come ard picl~ d lit') the. body. T\o men ··· · ·
l:i.. ved ]_n the. house. of Hhic h t !)2. . lady Has haJse.keeper. · · · r·
Hy frio:r1d ·: is not _sure of all ttL?. details. but this is the ..
general picture h2. get • · · .. _ . __
Hy frierd is a bus ire ssm9.n ~.Jhos~ r:tot ives :~re scund~ · He · .

Sa\·7 no reason to discount this r ·epc:rt, _ but Cannot VOUCh - . .·
for it be. yond l·iha t he told me.
I \•7as p.?! rticu.lary plc. a se.d to rc-'ld of Gart·ison 's evidence ·

tl1.:1. t LD2 Os Hald h a d inforrne.d the FBI of tl-':e assassinatior1
plot. I have. 1:-frd an incre.asillgly strong convictim ·tl\.'lt
this riu.st hl ve. .taken p Ja. ce fro~n my reading of 0S\·7ald' s ·
cba. racter. I do doubt tm. t it 'Has Lee : Oswald tl:at Has
Ruby' E _bedr.:t-'lte. That sounds to c ["[£ more like the Leon , ' ·
Os>:, ald 'Hho ·Has ~Ln" assassin.
7 .: '... c• . • . .
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\-lith best ,.ri_ shes for yut r work, ..-. .. • ._:

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Sincerely
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(I. t-(·S·~(."'\.. 0--rt. (;)j t' r:.....· : :· :·. ·. ~ £. :
Griscom Horgan
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OFFICE OF 'ri-m DIS'rRICT l'\'.l".L'Ort~my

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~-- STA'rE OF LOUT~:'ilANA OA\IH> r-.z~ Rl:;
PARISH OF OlU,E!\.NS c...wt y Sf-1/+W '·
(-t s~.-\~ '"+"c..ANA6A ~) ·
, .
"'"J.A c k' 14 !E-1.~ s
October 10, 19G7
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t.J/?1.-TeP.. SH;e/UP't;J ( --1- '1~)
_(.USANS
STATEMENT OF': JOLES .l UCCO KIMBLE, \'17/m 24
RESIDING A'.r: 4839 Babylon Street

New Orl0ans, Louisiana
--- --
met DAVID FERRIE in early 1960 in a barroom named The Golden

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.· Lantern in the French Quarter. I would see DAVE from time to time
in the same ba.c and ·r fle.,.., with him in his airplane ~ on several
J occasions.
One night while. drinking in the Golden La.:.."ltern, DAVE introduced

me to CLAY sH..;tiJ. I was \-lith CL..."-\Y SHAW and DAvE for several hours
that night 'IHhich was in Late 1960 or early 1951. From -that tirne on
I use to see CLAY SHAW on different occasions., you know drinking al~d
so forth. One day in late '61 0 ~ early '62 I received a phone cal~ .
s....tt..-..4 _ from DAVE and he asked me if J: \~ould 1 ike to take an ove:::-n i9h t pl;,:'\t\~~
-r trip with him. ·I said, c\ll right, and then R~t FERRIE at the airpo:::t
t.p..~: at \vhich-tj_me I found out that CLAY SHAW ,. 7as coming with us. At
this· time I al:3o found ou.t that 'l.ve were goi.n.g to canada to p .i ck same-
one up. No other explanation \\72l.s given. ~·0-~ile on the---trip, CL..'Z\Y
SHAN sat . in th.::~ back of the a il.-olane readinc:; books and slept. -SH:"\W
also had a brO\vn brief case ''lit11 him. o 11 th.~ .flight \ve stopped at
different place!"~ . to gas up and stretch our l~"X]s _ We stopped in
Nashville, Tennessee, Louisville, Kentucky, and Toranado, Canada.
Our final stop wa~; in Non.treal. canada. FZ?"'-~IE and myself stayed
in a hotel O'Jernight. l beli~v~ it might ha-ve been the Hilton Ai:t:-
or something like that. The l'lotel was loca-t:.~d .in Dovral \•lhich H3S
right outside of Montreal.. cr_~y SHAW disa??~ared after \ve landed anc
I did not see him until t.he t1~~t morning •r.rh:i~h \vas about 8 o"c1ock
when we were .r eady to l0;:,~ve ~~d come back t'-4 Ne'.;r orleans. . \'ihen SHAH
arrived at thP. plane, h~ 1'\:::u.~ t..""J.is Mexican c~ Cuban \.1ith him. This
guy was kind o :C heavy s~t:~ .:."b.:::-~ complexiorJ!, b;:"'lding in the front., in
his early 30's or rniddl~ 30 • s_ He sat in ~~ back of the ai:rpla.n.:~
\vith SEfAvl and !";;poke onl~.,.. 'to S.'i~W in broke:c 3:l~glish.: The ai.::..-plan~
that we used was a Cess::~ l. 7?. \.Vltich I be~:fu2·Yr-~4. belonged to a fri~nd
of FERRIE's. We bought tbl::J.-c ~:.'::~~ \vi th a Gu:lL£ z:redi t card \-.~nic.h FR~~~IE
had. When we got back t:~ to..'--:.~ :Lakefront .A:i::::?a~t:, I got into my ~ut.o
mobile and FEIWif.:: and S~~1.V ~~~~ the other ~y got into anob.'-1e::- a-..'...t.o-
rnobile and lefl:.
About a mon t:h or b·;o_, ::::::.~ ~.::- :t got anott-::e= 3-?'hc:;:~e cal~ fr~ .?E:~~XE
asking me if I wanted t'0 :rn..;.~~~ 't.lte return. ;~:i,? \,<ib~ h.im to Cc.~C.~,.
but I told hitn no.
have seen [.:)!lAW on c:;.:~~i:~~~::n t occas ior:s i.:n. ::t:-a::-rooms an..:3. :at t..~·~)
$'"~:I
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International 'I.'.r.ade Ma.!':.:"~ 1.::;:;:: ~1Ytil the ti~e '::.'hat the Dist~i-:::::'=. .At:.t;,)~n ,
office starb~d their i.c:.-·...-~--;~·:::=::;c~-::ion. I h2::.• 0 ~~2.:::-a other ?2·~-;:>l-= ~nt-..
-- -
dqce.~ GLl\Y.·,sH?\\'-1 - ~s:: c_rr~;~-:::'j;;:?J~~~'qD:, · ].~~t·_- he ~-~~~%: n~~~j2~'-: :g·e _en ·_:i?~;:?t:;,;~::~.~~{~~-}:
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.NW 12640 Docld: 59.168006 Page 199

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{ . me as CLAY BEWfRAND.
I would also like to state that about two or three weeks after
DAVE FERRIE died I got a phone call from JACK HELHS who ·-was formerly
with the Fed.:!ral Government and later connected with the Klu Klux
,,~~
Klan asking tlli:! if I would take a ride with him by FERRIE's house to
f(~'' pick up some pa.pers. I said, yes, and a short while later he picked
me up at my hous8 in a 1966 white chevrolet. ·we drove to FERRIE's
·~
house and par:;·::ed a little way dmm the block ... JACK got out of the
f..c»)..l.t.'..s. automobile with a flashlight and it appeared that he went around the
back of the hou.:::e or into the back yard. A short . while later _h e came
---~~ back with a black briefcase and got into the automobile at which time
we drove off. Later I believe that the contents of this briefcase were
put into a safety deposit box in the Bank of Louisiana. · Later I
believe that these papers were removed from the Bank of Louisiana and
put into a big black box in St. Bernard Parish which belonged to the
Klan. The fellow \vho kept this box is called OTTO. I do not know him
by any other name. I believe that these papers ,were then removed from·
this black box,. but · I don't know where they were removed to. · I did
manage to get some papers from this black box, but they- pertained to
the Klan, and I turned these papers to CLEMENT HOOD, an .FBI Agent I
was working for. I also had contact with CIA Agents. Their names
being STEINJY!EYER, who has since been transferred to Texas, and NAT
BRmVN who is still in New Orleans and another guy by the name of RED,
last name unknown. I used to have meetings with the Agents in differen
motel rooms where I would give them reports, pictures, recordings, etc.
and would a:lso receive my pay check or cash \vhich I would sign a
voucher for and would also receive furthe:r::: instructions. They would
mail different things to me at my post office box number which ~s
701-30252, Lafayette Street Branch .
• ' • ~ < : • : ... •
.
Several months ago RICK TmvN"LEY with WDSU called me and told me
that he had information that I had tape recordings that someone wanted
to buy from me. I asked him how he had found out that · r ·had them .. and ·
he said that didn't matter. He asked me if I would meet him some
place and I told him yes, . to come over to my house. He said, no, he
wouldn't do that, that it would have to be some public place. · So I .·
met him in the :Kopper Kitchen on Tulane Avenue. After we talked for
.s.-.~ a while I went home and put on a suit and we went down to \IDSU. When
we got to WDSU, TOWNLEY called HALTER SHERIDAN in New York and I sat
r~~
there while 'fm'-INLEY.,italked to SHERIDAN. After TmvNLEY hund up. he
~~)! sa.id that SIIERIDAN would be in town the following morning. TOWNLEY
· asked me what I \vanted for the tapes that I had, and I told him $500.
The next morning they gave me the $500 for the tapes and asked me . if
I would do a film for WDSU consisting o _f what I .know about the Cubans,
FERRIE, SHAW, etc. The tape that I sold them contained some informa-
tion about the IClan and other information about the papers that were
picked up at FERRIE's house. WALTER SHERIDAN is the one who gave me
the $500 for the tapes. This $500 was in a sealed envelope and was
all one hundred dollar bills. This was given to me in an office in
in WDSU which was located by their newsroom. We then went upstairs
and they locked the doors and placed a guard on the door and started
asking questions and taking pictures of me. I _even remember that
there was a tnan from Sweden who was talking to the cameramen and they
asked him to leave. They asked me questions such as, Do I know CLAY
SH..l\W: Did I ever fly 'l.vith CLAY SHAW ancl DAVID FERRIE: If I knew GENE
DAVIS, which I told them that I knew GENE DAVIS very well because he
was a personal friend of mine; If I knew GORDON NOVEL: If I ever
worked for the FBI, CIA, which questions I said, yes of which to
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·- . . •_..: .'.'... : .Cf.·~-.·
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:UW 12640 Docid: 59.1 68006 Page 200

r
.·• . •·
-3-
( questions WALTER SHERIU1\.N ·said he had already known that I would

say yes to. I \vas then told to say that I didn't know anything
that would help Garrison in his investigation and this was also
put on filrn. I don't remember everything that he told me to say but
he did tell me to go to Canada. He also said that he would edit and
cut the filros after I was .gone . . He also said that they would get m~
an attorney i f I needed one. I told SHERIDAN And TOWNLEY .not tore- .
le.a se this film if they were going to cut any part o~ it. · They said
that when I 90t to Canada: they would call me and ask if it could
be released. They called my wife later and asked her if she would
let them rel eas e it and she also told them no_ I understand that
fuis film has b e en cut and released.
. . . . . .
MR. HOOD told me not to get inv6lved with the District Attorney's
Office and if the District Attorney's Office tried to subpoena me,
that he vwuld take care of it. MR. HOOD told me to give · al~ the ·
cooperation necessary that ~VALTER SHERIDAN required.: SHERIDAN and
TOWNLEY also told me , riot to . talk \vith the District Attorney's Office'
and · to call them right away so they couldget an attorney ,for me.
That is about all I can remember at this time.
: ..
S/Jules Ricc·o Kimble

JULES RICCO KIMBLE
. >-": .,,_~ • .--
.. ~ -- : :-•
•.. ~
:·. ::.:·::.
. ,· .
mt 12640 Docld: 59168006 Page 201 · ·

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l:'I.Oute. l, Bo;c /.7::>, :. .
,Yellow Sp~ing~! · 9hio 45387
· J _anuary 2.;3, 19<.>7 : < .· ,
Tom B e~ th.:.'. D.
. ·• ! . : : .:~-·: .:. . . . ·- :.
·. i .
.. · ; _ ._.· -
District Attorney's Office
. .. :~ .
2700 Tulane: Ave ". ·-
"'Je.~- O'L ',J. .l..:r.... -~ •. ' l. •,. 70119

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.. _..:.·. :· - -.· -·-- ··.. '
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Dear 1·1r. · H2.the.ll:
: ·,.- · ... ·.i > ~--~ .
.·
.. :_ For~ Hl::a. t ·it is \-/0rth I ~!"Grassing -on·a -bit .of rep·cr-ting : ~ :,_,:-- .·
. ·•~ ~~~g ~t ~ ri ~nd · ~cd adrui rer of Jim s~~is on t~a t r ~earj;S;"~~~c0?§fJ~;:: 1
~d .is r"!".-;11:1inted :;;ri th a m;;1~,-~1;vhose. na.rrt? I -1-:rj 1 i.·:· ·-~.- ·: :~ :·: ~,,-; ·v;.v'":·Y: -;
r~o:: inr.ln.!.-'1...-?---L-:'~"', -x·:bo told P.W frienc1 tlr>t his mother: - .- \/\('~\: __,J-;1
ln Ne. e 0rl_e."' '1': hJ.d b.;'Pn h~·:..wel-:'.?.e~·; ·. . - to r'J.ay ShaTz Tbj·s .~:-_'· C' 7
lady is r-2-:) cr tcd as tcri:{ f iorl e.bor:.t the --lnz::>rd to l:Br from .. ·.:___( _-·- ~- ... .
.' ·ma-
' t S ~t :~ .I::T;m.;:-
T ;. "'h
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1 s . 1 nc. nc,es
l.. :nos.JlDC:
. f ·pt'PYT,• P _{3
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.. . . ·... .
assoc-iati.<;t+.- v ..:t- b Sl·;-JT-:.,. kno';.Jledge. . o£ tl£ s.:idistic s ·tuff. ._:.:,·. .-:·
(•·:hips , etc) in the. closet, and the mysh~ria..1s cleo:rth ~ - · .-. ··
· or killing of s o>aebody in the twuse 1 ,.,hethe.r an associa:te ... · ...... ..
or . not i s not knm-vn. 1'he.rc hacl been no oolice investigation, . · .·
but D. c or·oner tn cl come · ard pic1:e d up . th e . body·.. T~0 · men · ·· · · .-. '--. · ···,
li vecl in the house of -.;..rhic h t h.:: . lady '\-la s hous·~keeper. · · ..

Hy fri ca:~:l :is not _sure of all t re cle·tails, but this· is the
general pie t ur e 1-e · get •
!· · - .. . ,, . . · .·
Hy friend is a businessman Hho ~e· m~tj_ve s :a re scund. - He

sm-~ no r e ason · to discount this r e pa t, . bu·t cannot vouch
for it b e. yond 1-:ha t he told r.1e.
. . . . . . . . . :· . . ..
I '\·las pr: rticula ry plea:s e d to r e.a d of Garrison's e.vicierice
tl"'..-'1 t Le£ OSI\'ald had infori:l~d t r:.~ FBI of the . assassinc.tion
.... . .::.
plot. I httve l'f ;: cl an increasirl g ly strong · convictim th.:, t , .. ~.
this nr. .ts t · m ve. t.::il.;_en p Ja ce fro:a m.y reading oE Os•·lald t s

cl:n ractcr . I do doubt tm. t it uas Lee Os wa ld t r.at Has
-.
. . Rtlb)' t s. _be clr:t::J t e... rfhat SOtlrld.S ·to ::rre ftlOre -like the -. Leon :-
Os\·:r.:tld
.
"t;.Jh.o· \'la s .
·:::t_t, __ 2~Ssa s sln.
.:··.. ·- ·-.- . .. · - :' :·-·
\-lith best ;;-rl..shes for yGtr v70rk,

. . . .
Sincerely ·
( ; ,: I
Gris cor.:1 Horgan. .
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0
._~---·----··-·-·-~--~--·___
·first thought to be WHITE
name \·!e.
apparently is WIGKr, Vice President of Freeoort
Sulphur \·ihO reputedly ma de the fl:i. ht. Currently
·--~-- --
cln e· ·or L lS eing made to locate h'IGHT, who nO\·!
livt.:s in New York, by a contact of Nark Lane's.
De spite the fact that the oriajnal snun:e o-F this
·--·- ··- ..
L~:..:formation Has JULES RICCO KHl BU~ a man with a
,_!.~~~5cord, this lead keeps grmv-ing stronger. From
the ver' outset it hal -' """ r-:.;::.or:ted thct the fli ht
hud something to do \·iith the import of ickW
£()-llowing the loss of the original import. supply
from Cuba. Recent information developed on
~IGHT in a separate memo, indicates that he is now
on the Board of Directe>rs, of th.s fi-eEi:oort · l'7ic~
~::~'-a subsidiary of FreeoC>rt Sulphur .. (The .
separate file on this is a rather detailed report
from PlacquemineParishand. should be included in
t .he new - SHA~v file.
of his i~f'\.nton
in Clinto• th~ i t ·
bring t: is . wi~ess
u / some · .
9) TAXI CAB DRIVER:
Went out of his way on~ night to drive by FERRIE'S

house and told the passenger that he had taken SHEHIJ
to that a~dress on n~ny occasions. I have more ~·~
~,f7}'
.-- ;
memo for the .file on this taxi cab driver~ I am
including it in this listing in order to 1nsure
follow-up.
Ii.~
will be recalled that same time ago librar_y _
~!nlo ees vlhile going through their records, cc:me - I
across a library car~ mace out to CLEM or CLAY
discounte·d th i"' e :i ng neqc: t- ive bee~ ~132 J~: ·

ll
......--- - . .. --- ·.
2h0n e D'->1:'})2r turned OUt to have no me a ninq, hc.J~,·ie\/ er .
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NW 12640 Docid: 59168006 Page icn:J~ ;;·'· · -- --~- _ _
··;:11'
(
-~
e
po~:;~:: .ible tha~~-;-n:y 1as Hell <': S others I \-,~
( ·Li:S.~: d ~ing plac e::.; b v SW\ \': and oth e r :i.ndividt.~ 1 s.
-~l'h .: : siqnat.ure.
... ::.:::::. ::::;.:-- .
a}~rs
.
to be in SI-l'' l\"i'S h <:~ncJ.\,;_rj.t.~,ng_. . (&
--- -
J:'u r th<:c:cmore 1. t1ns ca.r-d \'lets not thru st upon us but.:
c :1 rne to us throu9h an official on the Library Board
\'ihO hc-:d been info:r med abou·t its di s covery by a
]_j_brary employee. We may have her e~ situation
p t:1Ei:~.lls~.l to that in \\'h_:i.ch SIIl\1'7 s~sn~~:cl his name CLAY_
]:;.· i ::F:'I'f~l\ND at the V.I.P. -i~oe>m. In th e l atter instance
/'L-1_~:~~-_:_;_tro~tg possi1)ility exists that. h e \·;a s th~ QD_
{ Flt a_~ o c cc~sion for an intel.ligen~-- I suggest
\Trlii t \~e ke~p our ~1in d,s open to th e po s sibility of ·
,the l:Lbrarles havJ.ng neen used in the same \'lay.
NOTE: Whereve r pre- ex isting memos or inform~tion

can be located concerning the ~hove leads,
it is suggested that they be located and
placed in our new jackets for SlffiW LEADS.
· JIM GARRISON
- .. - .' ....... ... 7
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• • ~;~u.l
0
({4; ~~It!'
TO: JIM GARR~SON, District Attorn2y
c· r:.. f"/i
L-1 ..._:.· J. • 'THOI·lAS DtTFFY I
RC:
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I! ()!! J9G7 Duffy rc~ce ived
II caJ.:. :cru;.\ a p2:c:;on './:w ic'LE!n tii.ied hi_T,l.:321f as CHJ.\RLE~S KRO? of 1
~·~ C~l-~~c~.1~ .~- -.~, ~JO ~-:l~.--·1l:.~·L·.· .~.:.1·~- ~- -:.c-:_.i_·s· · · ·

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7
t~·, L·.cc:J tha. t ~;
ho:c L-.1 v a f t2 r the
r: CYn tc! C~ tc~ c} })~ 7 Cl (~ U_}) Ct11 0 rc' C~ 11 j ,_, C~. l: 5_ O(i
; lll="'c"'.""'.f-•l""j-_~--~~a_csc) tllr.:tt \·JCt::.~-- ·t-1::\7 J ..n:~s. t.~_r. . .'..... :cais:-o fundr; l:(l ctSS2S~;{na i:-:,:-::-; _I:'.d)}~;I.,
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:.•. l·lr. l<l:ZO:!? co11f~:;·(:'(_;d-·the FBI and ------,---~-----~· ,..,. . ,.
-- ,!-~7:c:;J::~.:-cJ. th:::;m if th:::~y ·\'ould
1 bs: inte:uc~:;ted. Thsy told Hr. KI\OP th.o:::z:- I
\·/01~1lc1 be ir1terestecl. c.u1cl. to Cl})t-.airl as n~Ltc1·l il1EoJ:'!nclt.ior! cts ·}·:~} cot.l1.cl: .
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!1}.:~ ~J;_·r-~~().J2 . . .~~-~~-t:_ nt.l "t) ,C1.. r·c: C~() ~eel irl cr (! e \/icc --- t-~~ r.~~ Ij
1. -~~L~~;~_:~~}~~-tb.c ~i.~ ~~~b.'i.n.'~ ~ , ·II~ -~i ~6i{l. •.\\~\;>;J...,.~ ,-l.~c:m::~jA?c:;:··;~~L .......
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po'·c-·,c,·,nn ··{·
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t•11c· tl"'"' ·1'·' '·'h1cn tn~-" Cu 1 y·nc O"'·sc·,--,n""n
- ~-.a·f1~:~·3'1~f{.:.s~..:J£;;::·;':~~L~.~c1-~~-u--
1.·';'1;" 7· I
c,~![~~·~t:~~i~~~~;~1~!';';~~:~f~~-r'e,~~~t~:~1·
lj FERR.TE. _ ]',~; 2. re::;ul t. or. t.rno,~ I·I:c. l~F.OP acJV:L::;.2u t.h::: FBI of ',-.'hat.
r'~~~~~.~:~~;;£~::ROP
li . COJlllCC \£:(! ....] { ! t .!J.:.· _p-':_p.)c:.•
I
l,lll On J.larch lG, l9G'/h::.! Cl.Jain cont.C:l.cted th:2 FBI.a11d 1
sc::.iCi t.:.l·1ey \·.iOl.)J.c! })2 \T~:~c)_r rnt1c~1-1 j_l1t.C1~C!Stec1 j_l1 li.str::r1ir1g tcJ
t.f12y
1 tJ1s tctr)c: a9c1lr1. I::~c. I(r~OP tJ1c~l1 cc)litactc~cl Ssrt. l)ttffv- c)r·· t.l-lc-: l,T:::::1.·:: II
j 0 j: l ~2 2.ll ~:; J) i :::; t.J.~ i c -t l\ t. tc, )~·r1:~-~ ~( 0 f f ic:e . f~ g t.. l)tl f f)' ctcl~ \J i s 2 cl. I·•1 r
1
::; I~J.(Ci :p i
i he C~Cl1.1 [; :i_rn h2:; ck .. of
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I coll\lers.:l ticJrl caJL:::d Chicago
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ofi~ice. l>lr. KF<.OP he of I
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to',·:n on the:.
196"1
1~
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e c c-.; J. \-'2 c1.
.,
Duffy a copy of the tape.
As a result Officer Du.f fy
~(~hs
II
to · con tc.' c t:. J.I 1~ • !.7th, : ..n-·-•_.
._l --] r i ~
..-1 '··.'.::) ·i n
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l9S7.
is 2mployed hy _the
C b. j_ C:: c~- s ~:,
112 __
l·l. c·:: cl. }J.~ ::~; r1 ct \tCJ ic1. .i.J~ ·:J S s r.:_~__-. __ }?~_:.. ~~~-! ~[ 1~~}.5:~--~~:t.JJ~~:_s; __ )~1 ~! ____\}_Ci.fL ... ~; ~~Ii~.:}: (!.._ ..CJ. f--- ·~;--.~:-::.. t j_ !::. ~t
l. _____ j.:;)_\~.~>- J...\~.s ci. }J .~-:: c: c:. ~~ :: s.~~~-- _.l~t~~~:__~?. ~:-~ ____ \~.~:.' <-~ ~~~-~-:~_:=.i_____ .~:~:~:.: -~: ?---~~ : :_ _____t-. l'}_ .:;·~. __ret _i _J._i. t;_~. t :~1 !: _.. L. :l Fj~.: • C> £ .f i c· ;::; .L-
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NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 205

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t:i.me he had a. c1 v· i_.~=> ~~: c1_ t112 J!'}31
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c:t:ncl. he }·122:r:d of it. I
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811(1. of '•li t h 1-Lc.

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NW 12640 Do~Id~59168006 Page , 206

/ statement of Mrs. June A. Rolfe in the Office of the
District Attorney on Thursd ay , March 6, 1969.
In the early 60's, I will have to check some rent receipts

for the dates on thi~, I sa.w Clay Shaw in a light-colored
['
Thunderbird with the t9p down in the French Quarter in
New Orleans. There were two young men in the front seat,
Shaw was in the middle and had an arm around each of them.
A man that looked exactly like David Ferrie sat in the
back.seat. The reason I remember him is because of his
kooky hair color. It looked almost like it had been
powdered in color -- looked like a make-up job.
Ju~<,A. Rolfe (Mrs))
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 207

.:·•_ ..
•
.;, ' ·
.. ..
\
i\
1·. M E M0 R A N D U M ~ ~, ..5,tr-tJ ( <t- .==- &!: " "' ~1
:,t... ·. tre~~'£
Oct~Jer 23, 1968
TO: JIH GARRISON, · District At~ori:ley
FROi'·l: ANDRE\ 7 J. SCIA.tvlBRi\, Assistant D .. A.

1
RE: SHA\-.J - .FERRIE & '\i\j'HITE (Freeport Sulphur)
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** *
I contacted Hr. PLAINE by telephone in-regard
to NR. \'H-IITE of Freeport Sulphur and DAVID FERRIE. . PLAJ:NE _
told me that he distinctly remembers either SHAW or FERRIE_
talking about some nickel mineswhich were locatedon the_
~estern tip of CubJ;~. · · He says he does . not remember exactly
the gist of the conversation, but he distinctly remembers
~hat it was reg~rding these nickel mines. He said he cannot
positively say that FERRIE knew ~\TRITE or vice versa, but he
somehow feels that they must have known each other.
Alcock and I will call in MR. \\TRITE of Freeport

Sulphur and ask him about our previous memorandum from
KIMBALL which mentions SHl\1'1, FERRIE and WHITE being .together.
'
·'
.........
- ... ...
\ : .·.; --
~· - - ..;. ..- ·-: ~;
(
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NW 12640 Docld: 59168006 · Page 208

( ·.
__
E M 0 R A N DU M
' .
. ;
~rJv([: Lo ~ {---. ~~
t April 22, 1969 . ~ ~ -~ --...... S_,A z.o1 ~7
TO: Jllvl GAHfUSON, District Attorney

~ (<. :. 'IHOf\NLE'f ('1.)
.. p.. ~ S~Flw ( 1-)~
-~: O,S'Wi)LO
FROM: ANDRBv J~ SCIAMBRA, Assistant District Attorney
,I ~ ~ ljA/'IIf"rE~
RE: The Ne\v Sha\•1 Lead File
41) EDDIE PORTER LEAD (See Sciambra memo 12/19/68)
by tha name of JOHN \vno, according to PORTER, spent most of his tl•~
- _-"lffiSEiing the queens" arou~d the Arcad<;j. OSWALD ~old CAPT • .MP>.RTELLO
that JOHN was a member of the Fair play far cuba Commi tJ:ee. PORTER
currently lives in california but has relatives in the city. Efforts
should be made to get his California address so that we may further
communicate with him.
42} SHAW- PARTIES LEAD
"PATSY" I a colored female impersonator said that he has entertained

r
at some -of the pa.rties given byCLAY SHAW. He said that he quit
work1ng for SfffiW because he didn't like his attitude. (REID can
contact).
Lt3) ' BILL GAUDET T-'E')\D {See FO\VLER memo of 4/15/69)
1 .
GAUDET {s editor and pnhlishe~
of thp~:atin
American Reports] He
~ad offices in the old International Trade Mart and is now located
in the nei.v :t'l:ernational Trade r•tart. According to \'ffiiSBERG, GAUDET
is C.I.A.
mPmo of'~ 1 1.
44) SHA\•T IN ST. FI:~Z\NCISVILLE, LOUISIANA (see Scl· a.m.bra
- - A• •
<.! 1 3/b-'?)
'::' .~
J \Q
Leads pertaining to Sfi.A~·l's activities in St. Francisville have come

I. .
1. ~·
• in. I suggest that PILFORD who has made a conte.ct in St. Francis-
ville handle this lead in conjunction with ~a.
kl/1
. ' ..,J'.-·
\ft .
L!.-)
_:J FRIE.0<0S OF DEf·,JOCRi:\TIC CUBA (See Special ~s.
· ~ According to numerous reports, the Fr iencls of DBrJo-::i:'a. tic Cuh::l. ~.,,;,_s
· created and sponsored by the C.I.A. It was organized around 1960
JE.· b~ . BI~,L DI•-LZELL . and SERG~O A~CACHA SMrl'H. (B.U.N'NISTER was its
~ Dlreccor). Supposedly, 1ts E .B.I. contact \•ias REGIS KENNEDY e,nd
its C.I.A. contact \·las a man named LOGAN. It moved from the Balter
. Building to the· Tnte·rnatiOnal Tracle Hart a fe\•1 IC~onths· _a fter . it:s -- __
conception. On Jan B. ry 20, 1961, JOSEPH !>100RE along ·,.;i th a person
narr!ed os~·IhLD atte mpted to buy so~e trucks f.:r:-om Bolton Ford for the
NW 12640 Docld:59168006 Page 209

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r. '
Invasion. Although this may not be a matter of priority, because

of the people involved in the organization, I think ·r.de should keep
an open mind in this area.
46} GUY BANNIS'rEJ?. AND 544 CANP STREET (See Special File)
Because of th e impor tarice of GUY BAJ\TNISTER and the 544 Camp Street
location I suggest we assign one man to look thorqughly into GUY
BAJ\'NISTER and r~lated activities around 544 Camp Street •.
f1!... S~
47} McBETH ROOMING HOUSE LEAD (2429 Napoleon Avenue)
On p. 26 of the. rooming house's cash · book, there appears,

"6/28/59, LEE HARVEY OSWALD, El Paso, Texas, Room D". KERRY
THORNLEY's Grand Jury testimony reveals .that at one time he, t·oo,
fi ved at thesame HeBe thN-Roomirig House.
\;.> ).,...,. .;v-'~ . /\• ....,. ....
w~ . ~1
11/1 ..
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•
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· · ·-·· . ,..-.... · .. · - -·-::-"''
.;\ :j ·-':t~;~-· .
~- l2640 Docld: 59168006 Page 210

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...

October 9, 1968 ... ...,

TO: JIM GARRISON/ District Attbrney

FROM: ANDRE\v J. SCIAf.lBRA, Assistant D. A.

MR. PLAINE also informed me that he thought that the

met him in Houston/ either at his apartment or at the Normandy

.· A rnerrio in the GUY BANISTER file indicates that there

taking off from the Harvey Canal area in a Freeport Sulphu-r-

The report is that the combine of Freeport Sulphur,

... . '"'". - .. : . ·. ~ ~ - '· . -.

· Ntf . 12640 D.o,cld~59168006 ,.Pag~ 1 ..,_ ..

r-: ·:~~-- ·.-· . ;- i

October 23 '· 19"68

TO: JHl G_'\fu-:>.ISON, . District At~orney

FRON: ANDRE'i;J J. SCIAr·'iBRA, Assistant D. A.

RE:· FERRIE & WHITE (Freeport Sulphur}

' ·' I contacted Mr. PLAINE · by telephone in-reg~rd

Alcock and I \·Till call in HR •. l•lrHTE of Freeport

TO: JIM GARRISON, District Attorney

FROM: ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA, Assistant District Attorney

RE: SHAW LEADS - 2 Interview with WALLACE FASSM.-1\N

· · · ANDREW J. SCIAMBRA .....

1----------- ==---- ~-------------------------~----.:.___ -:_________:_____ _

!A. BILLIE. .:.:.:.:..

You met a CLAY · BERTRAND? '

I met a ci.AY BERTRAl\JD. · The name CLAY SHAW was ·never ·

r· mentioned or used to me.·

-Alright, can you tell me the circumstances . of meeting

I ·certainly can. I met him at the Masguerade Bar. I

-=meet him. "-o A-v-:J.~ .../rsn ~~ -r--: · :

It was some time in June of 1958. . .r,:-. ~·

On St. Louis Street. It's a homosexual hangout.

It's now ·when I left called the Cove. It changed

The Cove? C-0-V-E?

Uh huh, it's on st. Louis Street. Between Bourbon and

A. We 11, for sexual purposes...

A. oh, I was living on Dauphine Street, right across the

A. He worked for GENE DAVIS a-t the Court of _Two Sisters.

Q. What was he doing at the Court of TWo Sisters?

A. Some kind of maitre'd or something, he wasn't just any

Q. . Okay, and in traduced you .to ~e e.r:;;. BERT~

A. I never seen -the picture in the paper, to be honest with

Q .. . When did you see him on T. V ....:1

_A. Oh 1 it's been a long time ago, three or four months~

A. Well just something about Jim Garrison's stuff. They

A. Yeah, in a _building, you see, I just seen him.

Q. Then what you say then is that you saw on television

Q. Tl1is man was identified on tele>dsian at tbat tj,me as

A. 'l'hey said he was a New Orleans businessman or something.

A. . We went to·: GENE DAVIS 1

A. _This · was at ni gbt.

Q. Do you remember where GENE DAVIS' apartment waaJ

A. J · remember wher~- i t was · but not . tbe exact address. It

Q. · . Alright, now, . did you ever see him after · that?

boat; and then he entered my apartnent one night by ·

Q. Alright, you saw him twice more at DAVIS' apartment •• ~-

A. Now, sir, at · the Masquerade and we went · to DAVJS .'

Q. You think · he did not d_f._:i~k? . . ..

1----------- ==---- ~-------------------------~----.:._ -:___:_ _

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