J Rat-Emo Cognitive-Behav Ther (2010) 28:115–117

DOI 10.1007/s10942-010-0114-0

OVERVIEW

Two REBT Therapists and One Client: Overview

Hank Robb

Published online: 13 May 2010

Ó Springer Science+Business Media, LLC 2010

Abstract In the summer of 1994, two of the most published authors in the field of
Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy (REBT), Albert Ellis and Windy Dryden, each
saw the same client. Transcripts of these sessions provide a unique opportunity to
see the same approach used with the same client addressing the same life problems
by two experts with the same therapeutic orientation. A short overview of REBT is
provided as a context from which to consider the transcripts.

Keywords Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy
REBT
Psychotherapy

Therapist comparison

Introduction

In 1994, a trainee, ‘‘L.,’’ brought his lover, ‘‘Jane,’’ to the summer trainings at what
is now the Albert Ellis Institute. Jane asked for a therapy session with Albert Ellis to
address her love life. Jane was married with two teenage children. She was reared in
a strict Christian sect, married a man from the same tradition, and they reared their
children in that tradition. However, Jane and L. had become lovers and, as her
husband was not willing to continue the current arrangement, she was in a quandary
about whom to leave, her husband or her lover. Shortly after her session with Ellis,
Jane also had a session with Windy Dryden, who was a member of the training
faculty that summer. Ellis and Dryden co-authored The Practice of Rational
Emotive Therapy (1987) which indicates their substantial agreement on the conduct
of what by 1994 was called ‘‘Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy’’ (REBT). As was
their custom, both practitioners made tapes of their sessions and Jane later agreed

H. Robb (&)
Lake Oswego, OR 97035, USA
e-mail: robbhb@pacificu.edu

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that the transcripts of the sessions could be published and used for educational
purposes.
These events provided the very unusual opportunity to compare the approach of
two practitioners with the same therapeutic outlook when working with the same
client. In this case, the two most published authors in the REBT field. For reasons of
confidentiality ‘‘L.’’ has been substituted for the name of Jane’s lover in the
transcript below and other identifying information has been changed or deleted. To
a large extent these transcripts speak for themselves. However, for those not well
schooled in the practice of REBT a quick overview of REBT basics may prove
useful.

Overview

REBT typically identifies two types of problems. ‘‘Practical problems’’ are those
involved in getting what one wants, or perhaps, determining what one wants in the
first place. ‘‘Emotional problems’’ are dysfunctional responses to being confronted
with practical problems. REBT holds that while it is helpful to be, for example,
concerned, sad, annoyed, and/or regretful in relation to practical problems,
responding with anxiety, depression, anger and/or guilt are not helpful. The latter
responses are seen as qualitatively, not just quantitatively, different from the former,
e.g. ‘‘anxiety’’ is not simply ‘‘too much’’ concern. Similarly, unhelpful behavioral
responses such as substance misuse or procrastination in the face of practical
problems, rather than non-misuse of substances and effective prioritizing when
addressing practical problems, would also fall in the category of ‘‘emotional
problems’’ even though, in ordinary language, they are ‘‘behaviors’’ rather than
‘‘emotions.’’
The preferred order of operations in REBT is to treat emotional problems first
and then go on to address practical problems. Thus, an individual anxious about
dating would first be helped to reduce anxiety, while still experiencing concern, and
then be helped with the practical realities of dating. The rationale for first addressing
emotional problems is that potentially effective strategies will be less effective if
carried out while the individual is disturbed. REBT also recognizes that individuals
can be disturbed about their disturbances and even disturbed about being disturbed
about being disturbed. Thus, in the later case, one can be angry over one’s
depression over one’s anxiety about dating. Trickier to handle would be anxiety
over one’s anxiety over one’s anxiety about dating because both therapist and client
may become more easily confused about ‘‘which anxiety’’ is under consideration at
any given time.
REBT hypothesizes that individuals produce emotional problems by more
strongly holding to ‘‘Irrational Beliefs’’ (IB’s) rather than ‘‘Rational Beliefs’’
(RB’s). Thus, when one is disturbed, REBT hypothesizes that one is more strongly
holding one or more of the following IB’s, that something: (1) is awful, (2) is
unbearable, (3) absolutely MUST not be as it was, is or might be, and/or (4) that
someone is, or might be, proved a sub-human or super-human. These beliefs are in
contrast to RB’s. (1) As bad as they may be currently, life events likely could be

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much worse and certainly are at no time worse than they could possibly be. (2) We
are capable of bearing, and even bearing well, that which does not kill us, even if
we intensely dislike it. (3) Neither we, others, or life conditions absolutely MUST
be any way other than the way they actually are, have been or might be. (4) While
we can usefully rate a human being’s traits or behavior, there are no degrees of
humanity. Once created as a human being, one is never more or less than a human
being.
Effective REBT treatment comes by: (1) helping clients identify both emotional
problems and practical problems; (2) helping clients to reduce dysfunctional
emotional and behavioral responding, if such responding exists, by identifying and
reducing their adherence to IB’s and identifying and increasing their adherence to
RB’s; and (3) moving onto addressing the practical problems of fulfilling the one’s
deepest desires.

Reference

Ellis, A., & Dryden, W. (1987). The practice of rational-emotive therapy (RET). New York: Springer.

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