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VS BATTLES WIKI

God of War: Explaining

the Tiers
User blog

Introduction

This blog is being made in order to explain why

the God of War profiles are rated the way they
are currently. If you are seeing this because you
have some reservations and want more
information, check this thread where the
upgrade was originally accepted in and where I
elaborated on lots of stu! alongside other users.
Otherwise contact me on my wall directly.

This was mostly copied and pasted from my

original thread with some rewording and
recycling. I also reworked on some of my
counter arguments and sections, with credits to
Kepekley23 as well for providing some of the
wording in here.

Attack Potency

Primordials and Titans: Cronos and

Uranus

It all begins, of course, with the Primordials. The

beings who forged the universe itself, as shown
in the God of War: Ascension introduction.

In the intro we are shown 4 primordials. Here is a

screenshot of The Art of God of War: Ascension,
the o"cial artbook of the game, that names
them. Uranus, Ceto, Ourea, and Chaos.
Respectively, the heavens, the oceans, the
mountains and life itself.

If not obvious in the intro itself that the

Primordials created the universe, multiple Word
of Gods, like the senior SSM lead artist and the
senior writer of the series, from 2 to Ascension,
both confirm that they created the universe.
Ariel Lawrence, the writer, 's conversation is
even more telling, since she says they spawned
the galaxies. This should also be fairly obvious
from the intro itself, since Uranus, the starry
one, is shown creating all the nebulae and stars
in the universe, etc. when he falls down.

Likewise, I will provide more proof later aside

from just Word of God that the God of War
universe is a proper universe, with real sized
galaxies, real sized stars, proper celestial bodies
and etc, from the games and the lore.

You might ask why I'm talking about the

Primordials if their rating already reflects their
feats (not quite, but more on that later). I will
elaborate on that.

The most important and relevant Primordial on

God of War is Uranus, the creator of the cosmos
and the universe itself. The primary canon God
of War comics, by Marv Wolfman, have further
confirmation on Uranus's status as the creator of
the cosmos. Gyges, Uranus's first son and one of
the three hecantochires, states multiple times
that Uranus gave life to the universe, that
Uranus, as the son of Chaos, is the father of the
universe, and that those who were born to
Uranus have the right to rule all that he created.

Uranus's status as the father and creator of the

universe is extremely relevant to the scaling in
the God of War universe, because Uranus ended
up being defeated and overthrown by none
other than Cronos himself, identical to myth.
That's right, there are multiple sources and
statements in the series that Cronos defeated
and slayed his father Uranus and took control of
the universe from him.

First of all, when God of War: Ascension was

being promoted, Sony: Santa Monica created
multiple timelines to recapitulate what
happened in the series in order to tie everything
back to Ascension. Two of these timelines
outright state that Cronos overthrew Uranus.
These timeline statements came from the same
game that introduced Uranus, and showed him
creating the cosmos while fighting fellow
primordial Ceto. And that's far from everything.

As far as back as God of War 2, Cory Barlog

made a documentary where they established
that Cronos fought Uranus, and overthrew him
in battle in God of War's lore.

When asked about the timeline, the writer of God

of War Ascension confirmed that Cronos did
indeed beat Uranus. The senior director of
animation, when asked about it, said that the
battle between Cronos and Uranus would be
cosmic in scale, a mix of the Primordial War and
the Titan War. And when asked about it again,
several months later, he further reinforced that
Cronos and Uranus had a cosmic fight that
Cronos won. And it's still not all the evidence of
Cronos beating Uranus and seizing the rule of
the cosmos. Stig Asmussen, the director of God
of War 3, confirmed that the cycle of the son
overthrowing their father was a direct result of
fear and hatred, and that it began with Cronos
killing his father.

To put an end to the subject, Ascension, the

exact same game that introduced Uranus, refers
to Uranus being defeated by his son in the
multiplayer. Cronos' Blade's movelist includes a
move that is titled "Betrayal of Uranus". Clear
reference to Cronos fighting and betraying his
father. And I'll prove later that multiplayer-given
lore is canon to the series.

Primordials and Titans 2: Hyperion and

his spear

Now that we have established that Cronos did

indeed beat his father Uranus, who created the
universe in a fight, which we will further
establish once I get to the section where I will
debunk all counter arguments against my
position, we will be moving onto the other
universal like feats the series has.

Hyperion, Cronos's brother and one of the top

ranking Titans in the series, is stated in the
multiplayer to have forged a spear in the Sun's
core that possesses the strength to bear the
weight of the cosmos. For those who are still
questioning it, the God of War artbook confirms
that multiplayer weapons, armors and etc. are
canon to the God of War lore, so the description
is legitimate to the series' lore. Not only that, it
also contains a direct confirmation that the
descriptions which sound exaggerated and
over-the-top are all literally speaking the truth
regarding their scale.

The description is not mere hyperbole either.

One of the spear's moves is named "Scars of
Uranus". Referring to the literal embodiment of
the cosmos in the spear's move list adds even
more weight to its described ability, but, aside
from an admittedly secondary move name, there
is direct confirmation from Word of God that the
description is literal, and further confirmation
that it was Hyperion who forged the spear and
not someone else.

So the spear is extremely powerful but, in

comparison to the Blade of Olympus it's shit. We
know this because Hyperion was yet another
one of the Titans that Zeus sent to Tartarus with
it, and the proof of this is that on Chains of
Olympus, there is a scene where you see him in
Tartarus when Kratos falls on it at Charos' hands.
So, this spear, despite its force, is nothing
compared to the upper tiers of the verse. It
wasn't enough to turn the war on the Titans's
favor. The war was about equal before the Blade
of Olympus was forged.

Besides, Pandora's Box is still described as the

most powerful weapon on the God of War
universe, so it scales to everything else.

So, in short, Hyperion forged a spear that could

bear the weight of the universe itself and said
spear was still confirmedly not enough to put
him on any upper ground compared to the other
Olympian Gods in the war.

Primordials and Titans 3: Cronos, Father

of Time

Going back to the subject of Cronos.

In a conversation with Ariel Lawrence, the writer

of God of War 2, she stated that Cronos's birth
led to the very birth of time. Before any of you
"Twitter WoG-only feats are invalid" people try to
cry wolf, this is far from being the only thing
saying that Cronos created time, I'm just putting
it on the top of the section because I want to
highlight the confirmation.

The same WoG mentions, first of all, that time

didn't exist when the Primordials fought each
other - that is, eons and eons. Which indicates
an indefinitely vast period of time, something
that can't be ascribed. Which is supported first
and foremost by the wording Gaia (who narrates
the series) uses to describe it. She says it raged
on for "an eternity". She could've said hundreds
or thousands of years. The Titan War itself was
o"cially stated to have lasted hundreds of
years, which puts a quantifiable scale on it, but
the Primordial War is stated by all valid sources
to have lasted indefinitely long.

Why? Because, as WoG says, time didn't exist yet

when it took place, so it by no means can be
quantified. Now, we have more evidence
regarding Cronos' connection to time:

The Steeds of Time, the horses in God of War 2

that are tethered to the Island of Creation, were
gifted to the Sisters of Fate and personally
forged by Cronos in an attempt to have him
change his fate, as stated by Gaia in the game.
They are said to be "of Time" because of who
they belong to, namely Cronos. So the idea that
Cronos was a representation of time of sorts,
subtly traces back to God of War 2.

Secondly, one of the most telling pieces of

evidence actually comes from the new Norse
game. In the Comic Con 2018 panel dedicated to
God of War, they showed various concept arts of
Kratos. One of them states that Kratos's
bloodline is cursed by the cycle of patricide, a
cycle of son killing their fathers that "traces back
to the very beginning of time". This is a huge
indication of Cronos and the beginning of time
being related. The cycle of patricide began with
Cronos, Kratos's grandfather, killing his father,
Uranus. The cycle traces down to the beginning
of time, because Cronos began it, and his birth
led to the appearance of time.

And no, it's not a mere hyperbole considering

they emphasize it on the scan itself.

There's literally no other way to interpret this

statement - some of you might try to claim that
it might be referring to Uranus since he could
have killed his own Primordial parents as well in
the war, however this doesn't hold true since
Uranus is stated in the comics to be the son of
Chaos - and Chaos is a woman in the series, as
seen here. So he didn't start the cycle, since the
description specifies sons slaying their fathers,
not their mothers.

Finally, the last piece of evidence that Cronos

birthed time is that Gaia, his mother, and the
Titans in general are stated to consider time
meaningless. Remember that Cronos was the
last Titan to be born, so it makes sense that his
kin who are older than him wouldn't really be
bound by something that is younger than they
are.

You might try to claim that this could be

referring to their age, but the context of the
statement makes this an untrue explanation, for
the below reasons;

When Kratos defeats the Sisters of Fate and

travels back through time to change his fate,
teleporting all the Titans to the future and
reversing thousands of years worth of events,
they are completely una!ected by the changes.
Despite the fact that Kratos reversed them
being banned to Tartarus so that it never
happened to begin with, the past isn't retconned
from their memories and the events of time.
Helios, in fact, mentions the events of Chains of
Olympus (more on that later), which were only
possible because Zeus and the Gods won the
war and banished the Titans to Tartarus.

In fact, Gaia from the past not only recognizes

future Kratos, she knows everything about their
deal, such as the fact that she saved Kratos
several thousand years later from dying at
Zeus's hands in order to serve the Titans. And
Gaia is stated on the same novels to be
omnipresent

I already expect people to say "if the Titans

weren't restrained by time and knew all the
future events, how did they lose the war?"

The answer is easy enough, and answered by

God of War 2. The Sisters of Fate, who, as the
description should reveal, control the fates of
everyone (and everything, including the
landscape like rivers and volcanoes), were the
ones to deem that the Titans lost the war. In
fact, they lost because the Sisters manipulated
their threads to their liking, as Lahkesis states
herself when she meets Kratos. So no, it's not a
contradiction.

To summarize, Cronos was stated by WoG to

have birthed time with his appearance, the new
game's concept arts describe the cycle of
patricide, which was started by Cronos when he
killed Uranus, as something that traced back to
the literal (emphasized) beginning of time, the
Primordial War which took place prior to Cronos'
existence is also somewhat suggested to have
taken place before time itself, the Titans are
implied not to be restricted by time, and finally
Gaia herself knows everything that's ever
happened, future or past, time paradoxes or no
paradoxes, and is Acausal, which supports this.

The Olympians 1: Helios and Nyx

Okay, so we have talked about the Titans and

the Primordials and their feats. Up until now, it
was possible, although ignoring di"culties to
argue that the Titans beating Primordial
characters was an outlier. It all comes crashing
down with the Olympians, however.

Olympians in the series also have feats of

fighting and overpowering primordial deities.
Helios, the god (technically Titan, but he is a god
too) of the Sun, is stated to banish Nyx, the
primordial of the stars and the night, from the
nightsky and make her retreat everyday. As the
narrator of the level states, "on the edge of the
Aegean, where the Great God, Helios, banishes
Nyx from the nightsky". And, as I've proven and
linked before, multiplayer-given lore was meant
to be literal lore, given to the God of War
universe.

This means that Helios is able to forcibly make

Nyx retreat. I'll later dedicate a section to
completely refute any allegations about "Nyx"
being a metaphor to refer to Helios bringing the
day like the last thread argued, but for now it
should be enough.

Nyx in the God of War universe by herself

already has a feat that is arguably cosmic in
scale. Kratos temporarily comes across a portal
to an alternate dimension guarded by a statue of
Nyx on Ascension, and said dimension,
according to WoG, is a dimension that Nyx
inhabits that has eternal night and is a mirror
world of our own, containing a real moon in the
sky and even stars (which makes sense, since
Nyx in God of War is the same primordial of stars
and the night sky seen in myth). This both
shows that, if Nyx could help it, it'd be night
forever, meaning Helios is forcing her to leave,
and that she is able to warp/control a dimension
that is a mirror of our own.

She doesn't only have this feat. There is also the

statement that all the primordials are roughly
equal in strength and that none of them were
explicitly ahead of each other. This is why they
never managed to cooperate all that well and
didn't have a hierarchy, unlike with the Titans
and the Gods, who ultimately ruled the universe
with their own hierarchy of power. Atlas was the
strongest Titan physically, and Cronos the
strongest magically, while Hyperion was a right
hand of sorts to Cronos, alongside Atlas. The
Olympians had Zeus as the top god, with his
brothers Hades and Poseidon being the next
best and the rulers of their respective realms.
Together the three ruled all the other
Olympians.

And what makes even more sense is that said

dimensional portal is inside the Lantern of
Delos, a structure that is stated by the oracle,
Aletheia, to be located at the edge of the
Aegean Sea - the same place that Helios is
stated to banish Nyx in.

In short, Helios can force a primordial being,

Nyx, to retreat, with said Primordial having
participated in a war with the explicitly Universal
Father Uranus, as well as being confirmed to be
comparable to him.

The Olympians 2: Zeus and Olympus

Of course, the Titans were ultimately overthrown

and cast aside by their children, the Gods,
especially Zeus,who grew mighty and forced his
father to vomit the children he had eaten. Zeus
forcibly took control of the universe from the
Titans and banished them to Tartarus. So, of
course, Zeus scales beyond everyone else in the
verse. The only one who is stronger than Zeus
by the end of the series is Kratos, who is stated
by WoG to be at the top of the verse's Greek
Pantheon, which, of course, is supported by a
mountain of feats and statements.

WoG rea"rms that the Titans and the Olympians

are generally equal to the Primordials, which
makes crystal clear sense with what we have
established so far in this post. Helios, the sixth
or fifth greatest god, forces Nyx to retreat every
night. Cronos slayed his father Uranus, the
father of the universe, and was in turn
overthrown by his son, Zeus, in battle. So they
replaced each other. Zeus is the strongest, o'
course, since he beat a prime Cronos. And
Kratos, especially with the Power of Hope, is
stronger than Zeus and at the very top of the
Greek World, and perhaps all of the God of War
multiverse and pantheons.

We also have an in-game feat where Kratos

when he was the God of War was able to defeat
Thanatos, the embodiment of death who is
implied to be a Primordial because of his
description in the game stating he existed "long,
long before the rule of the Olympians and the
Titans", and thus would have participated on
that war with Uranus and Nyx as well and would
receive powerscaling from them. He also
created and warps the Domain of Death, which
is a separate dimension, but we have no clear
confirmation on that dimension's size so that's
an unquantifiable feat and just worthy passingly
mentioning.

Hades, Zeus's older brother, could roughly

compete with Cronos in raw strength. The same
Hades confirmed that he gets stronger with soul
consumption and he absorbed the soul of the
strongest of the Titans, Atlas, and thousands, if
not millions of normal souls after that. So he's
much stronger than he was back then, and
Kratos went toe to toe with him. The same
Kratos absorbed Hades's soul and got several
amps throughout 3, before tanking and
overpowering daddy-o Cronos himself, and
easily at that, before ultimately killing him with
the Blade of Olympus, the same blade that,
despite one shotting Cronos, failed to one shot
Zeus, even when used against him several times
at once. He was just temporarily weakened.
Even in GoW3, after being stabbed by it again
and pinned to Gaia's heart before it explodes, he
still survives. In the end, Kratos has to reobtain
hope and get over his guilt at slaying his family
to beat the life out of Zeus, ending the reign of
the Olympians once and for all.

The Olympians 3: World Pillar, Crisis on

Infinite Underearths

You'll pardon me for the horrible pun-reference

in the section title, but I couldn't contain myself.
This will be the last section concerning the
attack potency feats of the Greek Universe of
God of War before we move onto speed feats,
and will focus on the plot of Chains of Olympus,
namely Persephone conspiring with Atlas to
destroy the pillar that holds everything, taking
down Olympus.

The World Pillar on God of War does not merely

hold up the world disk like argued in the old
thread. There are several statements sugesting
the World Pillar is the landmark that literally
holds up everything in the God of War universe
together. It was stated in the o"cial Ascension
promotional timeline that, were the pillar
destroyed, all of creation would be taken out
alongside it. And this was reiterated in another
timeline that followed this one.

And it's not just these timelines. As Persephone

herself said, all that came before would end.
And, the cake part, Persephone states that the
world would revert into Chaos.

What she means by that requires us to consult

other sources in the matter. As stated by
Athena, Chaos is actually the primordial realm,
the void that preceded the universe and time
itself. The exact same void that spawned the
primordials and ended up being connquered and
brought to order by Uranus. Which means
Persephone is basically stating that, were the
World Pillar destroyed, the universe would revert
to the same void it indirectly came from. Poetic,
right? Also major confirmation.

To put an end to the subject, the God of War II

instruction manual states that Atlas in GoW is
holding up the heavens above his shoulders
(Atlas is standing on top of the destabilized
World Pillar doing its job, for those not aware.
Also, for the love of god, please check the
section where I counter arguments made
against my case before pointing out the mistake
I know you're about to point out).

Heavens, as in the original mythology, is a term

that in God of War is exchanged with cosmos
and universe. There is a number of examples of
this: