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The Truth About Soy

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Cy_Willson
Mar 14

It’s Definitely an Endocrine

Disrupter

“ T Nation has been reporting on the

hormone-disrupting effects of soy since the
year 2000, but some still say it’s a myth. It’s
not. Here’s why.

Some say it’s a myth that soy can lower

testosterone levels and have estrogenic effects
in men. Well, it’s not a myth. Sure, the effects of
soy require qualification and context, but they’re
real.

Negative Effects of Soy: The Evidence

Randomized controlled trials are the strongest

type of study. They provide an intervention,
randomize subjects into an active versus control
group, and blind the participants and
researchers as to who’s receiving an active or
control. This helps us assess whether the
independent variable (soy isoflavones) can
impact the dependent variable (testosterone).

Here are those studies in support of the

soy/testosterone relationship:

1. Randomized Controlled Trials

Showing Decreased Androgens
In a randomized controlled trial with crossover,
35 healthy men consumed a protein supplement
consisting of either milk protein isolate (MPI), low
isoflavone soy protein isolate (LISPI), or high
isoflavone soy protein isolate (HISPI) for 57
days, followed by a 28-day washout before
switching proteins (1). The MPI, LISPI, and
HISPI groups consumed 0, 1.64, and 61.7
mg/day of soy isoflavones, respectively.

The LISPI and HISPI groups experienced a

decreased serum dihydrotestosterone (a 5
alpha-reduced testosterone metabolite
responsible for androgenic effects in certain
tissues) and DHT/testosterone ratio as
compared with the MPI group at day 57. Serum
testosterone was decreased only in the LISPI
group as compared to the MPI at day 29 and
HISPI group and only at day 57.

Interestingly, the study also looked at whether

there were any differences in these values
between equol producers and those who
weren’t. Equol is a metabolite of one of the two
main soy isoflavones – genistein – that’s more
estrogenic than daidzein. It reported no
differences (2, 3).

In a randomized trial with crossover, 42 healthy

men, ages 35-62 years, consumed either 150
grams of lean red meat per day for 4 weeks or
290 grams of tofu (soy isoflavone content not
reported but probably around 66 mg/day) (5).

While total testosterone levels weren’t different

between the two groups, sex hormone binding
globulin (SHBG) – a protein that binds to
testosterone, making it unavailable – was 3%
higher in the tofu group, while the free androgen
index (FAI) was 7% lower.

In another trial, 19 healthy men consumed

scones made with either soy flour (containing
120 mg/day of soy isoflavones) or wheat flour for
6 weeks, followed by a 6-week washout period
(6). The soy flour eaters experienced a 5.7%
decrease in total testosterone.

In still another trial, 58 men, ages 50-85 years, at

high risk for developing prostate cancer, were
assigned to one of three groups of protein
supplementation (7). One group received 40
grams of soy protein isolate containing
approximately 107 mg/day of isoflavones. The
next group received soy protein isolate with
greatly reduced isoflavone levels (< 6 mg/day). A
third group got milk protein isolate (no soy
isoflavones).

After 6 months of supplementation, androgen

receptor (AR) expression in the prostate was
lower in the soy protein isolate with isoflavones,
while AR expression was increased in the milk
protein isolate group. The decrease in AR
expression is a positive effect regarding prostate
cancer.

One more: Healthy younger males aged 21

years were given 20 grams per day of whey
protein, soy protein isolate (26.3 mg of soy
isoflavones), or a placebo each day for 14 days
(9).
The subjects then performed resistance exercise
and had post-exercise hormone levels
evaluated. From 5 to 30 minutes post-exercise,
the soy eaters had significantly lower
testosterone levels than those consuming whey
protein and placebo. This suggests that soy
protein isolate may blunt the normal increase in
testosterone experienced after lifting (8).

2. Open-Label Studies

Open-label studies (where the researchers and

subjects are aware of what they’re given) without
a control group and randomization are prone to
confounders. More caution is warranted, but they
can still provide potentially useful info.

In one such study, 12 healthy men ages 25-47

years were given 56 grams per day of soy
protein isolate for 28 days (10). Total isoflavone
content wasn’t evaluated but may have been
around 51 mg (11).

After 28 days, total testosterone decreased by

an average of 19% and began to increase again
within two weeks after discontinuing the
supplement. Luteinizing hormone (LH), which
provides the initial signal for testicular
testosterone production, also decreased, albeit
not to a statistically significant extent.

In another study, 28 healthy men ages 30-59

years were given 60 mg/day of a soy isoflavone
supplement for 3 months (12). While estradiol
didn’t change when comparing baseline values
to those taken after 3 months, SHBG increased
while DHT and free testosterone decreased, but
only in the group of men classified as equol
producers.

3. Case Reports

Case reports are good for identifying potential

hypotheses, but because they’re subject to so
many uncontrolled variables, they generally don’t
allow scientists to conclude cause-effect.

There’s one case report on a 19-year-old male

who, aside from having type I diabetes mellitus,
was otherwise healthy. Physicians reported he
was suffering from erectile dysfunction, lack of
libido, and suppressed total and free
testosterone (13).

It turns out he was consuming very high

amounts of soy products, with an estimated daily
total soy isoflavone intake of 360 mg for a year.
Once he quit the soy, his symptoms normalized
over time.

The physicians attribute the effects experienced

by this young man to soy intake. This seems
reasonable, but he was also consuming
atorvastatin (a statin drug), which may decrease
testosterone (14-16).

The authors didn’t report whether the patient

also ceased consuming his medications,
including atorvastatin. Knowing that would’ve
helped to solidify the case against soy.
Nonetheless, it’s an interesting case.

There are also a couple of case reports of soy-

associated gynecomastia with excessive
consumption (17,18). In one case, the total soy
isoflavone was around 360 mg/day (17).

This case was also unusual due to the

substantial rise of the estrogens, estradiol and
estrone. Studies generally haven’t found an
increase in estradiol or estrone with soy
consumption, although some have, oddly
enough, with soy protein supplementation that
appears to be unrelated to soy isoflavone
content (1,7,19).

If related to isoflavone content alone, a potential

explanation might be increased aromatase
activity after high concentrations of genistein are
reached in certain tissues (at least 100 nmol),
leading to the formation of excess estrogens
(20).

However, this wouldn’t explain how soy protein

with minimal isoflavone levels could lead to
increased estrogens. It may simply be a chance
finding or this could represent yet another
unexplained discrepancy, but it’s most likely the
former. In any event, gynecomastia is likely to be
very rare and probably involves other variables.

Finally, a more recent case report featured a 54-

year-old male that developed secondary
hypogonadism after drinking 1.2 L per day of soy
milk containing an estimated 310 mg of
isoflavones for a period of 3 years (110).

His LH, total, and free testosterone levels were

dramatically suppressed but normalized after he
stopped drinking it. He also suffered from
erectile dysfunction and gynecomastia, which
improved after he ditched the soy milk.

However, his estradiol levels weren’t elevated

and were below the normal range, presumably
due to the lack of testosterone production. He
was following a low-carbohydrate diet, but there
was no report of any other abnormal medical
history or medications that might explain his
symptoms.

4. Observational Data

In an observational study of Japanese men, an

inverse association was found between total and
free testosterone and soy product intake (21).
However, these types of studies are also prone
to potential confounders where variables other
than the one you’re evaluating are involved.

A recent study found a significant association

between urinary levels of soy isoflavones
(especially genistein) and decreased plasma
testosterone levels (111).

Evidence Not Supporting Negative

Effects of Soy
Admittedly, there are several randomized
controlled trials in men that haven’t displayed an
effect on testosterone levels (24-29). Intake
levels of total soy isoflavones have ranged from
24-138 mg/day, with typically around 65 mg/day.
Total genistein has ranged from 36-54 mg/day.

Does Soy Cause Gimpy Semen?

In a prospective observational study, a higher

urinary excretion of soy isoflavones was
associated with decreased semen quality (39),
while another study only found a decrease in
associated sperm concentration (40).

An observational study in Chinese men also

revealed similar findings concerning sperm
quality, which is consistent with data in Japanese
men (41,42). However, a recent cross-sectional
observational study failed to find any such
association (111).

It’s important to note, though, that randomized,

controlled trials have failed to find an adverse
effect of soy isoflavone supplementation on
semen (43,44). One study also evaluated those
that were equol producers and found no
association with semen quality (43).

Why the Discrepancies in Studies?

Why do some studies find testosterone drops

while others don’t? There are several possible
explanations, many of which include differences
in methodology: strength of study design, soy
isoflavone intake level and formulation,
bioavailability of the isoflavones in the food or
supplement, study subject characteristics,
testosterone assay methods, etc.

However, while the evidence isn’t conclusive,

there are data to support the hypothesis that
equol production is one possible determinant of
the estrogenic effects of soy isoflavones (45).
Remember, equol is as potent or more potent as
the major soy isoflavones, genistein and
daidzein, respectively.

Soy Isoflavones Are Estrogenic: The

Dosages Required

Soy isoflavones can exert direct estrogenic

effects in the form of ER-beta agonism (a
compound’s ability to bind to and activate the
estrogen receptor subtype beta). This agonism
from soy isoflavones is achievable with lower
doses of soy isoflavones (genistein in particular),
around 0.25 to 1 mg/kg, although it could be
higher if factoring in potential protein-binding.

This ER agonsim isn’t necessarily a bad thing.

It’s linked with beneficial effects on
cardiovascular, bone, and prostate health.
Although, the potential benefits of soy may also
be mediated through mechanisms unrelated to
binding to and activating ER-beta.

Unlike the direct estrogenic effects, hormonal

effects (decreased testosterone) probably
require doses much higher than 1 mg/kg before
small effects are seen. Of course, this is
complicated by both the large inter-individual
variation in how the soy isoflavones are
absorbed and metabolized, as well as potential
differences between individuals in terms of
tissue sensitivity to the soy isoflavones.

In any event, doses of soy isoflavones of around

1 mg/kg (and between 0.25 to .75 mg/kg
genistein) can produce average unconjugated
genistein peak plasma concentration of around
10-20 nmol. These concentrations are effectively
maintained with daily consumption. (34,35,66-
69).

These concentrations are well within the range

where genistein can act as an ER-beta agonist
in vitro (3,31,33,70-72). Furthermore, plasma
concentrations alone can be significantly lower
than the tissue concentrations, depending on
how the soy isoflavones are distributed
throughout the body and how much is bound.

The data for exactly how much we should expect

to be bound aren’t clear. Many studies use
concentrations well beyond what’s relevant to
administration in humans. But based on in vitro
data showing a higher affinity at lower
concentrations and animal model data, it’s safe
to assume that at least 50% is protein-bound at
any given time (82,104-108). So, even higher
doses of soy isoflavones and genistein
specifically may be needed before ER-beta
agonism is likely.

Soy Isoflavones Affect Testosterone:

The Dosages Required
While the concentrations required for direct
estrogenic activity are attainable with a
reasonable level of soy intake, the dose required
for effects on testosterone is likely higher,
probably at least 1.5 to 2 mg/kg, before small
effects are seen in sensitive individuals.

However, even greater amounts may be required

when factoring in protein-binding. In vitro data
evaluating genistein show the concentrations
necessary for inhibiting or interfering with
testosterone synthesis are in the range of
around 40-90 nmol (76,77).

This would also indicate that very high doses,

presumably between 4-8 mg/kg, would be
required before a substantial decrease in
testosterone would be seen (78-80). This fits
with the doses consumed in case reports. While
other mechanisms have been proposed to
account for the potential lowering of
testosterone, those often require very high
concentrations (1 umol or much higher) of the
unconjugated isoflavone, which isn’t attainable
even with extremely high consumption.

Finally, aside from enzymatic mechanisms likely

only affected with high doses, the estrogen
receptor alpha (ER-alpha) subtype could also
induce negative feedback if activated by
isoflavones (81). However, genistein, for
example, would require much higher doses to
activate the ER-alpha versus the ER-beta.

In particular, doses between 3-8 mg/kg would

potentially be needed before plasma
concentrations could reach concentrations
capable of making this a potential issue as far as
lowering testosterone via reduced gonadotropin
secretion (3,31,33,70-72,79,80,82).

Although, these concentrations in plasma would

also need to be attained in the brain – the
hypothalamus and pituitary – which isn’t
necessarily the case for the parts of the brain
that are of concern for hormone signaling which
exist outside the blood-brain barrier.

And remember, when factoring in protein-

binding, the 3-8 mg/kg dose may be
underestimating the amount required for
concentrations necessary for ER-alpha agonism
(82,104-108).

Soy, Birth Control Pills, and

Misadventures in In-Vitro Assays

A recent in vitro assay purporting to reveal

“estradiol equivalents” or E2Eq for various food
items indicated that a cooked tofu burger (198 g)
could potentially contribute E2Eqs of 19 pg/mL
(the normal range for a man listed was 10-40
pg/mL) (83).

The authors also reported that the total amount

of estrogenic activity for the tofu burger was
three times that of a 125 mg dose of the
estrogen replacement drug Premarin, which
contains 1.25 mg of conjugated estrogens. To
make matters more worrying, they indicated that
a soy burger has 1/10th the activity of a low-
dose estrogen-containing oral contraceptive.
These results seem alarming, but I’m afraid the
comparisons aren’t likely appropriate. First, the
authors assume 10% bioavailability for the
estrogenic components of the tofu burger.
However, the 10% bioavailability is based on
total isoflavone content and not the
unconjugated portion (84-86).

This figure is highly variable between individuals,

but just as importantly, the unconjugated portion
of genistein is a small fraction of that 10%
(varying from a fraction of a percent up to around
3%). Furthermore, considering the genistein
content of that burger is around 20 mg, it makes
it highly unlikely that the concentrations
necessary for such strong estrogenic activity to
occur in humans would occur after eating it.

Secondly, the authors’ method for calculating

hypothetical blood values simply takes total
blood volume and uses this to determine
hypothetical blood values. However, this
assumes that the soy isoflavones or E2Eqs
remain in the blood and aren’t distributed
anywhere else in the body. This is highly unlikely
and is likely to substantially overestimate blood
values.

While this may be a fun hypothetical exercise,

the truth is that very large amounts are likely
required for certain sensitive individuals to
experience negative estrogenic effects from soy
isoflavones in food.

Duration
Not only is the dose of soy isoflavones an
important factor, but the duration of consumption
may also be important, at least when it comes
direct estrogenic effects.

For example, long-term soy consumption may

increase production of equol (the more potent
metabolite of daidzen), at least in some people
(88). Additionally, in studies evaluating the
potential estrogenic effects of soy isoflavones in
women, an average of 13.4 weeks were required
to achieve 50% of maximal effects and 48 weeks
to achieve 80% (89).

Why Should You Care?

Most people will want to know what the end

results would be from consuming soy
isoflavones. Would the decrease in testosterone
be enough to impact their muscle mass? What
about any direct estrogenic effects?

Unfortunately, there don’t seem to be any clear

answers. The best I could do was find a study
that supplemented untrained younger men
undergoing resistance training with soy protein
concentrate, whey protein concentrate, or
placebo for 12 weeks (25).

This was a well-designed study. However, some

potential weaknesses in this study include the
lower dose of soy isoflavones (64 mg/day
consisting of around 28 mg of daidzein and 36
mg of genistein as consumed in a soy protein
concentrate consisting of around 80 g of
protein), the untrained subjects, and the lack of
pharmacokinetic data.

Additionally, while there was no statistically

significant difference between the soy protein
concentrate, whey concentrate, and placebo
groups, only the soy group experienced a
decrease in total testosterone. This small
decrease was probably due to chance.

More likely, the doses administered were too low

to have a negative impact on testosterone, but
evaluating individual data might help identify if
there’s potential support for the notion that there
are more sensitive individuals that aren’t
frequently represented in these studies (63).

The study also evaluated androgen receptor

mRNA and AR protein in skeletal muscle, along
with body composition and muscle fiber type
cross-sectional area, but there was no difference
between groups for lean mass gain or body
composition.

In other studies, soy protein was shown to be

inferior to whey protein. However, it’s believed
that this is due to differences in protein quality,
digestibility, and leucine content (93,94).

Muscle Fiber Hypertrophy and ER-beta

While body composition was unaffected by the

protein supplements in the study above, whey
protein concentrate had a large effect size upon
type II muscle fiber cross-sectional area, while
soy protein concentrate had a large effect size
upon type I muscle fiber cross-sectional area
(25).

In effect, whey protein increased type II muscle

fibers (fast twitch) to a larger extent, while soy
protein increased type I (slow twitch), an effect
mirrored in animal models (95,96). This is an
interesting finding itself, but it’s also supportive
of the notion that the soy protein concentrate
exerted an estrogenic effect because other
studies showed a similar effect in women taking
estrogenic oral contraceptives (97).

So, Who’s Vulnerable?

Some people who consume very high amounts

of soy isoflavones can experience a negative
effect on testosterone or androgen levels. These
individuals are probably more prone to the
effects of soy due to inter-individual differences
in isoflavone metabolism and perhaps
pharmacodynamic variables that make them
more sensitive.

These folks are unlikely to experience negative

effects of soy consumption except in cases
where soy is a major source of their protein and
they have high protein requirements. For
example, a vegan bodybuilder who nearly
exclusively relies on soy protein with significant
amounts of soy isoflavones and consumes very
large quantities.
These rare sensitive individuals might
experience a sufficient estrogenic effect and a
substantial decrease in T levels (a 50%
decrease, although this also depends upon
numerous variables, including baseline
testosterone). As a result, you might expect a
blunting of positive effects upon skeletal muscle
from resistance exercise (101,102), but this is
highly speculative.

To illustrate how rare this would be, you don’t

have to look beyond studies comparing the
effects of soy protein to whey or other forms.
Soy protein generally performs adequately, and
in cases where it does show inferior results, it’s
likely due to differences in leucine content and
protein quality.

The Bottom Line

Whenever there are discordant data in science,

we must look for explanations. In this case, a
reasonable hypothesis can help explain why
studies evaluating the effects of soy protein on
androgen levels in humans aren’t consistent:

Dose-dependency. High amounts of soy

isoflavones are likely required.
Duration of exposure may be a factor.
It may depend upon the individual,
including unique genetic and
environmental factors, along with
unusually high consumption of soy
isoflavones.
If your protein supplementation consists
entirely of a soy protein product with a
significant amount of isoflavones, it could
impact the hypertrophy experienced by
muscle fiber type compared to other
protein sources. This may be related to
agonism at the ER-beta. Additionally, it
may blunt the effects on androgen
receptor expression from lifting compared
to whey protein. Although, thus far, it
doesn’t appear this negatively affects
gains in lean mass. While some studies
show differences in gains of lean mass
when supplementing with whey versus
soy, this is best explained by differences
in protein quality and leucine content.
Occasional consumption of soy protein or
soy foods is unlikely to have a significant
impact.
Larger studies evaluating equol producer
status, including pharmacokinetic data for
genistein alongside testosterone levels
and lean mass in trained subjects, would
be useful to provide clearer answers.
The greatest risk is likely in those who
consume a high protein diet and get most
of that from soy. Small effects on hormone
levels in certain individuals likely require
doses greater than 1.5 to 2 mg/kg of soy
isoflavones and possibly much greater,
including twice these values or more. This
requires significant, practically unrealistic
consumption of soy-based foods. Soy
protein supplements also vary in their
isoflavone content. See table below.
 Modern soy-containing beef alternatives
like the Impossible Burger also are
unlikely to contribute problematic amounts
of soy isoflavones.
Effects on hormone levels might include a
decrease in total testosterone and free
testosterone. But these effects would be
small and unlikely to be clinically
meaningful. Very large doses (probably in
the range of 3-8 mg/kg or higher of
genistein, for example), and in only
certain individuals, may have significant
enough effects to impact well-being.
When factoring in protein-binding, doses
may need to be in the range of 6 mg/kg or
higher for genistein.

Bottom line, unless you’re a rare individual,

eating the occasional soy-heavy meal isn’t going
to affect you to any noticeable degree. But avoid
soy protein isolates, just as much for their
comparatively poor leucine content as their
relatively high concentration of soy isoflavones.

Nevertheless, don’t let anyone tell you that the

notion that soy can affect testosterone and
estrogen is a myth.

Soy Isoflavone Content of Selected

Foods

Total
Isoflavone
Total (mg) Genistein
Content
Isoflavones* (mg)*
(mg) in 1
lb.
 Soy or
Veggie 6.39 5.01 29
Burger
Soy Hot
1 0.60 4.5
Dog
Low-fat Soy
2.56 1.51 12
Milk
Veggie
Sausage 3.75 2.70 17
Links
Meatless
14.34 9.23 65
Sausage
Soy Protein
Concentrate
(processed 94.65 52.81 429
via water
wash)
Soy Protein
Concentrate
(processed 11.49 5.26 52
via alcohol
extraction)
Soy Protein
91.05 57.28 413
Isolate

* Milligrams per 100 gram serving.

The no-soy protein powder:

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 Metabolic Drive® protein not only tastes
as good as a decadent milkshake, it also
provides a blend of the most technically
advanced and highest-quality proteins
available anywhere – making it the
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enhancing...

► References
last visit
heath_watts Mar 15

This is all still mostly mythology.

Skip to main content

Straight
Straight Talk
Talk About
About Soy
Soy

The Takeaway: Soy is a unique food that is

widely studied for its estrogenic and anti-
estrogenic effects on the body. Studies
may seem to present conflicting
conclusions about soy, but this is larg…

Is T-Nation funded by the dairy industry?

Does it have a connection with the crackpots at
Weston A Price?

Cy_Willson Mar 15

I tried to be as clear as possible in the article but

it had to be edited for length.
There’s nothing wrong with soy or soy protein. In
some very rare cases, sensitive individuals
(likely due to genetically influenced differences in
pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics)
extremely high intake of soy isoflavones can
potentially impact androgen levels. However, the
amount of soy isoflavones you would need to
consume are pretty unrealistic for 99.9% of
people. You really need the combination of
absurd soy isoflavone consumption and inherent
sensitivity. Anything not meeting those criteria
are unlikely to have a negative effect upon
androgen levels and if there are any changes,
it’s unlikely to be clinically meaningful.

The direct estrogenic effects at the ER-beta

subtype is responsible for many of the beneficial
effects of soy. Whether it may influence skeletal
muscle fiber type hypertrophy probably needs
more research.

My main point is that you can’t call something a

“myth” just because it’s rare and requires very
unique circumstances. Like a lot of things,
context is required.

juice421 Mar 15

I have more faith in Weston Price over any

conventional sickcare, $cientism-based
allopathic “research” group. The arrogance you
show proves my point that most normies don’t
see the wisdom of ancestral health & wellness.
Good luck soyboy.
 JokerFMJ Mar 15

Speaking of estrogen… There was an article a

while back that gave some lab codes for
estrogen testing for men. Anyone happen to
remember those?

heath_watts Mar 15

That’s just silly. The WAP is pure nonsense. I’ve

been eating soy for 25 years. I’m likely stronger
than you are even at my advanced age, and this
interaction shows that I’m smarter than you are.
“Normy”? Ha!

Mandors Mar 15

I’m kind of confused. Ninety percent of this

article seems to be a well written and sited
indictment of the effect of soy on human health
and hormone levels.
“The Bottom” line is by contrast an equivocal
throw-your-hands-up-in-the-air “well, don’t worry
it all depends.”

Cy_Willson Mar 15

The RCT’s which have the strongest design

either show no change or small changes in
group averages. My focus is more on the outliers
which sometimes show more substantial
changes. Of course, looking at outliers in
controlled studies risks turning them into case
reports but nonetheless it can be useful.
The main question is why there are these
discrepancies in some studies and I think the
most obvious explanation is the difference in
pharmacokinetics (isoflavone levels in plasma
can very several hundred to over a thousand fold
difference between individuals) and
pharmacodynamics. But even so, if we accept
that as the reason we have to further explain
why it doesn’t show up so readily in various
studies. I think that’s also due to the dose
required.

The, “well, it depends” answer isn’t as satisfying

but it applies to a lot of potential adverse effects
of various compounds.

hermenau Mar 15

The T.H. Chan school of public health? Yeah… I

wouldn’t trust that to be a reputable source of
health advice for soy.

They also think that seed oils are good for you
and that you shouldn’t take aspirin.

Harvard has incredibly debased themselves over

the years.

Benitonatty Mar 15

People get confused because of Industry

Funded Research. Soy is a big industry and it
doesn’t take much money at all to request a
report with a positive spin. Same deal with
basically al research, it’s a shame but it’s reality.

A lot of women think they are immune to soy,

that they have estrogen anyway so it doesn’t
matter. But look at the incidence of terrible
diseases such as endometriosis and breast
cancer in modern times.

jacek_p Mar 15

This article from harvard site doesn’t bring

anything meaningful to the discussion. I have no
idea why you even put it here. If you are
providing it here, at least elaborate why do you
think it has any kind of relevance and/or
connection with the content of the article you are
commenting.

heath_watts Mar 15

Here is a meta-analysis paper from 2021

showing that soy intake does not adversely
affect male hormones.

Neither soy nor

isoflavone intake
affects male
reproductive hormones: An...

Concerns that the phytoestrogens

(isoflavones) in soy may feminize men
continue to be raised. Several studies and
case-reports describing feminizing e…
 heath_watts Mar 15

Thanks for your reply. I posted this in response

to another question. This paper is a meta-
analysis of research to date in 2021 that shows
that soy does no affect male hormones.
I agree that more research could be necessary
but it is important to know that a good portion of
the anti-soy information that has been circulating
for >20 years was generated by non-scientist
quacks at the Weston A Price Foundation.

Neither soy nor

isoflavone intake
affects male
reproductive hormones: An...

Concerns that the phytoestrogens

(isoflavones) in soy may feminize men
continue to be raised. Several studies and
case-reports describing feminizing e…

cyclonengineer Mar 15

From the article:

Declaration of Competing Interest

“Mark Messina has a conflict of interest. Dr.
Messina regularly consults for companies that
manufacture and/or sell soy products. Mindy
Kurzer is on the scientific advisory board of the
Soy Nutrition Institute.”

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Does not seem to be a non-biased study. So

they didn’t receive funding for this specific study
but both lead authors have a direct financial
interest in promoting soy based product.

I am of the opinion we still don’t know but it

doesn’t seem that whey or Caesin affects
test/estrogen levels so why take the chance?

Andrewgen_Receptors Mar 15

heath_watts:

I’ve been eating soy for 25 years. I’m likely

stronger than you are even at my advanced
age

Whoa, calm down dude! Your Soy Diet-Induced

Estrogen is off the charts!

Refer to 1st reply below for my thoughts on

this post being flagged.

Beastiemode Mar 15

I wish they’d included women in this study

because anecdotally, estrogenic substances
cause a 5.2% increase in thigh-binding blobulin.

Andrewgen_Receptors Mar 15

lol who was so offended by me that they felt it

necessary to report this comment? Was it
@heath_watts by chance? The same dude that
posted:

heath_watts:

I’m likely stronger than you are even at my

advanced age, and this interaction shows
that I’m smarter than you are.

Question about this meta analysis you keep

posting: Do you think the authors may have
been incentivized to promote soy based
products based on their financial stakes in the
Soy Industry?

Cy_Willson Mar 15

Meta-analyses can be very useful but they aren’t

particularly helpful in identifying a specific
change if the majority of studies utilized aren’t
likely going to be relevant for a particular
question. For example, if the vast majority of
studies utilize a dose of 65 mg or less, yet you
suspect negative effects upon testosterone
levels may begin over 100 mg, the pooling of
data isn’t going to be very helpful to answer the
question. In this case, Reed et al. readily note
their limitations in the discussion section. In fact,
they discuss equol, androgen receptor
expression and decreased testosterone in
studies utilizing doses of 100 mg or more.

heath_watts Mar 15

I’d ask if you even lift, but if you’re shown in the

photo, I know you don’t.

Andrewgen_Receptors Mar 15

heath_watts:

I’d ask if you even lift, but if you’re shown in

the photo, I know you don’t

Did this sound smarter in your head? zoom in a

bit so you can see my tiny muscles

The Best Pre-Workout is Hatred