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Bramhasambandh

Topic: http://pushtikul.com/link.asp?TOPIC_ID=1550
Date: 14 July 2023

Topic author: unnati

Subject: Bramhasambandh
Posted on: 01 March 2006 19:10:55
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Can any one explain this

1) The recitation of Gadh Mantra (Sahastra Parivatsar.....) is been

recited in front of thakoreji. Now in this there is a line Daragar
Putrapta........ which means to dedicate wife, son etc.... So here my
query
arises that how can a women dedicate herself by sayin daragar,
putrapta as
she herself is a wife and how can she have a wife.

Unnati Kadakia

Reply author: vaibhav_shah

Date: 01 March 2006 19:31:32
Message:

jay jay shree gokulesh

i have alos a query.

is it required to take re-brahamsambandh for femails after marrage?

vaibhav

Reply author: vrajdulhe

Date: 02 March 2006 02:02:28
Message:

Jay Jay Shree Gokulesh,

I never heard about Re- Brahamsambandh Kind of system in our Pushtimarg. ( this is not our Laukik Merrage )

When the initiation is taken, the initiate should not accept any thing in his personal use, exept offering the same first to our shree Thakorji.

Accordingly, when he/she is married and his wife comes, he should lead her to Shree Thakorji and Kneeling down should request the Lord that a new servant for Aapshri's Seva, or service is
secured and is being admitted in the ServantStaff. Thus she is offered or dedicated to our Shree Thakorji.

Reply author: friendmonu

Date: 02 March 2006 09:52:07
Message:

Jsk,

Till I know Bramhasambhand means making a relation with God and giving all we are owing to Him

And this relation is never broken as though u forget Him, He is so caring that he never forgets u and

takes ur care, our Shreejibaba is having His one hand up for for taking care of vaishnavs.

Thus when u have given every thing to Him so how can u take Brahmasambhand again.

Jsk,

Reply author: vaibhav_shah

Date: 02 March 2006 12:28:08
Message:

jay jay shree gokulesh

my question is during marrage a girl gives her everything to her husband. so is it necessary to take re-brahamasambandh?

jay jay shree gokulesh

Reply author: friendmonu

Date: 02 March 2006 12:39:09
Message:

JSK,

I feel Thakurji is greater than the worldly relation

She gives everything to her husband according to others I mean to say soceity n all that

but for a vaishnav by heart everything is of Thakurji

So what's the need of re-brahmasambhand.

JSK

Monica

Reply author: shreekant22

Date: 02 March 2006 16:28:15
Message:

Jai Shree Krishna

A Vaishnav enters into the bond of Marraige only as agyaan of Shree Thakorji.

Prior to Marraige, She has taken brahmasamband, were when one surrenders every thing to Shree Thakroji, one does so, not only of the present but so also for the future. After
Brahmasamband, one only remains as daas of Shree Thakorji, and does all actions as will and blessings of Shree Thakorji. Hence a Vaishnavs marraige is also an action taken keeping in
mind Shree Thakorjis sukh only, were in ones thoughts are towards the future seva of the Families Nidhi Prabhu.

Hence the Question of Re-Brahmasamband does not arise.

I hope my reply makes sense.

Reply author: vaibhav_shah

Date: 02 March 2006 18:41:19
Message:

jay jay shree gokulesh

thank you shrikant bhai

vaibhav

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 02 March 2006 21:01:42
Message:

Jai Jai Shree Gokulesh,

In Gadyamantra DARA is used for both husband and wife and also cleared in Tatvarth deep nibandh (pancham skandh of bhagvatarth prakaran). This was very well explained by Shri Vitthalrai
(chaturthpeeth) in Aapshri's session on Sidhhant Rahasya in borivli- mumbai.

Edited by - dadaji on 02 March 2006 21:03:52

Reply author: Goswami ShriVitthalraiji

Date: 19 April 2006 02:16:58
Message:
Edited by - Goswami ShriVitthalraiji on 19 April 2006 15:18:34

Reply author: unnati

Date: 19 April 2006 08:05:02
Message:

Je Je Dandwat Pranam

The explanation given by Aapshri Is exactly which i was looking for My query. It is Beautifully explained which clears all the doubts arising with relate to Gadh Mantra.

Again My Dandwat Pranam to Aapshri.

Unnati Kadakia

Reply author: shreekant22

Date: 19 April 2006 12:09:48
Message:

Shree Vallabha deesh ki Jai.

Sashtaang Dandvat pranam to Je Je.

Aapshree ne humare upar krupa kari, iske liye koti koti pranam evam dandvat.
Reply author: gopal
Date: 20 April 2006 09:33:59
Message:

|| ShriGokulesho Jayati ||

Dandwat Pranam

Bavashri aapshri had really clearified many doubts in this postings, this is worth important for understanding the ethics of Brahmasambandh.

Dandwat pranam

Reply author: jigershah

Date: 20 April 2006 11:03:14
Message:

dandvaat pranam to shri acharya and jsk to vaishnavs

param kripa kee prabhu aapne moodh jeev like me needs all the pushti available

i may add here

there is only one male soul him the almights rest all souls are females souls

brahmasambandh word it self suggests that it is sambandh of soul to the lord almights

and not this destructible body this body will be destroyed after alpa manushya jeevan

soul that has achived brahmasambandh may be born again and again as male or female

but will not detatch from pushti marga as god will not leave the soul ( ramanand pundit example)

each birth gets better then the previous bith as far as pushit bhakti is concerned

and at some point god will shower his grace and soul returns back to nitya seva

brahmasambandh is marriage of soul to lord and tulsi mala is equal to mangal sutra or sign of that marriage

soul after achiving this sambandha becomes free of all the dosh (siddhant rahyasm )

but past life karmas have to be redeemed

unless pushti jeeva reaches pushti faal dasha and all the karmas are burned to ashes and soul is free to go to golok dhaam back to serving to lord

jsk jiger shah

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 20 April 2006 12:52:40
Message:

AISI BANSI BAJI VANGANME, VYAPI RAHI DHWANI MAHAMUNINKI SAMADHI LAAGI...
DANDVAT PRANAM, JEJE.
Apshri explained very throughly.

Reply author: hit

Date: 20 April 2006 13:31:59
Message:

Shashtang dandvat pranam,

Itana vishad Shri Mahaprabhujike utsavke parva par hame samajneko milega, kya saubhagya hai...!!!
Mahaprabhuji ne kahi kabhibhi ek word bina matalabke use nahi kiya. to dara.... in sabka jo matalab Aapshrine bataya kabile tarif hai. Ek binti hai Aapshri se Aap thoda aur Gadhyamantrake
bareme bataye...jaise kyo mantra prakat nahi kiya firbhi Sidhhant Rahasya me Shri Mahaprabhujine kahaki aksharsh uchhyate.

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 20 April 2006 13:36:36
Message:

Jay Jay Shree Gokulesh,

Gopalbhai,
Where were you? aapke bina jaise khana bina namakke..

Edited by - dadaji on 21 April 2006 18:34:04

Reply author: jagdish

Date: 20 April 2006 14:56:20
Message:

Saadar Dandvat Pranaam Je Je

vandan ke saath khoob dhanyavaad for such a detailed illustration. A humble request to please continue bestowing such krupa and in helping us to remove these cobwebs of doubts within
us.

Jai Shri Krishna and a sincere humble request to all the vaishnavs to help explain/clarify the above, if possible in english for those of us (especially myself) who are unable to understand the
Sanskrit and Gujarati languages used herewith.
Best Wishes
jagdish

Reply author: purvi

Date: 20 April 2006 23:56:12
Message:

jeje,

dandwat pranam.

aapshri ne hum par krupa karike ye posting ki.

dandwat pranam.

Reply author: friendmonu

Date: 21 April 2006 00:44:26
Message:

Dandavat Pranam JE JE,

Aapshri ko anekanek dhanyawad jo Aapshri ne sabhi shanka meta di.

JSK n Regards,
Monica.

Reply author: hit

Date: 28 April 2006 10:25:35
Message:

Shastang dandvat pranam to respected Bawashri,

Waiting for Aapshri's more vachanamrut.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 28 April 2006 10:36:55
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

Hitenbhai, ur question is really a discussable question, that Shrimahparabhuji had taken pratitya that i will discuss the word to word, things, which shrithakurji said to me regarding giving
thejeevs the diksha, but still not given the Samarpan mantra, So why shrimahaprabhuji had not given the Brahmasambandh Mantra??

I will give a hint, that if any of vaishnavas has the Tika of ShriPurushottam charan on Siddhant Rahashya granth the 2nd sloka, Brahmasambandh karnaat sarveshaam.............................
and also the 1st sloka Shravan Shyamale pakshe .......................

\ShriPurushottamcharan has beautifully explained it. Can we discuss further, ????

Reply author: hit

Date: 28 April 2006 11:54:58
Message:

Jsk,
Sure, pl. discuss further. kai aur question hai jaise bhahmasambandh kaun de sake, Damalajine kyo kahyo ki Maharaj, sunyo par samjyo nahi, bhrahmsambandhke bad apna kartavya kya
hai...etc. Kya bhrahmsambandhse sab dosh door ho jate hai? Gadhya mantra bina aparas kyo nahi bol sake? Mantra aprakat kyo hai ?

Reply author: unnati

Date: 28 April 2006 12:56:37
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

I have tried to translate Bawashri's posting in English. So that everyone can read it. If at all anyone finds any mistake please feel free to correct me.

1st Page is already in English.

Page2

God has used the word ‘daar’ in the given shloka therefore it is Praman (epistemology).

Q. Ok, but the sentence which you considered as Praman in that it is written to leave Daar (wife). Hence to explain this question is not proper.

A. If u see the 9th canto of king Amrish, in that we will come to know different types of devotees discussed there. 9th canto is ‘Ishanukatha’.
During that period king Amrish used to rule the world and just for the sake of his country he was not able to renunciate. But in him the
sacrifice of his wife is shown. Though he was a king but used to serve the lord as a servant. This shows that he had knowledge of devotional
duty (bhagwat dharma). King Amrish had a firm faith that god takes care of his devotees. Then why he will not dedicate his wife? He will
definitely do.
Q. Ok you accept that King Amrish was a devotee and was aware of the devotional duty. Thus he used devotion as a means regularly. In the
Mahadvimrugya bhakti (topmost type of devotion) it is said that (11/11/48 – 11/12/8) through devotion one can get the divine form as a fruit.
Therefore, do you accept king Amrish was also belonging to same category i.e. topmost type of devotion?
A. No, coz 1st of all king Amrish was a Maryada pusti devotee. He does not have place only in pusti or pustimaryada. From 9th canto as he was
not having a right for topmost devotion, so in his story might be the word of Brahma sambandha Samarpan is not described. But he does not
get any sin as the whole canto is based on maryada bhakti.
2nd, thing what you are describing about the place of satsang i.e. the fruits received from devotion is said here. But in the same place further
‘keval hi bhaven’ sentence is included. This sentence has a deep meaning rather then other sentences.

Page3

In this sentence where only on the basis of utkat bhavna (the most loving person without which you cannot stay or constantly thinking of
beloved person) Vrajswamniji’s, cow, animals-birds, and snake etc without any knowledge has also received the god. Also looking at this
sentence we will find that while describing about the Vrajswamniji’s etc, King Amrish devotee from 9th canto who is the main personality is not
described here coz if he was a Pushtibhakta then here his name would have been described.

3rd, in this main sentence for describing the fruit ‘EYU’ is used. God say that ’eyu’ means, those soul who gets me and in other sentences as a
fruit he came closer i.e. to say to get the god or to come closer to the god makes a vast difference.

4th, before the birth of lord Krishna path of devotion was not there. Therefore, whatever is said in Samarpan is not translation of any other
place (acharya), but as per the kalpasutra of karma, similarly dedication system was decided. As karma means any Vidhi (Do’s as per Veda) for
which kalpasutra are the basis. Similarly Samarpan gadh is decider of aatmanivedan. So not to have any question related to anyone.

Q. Ok, one thing you have to consider that more than your Samarpan gadh (As said in bhagwat Samarpan stada chatushtaya) sentences of
places and its description is given, i.e. all details of places is there, if so it was like that then in Samarpan gadh only the interested men’s were
been given. Therefore from your Samarpan gadh only men’s have a right for it and not ladies?

A. your question is not right just try to understand what he says to do.

Page4

According to all the places described in the scripture those who are indriyavan is eligible for that is said. What about the ladies there, but those
who are indriyavan and have all the balance of 9 fold devotion then can get right of topmost devotion and through aatmanivedan her right
exists.

2nd thing, in 7th canto Bhakta Prahlad and other kid’s conversation is described in which Prahlad says (7/7/16)

Shri Narada explains Kayadhuni the meaning of 9 fold devotion. From this you can know that she was a female but she is related to Daityas
and still the intellectual like Narada gave the Upadesh. Shri Narada knew that Kayadhuni was eligible so explained her.
3rd Shri Bhagwan and Shri Uddhav’s conversation, at the end god orders (11/29/39)
From this stanza Sudra and females having devotion as previously said topmost devotion can deserve it as a right.

(11/12/4)On the basis of place, from doing satsang whatever the fruit is received females are also part of getting those fruits.

Q. That is true from this females are capable of getting aatmanivedan, but in your Samarpan gadh only the female who are detached or young
girls at the time of Nivedan husband is not there, so female - vitragi - young girls will be included in the Samarpan gadh and they will have to
‘Adhyahar’ for husband If not done this way then they will not be dedicated and will get sin. Therefore this female - vitragi - young girl is not
included in Samarpan gadh mantra.

A. In Mimansa shastra on the basis of Shrushti Nyaya – Bhumi Nibandhan, the pada Daar the meaning is Pati (husband) is of no special
importance and by the pada Sut, gives mother-father also wife, so by the word daar, it clearly indicates that if husband has done Nivedan then
this implies to his family full with father-mother, children’s, wife, Mother and Father are dedicated and through this nothing is left as
undedicated. 5 types of sins are not applicable therefore no need to include in the Samarpan gadh mantra.

Page5

Come on, for this question let us understand the Mimansa Shasta’s - Shrushti Nyaya.

Q. Ok, but in Vyakran (Grammar) shastra if we see clearly instead of ‘dehaindriyahaprana - aatmasamarpyaimi’ it is said ‘dehaindriyahaprana
– paranyatmana saha samarpyami’. What is the aim to say this/ is there any Praman (epistemology) present in it?

A. Yes, sentence have 2 main parts ‘Udesha’ and ‘Viday’. For e.g. Black Horse. Here Black is Udesha and Horse is Vidhan. Similarly in Samarpan
gadh aatma is Udesha and deh, indriya, pran etc is Vidhan. In Samarpan Gadh, Aatmanivedan is related to all i.e. mother, father, husband, son
etc (sahakar/saath). Therefore by saying body soul is been described in many ways.
Body etc is always in relating to the ‘I’ness. There duty, ‘I’ness and ‘My’ness is always related to the topic of adhyas and wife etc is related to
‘My’ness.
Aatmana Saha , here the by the word Saha, just in the laukik, if someone invites a father for a function then along with father, the son will go,
so here the prime importance is given to Father, and not the son. Similarly it is been described in the Samarpan Gadhya the Aatmanivedan.
This we can understand very clearly from Shrimad Bhagwat's 11th skandha's 19th Adhyaya from the Mahadvimrugya Bhakti.
Unnati Kadakia
Edited by - unnati on 28 April 2006 16:12:48

Edited by - unnati on 28 April 2006 17:35:11

Reply author: unnati

Date: 28 April 2006 16:29:48
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Hitenji, Brahmasambandh is given by the Vallabhkul Balak only.

Yes all 5 types of dosh which are described in Veda are removed i.e. sahaj, desh, kaal, sanyog and sparsh after initiation(Brahmasambandh).

After taking brahmasambandh we should do seva of thakoreji. We should not eat anything without offering to thakoreji. One should not eat anything which is not offered to thakoreji. Once the
things are dedicated to thakoreji should not be taken back but bhog can be taken as prashadi.

Please feel free to correct me if i m somewhere wrong.

Unnati Kadakia

Reply author: unnati

Date: 28 April 2006 17:46:49
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Who can give the Brahmasambandh? Related link is given below.

http://www.krishnaseva.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=174

Unnati Kadakia

Reply author: jigershah

Date: 28 April 2006 17:51:35
Message:

jsk

dear unnati nice translation a really good attempt to help vaishnavs in english

jsk

Reply author: hit

Date: 30 April 2006 21:55:13
Message:

Jsk,
Thanks Unnati. Muje abhi tak Sidhhant Rahasyaka answer nahi mila. Waiting for further discusion.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 03 May 2006 14:49:07
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh

A beautiful question raised by Hitenbhai , so let us discuss such, from the Tika of
ShriPurushottamCharan on the Siddhant Rahashya Granth. The question raised by Hitenbhai is very prominent, that
why shrimahaprabhuji broke the promise by not giving the brahmasambandh mantra in the granth, if aapshri
promised that i will say the word to word what shrithakurji said to me.??????????
Nanu, yadi tadanintanvakyakathansyeiveyam pratigya, tada samarpangadhyamapi kuto noktumiti chet ..
Uchyate ..... Tadvi Panchaaksharmantravivranktvadatigopyam, ato noktam ... Shastre hyatigopya mantraday udiyant
eva, na tu prakahataya kathyante .. yatha "Sparshu yat shodashmekvinshami " ityadi .. Tanmantravivarkatvam
ceitsaiyva gyeyam .. Tatra hi mantrasthottampushuhantkriyapadsuchitasya kartu swaroopam, tasya
bhagwadviseshikrushnapaden cha bhagvadviyuktvadibodhanat mantrasthashasthayuktbhagvatswamitvatsambadhshalitvam
cha vivrutam bodhitamiti tatheti tadnukti ...

Reply author: gopal

Date: 03 May 2006 14:52:57
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

"Here the doubt arises that if shrimahaprabhuji had taken the pledge that i will say the word to word which
shrithakurji had said, then why the samarpan gadhyamantra is not given?? For this doubt, ShriPurushottamcharan
says that this SamarpanGadhyamantra comes in the Counteract of "Panchaksharmantra, So it is Ati Gopniya ( not to
be published), so it is not been given. In shastras it is said that the Mantras which are ati Gopniya, they r
just declared by the abrevations and not the fully mantra.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 03 May 2006 14:59:40
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

Kincha, Samarpan navadhabhaktatvamanivedanatvan prasidhamiti na tatra kopi sandeh ityatopi tatha ..Tasya doshnivartavavam tu
shashskandhe "YATHA KRUSHNARPITAPRANSTATVAPURUSHNISHEVYE" tyenen bhagvadiysangaduktam .. Kincha
"DUSAHAPRESTHAVIRHATIVRATAPDUTASUBA" ityartatra sarvasubhanivarkatven sidhasya dusahabhagvadirahataapasya tadanimbhavat
sevangikarsampadika doshnivruttihi kathan syaditi shankanivrutyartha hi brahmasambandhkaranpaden tatpurvoktam sarvamanudhya tata sarvadosh
nivruttirtatrabhidistsita .. Ekadashovinshyodhyaya bhagvatatmanivedansya bhaktimargadharmadhikaratvabodhanen etasyaivarthasya suchnat .. Ato
yadurupyadruaham tadev vyatpadhyam, natu nisandigdham subodhaman va .. Atopi tadanuktiriti janihi ....

Reply author: unnati

Date: 03 May 2006 16:28:12
Message:

Jai jai shri Gokulesh

Gopalbhai, that was a beautiful explanation.

In the whole Gadhmantra there are 84 letters and the last 5 are "Panchakshar mantra". Panchaksharmantra is to be recited in front of thakoreji. As said by Gopalbhai regarding Panchakshar
Mantra, So GadhMantra is not given in the treatise of Siddhant Rahasya.

Unnati Kadakia

Reply author: hit

Date: 03 May 2006 21:44:19
Message:

Jai Jai Shree Gokulesh,

nice going, pl.continue.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 04 May 2006 13:53:37
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh

Continued..........

Here the Tikakaar ShriPurushottamcharan wanted to explain the gopniyata ( personalness) of Mantra. Like in
ShriBhagwatji the word "TAP" comes. So instead of saying the whole word, this word is been described as the 16th
and 21st alphabet of Sparshvarna. To ShriPurushottamcharan takes the same example to make understand the doubt.
Like not saying the direct word, but by pointing the similarly reflects the meaning. And in this Sanketik word
the words are Bhagwad vakya (TAP), So here also in Brahmasambandh Mantra, there is Bhagwad Vakya, so is Gopniya
and is not been described fully, the Samarpan Gadhya Mantra. The meaning is Bhagwad Vakya, Bhagwad Mantra, etc
are very Gambhir (sensitive) so to keep unadvertise to non-adhikari jeevs, this Sutratmak method is been used.
So the GAdhya mantra is also Gopniya. So ShriMahaprabhuji hadnt given the whold of the brahmasambandh mantra.
And this same applies for Astakshar Mantra, s it is Bhagwad Mantra...........
Source : - Siddhant Rahashya Granth - ShriPurushottamcharan's Vivrutti-Tika Sloka 1st. Granth Published by Goswami ShriRajkumar
Nrityagopalji year SAmvat 2059 Page no 58

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 04 May 2006 19:59:07
Message:

Jai Jai Shree Gokulesh,

Very very true gopalbhai.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 13 June 2006 15:47:44
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

Now we understood that Brahmasambandh Mantra is Gopya, And also shastras says that mantras r gopya, and they had not to publish in
public.So Even our Astakshar Mantra is a mantra, So is the same rule applicable for Astakshar Mantra??

Reply author: shreekant22

Date: 13 June 2006 17:32:17
Message:

Jai Shree Krishna

In the Grantha Navratnam, Mahaprabhuji himself has mentioned the Ashtakshar Mantra.......in shloka 9.

As per the clarification given by PPG 108 Shree Yadunathji Maharajshree, The Ashtakshar Mantra too is gopya only, however, the same can be recited when in company of fellow Vaishnavs
etc. However, one should restrain from reciting the Ashtakshar mantra in public places, in front of anya margis etc.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 27 June 2006 19:38:57
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

Thanks Shreekantbhai for sharing the Vachnamruts of Pujya ShriYadunathji Maharjshri.

Reply author: unnati

Date: 30 June 2006 09:02:13
Message:

Jai Jai Shri Gokulesh

Shri Vitthal Bawashri very beautifully gave the vachnamrut on Siddhant Rahasya Granth when Aapshri was here at Mumbai and that time Jeje explained;

"Matri guptabhashane: Mantra is always gopniya it is not to be prakat"

Mantra is not to recited(Patha). Mantra is to do Jap.

Thats why in Sarvottam Stotra it is said in the last stanza "Japyam krushna rasarthibhihi" and not "Patheetavyam krushna rasarthibhihi"

Edited by - unnati on 30 June 2006 10:05:34

Reply author: Kadakiar

Date: 30 June 2006 12:40:51
Message:

Jay Jay Shri Gokulesh,

I have a questions from the explaination given by Bhai Gopal.

Yes, I agree as Unnati mention that :"Matri guptabhashane: Mantra is always gopniya it is not to be prakat"

But When Bhai Gopla says that as it is "The meaning is Bhagwad Vakya, Bhagwad Mantra, etc are very Gambhir (sensitive) so to keep
unadvertise to non-adhikari jeevas"
My Question is Vachan of Shri Krishna In Gitaji to Shri Arjun, Shruti/Smruti in Vedas they are all Shri BHAGWAD
VAKYA...
Is all this needs to be kept GOPYA?
Regards
Rajendra Kadakia

Reply author: Bharat Lathigara

Date: 30 June 2006 13:46:06
Message:

Brahamsambandh
Is a topic of good discussion. It need more clarification of to its pustimargi values and the whole ceremony. How where and why and by whom.

Some Pustimargi vaishnav have been mislead. And unauthorized "sanths" have taken the liberty of performing such a ritual. Awarness will help.

Reply author: jagdish

Date: 30 June 2006 16:23:36
Message:

Jai Shri Krishna,

In response to the following query... here are some personal observations as per my limited capacity and understanding. Please excuse any misunderstandings or confusions this may
raise. It is a request for the more experienced ones to contribute and enlighten us further .

"My Question is Vachan of Shri Krishna In Gitaji to Shri Arjun, Shruti/Smruti in Vedas they are all Shri BHAGWAD VAKYA...
Is all this needs to be kept GOPYA?"

----
There is a subtle difference between Mantra and the others such as Gitaji, Vedas, etc..

By its very nature the mantra is gopya and could be said to be 'personal bhagvad swaroop' given/lent to the individual and generally it is passed down to individuals from guru to shishya. In
this case Thakorji Himself presented the mantra, empowered as His own form to Shri Mahaprabhuji for the upliftment of 'specific' jeevs who have come to His shelter through Shri
Mahaprabhuji.

if God wanted to reveal it to the whole world, He could have done so in public, like He did when speaking Gitaji (this is a rough example)

- Similarly Gitaji is Bhagvad vakya but was spoken in the middle of everyone, thus implying that it is for the benefit of general public/layman. And yet not everyone present on the
battlefield was able to hear or grasp it at that time. If everyone would have been allowed to understand and hear the divine talk between Shri Krishna (Guru) and Shri Arjun (disciple), then they
would have been liberated instantly.... and there would be no need for the battle.

The mantra is for the benefit and upliftment of those particular indivudual (s), whereas the purpose of the bhagvad vakya, such as Gitaji, shrutis, smritis, vedas, upnishads etc are meant for
the general benefit of all.... they are all capable of delivering the soul and giving liberation to All who listen/practice these, and they have been revealed, out of compassion to the general
public for their upliftment.... As the purpose for their creation/revealation is for the benefit of everyone they cannot be gopya (however it still depends on the level of entitlement/adhikar of the
jeev as to how much they can grasp this subject matter), whereas the purpose for the mantra is directly for the benefit of certain individual jeevs. If the mantra's deeper bhaavs were to be
revealed to the non-adhikari jeevs, they would only look at it from a materialistic benefit point of view and would end up committing dosh and taking on further karmas, which would also be
shared by the person who is revealing the mantra or its bhaavs to these jeevs.

Reply author: gopal

Date: 30 June 2006 18:45:24
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh

quote:

Jay Jay Shri Gokulesh,

I have a questions from the explaination given by Bhai Gopal.

Yes, I agree as Unnati mention that :"Matri guptabhashane: Mantra is always gopniya it is not to be prakat"
 But When Bhai Gopla says that as it is "The meaning is Bhagwad Vakya, Bhagwad Mantra, etc are very Gambhir (sensitive) so to
keep unadvertise to non-adhikari jeevas"
My Question is Vachan of Shri Krishna In Gitaji to Shri Arjun, Shruti/Smruti in Vedas they are all Shri
BHAGWAD VAKYA...
Is all this needs to be kept GOPYA?
Regards
Rajendra Kadakia

Rajendrabhai, regarding the VAchans of ShriKrishna in ShriGitaji is not the mantra, and Mantras r GOpya, and vachans of SHriKrishna r not gopya, but r the brahmavaad. Orders.

Reply author: Kadakiar

Date: 01 July 2006 10:07:12
Message:

Jay Jay Shri Gokulesh,

Thank you for all clerifications.

Yes, I do understand that Mantra Given by Shri Mahaprabhuji is Gopya. I just wanted to make aware of it is the emphasise on it is gopya not just because it is BHAGAD VAKYA.

My second query, In general when Rushijen does YAGNA , Isn't they speak mantra and slokas loudly in open environment, inviting all vibhuti's and so on ( For suddhi of nature)?

We always tell that this is GUDH.. If it is gudh rahasya then How some one will learn or know about Shri Thakorji's leela.

Is it not true that by saiying it is GUDH .. GUDH ... We made people MUDH...

Why can't it be explained to the vaishnavjen rather then ignored by saying it is GUDH....

If it is GUDH tatva then why Shri Mahaprabhuji has given us the SAAR of Shrimad Bhagvatji, Shri Gitaji, VEDAS , PURANA and so on.

If Shri Mahaprabhuji also says that it is GUDH... then.....??????????? and yes, aap shri does mention in one of the sodhas granth.

Rajendra Kadakia

Reply author: purvi

Date: 01 July 2006 17:32:16
Message:

jay jay shri gokulesh.

gudh does not mean secret for ever.

when shri mahaprabhuji says something is gudh it means it requires a level of understanding to grasp it.

shrimad bhagwat, shri subodhiniji, nibandh have language and bhaav which is of a high level and to understand them we require a certain level of understanding. thats why the bhaavs of shri
bhagwat, shri subodhiniji are gudh and everybody would not be able to understand them just by reading, even discussing it with fellow vaishnavs could result in misrepresentation if the fellow
vaishnavs r not of such level to understand them. it could result in wrong understanding of a particular bhaav or leela.

hence such leelas and such mantras r regarded as gudh and not to be discussed in open. but as ones' own gurudev when feels that a particular jeev has that level of understanding, aapshri
can always on request explain the gudh bhaavs as well , if aapshri thinks necessary.

and in case of yagyas, hom, havan etc., the mantras r recited loudly as they r recited for the agni dev or some other devi- devtas for whom the yagya is done so they r not gupt. even during
marraiges the mantras r recited in public bcoz they r not gudh.

and its right that only if something is bhagvad vaakya it does not become gupt. it depends on the importance and hetu(purpose) of the mantra as well.

this is as per my understanding.

jay jay shri gokulesh.

Edited by - purvi on 01 July 2006 17:34:14

Reply author: jigershah

Date: 02 July 2006 02:39:01
Message:

jsk

mahima of gnayan is aseem

it is very unstable by nature it may be anything

shruti saar stotra brahm vakya puranokt etc

there are only two major categories simple as prakat and aaprakat

when patra and time is right knowledge is prakat or menifest it self

and when time is not right knowledge stays covered just like dirt on a clean mirror

we may not decide what is gopya ghudh or public knowledge

after reciting sudarshan kavach mantra for 14 years i was gifted the mool manta to invoke the protection

by just reciting 5 lines

only to find out later that sudarshan kavach is not authored by shree vallabh prabhu

so it si very hard to decide what is gudh gopya secerative and what is public

and best of all follow agya of your guruji

surshyam paads are all bhagvad vakya 25000 paads so is 1.5 sloks in shiksha sloki

jsk
Reply author: gopal
Date: 03 July 2006 14:36:58
Message:

Jai Jai ShriGokulesh,

Jigarbhai, to ur confusion, i would lke to add few things, REgarding the Sudarshan Kavach, in our sampraday, few granths like kavach
(sudarshan, yamuna) they r not pushtimargiya, u notified, lately, as per u got understandings. Moreover it is our bad luck, that we don't
guide our peoples properly. IF we know the things, we don't share some things good with our sujatis. And so the new upcomming jeev remains
in dilema and thinks that whichever pustak published having the pushtimarg written is a pushtimargi granth. It is not so. Surshyam pads
were around 25000, and they r the bhagwad vakyas, but moreover they reflect us the leelas of shriprabhu, and so any of the kirtan pads, we
had a tradition that we only sing in front of shrithakurji to make shriprabhu happy. Understand difference between mantras, kirtan pads,
bhagwad vakyas.

As RAjendrabhai said that yagyas done by ShriRushijans, they used to do the Mantra Aahvaan and also not in mind but loudly. There is one
restrictions in our Sanatan Dharma that Ved-Mantras can only be chanted by the Dwij-Dhari (who had taken janoi on his body) and this dwij
adhikaari varnas are only 3 Brahman, Kshatriyas, and VAishyas. The Rishijans used to do the Yagyas for the benefit of the society and In
ved there r 2 ways to understand ShriPrabhu is the Yagyaroopa "Yagyaroopo hari: poorvakande brahmatanoo pare" and ShriPrabhu "AAvtari
ShriKrishna Harihi to sarvatha Raksham karishyati" is Saakar roopa. So if the Rishijans did yagyas and doing the mantrochaar loudly, means
they r doing poojan of shriprabhu and we do poojan of shriprabhu in saakar roop, so the gudhatvam of mantras is individual and not
publicly.

Edited by - gopal on 04 July 2006 09:17:38

Reply author: jatin

Date: 03 July 2006 15:19:08
Message:

Jai Shree Krishna to Vallabhiya Vasihnavs

To all vaishnavs...May be my posting would be hurting to you....When you know that the Gadhmantra is Gopya and it can not be recited in public it means that...

Not even single word should be dicussed in public forum or in public

The entire Sankrit Version of Gadhya can be recited only we are in APARAS... We can discuss, speak only translated version in public ..

Gadhyamantra is Gopya mantra in it should be recited only infront of Shri Thakorji , Shri Baithakji and Shri Vallabhkul balak and we must have to be on APARAS.

Reply author: unnati

Date: 03 July 2006 16:15:16
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Jatinji, sorry to say u but please go through the recent postings. what u said is been discussed previously. Here we are not discussing on gadhmantra (Sahastra.....). Just try to understand
what topic is going on and then reply to it instead of hurting to any vaishnav.

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 03 July 2006 20:21:59
Message:

Jai Jai Shree Gokulesh,

Explanation of Gopalbhai is wonderful and very clear.

Evenif this topic has been disscussed before, Jatinbhai has expressed his opinion and its true. The Gadhyamantra in its entirety is gopya but any seperate word can be explained without
APARAS.

These are my views.

Reply author: jagdish

Date: 03 July 2006 21:31:17
Message:

Jai shri Krishna

very nice flow of knowledge/education

i guess, one way to educate vaishnavs/people in general is by providing such information, especially to sellers who 'bundle' such material as part of pushtimargiya material, as they are being
misled themselves.

Best Wishes
jagdish

Edited by - jagdish on 03 July 2006 21:32:13

Reply author: Kadakiar

Date: 04 July 2006 09:55:10
Message:

Jay Jay Shri Gokulesh,

It was excelent explaination by every individual.

I like what PURVI said that GUDH means difficult, which is not understandable or graspeble by a common person.

Yes, You are absolutly right but what is our normal trend is it is gudh, you want understand and we leave that in limbo to that person ( Vaishnav). This is my understanding and that is
the reason we are still far behind by not explaining the real truth to the new generation ( As in old days.. Dur ja dur ja ... Mari Apras chuvai jase ..)

NOw it is time for all young generation to get up - wake up and go to the right SHRI VALLABH KUL acharyaji, who can explain the truth and Shri Mahaprabhuji's wani in real sense.

Answer for PURVI's comment was ADHIKARI JEEV will understand the GUDH tatva of leela and Shri Mahaprabhuji's vani ( Refer to Shir Krishnadasji ni varta).
 But in todays trend we have scared some young generation by levi heavily on this which can be explained by LAUKIK prasang.

Every doctors or SURGON goes through the same curiculam ( STUDY MATERIAL). Some of them are very excelent in their prfession, some of them very dangerous to go for.

e.g Dr. Vijay Patel , cardiologist.... One of the best surgon who invented a heart surgory to carried out by ROBOTS and who was given VISA to USA by ignoring or excluding all
requirement for all Dr's. He did not have to give any exams, he was given green card as soon as he landed in USA and so on....

My purpose of this story was there are Vaishnava who have ADHIKAR and Shri Vallabhkul balak does give them such special treaty and all lilatmak ras.

Let us come to the explaination by Gopalji, This explanation cleares that evry thing and any thing can not be generalised.

Knife used by Dr's is to save life, Knife used by womens in kitchen is to cut vegitables, Knife used by gangster to take life.

Same thing with " Shri Bhagwad Vakya", "Mantra" and Gudh bhav.

In Pushtimarg Mantra (Panchakshar mantra, Ashthakshar Mantra and so on) are Gopya and need anushtan and it's ritual for it.

Also Shri Krishna ashya has ritual for it, and simillarly Shri Sarvotum stotra.

Once again it was very informative and excelent inputs by every one.

What ever I said is as per my mati... please verify and clerify from Shri Gurucharan .

Jay Jay Shri Gokulesh.

Reply author: dadaji

Date: 04 July 2006 10:46:29
Message:

Jai Jai Shree Gokulesh,

Exellent Rajubhai. Your query was also interesting.

Reply author: unnati

Date: 06 July 2006 18:46:47
Message:

Jai jai shri gokulesh

Rajendraji, your explanation is also good and very informative. But up to my limited knowledge i would like to add something and hoping to get reply on it.

As u have stated that :

" What is our normal trend is it is gudh, you want understand and we leave that in limbo to that person ( Vaishnav) "

But if really the Vaishnav is intrested then he will get the knowledge from anywhere though it is gudh i.e. with the sang of senior vaishnav or Acharya guru's. And there is a no vaishnav who
wont share his knowledge specially for the person who is intrested to know about the pustimarg and the different bhavs in pustimarg.

Also, " we are still far behind by not explaining the real truth to the new generation ( As in old days.. Dur ja dur ja ... Mari Apras chuvai jase ..)"

Now here i can say that, when the child takes birth in any of the pustimargiya vaishnavs house where the seva of Shri Thakoreji is done everyday, then the child is been thought right from
the childhood all the achaar and vichaar. For eg. If some fruits are brought then the child himself says offer this to Shri Thakoreji or this is for Shri Thakoreji. And also we can say that by
seeing to the other members at the home he also learns all that achaar and vichaar.

Also if the specific reason for aapras is been explained to the Young generation then there will be no reason arising of telling "Dur ja dur ja ... Mari Apras chuvai jase"

Reply author: gopal

Date: 07 July 2006 14:44:33
Message:
Reply author: gopal
Date: 07 July 2006 14:47:58
Message:
Reply author: gopal
Date: 07 July 2006 14:53:39
Message:
Reply author: anjan82
Date: 02 August 2009 11:29:02
Message:

Jay Shree Krishna

Reply author: jigershah

Date: 27 August 2009 00:46:14
Message:

unni wife is surrendering her husband and husband his wife i mean i got mine at age 10 i was not married
but still it is a promise to surrender future spouse as well

Reply author: sparekh

Date: 04 September 2009 15:31:59
Message:

jai shree krisha,

from,

swati parekh
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