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WORLD POLL 2023

PART 1

PART 2

PART 3 
PART 4

 Laura Citarella PART 5

PART 6
A Cinematic Sojourn to the Land of Awe and Astonishment: PART 7

Interview with Laura Citarella about El Pampero Cine and PART 8

Trenque Lauquen
 Hamed Sarrafi  August 2023  Interviews  Issue 106

In the enigmatic realm of Trenque Lauquen, Laura Citarella brings to fruition the very essence of El Pampero
Cine’s bold cinematic vision. This latest opus stands as the epitome of everything the Argentinian production
company has diligently cultivated, re ned, and strived towards. Following in the footsteps of most El
Pampero Cine movies, Trenque Lauquen reveals itself as an epic that eschews ashy aesthetics in favour of
subtle, introspective storytelling, captivating viewers completely. Rather than appealing super cially to the
senses, it chooses to delve deep into the human psyche and soul. The outstanding artistry re ects the
dedicated e orts of a creative team willing to push boundaries. With one foot planted in Latin American
literary tradition and the other in cinematic history, this lm e ortlessly straddles both worlds – exhibiting a
harmonious blend of light-heartedness and gravitas, with multifaceted characters and themes that cover
substantial narrative ground. Instead of chasing trends or favoured subjects and styles in lm festivals, it
charts its own unique course. As a paragon of Argentina’s independent cinema scene, known for delivering
pleasant surprises, this movie o ers a refreshing, insightful viewing experience – one that refuses
predictability, perpetually astonishing audiences by subverting expectations and pioneering new creative
frontiers.

Citarella’s cinema cultivates an aura of ingenious mystery by unearthing the extraordinary hidden within the
seeming mundanity of daily life. Her elliptical narratives shimmer with cryptic connections and tacit
meanings. In Ostende (2011) a young woman becomes enmeshed in the opaque designs of two women and
an elderly man, hinting at the enigmatic ties that bind their relationships. Almost a decade later in Trenque
Lauquen, Citarella once again follows a woman named Laura (presumably the same character, portrayed by
the actress Laura Paredes), now middle-aged and eager to explore the enigmatic past and present of a town
(Trenque Lauquen) through a series of puzzling events before mysteriously vanishing, becoming part of the
town’s unsolvable mysteries herself. Now, she entangles others, including her boyfriend and another lover,
in her enigmatic persona. This beguiling and mysterious atmosphere pervades Citarella’s other
collaborations as well. In La mujer de los perros (Dog Lady, 2015), co-directed with Verónica Llinás, the lm
depicts the daily life of a woman who lives unconventionally with dogs, distancing herself from society for
opaque reasons. Additionally, in the documentary Las Poetas Visitan A Juana Bignozzi (The Poets Visit Juana
Bignozzi, 2019), co-directed with Mercedes Halfon, Citarella and her team sought to illuminate the obscure
life of a poet by investigating her story.

Ostende

Throughout these works, Citarella reveals her enduring fascination with eccentric characters and
relationships that defy straightforward explanation. Her patient observational style fosters ambiguity,
drawing viewers into the search to uncover hidden truths. For Citarella, the mundane harbours the
mysterious, and daily life presents opportunities for revelation to those discerning enough to penetrate its
opaque surfaces. Reality’s riddles await those with an ingenious gaze.

The sweeping 250-minute Trenque Lauquen, divided into two parts, indeed o ers a delightful journey. By the
end of each part, two characters depart from the town with a sense of bewilderment, each stepping into a
valley of awe in their own unique way. Rafa (portrayed by Rafael Spregelburd) is still lled with unanswered
questions and unable to recognise his partner, leading to the shattering of his assumptions. On the other
hand, Laura, after immersing herself in mysteries and solving them, nds a sense of liberation and fully
embraces the realm of awe. As the lm unfolds, it initially brims with an abundance of dialogue, gradually
transitioning into moments of profound silence. The characters embark on a transformative journey, and we,
as observers, are equally enriched as we traverse the wilderness of their experiences.

Initially, Trenque Lauquen unfolds like a captivating novel, with each chapter providing clues, elliptical and
missing data, akin to a compelling detective story where the audience connects the dots to unravel the true
meaning behind Laura’s disappearance – if such a meaning even exists. However, the movie also fearlessly
ventures through various cinematic genres, seamlessly shifting its tone to capture the essence of science
ction, romance, road movie, erotica, mystery, and more. Within its epic structure, the lm invites the
audience to experience a similar sense of awe that the characters encounter by the end of both parts.

Indeed, this opulent tapestry intertwines the allure of mystery, the tenderness of romance, the enigma of
science ction, and the echoes of history. At its core lies the gripping enigma of Laura, whose vanishing in a
quaint Pampas town sets the stage for a captivating exploration of the human spirit. Much like other lms
from the El Pampero Cine group, such as Mariano Llinás’ La or (The Flower, 2018), Trenque Lauquen o ers a
liberating and awe-inspiring experience, drawing viewers into an enchanting world of intrigue and revelation.

Citarella’s and her collaborators’ ambitious e orts in directing and producing such inventive lms serve as an
inspiration not only for Argentine lmmakers but also for young directors worldwide who struggle with
funding. In the hands of this group, cinema transcends the ordinary and dares to venture into unexplored
territories. Their storytelling prowess de es convention, inviting audiences on a voyage of imagination and
introspection, where artistic innovation knows no bounds. They, indeed, stand as a true vanguard of
cinematic brilliance, forever pushing the boundaries of what is thought possible in the realm of lmmaking.
Despite some of their lms taking up to eight years to complete, the results o er hope that creative
storytelling, character development, and exible and respectful collaboration can lead to the creation of
thrilling and enthusiastic cinematic art.

Trenque Lauquen has left an indelible mark on the lm festival circuit, making a signi cant impact at
prestigious events like the Venice Film Festival and generating anticipation for its upcoming screening at the
Melbourne International Film Festival. The lm’s accomplishments are indeed noteworthy, with awards and
recognition owing in from esteemed organisations such as the International Cinephile Society, where it
received accolades for Best Ensemble, Best Original Screenplay, Best Picture, and Best Director. Additionally,
the lm garnered major acclaim at the Mar del Plata Film Festival and secured a nomination as the 3rd best
undistributed movie in last year’s Film Comment magazine poll. Despite these achievements, the full potential
of El Pampero Cine’s works remains untapped, presenting an opportunity for even greater recognition and
acclaim. While movie critics have shown their appreciation for the enthralling narratives and innovative
approach consistently showcased by El Pampero Cine, there is still ample room for the world to fully
embrace and celebrate their cinematic brilliance.

This interview explores the creative spirit of Laura Citarella, a vital member of El Pampero Cine. It will be
followed up in a future issue with interviews with other members of El Pampero Cine, learning from their
diverse outlooks and uncovering the essence of their singular artistic expressions. Through this exploration, I
hope to shed light on the creative ingenuity that de nes El Pampero Cine’s cinematic pursuits.

– HS

Trenque Lauquen

I genuinely admire El Pampero Cine’s innovative contributions to cinema in recent years. The
collaborative e ort displayed by you and your colleagues in creating captivating lms is truly
inspiring. I’m interested in learning more about your lmmaking process. Could you share how your
group formed and how you seamlessly collaborate in various roles, such as acting, directing, and
producing? Additionally, as a distinctive lmmaking group, how do you perceive your standing within
the Argentine cinema industry?

El Pampero Cine is more like a rock band than a typical production company. We have been friends for over
two decades, and during this time, we have developed a strong bond that has been instrumental in the
success of our lms. Our approach to lmmaking is highly independent, and we are always looking for
inventive ways to produce lms. We value the collective spirit and maintain a horizontal way of working,
which is a crucial aspect of our group.

The idea of working collectively started with Mariano Llinás, who was initially my teacher at university. He
wanted to explore a new way of working, one that involved a group of individuals with di erent skill sets
coming together to produce lms. I found this approach intriguing and joined Mariano in this venture.

Before joining Mariano, I had worked in the industry and experienced a di erent way of working. However,
the production of the lm Extraordinary Stories (Mariano Llinás, 2008) was a turning point for our group. It
was during this project that we nally found our footing as a team of four: Mariano Llinás, Alejo
Moguillansky, Agustín Mendilaharzu, and myself. Each of us had a unique skill set that we brought to the
table, and this collaboration resulted in a lm that we were all proud of.

Our group excels in its seamless collaboration, adaptability, and frequent role swapping. Each of us
possesses unique skills and expertise that contribute to the team’s success. For instance, I specialise in
directing and producing, while Mariano’s talents lie in producing and scriptwriting. Alejo Moguillansky is a
skilled editor, and Agustín Mendilaharzu showcases his expertise as a cinematographer. What sets us apart
is our versatility in managing di erent technical aspects of lmmaking, a rarity in most production
companies. This exibility allows us to smoothly transition between roles as needed, enabling us to
contribute to various facets of the lmmaking process. As a result, our nal product is more comprehensive
and cohesive.

Overall, our group’s unique approach to lmmaking has made us stand out in the Argentine cinema industry.
We are proud to be a part of a team that values collective e ort, is highly independent, and constantly strives
to push the boundaries of lmmaking.

Mariano Llinás, as your teacher, clearly played a crucial part in forming your group. But could you
elaborate on the initial manifesto or concept that brought all of you together? What shared
cinematic perspective forged such a strong bond? Were your views on the art of cinema mostly
aligned, or did you have notable di erences among your colleagues?

That’s a di cult question because I’m not sure what the answer is. I know that we can work in a very
economical way. We all prefer to produce an image or shoot something speci cally. We don’t want to deal
with irrelevant and stupid things in the middle because when we go for a lm, we try to make the lm
possible. We try to make a lm that we want to make, and we don’t spend time on pointless things. We go
and shoot and just think, and then we show the lm to the other partners, they give their feedback, and then
we work on the lm.

So, there’s a passionate way of working, but also a direct and concrete way of working. I think that’s the key.
We prioritise making the lm possible rather than all the things that usually surround a lm, such as going to
festivals, labs, getting investors, and making expensive lms. I think we all naturally share this belief that we
don’t need these kinds of structures. That’s one of the reasons we work well together.

Of course, we also have a shared interest in certain narratives and cinema, and we started to exchange and
contaminate each other’s ideas. That exchange is possible when you have things in common or a similar way
of looking at cinema. It happened naturally, but we were all looking for a way of working that was free and
possible. The idea of making lms possible is like a slogan of Nike or Adidas. We like to think that lms are
possible, even if they’re di cult to make, because we like to invent. We nd a kind of adrenaline in the idea
of producing in an ambitious yet small way. I think that’s something we all have in common.

Trenque Lauquen

The uniqueness of your lmmaking approach shines through in the creation of your movies. The
collective sense of freedom among all four of you is evident, particularly when discussing your latest
lm. In Trenque Lauquen, your movies embark on a journey that begins mysteriously, evolves into a
detective story, transforms into a love story, incorporates elements of science ction, and ultimately
culminates in a captivating exploration of nature. El Pampero Cine lms exhibit a delightful
playfulness, showcasing your shared enjoyment of artistic liberty. While each of you possesses a
distinct style, it is apparent that none of you limit yourselves to a singular lmmaking approach.
Even when delving into the realm of the unusual, this strangeness undergoes a metamorphosis,
seamlessly amalgamating diverse. elements into a cohesive whole.

I like the idea of the word “playful” that you brought up. It’s like a childish attitude, but maybe I’m the least
childish of all of us since I’m also a producer and I have to think seriously about how to make things work.
Sometimes I’m more practical than my partners <laughs>. As a result, I often approach things with a serious
mindset, carefully considering the logistical aspects. While my partners may be more carefree, I believe there
is still an element of playfulness in our collective work.

One fundamental aspect for us is our aversion to having a hierarchical structure or external in uence
dictating our creative decisions, such as the selection of actors or artistic choices. We value our
independence. Moreover, we are deeply focused on crafting lms that o er not only a cinematic experience
but also a journey and an adventure.

For example, our experience in Trenque Lauquen, where we spent six years, even though the script was
written beforehand. During the lmmaking process, we continually evolved and adapted, travelled far away
from Buenos Aires to shoot the lm, and our whole families including our kids and parents were fully
engaged. Ezequiel Pierri, who plays a key character named Ezequiel ‘Chicho’, is my husband and Verónica,
who plays Romina, is Mariano’s wife. Our children are friends, and we involved our extended family,
including grandparents, in taking care of the kids. This aspect of shared experience was an integral part of
our lmmaking process, extending beyond mere conceptualisation and encompassing our daily lives. It is
this atmosphere that infuses our lms with a distinct quality. Without this ambiance, a lm like Trenque
Lauquen would not have been possible. We are drawn to creating lms in a particular mood. By mood, I don’t
mean constantly laughing or being in a cheerful state all day. It’s more about capturing an atmosphere that
feels familiar and is deeply connected to our lives. This is why our lms have a unique quality to them.

I believe that the mood you aim for in your lms, which is adventurous and playful, is evident and
re ected in the editing process. It’s fascinating to observe how your editor, Alejo Moguillansky,
approaches the editing of your movies in a similar fashion to how he edits his own and Mariano’s
lms, such as El escarabajo de oro (The Gold Bug, 2014), Castro (2009), La or. He employs techniques like
cutting at unexpected points, allowing scenes to continue unexpectedly, and utilising dissolve or
superimposition e ects. These creative editing choices re ect collaborative nature of your
lmmaking process. It’s a unique experience that I thoroughly enjoy witnessing and believe ads to
the overall charm of your movies.

In the case of Alejo, I believe he was one of the pioneers in this approach. He began by creating small lms
with his wife and then incorporated their daughter as well. It was through this inclusion of family dynamics
that he discovered a path to continue our tradition of adventurous lmmaking. When we were in our 30s,
without children, everything seemed more straightforward. However, as we started to have kids, it naturally
became more challenging. Alejo’s contribution has been invaluable in navigating this aspect and ensuring
that our lms remain grounded in familial experiences and adventures.

Another signi cant contributor to this project is Miguel de Zuviría, a talented editor in Trenque Lauquen who
played a vital role. He has been working closely with me for about four years, even before Alejo joined the
team. He is typically the rst person I show my lms to, as he possesses a keen ability to diagnose the
strengths and weaknesses. Working alongside him at that stage allows me to re ne the lm further.
Subsequently, I seek Mariano’s input, which is always precise and demanding in the best possible way. He
provides invaluable assistance in shaping the lm’s structure. And nally, Agustín Mendilaharzu, who comes
from a theatre background and is both a director and actor, also steps in and contributes his insights into
the dramatic structure. These are the nal stages of the lmmaking process for me, and each collaborator
brings their expertise and personal artistic baggage from their own lms to enrich the work. While it doesn’t
always result in a perfect match, their contributions often prove to be instrumental.

By nurturing an environment of collaboration and drawing from our collective experiences, we aim to create
lms that encapsulate a sense of depth and authenticity.

La Flor

In addition to their playful nature, El Pampero Cine seems to have a fondness for incorporating
improvisation into their storytelling. I can recall a scene from Trenque Lauquen where Rafael and
Ezequiel are searching for something on a phone and, accidentally, Rafael drops a piece of paper with
an address. The quick reaction to pick it up felt like an improvised moment, adding a natural and
spontaneous quality to the scene. I also remember a scene in Mariano’s La or, where a group of
people is waiting, and a banana becomes involved. The scene continues inde nitely in a humorous
and improvised manner, showcasing a playful approach.

Similar instances can be seen in The Gold Bug and Ostende, where characters exude a carefree and free-
spirited nature. For example, in Ostende, people run around on the beach, and in The Gold Bug, there’s
a scene where individuals play with objects found on the set. It feels as if improvisation is
encouraged, and some scenes unfold spontaneously with minimal scripted direction. I’m intrigued to
know more about your approach to shooting these scenes. Despite the extended production periods
of your lms, do you often require multiple takes, or are some scenes captured in one go? How do
you foster improvisation during those moments?

During our lmmaking process, we have the exibility to create a scene, but if upon reviewing the footage,
we feel that something isn’t working, we have the freedom to return to the location and reshoot the scene if
necessary. (The nal scene of Trenque Lauquen, was lmed and edited ten days before the lm’s premiere at
the Venice Festival).

Generally, I don’t rely on improvisation in my approach to lmmaking. Regarding the incident with the paper
that you mentioned, it was an unplanned moment where the actor had a mishap, but he managed to handle
it gracefully. Surprisingly, it turned out to be the best take in terms of the actors’ performances. For me, the
accidental drop of the paper wasn’t a problem because the rest of the scene was captured perfectly in
multiple takes. The particular shot you’re referring to was quite challenging since it was a continuous shot
without any cuts. Additionally, we had two camera operators and had to ensure precise focus. Working
under such technical constraints can present di culties. Furthermore, the actors have speci c dialogue that
I’ve written, and I prefer them not to deviate from the script. It’s a demanding approach, especially
considering this particular scene was scheduled for early morning when we needed speci c lighting
conditions. Typically, you only have a limited window of about half an hour to capture a scene during that
time of day before the lighting changes. Therefore, it was a highly challenging shot. That’s why I emphasise to
the actors the importance of thoroughly knowing their lines and discourage improvisation. If they were to
improvise, it could potentially disrupt the continuity, such as with wardrobe choices. While there may be
some instances where improvisation is allowed, such as during a sequence where the characters read letters
in various locations, like a track, a bar, or the countryside, and have a picnic, in general, improvisation is not a
common practice. For instance, if you watch lms by Alejo Moguillansky, you might perceive them as
spontaneous and unplanned, but in reality, everything is meticulously scripted, planned, and tightly
controlled.

The involvement of your husband as one of the actors, and the presence of Rafael Spregelburd in
multiple lms, including The Gold Bug and La or is intriguing. Moreover, the strong connection among
the female cast members, such as Laura Paredes and Elisa Carricajo, who portrayed the scientist with
the unusual child, is notable. I’m curious to know if these actors and actresses are a liated with the
Piel de Lava Company theatre group, given their consistent involvement in your projects, like La or.
Could you provide some insights into this collaboration and the distinct contributions they bring to
your lms?

In La or, all four girls (Laura Paredes, Elisa Carricajo, Valeria Correa and Pilar Gamboa) featured in the movie
come from a shared background in the theatre group: Piel de Lava Company. Their experience and training
in theatre provide a unique foundation for their performances in the lm. However, in Trenque Lauquen it is
worth noting that only Laura and Elisa, two members of the theatre group, are involved.

Some of the actors and actresses we collaborate with have personal connections to us. For instance, one of
them is my uncle, who works in a radio station (the person works in radio station and always delays).
Additionally, as my family has roots in the Trenque Lauquen town, it’s interesting to see that many of them
are non-professional actors or teachers from the local school. In a unique twist, I also had the opportunity to
portray Carmen, the pregnant woman, in the rst part of Trenque Lauquen. The connection and collaboration
among the team members add a personal touch and authenticity to our cinematic endeavours.

Almost all the actors who appear in our lms are part of a close-knit group. Take Rafael Spregelburd, for
example, who is featured in the rst part of La or and also in The Gold Bug. He consistently collaborates with
us across our projects. Rafael Spregelburd is not only an actor but also a highly respected theatre director,
known for his ambitious independent productions with limited budgets. His theatre group “El Patrón
Vázquez” operates on a similar principle to our lmmaking approach. There is a sense of collective creativity
and ambitious storytelling despite resource constraints. Sometimes, Rafael’s group even separately
participates in El Pampero Cine ‘s lms. This interconnectedness creates a larger family of artists who
embrace this collaborative way of working, both in cinema and theatre. This spirit of collaboration extends
beyond the four of us. It encompasses all the people involved in our projects…

Laura Paredes

This approach can be seen in the way you collaborate with Laura Paredes …

This way of working has become ingrained in everyone’s approach. It’s a non-hierarchical structure where
ideas ow freely and exchange of information is vital. For example, in the case of Trenque Lauquen, I co-wrote
the lm with Laura Perez, who is not only an actress but also a skilled dramaturge. It was crucial to have her
active participation in the writing process, as she brought a deep understanding of her character and her
craft. I should emphasise that, initially, I outlined a linear narrative but as we developed the script, Laura and
I gravitated toward a more nonlinear approach. Though we had lmed some linear scenes already, the
prospect of the story and characters unfolding gradually over time resonated more. Consequently, we
restructured the entire lm, rearranging events nonchronologically. We considered incorporating two men
searching for an elusive woman as a short ending, but instead used that perspective to introduce Laura’s
escape upfront, broadening the lm’s scope. This reshaping required writing additional scenes to esh out
those characters. Laura was instrumental in scripting these new scenes and reshaping the nonlinear
narrative. Throughout the process, even o -set, I frequently consulted Laura, valuing her creative
partnership. Together, by embracing a nonlinear approach, we actualised our vision of a story that unfolds
unpredictably over time. Laura’s contributions were integral, elevating her role beyond writer or actress into
true creative partner in shaping the narrative.

This collaborative approach extends beyond the core team and includes actors, musicians, and other
collaborators with whom we work closely….

The music featured in the end credits of the rst part of Trenque Lauquen is undeniably captivating
and exquisite. Since watching the lm, I have found myself repeatedly drawn to this mesmerising
piece, a testament to Gabriel Chwojnik’s remarkable talent in creating such a wonderful composition.
Your choices and tastes in music are evidently diverse and unconventional, as demonstrated by the
playful selection of Elvis Presley’s “Suspicious Minds” as Laura’s ringtone. The way you incorporate
music into the lm is intriguing, with sudden and unexpected starts and even fading out
unexpectedly.

In Trenque Lauquen, we incorporated a signi cant amount of music composed by Gabriel Chwojnik, as well as
music contributed by our friends from La Plata. La Plata is known for its vibrant music scene, with many
talented bands that embrace a similar approach to artistry. Moreover, the idea of each character having a
favourite song intrigued me. For Laura, setting “Suspicious Minds” as her ringtone served as a way to con rm
her continuity from Ostende. Interestingly, “Suspicious Minds” was my personal ringtone as well, as I have
always been a devoted Elvis Presley fan. The song holds signi cant emotional value for me making it a deeply
nostalgic and meaningful tune. On the other hand, for Ezequiel, the choice of “Los Caminos” resonated
deeply with the essence of his character and the emotional journey he undergoes… Anyway, working in this
way and collaborating with our composer, without a traditional hierarchical structure, comes naturally to all
of us. It allows for a dynamic and creative environment where everyone’s contributions are valued and
respected.

In your rst feature lm, Ostende, there was a scene where Laura is seen reading a book by John le
Carré, known for his mystery and espionage stories. It seems that in all of your movies, you have a
penchant for stories involving something missing or in need of discovery. Even in Dog Lady, we are
intrigued by the wandering woman and her mysterious actions. It appears that you enjoy uncovering
mysteries within everyday life. Could you elaborate on the origin of this approach? Is it a conscious
preference for hidden stories and mysteries? And how did the idea for your latest lm speci cally
come about?

I have a strong fascination with the concept of mystery. I believe that a mystery retains its allure as long as it
remains unde ned. Once a mystery is named or explained, it loses its enigmatic quality. In my lms, such as
Ostende, the protagonist attempts to articulate and comprehend the events and relationships she
encounters. She seeks to bring order to the inexplicable elements she witnesses, unveiling the mystery in the
process. In Dog Lady, we intentionally worked with a character who has no past and remains largely silent
throughout the lm. By withholding her voice, we aimed to preserve the mystery surrounding her. If we had
given her dialogue, we would have had to decide on her accent and background, thereby limiting the intrigue
we wanted to create. Instead, she exists solely in the present, devoid of explanations, past, future, or even
words. This approach allowed the mystery to endure throughout the lm.

The Poets Visit Juana Bignozzi

Continuing to explore this theme, I came to realise its profound signi cance in my subsequent lm, The Poets
Visit Juana Bignozzi, which I co-directed with Mercedes Halfon. This lm about the poet was a serendipitous
discovery in my life while I was embarking on my own creative journey. Initially, I was unfamiliar with this
particular poet and her work. However, as I delved into her writings, poems, and the stories surrounding her,
I began to form an intimate connection with her essence. I discovered her through her poems and the
stories surrounding her, which allowed me to form an impression of her without fully de ning her character.
It was an intriguing process of getting to know her without truly knowing her as a person. This concept of
working with the mystery and the enigmatic nature of a character became a central theme in my approach.
It’s like surrounding someone with an aura of intrigue, where their identity cannot be easily de ned or
con ned to speci c labels. I nd great interest in exploring characters and situations that are surrounded by
an aura of mystery.

It intrigued me to work with this idea of surrounding a character with mystery, creating an atmosphere
where she remains enigmatic and inde nable. And I decided this could be the core for my next movie:
Trenque Lauquen. In Trenque Lauquen, the protagonist leaves everything in her life without explanation, and
all the people around her attempt hard to provide meaning and understanding to her disappearance.

I often use the example of psychoanalysis to illustrate this concept. When we assign a speci c interpretation
to an image or symbol, we potentially destroy the mystery and fantasy associated with it. If you dream about
a horse and then discuss it during therapy, there is a possibility that you might come to a realisation, such as
identifying the horse as representing your father. However, it’s important to note that the act of assigning a
speci c name or meaning to the horse can also diminish and kill the element of fantasy that is present in the
dream. By giving a de nitive interpretation, the mysterious and open-ended nature of the dream can be
altered or even lost. That example serves as a personal de nition of mystery and fantasy for me as well.
Fantasy, in this context, refers to something that eludes precise de nition or labelling. It encompasses
elements that exist beyond our ability to fully comprehend or explain.

Similarly Trenque Lauquen’s structure is deliberately divided into two distinct parts to explore di erent
approaches to understanding and interpretation. In the rst part, various characters try to understand and
interpret the protagonist’s actions; we witness a multitude of characters actively engaging in the process of
comprehension. They are driven by the desire to unravel the mysteries surrounding Laura’s situation, and
one avenue they explore is The Autobiography of a Sexually Emancipated Woman written by Alexandra
Kollontai. This book becomes a source of insight and potential connection to Laura’s experiences.

The characters, including Ezequiel, also perceive a link between Laura’s disappearance and the letters they
have been deciphering and maybe something about their relationship. They believe that understanding the
meaning behind these letters holds the key to unlocking the truth about Laura’s circumstances. Their quest
for understanding intertwines with their personal narratives and adds layers of complexity to the overall
story.

In the second part, you can observe that women have an understanding that a woman has the ability to
leave simply because she desires to. She can choose to disappear without o ering any explanation, almost in
a spiritual manner. For me, this aspect is the key essence of the lm. It begins by gradually losing its reliance
on language. If you observe the second part closely, initially there is a multitude of conversations resembling
a radio broadcast, with people contemplating various thoughts. However, it progressively slows down until it
reaches complete silence. The words dissolve, similar to the lyrics of a song that become unintelligible. It
symbolises the lm’s gradual journey into obscurity, mirroring the experience of the woman herself.

As the movie nears its conclusion, it becomes obvious that the narrative centres around a woman
embarking on a quest for a mystery, only to nd herself entangled within the very enigma she seeks.
The absence of something, in this case, becomes a powerful form of intrigue. Throughout your
movies, the life of Laura and the mysteries surrounding her have been an ongoing theme, extending
from Ostende to Trenque Lauquen. However, when considering your lms from a non-chronological
perspective, one might speculate that Dog Lady could serve as a representation of Laura’s future. It is
plausible to view Dog Lady as o ering a potential glimpse into Laura’s future, although it remains
uncertain and open to interpretation.

While it is an intriguing and interesting interpretation to consider Dog Lady as a potential future for Laura,
the protagonist of Trenque Lauquen, there are notable distinctions between the two characters. The
character of Dog Lady demonstrates a strong sense of purpose, making deliberate choices that challenge
societal norms. She actively designs her life and aspires to create a beautiful home, re ecting a purposeful
and almost political stance. This sets her apart from Laura.

Conversely, Laura’s experiences in Trenque Lauquen lean more towards the idea of surrendering to the
unknown and embracing a life without material possessions. Unlike Dog Lady, who continuously develops
resourceful systems for survival and enjoyment, Laura’s journey seems to revolve around the possibility of
getting lost and existing without the accumulation of belongings. These di erences highlight contrasting
paths and perspectives between the two characters.

Dog Lady

In Trenque Lauquen it is unclear where Laura might be headed after the events of the lm, considering she
appears towards the end. It seems she is attempting to embrace a state of lightness, devoid of material
attachments. This concept resonates with an essay I found in uential for Trenque Lauquen called Walking by
the writer Henry David Thoreau. (I previously read Thoreau’s Walden for Dog Lady) In Walking the author
explores the idea of losing oneself, continuous exploration, and the labour involved in this pursuit.

In brief, there is a dual operation at play in the lm. Firstly, it revolves around the notion of a person getting
lost without any discernible reason. Secondly, the lm itself refrains from attempting to decipher what has
happened to the woman. While the male characters in the lm strive to understand her circumstances, the
lm avoids providing any conclusive answers about Laura and her experiences.

Furthermore, the lm encompasses various genres, including romance, detective story, and science ction.
As the narrative unfolds, it reaches a point where it becomes necessary to shift the focus away from intricate
plotlines and intricate dramas. Instead, the lm embraces the idea of embracing the emptiness, the absence
of intricate plots and characters. It embraces the natural world, the sun, and a woman engaged in
meaningful work within that environment. This approach serves as the only tting conclusion for the lm,
considering the multitude of events and themes explored throughout.

I’ve also noticed an intriguing connection between your previous lm, which is a documentary The
Poets Visit Juana Bignozzi, and your latest project. In The Poets Visit Juana Bignozzi, there was a distinct
focus on a text (The Autobiography of a Sexually Emancipated Woman) that substituted “I” with “we.” It
seems that you have carried this theme over to your current movie, infusing it with a detective-like
narrative. It’s fascinating to witness how you have expanded upon the original plot and added layers
to the story over the course of six years. Can you discuss the multitude of ideas that have in uenced
your creative process during this time? Additionally, you mentioned co-writing the screenplay with
Laura Paredes, your lead actress. Could you elaborate on how this collaborative approach has
enriched the screenplay?

Absolutely. The intertwining of personal life and the lmmaking process is a recurrent occurrence in our
lms. It forms a reciprocal relationship where events from our lives naturally seep into the lm, and, in turn,
the ideas and concepts within the lm impact our own experiences. This ongoing dialogue between cinema
and personal life generates a perpetual ow of inspiration and mutual in uence.

In Trenque Lauquen, the six-year journey of making the lm coincided with signi cant personal milestones,
such as my pregnancy and the presence of my daughter. It’s interesting to note that the core elements and
themes of the lm were present from the very beginning. However, as time passed, the structure and scope
of the project evolved and expanded. For instance, during our trip to Italy, we captured numerous scenes
with the camera unsure of whether they would be used or discarded, and later we realised that they could
be incorporated into the segment involving Carmen and Palo. This collaborative and uid approach allowed
us to adapt and incorporate new ideas, images, and scenes into the screenplay as the project unfolded.

I should say during the initial stages of developing the lm, I began reading Alexandra Kollontai and, to my
surprise, I discovered various writings and markings inside the book, indicating that my friend, or someone
else had interacted with it. This discovery sparked an idea within me. I became fascinated with the concept of
a book that transcends time and passes through di erent individuals, each leaving their mark. Personally, I
have always been drawn to the experience of nding notes and writings within old books, and it greatly
appeals to me. As a result, I was determined to incorporate this expansive concept of books and their hidden
stories into the lm.

Additionally, I found a particular aspect in the book that deeply resonated with me – the notion of replacing
“I” with “we.” I nd this concept highly relevant to our collaborative approach in making the lm within our
team.

Trenque Lauquen

When considering the contrast between the rst and second parts of the movie in terms of the
portrayal of men and women, I made an early observation. Towards the end of the rst part, the
male characters seemed to drift apart from each other, whereas in the second part, the female
characters appeared to be united. An example that exempli es this unity in the second part is the
radio presenter who initially attempted to hide something from Ezekiel but later explained it to him,
assisting him in uncovering at least a portion of the true reason behind Laura’s disappearance.
Another instance is when we encounter the scientist lady and her friend/partner, whom Laura
assisted, and witnessed the mutual support they provided each other. However, when comparing
this to the rst part, it seemed that the men were rivals, both vying for the a ection of the same
woman. They worked independently and diverged from each other. On the other hand, the women in
the second part stood together, displaying unity despite challenges. This interpretation of how men
and women solve problems di erently is intriguing. I recall from your previous interviews that you
aimed to avoid a direct feminist perspective or approach in your storytelling or characterisation.
Could you kindly share your perspective on the portrayal of these diverse dynamics between male
and female characters?

I appreciate your viewpoint. It’s not that I shy away from exploring feminism in the lm, but rather I dislike
when some male critics try to reduce it to solely a female narrative. My intention is to approach the lm
without narrowing it down to that perspective. However, I do acknowledge that feminism naturally manifests
within the context of the lm.

The examination of how men and women approach problem-solving is an intriguing aspect. As an example,
in Argentina, there was a signi cant feminist movement advocating for the legalisation of abortion. It was a
powerful demonstration of women coming together, regardless of their political a liations, to ght for
women’s rights. The movement saw numerous women actively working on the streets, emphasising the
importance of unity in their cause.

I strongly perceive this dynamic in the lm. It becomes evident that the men are actively searching for
reasons to de ne and compete with each other, aiming to come out victorious. They desire to win, whether
it’s winning Laura as a trophy or winning against each other. They constantly strive to be present, attempting
to unravel and resolve the problem. While Ezekiel may not explicitly embody patriarchal traits, there is a
subtle in uence ingrained in him, albeit unknowingly, due to the cultural context he is a part of.

In contrast, the female characters in the lm demonstrate a contrasting demeanour. They do not strive to
exert control over every facet of the situation. Rather, they possess a profound appreciation for the
signi cance of embracing the natural course of events. They understand that not everything requires strict
control or manipulation. They are comfortable with letting go and allowing things to unfold freely. This
divergence in their approach to control provides a valuable insight into the feminist themes embedded
within the lm, highlighting the empowerment found in relinquishing unnecessary control and embracing a
more organic perspective.

It’s truly captivating to explore the recurring theme in your lms, where a profound connection to
Latin American literature is evident in your storytelling. This literary in uence not only shines
through in your own lms but also in the works of Mariano Llinás and Alejo Moguillansky. Being well-
versed in the rich literary traditions of the region, from the writings of Carlos Fuentes in Mexico to
the profound contributions of Gabriel García Márquez, Mario Vargas Llosa, and notably Jorge Luis
Borges, it becomes evident that these literary giants serve as a wellspring for your multifaceted
storytelling approach. Each door you open in your lms leads to another, creating a narrative
tapestry deeply rooted in Latin American literature. A distinctive element in your cinematic
experience is the incorporation of voiceovers, which adds a layer of literary quality. The voiceovers in
your lms, akin to someone narrating stories to us, possess a level of control reminiscent of music.
They infuse a poetic quality that resonates deeply with the audience. In lms like La vendedora de
fósforos (The Little Match Girl, Alejo Moguillansky, 2017), The Gold Bug, La or, Extraordinary Stories, and
Trenque Lauquen, the characters engage in conversations that feel meticulously crafted, as if
dedicated time was spent composing the text. Literature holds immense signi cance in your work,
becoming a de ning characteristic and trademark of your artistic expression.

Indeed, a deep appreciation for literature and a love for reading is shared among us. Through our
engagement with literature, we often encounter structures and ideas that can be translated into the realm of
cinema. In this particular case, the renowned Chilean writer Roberto Bolaño has had a direct in uence on the
structure and concepts of my lm. I must also mention the impact of Ursula K. Le Guin, which leads me to
re ect on Mary Shelley’s Frankenstein…

As you mentioned in your previous interviews, it is fascinating to learn that a wide range of sources
from diverse literary backgrounds, such as El Perjurio de la Nieve (The Perjury of the Snow) by Bioy
Casares, Walking by Henry David Thoreau, The Adventures of Tom Sawyer by Mark Twain and lms like
Attack of the 50 Foot Woman (Nathan Hertz, 1958) and more, have served as inspirations for writing the
script of Trenque Lauquen.

…The discussion we had earlier about the mysteries that arise at the beginning of stories has a profound
connection to literature and the experience of reading. When you delve into a novel, you become entranced
by the words, entering a realm akin to being immersed in a cloud. From there, vivid images and ideas
emerge, transcending the mere words on the page.

In a similar vein, cinema allows us to give voice to our characters and explore intricate plotlines. However,
there exists a place where the audience can forge a direct relationship with the material, forming their own
unique interpretations and engaging in a personal dialogue with the narrative.

For me, this enigmatic quality is at the core of storytelling. It is an experience that frequently occurs during
the act of reading. Translating this into lm is not always straightforward, as movies primarily rely on visuals.
Sometimes, the pressure to explain everything in a more explicit manner arises, unlike in books, which have
the luxury of language. You may have noticed that some poorly written scripts feature characters essentially
narrating the lm to the viewer. I hope my explanation is clear, but essentially, when one becomes
engrossed in the hypnotic power of visual storytelling, a similar immersive state akin to reading a novel is
achieved.

When re ecting on the recurring themes of mysteries and literature in your lms, it becomes
apparent that the majority of them are set outside of Buenos Aires, the capital city of Argentina. This
departure from the urban centre appears to intensify the feeling of intrigue, fascination and
mysteries. This tendency is also present in some of Alejo’s and Mariano’s lms. I’m interested in
understanding if this deliberate choice to portray locations beyond Buenos Aires holds a particular
meaning or intention for your group. Does it serve as a manifestation of a particular message or
allow for the exploration of certain aspects that you nd compelling?

The inclination mentioned doesn’t apply universally to all members of our team. However, both Mariano and
I share a personal attachment to the province of Buenos Aires. While I currently reside in Buenos Aires, my
birthplace and my family’s roots lie in the province, speci cally in Trenque Lauquen. These childhood
landscapes consistently manifest in our lms, as they hold signi cant memories and experiences for us.
Mariano also has a connection to the province, having spent his childhood there. Referring back to your
previous question, I believe our shared fondness for this region brought us together as collaborators. The
province of Buenos Aires is often seen as a transitional point en route to other destinations like Patagonia or
Córdoba. It may not be considered particularly captivating by many, but for me, who grew up surrounded by
its landscapes, especially the vast plains and the Pampas, it possesses a distinct beauty.

Capturing the essence of this place can be challenging due to the di culty of framing it. The vast and endless
landscapes make it hard to determine where to position the camera. However, once you overcome this
obstacle, you discover images that are unique to the province of Buenos Aires. The desire to depict these
landscapes stems from personal reasons and the inherent cinematic quality of the region.

Additionally, there are two practical aspects that make lming outside of Buenos Aires appealing. Firstly, it is
refreshing to leave the city and escape from our own lives. Secondly, it is much easier to produce lms in
small towns and rural areas. The rhythm of life, the way of thinking, and the overall pace of these places lend
themselves well to our patient and re ective lmmaking approach. In Buenos Aires, one must conform to the
city’s rhythm, which can sti e creativity and freedom of thought. The freedom and atmosphere of the
province make the lmmaking process more comfortable and conducive to our artistic vision.

Personally, I would always choose a less ideal location if it means working with a supportive and
accommodating owner or team. A pleasant working environment is crucial to me, even if it means
compromising on the physical aspects of the location. Therefore, working outside the city, away from the
bustling urban atmosphere, is preferable. I wouldn’t want to make a lm solely within Buenos Aires.

Rojo

Before we conclude the interview, I have one nal question. While I understand that Trenque Lauquen
does not have a speci c political agenda, the theme of disappearance, particularly in the context of
Argentina’s history, carries political implications. I have observed a recent resurgence of this theme
in various Argentine lms, such as Rojo (Benjamín Naishtat, 2018), Un crimen común (A Common Crime,
Francisco Márquez Matadero, 2020), Matadero (Santiago Fillol, 2022), Azor (Andreas Fontana. 2021 a co-
production with Argentina), and notably Argentina, 1985 (Santiago Mitre, 2022). In Trenque Lauquen, we
witness the story of a woman who vanishes, leading to a collective quest for answers. My question
has two parts: Firstly, did you intend to convey a hidden political message through your lm?
Secondly, why do you think the concept of disappearance is reemerging in Argentine cinema, evident
in Argentina, 1985‘s submission to the Oscars as a mainstream lm? I would appreciate your insights
into this trend.

Trenque Lauquen is not driven by political motivations. Throughout the lm, we deliberately incorporated
subtle hints to convey the idea of someone choosing to leave voluntarily, without immediate danger. Our
intention was to explore the concept of absence without peril. The rst chapter, titled “L’Avventura” is a nod
to Antonioni’s lm, where a woman goes missing. However, our emphasis was on highlighting the woman’s
choice. In Trenque Lauquen, our aim was to create a work of ction that explores the contemporary notion of
a woman’s absence, without directly delving into the grim reality of disappearances or femicides that
regrettably occur in Argentina, such as cases where women are tragically killed by men. This issue is not
exclusive to Argentina but is prevalent in Latin America and other parts of the world.

However, I strongly believe that ction should not always feel obliged to approach these topics in the same
manner. If I wish to create a narrative about a woman who chooses to leave, it should focus on her personal
decision rather than portraying her as someone who simply disappears. We deliberately avoid using the
term “disappear” due to its historical weight and connotations. Our intention with this lm was to present it
as a story about a woman who leaves because she wants to, emphasising her deliberate and intentional
personal choice. In the initial segments of the movie, by telling The Story of Carmen Zuna’s A air, we delve
into the concept that women possess the agency to simply choose to leave on their own terms. Our aim was
to introduce this character to the audience and o er early hints that there is no immediate peril involved.

I understand that many lms address important social issues with good intentions. The challenge with
closely intertwining cinema and reality is that viewers often expect lms to constantly re ect and engage
with real-world events, such as immigration, women’s rights, and minority issues. Our approach to cinema
di ers in that we don’t feel compelled to create lms solely focused on social causes.

We have observed an interesting response from people who have watched Trenque Lauquen. For instance,
many viewers have expressed that they enjoyed the rst part of the lm but found the second part to be too
disconnected from reality, which led them to dislike it. This reaction can be attributed to a prevalent trend
over the past decade, where there is an expectation for lms to constantly address social issues concerning
immigrants, women, minorities, and other pertinent topics. Nowadays Cinema is often expected to align with
di erent social perspectives and advocate for speci c causes and agendas.

However, we intentionally approach cinema di erently. This does not mean that viewers cannot interpret
Trenque Lauquen through a feminist lens or from a particular ideological standpoint. Rather, we strive to
create lms that do not solely seek to mirror or directly re ect reality. Personally, I am unsure how to make a
lm that adheres to such an approach. For instance, Dog Lady, another lm I worked on, maintains a close
connection with the textures of poverty but does not depict a woman who is speci cally impoverished. It can
be viewed as more of a fantasy than a straightforward depiction of real-life events. While working closely
with Laura Paredes in writing Trenque Lauquen , we made concerted e orts to provide clues that this story
was not exclusively tied to Argentina’s history or its current situation regarding women.

In essence, our aim is to o er a di erent cinematic experience that prompts viewers to engage with the lm
from various perspectives, rather than adhering strictly to re ecting or confronting reality.

But why is Argentine cinema currently inclined to revisit stories from the past? There is a noticeable
trend of numerous lms delving into historical themes. It appears that there is a recurring theme of
danger or urgency that compels lmmakers to revisit and reimagine historical narratives. Is this a
response to a perceived danger in the present, where people feel a sense of apprehension and a need
to revisit and retell stories from the past? Could you provide some insights into this trend and shed
light on why lmmakers are attracted to exploring the past in this manner?

Personally, I don’t believe there is currently an obsession with telling stories about the history of the
dictatorship era. There was a time in Argentina when the majority of lms centred around the dictatorship,
resulting in an abundance of lms on the topic. However, many of these lms relied on stereotypes and
lacked a genuine re ection on Argentine history.

That being said, I nd movies like Azor and A Common Crime to be di erent and noteworthy. They o er a
fresh perspective and a more profound exploration of the events. These lms present interesting voices that
approach the facts from a di erent angle, which I nd intriguing.

However, it is crucial to di erentiate lms like Azor and A Common Crime from Argentina, 1985. In the case of
Argentina, 1985, this lm is produced and distributed by Amazon. As you mentioned, it belongs to the
mainstream category and is directed and produced by Santiago Mitre, with Mariano Llinás contributing as
one of the co-screenwriters. This particular lm has garnered positive reception from audiences. However, it
is important to note that some viewers may mistakenly believe that watching this lm provides them with a
comprehensive understanding of Argentina’s history. They may not actively seek out other sources such as
documentaries on the subject. Nevertheless, after watching this lm, they may feel that they have acquired a
comprehensive knowledge of Argentina’s history. This highlights the potential impact and in uence of
cinema on people’s perception and understanding of historical events.

Moreover, companies like Amazon and Net ix have shifted their focus towards investing in and producing
series like Crown or characters such as Maradona or Pablo Escobar. They capitalise on the popularity of
these historical events or gures because they have proven to be commercially successful.

However, it seems that these productions thrive because audiences have a preference for content that
closely aligns with reality. It is unclear why viewers are less interested in a lm about a ctional monster
emerging in a park lagoon like Trenque Lauquen. Perhaps it is because such fantastical narratives are
perceived as detached from reality. For some reason, cinema has become a platform where historical,
political, and factual accounts take precedence, while the essence of ction seems to be diminishing.

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On Refusal, Negativity, and Hustler White Prismatic Ground 2023: Labour Seen

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Hamed Sarrafi
Hamed Sarra is a UK-based cinephile, critic and translator. He has written and translated
for Iranian newspapers and magazines for 20 years and more recently has established his
podcast, Abadiat Va Yek Rooz (Eternity and a Day), in which he reviews movies and lm
festivals and also interviews lmmakers and fellow lm critics. Sarra is particularly
interested in interviewing emerging directors on their social and political views. His
interviews have been published in Cineaste, Notebook (Mubi) and Cinema Without Borders.

R E L AT E D P O S T S

INTERVIEW WITH ALBERT BIRNEY & KENTUCKER

STEVE DOUGHTON AND JON RAYMOND ON EARTHLINGS AUDLEY
 Nolan Kelly  January 2024  Nolan Kelly  May 2022

S TA F F M E M B E R S D O N AT E T O S E N S E S

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